The Ramsey Show - App - How Do You Forgive Someone Who Won't Say They're Sorry? (Hour 2)

Episode Date: December 11, 2020

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Music Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studio, this is Today Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life, your money, and your mental health. My name is Anthony O'Neill, host of the popular YouTube and future podcast show, The Table with Anthony O'Neill, Dr. John Deloney, national best-selling author and host of an amazing podcast and YouTube show, The Dr. John Deloney Show. We are Ramsey Personalities hosting the Dave Ramsey Show today.

Phone lines are open, 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225. We have a couple of lines open today. Kelly is out today, but Madison is standing by to take your phones. She's have a couple of lines open today. Kelly is out today, but Madison is standing by to take your phones. She's killing it on the phone lines today. And so we would love to have a conversation with you. Let's go out to Wilmington, North Carolina and talk to feel,

feel good afternoon. How can Dr. D and I help? Hey, Anthony, Dr. I hope y'all are doing well. I really feel like you guys are like the perfect combo for my question.

So I really appreciate you taking the call. Oh, man. No, thanks for calling in. How can we help, man? Good deal. So, like, my wife and I, we're on baby steps four, five, and six. We both work, like, really high-demand jobs, and we're well-compensated. And my wife wants to come home to be a full-time mom and homeschool our daughters.

So we've talked about it. We've prayed about it. I'm in full support of it, but she has some guilt about like leaving a six-figure income and also like afraid of failing. So like I've told her, like she's bringing a six-figure value to her employer, but she's invaluable to our family. Right. And so I know like we'll still thrive on my income, but are we making a bad decision in moving forward? And how can I help her alleviate any fear and guilt she may have? Well, let's talk about the income side.

And I want Dr. John to help you figure out how to connect with her on the mental and emotional side of things. What's your household income right now, currently? So my wife makes $10 five and I make one 31. Okay. All right. So we're at about like 236,000. Okay. A year.

And so if she comes home, you're going to go down to $131,000 and you're on babysits four or five and six. Uh, how many kids do you have? We've got two. Okay. Two.

How do you feel about that? As the man of the house, uh, do you have we've got two okay two how do you feel about that as the man of the house do you feel comfortable with your household income being at 131 000 will you do you feel as if you all will be able to provide uh in a comfortable way with that income yeah i do i mean we've we've sat like, everything right now is like gravy on the biscuit, right? So we're killing it right now. And kind of being in four, five, and six, like, you know, there's certainly a lot of excess right now. But, you know, we've sat down, we've looked at the budget, and I really don't think we're going to have to necessarily, like, change our lifestyle or kind of goals.

We just may not get to paying off the house as fast. Okay. And that's, and that's understandable. Do y'all have three months or six months in your emergency fund? So right now we've got six. Okay. That's perfect. And you all are investing everything. So yeah, I think you're in a healthy place. Now I find it from a financial perspective. I am a huge fan of one of the parents coming home. And I say one of the parents specifically, because if the wife is the breadwinner, I don't have a problem with the father coming home and fathering, you know, hit the kids. I mean, that's what my brother-in-law did. And they're doing financially very well with that. And so I think spending time with your kids, especially while they're young,

is more important than money. But at the same time, we also want to make sure that you have enough money to provide for the home and you and your wife do. So Dr. D, how does he connect with his wife to make her feel excited, not guilty coming home? So Phil, I have lived this experience, and so I'm just going to talk to you from my experience, okay? The first thing that's important for every guy out there to understand is there is an entire industry. It's the air, it's the water, the air we breathe, the water we drink

that is designed to tell women no matter what they do, they are not enough. If they are working, they should be working more and taking care of this and growing humans. And if they stay at home, they should be doing this. And there's an entire ecosystem designed to make women feel off kilter. And so the temptation you're going to have, and you probably have had is to make this a math problem. We can afford this. And then you took one step further and you made it a character issue, which I love, which is you add this much value, you're going to add that much value to our home. And so I want you to hear me say those are noble pursuits to lay it out like that for your wife.

That's not the challenge. The challenge here is existential. It's deep. It has to do with a message she's received since she was probably a little girl saying, what is your value? Here's what you should be doing. Here's what you shouldn't be doing. And any way she looks and leans into, there's somebody there to tell her she shouldn't be doing that. And so what is going to be a great gift to her is you letting her know, I am going to stop giving you advice unless you ask me directly for it. I'm going to be here, and every day we're going to hug. Every day I'm going to listen to how things are going. And number two, she needs to plug in with a group of friends. Here's what she's going to have to do. And it's going to sound counterintuitive. She's going to have to learn

skills in the same way she had to learn skills to go be a ninja at work. She's going to have to learn skills that are going to help her be an extraordinary CEO of your home. And we like to think those things are innate, kind of like we're going to get married and we're just going to know how to do this. And we don't ever have to learn new skills, learn how to relate, learn how to communicate. It's going to be similar. And there's going to be moments of shame. There's going to be moments of guilt. There's going to be moments of frustration when she's going to have to reach out and say, how do I not fill in the blank? How do I take care of these two kids? And one's crying, one's screaming, one's, she's going to have to learn those skills and you're going to have to

provide her a safe, shame-free space for her to do that learning, do that failing, do that growing. And it's just going to be a process. But the fact that you're calling, the fact that you are asking, how do I love my wife better? How do I love her deeper? And how can I facilitate this transition in our family? Dude, she is blessed to have you, and she's going to need you, not your advice. And I hope you can internalize the difference there to any yeah it's great advice any woman who is making this

transition you want to go home go home it's an extraordinary thing and it's harder than work most of the time it's harder than work most of the time but you got to have a group of people around you that can be with you as you develop a new identity. Now, Dr. D, and again, I set this up by saying that I'm not I'm not married. So I'm asking you. Yeah. In this position for someone else listening, would it even be a good idea to when they're having the conversation, ask the spouse like hey bae what do you want to do from home like since because i feel as if some ladies are like hey i have to be doing something i need to contribute something to the family financially right and i think that's a that's fair but it's like my sister she came home and her and her husband talked and she said hey but i can do this

on the side you know and and he okay, cool. Let's do that. So when he comes home, he does things. She's able to go do that. Is that even a conversation you can have as well? It's not. And we live in these polar worlds right now. And this move isn't all or nothing. Yeah, yeah.

But if you think about it, she went to school for four years. She probably has a master's degree. She got six years invested in how to learn to do this job. Yeah. I want her to put that type of energy in learning how to be present and running this household too and develop that identity there. And then, yeah, along the way, I'm going to be a writer. I'm going to be a

coach. I'm going to have a side hustle. That's awesome, man. That's awesome. But we're talking identity. We're not talking math. That's the key here. I love it. I love it. Man, we're taking your calls. 888-825- 5225. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Has your family grown larger over the years?

Ours has too. Christian Healthcare Ministries is now helping over 425,000 members bear each other's health cost burdens. CHM offers budget-friendly options to suit a variety of needs, from the ability to choose your own medical professional to a portable program that moves with you throughout life. We even offer a generous maternity option that has helped many couples welcome new additions to the family. Today, many of those babies have grown, gotten married, and have once again turned to CHM. This next generation trusts CHM to meet their health cost needs and be part of a faithful community as they are expecting children of their own. How about you? Would you like to be a part

of our family as you grow your own? To learn more, visit us online at chministries.org slash budget and explore which options are right for you and your family. chministries.org slash budget. That's chministries.org slash budget. That's John Deloney, national bestselling author and host of The John Deloney Show, Anthony O'Neill, host of the popular YouTube show and coming to podcasts very soon, The Table with Anthony O'Neill, are here today with you on The Dave Ramsey Show, 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225. five to two five dr john whenever people do their debt-free screams i always ask them what the key was to making this happen and they almost always say the number one thing is budgeting that's because a budget puts you in control of every single dollar you bring in every single month you tell your money where to go instead of wondering where it went. And I remember those days wondering what happened to my paycheck when I got it on Friday and it was gone on Monday.

So when you start a Ramsey Plus membership, you'll follow a step-by-step plan on where you budget. Learn how to manage money the right way and get fired up as you make progress on your debt free wealth building journey. That's why we include every dollar, the best budgeting tool in the world. And I mean, it's the best one in your Ramsey plus membership. You get custom reports on your spending habits and you'll connect straight to your bank. So your transactions show up right in your budget right away. And you can try it.

America, guess what? For 100% free with the trial to Ramsey Plus. Don't wait another day to feel in control of your money. Start your free trial of Ramsey Plus. Just text the word BEGIN to 33789. That's BEGIN to 33789. Leah is in Ohio. Good afternoon, Leah. How

can Dr. D and I help? Well, hi there. It is so nice to talk to both of you. A little background. I'm married, have two kids, have a question about 529 plans. We learned about you guys back in March and have paid off $25,000 in debt.

Yeah. Way to go. Thank you. We have our three to six month emergency fund in place. And we just opened up a Roth IRA last month. Okay. Now, I know we are supposed to put in 15% of our income or our bring home income into the Roth IRA. I get that. What I don't understand is how much are we supposed to put into a 529 plan?

Oh, man. Such a great question. And there's no specific dollar amount that I want you to put into that. Now, let's rewind because you said you're supposed to put 15 percent into a Roth IRA. You're supposed to do 15 percent into any retirement accounts. So let's say, for example, you have a job and do a 401k, a Roth 401k or 401k and a match. So I want you to max out that match. So it goes in this order. Match. OK. Rothoth then any type

of retirement accounts so do you have like a an employer right now that's doing a match um no i don't work enough at my at my job okay um what about your spouse qualify for benefits um my husband is an owner operator truck, and we are currently saving up money to buy myself a truck as well. So we will both be owner-operator truck drivers. There you go. I love it. So you're doing it absolutely right then. So you are investing in the right area. So what I would even do is maybe call a smart investor pro because I even think there are some other options you can do as business owners, like the S&P. You can invest into that as well. But you're doing that part right.

So when it comes to the 529, that's just a thing that you and your husband can sit down and talk through and say, listen, how much can we put into it? I would definitely say look into about at least, I would aim for in between $12,000 to $2,000 a year. That's about $100 to $200 a month if you can. That's the bare minimum because studies are showing if you could do $100 to about $150 a month, you can have anywhere between $80,000 to $100,000 in that count if you do it over the period of 15 to 18 years. And so that's the bare minimum. But what I'm doing is we're just maxing it out with my nephews and nieces.

So that's what I would highly recommend. There's no set percentage. There's no bare minimum. But what I'm doing is we're just maxing it out with my nephews and niece. So that's what I would highly recommend. There's no set percentage. There's no set amount. It's whatever you're comfortable doing as long as you're also investing into you and your husband's retirement. Sounds good? Yes. Thank you very much. Thank you so much, Leah.

Good for you guys. Kicking butt, man. I love that question. Like, how do we take care of our kids? Man, I love that. Sean's in Philadelphia. Good afternoon you guys. Kicking butt, man. I love that question. Like, how do we take care of our kids? Man, I love that. Sean's in Philadelphia. Good afternoon, Sean.

How can Dr. D and I help? Hey, how's it going, guys? Hey, yo, I'm Dr. D. Truly an honor to talk to you guys. How are you? Man, it's an honor to talk to you, man. We're doing well. How can we help? Awesome, awesome.

So I have been blessed with an incredible opportunity. And my question is, how do I just capitalize on this moment and build even more wealth at such a young age? OK, talk to me. What's the opportunity? Sure. So I'm 20 years old. I have no debt. I currently own two rental properties. I have a full time job. My income is about $60,000 a year. I'm paying into a pension, contributing into two Roth IRAs, totaling about $750, so $375 in both. But here's the crazy and unique part. I have been given the opportunity to live for free in a historical home in my

hometown. And all the expenses and utilities are paid for. And there's also a budget for the restoration. So I won't be spending a dime. So again, you know, how can I just capitalize on this incredible moment and an opportunity, you know, in life and just, you know, how do I maximize my wealth at such an early age, a young age? All right, man. I love this conversation. Let's talk, brother. You're 28.

That's what I'm talking about. You single? Yo. Are you single? I am. I'm single. I have a girlfriend. I'm single, but no.

Yeah. Okay. I haven't, it's not the night yet. Okay. But you're taking. Okay. I got you. I'm taking.

$60,000 a year. No debt. You have a fully funded emergency fund, correct got you. I'll take it. $60,000 a year. No debt. You have a fully funded emergency fund, correct? Correct. All right. You have two rental properties. How much do you owe on these rental properties? So about $60,000 on one and about $217,000 on the other.

Okay. All right. All right. So you're looking at about, yeah, about 277 in debt on your rental properties. But then you're not paying any rent right now when it comes to the property that you're living in because they're going to be taking care of that, correct? Yes. We'll be paying a single. What's your current rent right now wherever you're living in because they're going to be taking care of that, correct? Yes. What's your current rent right now, wherever you're living?

So I'm not, I, I'm not, I was not currently renting. I was living in a home and I just moved out of that home to move into the historical home. And I'm renting that out right now. Okay, cool. So, you know, I say this again, you know, we had this call, something similar to this earlier. I'm not a huge fan of financing rental properties. I mean, I'm just really not. But because you're already there, the best thing for you to do to take advantage of this opportunity that you have right now, I will be attacking the $60,000, the home that has $60,000. And then very next, man, I'm going to go to the 217 and just knock that out, all right? Knock it out. Okay. That's what I would do in this situation.

And to be honest with you, man, at your age. I would sell the 217, what I would do. Yeah. I mean, he can. What's your equity against the 217 house? I would say probably it's probably worth about $280,000, $290,000. So I'd probably have, what would that be, $70,000? I'd sell that one tomorrow and pay off your other house free and clear and then save up that money and buy your next house with cash.

But I own that one, obviously. I'm renting it out for a substantial amount of money, so I'm just going to put that income that I'm getting for rental, I'm going to put that towards the mortgage. Yeah. So just have that paid off. We get you. And it just goes back to what John is getting to,

is that we just we want you to pay cash for rental properties uh but because you are already in them i'm not a huge fan of you having to i'm gonna be real with you sean but at the same time if you are in them and you're not paying any rent right now you need to be aggressive okay um and i and if i was in your shoes i would listen to John's advice. Here's why. You're only making $60,000, and you have two mortgages that you're held liable for. That's just a lot of weight. I would rather you be pay off the $160,000, stack up your cash, go buy one, and go get into rental property from there.

It takes one mayor of one city to say, everybody go home, that both of those renters not being able to pay you at the end of the month, and those mortgage companies are calling you. Yeah. Yeah. Man. You got a gift right now, brother. You can be debt-free, have a house that you have out, own outright that How can Dr. D and I help? Antonio, Texas. Gabriel, good afternoon. How can Dr. D and I help?

Yes, hi. How y'all doing? Hope y'all doing good. Yes, sir. We're doing great. How about yourself, brother? I just found the Dave Ramsey Show, and I'm trying to wrap my head around a few success stories I see. And with somebody at my salary and being okay,

how can I or can a few be achieved? I got $31,000 in debt. Okay. Only I work. I'm married. Okay. Only my wife and I at home, but only I bring home the money. Okay.

How much money are you bringing in a year? Well, it's at $45,000 a year, but after deductions and what have you, the bring home is more like $26, $06, somewhere on that line. Gabriel, what do you do for a living? It's maintenance. What kind of maintenance? For the university. Okay. Before Anthony gets into the money part, are you hearing me directly? You're a San Antonio guy. I was a Houston kid. Okay. So

I'm talking directly to you. Okay. Okay. Yeah. What you do is noble and good and the work at that university could not go on without you being there. Sure. So you don't make a ton of money, and you are in the presence of all these fancy-pants PhDs who walk around as though they're better than other people. I want you to hear me say directly, you have a valuable work that you do, you are valuable, and I want you to stop hating on yourself

and thinking that you're less than, okay? Sure. Thank you. Yeah. Do you hear me directly? I do. I do. What you do is valuable, brother, and so don't hem-haw around. You're a maintenance guy. You can fix stuff. You know what I can do? Nothing. I can chit-chat on a radio, my man, okay?

Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. All right, so I'm going to turn it over to Anthony here, but we're going to start this conversation with your head held high, that you're a good provider, you do good work, you make sure that students have a place where they can go learn. You are changing the future of your city and your state because of the work you do. Okay? Sure.

Thank you. That's real talk, man. All right. Thank you, John. Yeah, I always take part in this. Yes, sir. Thank you. Man, you just fired me up right there, John.

That's what I'm talking about. Yeah, he does. So here's the thing, too, man. And I want to echo what he said with facts. So the average salary in America today is $48,000. So you're at 45. You know, you're right around the ballpark. So let's look at that fact, all right?

Here's the second fact that we have to look at. You're in $31,000 worth of debt. What kind of debt is this? Most of the car, $19,000. That is a car I'm paying for now. So you got almost $20,000 in a car? Yeah. What kind of car is this, bro?

It really doesn't matter because No it don't matter The dead got me The dead got me Nice try bro you called us What kind of car is it bro It's a Chevy A Chevy what

Tahoe It's a car sedan 2017 how much does it work? Probably about $10. Okay. All right. Yeah, I'm pretty uptight down on that one. Okay, cool.

And then what's the other 11 in? You got credit cards? No, no, no. Just small stuff in collections. Okay. Like what? Medical bills? Medical bills.

Utilities. Okay. Medical bills and utilities. All right. And utilities. You, medical bills and utilities. All right. And utilities. You got little ones? Yeah. No, no.

Kids and me? Yeah. No, no. I got grandkids, but all my kids are gone. Left home. Okay, cool, great. So here's the first thing, Gabriel, that, Gabriel, I want you to really consider.

Before I get into the practical, here's the very first thing. You got a pen and paper near you? Yeah, I want you to really consider. Before I get into the practical, here's the very first thing. You got a pen and paper near you? Yeah, I do. I want you to write down this word, why. I want you to write that down. I want you to circle that word like five times. And tonight, I want you and your wife

to answer this one question, why. Why do we want to change financially why do we want a better life yeah after and and do not stop talking about it until both of you are emotional and you see tears coming out your eyes when you have that answer what i'm about to give you next and what i'm gonna have Madison do when we get off the phone, it's gonna be so easy for you to accomplish because your why is making you cry.

One of the things that my mentors taught me, man, just a few weeks ago, it shifted my whole just thought process when it comes to my why. And I'm going into this next year, year 2021, that if your why doesn't make you cry, then the price of commitment will make you cry. You have to make sure that you really know why you want to change this.

You want to make sure, hey, why are we doing this? So this way, when we start this baby step journey with Ramsey Solutions, it's going to be a hard process. But our why is going to push us through. So you're making good income. Okay. You're right there around the average. So the very first thing we got to change is our mindset, bro. That's the very first thing. And the mindset starts with where are you going?

Why are you going there? So that's the very first thing that you and your wife to really dive deep into is why do we want things to change financially? Then from there, you're going to jump on the baby steps. And I don't really want to live on a baby steps right now because, you know, the world knows them. OK, so what I'm going to do is give you something better than a two minute, three minute phone call with me and Dr. D is I'm gonna give you free access to Ramsey Plus. This is our Christmas gift to you. We are sowing a seed into your next stage of life.

You and your wife are going to go through and take these classes together and you're going to get on a budget. You're going to live below your means. You're in a great place financially. If you follow this, you won't be calling in next saying how do I live on a low income budget because your budget is right

around the norm you're going to be asking the questions okay how do I build wealth how do I start thinking about a legacy for my kids how do I become an everyday millionaire that's what you're going to be asking so bro we salute you thank you so much for calling in but I want you to stay

on the line Madison going to get you that free trial. That's on Dr. D and myself. And man, I want to encourage you to... Well, thank you. Nah, thank you, bro, for calling in. Thank you, man. And continue rocking with Ramsey Solutions. Don't listen to the world. Listen to us. Connect with

Dr. D on social. Connect with me on social. That's at Dr. John Deloney. At John Deloney. At John Del social. Connect with me on social. That's at Dr. John Deloney. At John Deloney. At John Deloney. And follow me at Anthony O'Neill. And every single day, we're posting stuff around motivation,

around money, and really how to keep you on that track. But the number one tool you can do right now, the number one thing you can do is come up with your why. And starting January 1, jump on this thing that Dr. D and I are going to give you, and that's, man, Ramsey Plus. And to everybody listening, we've heard in this hour a 15-year-old

and to this gentleman who walks around with his head looking at the floor, thinking he doesn't have value. He's got grandkids. His kids have left the house. It's all the age ranges in between. It's never too early to get started. And more importantly, if you're sitting there listening, it's never too late to start. It's never too late to look in the mirror and say, I don't have to live another sleepless night. I don't have to look at my wife or my husband sleeping next to me and wonder, are they going to be okay?

You can exhale, follow a simple plan that's real hard. If the plan is simple, do it. It's hard. And then be free. But you know what, though, man? Isn't it funny that people, they don't want to go through the process Of financial freedom They just want to have financial freedom I don't think Anthony

I don't think they know I just don't think there are There's millions But I think there's tens of millions Who don't even know what it would be like To wake up and owe nobody anything They don't I was talking to a person yesterday.

I said, would you rather live 12 years where you are or would you rather take 12 months? That will be hard to change the rest of your life. She told me, I'd rather stay where I'm at for 12 years because her pain has become comfortable. That's right. So she's living in beautiful bondage. She's not willing. And I think America listening to us right now. They are not willing.

To take 12 months. Of pain. Of strategic pain. Everything. To change the next 12 years. 20 years. 2030. Man.

We're going to talk about it. You got it, Gabriel. On the Dave Ramsey Show. Dr. John Deloney host of the Dr. John Deloney show and Anthony O'Neill host of the popular YouTube show coming to podcasts where very soon

The Table with Anthony O'Neill are your co-hosts today here on the Dave Ramsey show 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225. Tina is in Pensacola, Florida. How can we help today? Hey, A.O. I was calling to talk to John. Okay.

I called in back in late August or September, and I wanted to give him an update. Okay, give him an update. I like these kind of calls. Oh, man. You're making my heart race a little bit, Tina. I hope this goes well. So what's the update? It is well.

It's awesome. I talked to you and Hogan, and I was the one that called in. I had just been diagnosed with stage four breast cancer. Oh yeah. You and Chris or you and Hogan, um, gifted me, my husband and I with a coach to help us figure out our way out of debt. And instead of, instead of one month, your Ramsey Solutions or whoever, the powers that be over there, gives you three months of a coach, which is amazing. Yeah.

So we are debt-free. Wow. Good for you. Congratulations. Yeah. So our house was paid for already. We had $28,000 and some change in credit card and hubby's truck debt. And then we had started the baby steps in, I think, June, May, June, before I was diagnosed. So I was diagnosed in August. Threw a monkey wrench into everything. But I just wanted to call and give you an update. Well, Tina, thank you so much for calling to check back in.

That's a blessing to everyone listening. More importantly than your debt journey, how's your health? How are you feeling? I feel good. I'm still in treatment. It's going to be a lifelong treatment, of course, with stage four. I was able to go back to work for a week. I made it a week and then my counts tanked and I needed some blood

transfusions. So I'm back off work until my counts come back up and hopefully I can be released to go back to work and work while I'm healthy enough to do so. Well, I want you to know that we will continue to think about you. We'll continue to pray for you and your husband. We'll continue to pray for your health specifically. And I want

you to know that there are millions of people on your team. I know. And my coach that you guys gifted me is also a breast cancer survivor. Right. The perfect coach for us. That's right. And there's nothing better than when you're able to look at a tragedy that life has just dumped in your lap, right? Just dumped in your lap. And you're able to grieve it and to take a deep breath and have some people around you that are ready to go to war with you,

are ready to walk alongside you, are ready to just sit by you, and then you're able to make meaning on the back end. And this phone call is meaning making. I want you to know there are millions of people thinking, is this going to be the year we get out of debt? We can't do it because of this. We've got this going on in our life. I don't know about this.

If Tina can do it that's exactly right you're an inspiration to me to my good friend Anthony to everybody listening to this thing and now my husband will have one less thing to worry about when I'm no longer here because that's a reality sure it is stage four. It's stage four. It is. But he won't have to worry about money and grieving me at the same time. That's such a gift. It is. And after 32 years of marriage, it's going to be a hard one.

Yeah. But at least he won't have that to deal with and debt and everything that goes along with that. He can just concentrate on his feelings and going through the motions and tina you know this but i'll just speak it out to even folks who don't have cancer we are all every one of us temporarily able able-bodied we're all hanging on to sinking ships and what you are able to do right now is look at a true, stark truth right there in the mirror, right? And you can look at that knuckleheaded husband of yours, and y'all can love each other recklessly. Because y'all were uncomfortable for a season. You did hard, hard work. And I'm so proud of you.

We're going to continue to pray for you. I believe that crazy things happen sometimes medically, psychologically, spiritually, and we got your back. Everyone listening to the show has got your back, Tina, and I'm just so grateful that you called in. Wow. Thank you. It's a Christmas gift for all of us.

I appreciate you. Well, let Chris know. I was hoping that Noah no offense to you all, I love listening to you too. I was trying to wait for the day that you two were back on together and I haven't got that yet. So I was like,

all right, I'm just going to call in and try and get through. Tina, I wasn't going to air our dirty laundry, but Chris actually put a request in that he no longer be on the show with me because I'm so much better at it than he is.

And I embarrass him. He's learning still this whole radio thing um anthony is much better at it and so that's kind of why we we get paired together regularly not at all no not at all not at all he's got the whole voice thing going on you know yeah hey you know what he has a whole modulator it's not even his real voice james back there drops it a few octaves. He's that insecure. It's a whole thing. But anyway, Tina, you are a – He's really speaking in soprano, right?

Because it's all digital. Yes. America, we're airing Hogan's Dirty Laundry. No, he's a saint. But again, we're so grateful that you called. Thank you so, so much for circling back to us. And we are with you on your journey as you move forward. It's awesome.

Wow. I mean, I didn't. It's awesome. Wow. I mean, I didn't feel offended at all. No. I mean, that's a success story and that's why we're here, you know, to hear more stories like that to encourage people. And I just love her heart. Her heart is like, hey, one less thing for my husband to deal with. If something does go the way we hope it doesn't go.

But if it does, at least one less thing is taken care of. And there's something about folks, what is it, 70% of people die without a will because they won't look in the mirror and say, here is the reality. There's people who won't make a budget because they won't sit down and say, here's the reality. And Tina is an inspiration. She is staring death straight in the face, and she's continuing death straight in the face and she's continuing to work at it and she's continuing to work at it and man can you imagine anthony being able to set your spouse up in a position to say what's coming is going to be hard yeah and we're going to make it as less hard as possible

what a gift what a gift, that's a tough one. Well, Dr. D. Benton, Brenton, I'm sorry, from Instagram asked a question. He says, how can I find

the strength to forgive someone when they aren't sorry for what they have done? Forgiveness is not for somebody else. It's for you. Yes, sir.

Forgiveness is a brick that you carry around with you. Somebody hurt you. They hand it to you. Yes. Forgiveness is a brick that you carry around with you. Somebody hurt you. They hand it to you. And I'm carrying this cinder block around my neighborhood. And I say, are you sorry? And they say, nope, I'm still carrying that brick. I decide to set that down. I decide if they say they're sorry and they mean it, that's gravy, right? It feels good. We can reconcile a relationship relationship but forgiveness is so that i will not carry that burden around anymore so how do you do that though like how do you

if if i hurt you real bad and i move on with my life but i did not say i'm sorry how do you release that stress that burden from you what are some practical things we can do and practice to do that? Sometimes it's as simple as acknowledging that you did this thing. It hurt. I'm carrying around with me and I am choosing to not carry it anymore. And then you will hear it pop back up in your head. I'll walk into a room and see you there. My heart will beat a little bit and I'll say, nope, I've forgiven him. I'm over. Right. So it's reminding myself sometimes it's heavy myself sometimes it's heavy it's traumatic it's abuse right and I'm gonna sit with somebody that's gonna teach me some skills on how to unwind that from my life and most often it's a decision to want to and we don't want to we love carrying around injustices we love carrying around other people's things they did to us because it makes us feel superior i don't and it's something about setting it down and being free i can't deal with it

i mean i had someone cuss me out the other day and right in the midst of it i said i forgive you while they were cussing me i said i forgive you what'd they say to that they just kept cussing me out there you go that's right but you know what hey honestly i forgave them and i just kept on moving i'm not gonna carry that. I'm not going to carry that. I'm not going to have that. I got too much to do. I have too many people to help, too many people to serve to be focused on someone else's life. Wow.

That wraps it up for this hour, America. This is Dave Ramsey Show. You can listen to Dave, Rachel Cruz, Chris Hogan, or the rest of the Ramsey Network anywhere with the Ramsey Network app on your smartphone. Catch all of our full shows, browse by topic, or send clips to your friends.