The Ramsey Show - App - How Much Term Life Insurance Do I Need? (Hour 2)

Episode Date: September 14, 2022

Take our Audience Survey & Enter to Win a $500 Visa Gift Card: Click here to take the survey   Dave Ramsey & Ken Coleman discuss: How much term life insurance you need, Avoiding borrowing money for educational training, Working through financial hardships.   Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6   Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Pods Moving and Storage Studio, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. We help people build wealth, do work they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author and host of The Ken Coleman Show, is my co-host today.

On Ken's show, he talks about careers and talks about the idea of getting a job, getting a, you know, actually getting employed, number one, but then doing it in such a way that you're working for people you love and love working with and making actual money doing something you care about. It matters a lot. It changes the whole formula, doesn't it, Ken? It really does. If you think about our relationships and then our work, those are the two most important things to us as humans. And sadly, so many people still think that work is just something that we have to put up with. I'm just going to deal with it. I'm going to deal with crappy leadership or toxic co-workers or just being bored doing something

because it's a good check because it's the only thing I can do. And we slog through a week just feeling like, well, I'm duty boundbound and not realizing that there's a unique contribution you can make where you get paid really well and you enjoy your work. And it's possible. And you know, listen, getting out of debt many times is the greatest step to stepping into that dream job because now you have no limitations. And so this all works together, not to mention, as you've said many times, your income is your greatest wealth-building tool. So we want to help people win at work so they're winning in life. Open phones, you can talk about that or whatever you want to.

This is the Ramsey Show. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Josiah is with us in New Hampshire. Hey, Josiah, what's up? Hey, Ken and Dave, how are you both? Better than we deserve, sir. How can we help? Glad to hear it. I'm 25 years old, married, and debt-free in baby step four, and applying for term life insurance. So I'm going through Zander and got approved for $500,000, but I'm wondering whether I should go with a 20- or a 30-year term,

my thought being if we're debt-free now, in 20 years I'll be 45. Will I have a net worth high enough to not require that insurance? Or should I go with a 30 and stay insured until 55, at which place I can be more confident that we'd be there? How's your health? Health is good. Do you smoke? No, non-smoker.

Are you obese? Nope. Okay. I would buy a 20-year. Okay. Now, let me tell you how I did that, okay? Here's what actually happened with me. Knock on wood, I've been healthy as a horse my whole life, okay?

Hardly seen the inside of a hospital unless i was visiting someone else so um what happened was i bought my first term life insurance when i was your age and uh i bought a 15 year level but then what happened was we added kids we added income and i wanted to upgrade the. And so I had a choice then of buying yet a new policy and getting rid of the old one or just buying additional. So like I bought $500,000 in your case, okay? Later on, I might buy another $500,000. But that might be three years from now or five years from now.

And as you've noticed, it's not very expensive. Doesn't cost much money and so what's going to end up happening is you're unless you lose your health along the way your ability to get insurance you're going to end up adding policies or buying whole new policies and starting the clock over gotcha so you don't need a 30 you're going to end up buying a series of policies or replacing the earlier policies as you want more and more and more depending on which way the math works the best and um then you're going to be in a position to begin dropping them later or when you look up and you're 45 and you go we're 100 self-insured you just cut the cord on the whole thing and let them let them float away.

But what ended up happening in our case was I've added policies every five years or so from 25 all the way up to 60, not 60, about 50-something, and I kept some policies even though I didn't need them recently, just SWI Sharon wants them. And it really didn't have anything to do. I mean, it wasn't like she's not, that policy is going to make the difference whether she eats or not. It's kind of silly. But even those policies are starting to expire now,

and we're definitely not going to buy them even if she wants them. I'm done with this. So we have convinced her that she's okay. I think I've got an acronym for that one. What? If Sharon wants it as SWIi you just came up with a new one d dc dave doesn't care ddc you're not doing it you're done well i mean it's it's you know she's okay and she knows she's okay now and that's gotten rid of the that need but what ends

up happening is you're not buying one policy that's going to serve you throughout your entire life you end up adding that's incrementally as you go along and so five years from now if you buy another 20-year policy or another 15-year policy you just started that clock over on that portion the other one when it expires you're probably not going to renew it you know 20 years from now that's where i am at you're describing our journey as we begin to have kids three kids you added as you went along yes added as i went along obviously we were able to upgrade in-house over time and so sitting with our smart investor pro we determined what that right amount was and i'd it was like three or four years ago i just did it and so that'll probably be the last one obviously i mean we shouldn't need it at all so that you

describe exactly the journey that that i'm in and i'm i'm 23 years older than him now but the way our brains work and i did the same thing josiah when i was your age i'm thinking well if i want to just get a 30 and i'm done it's over but it really it's it's more life that comes at you in layers rather than linearly like well explain to young folks so if they're getting ready to start a family what you recommend when you go from a couple no kids to one kid or two how you the whole time i'm just saying you know 10 to 12 times your income because when you're 25 if he's getting 500 000 then maybe he makes 50 grand okay if something happens to him you know she's got 500 000 bucks if she's got one if she got a little baby she's still got 500

000 bucks invest that at 10 in a good mutual fund if it's making 10 it would pay off pay out 50 000 bucks we've replaced his income without even touching the principal and so that's the idea of 10 to 12 times your income on on you and guys you got to go to zander insurance to get a quote if you haven't done this because the deal is people are blown away how cheap term life insurance is and it's gotten cheaper over the years oh yeah i mean i bought some one time at 45 and i came back in my 50s to buy more and even though i was seven or eight years older it was cheaper yeah because the rates had come down because they're using better and better and better actuarial tables that are more modern and reflect the health improvement. They were using tables from the 1940s.

Oh, yeah. And then they started using tables from the 1960s, and now they're using tables because life expectancy has changed. Yeah. And, I mean, it's already cheap, but if you have the preferred health designation, I don't know if that's what they call it, it can make a lot of money. I like to recommend this to dudes. I dropped weight like a wrestler three years ago when I did it. Super disciplined, Dave.

Yep. And I got the preferred rate and saved. Got more, but still saved. If you smoke, it's double. Oh, yeah. It's double. Yeah. Double. That's why I asked if he smoked or he was obese. Yeah,. If you smoke, it's double. Oh, yeah. It's double. Yeah. Double.

That's why I asked if he smoked or he was obese. Yeah, that's right. Because it's double. All you got to do is just quit smoking, and it cuts your insurance in half. Oh, and it saves you on all the cigarettes. Oh, and it saves you on all the health problems. And, yeah. And no quarter pounders within three days of taking your blood test.

There's some world-class advice, Dave, right here on The Ramsey. That sounds like that came from experience. Oh, yeah. This is The Ramsey personality is here he talks about jobs and careers every day number one best-selling book from paycheck Paycheck to Purpose. He's my co-host. Have you ever noticed that when you commit to change in one area of your life, it's easier to make progress in the other areas?

Met thousands of people along their journey to building wealth who also did other things like lose 50 pounds or find a career that they love or overcome stress and anxiety. What seems impossible is possible when you have a smart plan. In a smart plan, you turn up the focus and intensity on your goals, and that's why we're bringing the Smart Conference to Dallas, Texas, on Saturday, October 22nd. It is our only live event with tickets left in the fall here,

and we'd love to have you. The tickets are $35 for general admission. VIP and Platinum sold out long ago, and there's probably about 1,000, 1,500 tickets left to this. It's going to be about 8,000 folks, and it's all day long. It is your top thought leaders in every space. Ken Coleman will be speaking from his number one book, From Paycheck to Purpose, how uh, and get the job that you love

making money like you've never made before. It's awesome. Rachel Cruz will be speaking on money. Of course, Dr. John Deloney will be there speaking on mental health and mental wellness on parenting, marriage boundaries, all of that mixed in a George camel Ramsey personality. He'll be speaking as well. Others, I'll be speaking. And on marriage, Craig Groeschel and Amy from Life Church in Oklahoma City. So looking forward to having you guys all with us. This is Dallas, Texas, Saturday, October 22nd. There's not a lot of tickets left.

If you want to come out, do come out. We ran into a lot of people at Phoenix this week who had wanted to get in and couldn't get in the sold-out events there in Phoenix. So don't wait until you're one of those folks. RamseySolutions.com slash events and get your seats today. This is the Ramsey Show. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Our question of the day comes from Blinds.com.

Find out for yourself why Blinds.com is the number one online retailer of custom window coverings. You get free samples, free shipping. And with the new promos they run every month, you'll save even more. Use the promo code RAMSEY to get the best possible deal. Today's question comes from Rachel in Tulsa. I am currently doing a survival job and planning to pursue a career as a UX UI designer. I found a six-month program at a college for $5,000 that would set me up well for career placement. I do not have anything saved at this point and wanted to know if it was smart to borrow the money to complete

this program if I would be able to pay it back quickly. The answer is no, it's not okay and you don't need to borrow. Let me give you just a really quick exercise that'll open up your mind here to how achievable this is. If you need $5,000, let's just take 20 hours a week, if you can work 20 hours a week additionally to what you're doing, and you get a job making $20 an hour. That's very doable. That's not a pie-in-the-sky example. Okay, based on 20 hours a week at $20 an hour, even after taxes, you're going to be five or six months away from making $5,000 cash to be able to pay for this. Now you don't have any debt. Now you're qualified to get into the field that you want to get in,

a field that is very lucrative. You're going to start out doing very well and have a ladder to make six figures pretty quickly. So you don't need to borrow the money. What you need in this situation, I understand what I'm saying, this is very difficult. What you need is some patience. But if you can take that frustration or that desire to get in this new field and channel it into some hustle and really crazy maniacal focus, you can make that $5,000. And I didn't even mention selling things, cutting your budget.

But we can get to that $5,000 nugget, if you will, quicker than we realize. You can drive Uber Eats and pizza and make a couple grand a month. Yeah. Pretty easy. Or more. Yeah. Probably make, if you work like a crazy person. Yeah.

I just gave a 20-hour-a-week example. Yeah, I know. That's small. You kind of dumbed it way down. But if it was me me i would do it in about two months oh for sure i'd go get my 5 000 bucks but here's where you get 5 000 bucks you earn it you don't borrow it that's the point of the that's the point of the answer and you go do it right now and you gear up and you go okay i want this i want it bad and i'm willing to pay a price for that so i'm giving up my friday night parties and i'm giving up my saturday night parties and i'm going to work like a crazy person for a short period of time so i can

have the cash pay cash for this and then go get the job because let me just tell you these things there's only one way borrowing money to do anything works out is if it works out perfectly so your your theory here is is you're going to go get this new designation, and quickly you're going to make the money back because quickly you're going to get a new job that pays more. That may be true, but it might not be true. It's possible that doesn't happen. And you're counting on it only.

The debt thing only works if it works. It doesn't work when things don't work, and most of the time things don't work exactly like you think they're going to and this is not a necessary risk no no you can do this we're not saying don't go get the thing we're saying go get it but go get it fast and go you know just go crazy i mean walk dogs babysit dogs babysit kids house sit deliver stuff sell stuff go crazy work six jobs and knock five thousand dollars you can get in two months easy yes it's no i take that back it's not easy mathematically easy yeah you'll be tired that's right but tired didn't kill you you know it you know so that and the other thing that'll

happen is uh when you go get that degree that way and you're holding that that designation in your hand and then somebody wants to jerk you around uh and not pay you in a potential job you'll walk from that because you you paid a price to get this designation yeah and you won't you know we're gonna this is gonna pay off in other words we're gonna force this to be a payoff situation. So good stuff. Good question. Very good. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Josh is in Louisville. Hi, Josh.

How are you? I'm doing well. How about you all? Better than we deserve. What's up? Awesome. Yeah, so I've got an investing question for you guys. My fiance and I just recently got engaged and are beginning to think about and kind of plan for our marriage. I know that you all typically recommend 15% of your income being

invested. As it stands right now, each of us will get about a 5% match from our companies, and they do both have a Roth option. would you all recommend once we get married that we throw 5% into each of our companies' Roths and then 5% into another Roth or throw 7.5% of each of our incomes into each of our companies' 401ks? Good question. Now, let me clarify. You're saying you will be debt-free when you're married? Correct. Yeah, neither of us have any debt. And you have an emergency fund of three to six months of expenses?

That's correct, yeah. And so now we're starting our 401ks newly, or we're starting our retirement plans newly married. Now, the way the formula would work is this. What do you make? I'll be making about $60,000. And what will she make? About the same, maybe just a little bit less.

Okay. All right. So 15% of $120,000. Okay. That's the number you're trying to achieve. I don't care where it lands. It doesn't have to land 50 on you, 50 on her. Let's pretend that your 401k sucks and hers is awesome.

It could land over in hers. Okay? Because as a married person, in the event of a divorce, you're going to split up the retirement accounts regardless of who the name they're in. That's how the law works. Okay? So it doesn't matter whose name it is in. What matters is the most effective.

Then how do we parse it out? We use a formula. We laughingly call it rock, paper, scissors in a way, except rock, paper, scissors can go different ways. This only goes one way, and it is match beats Roth beats traditional. Now, what that means is we're going to do all the match we can do because you're getting 100% ready return before you even get started. So you said you got a 5% match, she's got a 5% match,

you're going to both do 5% there. And what does that amount to? Well, it amounts to $3,000 each. And so that is $6,000 going in to get both matches of our 15 percent and uh you know we're trying to get to what 15 18 000 bucks is what we're trying to get to 15 of 120 000 okay now then you're going to do roth and you're going to look at her 401k your 401k if they both have good options you could probably just finish up there and it does end up being 50 50 that way and that's fine but if one of them sucks just go ahead and get the match

and bail after that put enough in to get the match and put it all in the other one and if that doesn't get you to your 18 000 then you'll do individual roth iras and you'll get there. You won't get to traditional. So always get the match first, then do Roths of some kind, then do traditional. You've got enough Roth available to you to never get debt-free stage. Christina is with us. Hi, Christina. How are you? Good. Thank you. How are you? Better than I deserve. Welcome. Where do you live? We actually live just south of here in Spring Hill, Tennessee. Oh, your neighbors. Okay. Wow. Big long drive for you. Yeah. Yeah. Well, good to have you. Welcome. How much debt did you pay off?

So we paid off $170,000. Wow. And how long did that take? It took just shy of three years. Wow. Good for you. And your range of income during that time? Well, it actually is a little different from probably what you're used to hearing. We had one more family member, and so we started off with about $117,000. And now it's one less family member, and I'm making around $55 to $75 because part is commission. Ah, okay.

What do you do for a living? I am an insurance agent. Oh, good for you. Yes. A Dave Ramsey-loving insurance agent. That's good. We're not mad at all insurance agents. We just want you to buy the good kind.

Yes. Good for you. Welcome. Okay, so it sounds like there's a story here. Yeah. One less family member. What does all this mean? Yeah.

So we started out a little while back, and I guess just during COVID, that one less family member started making some really funky decisions. And it was a little bit of a break of our family. And unfortunately, that just gave us quite the hard time. And he went in one direction legally, and we kept on moving forward ourselves. Wow. Yeah. I'm sorry. Thank you. You've been through a lot of pain.

Yeah. And actually, it happened my last semester, about two years ago, I just got this really strong impression to go back to school. And so right in the midst of my last semester, getting my bachelor's degree, this all happened. And then I just felt God saying, no, no, you can keep, is this is this is it just keep going this is the plan and you're you're going to be okay so I finished I graduated in May. And a degree in what? Organizational leadership. Good for you. Yeah. And where'd you graduate from? Middle Tennessee State University. Awesome yeah they got a great program there. And debt-free too. Yeah I bet you did. Yes yes. And so youbeknownst to you, were getting prepared for this breakup.

Yeah, had no clue. It was very, very sudden. No plans, no family arguments, nothing. A lot of silence. And the cool thing, I guess it's cool and not cool at the same time, is I didn't realize how much of our journey we were actually, I was actually doing by myself with the kids. And because I had a spouse that was like, sure, whatever, whatever you want. Okay, fine. Yeah, that's good. So I didn't have any pushback, no fight. But I realized

afterwards that I was running it with my kids alone. But we did a good job. We did a great job. You were already carrying it. So when you had to carry it, you didn't notice. As much. Actually, no, that's totally true. God was just directing, and it lightened the load a lot. Yeah. And you've got a couple of kids. Yeah, times three.

Wow. So two, four, six? wow yeah yeah always wanted a big family and we we made one and I have no regrets and they've been amazing they've been on this journey with us we put up a kind of a thermometer up on the wall with really cool chalk and colors and all that and we just started just filling it up as we were paying off debt. And they were supportive. And my teenage son was helping babysit while I went to deliver people's groceries.

And some of them helped me to clean offices and just make everything we could to just pay off all the rest. And it was amazing. They were literally on this with me. It was amazing. I mean mean you have walked through hell and you're joyful and bubbly about it it's great I mean your attitude is

amazing yeah thank you I'm quite honestly stunned uh and I guess the the only question that's popping in my mind right now I'm rarely speechless uh but the only question that pops my mind is is how much does the financial piece come into play in, in, in the world you're in right now? Well, I mean, had I not been, uh, you know, listening to God this whole time, I would have, uh, with everything that occurred, um, I would have no degree. We'd have debt. I don't know what we would be doing, but instead I was prepared to be able to go right into a great job. One that I love, by the way, because I followed a lot of your principles, John. And very, very happy.

And we don't have any debt, no car payment, nothing. And so I was able to be able to maneuver us upward without going into debt because we needed money. We were like, oh my gosh, no more paycheck. So that was a big deal. Huge, huge deal. What kind of a ladder do you have financially now in this new role? I'm sorry, I don't really understand. How much opportunity for you to grow your income? Yes, oh, I'm sorry, ladder, of course.

Yeah, a ton. Actually, where I'm working, I work for a very, very supportive team that thinks very much like I do. And we're it's amazing, but I'm really good at my job. And so they put me in what's called the aspirant program. So, you know, give it five, 10 years and I'll have my own agency. I'm not going to go into debt for it, obviously. You're going to be crushing it. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. It's going to be great. But it really all came down to, you know, when you said before, you know, kind of going through hell, I'll tell you, it really shows you kind of like money in a way, shows you what kind of person you are. You either sink or swim. You either get negative or you get positive and you just, it's what you feel like doing and i we felt like surviving and having a nice happy life and not going downward and not digging a hole and so we did well let me tell you you have a spine of iron thank you ain't no stopping you yeah you're a force of nature girl thank you i love it and and you know you're taking the high road obviously

by staying vague and i'll respect that. Thank you very much. On all the crap and everything. But the good news is you just kept smiling and kept pushing and kept smiling and kept pushing, and God has rewarded that. So proud of you. Thank you. You have to feel accomplished. You have to feel powerful.

Yeah, it really kind of gave that um when you say spine of steel john um it really did because when you get to that point you don't it's it's not a pride thing on the wrong side of pride but it's more like oh i can see now that i really am able to do this and um i was just uh telling somebody when i was when we're driving over here you know the kids are listening to you guys on the radio with other people's debt-free screams, getting them ready. And there's someone talking about credit cards. And I looked over at my son, Ben, and I was like, hey, you know, some people really do use credit cards. And I just thought he would be like, oh, yeah, that's true, Mom.

But he was like, oh, really? And I was like, yeah. And he goes, oh. I feel sorry for them but um I will tell you though we really didn't do it completely alone we had a Ramsey financial coach uh Mr. David uh Gibbs over here um he has just stuck with us this entire way he's been with us almost three years that's good yeah what a wonderful story we're very very proud of you thank you okay what do you tell people the secret to getting out of debt is oh um working really hard take every single side job you can just keep smiling about it

tell yourself this is right and you're strong no matter what you've got going on and that's the reason i wanted to do this today um to uh single moms to people who have lived through crap thing people who think they've got too many kids they can't do it whatever it is um that's absolutely incorrect and i've got three kids who are special needs and we we pushed everything everything so anybody who says they can't that's absolutely false wow well you just proved it yeah you just proved it thank you mic drop wow we got a copy of baby steps millionaires for you financial peace university one-year membership and total money makeover read them give them away whatever you want to do bring the six kiddos up on stage let's introduce them right quick before we run out of time. So what are their names and ages? So just

going from top to bottom, this is Daniel and he's 14. Benjamin is 12. Julie is 11. Joshua is 9. Rebecca is 7. And Elizabeth is 5. Amazing. Christina and the team from Nashville, $170,000 paid off in three years. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. All right. Ready, guys? 3, 2. Let's hear a debt-free scream. All right, ready, guys? Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Wow! Wow!

You're a young couple, 25 years old, making $160,000 a year, and you can't figure out how to get out of debt. Shut up. This is The Ramsey Show. thank you for joining us america ken coleman ramsey personality is my co-host today when you're're worried about money, it's all you can think about, and that stress affects everything, your family, everything, until one day you look up and you feel like your entire life's on fire. You don't have to live that way. You don't have to.

When you have a plan for your money, you'll discover peace even in the middle of the fire as you walk your way through it and out of it, just like our last debt-free screamer. In Financial Peace University, you'll learn the simple plan that's helped almost 10 million people budget, save, invest, spend wisely, get out of debt, build wealth, and increase their generosity. And now the course includes Dr. John Deloney, George Camel, Rachel Cruz, and me. It's the best version of FPU we've ever done, and we're offering at the lowest price we have ever had to make it easier than ever to get started.

Decide today. You're done letting money stress rule your life. Get started with Financial Peace University. Visit ramsaysolutions.com slash FPU. That's ramsaysolutions.com slash FPU. That's ramsaysolutions.com slash FPU. Ken, when I was growing up, I went to, mom and dad were in the real estate business, and they would take us to sales conferences,

and I got to hear some of the old-time motivational speakers and later on became friends with Zig Ziglar before he passed away. He was kind of the king of that. And, you know, they talk all the time in that world about your attitude is everything and you decide your attitude and um that last debt-free screamer was i mean it's intriguing she's inspiring yeah i mean it was unbelievable it's intriguing to me though that the same set of circumstances come at one person and they choose and you do choose to approach it with one attitude or another i do this i mean don't i mean we all i guess

everybody sometimes something comes at you and you just go you have a little pity party and it's like well it's not fair my life is bad and it sucks and we do that and then other times you just rise up like she did and man i just want to be her when i grow up all the time no question she she went into a we don't know what the story was but oh my god it was obviously a mess and leaves her as a single mom with six kids yeah and nothing but smiles and on fire and jamming it and everyone watching and listening knows she's going to be okay yeah and you know what that had to do with not the circumstances it had to do with her attitude and how she's approaching it well our values drive our attitude i really believe that we still have to make the choice but there comes a point when hardship and

the unexpected comes your way and it's really a fork in the road. And so I'm either going to have a positive attitude and keep pressing on, or I'm going to have a negative attitude and I'm going to withdraw. I'm going to retreat. There's an incredible woman who values dictated her actions. And see, attitude determines actions. And I think underneath attitude is always, what do I value? And here's a lady that said, you know what? I got six kids. There is no option. I love these kiddos. We've been on the debt-free journey. I'm not going to stop. It's doable. And she realized I was leading the charge anyway. And so she chose to say, you know what? I've still got my six kiddos. These kids are everything to me. Got arranged it to where i finished my degree just as i needed great professional possibilities puts a financial coach in her life to help her mc coach to help her

walk through this stuff but all of these things she did right and she just looked and said okay this sucks but there can be a better future and i whispered to her just as we we took pictures with her i said hey the best is yet to be and she looked at me she goes i totally know that i mean that is the attitude you're talking about and she's been through some storms yeah well and and you know the truth is everybody gets a storm oh we all we all get welcome to life we get it we're in the last two or three years have been a storm for a lot of people in a lot of situations and whatever you you know, whether it's a medical diagnosis, whether it's a relational blow up, whether it's a career blow up, a financial mistake, a business error, I mean, you know, or something comes at you that you don't have any control over.

But the only thing you can control, and this sounds so Pollyanna, man, when I used to hear these old motivational speakers, I would think, yeah, bull crap, you know. But, you know, there's nothing that comes at you that a negative attitude makes better. It doesn't make it go away to have a positive attitude and a positive outlook and a way of doing it but she was a stellar example of i'm going to choose to embrace this and call it all joy yeah i can hear zig in my i can hear him in that classic southern accent that that kind of evangelist draw talked about the attitude of gratitude and you know she in that moment decided to focus on what she was grateful for not not what she lost.

This is a message for me and you. It's a message for everybody listening that whatever it is you're facing, maybe you don't need to look like you're weaned on a pickle. I love that. That's true. Maybe you don't need to sit around going, life is bad. Biden's the president. Before that, Trump was the president. It's bad. Life is bad. And, you know, Biden's the president. And before that, Trump was the president. And, you know, it's bad.

And life is bad. And, you know, a lot of people spend their whole existence like that. Keeps you stuck in the past. Yeah. Well, it keeps you stuck, period. Yeah. You don't move out with that one. But, man, the lesson for everybody listening and for me out of that is I get to decide.

Yeah. I get to decide. Am I going to smile at this and go, this sucks, and we're going to do it anyway? Yeah. You know? Or am I going to sit on my hands and go, well, life is bad, and, you know, there's systemic problems with the economy, and America's just falling apart. It's a horrible place, and I'm proof of that.

That's great. You sound like the guy's had a pickle right there. That's pretty good. Yeah, you know, instead of getting – Well, nobody ever does negative attitudes with a positive enthusiasm. That's the whole point. Yeah, I mean, intonation slows down. I mean, it's crazy.

I think we all have to choose in those moments. Instead of becoming discouraged, we have to get determined, and I think that's the focus. It's okay, all right, I'm not going to let this overtake me. I'm not going to let it determine my future. You talk about a true hero. You call our audience rightfully so heroes all the time. Now, how can you not look at her?

And I love that she called out other single moms to say, hey, you can do this. I'm up moms to say hey i'm up here i'm up here to say you can do it yeah i'm here to prove hold my beer i got you can do this that's right this is this is real and uh that's a real thing so um deloney dr deloney john talks about that all the time that um you are not your identity is not the worst thing that ever happened to you. Correct. That is not who you are. You're not a product of a negative thing that happened. I'm not a product of being stupid and being bankrupt by the time I was 28.

It's just a thing that happened. Did it change me? Yeah. Did it change the direction of my life? You but i'm not a product of it i'm not dave ramsey and i filed bankruptcy that's not that's not my identity it is a thing in the rearview mirror nowadays 30 years in the rearview mirror um more than 30 years and so but but um you know it's still there there's still know, it's still there. There's still a thing there. It's still there, but it's not defining the future. Well, I love your story, and I don't want the audience to miss that, you know, Dave's obviously wildly successful now, but it's largely because of the failure.

You know, successful men and women don't let failures define them. They learn through those failures. When you talk about that story, when everything's crashing down on you and the shower's so hot you can barely stand it, I mean, here you sit decades later because you decided to learn from that and move forward. I'll be honest. For about six months, all I did was surround wine. Well, sure. And I blamed everybody else.

I blamed the president. Which is natural. I was the guy we're talking about not being. And then a buddy of mine goes, you know, you have a whole bunch of lemons you probably ought to make some lemonade there you go in other words i'm tired of you whining you need to go do something with all this and get up off your your whiny butt and uh he called me out and you know that was that i remember where i was sitting in that lunch with him and uh that wasn't the only thing that did it but i had but I just tried whining long enough, and it wasn't working, so I needed to try something else.

Well, and you're an example that our failures can refine us, shape us, the fire, the pounding. You know, I love watching the old blacksmith when they take this inanimate iron object and they stick it in the heat, and it gets piping hot, and it's red, and then they put it on the anvil and beat the stuffing out of it all to turn it into something extremely valuable and so you've not lost your value no that's what we're saying being reshaped yeah and uh it but the the hammer hurts oh and the fire's hot the fire yeah and the fire's getting there's no fun it's real it's you know having a testimony is a wonderful thing getting one's's a pain in the butt. This is The Ramsey Show. Dave here.

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Ramsey.