The Ramsey Show - App - Don't Run FROM Your Problems...Run TO Something! (Hour 3)

Episode Date: December 9, 2021

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I'm Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's The Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. You jump in, we'll talk about your life and your money. It's a free call at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Dr. John Deloney, Ramseysey personality is my co-host today he is author of the book redefining anxiety and it's on sale right now at ramsey solutions.com for ten dollars you can also

listen to him on the dr john deloney show millions do lots of questions come in and great answers lots of wisdom around mental health around relationships and boundaries. So we'll be talking about that this hour, as well as your money. Don is with us. Don's going to start this hour in Binghamton, New York. Hey, Don, how are you? Good, sir. Thank you for taking my call. Sure.

What's up? I am trying to change the future of the next generation. I'm one of those guys that got debt-free, mortgages paid. We own four acres of land. We're currently living in a double-wide, but we're changing that into a stick-built house come next summer. My wife and I are both in our 60s. We're building a small empty nester house.

Now, we have four grandchildren. We want to leave this property and house too, but they're never good. They might be 20 by the time we pass and we want to be able to leave it to them, but it's going to have to take care of itself as far as taxes and everything until they inherit it. Any help? Any ideas? Uh, make that happen. We've put my money in the stock market. Um,

I've got 40,000 in there now just started investing less than a year ago. We have 40,000 in there. I got, uh, 6,000 in a money market. That's my emergency fund. Thanks for mentioning that, too, because that thing saved me here a short while ago, and my wife went in the hospital for about a week, and I had to dip into that thing and pay that bill because I don't like to have debt.

Somebody taught me that. How old are you guys, Don? I'm 63. My wife is 60. How old is the guys, Don? I'm 63. My wife is 60. How old is the oldest grandchild? Eight. Okay. They go from four to eight.

Yeah, the same bunch I got. I'm 61. My oldest is eight. So there you go. You're a good man, and you have a wonderful heart to leave a legacy. And property is something emotional about leaving real estate in your legacy yeah i want to leave a family treasure so to speak something i can keep in the future and and we're another thing we're doing for that house is we uh we have about two acres of uh

trees out here and the ash trees you know uh is dying it's being eaten up by a bug so we're taking all of our ash trees and have them cut down the amish guys coming in tomorrow to do it and uh we're gonna have the ash trees taken down sawing into uh lumber for flooring to put in the house and one oak tree red oak tree out there we're gonna have cut down and made into a door for the front of the house and so it's something they can look back at and say, Grandma and Grandpa left this for us. We want to be able to say that. We want to be able to leave this to them.

And somehow or another have the taxes and everything taken care of until they can take it over. So you've got such a big heart about this. Your big heart and your vision and your dream is colliding with the practical aspects of doing this deal. And so having owned a bunch of real estate and fooled with it most of my life, I wouldn't put the burden of managing a rental property that I used to live in if I died on a friend or a relative as the trustee. You could leave the property under trust for the minor kids

and have someone manage the property, be the property manager for all this time. I wouldn't put someone through that for this. I just wouldn't. I would just, if you were to die tomorrow, both of you, I would just tell them to sell the thing and divvy the money up into trust, into the kids' names to take care of them. Now, what I would do is once they, if you live until they're grown

and you want to leave it to them directly after they're grown, 20, 21, whatever, then I would change my will to leave the property to them at that point and let them, you know, let them have the benefit of that. But this is not a family farm. It's not been in, it's not hundreds of acres. It's been in the family for eight generations. It's a place that you are building on at 60-something years old right now. So it hasn't got a huge history, but you've got a lot of heart in it. I can hear it the way you're talking about it.

So I personally, then what I would do is what I do with mine now and what you already do with yours. I'd walk the property with them, teach that 8-year-old right now that you use those ash trees for that. You know, the Amish guys are coming in. They're going to help us. They're wonderful craftsmen. They're going to help us get these flooring in out of this,

and this door here is going to be from that. And let that 8-year-old, 10-year-old, 12-year-old, 14-year-old walk that property. Let him hear the stories from his grandpa's mouth, and then he'll replicate that in his life somewhere someday if you die before he's old enough for you to leave it to him. But I wouldn't leave that on someone and let it be a mess for 10 years, you know, that somebody has to screw with personally. I don't know.

What are you hearing, John? Yeah, why wouldn't you leave it to their parents? that somebody has to screw with personally. I don't know. What are you hearing, John? Yeah. Why wouldn't you leave it to their parents? Is there something that you're concerned about, the way their parents would manage it? You're pretty observant. Their parents won't speak to us. We're not allowed to see our grandchildren.

We haven't seen them. Oh. There we go. For years now. We haven't seen them in four years. Um, we're just hoping that we live long enough that, um, they get old enough and they can make their, their own minds up and come see us. You create them a special, special place. Yeah. That's I'm so sorry. I do have a friend that's quite wealthy, very, very wealthy, I should say. And I've considered this as an idea.

Tell me yes or no, what we're working at. Leave it to him. And if I, you know, we got, like I say, the stocks going and trying to keep a savings in the money market. And if I leave enough money for him to maintain the taxes and stuff, he agreed to it. Would that be an idea? It would be, but, again, I think it's a burden that's part of your – you have this dream in your mind of the kids all walking the fields with you, and they've come back, and this whole thing is reconciled and all of all is forgiven this home is a is a is a reconnected

family yeah and um until that happens i would have my will that the property is sold and the money goes into trust for them that's available to them when they're 25. But once there's reconnection. Then you can consider changing that. But I'm so sorry. I'm sorry. Now I understand why I was hearing so much heart in it though. This is The important than ever. While some circumstances can't be controlled, there are items within your budget you can take charge of, such as your health care costs. For nearly 40 years, Christian Health Care Ministries, or CHM, has provided a budget-friendly means of sharing

for medical bills when our members need it. Learn more by visiting chministries.org budget. That's chministries.org budget budget. Christian Healthcare Ministries is a Ramsey-trusted provider. So when you think of a millionaire, what kind of a job do you picture them having? Some kind of high-powered executive position like a VP or a CEO? Well, here's the thing. Only about 15% of millionaires actually have that kind of job. The reality is the top five careers for millionaires in America are engineer, accountant, teacher, manager, and attorney. And that's one of the many surprising things our team found when we conducted the largest study of millionaires ever done in North America.

We studied in depth over 10,000 millionaires and how they got there. Our study also made it clear that to become a millionaire, you've got to invest wisely and steadily. 78% of the millionaires that we talked to had a financial advisor in their corner, a trustworthy financial advisor. Now, we have trustworthy, vetted investing pros from all over the country that we have vetted, and they go along with the stuff we teach. They're called SmartVestor Pros. They don't work for us.

They are our investment advisors. We're not in that business. But we refer you to them. And to get in touch with a SmartVestor Pro in your area, just go to RamseySolutions.com slash SmartVestor. You can sit down with them, get your kid's college fund going, get everything going over the details of everything, and you'll know what to do to get your rollover of your 401K, whatever it is.

RamseySolutions.com slash SmartVestor. Ben is in Charlotte, North Carolina. Hi, Ben. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave and John. I appreciate the time and appreciate all you guys do. Sure. What's up? So my lovely wife and I, we are saving to build a home and purchase some land.

And through conversations we've had with realtors and builders, they recommended that we buy the land first just to curb the increase in land prices in this crazy time. So the question that we have is we're trying to save aggressively to do that, but knowing that we will probably purchase land before we actually build a home, that extra money that we're saving, should we be paying down our mortgage or should we just be saving all of this extra money in a savings account? Are you going, you're going to buy the land long before you sell the home you live in? I don't know how long. The goal is to start

building a home in about three years. So it's whenever a deal comes with the right property and the right amount of land. I would just save up the money and buy the land. Okay, so save it all on a savings account? Yeah, and then just buy the land. Because the logistics of what you're lining up, the dominoes are too far apart to knock the other one down. In other words, you might buy this land sooner rather than later, and then it might be another year, year and a half, two years before you even break grounds,

what you're telling me. Potentially, yeah. Yeah, and if that's the case, you don't have a place to live, because you've got to sell the house to get the money out to buy the land, and I'm not going to tell you to borrow money to buy the land. Right, and that's definitely not our plan either. Right, and so if you put it all into your house, the only way to get the land would be to sell your house and move into an apartment.

Yeah, which we've done before, and now we're going to have three going on four kids. We don't want to do it again. Yeah, that sounds less than fun. So, yeah, I think you just save up pay cut. It's a break-even. You're going to end up at the end of the story with your house sold and all the money that you would have had in your house or had in the land is all going to be in the new house anyway yeah that's true so at the end of

the story it's all going to be piled over on that one pile anyway so you're still going to get there and you're not going to add any debt in the process and so um you know until you actually do the construction loan that kind of stuff if you do a construction loan so yeah yeah i not going to add any debt in the process until you actually do the construction loan, that kind of stuff, if you do a construction loan. So, yeah, I think your advice is good that you've been getting. I would just save and pay cash and buy the land. How many acres have you got? Almost seven. Okay. Man, that's nice.

Six, yeah. That's good. That's very nice. That's good. A little wiggle room is a good thing. Owen is with us. Owen is in Grand Rapids. How are you, Owen?

Hi, Dave. How are you doing? Better than I deserve. What's up? So just a quick question. I'm having a bit of a little issue here. I'm 20 years old. I'm in college.

I'm currently studying aerospace engineering. And I'm not really sure if I want to continue or drop out and go into the trades considering I'm about $51,000 in debt at the moment. And I'm just really not enjoying it. What is it you're not enjoying? Well, I just do not like the classes I'm taking at all, and I really just want to start working and building up income as soon as possible since I'm a broke college kid, basically. What about the classes do you not like? You don't like the math?

It's not aerospace? It wasn't what you thought it was? Or are you just like millions of college kids just exhausted? I'm very stressed and exhausted all the time. And I just, yeah, I'm not a fan of math. I'm learning that now. And I'd rather do, I know I like aviation. So I will, you know, if I did do something like the trades,

I'd want to go into probably, you know, aviation mechanic. So I'm just not sure what direction I should go at this point. What year are you in school? I'm a junior. But I am doing a five-year program, so I still have about half to go. And it's making my stomach hurt thinking about another 50K in debt. Okay, that's a different subject than my stomach is hurting because I don't like math. Yeah.

What school are you in? Western Michigan. Not that expensive. You can work and not go 50K in debt. Yeah. The problem with that is I don't really have time to have a full-time job at the moment. I do work on the weekends when I can, and that's been going fine. Yes, you do.

You have more time to work than you've been working because you don't need to go 50 grand in debt to finish. You can work your way through Western Michigan. That's possible mathematically. You have that much time. There's something else going on here, dude. Are you okay? What do you mean? I'm hearing from my former colleagues from all over the country

that college students are reaching a mental health breaking point, that they're exhausted? I mean, I'm fine. You're okay? There definitely is. Yeah, I'm honestly fine. There definitely is. College is a lot different now after COVID.

That's what I mean. That's definitely true. All work and no play now. Yeah. Not that I care too much about the play, but... Yeah. You've dug yourself a $50,000 hole, and what I've seen time and time again is students leave

and, man, making minimum wage is hard to pay that $50,000 off. Yeah. You'd have to be committed to a short-term program that you paid for with cash and not go into any more debt, and it'd have to have a really high ROI on it, man. You don't want to get out. Which is, I'm sorry. Yeah, go ahead. Have you thought about changing your major to something you like more?

Yeah, I have, although trades would be a lot cheaper so that's i have thought about that though i've not ruled that out okay the the the language that you're using to discuss all of this sounds to me i i'm hearing that you're not running to the trades you're running from college the trades is an escape is the way you keep describing it it's not like oh man i'm so passionate about that i want to go do that i've always wanted to do that and going to college was a complete mistake for me i completely goofed no that none of that it's more like i hate this place over here i hate math class i hate the stress i'm under and the anxiety i'm under and i'll do almost anything to not do this anymore and then you're going to find somebody on the internet that tells you man

welders make eight hundred thousand dollars a year and you could you know i mean like at some point it dave's exactly right you are you're running from a problem not towards what i've never thought about that yeah i think we need to i think you need to figure out what you can run to before you run. I'm okay with you quitting college. Absolutely. Okay. And I'm okay with you changing majors.

And I'm okay with you working 50 hours a week and paying your way the rest of the way through if you want to do that and change to engineering or probably more math there. But anyway, I want you to have something you're going to rather than just from. Go meet with the college counseling center. You've paid into it, and they're there for this exact purpose. See if they can help you guide you through this. Hang on. I'm going to send you a copy of Ken Coleman's career assessment, and maybe that will give you some insights too. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today in the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage.

Lisa's with us. Hi, Lisa. How are you? Hi, Dave. It's so great to see you. Hi, John. So great to see you. I'm so thankful to be here. Well, we're honored to have you. Where do you live? I'm from Houston, Texas. H-Town? Yes, Houston, Texas. H-Town. Well, good to have you. And how much debt have you paid off, girl? Oh, Dave, $264,000 on a single income.

Wow. And I waited seven years to walk through your doors. Wow. You've been working on this seven years? Seven years. And what was your range of income during this seven years? I'm a registered nurse, and it was between 83 and 93. for you well done you've had a boring few years the last couple years huh it's been wild let me tell you yes thank you so much for for being on the front

line that's right filling that gap for all of us so uh 264 000 was that your house well part of it was um i did something kind of interesting i sold my house at the end of my journey i was maybe two to three months out so about 164 000 was just the regular you know credit cards cars and oh of course Dave, I had some payday loans. But about $102,000 was my house. And I decided to go ahead and sell it towards the end of the journey because I knew it would accelerate my journey. And I would be able to have my six-month emergency fund. And I would be able to start my 15% investing and that kind of thing. So I sold it towards the end when the real estate market was really booming in Houston.

Wow. And it ended up being a fantastic decision for me. And I'm so happy, Dave. I cannot even find anybody that I have to pay. I am so thankful. Good for you. I am so thankful. Good for you. I am so thankful. You're so free. It is just the best, best feeling in the world.

And yes, it was a lot of work. And yes, there were some things that happened on the journey that I wanted to share with you that I think even a lot of your listeners will be able to appreciate. And I had decided that all the way through this journey that I was going to keep God first. And in the journey, I would budget grocery money. I would take it right out of my budget, and I would go down into the third ward of Houston, and I would find families that were in desperate need of food. Throughout this whole journey, I did this, and I would go door to door to families down there, and I would feed them. And I believed that God delivered me out of this huge mess, this huge hardship, because I honored him, and I did what the word of God says in giving.

And the other thing that I want to share with you is right when I, right when I had my, right when I was just about ready to get out of debt, I had a AC company come in and let me know that I had to have the whole AC replaced. So I was just about ready to land the plane, just about ready to become debt free. And I got handed a $10,000 AC bill. And I just stood in my kitchen and I looked at it and I thought, what would Dave do in this situation? And the solution was just attack it like every other bill, every other debt. And I learned from it, when you have a setback, don't step back,

because God has your comeback on the way. Wow, that'll preach. Good for you, girl. Good for you. Very well done. Very well done. Now that you did this, what do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is the first thing i would say to him is to get organized uh the first

thing i would say to him is to get organized and that's what i did i as i organized my debt smallest to largest as you teach but the other thing uh i would say to him is on the journey there are gonna there are setbacks. There are hardships like what happened with an AC unit. And to not get discouraged, to keep pushing, keep going. And I also feel like giving in the journey is critical. I do believe that God delivered me out of this mess when I was helping the poor. And I believe that, you know,

you've done such a great job teaching us the Word of God in your work. And I listened to you also. Another thing I did was I listened to your podcast an hour going into work and an hour coming out of work for a long long time and i read the total money makeover twice so i just made sure that i was educating myself with everything that you're a force of nature girl i mean there's no question you are you are getting after it

yes definitely god delivered you and god blessed you and but what he did was he multiplied your efforts and you put forth an extreme amounts of effort. And, you know, you weren't sitting at home waiting on roast duck to fly in the window. You went duck shooting. I'm so proud of you. Thank you. Well done. Thank you so much.

Very, very well done. Very cool. Yeah. I suspect anything you set your hand to is going to occur. Yeah. It's very, very well done. Good stuff. I'm proud of you.

Congratulations. Thank you so much, John. Thank you so much. The work that you do and together the team that you have has – I just celebrate the victory, Dave, with you and all of your team because your hard work is what's educating the public to become debt-free and to live a life of freedom and happiness. I'm so happy now. And when I walk through those doors, I waited seven years to thank you. Wow. And I'm thanking you now.

Well, thank you. You're inspiring. You're inspiring. I'm so proud of you. Very, very well done. Good stuff. Good stuff. Okay. If somebody asks how you get out of'm so proud of you very very well done good stuff good stuff okay if somebody asks how you get out of debt what do you tell them the very first thing i'm going to tell them is to put god first in their finances um the other thing i want to share with

them is to be organized a while yes be organized have that yeah and to really follow your steps because they work. And I also know that in the journey that they not get discouraged. And I was on a long journey. I wasn't on a two or three year journey. I was on a long one because it was a lot of money for one income. But I'm so thankful now that I did it. I'm so grateful to you for educating me and it's so great to finally meet my mentor bless your heart who was your biggest cheerleader i think you no no i'm talking about in your life sitting right next to me uh my sister-in-law carol oh go carol

yes all right my brother mike who's a phenomenal money manager and my nephew dean that is an even more phenomenal money manager so good people in your corner very much good stuff well we got a copy of the every uh baby steps millionaires for you that's the next chapter in your story for sure the book comes out january the 11th we're going to give you a copy today an advanced reader copy and also a copy of total Money Makeover for you to give away and get someone else started on their journey. I got a feeling that you will be discussing this with someone. It sounds like that's the way that goes. So I'm so proud of you.

Way to go, hero. You killed it. Absolutely awesome. Thank you so much. Lisa is in Houston, Texas. $264,000 paid off in seven years, making $83,000 to $93,000. Count it down.

Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. May the glory go to God. I'm debt-free! Yeah! Yeah! Whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop. Yeah!

So great. You can never mess up feeding the poor. Nope. You can never mess up feeding hungry children. Nope. There's never a time you look back and go, oh, well, that was a mistake. Shouldn't have done that one. That one doesn't come up.

That doesn't come up. And it turns loose things in your spirit generosity is an amazing thing it causes people to be highly attractive generous people are highly attractive and grateful people she's she's one of the most grateful people i've had an opportunity to meet this week yes amen good stuff grateful way to go lisa you're a hero very very well done this is the ramsey show Thank you. Our scripture of the day, 1 Thessalonians 5.11, Therefore, encourage one another and build each other up, just as in fact you are doing.

Bill Bradley said leadership is unlocking people's potential to become better. John's with us in Boulder, Colorado. Hi, John. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, David and John. Thank you for the time today. Sure. I got a question that might be covered in your upcoming book. I already pre-ordered it, but I figured I'd try to get in early. I have a question that regards to your favorites, math and multiple choice,

regarding employee stock purchase and RSUs. I'm on baby steps four, five, six, and really trying to get it done. I think I can reach step seven by 2026. You know this part, but my employer, Apple, offers employee stock purchase that I can buy into two periods for 15% discount on the stock from the lowest of either the start or end of the period. I'm doing 10% of my gross salary using that post-tax money.

So in a year, I'm putting roughly $13,000 into the CFPP. If I go and buy that stock at the lowest from the start of this period, that'd be about 105 shares, which would turn the 13,000 into about 18,000. The multiple choice portion of it is, um, would I sell immediately, pay no short-term taxes on the gain, B, sell in a year with long-term taxes, C, an arbitrary date, or D, not do ESPP altogether and just chunk it towards my mortgage. Gotcha. Okay. Well, to start with, you need to be doing 15% of your income towards retirement, not counting this discussion, are you? Yes, I am. Okay. And so this is play

money beyond that. And the only downside is, do we put it on the stock and mess with it, or do we put it into the house and pay the house down? Yeah. Here's the thing. In general, I mean, you mentioned the company, so that here's the thing in general i mean you mentioned the company so that that does change the discussion slightly because apple's track record is unbelievable um but the 99 of the time just about any other company you mentioned and i don't think it's true of apple but it could be if you look at a 52 weekweek high and a 52-week low of a single stock, almost always there's a 15% movement up and down. And so a 15% discount is what everyone gets on their company when they're doing an employee stock purchase. That's standard, okay?

Everybody gets it. It's not unique to your company. And so my point is you could buy something and it could drop 15% as easy as it goes up 15% in one year. And so the 15% discount does not make it a great buy in 99% of the cases. Now, Apple pretty much has gone up and to the right. So it might be an exception. I don't know. If you're going to play with this because it's Apple, you're not going to do it because it's 15% discounted. You're going to do it because it's Apple and because of the track record and the history of it being up and to the right.

The second thing you want to do is if you're going to be in any single stock, I would not ever have more than 10% of your net worth tied up in that. That way, if the whole thing goes completely belly up, for whatever reason... My mom worked at Enron. There you go. It doesn't affect you. Yeah. Because there is no sure thing.

And so the lack of diversification, even if it's in the best company of whatever best companies, and they have more money than the country of Egypt, which is actually true. So, you know, then, you know, even if that's the case, you still don't want to bet much more than 10% of your net worth on there. So if you want to play with this because you're enamored with it, don't let it be more than 10% of your net worth. Personally, I have not followed that direction. My personal path and what I've taught and what you hear me answer the question over and over again is, no, don't do employee stock until you get your house paid off

and put everything towards your house above 15% of your income going into retirement. And that's the standard Ramsey way of doing things, and that works 100% of the time. This could work, and you could make some money on it in the future i would not hold it less than a year if you're going to hold it less than a year i just wouldn't screw with it but if you're going to hold it long term don't allow that account to end up being more than 10 of your net worth and uh and don't just don't hit your wagon to a single stock because that's always going to bring back pain into your life later at some point. It gets scary.

Elizabeth's in Louisville, Kentucky. Hi, Elizabeth. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. I have a two-fold question for you fellows today, if you don't mind. I'll try to make it quick. My family has had two major life changes. I have a family member that cannot eat her processed nutrition, so she's on vein nutrition, which is $10,000 a bag.

My dad had a major stroke and is looking at nursing home placement and has no long-term care insurance. I know the answer, that would be one of the answers, is long-term care insurance. I know the answer, that would be one of the answers, is long-term care insurance, but I also have a dilemma in the way I'm feeling. They're getting the same care, paying thousands upon thousands, $13,000 a month out of pocket, and the person down the hall is paying nothing so as a christian and because i trust what you um have to say how should i feel about that or do you have any advice for me on how i should process through that well i pay millions of dollars in taxes and the personal welfare doesn't and i pay less than dave and we share the same road and the same police officers.

True. The person that's in a nursing home on Medicaid, Medicare, it's Medicare, or Medicaid, that's welfare. That's welfare. You have to be indigent. You have to be poor. If you have assets to pay for your nursing home, the government will not pay for your nursing home the government will not pay for your nursing home because you're not poor yeah i know it's sad that they could take everything though now they're not taking everything any more than a restaurant takes everything if you go over there

and buy food at the restaurant they're providing a service and you're paying them for it they're not robbing him so bad they're not robbing him he has worked his whole life to be cared for and taken care of and his assets will provide that care for him and it's not um you know who they're taking from is you because you're not going to get the inheritance because he's going he's going to spend it on himself before he dies yeah and my mom my mom is in good health yeah that's bad yeah yeah but but the truth is i mean you're he's you know so uh what i'm going to do is shop the nursing home experience get the best care for the least dollar like we would with anything that we purchase.

And not just assume that. But the person down the hall that's on welfare doesn't affect whether I go get a job. No. And I'm not going to give them access to the last few remaining years I have with my dad. I'm not going to choose bitterness and choose anger and choose resentment. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to give that away to somebody I don't know. I don't know their circumstances, their story. I don't know anything about what's going on there.

I'm going to be grateful that my dad was so good with his money that he can pay for his care right now, even though it's liquidating. It's going fast, right? But he worked hard. He's taking care of it. And I'm going to enjoy the time with him. Well, what I am going to do is negotiate and, you know, manage every bit of this money. You're purchasing a service just like you're purchasing having a car repaired or, I don't know, anything you pay for a service, you pay for the service.

And nursing home care is a legitimate service. They're not robber barons. They're not stealing. They're not making you do this um and you may choose depending on the what his needs are with the stroke you may choose to hire private care in home it might be cheaper might be cheaper uh and it might be higher quality care uh if you've got that ability uh requires some more management maybe on your part if you're going to manage the people involved but um you can look at that as an option too and and find different ways to do this

because if it's $13,000 a month, that shouldn't be that much. Yeah, that's high, high. But, yeah, nursing home evokes a different place in us to where people feel like they're being stolen from, and you're not. And often our own grief and pain, we look around for somebody around us to cast that upon. Right. Don't do that. Sit in it and choose joy.

Yeah. Thanks for calling, hon. I'm sorry you guys are going through this. That's fine. Dr. John Deloney, good show today. Good job to Ben and Kelly in the booth. I am Dave Ramsey, your host. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to

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