The Ramsey Show - App - How Do I Balance "YOLO" With Saving for Tomorrow? (Hour 1)

Episode Date: June 25, 2021

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studio, this is The Ramsey Show. It's where America hangs out to have a conversation about life. I'm Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, host of The Ken Coleman Show on The Ramsey Network, joined by my colleague John Deloney, who is a Ramsey personality as well, and host of The Dr. John Deloney Show on the Ransom Network. And we together are here for you. 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225.

If you're new to the show or new to us, Dr. John Deloney is, are you licensed? I'm not. You're not, but you're trained. I'm intentionally not licensed. But you're trained. That's correct. You're a psychologist by trade. Counselor.

Counselor. By trade, yeah. Okay. Oh, I see. See, that helped me there, too. There we go. Bottom line is, you understand people. I watch enough Instagram that could probably come up with an answer.

Oh, I love it. You're an Instagram expert. I'm an Instagram expert. No. So, John, we could take calls., emotional health, mental health, relationship issues, that's marriage, parenting. Hey, one of the topics that John and I love to team up on is pretty nasty situations at work. Yeah.

So if you are truly in a toxic situation, not difficult people, but I mean maybe abusive situation, a really dead-end situation at work, we'd love that call today because John can dive in on that, and then I can come in as well. We can talk about an exit strategy. We'd love those calls, and then, of course, I focus on doing work that you were created to do, living and working on purpose specifically, but we look at the professional contribution. And then, of course, we're going to take your money questions. So if you're new to us and the show, welcome aboard. We're going to talk about life, whatever you got, and we enjoy it.

We have a lot of fun together. So John, you ready to go? You ready to get to it? Let's do it, man. All right, let's go to Anna to start us off in Fayetteville, North Carolina. Anna, how can we help? Good afternoon. Thank you so much for having me on your show.

I just want to say that you are greatly appreciated for all that you do, so thank you so much. Well, thank you so much, Anna. What's going on today? Yeah, so just a quick background. So I'm 24 years old, about to turn 25. I work full-time and I'm also pursuing my doctorate degree full-time, so just a little busy there. And so I'm in the process of looking for a new job and interviewing, and I'm just having a lot of doubts about my on my abilities as a young professional and always try to kind of self-sabotage due to my anxiety and doubts. And so I've always just been very hard on myself.

And lately I've been so stressed out that I'm just having a hard time focusing and falling asleep. And so I guess my question is, how do I get rid of these doubts and gain self-confidence as a young professional? And also, how do I begin to practice self-compassion to improve my mental health? Wow, a lot of stuff there. Let me ask a couple questions, and I'm going to let the good doctor start, and then I'll jump in for an assist potentially. What is the doctorate for? What is the goal? So the goal is to do healthcare administration. My goal is to become a medical director or a medical manager.

Okay, great. All right. John, you want to dive in first? Yeah, let me ask a couple questions. So where did you learn, who taught you how to talk to yourself in a way that you would never let somebody talk to one of your patients? I don't know. Who told you you were lazy and you weren't that smart and you're probably going to screw this up? Who told, who, who, where'd you learn that? Um, I, I, I wouldn't necessarily say that I learned it, um, from my parents because they've never told me, not being a failure has always been something that my parents have instilled in me.

So I was raised by a single mom, and it was difficult at times. And sometimes our parents, those we love, our coaches, our teachers, church leaders, the adults in our lives, they may not always say, hey, you're an idiot, or if you fail, you're going to let us all down. But sometimes they can imply that, you can pick that up. So it may be in the ethos. Here's what I'm getting at. The first and foremost thing is you've got to learn to talk to yourself in a way that's respectable and that is dignified in the way that you treat other people which i know you do you wouldn't be getting into health care administration if you didn't care about people you didn't care about patients and doctors you've got to start talking to yourself in a way that honors you right when

it comes to self-compassion, let me give you two things. Number one, some of my darkest seasons of negative self-talk, of self-defeating, just those loop-de-loops, was when I had spent year on year inside of a textbook, inside of a classroom, inside of working a full-time job,

inside of being completely and totally burned out at both ends, exhausted, no fun, no community, no joy, no production, just reading, reading, thinking, or thinking, reading. We were not designed to stay in our own heads by ourselves all the time. So what I want you to do in the middle of this doctoral program, in the middle of this full-time job, in this job search, is get out and do things with your hands with other people. Go serve some other people. Make a regular routine Monday night get-together or Tuesday night get-together, whatever it looks like, and you may be late on some assignments.

You may be behind. I don't care because at the end of the day, if you slide across the stage with your doctorate and you are completely burned out and anxious and fried, you be of no use to anybody including yourself right when you take care of yourself then you can do your best work then you contribute to yourself to your community to your classroom to your to your academic career then you start seeing success and when you start seeing success then your body feels good about you you can't talk yourself into self-compassion you walk into it right and i just i just want to ask you are you afraid of being your mom um yes because um she has she has um sorry um she has always taught me not to. She has always wanted me to be better.

And I love her. I love her to death. Hey, don't defend her. Don't defend her. Hold on. Keep going. Keep going. She has sacrificed so much for me and my siblings.

And I guess I'm just afraid of... Yeah. I'm just... I get it, Anna. Here's the deal. I didn't ask you that question to put you in a tough position. I asked the question because I wanted you to hear what I heard. You're afraid in this whole pursuit of the doctorate and the job

that you're going to fail because you come from not much. And I think you're having a hard time believing that you belong. That's what I heard, John. I want to tell you this, Anna. You have the talent to do this. You know it. You have the passion to serve people the way that you've envisioned it.

And you have a responsibility to be the best version of you, Anna, because somebody's on the other end of that. Don't you dare believe the lie that you can't do what it is you know you're supposed to do. You're not your mom. You're Anna. Now go do it. This is The Ramsey Show.

You've got a lot on your plate. A job, your home, your marriage, and your growing family. While you're enjoying the present, you can't help but think about your future and your finances. As you explore your options, consider Christian Healthcare Ministries, or CHM, for your health care. Their generous maternity program and budget-friendly monthly programs have been a blessing to members welcoming children into their families. Visit chministries.org slash budget to see if it's right for you. That's chministries.org slash budget. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by my colleague, Dr. John Deloney, as we take your calls this hour. 888-825-5225 is the toll-free number. What are you waiting on?

I mean, we had tears in our first call, John. People are ready. Yeah, man, it's a hard season for folks, dude. Yeah, let me point something out. You and I both, the nature of our shows, we take a lot of calls that have a lot of emotion around them, right? Work and purpose and then emotional and mental health relationships. If you feel like, as you're listening today, you're going, okay, I'd like to call John and Ken, but I don't want anybody to know it's me. We'll change your name.

Kelly will change your name, your location. You can change some of the facts around where you are so that we can protect you. You got an amen to that? Absolutely. And so we don't mention that all the time, but I mention it more and more on my show because I want people to feel like, hey, I can get some help right here. I don't have to totally expose me and my situation. I'm not going to get burned, right? Yeah, I don't want to get burned. So I want to put that out there. I don't know if anybody's supposed to hear that today, but we're going to offer you that.

Kelly will take great care of you because we want to help you. So don't let that be a barrier. Maybe today's your day. I don't know. Ken, I want to touch on that last call for a second. Yeah. A common, maybe the most common thing that, if I continue to unpack and unpack and unpack,

and sometimes these calls are hard because you get, you know, seven minutes or five minutes and that's it, is we have so many voices looping around in our heads that may have come from a parent, may have come from a coach or a teacher, whoever, an old boyfriend or whoever. And over time, that voice, that thing they said that hurt us, that lived in us, we're not going to be enough, you're not going to do that, you might as well just do this, you're not going to make it, whatever that negative talk is, it morphs into our voice.

And we walk around thinking that we're mostly pretty honest and that we're mostly pretty smart, right? And when we start telling ourselves those things in our own voice, we believe it. And then our bodies literally respond chemically to that truth that is, you're probably not going to make it. You're probably not that smart. You're not. We aren't doctorate people, right?

You're not senior leader. We are nurses. We are not doctors, right? We are not, right? Whatever the hierarchy is, they're not, you know, senior leader we are nurses we are not doctors right we are not right whatever the hierarchy is they're not you know not to belittle nurses but at some point you've got to get around other people that you trust whether that's calling the show whether that's getting a group of people and let new voices into your heart and so they challenge it right that say no and you're not crazy when you feel like i'm not enough because that's what you know that's what you've been told and you got to get some encouragement around you got to get some people

who've walked alongside you to help you say nope we're going off into the jungle off the normal path and we're going to create something new i want to stay here i just think somebody needs to hear this yeah i'm so glad you brought us back we're and john's talking about the call in the last segment uh this is a bright bright woman uh i mean about to be 25, on her way to a doctorate. And just, I don't have any confidence. And you asked her, where did you learn to talk to yourself that way? I love that position. William James, considered widely the father of modern psychology.

One of my favorite William James quotes. I'm sure you've heard it. No matter how absurd something is, I want everybody've heard it. No matter how absurd something is, I want everybody to hear this. No matter how absurd something is, if it is repeated often enough, people will believe it. He said that.

Haven't you checked out the news the last year or two? Yes, but I don't want to get into that thing. I'm saying that to your point. This is the guy who's considered one of the gurus. And he's right. Just say it enough. When we first hear it, sometimes it's absurd, but we hear it a couple times, three, four times, five times. And all of a sudden, to your point, you begin to believe it.

And then once we believe it, is that when it becomes our voice? Well, what happens is when you believe it, you start seeing it everywhere. Oh, isn't that the truth? Right? Isn't that the truth? I kind of screw stuff up. I'm kind of a loser. Then, when somebody honks at you on the highway, you go,

they think I'm a loser. They think I'm a terrible driver. Or when your boss says, hey, great job on this report. I need you to change the font next time. You go, oh, because I suck at writing. Instead of going, you missed the whole hey, great report, or you missed the whole hey, I just wasn't

paying attention right no you're not a crappy driver you cut somebody off move on with your life right so

it works the other way though Ken when you look at your kids and you hold them in their face and you say hey I want you to know I saw how you just

talked to your sister you treated her with respect and I wanted to let you know that that honored her that honored my family and that's my daughter that honored me son and i'm proud of you yeah when you catch your kids doing right they begin to stand up a little taller when you when they mow the yard and you call them back out and say hey you did a good job but you're not finished yep and they learn how to do a good job not through you just praising them mindlessly and

nonsensically but you call them back and you call them back, then it works the other way. They begin to see that. They start to see, hey, I'm pretty good, right? That's exactly right. And so it works both ways. But when you find yourself, so here's where that last call got me. I got a book deadline. I got chapters due on Wednesday. My family left town on purpose so that I could have some writing time again.

I saw the cookie dough. I'm laying eggs, man. Oh, you're have some writing time. Yeah. Again. I saw the cookie dough. I'm laying eggs, man. Oh, you're not getting it done. I'm struggling. Struggling? I'm really struggling. Struggling to focus? Anybody who's written a book knows you can find these moments where it's just you get stuck,

and it's just like you're walking a quagmire, and then the talk comes. And these stories I've been telling myself since I was a middle schooler. Give me one. Right? You willing to share? Yeah. Give me one. Give me one you heard last night. This morning. This morning. I'm writing. schooler. Give me one. Right? You willing to share? Yeah. Give me one. Give me one you heard last night.

This morning. This morning. What I'm writing is this. Who are, you know why you can't think of X, Y, and Z? Yeah. Because you've got no business doing this. Yeah. Yeah.

You're over your head. Who do you think you are? You know what I mean? Right. And it's like, oh, yeah. And then you go back and try to read the top paragraph and read through it again. And you realize, that's probably not that great of a paragraph. You start seeing it everywhere, right?

And the loop comes back. And then all of a sudden, I'm just going to go, you know what would make this feel better? Diet Coke and cookie dough for breakfast. That'll solve my problem. Right? Right? Or I'm going to scroll through Instagram for a while. So you get in these negative loops.

And so I've been where she is. Sure we have. I have too. When you're at the end of a doctorate program and you're thinking, I am fried, cooked, burned. I'm exhausted. And all those old stories, wherever they come from. Yeah. Right?

And so, man, get around other people to care your body, to care your minds. And when you have those seasons of where you're just beating yourself up, man. Yeah. Stop. Yeah, I agree. I just add to this practically real quick. When we confuse ourselves, because that's confusion.

It's nonsense. It's nonsense, but it kind of confuses us because I'm on this path to a PhD, and yet I've got these voices going, you don't belong. It's a confusing time. Right. So one little thing that I think people need to do,

and I try to remind people on the show, is let's retreat back to clarity for a second. Let's retreat from the dialogue and let's come back. And what you're saying is right. And many times retreating to clarity is in the safety of the clarity of people who know us well and can be objective and tell us the truth. And say, you're not an imposter. You really are bright. And you're going to crush this PhD program or whatever the thing is. And

actually, you've always been this kind of person who just loves people or jumps in and whatever the type of work is or whatever the journey is leading towards. And when we can kind of retreat back and go, wait a second, I do have what it takes. I actually have the talent

from the creator of the universe. I actually love this. And it matters deeply to me. It's a wonderful elixir to fear and doubt. And we can get some facts. Let's call this what it is. There's the other side of that, which I know there's people driving down the road going,

oh yeah, but, so yeah, let's just acknowledge it. Having a bunch of you go bros around you isn't helpful either. No, no, that's right. I need somebody in my life who did this morning who said, just start writing. Yes. Stop all the nonsense, Deloney. Start putting words on a paper.

Right? So there is people who call you out. Yeah. I'm really glad you said that. This is not going to the posse who just says, man, you got it. You go, girl. You're right. It's somebody specifically saying, you have the talent to do this. You got the passion. You're going to have to wake up and do it.

So I want three pages by 10 o'clock. Yeah. Who cares? Whatever the thing is. So it's both and. That's right. That's good. I love doubling back on, we got to have people in our life.

You got to be a steward of your body and your mind that's right and you gotta have those moments where you can stop and honor yourself and talk talk dignified to yourself i think it's nearly 80 year study from harvard the largest most impressive study on relationships in history and they've come up with a conclusion that says 95 percent of your success or failure 95 percent of your success or failure. 95% of your success or failure in life is based on people you hang out with. That's who you're married to. And you know who we hang out with a lot? That person in the mirror. That's the truth.

We often treat that person like crap. That's the person we listen to the most. And treat the worst. All right, good stuff. All right, 888-825-5225 is the number. What are you waiting on? Dr. John Deloney, Ken Coleman, waiting on you. This is the Ramsey Show continues.

Thrilled to have you with us. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by my colleague, Dr. John Deloney. We're taking your calls about life, relationships, your work, your money. Whatever you want to talk to us about, we will take the call. Well, I guess it's not whatever. We're not going to do sports talk. I'll do sports talk. I'd love to do sports talk, but James doesn't even know what sports is. Our lovable producer is just such a music guy.

Kelly knows way more about sports than James. And so that's a little awkward for James. But your producer, Madison, knows more about sports than all of us combined. Well said. Touché. Touché. Hey, John, before we get to the calls, I know a lot of people out there are busy. My goodness, summer is busier than the school year.

My wife, Stacy, is running around like crazy from ball practice to the grocery store. And you kind of forget sometimes what your kids are doing, what they're watching, but they're learning from you. More is caught than taught, and that's especially true about money. For most kids, the best financial education they'll get is watching how you handle your money. So this summer, we want to help you teach your kids about money and make it fun. The Adventure Pack is a family favorite. That includes the new Storytime Collection, Financial Peace Junior, the Smart Saver Bank, and more.

And each sibling can get their own kit. Or if you've got a teen who wants to make some money, the Teen Entrepreneur Toolbox, I've got one in my house. Fabulous tool. Show them how to safely start their own business this summer. They can turn their hobby into a real business. You can teach your kids the right way to handle money while they're young so they never have to deal with money mistakes like maybe you did or are doing.

This week, you can save up to 80% off by shopping the kids and teen sale by going to the online store at ramseysolutions.com. That's ramseysolutions.com slash store. That's ramseysolutions.com slash store. All right, let's go to San Antonio, Texas, where Jim joins us on the line. Jim, how can we help? Hey, guys. How are y'all? We are living the dream.

Jim, what are you doing? Well, I think we are, too. Good. This week, we hit our EDM. Yeah. That's everyday millionaire for newbies. Way to go, Jim. We took the Financial Peace University class back in the 90s.

Did they have color TV back then? Oh, John. I'm 62 now. All right. It was tough. It was through our church. A couple mentored us, and we took the class, and it was hard just getting started. I took sack lunches to work.

I worked as much overtime as I could. I probably deprived my children a little bit of fun. So we nitpicked on our budget a lot. And I was able to pay the house off in 15 years instead of a 30 year note. And we started investing in a ranch and bought it at negotiated half price. Um, so now my wife wants to celebrate our 40th anniversary big. So I'd like to take her on a cruise next summer. I'm guilty as heck because I've never seen money like this.

I mean, it's real estate. The ranch is paid for. The house is paid for. Jim, take her on the cruise, brother. Stop talking and flip the cruise. Why are we even talking to you? What are you doing? I grew

up in a large family. A large family. And for Christmas, we would get those little plastic G.I. Joe men. Yeah, I love those things. And they'd put five or six of them in a paper bag and staple it and put your name on it. Yeah. Jim, Jim, Jim, Jim, Jim, you're just doing it again. John, please help this man with all this guilt he's experiencing.

What is going on here, John? Break this down. Jim, your heart is good. Yes, you're a great down. Your heart is good. Yes, you're a great guy. Your model is good. And somewhere along the way, stuff was had by people who were other than you. They were the other, right? And now there's a psychological shift where you've become the other.

And you're still Jim. You're still a great guy. You're still a good guy who loves his wife, who loves his kids, who works really hard, who's diligent, who has taken years and years to do things right. Go on the cruise. And listen, enjoy every

second of it. And if you can't breathe, donate some money to a local charity, to a local church to make yourself feel better. You don't need to do that. You've earned it. My guess is you're already somebody who gives generously go on the cruise that poor woman has put up with you for 40 years yeah i mean jim buy her a dress for every day of the cruise you need to let go man 40 years spring for the like the all the drinks all the everything listen and you got to go on that weird water slide, all the weird crap.

You've got to do all of it. Go-karts and everything, Jim. Do an excursion every day. You've got to go blow some money, Jim. You've got to blow some money. It's therapy, right, John? Don't do that. In all seriousness, Jim, here's what's going to happen.

Here's what's going to happen. It's a transition. Here's what's going to happen. It's that transition that was stuck in our head back on that first day was live like nobody else so one day you can live like nobody else. Which is now. That's now. And you're going to realize that the beauty of all of this was the journey. The beauty was you locked arms with the most important woman on the planet for you, and you all walked through hell and back together. You sacrificed your time, your kids, your dreams, all that stuff, but you did it together, and you all are tough, and you're resilient,

and you raised great kids. You're a member of your community. Go on a cruise. Yeah, my goodness. Okay? And enjoy every second of it. I'm over it so much. Yeah, listen. Budget.

Let me explain my blow some money. He needs to budget the old envelope, the blow envelope. They need to go spend some money on the cruise. He needs to live like no one else on this cruise and celebrate 40 years of matrimony, man. That's exactly right. All of it, man. Just go. Do an excursion.

Get her some jewelry i mean dude man way to go it's just say if you feel bad on the way back give some money away but you won't right man go you've worked hard brother good for you um let's break that down because we get that call on a regular basis yeah you started there i mean there is a – is it guilt or shame? Both. Combo? Both. Why? So because it's about identity, right? And what often happens to Dave, and I've talked about it often, our identity shifts into I was a failure, and when I cross this finish line, which is debt-free,

everything's going to be okay, and it's not. And then the bar moves to when I become an everyday millionaire. Then I'm going to be okay. And it's not. And then the bar moves to when I become an everyday millionaire. Then I'm going to be okay. There is no external solution to internal holes, right? There is that childhood poverty where you got three little army men. And your mom and dad said be happy with it. And they were. And that's okay.

And his mom and dad were busting their butts to make that work, right? That's okay. That's right. And his mom and dad were busting their butts to make that work, right? That's great. But there's this move, this idea that if you've worked really hard for 50 years and you've done things the right way and you've amassed wealth, that you're somehow a bad person, that you're not a good human anymore, right? Or that you somehow – and it's all about that spirit. A million dollars isn't going to heal you but it's not going to kill you either right so go on this trip it's about identity am i somebody who looks at others or am i somebody who works really hard towards a goal i get it and we're going to move on right yeah it's incredible work man yeah it really is since the 90s 30 years yeah Yeah. Yeah. And painful. Yeah. He still feels the pain.

That's right. Same as Dave will tell you. I remember the moment I got the bank notice. Yeah. The same as I remember my senior year in high school when I dropped the baton in first place in the mile relay. I remember that. And it ricochets through your life. Yeah.

Except for the fact that you have changed your lifestyle. Yeah. And you're never going to go back. No. So use the budget to go on the cruise. And enjoy it, man. And just have a blast. And take your grandkids out to the ranch.

Yeah, I love it. That's good for him, man. Jim, we really appreciate you. Happy anniversary. Yep. 40 years. We didn't even talk about that. That's incredible. 40 years. What a milestone, man. That's big. We're all trying to get on that team. You anniversary. Yep. 40 years. We didn't talk about that. That's incredible. 40 years.

What a milestone, man. That's big. We're all trying to get on that team. You're a unicorn. That is quite an accomplishment. And you're a good dude. We're having some fun with you because we want you to go enjoy the fruits of your labor. That's the whole reason. I think John's right. As you're on that cruise, reflect on how great the

journey itself was, not the fruits. Alright, don't move. More of your calls coming up next. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show, America. Thrilled to have you with us. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by John Deloney, and we are taking your calls this hour, 888-825-5225.

Let's go to Anna, who joins us in Olympia, Washington. Anna, how can we help? Hi, guys. Thanks for taking my call. I wanted to get your input on trying to balance kind of a live for today attitude with long-term paying off debt and savings goals. I'm an emergency medicine doctor and, you know, see people who have sudden death or I walk in a room and diagnose somebody with cancer out of the blue, and so I have this kind of perspective that I don't really know how long myself or my family members have, and so balancing that live for today versus paying off medical school debt, et cetera,

just hoping to get your perspective. Yeah, that's a very interesting perspective that you have. It's kind of in your face all the time. So I've spent several years researching and walking alongside doctors and the mental health of doctors. And one of the things that is – and same with lawyers, same with preachers. Obviously, I grew up in the home of a homicide detective. And one of the bellwether moments for me was when I realized that those who work in the pain of other people's for a living, over time their bell curve begins to shift.

And so I've got this funny, it's a funny family story that wasn't funny at the time. Now it's funny. I was a kid. My dad took me to baseball practice i was like 10 i was in this suburban north houston little community um the worst thing i ever knew that happened is somebody spray painted something on somebody right i mean nothing big and i left the back door open standing wide open when we went to baseball practice behind a, a fence that was locked. We got home and my dad looked at me and he said, the door's open. And he went, he proceeded to clear the room as though it was a police scene, as though it was a military scene.

And I remember being nine or 10 and we laugh about this now. I remember being nine or 10 thinking that's a bit much, you know what I mean? But here's the thing. Yeah. A hundred percent of his day was dealing with things that statistically never happened to anybody except it does. Right. So fast forward to your situation. You're a doctor who all day, every day, what you do is you go into people's, this is never going to happen to me, and you tell them, but it happened to you. And over time, that secondary trauma weighs you down.

It begins to infiltrate the way you see the world. Think of it as bricks in a backpack. It begins to lean you over too. You're not hurting, but you're experiencing other people's pain all day long, all day long, all day long. And it begins to shift the way you see the world. It's a new pair of glasses. It makes you think, what does it even matter? I could just get hit by a car on the way out of here. And there's a gift to that. You know how precious life is. Most people don't. And there's a weight to that, which is you could get hit by a car and you probably won't. And so I've lived in that same thing, working in crisis, working hard conversations with folks day after day after day for year after

year after year. And the way I balance that is recognizing it could. And so I'm prepared for the it could, but also living like it probably won't because it probably won't. Does that make sense? Yeah, yeah. I'm just curious. Anna, is there a specific area of tension where you're going, I'm busting it right now, maybe? Give us a little bit more detail about where this tension. It's a really brilliant question, and I think John diagnosed it beautifully.

But I'm just curious, where's the practical tension for you right now? Well, as you guys know, the training is long. So, I mean, I was gazelle intense with my entire life for like seven years. And the loans and the money became like this idea of monopoly money. So when I came out, I was probably negative $ 900K with my doctor house, my two cars, all my student loans, and it really didn't mean anything. And then there was this weight after a few years on me of, you know, what is weighing me down? And when I actually looked at it, it was like, oh my God, if something happens to me, my whole family's life is going to be destroyed.

And so working back to like, you know, get that paid down, get that paid down. But just after a while, it's like, okay, do I not go on vacations with my kids just with that enormous amount of debt, you know, that's going to take a decade to pay off? Do I put off those vacations with my kids? Do I work more to make more money to get the shovel bigger to pay it off, when, you know, again, I have these experiences where I'm taking care of pediatric cancer patients, or a 40-year-old woman who comes in bed, you know, that was totally healthy, that is my same age, and so it just, the idea of putting vacations off, missing their ballgames to work more, all that,

even though I know, you know, yeah, I need to get out of debt. It's just, it's hard to trade that, you know? You're exhausted. Yeah, you're exhausted. I mean, that's, let's just own that. Are you a double income, one income? What's the situation? I'm just one income.

My spouse stays home to stay at home with the kids. What's your debt situation right now? Yeah, I get it. And I think that the kids. What's your debt situation right now? Yeah, I get it, and I think that's great. What's your current picture? I'm about half. Yeah, I've got it down by about half. I'm about $400 still in debt with my house and student loans. Okay, so let's take the house out of it.

Yeah, how much loans? How much in student loans? About $120. Okay, you are gazelle intense for $120 more, and then you're going to go on a vacation. Got it? And I'm serious. Yeah. We even have separate baby steps for each one of those things.

Credit card debt. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? And you can knock that out. You're what, an emergency room doctor? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yes, you can crush that out. You're what, an emergency room doctor? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yes, you can crush that 120.

And then chill, relax on the house. So we put the house in baby step six. Right. Okay, and we do that on purpose. So you're a lot closer than you realize. And I also think that you've paid enough off. Are you guys not taking vacations? Is that where you really are?

You've not taken vacations in years? No. No, we have. But then I have this guilt of like, oh, that money could have gone towards the debt. And my student loans are low 2% and would go away if I die. So it's kind of like, well, is my priority paying off my house? So if something happens to me, my young kids and my spouse will have somewhere to live, and my student loans go away.

So it's just a strange situation. Yeah. You know what, John? On this situation, I mean, okay, I'm trying to sit here. I hear what she's saying. You paid off 500 grand so far? Yeah. Yeah.

Go on vacation. Yes. I think now you've got the point where, A, you know how to budget, and you can live a normal life, and you're still knocking these loans out. Right. You do not. Yeah. We tell gazelle intents for people that are in. I mean, first of all, we want everybody to be gazelle intents.

But I think there's some relativism to this. It's like you've knocked out the credit cards in the cars, and you're not swimming anymore in debt. You are in a situation where, with your income, you are going to anymore in debt. You are in a situation where with your income, you are going to knock this out. I'm not saying you're not intense, but to translate gazelle intensity in your situation to we're not going to go on vacation and I'm never going to see my kids, I don't think that's your situation.

I take a deep breath and enjoy life and keep being disciplined. And, Doc, let me tell you this. Man, I'm going to go speak to a medical school in the fall, so I'm going to be as direct with you as I will with those students, okay? You're brilliant. You wouldn't be entrusted with the lives of others if you weren't. And so let me say it this way. This is not a math problem.

This isn't an interest rate problem. This is an a math problem. This isn't an interest rate problem. This is an inflammatory response problem. This is an existential problem. This is a weight that you carry all of the time problem. And so you can justify the, even your language. My family would be destroyed. You know what? They wouldn't.

They'd have to rent a house or a one-bedroom apartment, but they wouldn't be destroyed. And that is the language of secondary trauma. That's an exhausted person who helps other people for a living and then goes home and has to be a mom too. And so you've got to, got to take care of yourself. At some point after sprinting for seven years, nine years, 12 years, you're going to run out of gas, and that car is going to stop in the middle of the road. You probably should go talk to somebody.

Go start taking care of yourself, take care of your family. Knock that $120,000 out, and then breathe. Next month's budget, let's move it around a little bit, and let's put a little day spa appointment in there. I don't know, you made three or four of those, five or six of those. Well,

I was just starting her out. Just getting her started to relax. I love it. All right. Hey, I want to thank

our producer, James Childs, our associate producer, call screener, Kelly Daniel. I want to thank my colleague, Dr. John Deloney

for hanging out and we want to thank you, America. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for The Ramsey Show. If you would like to do your debt-free scream live on the show, make sure you visit theramseyshow.com and register. We would love for you to come to Nashville and tell Dave your story.