The Ramsey Show - App - How Long Should I Be Gazelle Intense? (Hour 2)

Episode Date: December 16, 2021

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I'm Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studio, this is The Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. I'm Ramsey personality George Campbell, joined today by the best co-pilot a guy could ask for, Rachel Cruz. So good to have you. We're having a good time today. Thanks, George. There we go. It's good to be here. We got there, America. Hey, give us a call, 888-825-5225. We can talk about your life

and your money. Phone lines are open. Keith is kicking off this hour in Phoenix, Arizona. Keith, welcome to The Ramsey Show. Thanks for having me, and I appreciate you taking the call, Rachel and George. My wife loves streaming your show, by the way, Rachel. Oh, thank you. Sweet.

My question is going to be a weird one. I am at the end of a 17 year journey to get that free in October. Uh, uh, you know, that literally the lion was outside the tent door and he was hungry. Honey,

we need to file bankruptcy or something needs to change that level of desperation. Keith, what was the, what was the debt? Can I ask? Oh, house credit cards, car and the American dream, right? You debt, can I ask? Oh, house, credit cards, the American dream,

right? Yeah. You know, we were in our 20s and early 30s, and oh, you need a new couch? Go charge it. You know, that kind of stupidity. In the process of that 17 years, you know, we did the whole Ramsey, sold everything we could sell, paid off the credit cards, got the cars taken care of. But, you know, corporation moved five times, got downsized, got kidney cancer, started a business. So we're the tortoise. We got there in October. My thing is I'm the leader of my house for 17 years. We've been running from the lion. The lion's gone.

It's like, you know, we have these discussions of like, what's next? And oh, well, maybe we should get a cabin. And then, you know, my wife and I are both free spirits. So that's another little hiccup in this thing. And, you know, my wife's on realtor.com looking at cabins. I'm like, well, no, we don't want to go back into debt. So it's kind of we're at this weird place where everything's good on, hey, get out of debt, do the steps, get the 529 funded for your kids. We're doing all that stuff. We're doing really well, but there's no what's next.

And after literally the first time in 30 years we're debt free, I feel lost. Sometimes I miss the lion, if that makes sense. Yeah. So Keith, let me get this straight. You guys are in baby step seven and your primary home is paid for? As of our 26th wedding anniversary this October, we paid it off on the night of our 26th anniversary. Way to go. Congrats, Keith. It's a big deal.

And you say that with excitement, and my wife cried, and it was beautiful, but I've known this was going to happen since January, February last year because I knew where the money was coming from. But once again, I feel lost because I don't have a what's next. And I never thought I'd call you guys and say that.

Well, we get this call. We do get this call, I would say, on a regular basis of this idea of whether people have paid off. They're already on baby step seven or they're even on just four, five, and six. And I think, how can we have fun? Like, we don't even know how to do this. Because it's going to take some new habits. Like you said, you've been in the habit of running away from that lion

and paying off this debt. And now there's nothing. And so you guys need to sit down and you guys need to have some goals. And the goal now is not paying off debt. The goal is, okay, what are we going to do? Because there's really three things, Keith, that you guys can do with money.

You can give it, you can save it, and you can spend it. So you need to do all three. I would up some of your giving. I would look to see what can we be saving for in the future. What's our 10-year goal? What do we want to have in retirement? Do we want a cabin? All of those. And then the part that's going gonna be tough for you guys, or maybe not, you're both free spirits, but to up that spending lifestyle a little bit, you know, a few percentage points and enjoy some of this as well. So it's kind of a whole formula, but I would really, really recommend, Keith, you guys sitting down, my husband and I, we do this once a year and we look ahead and say, okay, in the next three to five years, what are things we want to do? What do we want to give to? Do we want to replace a car? Do we want to go on a certain trip? You can start planning out and having goals out there. That is what's next.

That's what that will be. Yeah. And like Rachel's saying, you kind of need to plan for the fun. And for the free spirit to do that, it actually is super helpful. So you don't feel bad and you're not out of control in one area or another. You're not hoarding up money over here, saving for nothing because you're just, you can't stop, but you're not also spending out of control and going back into debt and making some unwise decisions. So I would split it up and go, all right, we want to do one fun thing. All right, we're going to save up for vacation.

We're going to go to Europe this year. We know we want to buy the cabin. Okay, we agree that's a five-year goal. So let's just save up to where in five years we can pay cash for the cabin. All right, we want to give this much. And that way you have a plan. You can kind of take a deep breath and enjoy where you guys are at. This is a good problem to have, Keith, and I don't want it to cause anxiety for you. It's a blessing. Don't get me wrong. But but like i said being the leader and literally our focus i mean we paid off almost seventy thousand dollars on the house just this year to get to this point so we've been hitting it almost as hard now as a gazelle to get it finished as we did when we

first had the you know the the credit card. And now there's like nothing that's just unnerving in a way. So maybe I've changed and I'm not as much of a free spirit as I used to be. We've trained you. Well, and I think you can realize too that life is, you know, there's a quality of life that money doesn't have to buy. Like you can be content with maybe, you know, the lifestyle thing is like, hey, we really don't need what we thought we needed. And we're kind of OK with that.

You're going to get to a lot of these conclusions. And I appreciate, Keith, your kind of intensity and motivation of being that leader. As you keep saying, you've said that word twice in this call, which is great. But I think, too, money is such a team effort. And I think you and your wife have done a great job being a team through that. So continue to be a team. Don't put all of this on your shoulders. Bring her in and you guys together say, OK, as our family, what do we want this to look like?

And those conversations, once you get used to it, and granted, this has only been 90 days for you. So you can take a deep breath. You're OK. You don't have to figure all this out right now. But as you really get into that new norm, those conversations are fun as a couple when you say, wow, we really have no payments. What's our next goal? What do we want to do? And it's a beautiful thing, Keith. I'm really proud of you guys. Yeah. And part of this is balancing that contentment and goals. It's great to have both. You can have a lot of great goals and you can be very content with where

you're at. And I think right now, figuring out that new balance is what's important for you. I appreciate that. We'll have to have a family meeting and get our son in there and work on this. I like that idea of having a fun goal and maybe some more longer-term things that we can shoot for instead of just running from something. That's exactly right. I don't know who needs to hear this out in America. Getting cancer, getting laid off is so much better when you don't have credit card debt and car payments.

I can't imagine how we would have made it. So get through those baby steps fast because life gets in the way. Beautifully said, Keith. What an inspiration. Way to go, man. That's true. Enjoy baby step seven life. It's a good Keith. Amazing, Keith. What an inspiration. Way to go, man. It's true. That's life. Baby Step 7 life.

It's a good one. This is The Ramsey Show. People all over the country are discovering a faith-based and budget-friendly way of meeting health care costs through Christian Health Care Ministries. Christian Health Care Ministries, or CHM, is a nonprofit organization that helps members carry one another's burdens with health care expenses, and they have successfully shared each other's medical bills for nearly 40 years. See if CHM is right for you by visiting chministries.org. CHM is a proud sponsor of Dave Ramsey Live Events. I'm George Gamble, joined today by Rachel Cruz. This is The Ramsey Show.

Open phones this hour, 888-825-5225. All right, George. You know, we just had a call from a guy, Keith, who had just paid off his house and baby step seven. And I thought, Rachel, you are the person that I want to break this news to. So I have a picture on my phone here. Tell the people what it says. Oh, wow.

George, it's a blue background. Thank you for the description. Of an image with a circle, but it says, current principal balance 0.00.

George freaking Camel. Did you pay off your house? We did it. Oh my gosh. Look at that. And the crowd goes wild. Thank you to the guys in the booth. George.

We did it yesterday, Rachel. Me and my wife went down to the bank. Paid off your house. We did it. How old are you guys again? I'm 32 and she's 31. Thatid off your house. We did it. And how old are you guys again? I'm 32 and she's 31. That's unbelievable, George. Unbelievable.

You got Janelle over there clapping. The whole crew. I knew my Ramsey family would appreciate that. It's been very sweet. The team has been so awesome. George, tell...

How'd you do it? What's the hardest part? Should we go through all the debt-free... Well, here's the thing. I'll give you a little bit, but we are doing a debt-free scream. Which you should.

Now, I don't know if you may be able to speak to this. I don't know that a Ramsey personality has done a debt-free scream. Oh, that's a good question. Can you prove me wrong? Yeah, that's never happened. Andres Gutierrez. James is saying it's never happened. We went through all of them.

Nope, James already said it. Man, you're making history. So this is a momentous occasion. I know. And so January the 12th, the day after Baby Steps Millionaires book launch, I will be on the show with Dave and doing a debt-free scream with my wife

20 feet that way on the debt-free stage. That's amazing, George. Thank you. I appreciate that. You've been a great cheerleader along the way. I've learned a lot from you and the stuff that you're teaching. And I just thought, you know what?

If I'm going to work for Dave, and especially if I'm going to be a face for this place and preach our message, I should be doing it. And so my wife works here. Fun fact, for those of you that don't know, we met here. Beautiful love story. And when we got married and we still worked here, we just were like, what if we could get a house and pay it off as soon as possible? What kind of life could we have? What kind of options could we have? What freedom could that give us?

What message would that send to other people who may not believe it's possible for them? Yep. And so that was a driving factor. It's not the only factor, but it was just one of those things where I was like, I wonder if and what if we did it? What would that be like and feel like? And we're still in shock. I mean, it this was 24 hours ago we did this and you paid how long did it take it took 26 months gosh just over two years yeah it's incredible George because a lot I mean I would say a lot of people a lot of people if you just go and pull them

out on the street to pay off your house I mean mean, I think a lot of people would say, no, it's no. It's not possible. Yeah. What's funny is we had to go to the bank to do this. It's very old school. I didn't know this, but, you know, Penny Mac is the mortgage servicer. And so when you go to pay it off, it says request payoff statement. There's no magic fund payoff button with confetti.

And so you wait, you get snail mailed this piece of paper with the instructions for wiring. And then I'm like, oh, cool. I could probably do a wire online. It's 2021. No, you have to go to the bank to do a wire. It's very secure. So I go to our bank and say, I'd like to do a wire.

And they sit me down. And this lady, I mean, this is just a transaction for her, right? This is just another thing. This is a life changing moment for the camels, but not as much for her. If you've ever been in a bank, they're exactly disney world it's it's sterile there's no music playing you're in this like sad little office and she's just like all right here what's the information okay is this for a closing i was like no we're just you know we're paying off the mortgage oh congratulations that's the dream no emotion on this lady's face that's the dream. No emotion on this lady's face.

That's the dream. And 10 minutes later, she's typing, and she goes, all right, the wire transfer will happen at some point today. Is there anything else I can do for you? And we just dejectedly were like, no. And I said to my wife, like, let's get out of here. We got to get out of here. It sounds like an episode of Curb Your Enthusiasm or something.

Yes. It was very much like Curb Your Enthusiasm, James. So after we left the doors, we felt like we could scream. Yes. But in the bank, it was like, this is not a safe place. Man, I wish y'all had like confetti popper. I wish we would have known. What if we came around the corner?

Oh, that would have been fun. Throw a party in the bank. That would have been hilarious. These guys are out of here. We had a DJ, balloon. I was hoping. I was like, if I had a bank, I would have confetti, cupcakes. We'd have everyone walk in like it's's Chili's and they're singing happy birthday,

but it would be celebrating the debt payoff. Isn't it funny? The life events, whether I think it is like paying off debt, even getting married or having a baby, like, like it's like your whole world has changed. Everything is suddenly different, but the world just keeps moving. Like everyone keeps living their life. It's a little bit anticlimactic sometimes. Yeah, we just drove, it was over our lunch break

and we just drove back to work in traffic just going like, ah, all right, back to work. Okay, but it does, we're joking about it, but it does, it has to feel great.

It was amazing. Today sitting here being like, you're not going to have a mortgage payment January of 2022. Yeah. Nothing. Nothing.

Is that wild? I mean, it's just wild. It it is very wild and i'll tell you this just like keith we are very goal oriented and so we're like okay well there's still like a thousand other things we got to do we want to do that we got to do we want to go to europe i got to upgrade the car we want another house you know yeah and so it's funny as a driven millennial it's just kind of like nothing is ever enough and so it was a great call because it reminded me like we need to celebrate we need to take a pause we need to be content with where we're at go holy crap we did this yeah like we need to just like hug and celebrate and not be like all right what's next on the agenda go that's right check check check that off check it off will you go to like a good dinner or something will you go well you know what's funny we have

our Ramsey Christmas party this weekend and Oh, yes. And we have a wonderful, expensive dinner scheduled with some of our best friends here. There you go. It's perfect. Perfect. So you guys were booked. The cruises were booked for dinner. Silly. So.

But yeah, we're very excited. And you know, the nice thing is I'm up in the dinner budget. Yes. I'm going, you know what? I want to go out once a week and have a really great meal because we can. And just enjoy it because you can. And mostly because we hate cooking with a burning, undying passion. Both of you do. Both. Yeah. It's a dark situation. Yeah. I will say that. Make sure in your marriage there's someone

who loves to cook. You know, I found this new girl on Instagram and she's changed my cooking life over the last month. Yes. I've seen you post some of her recipes. They're amazing. And someone that can't cook that well. All right. There you go. All right. Well, we'll celebrate later. Let's get to the phones. George, proud of you. Thank you. It's incredible. Absolutely incredible. I appreciate that. John, sorry you had to hear that. He's in St. Louis. How can we help today, sir? Hey, thanks for taking my call, Rachel. I really appreciate it. Speak directly into the phone for me. You're breaking up on us. Can you hear me now? It's a little better. I just want to say thanks for taking my call. Congratulations on the big news.

That's awesome. Thank you. Appreciate that. What's your question for us? With inflationary pressures, can you hear me now? Yeah, a little better. With inflationary pressures right now, would you guys recommend, for days four, five, and six,

giving back a little more emergency fund right now. This was everything that's going on in the world. Over two still stick your guns, the three to six months worth of expenses. Okay, let me recap for those that couldn't hear. You're saying, should I have a bigger emergency fund because of inflation and everything going on in the world right now?

Correct, essentially. Got it. Yeah, we get that question a lot, especially this year, Rachel. Yes. And this is a big, it's a big piece of anxiety people are feeling of like, is it enough? What's going to happen if I lose my job? And what we found is three to six months is enough. And the chances of you needing to survive for a year or two, you can always go to work. People are hiring

right now, if you didn't know. And so the worst case scenarios, if you play them out, they're not all that bad if you don't have any debt and you have three to six months of expenses so me personally i would not have more than six months yeah yeah and john i would say too if you you know if you guys are on the three to four month then you're like man maybe we should just put a little bit more aside that's totally good too i mean i think that they're yeah six months it's it's plenty. Just like Georgia say, you know, if you don't have an income coming in for a reason, because of a job loss,

you can always replace that with something else. I can keep you guys afloat past six months. So we're still good with that. Even with inflation, everything that's six months. Like the extra 2% inflation that we're experiencing right now is not going to make your emergency fund either fund either way yeah now if something crazy happens we've got bigger problems than emergency funds you know if it gets apocalyptic out there seven months versus six is not going to be the deciding factor i know rachel you have a lot of thoughts about the apocalypse but that's for another show

i appreciate the call john it's a great question and I want to validate his fear that it is scary. So the best thing you can do is get out of debt, is have that emergency fund in place and don't be afraid of work. That's right. And that keeps it all secure. Thanks, John, for the call. There it is. This is The Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. welcome back folks this is the ramsey show i'm george camel Next to me is Rachel Cruz. And if you're watching on YouTube or wherever, you just saw a fun photo of me holding up a 0.00 balance on my mortgage. We paid off our house yesterday and we celebrated. And Rachel, it's hilarious. During the break, I got an email from Penny Mac that starts with, we're sorry to see you go. I bet you are, Penny Mac. The camel loan equals paid in full. That's nice that there's... I'm glad they apologized.

They're going to miss you, George. They're going to miss all of the interest I was giving them. Are they going to miss you or your money? That's the question. My guess is the money. I don't know. Probably. And we're keeping the debt-free scream party going here because Caleb is on the line in

Dallas, Texas. Caleb, what's going on, man? Hey, guys. Not much. Just on my lunch break and figured I wanted to come call and give my story a little bit. I love it, man. Well, congratulations. How much debt did you pay off?

Thank you. I paid off $17,000 in debt. I had $12,000 in student loans and $5,000 for a car loan. Wow. Way to go. Okay, how long did this take? So it took me about two years. I started when I started my internship,

and then immediately after I started my career as a software developer, I basically quadrupled the amount I was putting into my car payment because that was a higher interest and then snowballed it into my student debt. Whoa. What was your range of income during this time? So my internship, I was paid about 14 an hour and I was starting with the minimum. Um, and then when I started my career, I started at 60,000 and And I took the amount that I was putting for my car payment, which was about $100 a month, put that into my student loans. My student loans minimum payment was about 60. So I decided, you know what, we're going to just pay this off. So every month I was putting in $500 a month into my student payments after my car loan was paid off and sure enough for my birthday this

year i had a thousand dollars left on it i said nope for my birthday this is my present from me to me i love that i had myself debt free for my 26th birthday oh caleb 26 years old and debt free that's the gift that keeps on giving. That's amazing. Congratulations, Caleb. Great, great job. How does it feel? It feels amazing. I mean, I heard some of the calls today already on the show and they were talking about how they don't know what they do now. They're debt free. And I was kind of in the same boat for a little while, but my mom is actually a big listener of the show. And my parents have both been big listeners ever since I was growing up as a little kid. And my mom said, go talk to one of the financial advisors from Dave Ramsey. And so I reached out and I actually have one that I'm going to start working with next month to put into investments for a house.

Wow. Amazing. Start with the future. Man, what a sharp guy. Your parents must be so proud. I bet they're listening right now. I hope they are because they were the ones that kept telling me, you got to go on the show.

You got to go on the show. Awesome, Caleb. Okay, so at 26, again, this is weird. This is not normal. Do your friends, are they inspired by you? Do they think you're crazy? Like, how did your friends respond? You know, it's a little funny, actually, because some of my best friends, when I was talking to them about some finances here and there occasionally, and one of them just said, you don't have a credit card?

And I tell him, no, never have. And it blows his mind. He's like, well, how are you building your credit? And I was like, I didn't need to, I just pay for it upfront with cash. And he, he just couldn't wrap his head around it. And so to me, it was never a foreign concept because, you know, my parents, again, growing up with Dave Ramsey, always taught us you don't get a credit card because you don't have the money. So the concept was get the money and then you can get what you want. Wow. Brilliant. If only all of America thought that way. That's right. Way to go. So what are you going to do now? You're 26. You have no debt. What's next for you?

So, um, right now I'm actually working on myself. Um, I, I ended up getting a raise this year and I decided to spend that raise on finishing off paying off my debt. And I actually hired one of my friends as my nutritionist. So I've been working on myself financially and physically and just trying to better my life here and there as much as I can and now my next goal for next year is to put in the savings for a house and working on the rest of my future wow Caleb you're amazing this is incredible absolutely I love how debt payoff and getting a hold of your money can bleed into other areas of life and you go what else can I improve in oh yeah it yeah. It gives you that motivation to say, oh, my gosh, okay, well, I can work on this and this.

Like, I can do it. It gives you hope that you can actually change your life because you did. It's amazing. So, Caleb, talk to that maybe 24-year-old who's sitting there with $17,000, $50,000, student loan debt, car payments. They're living off credit cards. They're getting their rewards. They're building their credit score. Life is normal. What would you tell that person?

You know, I would have to say, start getting out of it now. Little by little, as much as you can put in, you know, all the things that you think you can't live without, think, can you really not live without them or are they just a luxury item in your life? And if they're not something necessary, start getting rid of that debt. It feels so nice to go day by day, living life, coming home and not having to worry about, Oh, shoot, did I forget any kind of payment? Did I forget to pay off this? Excuse me, this debt, this loan. And, uh, it's a big life changer. It changes your future. It changes how you view everything around you, your life. And it's an inspiration, honestly. It just,

it makes you want to help other people to feel the exact same way. Man, beautifully said. Yeah, it's contagious for sure. When you, when you taste that freedom and you think, wow, I don't owe anyone anything. It changes. It changes everything. And I can totally see and understand that idea of wanting to help other people in it. So Caleb, what would you say is the key to getting out of debt? What's the one thing that kept you motivated and kept you on the winning track? You know, I would have to say to make the best of your opportunities. For me, especially since most of my debt was in student loans over the pandemic, you know, things were

really hard, just all around with everything. A lot of people started getting really high depression. But even though there was all this bad stuff happening around, you know, there was always a silver lining. And for me, the student loans and student debt had no interest for over a year. And so for me, I took that opportunity and I, you know, I was snowballing as much as I could, didn't have to pay interest on my loans. And so even when things are looking bad, even if there's a literal pandemic in the world, find a silver lining, find some sort of positivity, make the most of what you can and just take the lead. Man, Caleb, you are wise beyond your years, man. We're pumped for you, proud of you. We've got a copy of Baby Steps Millionaires, an advanced reader's copy for you to celebrate because that's the next step in your journey. And we're also going to send you a copy of the total money makeover

that you can pass along to another 24-year-old, 25-year-old, maybe one of your buddies who goes, how'd you do this, man? And you can give that to them. You ready for this, Caleb? Absolutely. All right. We've got Caleb from Dallas, Texas, $17,000 paid off in two years, making $15,000 up to $60,000 quadrupled his income. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. I'm debt-free!

Woo! Yeah! Wow. That's what it's about. I feel good about this next generation, Rachel. I do too. At least the ones that call into this show and do their debt-free screenings. Lots of hope. That's incredible, though.

I mean, there is something to be said about getting it early, and that's one thing people say around here all the time is, I wish I had had this when I was younger. If only I had known this in my 20s. If I had only known this in high school, I would have made a different decision with college. Right. So it's.

It's that. Kind of. I wish I had. And when you hear. Especially younger people. Do it. You think. Man.

Their future. Is so bright. Yeah. It's so bright. And it starts with the parents. I mean. You heard him say. Yes.

My parents are the ones who got me on to this. Yeah. More is caught than taught. Do this stuff guys. This will change. Your family tree. change generations to come. It is so, so worth it. This is The Ramsey Show. Thank you. Hang off debt is smart. Saving and investing is smart. But there's one key to winning with

money that people overlook all the time. That's protecting your finances from emergencies. That's where insurance comes into play. Now, there are 10 kinds of insurance coverage you might need based on what your life looks like today. And we've built an incredible tool called the Coverage Checkup to show you exactly which types you need to add, drop, or adjust. We'll even rank your coverage list by importance, email it to you, and connect you with Ramsey Trusted insurance providers so you can get your plan in place fast. Seriously, this could be the most important five minutes you spend today. Donald wrote in, and I like how he puts this, for anyone who has not completed this checkup,

do it now. You never know when something will happen and you never want to leave your family in a bad situation. Go and visit ramsaysolutions.com slash checkup today. Don't let an emergency sneak up on you. Protect your family's future now. Well, Rachel, it's that time of year. In a few weeks, we are going to be doing a special giving edition of The Ramsey Show. It's coming up next week and we want to hear stories from you, our listeners, about how you have given generously this season. Maybe you've tipped a waitress 100 bucks or bought a Thanksgiving dinner for a family who couldn't afford one. Maybe you've blessed someone in need by giving them a car. Or maybe you've been on the receiving end and had your life changed by someone who gave generously to you. We want to hear from you. Just go to

ramsesolutions.com slash ask and put giving in the subject line and share your story. We do this every year at Christmas time and it's one of our most popular shows, one of my favorite shows. It's inspiring. It really gets me in the Christmas spirit. It's coming up December 22nd.

So go ahead and start sending in your stories of giving today and let's celebrate living like no one else so you can give like no one else so you can give like no one else. Open phones this hour. The number is 888-825-5225. I'm George Campbell, joined today by Ramsey personality and bestselling author Rachel Cruz, and we are taking your calls. Matt joins us in Modesto, California. Matt, welcome to The Ramsey Show. Hey, how you guys doing? Great. How can we help?

Yeah, so I have a little bit of a car situation. Given this current market, I'm able to have my car paid off. Currently, I owe about $18,000 on it. The only issue is I don't have a solution for another vehicle if I were to do that. So I thought I'd call you guys and pick your brain and get some ideas. Okay. So how much could you get for the car if you sold it today? I can get about $18,100. So about what you owe?

Correct. All right. So that would leave you with pretty much net zero. Pretty much, yeah. Do you have any money in savings? Just the $1,000 emergency fund. Okay. And do you have any other debt?

Yes, we're going baby step two, so we have another vehicle, credit card, personal loans. Okay. And you have another vehicle, you said you have another car payment, but you're just looking at this one right now? Yes, the other one's my wife's. She's a little bit more reluctant to sell at this point, so I'm kind of the one open to taking the hit as far as getting a less expensive vehicle. What do you owe on that one, and what would it sell for today?

I believe we owe $23,000 on that one, and what would it sell for today? I believe we owe $23,000 on that one. And I haven't looked at the value in a while, but last time I looked it up, they were offering a few thousand more than what it's worth. Yeah. That's why I asked. I'm just wondering. And part of this is getting your wife on the same page. Is she on board with the baby steps?

Oh, absolutely. Yeah, we've been going through your wife on the same page. Is she on board with the baby steps? Oh, absolutely. Yeah, we've been going through debt, through the debt snowball. It's just her car, you know, it's a big expense. And, of course, it's got brand new and the warranty, and it makes her feel safe. So that's why I'm the one more willing to sell my car and kind of help speed things up. How much do you guys make, Matt, a year? We both make about $84,000. Okay. Yeah, I mean, it's a lot of car.

When it gets to be about 50% of your household income it starts to be a lot um so i would be in favor of selling um just to get this off your plates but that would require different options right you could pause the debt snowball save up a little bit of cash and get what we'd call the beater like the the not-so-fun, few-thousand-dollar car. Right. But you're $18,000 lighter in debt to do that. What other debt do you have? You have the two cars.

What else was it you said? Two cars. We have a personal loan. It's about $3,500. We have about maybe $7 seven grand in credit cards okay yeah that I mean that that that's where I would lean if I was in your shoes and I would really love her I understand the feeling of being secure and the new car, the warranty, all of that. But it may give her a little bit of ease to go and even just look at some used cars, even SUVs, because they're not as bad. Again, I think people have the word used in their head and have a stereotype with it.

But when you go and look, they're not as unsafe feeling as you would probably imagine. I mean, I just feel the weight of these cars, right? Like if you guys were making $150,000 a year and you can knock them out. But I just don't want to see you guys drowning in car debt.

Yeah. When you got $41,000 in cars making $84,000 and you've got a pile of debt, it's just, that's a tough, tight situation. And so there's going to be, you need to make some sacrifices here. That might mean taking on some side jobs,

selling your car and selling other stuff. But what you need right now is to stack up cash quick. And so I'm going to have a conversation with the wife about selling this car if you can make money from the deal and try to clean up some of this debt. Because remember, you clean up those two car payments, you know, have more money in your bank every month that you can use to attack more debt, to save up more. And so maybe run some numbers with her, whatever you might think might connect with her personality style. But there's going to – sacrifices need to be made. And if she's not willing to make them and it's all on you, that's going to put a strain on the relationship on your end. Yeah.

No, it definitely can. I'm, you know, trying to compromise by just me doing it. But no, and hopefully by me doing this, it helps kind of spur on something. So, I mean, we've touched on it briefly, but it wasn't something I'm just trying to press too hard right now, but hopefully she comes around and is more open to the idea, you know, maybe in a few months. Yeah. Well, back to your question, I'm probably going to try to save up $3,000 and I'm going to go to a reputable dealer in my area. I'm going to look on Craigslist and Facebook Marketplace and whatever you do, make sure you do get inspected by a great mechanic who can point out any issues. Because the biggest fear everyone has, Rachel, is what if I get a $3,000 car and I have $4,000 worth of repairs in the first month? And the truth is, I think a lot of it comes down to justification of why I don't want to do the

thing. But the truth is, cars are more reliable. Go get you an old Honda, an old Toyota with 200,000 miles, and it's going to get you from A to B, and it's not going to look pretty, but it's going to give you some motivation to get out of debt. The worse car you drive, the more motivation you're going to have to get rid of this debt. And so that's why I don't love her driving this shiny new car because it's going to get her comfortable. And you already told me she's very comfortable with this situation and this car, and I want a little more fire from her and you on the situation. Clearly, you're wanting to do whatever it takes to get out. And I applaud you for that. So start to save up some cash as fast as you can. If it means pausing the snowball for a month, that's fine. But I don't want you to go, well, we haven't done the snowball in six months because we're

saving up for the car. And so I think you're going to need to make some sacrifices. And if she's unwilling to do that, there needs to be a harder conversation. Yeah, and there's always just, I mean, kind of echoing what you're saying, George, we find the deeper you're willing to sacrifice, whether that's time, because you're taking on an extra job, whether that's lifestyle, the faster you're able to get out of debt. And honestly, the faster you're just on the other side of this. The sacrifices, it's for a short period of time. It's not going to take too long, especially if you guys get out of debt and honestly the faster you're just on the other side of this you know the sacrifices it's for a short period of time it's not gonna it's not gonna take too

long especially if you guys get rid of these cars you're able to knock out that $35,000 or $3,500 loan $7,000 credit card I mean you can make a lot of progress very very quickly and then get some emergency funds and then from there it's like okay you can take a breath and then go and buy another car like you can still upgrade that will never not happen in your life yeah but it's just

how do we clean it up as fast as possible to get to point A to point B as quick as possible and you guys just have a lot of car yeah

and true security is not coming from $23,000 in car debt it's coming from being debt free yeah that's the security that I want for her

thanks for the call that puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. Our thanks to you, America, for listening, James Childs, our producer, and Jenna Sears for screening the phones. We'll be back with you before you know it. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for The Ramsey Show. If you would like to do your debt-free scream live on the show, make sure you visit theramseyshow.com and register. We would love for you to come to Nashville and tell Dave your story.