The Ramsey Show - App - Dramatic Change Leads to Dramatic Wealth (Hour 3)

Episode Date: February 20, 2019

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios. It's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I am Dave Ramsey, your host. Thank you for joining us. Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Yolanda is with us in Charlotte, North Carolina. Hi, Yolanda.

How are you? Hi, Dave. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So I have a question. I actually just found out that I'm losing my job as of March 30th this year.

So, yes, I know. But I'm okay. I'm okay. But I have a question. So my severance, once I received my severance, my husband and I just really started on your program. And just curious to know if I should pay part of my severance. Well, not part. Just pay like one month towards our mortgage

so that we can pay our mortgage like every other week versus paying it at the beginning of the month. Every other week. You mean biweekly? Biweekly. Okay. No, I don't think now is the time to convert to a bi-weekly um you can only do that if you sign up for a service after you have the mortgage and most of those charge you to do that so i wouldn't so first let's just talk about

bi-weeklies okay the only reason a bi-weekly will pay off a 30-year mortgage in about 22 years. But the reason it does that is not that it's biweekly. It's that you're paying a half a payment every two weeks. And there are 26 two-week periods in a year. So 26 halves is 13 payments a year. The fact that you're paying an extra payment a year effectively is what causes your mortgage to reduce. So you can pay one extra payment per year and have almost exactly the same mathematical effect as doing a bi-weekly, and you don't have to pay a fee to some company to set up the bi-weekly. I assume somebody's trying to charge you to do this, right? Actually, it's not

they didn't tell me that it would be that that was one of our options is it a new mortgage uh we've had it for about two years okay well if they will convert it to a bi-weekly uh at no charge at all and you want to do that fine but i would not pay a fee to do it because of what i just described. You can just pay. You can take one twelfth of your payment and pay that as an extra principal once a month, and you'd have, I mean, within a penny or two of the same reaction as a biweekly. So don't pay a fee to do it, but just pay extra principal.

If there is no fee and you want to convert to that, that's fine. I would wait to convert until you get settled down on this career thing. So what does your husband make, and what do you make currently? I currently make $55,000, and he makes $87,000. Okay. Did you say $65,000 or $55,000? $55,000. $55,000.

And what do you do now? I am a lead coordinator. A lead coordinator. A lead coordinator? Lead of absence. Oh, lead coordinator. You work in HR then? Mm-hmm. Okay.

And how long have you been with this firm? 17 years. Okay. All right. So this is emotional and shocking and all of that. Okay? So this is emotional and shocking and all of that. What I always like to remind folks is that many times if you make the decision for this to be a wonderful opportunity instead of a catastrophic event, that's all it takes for it to be a wonderful opportunity. What if you got a new job between now and March 30th that started april the 2nd paying 67 000 in hr now what would happen to that severance then that severance would be like a signing bonus

what would happen to this event then it would be like one of the best things that ever happened to you. That's what I'm expecting God to do. Yeah, absolutely. And, yeah, so if you look at it that way and you go get out there and turn over the rocks and you go get that new job, if you've gotten a new job before this one ends, the severance becomes a signing bonus. But you've got to go out there and turn over the rocks. God will make it rain, but you have to plant the seed, right?

Yeah. Yeah, he feeds the birds, but he doesn't drop the worms into their mouth. Follow me? I follow you. Okay. Go get it. You got this. It's going to be a blessing.

Thanks for calling in. Rebecca is with us in Fargo, North Dakota. Hi, Rebecca. How are you? I'm good. How are you, Dave? Better than I deserve. What's up? I just wanted to know when can you justify doing a car repair if your car isn't worth that much? Usually if the car repair is going to be so large compared to the value of the car that it ends up causing you to have so much in the car it doesn't make sense. Let me explain what I mean. What's the repair and what's the cost?

The repair is the clutch is slipping, and so it's about, he said, around $700 to $800. So it's a clutch replacement because it's slipping? Yes. Okay, because you can adjust a clutch a lot cheaper than that, but it sounds like the clutch is bad. Okay. It's bad, yes. And what is the car worth if the clutch were fixed? I looked on Kelley Blue Book for private party sale, and the fair price was $1,500.

Okay. All right. And you can probably sell the car like it is. Let's just make up a number, $1,000. Sure. Okay. So $1,000 in your hand and $700 in your other hand that you're getting ready to spend on a clutch, those two added together equal $1,700,

which is more than the car is worth. So the way you make the determination is your as-is value plus your repair cost, if that is more than the fixed cost, the value of the car after it's fixed, then you sell the car so you sell this car okay and or or before you do that get a second opinion on the clutch okay where who gave you this bid um it's our our repair guy that we've gone to for years where i mean does he have his own shop? Yes, it's his own shop, yep.

Okay, and the other repairs that you've done there for years, you felt like were very reasonable price. Yes, and we trust him implicitly. He's very fair. Okay. Well, on a large repair, there's people I trust implicitly, but I always just get another opinion. And this is a big deal in your life, but I always just get another opinion.

And this is a big deal in your life, so let's just get another opinion. If somebody else comes in and goes, $1,200 to repair this car, then you go, oh, my buddy has been taking care of me, and you just confirmed what you believed about him, right? And that still says you sell the car. But if you get a bid that goes, you know, you don't really need to replace this clutch. You need to just dial it up a little bit, and I think you can get another 20,000 miles out of it if you get a bid that goes you know you don't really need to replace this clutch you need to just dial it up a little bit and i think you can get another 20 000 miles out of you dial it um and i can do that for 100 bucks and now i don't trust my guy so much anymore and i dial it up right so i'm going to get a second opinion just for the fun of it

uh from somebody else another not a dealer repair place that's expensive but just another person that does auto repair that you have a friend that you trust and try a second thing and don't tell them what your guy said just go hey this clutch is messed up tell me what you think ought to do and just get a second bid and that'll tell you give you good solid information to make your decision with with. You know, I get asked all the time, at what age should I buy life insurance? Let me be clear. If you have a family, if there are people depending on your income, now is the time to have term life insurance. I don't care if you're 20, 30, 40, 50, or whatever. Your age is less important than your financial situation. If you have debt and a lack of savings, it makes no sense to risk your family's financial well-being based on the cost of a term life policy. Term life rates are just plain cheap, even if you're not in perfect health.

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Thanks for joining us. Gina is with us in Mobile, Alabama. Hi, Gina. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's up?

Dave, my son currently receives around $1,000 as a survivor's benefit for Social Security from when his dad passed away. I used that money to pay for his private school education. He is now in public school. So for the next two and a half years, I can put that money, that $1,000 away in a savings account for his college, or currently my husband, I've remarried, my husband and I are going through FPU, and I wanted to know if we should use that $1,000 towards our debt snowball what is your household income 160 okay all right morally the way i look at it is this legally you can do with the money whatever you want okay morally the way i look at it is the money is furnished to the child to make sure that the child is cared for yes you are spending well in excess of twelve thousand dollars a year on food shelter clothing electricity caring for this child agreed correct okay so the child is cared for yes he is okay so

it's you know so so really morally you just put it at the top of the line it's one of the household incomes that you have that you budget your household income. And so when you put your income at the top of the page, you put his income at the top of the page, and then you take care of him, you have spent more on him, including when you get to baby step five and you save for his college, you will have spent a lot more on him than $1,000 a month provides. And so he in no way comes up short okay does that make sense you're not you're not cheating him by not keeping it separate i would

not keep it separate i would make it part of your household budget work your baby steps and when you get to baby step five which you will very rapidly with your income, and you're saving very aggressively for his college. How old is he? He is 16, so he has two and a half more years where he will receive this survivor's benefit. Right. And in the first year of college, anything that you would have gotten in the next two and a half years, you're going to spend anyway.

Okay. Helping him. Very good. Okay, yes. And like I said, it was more like a moral issue. I was like, okay, is that really mine to put into the budget? Yes, because you are already spending more than you're receiving. Thank you, Dave.

Let me tell you, you are changing our lives. Thank you so much. I'm not. You are. I'm proud of you. Get after it. Love it. Thanks for calling in.

You're the hero. Open phones at 888-825-5225 maisha is with us in new york hi maisha how are you i'm good dave how are you better than i deserve what's up i just wanted to ask you a question i'm a divorced mom four kids my income is maybe, if I add my second job in about 32 a year, my debt is roughly about $66,000 and some change. If you could tell me how long you think it might take me to pay this off? Well, you live in a very, very, very high cost of living area, don't you? Yes, but I also live in public public housing so i'm definitely one of your lower end income people um yeah okay so my my rent is based on my my income okay so how much

is your rent uh 705 okay on a,000 income with four kids? Yes, a daughter in college and three sons, a senior in high school, a sophomore in high school and a seventh grader, and child support is sporadic. She's trying to be nice. Okay. Okay. That's a difficult road, kid i mean you're it is your income in that in that new york city environment your income with four kids i don't know how you're making it even with a 750 house

payment uh when they're when they're gone and child support is gone for sure unless you're trying to collect back child support at that point, which you probably would be owed. If you just call me up and say, I'm single, I make $32,000, and I have $60,000 in debt, and I live in New York City, I would be going, I don't know how you're going to do that. Yeah. So what I would tell you is this.

In order for you to call me back 10 or 20 years from now and be very, very wealthy and prosperous and having a wonderful money life, something's going to have to change dramatically. The numbers you're giving me aren't going to lead you there. Okay. So one of the, one of two things will change. Either you're going to do something with your career that triples your income, because it takes six figures to exist in New York City,

or you're moving to another area of the country that has different opportunities and a different cost of living. Now, that might be when the kids are gone three years from now. You might suffer through and break even for three years. But I don't think you're going to be paying off a ton of debt with four kids, $750 rent, and $32,000 income in New York City. I mean, if you pay the payments on your debt, I think you're doing well. And paying the payments is a 20-year plan. Yeah.

So I'm not trying to give you no hope. I'm just saying you have a small shovel, a big hole. Yeah. And it's like, you know, I got a teaspoon and I'm out in the yard trying to dig a ditch. And so I want to challenge you to say, okay, if we're going to stay put in this area, what are we going to do with our career to get my income up on a temporary basis and on a long-term basis by even changing careers? What do you do for a living?

Well, I'm an office manager, and I just got that job, and I'm probably going to need to go back to school to finish my degree which will mean having to probably take out a loan maybe it depends on what degree you're finishing and where you're working maybe you work someplace that pays for your degree to be finished yeah that's that's true i could i i do plan on possibly looking at and maybe you don't need a degree. I don't know what you're going to do. Don't just assume more education is always the answer.

I want you to lay out, how old are you? 44. Okay, so what do I want to be when I'm 54 that pays $75,000 a year? Okay. And I've got 10 years. So what are my steps to get there? Now, that will get you out of that. Not in two years, probably not in three years,

but it'll probably get you out of that in five years. But sitting where you're sitting is probably a 10-year plan. Yeah. And that's really disheartening. So I'm glad you got a new job. I'm glad you got some support on the housing right now. And that keeps the wolf away from the door. That's good. But now we've kind of got the survival taken care of.

Now past survival, how do we prosper? Just real quick, I want to thank you. Because of reading your books, I actually started reading the Bible again. Wow. Because I would go back and reference the passages that you wrote in Total Money Makeover, and even though I knew I wasn't in the income bracket, it took me back to the Bible. So I started reading that again. So thank you.

Well, thank you. I want you to understand I'm not saying someone can't make it at $32,000 income. You can make it at $32,000 income. But you live in one of the two most expensive places in America. I do. To do that. And so that's very, very, very, very difficult. Add to that four kids.

Add to that sporadic, in quotes, child support. So, you know, you need a break. And you're thinking about it so you're not stuck. You're not stuck. You just need a break, and you're thinking about it, so you're not stuck. You're not stuck. You just need a path. You need a flashlight and a path on how to get out of this cave, you know? I'm following the baby steps. I'll continue to do it until.

Do that, but work on the income side of the equation or relocate within 36 months. Okay. One of those two things, and let's get you going in that direction. And hold on. I'm going to send you a copy of another book you need to read called Start. And you're doing a good job. You've already more than started. But I'm really proud of you.

Very well done with all the decisions you're making. And you are in the process of completely changing your life. I see big things for you in the future. But we've got to change the math of your situation. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Are high health care costs getting you down? Are you confused trying to navigate your options? Do you wish you could find an affordable, biblical solution to your health care costs? Based on New Testament principles, Christian Health Care Ministries, or CHM, helps Christian families, churches, and ministries join together as the body of Christ to share their major healthcare costs.

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chministries.org. Thank you for joining us. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Bob is with us in Springfield, Illinois. Hey, Bob, how are you? Great, Dave. How are you doing? Better than I deserve, sir. What's up? Oh, I've got a quick question for you.

I know you've got your formula for cars or things with motors. Where would you put a classic car in that? I wouldn't. It's a hobby on the side. Okay. And it's not a driver, right? It's a classic. It's a garage setter, right? Well, no.

It's a driver. It's a garage setter, right? Well, no, it's a driver. It's a 1967 Mustang convertible. But you drive it to work every day? Oh, no, no, no, no. So it's not your daily driver. But, I mean, it's drivable, but it's not a – It's drivable. It's not – you know.

Okay, I got a 1960 Corvette that's a frame-up restoration in my basement, all right? You can count that if you want to count it but more what i that that's not going to go down in value usually it's going to go up in value right but you it's not you have that's that's not your regular car that's an extra car right right and so it's it's more like a hobby but uh uh so i wouldn't count that in the things with a motor in them, no, you know, that are going down in value. So, like, you know, that 1960 Vette will go up in value. It's a great restoration. Your 67, what did you call it?

What was it, a Mustang? Mustang. Yeah, that will go up in value. That's a classic body style. That's wonderful. As long as you maintain it and it's, you know, it's in reasonable condition, you know, you're going to see some increases there. Probably already have recently. Yeah, it's been in the family since 1972, and it's been garage-kept the entire time.

Oh, yeah, that's a beauty. That's wonderful. Yeah, it's in good shape. I wouldn't call that my retirement investing. It's just a hobby that's not costing you money. You know, like that vet, it's a hobby. It's just something fun to have to get out and drive on the weekends it's pretty and that kind of stuff and yeah uh that that kind

of a thing and it's like you know i've got a gun collection it's not it's not what i'm planning to retire off of but i buy them right and i know a little bit about firearms and so you know when i buy something i usually make money on it's usually worth more than i paid for it and it's the type of gun that'll go up in value. Same kind of a thing. You can do that with art. I've got a friend that has a huge wine collection that he, you know, expensive French wines that he bought years and years ago, and they've gone up in value.

But you wouldn't want to bet your retirement on that. Right. That's just like a hobby that's not expensive or in the sense that it doesn't cost your money gotcha okay yeah can i ask you one more quick one yes sir because i'm actually um into retirement now and so my income has gone down about 30 percent um from just a matter of a couple years ago but do should i continue, even with this drop in income, we've managed to still redo the budget and put almost 15% in long-term mutual fund savings. How old are you?

56. Okay, and how much is in your nest egg? About $165,000. Okay, and how much is in your nest egg? About $165,000. $1,000. Is your house paid for? No. Okay. Should I stop that investing?

No, I would still work on both of those goals. I mean, I wouldn't be panicked about it, but I'd like to see you adding something towards retirement. Maybe it's not 15% since your income's gone down dramatically, but certainly the 15% is of a lesser figure now. And I want you to move towards that house being paid for. Because I'd love for you to have, let's say you're 67 and the house is paid for and you've got $500,000.

Right. That's where we ought to be headed towards. I mean, that would get you into a sweet spot there where we don't have to sell the mustang to eat someday yeah let's get the house let's move towards those two goals i'm not as it's not a breakneck speed but you're a young retiree too so um you know you may find some things you could do as an encore career that you enjoy and are fun and that make money more than you ever did in your life. It's not that unusual at your stage of life, by the way. See a lot of people having in their 50s, particularly their late 50s, what's called an encore career, that second bow after the curtain comes up, you know, and goes back down and all that.

And you come back out and sometimes you catch a sweet spot there, catch a wave. And I see people make some serious money there. But, I mean, if you just did something on the side that was fun and add $20,000 or $30,000 to the equation, you don't have to. It's just you're a young retiree, so that's a possibility. Jennifer is with us in Jacksonville, Florida. Hi, Jennifer. How are you? Hi, Dave. Thanks for taking my call.

We love your show, my husband and I. Thank you.. How are you? Hi, Dave. Thanks for taking my call. We love your show, my husband and I. Thank you. How can I help? My question is, I've been dreaming about this, and I know it's not the best thing to do on your steps, but investing about $1,400 over the next couple months into a new small business that has to do with the health ministry is actually, I know you preach about not buying supplemental policies and whole life coverage. I actually used to sell that stuff. And I just, from watching your show, I just realized that probably wasn't the best thing to do for people. And I'm getting out of that field.

My husband's in the Navy. We realized we have some debt, $12,000 in credit cards, $5,000 in his car. My car's paid off. And he's going more, he's a Navy reservist, and he's switching to more of an active duty Navy reservist. He's been working on base at a couple different ports this year. And I've been Uber driving in between. So what are you investing $1,400 in?

It's a new type of of business uh with uh health ministries i'll just put it to you that way i need to get llc set up and i would it's different than the insurance i sold before okay did you say health ministry well metashare and uh metiShare. Oh, I heard you. MediShare and also... It's just different than what I had done before. Why do you have to pay $1,400 to get into it? Well, I just... There's an attorney at work, and he said that for liability, I should probably set up an LLC. Oh, no, you don't.

No, you don't. You don't have any money. You don't have any liability. No. Nobody's going to come after you. There's no target on your butt. If you've got some money or you're making some money, then you. There's no target on your butt. If you've got some money or you're making some money, then you worry about having a target on your butt.

But right now, you know, you're not going into an industry that's heavily litigious anyway. People are just going to sue you just for that. But if you start making some serious money, yeah, put an LLC on it. But until then, you don't need to. And you shouldn't have to pay $1,400 for an LLC anyway. Well, I was just adding up some of the different expenses and brochures and time and investment, you know, taking off time from my other job. That was kind of a roundabout number I came up with because we are trying to pay off the debt.

Yeah, I think you work at beside your other job, and I think you spend very, very minimal money until you make some money. And if you make some money and if you make some money doing it then you can plow some of that money back in but in terms of i don't think it requires you know the startup cost here is just not necessary hardly any of it for you to go try this let's go make some money with this idea and prove the idea what we call proof text the idea in the marketplace let's put it in the marketplace and make it work. You go do it.

Not just a theory, not just a dream, not something somebody's selling you. You actually make some money doing it. When you do that and you put some money in your pocket, then you get you some more brochures. In the meantime, you just order 10. Just go down and run 10 color copies off and make yourself a brochure. It's really not. You run them off on your computer. I mean, you don off and make yourself a brochure. It's really not. I mean, run them off on your computer. I mean, you don't have to have a lot here.

And then when you make a little money, then do some more. You start making a whole lot of money, like hundreds of thousands of dollars, then get you an LLC. But until then, I wouldn't fool with that. Let's just keep this real clean and real simple. This is about making money, not spending money. And so I wouldn't do it. I would shirt sleeve it, bootstrap it.

I wouldn't do it otherwise. Thanks for the call. Open phones at 888-825-5225. You know, Americans get nearly $3,000 back every year in a tax refund. That's $250 a month you're giving the IRS at no interest. Well, that's ridiculous. What if you took $250 a month and put it into a growth stock mutual fund? How much money would you have?

Yep. Millions of dollars over time, right? $3,000 a year invested, that'd be a lot of money over time, wouldn't it? Yep. Well, get in touch with one of our endorsed local providers for taxes. They'll help you make sure you're not getting a refund because you're not putting in too much. And they'll keep you from spending the average of 13 hours preparing your own return. Drive me crazy.

People using ELP get their taxes done five times faster than those who don't, and the taxes are done right. There's a plan. Yeah, go to DaveRamsey.com slash tax prep and get an endorsed local provider for taxes in your area. Strongly recommend this. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. our scripture of the day proverbs 14 29 whoever is slow to anger has great understanding but he who has a hasty temper exalts folly.

Charles Dickens says, have a heart that never hardens, a temper that never tires, and a touch that never hurts. Wow, good stuff. Ashley is with us in Sacramento, California. Hi, Ashley, how are you? Good, Dave. It's an honor to speak with you. You too. What's up? So, 13 months ago, I found you doing some pregnancy and formula, best thing that ever happened to me in the middle of the night.

And my husband and I have paid off $46,000 in debt. Wait a minute. You need to speak directly into your phone. I can't understand you. Oh, I'm sorry. My husband and I have paid off $46,000 in debt in the last 13 months. We have $46,000 less in debt to pay off. We were paying about $3,000 a month in debt, but we now have our second child in daycare, which is costing $1,500 a month. So we only have room in our budget to pay $1,500 a month towards debt. My husband has a 4% 401k match at his job, and he is reluctant to stop putting money into that 401k match, which is about $200 a month.

I'd like him to stop so we can continue to pay off our debt in 24 more months but he thinks that he needs to continue. So I was hoping that you could help me have a conversation with him to stop paying that in. Yeah. So I have a pretty decent sized belly. It's

not as big as it was this time last year and I hired a personal trainer. And he tells me he's got a complete, like, a six-pack of abs, an eight-pack of abs, right? I've got a keg, right? And he tells me what to do. Now, he obviously has done something that's right with his physique that I haven't done. So I can either do this my way,

or I can do it the guy's way who's got the set of abs. Very true. You following me? Yeah, definitely, sir. Yeah. And so your husband is the guy with a keg who's looking at a guy with a set of abs financially, and he's going, I've got this figured out. And we're looking at his belly going, no, you don't.

Yeah, really true. I think I was, my husband thought I was kind of crazy to jump on the sand wagon, but he said there's nothing worse than a bad pregnant wife, so he jumped on and has got in. That's the wrong reason to jump on. The right reason to jump on is to look over and say, hey, this Dave Ramsey thing that my wife is looking at, this process of handling money,

five million people have used it to get out of debt. I'm in debt. I need to do something different than i've been doing my best thinking has not gotten us out i've got to do something different this is your husband okay he should be thinking this way and it's not to keep his pregnant wife from yelling at him it's because he actually looked at this logically used critical thought and said i want something i've had, so I've got to do something I've never done. I'm going to try a new system. This guy seems to have a proven plan. I'm going to buy in.

Then your husband's on board. Otherwise, you're just beating him with a wet noodle, right? Yeah, I mean, I feel like he's kind of on board. No, he's not. No, he's not. I'm doing this to keep my pregnant wife from yelling at me. He's not on board. Well, I mean, he's been on board in cutting our lifestyle at paying $3,000.

He's going along with you. He is not on board. That's true. So how would you recommend I get him on board? You're right. You're right. He needs to look at the logic of this and say to himself, am I willing to try something that I've never done before that is outside of my comfort zone

in order to get something I've never gotten before? Because my best thinking has gotten us into this mess. You know, my best eating pattern has gotten me a belly. So I need a different eating pattern. Right? Yeah, no, that makes sense. And so, you know, I have to submit myself to someone who knows something more than me and does something differently than me to get different results than I've gotten to this point.

A new set of knowledge, a new way of looking, a new way of thinking, a new way of behaving in order to get different results than I've ever gotten before. And that's when someone gets on board. And so just talk that through with them and just go, honey, you know, our best thinking has gotten us to this point. I want you to actually read this freaking book with me. Right. Tell what she hasn't done. And then you tell me how you are smarter than this system.

And if you can convince me of that i'll shut up about it but so far you know the thing that you and i have done together has gotten us in this mess not out of a mess we're not sitting here with 10 million dollars we're sitting here in a mess i mean if you call me up and you have a 10 million dollar net worth because you've got some system figured out and you're you know debt free and winning and your marriage is wonderful on the money issues and all that. And you say, my stuff's working, Dave. I'm not going to do yours. I'm going to say, hey, you probably ought to.

It's working for you. I'm not going to argue with you. But when you call me up broke and say, I want to keep doing my system, that's just not logical. Yeah, and I was hoping, I guess I just kind of hoped that with paying off $46,000 in debt in the last year that he would really see the long look of the plan and get on board. Yeah, kind of think he might have. Yeah, I mean, that's like looking at somebody who lost 40 pounds and you go, that's apparently working for you, you know? Yeah, so he's like half on board. He brought it down from he was contributing 15% down to four.

But I'm like, we could get out of debt and you know six months sooner if you stop doing that four percent we may but you know you're the horse in front of the plow plowing the field manually here and he's standing on the sidelines going you know that's a pretty good job you're doing down there yeah that's true you know you're carrying all the emotional weight here and so that that's he's not a bad guy he's just not on board and so sit down talk to him just say honey this matters a lot to me that you look at this and you intellectually and emotionally and spiritually engage this process and if we're not going to do it you need to do it not do it from a point of knowledge instead of standing on

the sidelines monday monday morning quarterbacking this idea after the game was already over on Sunday. You know, and I just don't want to do it by myself. I want your help, and I don't want to drag you along. That's not how marriage works. I don't want to drag you along. And so that's the process. And, you know, I think he'll get it i think you just got to mess with him a little bit which is what i've been doing in this conversation and so that's the

thing so good question you know it's a really good point to think about if you hire a personal trainer and you're not going to do what they said to do when you're working out and with your eating patterns why did you hire a personal trainer? Is that like a fashion statement? I mean, you know, and if you're going to submit yourself to a new way of thinking and behaving to get a different set of results in any area of your life. If you're going to go to a marriage counselor and you do nothing the marriage counselor says, you know what a good marriage counselor does?

They tell you not to come back and waste your money anymore because you're pig-headed and you're selfish and you're arrogant and you're not listening. And they run you out of their office. That's what they do. Now, a bad marriage counselor will just keep playing patty cake and singing kumbaya and taking your money and letting you stay in your slop but a good one will bust your chops and say you know you're you're just being a twerp to your wife you know you're being a you know a test pilot for a broom factory your husband you know you got to stop this a good one will bust up in you and you're either going to

submit yourself to a different way of being married to have a better marriage, or you're going to keep having what you've been having. All of these things are the way we intellectually, emotionally, and spiritually attack these processes. And so actually, it's not different, and our husband's not a bad guy. He didn't do anything wrong. It's just how we all have to look at this stuff and unless you take something seriously enough to engage in a new paradigm a new way of looking at things a new way of behaving you're not going to get any different results and that's what we do around here we shake up your paradigm this idea that you need a fico score they have to have a credit card to live we shock and shake up your paradigm. And we're really, really good at it.

That's why we've gotten more people out of debt than anybody else. That puts this hour of the Dave Ramsey Show in the books. We will be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus. Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for The Dave Ramsey Show. If you would like to do your debt-free scream live on the show, make sure you visit DaveRamsey.com slash show and register. We would love for you

to come to National and tell Dave your story.