The Ramsey Show - App - How Can I Find Fulfillment and Avoid Bitterness? (Hour 3)

Episode Date: March 31, 2021

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I am Dave Ramsey, your host. Thank you for joining us, America. Open phones at 888-825-5225. My co-host today, Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey personality, best-selling author, and also the host of the Dr. John Deloney Show, an explodingly popular podcast by the Ramsey Network. Everything going up on that.

So be sure you check out Dr. John Deloney's podcast. Everyone else in America is. If you haven't checked it, you're one of the few. So be sure you check out Dr. John Deloney's podcast. Everyone else in America is. If you haven't checked it, you're one of the few. So be sure and do that. And you can participate in that show and call in on it. You can send an email in. Kelly will set you up to be a caller. Whatever you want to do, he takes calls and gets into people's situations with their relationships.

Man, anything you can imagine. Education, school, and and marriages and breakups and relationships and mental health issues and anything having to do with mental health and anxiety and boundaries and all that yeah yeah and we get into everything and we'll take those calls here today too the phone number 888-825-5225 asheville north carolina michael starts this hour hey michael what's up? Hey, Dave, how are you? I've got my nine-year-old daughter with me here.

Can you say hi? Hi. Hi. We are very excited to be on your show. Thank you for taking our call. Well, we're honored to have you. Dr. John, I've got to say I love your show. Whenever I'm having a bad day, I just listen to that. It makes me realize my life is so much better than some of the calls that you get.

I thought you were going to say your life's better than mine, and I was going to agree with you, but I appreciate you. So I had a quick question about 529 plans. My wife and I are debt-free as of last year. We just started a 15-year mortgage. Income's around $115,000, looking to be at about 130 here later in the year, and we have about 225 in retirement. I've been going back and forth with my investor. I was telling him we were going to take your suggestion and put about 15% into retirement, and he says because we're behind, he was hoping we could do a little bit more. I know that's his job to do that.

I was toying with anywhere between $500 and $600 for a 529 split between an 8 and a 10-year-old. And I just wanted your advice on what you would do if you were in my situation. An 8 or a 10-year-what? I have two kids. Oh, an 8 and a 10-year-old. Oh, okay. Yes, sir. All right. All right.

Well, if you get with one of our SmartVestor pros to get a second opinion, they will have you put 15% into retirement, and you can run a calculation out as to how much you need to put for each child to be able to hit the goal by the time they're 18 and have the vast majority or whatever portion. You say, you know, I want to have X number of dollars in that college fund by 18. Then you can back that in at current rates of return on mutual funds with a SmartVestor Pro, and they can show you exactly what you need to put in there.

What you're proposing is not bad at all. That's wonderful. I mean, that's $6,000 a year you're putting in, $500 a month. Obviously, the older one would get a little more than the younger one because you've got a shorter time frame to get to a college fund. And so, you know, it doesn't have to be a lot more because they're fairly close in age. But, you know, if you're going to do, are you going to do $500 total or $500 each? So the number is closer to about $600.

I was thinking of putting a little bit more in for the older one and a little less for the younger one. Yeah, that's exactly what I'd do. Yeah. And, you know, I would do that, and I would be putting 15% of your income into retirement. And above that, anything else you can find i'm going to put on the house let's get that house paid off and um uh so and again if you want a second opinion just click smart investor at davramsey.com and you can get with one of the smart investor pros the thing about the smart investor pros is they're going to always give you

uh advices that's congruent with what you hear on this show it's not going to be you're getting one set of advice from me one set of advice from them and then you don't know what to do right it should be anyway we're we spend a lot of time a lot of effort with them uh making sure they have the heart of a teacher and that they know what we teach here so that you go to them and you get you know you got i want to do this ramsey plan. Okay, the baby steps, here's exactly what we're doing. And then you don't have this push and pull of, well, I wish you'd do more than that. You don't have that kind of stuff coming out of that. Whenever I, in the past, and I've sat down with a financial advisor,

and when they say this phrase, so what are your goals? I always feel like I'm at a car dealership and they're saying, what can your payment be, right? And there's something about, I like going in and saying, we're going to do 15% of what you got, right? And then we're going to talk about where would you like to be and how can we fill that gap? But there's something that just feels oogie when somebody starts with, how much can I get you for versus,

let me teach you how this whole process works. Exactly. That's good. I like that. Terry's in Tri-Cities, Washington. Hi, Terry. How are you? Hi, Dave.

Thanks for taking my call. Sure. What's up? I want to know if I should start paying down my home. I'm debt-free except for my mortgage. And, um, but the glitch is my house is a manufactured home, but it's in a wonderful neighborhood and a great location on a cul-de-sac without any backyard neighbors. And I, I really wanted to get into a stick home, and I thought about it multiple times, but I thought, gosh, I'd end up paying $200 to $400 more a month on that,

and right now I have $7,000 to $8,000 in emergency fund, and I make about $60,000 a year, and I pay for my house by... Sometimes the answer to a financial question is very easy. If you pan out a little bit and say, 15 years from today, what is this going to end me with? And so if you stay in this home, 15 years from today, you're going to have a mobile home that is worth almost nothing. Because they will fully go down in value. Agreed? Yeah.

Yeah, that's not good. That's not good. And 15 years from today, if you pay a little more for a stick-built home, you're going to have something that's gone up 3 or 4x in value. Mm-hmm. So one is destroying wealth and one is building wealth. Uh-huh. And the comps on my house are now $245,000 five years later.

So I thought, well, maybe I should take advantage of that. Yep. Because it's not your house, it's your lot. Right. Well, yeah. The dirt is what's valuable. It is not the mobile home. Right.

100% of mobile homes go down in value. Uh-huh. I'm going to inherit my mom's house, hopefully later than sooner. And I'm 61 right now, so that was my other thought. If you want to sit on that until that happens, that's okay. But every day you own a mobile home it goes down in value that's what you have to think about so don't put more money into my mortgages about 840 a month it doesn't matter if you want to pay it off that's okay it's still going to go

down in value right nothing wrong with getting rid of the debt on it but it's still going to go down in value matter of fact i probably would get it paid off, make it easier to sell. You sell the lot and the mobile home together, and if you don't have a lien against it, it'll probably make the whole process easier. So that's not a bad thing. But don't hold this thing for 10 years. It's going down in value. you. Technology and digital products are changing every single day. Ramsey Solutions is no exception. We are working hard to produce shows and design products that will serve people well. But in order to do that, we need people like you to join us on the mission

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Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. About 40 million Americans filed for unemployment benefits in 2020. Congress passed a new COVID relief plan that changed the unemployment tax laws. If you took unemployment, your first $10,200 of unemployment benefits are tax-free from federal taxes. Don't claim them as income. However, there's a couple of cases where your unemployment will be taxed. If you went on during the year to make over $150,000 and took unemployment at any point,

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It's really easy if you've got an uncomplicated return. If you do have a complicated situation, get with a pro. Either way, we can help you out. Text TAX to 33789. Text TAX to 33789. Our question of the day comes from Blinds.com. Find out for yourself why Blinds.com is the number one online retailer of custom window coverings. You get free samples, free shipping.

And with the new promos they run every month, you'll save even more. Always use the promo code, the magic word, Ramsey. All right, today's question comes from Jessica in Washington State. Jessica writes, I'm a full-time mom with three children. My husband's job allows no time for him to finish, allows no time for him to give me a break. I'm one class away from a master's degree and I can't even find time to finish. We cannot afford childcare. How can I find fulfillment and avoid becoming bitter? This sounds like a multi, there's a lot in this question dave

i've been through seasons where obviously my wife and i both had graduate degrees we had a young kid we were trying to finish those and race and get done and there was times we had to trade certain things for child care we had to get really creative with having somebody come over and help out or folks from where we worked or folks from school, folks from church. But when we had to figure it out, we figured it out. And unless somebody's out, they may be out on an island here, so I don't want to doubt Jessica has gone to the ends to figure it out, but it sounds like she's got a challenge with her husband's job which below

that is she's got a challenge with her husband that's what i heard yeah um because listen i we've been through seasons here when i started this business i was working 16 hours a day right sharon will tell you she was like a single single mom. And when I think about that situation, if we had sat down with three kids and she's at home full time, and I'm gone all the time. I mean, I was teaching financial peace. I'm on the radio. I'm traveling. I'm speaking. I'm launching books.

I mean, it was about a two-year period of time that I was leave before dark and come home after dark. I mean, it was just, you know, it was working to get a business off the ground. And we were in agreement on that. She was not embittered by that. But if in that setting, as hard as I was turning it on, if she had said, I'm one class from a master's degree, this is pissing me off, I want to finish it, we would have figured out a way to adjust old dave's that's right uh

schedule uh because i love my wife and and that is a i mean if you want to go to back to school for four years that's a different equation you're one class that's why something else and you can't smell right he can't figure out a way to adjust his job on that ever in the foreseeable future. I call BS. I call, well, and the other side of it is how can you find fulfillment and avoid becoming bitter? You can't be fulfilled if you're in a one-sided relationship where somebody is not willing to sit down and have this conversation with you. Well, I'm not sure their master's degree makes you fulfilled. I'm not sure even getting a master's degree and going into a career is going to make you fulfilled.

It's the relationship issue here. But this is, I don't know if I, I'll just take fulfillment out of it. I'd just be bitter. I mean, come on, Bubba. Figure this out, man. That's a husband problem. That's what old Dave's reading into that. I'm not sure.

Well, yeah just just because it's do you find this that people like to blame the job and not the the employer employee there's been seasons where i think it was easier for me to get frustrated with my wife's employer or her to get in frustration for wife's employee with my employer than to sit down and say, hey, John, you're choosing work over us. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's, yeah. I mean, if you, because here's the thing.

If he is in a good career, in a positive situation, he's getting a ton of attaboys and affirmations, and he wants to stay there and get more of those instead of come home. With somebody who's bitter and unfulfilled. Yeah. And exhausted from watching three kids all day. But, I mean, yeah, he's like a hero there. And when he comes home, he's a dog.

So, I mean, I don't know. I'm not blaming her either. I'm just saying. Or, you know, he's just a self-centered jerk. I don't know. I don't know. I'm not blaming her either. I'm just saying. Or, you know, he's just a self-centered jerk. I don't know. I don't know what's going on. What I can tell you is bitterness is the paved road to resentment, and you don't come back from resentment. So this couple needs to throw a flag, turn all the lights on in the house, and say, we've got to stop this right now.

I agree. I agree. And, I mean, it might be, because here's the thing, too. Maybe there's, he's in a situation where for the next 12 months he's going to have to do this. And it's all seasonal, right? Yeah. But this all feels like it's fatalistic. It's forever.

And that's what's setting both of our signals off. Yeah. We've got flares going off all around our brains right now. But if you go, well, for the next 12 months he's going to have to turn it on, but the uh um but if you go well for the next 12 months he's going to have to turn it on but then i'll be able to take my class then you cannot be better because you can see your your chance of finishing this up and that's a reasonable ask but that's a couple coming together like a budget right and saying it's going to take us this much a month yeah to pay this off in this but there's an end to it that's right because you know but

but if this is like for the next 10 years, it's just his job. I just have to put up with it. That's so fatalistic. Right. That's just the wrong way to look at it. Because nothing is that solid. Nothing stays in place that long.

Andrea is with us in Grand Junction, Colorado. Hey, Andrea, how are you? Good. How are you? Great. How can we help? So I have a question about a home that my husband and I bought last July. The home was really old, and we planned to remodel it,

and before we bought it, we got people in to let us know about how much we were looking at as far as with everything we wanted to do. We've gone through Phase 1, phase two of our remodel. Now we're looking at phase three, which is a master suite addition. And from last summer to right now, what it costs to do that addition, we went from about $40,000 addition to now it's looking about $65,000 to $70,000. Did you change the plan? We did not change the plan.

It seems like, I don't know if it's just in the small market that we're in. Lumber prices are way up. Lumber and steel. Yeah, but lumber and steel both. Have you got steel in the addition? In a residential add-on for a bedroom? So it would be digging out a basement. So that went up substantially.

And then the lumber. No, digging out the basement did not go up. If you got steel I-beams across the basement to put the dadgum bedroom on top of, that went up. Right, that portion went up. It seems like the lumber went up. And then we did a metal roof, and that portion went up it seems like the lumber went up and then we did a metal roof and that also went up yeah yeah um if we're you know to finish that that part of it out yeah so my question i would put this project on hold bedrooms would you okay yeah because this is this is going to even out because the lumber factories and the steel factories both

i don't know if they're going to come down dramatically, but there's just this tremendous shortage because they weren't operating during COVID and everybody was still ordering lumber. And so there's this drastic shortage. And that's one of the things that's driving the prices up. I don't know that they'll come back down dramatically, but they're, I mean, nuts. They went up 30% in some cases, lumber packages did. But I had somebody come quote me on some new windows a few weeks ago. Then I got a text yesterday that said, hey, we just went up again. I'll hold your price.

But, I mean, it's everything. Yeah, yeah. So, you know, it might be that this addition is now unrealistic. That's my point. But I would sit on it a little bit. Let some of this go by if I were you. This is the Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage, Aaron is with us. Hey, Aaron, how are you?

Good. How are you, Dave? Better than I deserve, sir. Where do you live? I live in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. Cool. Welcome to Nashville. And all the way down here to do a debt-free scream. Yes, sir. How much did you pay off, sir? I paid off $19,000.

Good for you. And how long did this take? It took six months. Good for you. And your range of income during that time? $32,000. Wow. What do you do for a living? I'm a graduate student researcher at the university. Okay. Yep. What are you studying? What are you researching? Mechanical engineering. Outstanding. Good for you. So how do you do $19,000 in six months if you only make 32 how'd that work just cutting the you didn't make 19 000 in six months uh no well i i was a really good saver back in back in school so whatever oh yeah so go how much did you pull from savings uh like i had like between like five and six thousand dollars so i was i was pretty good saving beforehand uh for you yeah but it

was more so uh just trying to get that into place so what uh what fired you up what made you decide six months ago you're gonna get after it um so it was uh it was a march whenever the pandemic was uh starting and um and uh uh like you know the whole world was, like, on fire. Like, toilet paper was flying off the shelves. It seemed like the world was coming to the end. And then they were talking about forbearance with student loans. And I realized that, like, I had no idea how much, like, I owed. And I was like, okay, well, I need to figure out how to get on a budget and stuff. So I went on YouTube, figured out how to make a budget.

Like, it was like some college professor on YouTube teaching me how to make a budget. And then the next day, I guess because I looked up budget, you came up. And you were getting fired up over somebody trying to finance a TV at Best Buy. And I found that hilarious. But I found there was a lot of merit to what you were saying. And I bought your book right at the end of the night, and that's all it took. I love how a graduate student doing research in mechanical engineering heard a professor and then heard Dave and thought, I'm going to go with Dave.

I love it. Yeah. I love it. Well, you don't get good rants out of college professors like that they just they don't come off yeah well well done sir how does it feel now that you're free uh liberating so what did you get out of the total money makeover when you read it all in one night that that uh that you actually did so when somebody says okay well if i read that book what am i going to learn that's going to help me get out of debt what did you do it was really like uh a mental shift like it wasn't like uh it like you know like like you said if you were doing like uh if you're doing math uh like

you would have been dead in the first place so it's really the mental shift that like you know you're never going to borrow money again and you're going to be on a written plan from now on. Yeah. Yeah. Well, well done. So I've worked exclusively with graduate students. I've been a graduate professor myself. I've met a number of students in your situation, and it's hard to exist sometimes on those grad student stipends.

Yeah, yeah. exist sometimes on on those on those grad student stipends yeah yeah how did you manage to do that and be so focused on both your studies and pan off your debt it it was really like i mean like i mean like i said it was like cutting everything to the bone like it was like uh like moving back home like only buying food like that was a the great value brand uh like cutting my own hair like i mean like it was like i wasn't gonna say anything but you did a good job man yeah yeah yeah you should see whatever i first did i did not look good at all but uh yeah no it was like it really was like just cutting everything to the bone but like by doing that and not spending like any money at all like going out to eat or going out with friends it really made me focus on my studies too like and focus on my work

so like my work and like my focus was like all my work was like really improved by doing the program i'm usually in awe of the folks on the debt-free stage just personally i you're a superstar my friend man where you have pulled off and it's you know nineteen thousand dollars making 32 making six months with six thousand out of savings that's very impressive well being a student and an employee of the university too that's just extraordinary i'm proud of you man very well done who were your biggest cheerleaders uh mom and mom and dad they were they're the biggest cheerleaders they were uh very skeptical at first uh like you know whatever i was telling them that uh there's a bald man on the radio in tennessee giving financial advice they they probably cuts his own hair yeah

wait till you call your parents and tell them you're gonna go work for that bald man that's a whole other yeah i know man i'm proud of you aaron well done very well done aaron i'm proud of you too sir it's very impressive what you pulled off and that it sets you up to do so many other things later because it builds a level of confidence doesn't it oh yeah like i mean now i could go anywhere like you know sky's the limit like where i can like practice engineering like so what is your so engineering is your future career? Oh, yeah. Definitely.

Yeah, definitely. How far out before you start that? Well, I mean, like, I may be going on for a PhD here. We'll see. But for right now, it's just a master's. So, I mean, like, going into the workforce, maybe, like, you know, another three or four years. Okay. So, you're going to go and do engineering or you're going to teach it?

Haven't really decided that yet. Yeah, yeah. But the cool thing is you can do whatever you want because you don't owe anybody any money. Exactly. Yeah, yeah. So, I mean, yeah. Gives you a lot of wiggle room, man. Well done.

Very well done. All right. Aaron from the Pittsburgh area. $19,000 paid off in six months, making $32,000 a year. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. I'm debt-free!

Yeah! Yeah! Well done! Dave, the average listener will not know how hard what he did actually was. He swam upstream in a culture with no water. I don't know how. I'm just in awe of what he pulled off while also going to school. I mean, he literally had to cut everything.

I'm moving back home with my parents. I'm going to do nothing. I'm going to cut my own hair. That's a guy that said i'm gonna make the change now and what he did was really impressive well because no one around him no one no he's doing that and the math didn't work right it was if he had come to me i would have said hey man why don't you wait till after school and he said nope i'm gonna do it now yeah and went to all like you know all the great links to go to to get this thing done, man.

It's so impressive. It is. I remember when I was a kid going to a sales conference with my parents, and the guy was a positive thinking guy. And at first, I was really, really enamored with that, and then I went through a period of time in my 20s where I'm like, you cannot positive think your way into everything. I can't grow hair on my head just because I'm positive think. I'm not going to add a foot to my stature and be able to play in the NBA as a result, you know, just because of positive things.

So you can't positive think your way into everything. And so I kind of just set all that stuff aside and turn it off. But the more I do this in this chair over the last 25 years, the more I realize that belief that you can do it is more important. That's called hope. Belief that you can do it is called hope. It's more important than the math. It's that idea that, yeah, no matter what, I'm going to keep moving forward.

Well, I mean, because I'm having to ask him because the math didn't work. Right. I mean, he did not make $19,000 in six months. How do you pay off $19,000? You couldn't do it. It's mathematically impossible. Well, he took savings out. Oh, by the way, in my undergrad, I saved some money.

In my first year of grad school, I saved some money. Yeah, so I had this $6,000, and that changes the equation. And then I lived on literally beans and rice, rice and beans. It's very, very impressive. But all of that stems from I'm going to do extreme things because I believe, I hope, I have hope that, I believe that the result of planting corn is that corn is going to grow. I believe the result of this is I can see the math that I'm going to be out in six months, seven months, five months, whatever it is. So I'm going to walk five miles a day to get water for that corn. I'm going to keep watering it.

I'm going to keep watering it. People are going to say I'm crazy. Because I believe. I'm going to be tired. But if you don't believe, then you start going, well, people like me can't get ahead. And let America listen directly from an engineering graduate student. It's not about the math. It's about the psychology.

It's about the heart. Isn't that interesting? He can do the math. Talk about a guy that can do the math. But it's just like, man, I had to get my heart right. This is The Ramsey Show. We'll see you next time. our scripture of the day proverbs 9 9ruct the wise and they will be wiser still. Teach the righteous and they will add to their learning. George Patton said, accept the challenges so you can feel the exhilaration of victory. Amen.

Open phones at 888-825-5225. You jump in, we'll talk about your life and your money. Dr. John Del deloney ramsey personality is my co-host today max is i'm sorry mitchell is with us in chattanooga hi mitchell welcome to the dave ramsey show hey john hey dave um quick question i'm in the tail end of baby step two and i have a car lease or a fleece as you would put it. And the turn in is in June. So I'm wondering if I should pause where I'm at on the baby steps. I have obviously baby step one done, but should I pause baby step two to stack cash toward buying a new vehicle after I turn it

in and cover any expenses that I would have at the end of that fleece? Yes. To buy a $2,000 or $3,000 car? Yes. Have them try to sell me this thing out of finance? Yes. Okay. You're right on. That's a really brilliant idea. You've properly looked into the future and avoided an emergency that really shouldn't have been an emergency

because you thought about it six months ahead of time, five months ahead of time. You're going to be able to do this. Well this well done yes that's exactly what you should do right on thank you thank you sir there is a principle there that christmas should not be an emergency they don't move it right doesn't surprise anybody this lease is coming up that you know you're in the fall you're going to go to school these are not new pieces of information and so you know develop some kind of a game plan and that's what he was doing is shuffling you know moving the shell around hiding the p till we find a game plan to figure this out so i don't know how i'm gonna get a car i can't be walking i can't turn this thing in i

don't want to finance this thing i don't want to keep it it needs to go away and how am i gonna do that i can't say i'm gonna stop beautifully done good critical in. I don't want to finance this thing. I don't want to keep it. It needs to go away. And how am I going to do that? I can't say, I'm going to stop. Beautifully done. Good critical thinking. But people don't look out past freaking Friday. I was going to say, I have not read a book on it, and I could probably call a buddy of mine that's got some theory on it, Dave, but you've been doing this for a long time. What is this?

Where there is no vision, the people perish. When you don't look out past Friday. Yeah. Yeah. It's the car lease. It's Christmas. It's you're going to die, have a will. It's that your kid's going to go to some sort of secondary education.

I mean, it's everything. One definition of maturity, though, is just the ability to delay pleasure, the ability to look into the future and go, this should not be a surprise. No. The tires wearing out on your car are 100% probability that's going to occur. An oil change coming up is for sure going to happen. It's 100% probability.

And so you shouldn't need, oh, the tires suddenly went out on my car. I mean, you wouldn't believe the number of times I had somebody that the tires suddenly went out on their car, so they traded cars. Max is with us in Seattle. Hey, Max, welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Yes, hi, Dave. Hey, John. So I'm 17. I'm a high school senior right now.

And so I'll be a freshman at my state school as a business finance major. And I'll be living with my parents during this time. And so I have a guaranteed full ride for all four years. And this year, after tuition and fees, I'll have about $10,000 leftover scholarships for the first year. And so my question is, what should I do with this leftover money? Should I save it for after college? Should I invest it or give away part of it? That's my question.

Put it in a savings account to keep going to school with. That's right, man. You may want to get an opportunity to study abroad. You may get an opportunity to do an internship. Something else may fall through, and you may need this money. Right. It's 100% to be invested in Max's education. Nothing else.

And I can tell, if you're a business finance major who's got a full ride, that means you're a person who thinks ahead, just like we were just talking about. Don't overthink this. Just put it in a savings account and have it there available for you when you need it because you're going to need it. Here's the math for you, Max. You completing the degree and completing it debt-free is much more valuable, exponentially more mathematically, financially valuable than you can make on a mutual fund. Okay? You put $10,000 in a mutual fund, you make $1,000.

Max is worth a lot more than $1,000, because Max is a freaking bright student. And he's got a degree, not in underwater basket weaving coming up, or left-handed puppetry. He's got a degree that's very usable in the marketplace. So you finish this degree, you finish it on time, because you keep looking ahead

and you make sure you take the freaking classes necessary to graduate on time. It's amazing. It's a whole other story. And you keep this money set there. Now, let's say you go all the way through and you never need the money and the money's still sitting there. Well, then it's there to help you start your new job with a new apartment in the new city, maybe buy a little bit of a better car or something after you graduate but you are the

secret sauce in this equation you are worth more finishing this degree than any mutual fund will ever pay you i'm ashamed to say this dave because i'd never done the lost sunk cost math here but i was sitting with a group of folks in a think tank working through the how do we lower the cost of higher education, and there's a million different options on the table, and one of them was get out early because you don't do the math not only on the cost of this education but on the lost cost of unearned wages. Man, I went to the University of Tennessee with my oldest daughter,

the first one to go to college i'm sitting in the freaking freshman orientation and they go well 57 or 52 or whatever it is graduation rate and uh of the ones that graduate only% do it in four years. Oh, yeah. That 50% is on a six-year graduation rate, right? And so, yeah. And so I reach over on her notes and wrote in big letters, have a freaking plan. I mean, when I was in school, they gave us a catalog. I'm sure it's on digital now. But you look and you go, these are the classes I need to take, and they are all offered during the four-year period.

You can't schedule that. How do you qualify for a college degree? But, Dave, I don't want to get up. So lame. I don't want to get up before 11 a.m. Eight o'clock classes bother me because my beer pong gets interrupted at 11 p.m. the night before. You're giving me a hard time here, man. I get to the gym by 4 p.m., so I don't want to take any afternoon.

Don't get me started. By the way, that extra year costs money. That's what I'm saying. You can take a full load, not even a full load, and graduate in four years. But it costs 25 grand. I mean, on what? 100% of the degree fields. It costs 25 grand, let's say, and that's on the low end.

But if you were going to go make 45 grand at a job, it costs you that too because you're not working right there's a there's a cost on top of that that's true and that's where when i thought oh my gosh it's this it's the tuition plus the fact that this five-year plan i mean i'm sorry if you graduate in five years you can be pissed at me if you want but i every all three of my children graduated in four years because i said 100 of the money stops at the four-year mark, and I'm going to kick your little college butt. I mean, unbelievable. Just have a plan.

You could go to high school now and do dual credit courses. There's so many options you can take. You can get done with five years with a master's degree now. I worked 40 to 60 hours a week when I was in school and graduated in four years. So cry me a freaking river. Get done. Seriously, get her done. You know why I graduated in four years?

Because I didn't have the money to keep going. I didn't want to keep going. I wanted to get out and make money. It's like I was so broke I couldn't breathe getting through. I didn't want to live that life anymore. It wasn't party central no not living on my daddy's frat and my daddy's frat and my daddy's frat paying the bill it's not unbelievable man it's unbelievable so you got you gotta go to school so higher education you know

you can blame these universities if you want or you can blame your lazy butt for not following the dadgum syllabus well nowadays you could 30 to 60 hours in high school for free. Yeah. A community college for free. Right. And then roll in and be out in 18 months or 24 months if you want to. And then hit the workforce and get ready to rock and roll. So you get a four-year degree effectively in two years.

The number of students coming in with 30 to 60 hours, it was impacting the college bottom line because kids were taking the classes in their high school for free. AP classes. That's right. Dual credit courses. Dual credit AP and or clap out. It goes all the way back to what we were talking a minute ago. Just the number of parents I would talk to over the years. Good people

that just suddenly went, oh my kid's a senior. They've got to go to college next year. Yeah. Like it's a surprise. Like they just showed up. That's right. Christmas is in December. That's such a great line. Don't move it. Christmas is in December. Good show, John. Good job. James Childs, Kelly in the booth. Well done. I am Dave Ramsey, your host. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace,

and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus. Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for The Ramsey Show. If you would like to do your debt-free scream live on the show, make sure you visit DaveRamsey.com slash show and register. We would love for you to come to Nashville and tell your story.