The Ramsey Show - App - I Feel Like I Never Have Enough Money (Hour 2)

Episode Date: July 6, 2023

Ken Coleman & Dr. John Delony answer your questions and discuss:  "Can I afford to move while on Baby Step 1?" from the blog: Relocating Tips: How to Make a Smooth Transition, "I feel like I never have enough money..." Starting over after a divorce, Selling business equipment to pay off debt. Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET Here's an EveryDollar deal just for our listeners: get a 14-day free trial PLUS $15 off your first year of premium. Click the link below and start budgeting today! www.everydollar.com/TRS Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3cEP4n6 Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6 Interested in advertising on The Ramsey Show? https://ter.li/s64ye3 Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Девочка-пай Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Potts Moving and Storage Studio, this is The Ramsey Show. It's where we help you win in your life, specifically your money, your relationships, and your work. The phone number is 888-825-5225 is 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by Dr. John Deloney.

That's twice in a row. I can't get the doctor and the John today. I'm just going to go John the rest of the show. That works for me. And no way to slight your hard work with two PhDs. I'm unslighted. Okay, good. Just call me John.

Because I don't know what's happening. It's this guy from the parking lot. James, I can't say doctor and John at the same time, so we'll just keep on moving with that. You can call me the joctor. Joctor? I haven't been called joctor. I like that.

That's actually great. That's a term of endearment. The guys in the class don't like it, but we're in charge. They are not. We're on the mic until they cut it off. That's how that works. Katrina's up next in Charlotte, North Carolina. Katrina, how can we help? in charge they are not we're on the mic until they cut it off that's how that works katrina's

up next in charlotte north carolina katrina how can we help hi thank you for taking my call you bet what's up so i uh just started fpu this week actually i'm on baby step number one um, out of the $1,000, I just have $25,000, and I'm getting paid tomorrow, so I'm going to be able to add a lot more to it. However, I actually know that I need to make more money. Once I learned everything about the Dave Ramsey financial piece, my 35 annual income is low, so I learned I need to make more money. So I applied to some jobs, and I actually got interviews and potential offers in another state. So is it a good idea to move if I'm just on baby step number one? Well, I wouldn't let baby step one be the determinant factor here. For instance, if you get a raise and you are doing work that you really enjoy, work that you're good at for a company, that there's some alignment there, and this is just an overall great decision, then you moving in baby step one, two, three,

or four really doesn't matter as long as you can afford the move. So if you've got to go bust it a little bit, let's say your move cost you a couple thousand or 3,000 or 5,000 or whatever it is, whatever that move cost is, you've got to fund that. And so that has to be obviously a part of the conversation, but I wouldn't turn down a great opportunity that you knew was a great opportunity just because you're in baby step one. Does that make sense? Yes. So, I mean, I guess I've been doing this for like four days.

So I just pause now and just save up as much money to move? I'd wait until I had an opportunity. Yeah, let's wait until we have a deal on the table. Makes sense. Because here's the deal. Some companies will pay a certain amount of money towards moving expenses. So let's just say i'm making this up let's say it's costing you four thousand dollars to move i'm making that up i

have no idea what the move will cost and the company gives you 2,500 towards that now you know okay i've got to come up with 1,500 to afford this move what we don't want you to do is go backwards we don't want you to use a credit card for this we want you to get really creative very aggressive to be able to pay for the move but But if we're moving to a better situation, it allows us to get through the baby steps faster. Can I throw one thing at you, Katrina? Yeah, absolutely. Let's say you got a job two states over, okay? And it was exciting, and they were going to pay you $50,000 instead of $35,000. It was going to be a job you were excited about. I want you to look very carefully at the things in your home

that you think you have to move. The number of times I had a Craigslist couch that I ended up paying more money to move than the stupid couch was even worth, or I would store it. Listen, both me and jade were talking yesterday jade warshaw were talking about how we have had outdoor furniture inside our homes for years because that's all we could afford and yeah it was shockingly fine everybody lived

and so if you have a bunch of incredible deluxe bajillion dollar couches and whatever you got to move, fine. If you are like me when I was making 35 grand figuring out, oh, I need to do something different, leave all that stuff, give it away, put it out on the curb and give it away, and that will drastically reduce your move cost. You need a mattress and you can build up from there. Yeah. I love that advice. I love it. You can, listen, not only are you reducing your cost,

you can pay for the move by selling those things that you don't need. So I love that advice. So Katrina, head up. Don't quit the baby steps. This is going to help you advance through the baby steps. You got it? i yeah i wasn't even this gives me a lot of clarity because there was a part of me that was like i'm committing to this whole new financial thing and then now i'm getting interviews i've gotten four this month and the pay uh right now i get paid 1750 and the increase goes up from $25 to $28 an hour. So I know this is a blessing and I don't want to turn it down, but I just felt like I was backtracking. Like I decided this and then now I'm doing bad and I felt a little bit chaotic. No, it's the opposite. You got on a plan and the

universe opened up a path for you that you didn't even know existed. Both Ken and i moved from where we had established families where we lived to a new city for a new position and it's transformed our lives yeah okay okay so this is more positive then i shouldn't be so fearful off the charts don't be fearful at all you just okay you're gonna make more money and and here's the deal, though. Let me caution you on this because I'm the work guy. I've got to say this. Please don't just look at these opportunities as just a bigger paycheck. The world is full of millions of people that changed jobs over the last two years, John, and they call it the great regret, who they took a bigger paycheck,

but they got there and they realized, I like those people back there or I like the position back there a little bit more. So what I'm saying is don't just take it for the extra money. I want you to make sure that the position itself, again, is a good fit for you. You can do the work. You've got the skill and you enjoy it enough, or it is a, I can do it. I think it's a good culture, good environment. And this is a ladder for me. If I do a good job for two years, I can do it. I think it's a good culture, good environment. And this is a ladder for me. If I do a good job for two years, I can see myself climbing a ladder and getting to where I ultimately want to be. I don't want you just making the decision just for the paycheck. Okay. Okay. I'd hate to see you uproot your life. I'll ride all this. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So

proud of you. Welcome to our crazy little gang that you just joined. We're excited to have you. I love that. That is so great. John, what's the psychology going on there? I think that's a really interesting question. I think there's a lot of new people that are joining our show every day. We see the numbers. People are watching, people listening.

And she's just started, and she went, wait a second. I have to choose one or the other. I've got to do the baby steps and get out of debt, or I got to choose to take a job. There was a fear there that we just kind of helped her with. What was that? Well, it's this strange phenomenon, and I'm certain there's a psychological term that I probably took in a class a decade ago. I forgot the term, but it happens a lot with people talking about, we need to move everything to crypto because it's all coming down, or I've got to move all my money into silver or gold because it's all coming down. Or I've got to move all my money to silver or gold because it's all coming down.

The illusion there is when it all comes down, I'm going to need a way to put gas in my car so I can get to my job. Not realizing if it all comes down, your job is gone, right? Similarly, on the flip side, when we enter into financial peace, we enter into a new plan, a new relationship. We think that our life is going to be exactly the same with just this new thing. And we don't have a psychology for, oh, no, no, no, no. Sometimes when you change your life, everything changes.

And it feels scary on the front end, but it's incredible. Love that. So proud of you, Katrina. We're rooting for you. Can't wait to hear the great news. And we'd love to hear you call back and do your debt-free scream. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, you guys. Health insurance costs are only moving one way and that way isn't down. And if higher costs aren't enough, the wait times to see your doctor are longer and it's harder than ever to get anything approved through the bureaucracy.

So if you feel like the system is working against you, try a biblically-based alternative to health insurance, Christian Healthcare Ministries. CHM is a health cost-sharing ministry that's helped hundreds of thousands of families like yours take care of over $11 billion in medical bills since 1981. And CHM has also helped them stay true to their values and avoid miles of red tape. And CHM support goes far beyond meeting financial needs. They'll also help meet spiritual needs. Members become part of a family who will pray with them and for them when they experience a medical event. So listen, y'all, there's no better way to take care of health care costs.

CHM programs start as low as $98 a month. So learn more today and join at chministries.org slash budget. That's chministries.org slash budget. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. I'm joined by my colleague John Deloney. We're thrilled that you are with us. 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Boston, Massachusetts is where we go next. Mel is there. Mel, how can we help? Hello. Thank you for taking my call. You bet. You know, I just have a quick question with, you know, I just, I'm just in some debt and I just feel like at the end of the month, at the end of paying everything, I just have no money for myself.

And, you know, I'm slowly paying it off and doing OT. It's not like I'm just doing my 40 and going home. It's just kind of like I'm putting in, you know, $32 of OT every two weeks. And I just feel like I never have enough money. Okay. How do you know if I just need some advice or some help? Sure.

Well, let's first start with asking you, what's your budgeting process like? Do you budget at all? Yes, I actually did start last month. I took the whole month of June to kind of just see what I spend my money on. And I've noticed I spend a lot of money on food, like just eating out. And one good side about that of doing that is now I know I spend it on that. So now I'm like being more conscious. So you've only done this one month. So let me start by saying we've told people for decades,

it takes about 90 days, three months or so to just figure this thing out. So give yourself some grace as you're heading into month two. But what you're focusing on is how much am I short? Do you have an idea how short you are right now at the end of the month? Well, usually I'm never really short. It's just kind of like at the end, it month? Well, usually I'm never really sure. It's just kind of like at the end, it's kind of just like I'll have like $200, $300, $400 for myself to spend on whatever I want.

I usually just end up putting that in a savings and then kind of just living with like $200. So what do you know after your first month of budgeting where there's a lot of fat that you can trim off? We've already identified one, which is eating out. What else? Where else are you spending a lot of money that you don't need to spend it? Probably going out as well.

Just food, like food, eating out at work, trying to find some food, and then going out like on the weekend. All right. What's the combined number that you spent last month, just ballpark figure, on going out and eating out? Probably about, let's see, probably last month about like $600, $700. All right, so there's a $600 to700 difference right there. If you begin to cut that and you get disciplined, you understand what I'm saying? So now you want to cut back for a month in month number two of budgeting and then look for other expenses that you can cut and go, okay, can I find, and I'm just making this up right now, but have any debt i do so i mean it's kind of

weird so um about a year ago actually a year ago in a couple of days i broke my ankle and i was working as manager security and then they laid me off the contract i did so they wanted to give me another job that was very less repayment offering me in the teens when i was getting up to cool for 30 so i you know decided just to take some time off and find a new job that wasn't in security i found a new job and then i broke my ankle and then i was probably out of work for about six seven months and then in that time i amassed about you12,000 in debt and another $2,000 in credit card debt. So I consolidated the $12,000.

Okay. So the only debt you have is $12,000 that's been consolidated recently. Is that what I'm hearing? Yes. And what's that pay? I have $12,000 in a consolidated loan, about $2,000 in credit credit card and then i have a mortgage okay so you're familiar with our baby steps yes yeah okay so where are you on that i know you're trying to budget and the budgeting is learn is a learning process while we're attacking the debt so do you have a thousand dollars in your emergency fund? Baby step one. Yeah, well, tomorrow I'll get paid. So I know I've done, so this, you know, last week I did about 35 hours of overtime so I can just pay off the credit card.

You're not answering my question, my friend. Baby step one is $1,000 in a savings account for an emergency. Do you have that right now? Yes. You have $ that right now? Yes. You have $1,000? Yes. In savings? Yes.

Not more, just $1,000? Yes, I have $1,000 in my savings account and I have my regular check-ins account. Okay. So the baby steps now, you've got baby step one done. Now we're taking the smallest debt you have and we're going to attack that with

everything you have. The budgeting process that we just walked through is to find as much money as possible that you can attack the debt snowball with. So the smallest debt is what you're going after next. And then if you knock, when you knock that out, you take what you have been paying towards that and you put it towards the next, and you just keep working through this process. Do you understand what I'm saying? Yeah. That's what's next for you. Okay.

What do you do for a living, man? I'm a ranger at the moment. I work for the Commonwealth. A ranger. Is that a park ranger or a police officer? Yeah. Park ranger. Park ranger. Okay. a park ranger or a police officer? Yeah. Park ranger. Park ranger.

Okay. Do you live on site? Do you live at a camp or do you live at home? No, I live at home. It's about 15 minutes away. So I take the public transportation. I don't own a car.

Oh, that's good news. Okay. I was going to suggest you pick up a second and third job um and begin figuring out ways but you're working overtime so much here's what i think you got to do man you got you got to get radical the way dave says it is i will not see the inside of a restaurant unless i work at one i will not go on a date with somebody unless we are going for a walk in a beautiful Oregon park. I'm just not going to spend any money because I got to get out from under this debt

so I can get my life back. You don't have a life right now, man. You're killing yourself working overtime just to stay afloat. And we say it all the time, man, you're just worth more of a life than the one you're leading. And so, man, keep working overtime, but get this stuff out. You don't have a huge amount of debt. You do live in a state that takes a big chunk of your paycheck every time you bring some home. So that'll take a little bit longer than it might in another state. But, man, I would just keep hammering it and hammering it and hammering it and get it done. Right. But I know, I mean, like I said, I worked

a whole bunch of overtime and the credit card debt by tomorrow when I get paid, it's going to be done. So then the consolidated loan is what's next. Awesome. Right. So how quickly can you pay off that $12,000 if you give it everything you got by cutting all of your expenses that you can cut? I mean, you cut everything that you don't need. How quickly could you pay off the $12,000? I mean, you know, I did some math around it, and I think I can get it down hopefully, you know, with the projected number I have about probably next summer. Great.

No chance. You can get it done faster than that. I absolutely agree, but you're going to have to work. You're going to have to work more. So I don't know if you're changing jobs. You're talking about a year from now. How much do you make? I make about $50,000 for my job, and then I have an income home. So I have a rented home that I make about an extra $900 a month. I would sell that rental home. You can't afford it. Can you sell that home? Well, the mortgage is paid and I actually

make money from it. Oh, so you own that home free and clear? No. So I have a mortgage on it, but with the amount of money I get from it, I pay the mortgage plus I get payments towards me. Right. But John, what do you do tomorrow if the air conditioner goes out? How are you going to pay for that? That is where, when I broke my ankle, that was where one of the reasons I amassed a lot of debt. Mel, we're running out of time. Running out of time. I got to be quick. Sorry to interrupt, but it's on purpose. How much is that house worth right now if you sold it today? About $360,000. What do you owe on it?

About $230,000. Sell that house today. You're debt-free. You have a fully funded emergency fund and you are starting to pay off your mortgage, brother. You know what you'll do on Monday of next week? Sleep deeper than you've slept in years. Years. You still haven't recovered psychologically from breaking your ankle and you're going to have to forgive yourself for the seven months where it was really tough to get up and move around after that and you just didn't work and you stayed at home and you dug yourself a hole, let's clear that hole. You're on the right path now, brother. You're on the right path.

Stay on the line. I'm going to send you Financial Peace University and EveryDollar app, the best app for taking care of your daily and monthly budget. Stay on the line. I'm going to give it to you as my gift to send you onto the right path. Sell that house, brother, and get free. Mel, you got this. RamseySolutions.com.

Find a great real estate pro there. Get that house listed and change your life forever. Great stuff. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show America. I'm Ken Coleman. Dr. John Deloney joins me this hour. 888-825-5225 is the number. If you're new to the show, we have a lot of you that are joining us every day,

and we're so excited that you're here. If you want to dive deeper into this, what is this Ramsey Baby Steps? What is this about? How do I get out of debt? What is this process? We want you to go to ramsaysolutions.com and click on the Get Started button. That's ramsaysolutions.com and click on Get Started, and it'll catch you up on everything that we talk about, where you are in the journey so that you

get caught up. And if you're enjoying the show, a couple things I want you to know about. Please consider, whether you're watching or listening, subscribing, sharing, leaving a review. That would be great. And this is exciting. You can now watch the Ramsey Show as a live stream on Twitter. That's twitter.com slash Ramsey Show. Twitter.com slash Ramsey Show. I would have never thought all those years ago when Twitter came out that one day we would be live streaming on Twitter.

This is exciting. John, I'm going to let you take over. I need to call my mom real quick. She's going to be very proud. It's going to be a great moment. Hey, Mom, I'm live streaming on Twitter. No, I kid. If only I knew even how to.

I don't know how to do it either. I had to ask James, where do you even see it? So there you go. It's twitter.com slash Ramsey Show right there at the top of the feed. Apparently everybody's streaming on Twitter. You and me right now, pal. We don't even know how to do it, but we're there. We are there. Doesn't that make you feel super important?

It does me. All my dreams are coming true right before your eyes, Ken. We'll celebrate on the commercial break. I can only imagine. There it is. His favorite song, folks. Let's go to Alberta, Canada. Annika is joining us there.

Annika, how can we help? Hey, I just have a question for you about kind of starting my financial journey independently. I'm a mom of two, and I separated from my husband over Christmas last year. And I just finished school, an education degree. And I have a contract starting in September and, you know, some money in the bank. So I'm just kind of wondering how I should start independently. I'm kind of scared and nervous about it. Well, have you sat down and done a budget yet on what this contract is going to provide you versus how much it's going to cost to live in the area of the school? Yeah. So I should be making net $6,000 a month and I've

budgeted. I've actually just got a rental a few weeks ago and it's $1,650. So I've gone through the EveryDollar app and budgeted all my expenses. What's your gross going to be? Pardon me? What's your gross take home? It's $64 a year, and then I get child support at $3,000 a month. Okay. There you go. Okay. So what makes you nervous? It sounds like you're making plenty of money and you've got the tools, you're using them. What makes you nervous?

I think just going from like being in a relationship where my spouse was making a ton of money and I haven't been in control of our finances at all for the last eight years. Um, basically just living off of an allowance and then, you know, so taking independence, I guess of it. And, uh, I don't want to make a misstep. So let me go ahead and clear you of that worry. You will, you'll make a bunch of them that's because you're human just like me ken everybody even james back in the booth makes mistakes way more than you would think um that's a part of that's just part of being human right and so give yourself some grace there you're learning a new set of skills and the fear is real how much of this are you looking at

the numbers and realizing just how much of this are you looking at the numbers and realizing just how much your life is going to change, your lifestyle is going to change? So much. I'm moving from a big, beautiful five-bedroom house to a duplex rental. And not only that, but just lifestyle changes with being able to go out and eat and all the things.

Yeah. This is something that gets left out of the conversation, but you're going to have to grieve this transition. You're going to have to spend some time telling a friend, sitting with a counselor, sitting with yourself. And I wish I had a better word that didn't sound so woo-woo and Pilates yoga but you're gonna have to journal about you have to write it down i'm frustrated that this relationship didn't work out i was in an abusive situation i was given an allowance i wasn't even a full person um i'm gonna miss not worrying about money i'm gonna miss all these things and here's what i get to do you gotta spend some time in that ugliness if you just try to avoid it your body's going to try to solve for it man and it's going

to you're going to feel anxious all the time you're going to feel like you're always missing out you're never going to settle into your new reality yeah there's some exciting things like being well just frankly independent is so exciting but i I just, you know, maybe a single mom is, is, yeah. It's like riding a bike. You remember when you rode a bike for the first time, you were equal parts terrified, but also excited to figure it out. Yeah.

That's what's going on. And I think it's very important to, I hope you really embrace what John told you. You're going to make some mistakes just like you did riding the bike. But the fact that you're getting involved here with the baby steps and financial peace and you're pursuing this, when you skin your knee, it's going to be okay. It's going to heal. You're going to be fine. You're going to figure out how to budget all these things. You're going to learn how to eat differently than you did and it's going to stink and you're going to look back on some things. But at the same time, you're going to go, you know what? This is only for a season.

It's going to keep getting better. And so that's what I want you to hear is that you're going to be fine and I would channel that excitement about being independent, about a fresh start. You got this. We're going to walk with you. Yeah. So here's the deal. I want you to hang on the line.

I'm going to send you a copy of my book, Own Your Past, Change Your Future. And the whole premise of the book is, so everything's in ash. And that scary, terrifying question, what am I going to do now? And there's no path for that. That's not in our public lexicon because the way our culture talks about it is either somebody's got to rescue you or you just got to suck it up and grind it out and crush it and kill what nonsense the book lays out a path for you to move out of what i hoped would happen versus what actually is and what do we do next okay so hang on the line here we're going to send you a copy of that thing you've got this it's going to be wobbly it's going to be a struggle

it's going to be a challenge the one thing ken and I would tell you is to make sure you've got some friends in your life, some people around you that will walk alongside you and help pick you up when you fall and scrape your knee, which you're going to do. It's really true. You know, that's true in any transition of life where there's just a lot of uncertainty. Sometimes it's just nice to be in a place with people that you can be vulnerable with and go, I don't know how I'm going to get through tomorrow. Yeah. in a place with people that you can be vulnerable with and go, I don't know how I'm going to get through tomorrow. And then they go, you're fine. I know what I'm in my most pathetic and I'm around the right people. They look at that pathetic voice and that pathetic posture or whatever I'm saying. And they just in a loving way go, uh, snap out of it. You know, like you're going to be okay. And you need that. You got to have that. Yeah okay and you need that you gotta have that yeah and um you also have to have people and this is gonna make us not popular on the twittersphere oh boy um we just started live streaming i know we just started already gonna get in trouble all right

you need some people let me say it this way it's okay to be sad if you wreck your lexus yeah it's okay and in a culture we our culture is, oh yeah, oh yeah, it must be nice. No, it sucks. And it sucks if you have a life where you have a really nice home and you're married to somebody who's making a great salary and then you separate from that and you're a single parent and you are lamenting on what was. You're allowed to do that. In fact, we're going to sit with you because it's a bummer.

Yes, millions of people don't have that. that doesn't mean it doesn't hurt right and if you skip over it and try to pretend like oh it's fine get everybody then your body's going to continue and continue and continue to try to solve for it so no matter where you are on the pecking order whether you are struggling to find groceries or whether you used to have all the money in the world and now suddenly you don't you gotta sit in that reality and grieve it, man, as you transition. I thought she said something that I found it to be heroic, given her situation, and not being able to even understand what she's dealing with. But she said, I'm a little bit excited about, I'm kind of excited about being independent.

I think she's actually in a really good place, given she's been through a lot right now. She's just nervous about it. Yeah. And she did what is wise. She reached out to a couple of knuckleheads and said, hey, I'm not crazy, am I? And we said, no. No. You're good to go.

Yeah, and you're going to be fine. But I never will bet, John, against a mama bear. I'm not betting against a single mom. I don't care how many mistakes she makes. Never. So I feel real good. All our chips are in on you, Annika. Hang on the line.

We'll get you John's book. You're on your way to a better future. Thanks again for trusting us and for the call. This is The Ramsey Show. The Ramsey Show continues. We're thrilled that you're with us. I'm Ken Coleman. Dr. John Deloney joins me in studio this hour, taking your calls about your money, your relationships, your work. 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. Let's go to Clint in Maupin, Oregon. Clint, how can we help?

Yeah. Hi, Clint. Hey, how's it going? Thank you guys for your time. You bet. What's up? So I've got a lot of different ways that I could. I want to make changes in my life, and I've got a lot of different ways that I could go. So I started a construction company about two years ago, and since then, I had three employees and kind of come to the point where I don't have anymore. I've also picked up a second job as an independent sales rep with that. I picked up

quite a bit of debt in equipment and trucks and credit card. And so I'm wondering right now, I've kind of found that I'm, I'm not the best businessman that I thought. I love construction and I love building, but it just ended up, I live in a small community and I seem to always create a friendship rather than a business relationship. So part of me wants to quit the construction and just get rid of the debt, but I have a lot of people that are telling me that I'm not really that far into debt and, you know, the situation that I'm in is not that bad.

And I do, I do make all my bills and stuff, but I listened to your guys' show just recently started. And, uh, it, I mean, I used to be debt free before I started the company. And so now I'm kind of like looking at my situation and looking at how I feel. All right, Clint, let me ask you a question real quick. Let me ask you something. When you say you're more of a friendship than business, does that mean that you're doing work for people and you're having a hard time charging?

What does that mean? Yeah, pretty much. So I worked at the store here. We're a really small area, so worked at the only store in town. And I just ended up, like, being there, getting a relationship with everybody in the town. And so now it's like I started a company and they all want to support me, but I feel myself. I just, yeah. Okay, so were you doing renovations? What kind of construction work were you doing? So I did everything. I mean, my major background is

in excavation. That's why I ended up buying the excavator and the pickup. Both were situational. I had a paid for truck, but it was being pushed way too hard. It was not really built for what it was doing. So I just continued to break it. At the time it was post COVID and the market for used trucks was just, you couldn't find them. And so I hear you guys talk a lot about telling people to get rid of their cars. But mine is a tool, not like a luxury item. Let me dive back in because I want to get a picture of where you are on this so we can give you some advice on this. So were people disputing your hourly rate when you were quoting them,

or were you just knowingly short-selling yourself essentially by not quoting because you feel bad about it, you didn't want to face rejection? John can figure that out for you. He's probably got a beat on it. But I just want to understand, you've lost these employees. It's down to you now. And you're trying to decide, do I stay with this and pay off this debt and learn how to be a better businessman by maybe just being me? I'm trying to help you here, but I need to understand, why weren't you making enough money? Is it because you didn't charge enough or people said you charged too much? What's going on?

No, I just never. In fact, I made a list from last year of the jobs that I did for free just because I grew up in a pretty Christian background. And so, I don't know, I used to help all kinds of people just because I enjoyed building and it wasn't how I made a living. But now that kind of carried on. And is that why you couldn't pay your people? No, I didn't lose my employees because of money they they just found other jobs okay there was there was no i didn't lose them or fire them they just they found better how much debt do you have for the company for the company i'm about 154 000 okay what's your debt service on that? What do you have to pay every month?

It's hard to say. So I have like $18,000 in credit cards. The truck's like $71,000, the accelerator's $69,000. And the interest rates vary from like almost nothing to 14%. Yeah, but you know how much money you have to make every month just to break even with your debt payments. What is that number? $8,000, and that includes my living, my house and stuff. So you've got to make a minimum of $8,000 to keep your home lights on and your business lights on? Yeah. Have you ever cleared that? Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Okay, so there's plenty of work in mopping. So there's plenty of opportunity, and you've cleared $8,000 or more before. Definitely. All right. So what are you questioning? Whether or not you should stay with this? Why are you questioning that? Or let me ask you this. Did you get into it and you're a year and a half into it and this just isn't the job for you? So here's what happened. At this winter, I ended up, so I used to manage the hardware store right here. And so that one of the companies actually reached out to me that I used to work with. And so I started working for them as a sales rep, an independent sales rep. So I don't have hours and I'm able to flex my time around. So I'm doing both. Are you making good money doing sales? Do you like that more than being

a construction manager? Well, it's making like, I mean, I'll probably get like an $8,500 check. So I'm looking at that and how much time I spent. And then I look at like. That's not the answer. That's where I'm trying to decide if I should keep both. Clint, you didn't answer John's question. Answer his question. Do you like the sales role more than you do doing construction work?

We're talking about enjoyment. I like one more than the other. I do enjoy both of them. Okay. I think I'm just frustrated with the one right now. Sure. I do enjoy both of them. Okay. I think I'm just frustrated with the one right now. Sure. I would be too.

If you're clearing as much money as you say you are in the construction, even the way you answered that, like, have you cleared 8,000? Oh, yeah. Then you could make a plan and be completely debt-free and own all these trucks in one calendar year. If you actually said to yourself, I'm going to honor these people by charging them a wage so that I don't have to worry about money and I am going to be able to be in the best position to do the best possible work for them. I had a counseling professor once that gave us all a great talking to. And she said, if you're a therapist and you can't eat, you're worried about paying your bills because you undercharge everybody,

you cannot be a good therapist for the clients who show up to you needing your full self. So you have to charge a living wage. You have to charge what you're worth. And so you can't shortchange your customers. You can't shortchange yourself. Now, if you don't like doing that part then get out of the business but it doesn't sound like that at all it sounds like there's one part of it that you don't like and that's the making money part of it the telling them hey here's how much my business costs being told hey we can't afford that right now. Great. It's awesome. I will be here when you're ready.

It'd be fantastic. And so be it, man. But also, if you like both jobs and you're able to take care of your home responsibilities, knock your lights out. I'm confused as to ultimately what your question is, because it sounds like things are going fine either way. You just have a whole bunch of debt and you can't breathe. And yeah, you're right. Now I wouldn't do that, but what's the, what's the challenge? I guess it's just, I think it's just might be a long, I guess maybe honestly, I was looking for a way out. Cause I was here. You guys say about like dumping your debt, but my debt technically makes money. I don't care about that.

I don't care about that. I think he wants out. I think he want out of the business. Sell your stuff, dude. Sell it. Sell it all and pay off the last truck and just do home remodels out of your truck. Yeah, that's true. If you got the itch for that, then do that.

But if you're looking for a way out, sell everything. Or become the best salesman on the planet crush that job and my buddy's father is a former carpenter who's retired now and he only takes on projects that he does for free for people who are in need and so let that be a way that you give back to your community, let that be a ministry that you do, great. But you have to pay your bills. So one question, you guys talk about being debt-free all the time. In this case with a business, I mean, do you look at that much debt

and do you see that as bad or is that not necessarily? Yes, because dude, 2020 happens again. And your government already has told you, will tell you again, you cannot work. You can't go to work. Those debt payments will still come true. So you're in a little season when you're making money off those trucks. I would not hang on to that long term.

I'd much rather a crummy truck that I own than being in debt and trying to make my bills. Get rid of it. You're looking for a way out. We've got the way out. Great hour, John Deloney. Thank you, sir. Thank you, James Childs, our fearless leader there behind the glass. And you, America, for listening.

This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, it's Dr. John Deloney. If you like what you heard in this episode and want to know more about getting started on the Ramsey Baby Steps, go to ramsaysolutions.com and click on the Get Started button. We'll help you figure out the best next step for you based on your specific situation. That's ramsaysolutions.com and click Get Started.