The Ramsey Show - App - I Feel Like We’ll Never Be Millionaires (Hour 2)

Episode Date: April 18, 2023

Dave Ramsey & Ken Coleman answer your questions and discuss: "After 10 years I still feel very far from Baby Step 7", "I don't know how to get ahead with my finances", "My husband won't stop investing even though we're deeply in debt", Why parents shouldn't pay for their adult kids' expenses. Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3cEP4n6 Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6 Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the pods of Moving and Storage Studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author, host of The Ken Coleman Show, talking about work and careers as my co-host today. We're taking your calls at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225.

Allison is with us in Seattle. Hi, Allison. Welcome to The Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Thanks for taking my call. I appreciate it. Sure. What's up?

I just have a question for you. I'm a longtime listener. We've listened for about 10 years. And I just am curious about your own personal story when you went through bankruptcy. It seems like, if I understand correctly, you became a millionaire pretty quickly after that, or if I'm incorrect, maybe I'm incorrect on that. But I just am wondering how did you do that? It just, it seems so slow to pay off our mortgage, and so I'm a little bit discouraged. Like, I see all these young kids on YouTube, you know, doing all of these, I don't know, investment-type things

where they're buying duplexes, living in half of it. You know, I forget what that's called, but I'm just curious. It just seems so slow. No, it was about 10 years for us. 10 years. We filed bankruptcy in 1988. It was probably about 98 or even near 2000, somewhere in there before we hit a million dollar net worth. I guess I've never gone back and looked at it, but it's somewhere like that. It wasn't that fast. What do you make? What's your household income? About $105,000. Okay. And how has that increased over the last 10 years?

Quite a bit. I mean, my husband, I think he started around $65,000 maybe. Yeah, okay. And so you have just your home left to pay off? Yeah, it's probably worth market value

right around $700,000 and we owe about 99 on it okay but we don't have any intention of selling it so yeah i didn't want you to sell it i just was asking what was going on okay so you got a you got a 700 000 uh you know piece of net worth there and you've also got surely you've been saving for uh retirement through that time right yeah we we do the 15 in 401k and my IRAs yeah and how much is in there I don't know I haven't checked that for a while oh roughly maybe maybe 200 150 200 so maybe you're a millionaire and you just made 100 grand max that's pretty good well i don't know about i don't know well i mean if you're if you did if you have 250 000

in your 401ks and you have a 750750,000 equity in your house, that's a million dollars. Yeah. Yeah, I guess maybe. Yeah. Let's assume that you have a fast forward button because I'm hearing some angst here. I'm just curious. If you fast forward, I think you've been watching crap, get rich quick stuff on the internet and you thought there was an easier way to do it than you've been doing it. With the income you you've had you've done an amazing job what do you want on the other side of this what's on the other side of paying the house off let's assume you've done that what do you want you know i really don't know i've kind of asked myself that question as well i just i think i think i come from a long line of on on both sides of my family, elderly grandparents and great-grandparents dying with nothing. And I'd like to have a better quality of life when

I'm older, I guess. You're already on your way in a spectacular fashion. You're not dying with nothing. Yeah. How old are you and your husband? I'm 44. He's 46. What does he do for a living? He's an electrician. He's already increased his income. Does he work for himself now? No.

No, he works for a utility company. Yeah, but he's still a young man. A natural progression for him to be to start his own company and become a millionaire just in that business alone plus what dave's already laid out for you guys i just think this is so fear-based that you haven't been able to look at your own life and your own reality and see how good you're doing yeah one third of the people that we'd studied that became millionaires did so on six-figure income or less. And that's you. Wow.

That's you. Wow. Okay. So far, I mean, you just now got over $100,000, right? Right. Just in the last year. Yeah. Yeah.

And so you did everything to this point that you've done on less than $100,000 a year. And you told me the house is worth what? Right around $700,000. Okay, and you owe $100,000, so that's a $600,000 equity. I said $700,000. I was wrong, okay? So you have a $600,000 equity, and if you've got $200,000, $250,000 in your 401ks and Roth IRAs, which you need to go look up tonight. You all need to sit down and talk about this.

Yeah. Because you're stewing about this and don't even know the numbers. Yeah. Because sometimes just knowing the numbers will relax you. So here's the thing. Let's pretend that you got $300,000 in there. That's $900,000. Okay?

Very close to a million you follow me six hundred on the house plus three in the other very close to a millionaire at 44 years old that's a long way from dying old and broke yes and so yeah john deloney talks about when you're running into these emotional things and you're you you're running the, uh, the catastrophes over and over in your head, that facts are your friends. They'll, they'll kick the drama queen out of your brain. Facts.

So facts will do that. So sit down and look at the facts because here's a fact. Okay. Let's say that, uh, your net worth grows at an average of 10% a year because you're invested in good mutual funds and real estate does well in the Seattle market, which it traditionally has done for the last 30 years. Okay.

Now, Seattle could screw it up and, you know, cause it to fall in on itself like some of these other cities have done. But let's just assume that Seattle continues to be a boom town. Okay. And so if that happens, your million dollars is going to double every seven years. So you're 44 at 51. It's going to be 2 million at, um, at 58, it's going to be 4 million at 65. It's going to be 8 million. And that's if you add nothing to it.

See what I mean by facts, real estate numbers real estate numbers yeah facts are your friends that's if things go up 10 a year if you got your mutual funds and your and your real estate goes up 10 a year now it may or may not go up that much it may be a little bit less but i'm not that far off my point is not is that you know it's going to double if it doesn't all double every seven years it's going to double every eight years. Whatever it is, it's still going to be pretty close. And that's without adding anything to it. And you're going to continue to add to it.

So your chances of becoming your relative that died broke is close to zero. I mean, you're doing so good. Way to go, Allison. Go get you a mirror and pat yourself on the back. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, you guys. Health insurance costs are only moving one way, and that way isn't down.

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Yeah. If you put off filing your taxes because the process feels tedious or confusing, we understand. But if you owe Uncle Sam, he wants his money. And if you don't file today, you can get hit with extra penalties and interest on top of what you owe. Failure to file is a problem. Don't do this. Get filing. So it's time to find your tax software.

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providers if you've got a complicated return click on elp for taxes we'll help you just go to ramsey solutions.com smart tax today is the day. Oh, my gosh. All right. Sway is with us in Kansas City. Hi, Sway. How are you? Hey, Dave. How are you doing today?

Thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So I'm currently in baby step number two. I have roughly $66,500 in debt. $21,000 of that is a vehicle. I make about $40,000. What do you do for a living?

I drive a dumpster truck. I do lawn waste. I pick up lawn waste. I pick up lawn waste, like leaves and grass clippings. Okay. What's your question? Currently, with the way it's set up, it'll take me about five years to get out of this hole. You got $21,000 car. What's the rest of your debt? 36,000 was because I decided to do an it technical program here in Kansas city, um, to try and, um,

essentially supplement the income that I lost after my divorce. And I just, I really messed up that opportunity at the time. And since I started listening to your show, I actually took some accountability and some responsibility for the mistakes I made. And I asked him if I could reset the coursework and I'm on a wait list because that was kind of the only thing I could think of on how I could really make more money. So quick follow-up question, we'll get to the money stuff. You signed up, paid a lot of money for this IT tech course you didn't finish, is that what I'm understanding? Correct. So you don't have the certification that you were paying for but you've paid in full correct okay but they're gonna let you go back through we hope yes we hope yes cool and you're what are you studying in tech what are you what are you doing can you repeat that sir what what are you studying at it at the technical

school it security awesome well there's gonna be that's gonna increase your income my friend which will help us get out of debt really fast if you apply yourself. That's kind of the goal. And I was considering going to your show in Kansas City this week because I'm not really passionate about IT tech, but I've listened to enough shows where this could kind of be my short-term strategy. It could be short-term. Yeah. yeah well we'll take care of you probably gonna beat dumpster truck yeah yeah when we're done i'll give you two tickets to my event thursday night the breakthrough event in kansas city at union station we'll help you with that but let's let's tackle the rest of this money stuff and i'm hoping they'll give you the credit or allow you to take that course my friend i'd fight hard for that thank you i'm really hoping i'm hoping to know by friday if i make the wait list or not otherwise the credit or allow you to take that course, my friend. I'd fight hard for that. Thank you.

I'm really hoping to know by Friday if I make the wait list or not otherwise. My mom says, you know, all things happen, you know, in God's time. And so I'm hoping. Do you have family? You got small kids, a wife or anything? You got a divorce. I'm divorced. I have two small kids.

I have a nine-year-old who will turn 10 on the 24th, and I have a four-year-old daughter. Here's why I ask. Whatever time that you have when you don't have parental rights or whatever, you've got to be working more than just this truck. Right now, while we're waiting on this technical thing to fix up, we've got side work, side economy is blowing up right now where you can go and make an additional big chunk of change every month and get some momentum, my friend, to work the baby steps. You ought to be working like crazy when you're not with those kids.

And honestly, I am. I was doing that, and that's kind of one of the things, because my car's not fuel efficient. I was doing Uber Eats and DoorDash, both of them, and I was only making maybe $100, $150. So let's not do that. Let's go work in a warehouse. Let's go do late-night grocery. I mean, my friend, the hourly wages. Do you have any technical skills at all as far as the tech part goes? No, and I really just jumped into it because of great marketing.

I could have a new career in four months. I just really's just a high school education and so i was stuck at like the labor at like like like yeah uber eats is not the only thing you can do is an extra side hustle i was hoping you had some tech skills you could start writing some code while you're doing this stuff but that's okay the uber eats is not the only thing driving is not the only thing and oh by the way you maybe sell the car because it's 21 freaking thousand dollars and you only make 40 and so that's kind of where i was um yeah get your beater thinking about this i do have a beater and so the reason i'm in this situation with this vehicle and why i felt kind of wanted your

guidance was my mom essentially took it out in her name because I had totaled my truck, but with my total truck money, after my divorce, I bought a 2001 Honda Civic beater, uh, three months into it, engine blew up, put a new engine in it. Like it's my point A to point B car and i ended up with this explorer because she wanted me to continue my side hustle at the time i had a lawn and tree and lawn company last season i had to put over i was in the red i kept getting damage to my my zero turn mower and it was costing me more money to hold the business than have it. And so I got the vehicle.

Absolute bull. Whoa, whoa. Okay, that's absolute bull. People make money in lawn care every day with zero-turn mowers that tear up. You absolutely, you weren't mowing enough was the problem. You need to mow more man i'm that that's absolute crap the zero turn mower put me into the red said no one who runs lawn care ever we mow more and we make more money than the mower tear down you break mowers that's part of the

business but you make more than that so dude what happened is is you got the snot knocked out of you in this divorce and every time everything we're talking about it's got this this uh wet blanket on it everything we're talking about oh this is bad and this is bad and this is bad and this is bad so right now today is your day's way to change the what you need to lift your chin up, start looking forward. I know you've got a bunch of pain in the past, but you need to start happening to some things with some zest, some enthusiasm, some energy, and a smile.

So get in there and happen to this dadgum IT thing. Get this done. Get this stupid car sold or get back in the lawn business. Man, you can make so stinking much money in a lawn business that you went in the red because your zero-turn mower broke. Oh, give me a break. Come on, dude. Really. While Dave was talking, I pulled up a warehouse associate job.

No degree required. No previous experience. $23 an hour is the first thing I pulled up. The opportunities are there. Go work and start getting some wins. Hang on the line. I want you to come be my guest Thursday night Union Station, the Breakthrough event.

Hang on the line. We'll get you two tickets. Bring somebody else. It'll fire you up. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go. It's time, man. It's your time. It's your time right now. Go. Get it. This is The Ramsey Show. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, is my co-host today.

Open phones at 888-825-5225. Mary is with us in Charlotte, North Carolina. Hi, Mary. Welcome to The Ramsey Show. Hey, Ramsey. Thank you so much for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So my husband ever mentioned to me that he had a second 401k account from his previous employers, and I came across all this while we were doing the budgeting.

And mind you, we've been doing budgeting for like a very long time. The question came about because we have a $60,000 credit card debt. And my question was, well, can we pay some of it from the 401k? And I think that you're totally against that, right? Yes, I am. But the bummer is that he never did tell me he had another second 401k, which amounts to almost 250 000 so he's still putting you know money towards that 401k plus the current employer's 401k

no he's not you can't add to a 401k at a company you no longer work for. Oh, okay. You can only add to a 401k in a company you actually still are employed by. Okay, so you're putting 15%. Okay. Yeah, you're putting 15% of your income towards retirement right now? Yes, that's what he's putting in. In the current employer? In the current employer. He's not willing to take the money out because he says it's not feasible.

Not feasible. No, I wouldn't take it out of the 401k, or you mean he's not willing to stop adding to it? Correct. He's not willing to stop adding to the 401k. Well, what's not feasible is the fact you people still have $65,000 in credit card debt. That's straight up stupid. Right. I agree with you 100%.

Well, so his statement is asinine. I'm going to keep putting money in this while we overspend over here and never reduce our credit card debt. That's dumb. So we were making the account and trying to figure out how much more you're going to be losing. So he's putting in $800, and his company matches up to the $5,000. You guys are not in agreement on what your goals are. Okay.

You need to sit down and decide what we're going to do with our money and if you're going to follow the ramsey plan of getting out of debt so that you can become wealthy faster then you would stop your 401k contributions temporarily while you attack this but y'all have been playing footsie with this he sort of kind of goes over here to the side does whatever the flip he wants to do. You go over here and try to clean up his mess on the other side. Y'all aren't working together. You're working against each other.

You're not going to get this money stuff straightened out as long as you do that. Yeah, I sit down and I tell him, look, this is what's going on. No, that's not how it works. You don't get to tell him anything. We have to decide together that we want to follow a path to become wealthy. And he's not even listening, no matter what you tell him. You just sound like Charlie Brown's teacher in the background.

That's what it sounds like to him because he's not even on board he's just tolerating this thing that you're doing so the two of you need to sit down and say together what are we what are we going to do honey i need your help with this i need you to come alongside me so that we can get out of debt so we can become very wealthy because what we've been doing for the past several years has gotten us to where we are and where we are sucks and i'm kind of tired of this sucking stuff and i wish you would get tired of it too and we could work together on this but right now you feel like you're trying to drag him and you're getting increasingly disgusted with him and he probably tired of hearing you nag yeah yeah am i missing

something no sir yeah so i think this is a marriage communication thing the bible says where there is no vision the people perish y'all don't have a vision for where you want to go together like if sharon and i decide we're going to go on a trip and i don't know make up a we're going to go to florida okay then we decide together that we're going to florida otherwise i gotta duct tape her and throw her in the back seat and take her to florida and that's that's problem problematic it's called kidnapping so you know it just doesn't work so we have to get we have to talk about do we both want to go to florida yeah then we can talk about what's the fastest way to get to Florida. Are we going to buy airline tickets?

Are we going to get our little butt in the car and drive down there? You know, you can get all kinds of methodologies once you both agree on the goal together. But if I want to go to Florida, she don't want to go to Florida, I end up in Florida by myself. Yeah. And Mary, I would just mention this credit card debt. I would mention what it feels like, as Dave touched on, but I would introduce some numbers to the conversation. This is what we're paying every month in credit card debt, and this is the interest they're charging us. And appeal to his sense of money.

I'm scared. Share your fears. I'm scared this is not working. And when I get scared, I get mad, and then I start nagging you, and I'm tired of being a nag. I don't want to do this, and I'm tired of you not listening to me too you know we got to get on the same stinking page here man this matters yeah and then you all decide together what you're going to do and that way you're not pulling in different directions and set a vision for where you want to go. That's what's missing here, is you're trying to do all these Ramsey tactical things that we teach, and both of you are not doing it. Yeah, I was going to ask you,

as we listen to this story, he's looking at it, we presume, he's going, well, I don't want to give up that retirement money to try to pay off debt, and I think it needs to be a complete switch of, switch of it's not just about that my friend it's about what happens if you pay off that debt you get on the other side of that and all those credit card payments now turn into the baby step plan it's like he's so focused on stopping he doesn't want to stop investing in his 401k that he's missing everything else well I mean it feels like you're sitting with credit card debt making a you know paying 18 on it you can't think that's a good 20-year plan exactly no one logically can go oh that's a wonderful plan let's just keep doing that it's more like i hate that that it's over there but i just don't hate it enough to do anything about it yet right right you know you got to hate it you

got to get sick and tired of being sick and tired and busted in the mouth and that's when you that's when things start moving man nothing moves unless it's shoved and so you get sick and tired of being sick and tired and busted in the mouth and that's when you that's when things start moving man nothing moves unless it's shoved and so you get sick and tired of being used to have that i've had it moment and then you're willing to do whatever it takes to get there that's when you start moving stuff around in your life particularly money stuff that's exactly how it works mickey is with us in jacksonville florida hi mickey welcome to the ramsey show hi dave hi ken thanks for taking my phone call i appreciate it um i just have a quick Mickey is with us in Jacksonville, Florida. Hi, Mickey. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Hi, Ken. Thanks for taking my phone call.

I appreciate it. Sure. I just have a quick question. So for the last five years, my husband has kind of been sending a call to pastoral ministry, and we were just, so we're in Baby Step 2 currently, or I'm sorry, we're leaving Baby Step 2, and we were trying to figure out if there was a way for both of us to go back to school debt-free. I don't know what your thoughts are on that. He's currently an aircraft mechanic, and he's thinking about making that, you know, just following the path he feels like God has on his life. And I don't know what your thoughts are.

What's your path? Because you said both of us. Yeah, so I'm a stay-at-home mom primarily, but I do work part-time for about 10 to 20 hours a week, just depending on the week. Yeah, but why do you think you need to go back to school, or why do you want to go? So I was wanting to go back to school to get my degree in Christian and marital, I'm sorry, family and marital Christian counseling to help support his ministry. And then he would go back to school for pastoral ministry.

But then it would also, you know, allow some room for income in the case that he does decide that he needs to stop being an aircraft mechanic altogether, if that makes sense. He can't decide that because y'all don't have any food if he does. You have to have food. Yeah. So pastoral ministry is going to be a part-time gig, and you can, guess what? You can start at a church tomorrow. You don't have to have a seminary degree to do that.

Right. Some denominations require that, but most don't. So you can start, and you can start volunteering at your local church. Now, I suspect you both already are, aren't you? We are. Good, good. So let's find a way, a path into pastoral ministry that does not involve $250,000 worth of seminary degree when you're an aircraft mechanic trying to feed two kids.

That's right. And besides grants and scholarships, you're going to have to save, which means be patient. You both may not be able to go to college in the same season. You're not. You don't have any money. It's not happening. You're broken in debt. So you're going to have to lay out a game plan that gets you there gradually and incrementally.

And it may be that he becomes a pastor without a seminary degree. That's not that unusual. Open phones this hour, 888-825-5225. So the folks at Fox News, Ken, contacted us a couple weeks ago and said there's an article in The Hill showing that up to 50% of American families are paying their adult children's bills to a tune of an average of $82 dollars a month wow and um the and the vast majority i forget what the number was no it's up to 25 percent of millennials

their parents are paying their housing meaning they're paying their house payment their rent or they're living in their basement i don't know which um this is um i've never seen it like this that and it's and so i did an op-ed that's on the on the front page of fox web right now and fox business web uh on this subject and it blew up the op-ed blew up um just like this i mean i had a thing on social media last week that got 32 million views it blew my mind it blew up just and it was a clip from a couple of years ago of me taking a call from uh these people that were almost a million dollars in debt and only 200 000 of it was their mortgage i mean they were just it was amazing and i was i don't know why the thing blew up it's calls we take here all the time that's right i really couldn't see anything different but something was special on tiktok and it just went nuts

so i guess that tiktok generation just had never seen they've not seen that seen someone actually know the answer to the question and care deeply about the people on the other side care enough to tell them the truth yeah and we tell them the truth tell you the truth here sometimes you don't like it but we always tell you the truth but this this thing of parents you and i have been talking about this a lot in america right now with the labor crisis we're going to talk about it more on may the 4th with this thing with mike rowe that we're doing uh and you guys ought to sign up and watch that uh live stream that we're doing because this labor crisis is tied into this loss mike rowe at dirty jobs and i were talking this loss of work ethic we've forgotten how to do hard things that's right yeah there's two

calluses are a thing of the past yeah yeah there's two things that i think parents have eliminated over the last few decades hard hard things and scary things. Hard things where it's not scary, it's just really, really hard. I'll give you an example. My father, first job I got, I was 14. He went and got the job. He knew I needed to work, and he made a couple connections, but he specifically chose a job that he told me years later. He goes, I wanted you to taste really brutally hard work. And I had to go up on a latter day for a local painter that he knew. And I had to scrape paint off the side of a house with a propane tank in one hand and a scraper in the other. And you know, I'm 14. My arms were as

big around as strings. And you just, it's painful. It was exhausting work. And he told me, I wanted you to taste hard work. So number one, you could do it. Number two, that you would set your sights on something higher. That's a hard thing. And scary things are allowing kids to fail, to try an instrument, Dave, to maybe try a small business, to try a sport, to do something. Where they actually keep score. Yes.

And you don't get a trophy unless you win. Yeah, well, that's a whole other issue is participation. It's part of the problem. Yes. Part of the problem. Oh, well, that's a whole other issue is participation. It's part of the problem. Yes. Part of the problem. Oh, yeah, it's a big issue. Psychologists call, when you pay your kids bills, psychologists call that enabling. Yeah.

Okay? Yeah. And the rest of us call it stupid. And you're not helping. You're not helping. No. Because the little eagles are not not gonna soar unless you kick their butt out of the nest then you no eagle ever flew with the nest attached that's right never happened

so the helicopter parenting oh the participation trophies i don't want my child to ever hear or see or experience anything negative it's not good for you you. No, we've stunted the growth. It's not good for you. You need to experience winning, and winning is not as fun unless you have also failed. Yeah, well, you don't appreciate winning until you've lost. The sting of loss is what drives champions. And you're right, Dave, this participation stuff, we've laughed about it for decades, and now it's playing out in the workplace.'s how it's it's unrealistic and unmet expectations this is what it looks like in the workforce right now and it is these kids have gotten trophies and

parties just for showing up you know what's weird is that it's not all of them not all so they get thrown under the bus like gen z and millennials get thrown under the bus is all being this. And they're not because I got 400 of them working in the building here. Correct. That are missional. They're hardworking. They care deeply. They're passionate.

They'll charge the gates of hell with a water pistol, man. But then, you know, they got their friend over here who's mommy's helicopter. And the irony of irony, you know, your 28 year old son lives in your basement and in an act of sheer irony spends his day playing call of duty yeah that's i mean think about the irony of that yes he doesn't even understand he doesn't know what duty is and he's never answered a call yeah and oh my god and this is what plays into this dave is that now parents feel bad because their kids are struggling and so now they pay their bills for them we need to struggle we have

worked michael easter talks about this in the comfort crisis we have worked very very hard to become to be comfortable oh yeah and then we've worked even harder to make sure our kids don't experience any pain and it turns out now the data is in that's a mistake allow your kids encourage your kids force your kids to do hard things and scary things that's right it is so you get you know stand on your own two feet there is so much dignity in that when you have to buy your own bread and pay your own light bill because mommy isn't going to do it you have become a man my son oh my gosh and then we wonder why there's a manhood crisis yeah you know we wonder why there's a stunted growth out there and you know it's society's

fault you know i'm triggered kiss Kiss my butt. You're triggered. Get off your tail and go do something. Triggered. Yeah. Give me a break. See, that's the problem. We create terms like that to describe real emotions that everybody's had. I need a safe space.

Ain't one. No, you don't. Ain't one. Heaven. That's it. Right. That's a safe space. Until you get there, not going to be safe, Bubba. And that's the truth. Accept it and space until you get there yeah not gonna be safe and that's the truth

accept it and get on with it yeah you know i can't have a car that doesn't have 73 airbags i mean you're telling this to a generation used to sleep in the back window while they were driving down the road we didn't have bike helmets or elbow pads you know what it made us better bike riders because if you wrecked you stuck to the sheets for six nights those are consequences well it's gross dave but it hurts try pulling this sheet off of your leg yeah i know well i got it don't do it hey i'm gross dave out this is very exciting folks it's a rare moment in the show hey i went farther than dave but you know the point is is that we here's what happened it's a marketing message that scared everybody. Marketing started figuring out that if I scare parents, they'll buy more stuff.

And then it took hold. And we've got the most scared society ever. This whole thing, it comes from I want good things for my kids. And enablers are always the nicest people, right? They don't want their kids to hurt. They don't want anyone. Whoever it is they're enabling, they don't want their kids to hurt they don't want anyone whoever it is they're enabling they don't want them to feel any pain and the sad thing is what we're discovering now is is that a controlled reasonable level of pain in order to create growth is the right way muscle

is not built unless you get sore how do you get sore that's called pain working out you lift a weight and your muscle gets sore lactic acid kicks in kicks in but no muscle is built sitting it's true it doesn't it never has happened and the muscles of our brains the calluses on our brains come from enduring through persevering through hard things that's right stressful things and coming out the other side and no one's saying oh here's a safe space i'm sorry you're triggered that's exactly right now what you are is you're prepared you're prepared for whatever life throws your way toughening because you've come through challenges before

you've done hard things you've overcome scary things and now you go okay i can take the next hard thing on i can take the next scary isn't it interesting that throughout history that to go from adolescence to adulthood with every culture but ours there has been some kind of ritualistic rite of passage that involves something hard it's a very good point yes absolutely if you look at i'm not saying your kid needs to be put out there in a life or death situation in order to be okay i'm just saying maybe they should sweat once. At least. At least think there's a bear that's going to get them. At least you should have a callus from having persevered through a loss

and turned it into a win. Yeah. And moms and dads in America, doing this for people you love is an act of love. It's not a big old meaning. As a matter of fact, enabling is quite the opposite of loving. This is The Ramsey Show. Dave here. You can find all of our shows with the Ramsey Network app on your smartphone.

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