The Ramsey Show - App - How Can I Encourage My Fiancé To Be More Goal-Oriented? (Hour 1)

Episode Date: February 4, 2022

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I'm out. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is The Ramsey Show, where we help you live your best life by being healthy relationally, successful professionally, and peaceful financially. Open phones this hour. It's a free call for you. 888-825-5225 is the number to call. I'm George Campbell, joined today by my colleague, Ken Coleman, and we are excited to talk with you

about whatever's going on in your life. Maybe you've got a career decision to make. That seems to be a theme lately, Ken. A lot of people looking to switch careers. I'm going to move over here. I'm more remote now. I can go anywhere. What do I do? The options are endless. We can help you narrow that down. Maybe you've got some money decisions to make. You're trying to get this budget dialed in. You're feeling the

weight of inflation. You want to get rid of some debt. You made a bad decision. We are here to help you. We're not here to judge you. And we want to be that helpful friend that you can call for advice. 888-825-5225 is the number to call. We're excited to talk with you. Ken, you just came off hot on your show. How'd that go? Well, we had a good time today, and one of the things we talked about, we shared a story that new data is out that we've got managers, okay, so leadership level of the corporate structure, whether it be small business or, you know, on up into large businesses,

are also leaving at the same rate as, you know, America's workers. So quick snapshot on what we're talking about here. So since August of 2021 up to December of 2021, we've got the latest numbers. Each month, August, September, October, November, December, we've had over 4 million people leave their jobs. Wow. All of those months, by the way, 4 million plus to make the math easy. Each one of those are records. So previously, we never had that many people quit their jobs.

Now, they're not quitting and going home and drinking sun tea and hanging in the hammock. We've got this big musical chairs thing happening. You remember that game, George? You're younger than me. Well, I'm millennial, but we had that when I was growing up. You strike me as somebody, by the way, is as small and as nimble as you are that you probably did very well with musical chairs. I was sneaky, man. You could just get right in there on the edge so what's happening is so so how does this affect the audience and their money so wages are increasing all right because of two factors okay you've got your normal inflationary pressures that the supply chain and the disruptions and things that the pandemic created that's one factor but the other factor is coming, you know, I would say largely in the middle back half of the first year of the pandemic, we saw big companies, Walmart, Target,

Best Buy, and beyond raise their minimum wage. Now, not the federal minimum wage, but they just said, we're going to raise our minimum wage. You're going to start a jobs at these companies at 15 an hour. All right, so fast forward. You see one do it, another does it, another does it, another does it. And so we go, okay, we're going to increase our wages because we want to entice people back to work. So this all starts to happen, and it just kind of builds on itself. And so people start going, wait a second, I can make $3 to $5 more an hour over here. I'm going to go over here.

Or I can make 15%, 20% more over here. I'm going to go over here. Or I can make 15, 20% more over here. I'm going to go over here. So when they leave, it creates a hole, the musical chairs. We all get this. So then companies, the only way they get people is the dollar. So as a result, we are in the greatest boom of salary or financial opportunity related to your work. So if you're thinking about this, folks, I can help you with this. So we will help you today. I mean, you want to talk about a big shovel, as Dave created this idea of the more money we make, income is our greatest wealth-building tool, you know, your job.

Yeah. And so it's also the greatest opportunity for you to get out of debt. And so now is a great time. But all that said, we covered the fact that leaders are leaving too. Because as people are leaving, George, it creates, okay, we've got a hole, now I've got to fill it. But I've also got to take care of the people that are here. And so there's also pressure coming from executive leadership or the small business owner for those middle managers or leaders. They've got pressure coming from the top to perform. Then they've got pressure from below them with the team going, hey, I need more, man.

You're asking me to do 20% more. I'm not making more. You know, mental health, burnout, all those things are real. And then, of course, you get the customer coming at you directly. So it's a disheartening piece of data because, as we know here at Ramsey Solutions leadership is the glue yeah of an organization and so we've got a lot of burnout for leaders too and that's disheartening and so we reported on that and of course we we deal with that on the Ken Coleman show every day and of course Entrez Leadership our you know wildly popular leadership division Ramsey Solutions

and the Entrez Leadership podcast I couldn't recommend that enough. You host that to give leaders the tools because it's all about people. That's right. Great reminders there. Fascinating situation. Yeah, so we reported on that. Well, let's go to the phones this hour. Cleveland, Ohio was where we go.

Joe joins us there. Joe, welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hey, how are you doing this afternoon? Joe from freezing cold Cleveland, Ohio. How can we help today? Let's warm you up. there joe welcome to the ramsey show hey how you doing this afternoon joe from treason called cleveland ohio how can we help today let's warm you up i had a question i'm 61 years old semi retired and my father passed away about a year ago and he left an ira for me which is approximately six figures i don't have a lot of savings in the bank account nothing like that my house is paid off in full so i don't have a lot of expenses praise my bank account, nothing like that. My house is paid off in full, so I

don't have a lot of expenses. Praise my father in heaven that I listened to him, so everything's paid off. But would you recommend cashing out an IRA like that or living off of it a little bit? I don't really have any much coming in, maybe some social security in a few years because I'm 61. Yeah. So you don't have any savings, any retirement savings? No, I don't. I was kind of a self-employed guy back here and back there and, you know, over the years, you know. Okay. It sounds like you got some background noise there. I don't know if you can shut that off so we can hear you nice and clear. Let me turn this truck off. Maybe that's a little better. There we go. Okay. So Joe, how much is in the IRA? It's about $100,000. Okay. Well, considering you don't have any retirement savings, this feels like this is going to be partially your retirement savings.

Correct. So I wouldn't go cash it all out and just have it sitting in cash. That feels like a bad idea. I would let that continue to be invested, make sure that it's being invested in good growth stock mutual funds in there. As you head into your retirement years, you're going to have to live off something, and Social Security isn't going to cut it. Right, yeah, that's very true. So how long do you plan on working for?

Well, I could probably work now. I run some tow trucks, and I help guys sell cars and things, so I could maybe do that another 10 years, I'm hoping. I'm kind of a healthy guy, you know, don't smoke, don't drink, don't do all that crazy stuff hey joe what would you say because you you're doing several things or what would you say is an average yearly income for you now and what do you think it could be for the next 10 years knowing we've got to start really you're debt free so now it's just piling on this this retirement

account what do you think you can make what are you making approximately maybe 45 50 working part time a year you know yeah so a lot of so a lot of expenses yeah so let me i'm just asking more challenging i think one of the questions you've got to ask is uh you're healthy you said you know i think you're still a young man um yeah absolutely it's perspective what if you work full-time how much more money this is the thing you got a answer on your own this is your homework assignment how much more money could you make working a full schedule are there some more desirable jobs given the holes in this economy where you can make even more and start to fast forward the retirement contribution joe if you don't have any savings i definitely want you to park some of that take some of that out as an emergency fund of three to six months of expenses. Beyond

that, I want you to invest and use this money that was left to you as a blessing to kickstart a new retirement fund, a new future for Joe. That's what I want for you to retire with dignity and not be stressed out once you're unable to work or no longer want to work. This is The Ramsey Show. I get asked all the time, when in the baby steps is the right time to buy life insurance? My answer is typically now. Life insurance is not part of the baby steps because it's needed when your family has debt and not enough savings to provide for their financial needs. That's when they're at the highest risk. And no matter where you are in your baby steps, it's a necessity, not a choice. This includes working husbands and wives as well as stay-at-home parents.

It's pretty expensive to replace those stay-at-home parent responsibilities. I only recommend term life insurance since it's the most affordable way to get the right amount of coverage and not break your budget. Go to zander.com or call 800-356-4282. These are the guys I personally use. Term life insurance is inexpensive, and your family needs this no matter where you are in your baby steps. That's Zander.com. Or call 800-356-4282.

Zander.com. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ramsey personality, George Campbell, host of the Fine Print and Entree Leadership Podcast. Joined today by my pal, Ken Coleman, host of The Ken Coleman Show, bestselling author. And we are here for you, America. What do you want to talk about? Money, career, life. We can do it all. selling author and we are here for you america what do you want to talk about money career life we can do it all we are happy to help walk you through whatever is on your mind whatever's keeping you up at night you need a little confirmation we got you george i just thought

you know i'd sweeten the pot a little bit okay if people are a little nervous they're going hey i'm not where i want to be in my profession i want to make more money i want to get a bigger shovel maybe they're just like ken how can i make more money to get out of the baby steps faster? If you call in today and you have a job-related question, guaranteed, we're going to give you a copy of my latest best-selling book, From Paycheck to Purpose. So if you've got that kind of a call, we're just going to go ahead and give you that book, too, which will help you no matter where you're at in your journey. Now, call with a real question. No, it's got to be real. You're not getting through Kelly without that.

No, well, that's assumed. Good way to sweet. And millennials, Gen Z, if you're going, well, I got a call. So there's an app on the phone, Ken. I don't know if you've seen this. It has a picture of a phone, which you may not even know what that picture is. It's like the old school phone. And if you tap that, you can dial the number, 888-825-5225, and you will hopefully be connected with the wonderful Kelly, and she will put you on with us to help you out. So the number to call, 888-825-5225. Let's have a conversation.

Will is ready to do that. Look at this. Will is ready. As I say it, Will appears. Boston, Massachusetts, my hometown. I'm very excited. Will, how are you doing? Hi.

Thanks for having me on the show. I'm a big fan. Awesome. Happy to speak to you both. We are excited to talk with you. How can Ken and I help? So quickly, I'm in the middle of a job change. I'm not.

So I was working at a major hospital here, and I got let go because of the COVID mandates. Oh, I'm sorry. And I have a new job opportunity in another hospital in a different part of the country, and they also have a similar mandate in place, and I'm trying to decide whether to even go down and interview. I was hoping to get Ken's perspective on how do I align my values with this choice of decision. Yeah. Well, if I'm understanding you correctly, you're looking at doing something similar to what you were doing,

just at a different hospital in a different state. Yeah, because I loved the work I was doing. Which is what? I mean, I've been a big fan of yours for a long time. Thank you. And, you know, that passion and passion and purpose hit all the boxes. What is that work that you're passionate about? Describe it to me. Well, I guess

I'm an academic researcher. I've been doing this work for 20 years. It's in medical technology. That's what you specialize in. Trying to help kids, trying to help people. You specialize in the research in medical technology? Yeah. Okay, great. And that's part of the problem is very specialized.

There's probably 10 places in the country that do what I do. Oh, really? Okay, all right. Now, that is a challenge, but I want us to – so the reason I'm taking you here is because – let's talk about the realities. I've not seen anything in the headlines that tells me that hospital systems – let's just call it that – are going to remove a vaccine mandate anytime soon. Would you agree with that statement? Is that close to accurate? I agree with that statement, yep.

All right. So we've got a challenge then we've got the challenge of ken what i do is so highly specialized and you've narrowed it down to there's only 10 organizations that even hire somebody like you is that what i'm to understand well that do this work i mean so that the flip side is is that my skills are very applicable to other fields. So my wife jokes that I was unemployed for a day and a half. Right, exactly. Because I got terminated, and then the next Monday I had a new job at a different company, but doing different work.

Right, so I'm glad you said that. Because, Will, let me just tell you what I think. Listen, I get hammered on the Ken Coleman show on this on the vaccine mandate, but I'm not a doctor, nor have I ever played on TV. I will tell you that I would like to wear scrubs to work. I've got to tell you. If Dave would allow that,

I'm in. I would wear scrubs. But I'm not going to ever give anybody advice on anything medical, whether I'm passionate about an opinion or not. So I'm not going to do that. What I will tell you is you know what you believe, why you believe, and then how you think you should live based on that, true or false. You know that.

True. Yes. I owe you and Dave Ramsey a huge, huge thank you because I've been listening for about three years, and I was set up in such a way that I could make my own choice and choose my own destiny. Right, so don't change it. I'm just not sure how to proceed because I'm being offered a job that I would really like this job. Well, ask them point blank. Ask them point blank because you're not – here's what I'm saying.

I'm not going to tell you what you should do about the vaccine mandate. That's your call. But you've already told us what you feel. You lost your job because you said I'm not going to take it. Yeah. So if you've changed your mind, or if you're willing to change your mind, then I say no challenge. But I don't think that's what's going on. So if they've offered you this, you get on the phone and go, hey, guys, thanks for the offer.

Here's the deal. I'm not comfortable taking it. Here's why. If that's a sticking point, I'm not here to fight you, but I just need to let you know that up front. What do you have to lose? Nothing. It's more of, so, I mean, there is an exemption process that I could go through. My wife's big concern is that if I take this job, what's to say that I'm not going to lose it in a year? Over what?

So the exemptions are temporary, right? So I could get the exemption this month and get hired and move the family down. But then in a year again, her concern is how do we trust that the company won't do the same thing in a year again her concern is is what god how do we trust that the company won't do the same thing well we can't in a year we can't so so therein lies what are you have let's go back to what we said i think i think the balance of our conversation and really how i can help you is is simply this you said early on in the call that your research skills and your experience are very valuable and transferable and i think you have to broaden your horizons the fact of the matter is you have an

incredible resume uh and so you are a very attractive candidate to who knows how many companies who just need an absolute you know uh bloodhound of a dog that can just sniff it out research it figure it out, make good suggestions, whatever it is, that's what you're really great at doing. And so that has all kinds of benefits. And there are private companies that are in that medical space. Obviously, that one makes sense. But I think you got to open yourself up to so many different industries. You are a world class researcher. And as long as you get to research something you're interested interested in that has a direct impact on people that you can connect your values to, you know this is what I teach, then it's open season. Go for it.

But don't subject yourself and your family to this move if it's going to uproot everybody and then we're back in the same place a year from now. I think you must take control. Control what you can control. I'm looking in other industries and other companies that aren't going to require the mandate. Right. That's it. That's what you're left with. Okay.

Or that, or you go get the Vax. I mean, so the draw is I really loved the work I was doing. You can still love the work you were doing somewhere else. I think it's a false narrative that, gosh, I loved it so much there, I'm never going to find that again. Because remember what I teach. You have talent. That's what you do best. You have passion, work you love to do.

And then you have a sense of mission, results you want to contribute to the world. You can find that in other industries outside of medicine. True or false? True. Absolutely true. Absolutely true. So appreciate the call. But you can do this. But you've got to do what's right for you and your family,

and don't feel the pressure to just take this one opportunity. But I would also say that you have financial freedom, and if the family's willing to make a move, and we see what happens a year from now, that's not a giant risk either, other than just a kind of a pain to kind of move the family around. So there's a little bit of a relational family component to this answer that I can't answer for you. You and your wife have got to decide. Yeah, I'm feeling the same thing. If I'm in Will's shoes, I'm making the move. I'm not going to be as worried about the, well, what if in a year from now? I'm just going to make the move if they're willing to have me. And I like being honest up front. And the family's willing to move. Yeah. Because there is a risk there of, you know, uprooting again. And I love that he's not. And the family's willing to move. Yeah. Because there is a risk there of uprooting again.

And I love that he's not wanting to waste anyone's time. Just up front say, hey, here's where I stand. Would you guys be willing to take me? Yeah. And if they say yeah, we make the move with the exemption process and move forward with it. I hope that he loves it. Thanks for the call, Will. A little taste of the Ken Coleman Show right here on the Mothership, the Ramsey Show for you this morning.

So make sure to check out Ken's show if If you've got career challenges that you are facing, Ken would love to talk with you on his show. You can get more information about that at KenColeman.com. By the way, we owe Will a book, a copy of my best-selling book, From Paycheck to Purpose. Hang on, Kelly will get it to you. We got you. Open phones this hour, 888-825-5225.

We'd love to hear from you. This is The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined today by Ramsey personality Ken Coleman. It's tax season, folks, and many of you have been filing your taxes with the same software for years. But are you sick and tired of the add-on fees? They sneak in there? Yeah, you've probably seen all the ads saying it's free to do your taxes with the same software for years. But are you sick and tired of the add-on fees they sneak in there? Yeah, you've probably seen all the ads saying it's free to do your taxes with the big companies. But the reality is that for most people, it's not free. By the time you realize you don't meet the free criteria, you've put in too much time to start over somewhere else, so you pay up.

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started today. That's ramseysolutions.com slash smart tax. Our question of the day comes from blinds.com. Their 100% satisfaction guarantee means even if you mismeasure or pick the wrong color, they'll remake your blinds for free. You get free samples, free shipping, and with the new promos they run every month, you'll save even more. Use promo code RAMSEY to get the best deal. Today's question comes from Andrew in New York. I'm 25 years old and I work in accounts payable for an HVAC refrigeration company, making $52,000 a year. I dislike sitting in an office all day, and I dread going to work. There's no room for growth other than two raises a year.

You don't hear of two raises a year very often. Let's keep reading. I've been considering the possibility of transitioning into a role as a mechanic in the field. I've already spoken to the supervisor who said I could transition to being a mechanic once I receive my EPA certification. I would take a $5 an hour pay cut at first, but mechanics earn much more and get six raises a year.

I would be making more than I am now by this time next year. If I start soon, I think I would enjoy the work in the field more since I enjoy being outside and moving around. Should I transition into a completely new career with an opportunity for much higher pay? Before you decide, I want you to spend some time with a minimum of three mechanics in the HVAC refrigeration field. So that either are three mechanics from your company, because you've already got some relationships or certainly inroads, or outside of your company. I don't care. And I want you to talk to people who enjoy it like not the miserable hvac mechanic because that's not going to yield you anything you know the idea of the right question to the wrong person still get you

the wrong answer you got to talk to the right person who loves the right questions to the right person and that's somebody who's been doing a while and enjoys it i want you to just figure uh as though you are doing a high school or college term paper with these mechanics do some research sitting with them talking about the ins and outs of what they do the long the easy the you know the long hours or the easy work versus the hard work the awful days the good days get it all process that and i think your heart's going to reveal to you whether or not you would enjoy if it's a yes then go ahead and do it yeah when i see i think i would enjoy it that worries me yes you may not yeah if he knows he's going to enjoy it and he knows that the five

five dollar an hour pay cut is temporary this time next year he's making a good bit more that's the kind of go backwards to move forward move i'm always in favor of this sounds like an easy move for me i'm doing it if i'm him as long as we do the right shadowing and we go yeah i'm all in yeah but if i was asking this question george what would your answer be no ken does not need to be turning wrenches right why george uh for about a thousand reasons mostly because it'd be dangerous for whoever's driving that vehicle because i don't have the talent. You and I are very grateful for mechanics out there. We are.

That is why I work hard so that I can pay a mechanic to do the work for me. There it is. I'm not sitting there on YouTube on a Saturday trying to figure out how to change my own brakes. This is it. No thanks, Tom Hanks. Yeah. All right. Let's go to the phones this hour.

Ryan joins us in Tempe, Arizona. Ryan, welcome to the show. How can we help? Thanks for having me on, guys. How are you guys doing? Great. What's going on with you? Oh, I got kind of a unique housing question for you. Okay. So I work in Tempe, and I actually drive up three hours from where I stay and live in the beginning of the week and then stay the week for work and then drive back down. And I really want to get a house around the Tempe area. Okay.

As you guys know, the housing market has just gone insane. I have no debt. And currently, up in Tempe, I am staying with, um, my boss who renovates the house. And so I've been able to slowly been, uh, saving up for a down payment, but I don't want to overstay my welcome there. Sure. You want an exit strategy?

Well, not necessarily an exit strategy, but a, uh, an exit strategy, but for me to be able to get a house and do what you guys suggest with only 25% of my take-home pay for the mortgage payment, I'm going to need to build up a pretty big down payment. Sure. So I don't want to bother my boss with staying there for another five years or more. Got it. So what's your income? So I make $17 an hour plus as much overtime as I could ever stack in there. Okay. And how much down payment do you have right now? Do you have any savings? Above my emergency fund, I have $5,000 saved. Cool.

Okay. Well, I love the idea of you not driving, making that drive every week. That sounds miserable. Yeah, it's not the most exciting thing. But the other side of this is you want to buy a house in a very expensive area while not making a whole lot. And so this is going to be a patience game or it's going to be a shovel game where we go, we've got to find some more money.

What's the number? What's the number that you need to save? What's the whole number for the write-down payment? Ooh, about $50,000. All right, so you've got $45,000 to go, right? Yes, sir. Okay. I'm wondering, George, and I'm wondering, Ryan,

is the move for you maybe to move to Tempe and rent and share a place with somebody? So we remove this. This is an emotional and mental drain. Right now we need to get rid of the drive. We need to get rid of the drive. And so why not move to Tempe if you've got to rent with two or three guys, right? You're an enterprising guy. You're not a creep, you know, fine. I think that's my move. Yeah. And then I'll tell you what else I get out of that move, right? And I have time to kind of look around, find some bargains. Let the market cool down.

Let the market maybe cool down some. I wouldn't get too excited about that. But the point is, you don't put all this pressure on yourself to buy when you move to Tempe. Let's get to Tempe, make life better by virtue of the drive being better. And then I got to tell you, with all that overtime that you can get and the fact that you have no debt, $45,000, George. It's doable. Let's run the numbers. How quickly could he actively save $45,000? Well, how much margin do you have right now, Ryan, at the end of the month to throw at the down payment with all the overtime and everything? How much margin do you have?

How much are you throwing into that savings account for the down payment every month? Every month I save about $1,200. Okay, so $1,200 a month is what you're saving right now? That's about $15,000 a year, and you need $45,200. Okay. So $1,200 a month is what you're saving right now? That's about $15,000 a year and you need $45,000. So it's $3,000 if we just stay at that pace. Excuse me, three years if we stay at that pace. Yeah. Ryan? So the question now, Ryan, is how do we speed it up even further? And I love the idea of renting with roommates in Tempe to avoid the drive, give you a little bit of even more margin. Are you paying rent right now, or is he letting you

stay there for free? He lets me stay there for free, so that's how I'm putting away over half my paycheck. Awesome. Okay. All right. Well, that changes some, but how old are you, Ryan? I'm turning 26 next week. Yeah. I mean, is it that big of a deal to save up for two or three years and wait? And your income will go up in those years, right? It should, yes. What kind of career are you in? I'm in the manufacturing world. Okay.

Well, I'd be looking for a salaried position where you can make more, which will speed up this process, and you can get roommates. But I think the idea of staying at the boss's place for three years, like you said, feels a little bit tight. I don't love that idea. So let's try to find a solution here. It may be a patience game. It may take you three years to do this, but it's absolutely doable, even with your income. So stay the course, man. And the fact that you're debt-free, you've got the emergency fund, just shows you can do this stuff regardless of your income. Whether you make $100,000 a year or $40,000 a year, this stuff works. Way to go, man. Rooting for you. This is The Ramsey Show. show. You are listening to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ramsey personality, George Campbell, joined today by my good pal, Ken Coleman. And we are taking your calls, America.

So ring us up, 888-825-5225 is the number to call. Hannah joins us in Seattle, Washington. Hannah, welcome to The Ramsey Show. Hello. Hey, how can a Ken and I help today? I was just calling in because I recently got engaged and I was wondering what's the best way to encourage my partner to branch out and try and figure out what he might want to do as a career would be. Right now, he just, it's a good job, but it's not a going anywhere, have room for improvement or financial gain type of job. And he's just very comfortable. he's been there for four years and i don't want to see maggie but i i do want to encourage him to try and figure out what he might want to do for the rest of our life has he told you he does not enjoy it no he doesn't hate it but he doesn't love it it's just kind of, it's a job where he has a lot of wiggle room,

so he can pretty much work as much overtime as he wants. And he's not working any overtime. No, he does every single day, actually. Wow. Like two or four hours every day. But you're saying it doesn't show much financial opportunity beyond what he's doing. Yeah, right.

And he seems very comfortable. In the last four years, I think he's gotten two raises, and they weren't large or small raises. They were just kind of middle of the road. What's the conversation been like between the two of you around this because i i know you've talked about it based the way you're setting this call up yeah what what give me a quick summary of how it goes um you know i'll ask him like oh do you have any like goals or dreams or passions and then it that's when it kind of falls dead what does he he say? Nothing at all?

No, I mean, he'll say, oh, I don't really know what I want to do. Or, you know, I have a lot of perks at this job that I might not get at other jobs. Because, like, if he asks for a day off, he gets the day off. Right. Granted, he doesn't take many days off. Right. So it sounds like he's got a good work ethic yeah he does yeah well so let me address this i'm like if you

had passion somewhere else you could succeed so quick and you could but you know but i love the heart of your question so here you are you're in this really interesting relationship role where you want to be an encourager, but it can quickly become, and I don't want to use the word nagging. You use the word nagging. I understand what you said, but I think it becomes you go from encourager to irritator, right? And it's like when you bring it up, the reason he drops off of it really quickly is people don't like to talk about something that makes them uncomfortable. Right? Unless you're just some psychotic jerk who likes to make people uncomfortable. So whether it be politics, religion, whatever, any kind of topic at work, when a person just doesn't feel comfortable talking about it they shut down would you agree with that yeah and so the reason he's uncomfortable talking about it

shuts down is because he doesn't have an answer and he might very well get defensive pretty quickly because he's like why are you asking that and so what happens is is when you bring it up instead of being this you know person who's behind him and i know you are and this person who's supporting him and i know you are and a person who cares and is cheering for i know you're doing all that but he doesn't see it that way he sees it as the person who keeps making me feel uncomfortable so i want you i want you to understand the psychology in this conversation so there's no no, like, one, two, three, four things that I could give you that you do for him. But I think what you've got to stop doing is asking questions like, you know, what are you dreaming about? Or what do you want to do professionally?

Because you already know he do is have the conversation a little bit more fun and lighthearted and hit him in the right times with, you know, have you ever dreamed about something? I was dreaming about this the other day. Like start talking about what you're dreaming about. Start talking about what maybe you're passionate about. And then he's not feeling like I have to come up with an answer for her. He starts to hear you, and then you're kind of making it fun and going, if money didn't matter, what would you do?

Just that age-old question. You know what I mean? Did you ever dream about something when you were 18? Now, that's one way to do it, okay? The other way to do it is I really want you to, you don't have to tell him you called this show, but I'm going to give you a copy of my brand new book. It's a bestseller called From Paycheck to Purpose.

And it helps people see, how do I get clear on that answer? What do I want to do? What would I be passionate about? And then how do I do it? So it's the seven stages of how you do that. And then I also want to give you a link to our Get Clear Career Assessment. And this is an assessment that will be fun for him to take because it's less than 20 minutes and just say hey if you take this this is going to spit out a purpose statement that we can kind of then have some fun with and it's low key low pressure it's going to tell you what

you do best if that's talent it's going to tell you what work you love to do that's passion and it's going to show you what results you care about from your work that's mission and and let him take that and then have a fun conversation about the results and have him go talk to a couple other people besides you about his purpose statement and then go you know what this guy ken says he says if you take that purpose statement it becomes like a job description and and so now all of a sudden it's very relaxed fun no pressure for him i think that's the best you can do. You can no longer make him feel any pressure or feel like he's got to give you a clear answer around this conversation. So

I'm going to give you both of those resources because that way it's not like, hey, and by the way, read this and then tell me what you come up with. Just go, hey, you know what? I've asked you about this before. I listened to this show, whatever, whatever. And just go, hey, check this assessment out. Don't ask him to read the book. Have him take the assessment. And if he wants to do more, then give him the book. I love it. Great resources. No pressure. Hannah, I'm just curious. Is there a question behind the question here? Is there like a number like, man, I just, I love this guy and I feel like he deserves better. He should be making

more money. I want to see him with more drive and excitement. Is there something behind that for you? Well, right when the pandemic hit, I was lucky enough to get a job at a company that I won't name just because of who they are, but they have a lot of benefits, and one of the benefits they offer their employees is a schooling benefit, which I jumped on immediately. Good.

And I, through listening to your show, actually, I'm really excited to read Paycheck to Purpose because I have an idea of the path that I want to go on, but there are some unknown factors that I don't know for sure if it's going to be the perfect fit for me. So reading that hopefully will help me as well. By the way, when you start to get enlightenment along the journey, just share it with him. You see what I'm saying? Yeah, totally.

But hey, George is on to something. I think you're afraid that if he stays where he is, you all aren't going to be able to have the life you want to live. That's what I think I hear. A little bit that, and also I just want him to be as excited about something as I am, I guess. I don't know if that's selfish, but I just know when I start, because I want to become a nutritionist or a dietician. I struggled with weight as a child, and I'd like to get into a field where I can help children to learn about nutrition before they have to go through that struggle of being overweight as a kid. And so I guess I just want him to have something that he's passionate about. Let me tell you something.

You're not selfish, but I'm telling you he needs to just catch it. He needs to see how joyful you are, and instead of feeling pressure from you, he just needs to feel motivated by you because he goes, Wow, I want what she's eating. You know what I mean? I love the idea of you guys bringing this thing together too. Maybe. That could be cool. You know what I mean? I love the idea of you guys bringing this thing together too. Maybe. Yeah, and ultimately

it would be amazing if we could maybe even be interested in something similar that works together because I would love nothing more than to have our own business and be able to work. Ooh, so start sharing that dream with him.

Hannah's dreaming. That's what we like to see. She's got to get her fiance on board too. She's awesome. She's got ideas for days. Well, Hannah, hang on. Kelly will pick up and we'll get you a copy of From Paycheck to Purpose and Ken's Get Clear Assessment. That will be immensely helpful.

That puts this hour of The Ramsey Show in the books. My thanks to my co-host, Ken Coleman. The whole team in the booth keeping the show running so smoothly. And you, America. We appreciate you guys listening so very much. We'll be back with you before you know it. This is The Ramsey Show. This is James Childs, producer of The Ramsey Show.

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