The Ramsey Show - App - I'm a Collectibles Hoarder and Need To Make a Change (Hour 1)

Episode Date: March 7, 2022

Dave Ramsey & Dr. John Delony discuss: How to budget for an engagement ring, The difference between collecting and hoarding, Dealing with a large inheritance Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey personality, is my co-host today. He is a number one best-selling author. He's also the host of the fastest-growing podcast on the Ramsey Network called The Dr. John Deloney Show, where people call in with mental health questions, relationship questions. We'll take those today, as we always do, and we'll also take questions about your job, your career, and, oh, even your money.

Andrew is going to start off this hour in Milwaukee. Hey, Andrew, what's up? Hi, Dave. Thank you for taking my call. Pleasure speaking with you. You too, sir. How can we help? So my question is, I'm in the middle of my baby step two.

I'm hitting it with gazelle intensity. However, I'm also about one and a half years into my relationship. Both of us are, we know we want to get married. It's going to happen this year. My question is essentially how much should I be budgeting for the engagement ring? And when do I buy the ring? Is it my next paycheck? All that goes to the ring? Or is that a sinking fund sometime within this year? The question about how much to budget, I'm basically asking because I know you typically say one month's pay. One month's pay is very different compared to base, compared to what I'm making right now in gazelle intensity, getting all the overtime that I am getting. Okay. Well, congratulations.

How old are you? I just turned 26 two days ago. Awesomeness, man. Well, this is fun. What a great time for you. Okay, so your range of one month's pay plus base plus hustle is what? What's the bottom end of this idea and the top end of this idea? So yearly gross base is 80.

Okay. Right now, gazelle intensity, I'm taking home $3,500 every two weeks paycheck. Okay. All right. So 80 to 120. Okay. correct and so um what does she make she currently um is between 40 to 50 what's she doing she's in between jobs but that's she was a director for a music program now she's looking to transition to potentially hr so she'll either one of you grow up wealthy uh no okay all right well because there's a whole there's a whole thing a whole lot of things that go into this um the idea of one month is to give folks a guideline because the

jewelry store the retail jewelry store people will tell you three months but that's a crock you don't need to spend that much um number two you, what I was trying to ascertain is expectations based on her income, how she was brought up, those kinds of things. And so, and there's all these stories and everything about rings and everything else. It's a fun time you're in for sure. And I want you guys to have fun with the whole process. And so we don't want the ring to be the center of the attention because you went nuts on one side and we don't want it to be the center of the attention because you didn't

spend enough on it either on the other side right so that's that's kind of the balance i'm looking for just as a old grandpa here um so if i'm in your shoes you know probably the five thousand dollar range is probably going to be fine that'll be a pretty dadgum nice ring i will tell you that diamonds having bought quite a few of them over the years um uh because the one i bought when i started i had to upgrade a couple times since but um anyway the uh uh they are completely worthless and don't let anybody talk to you about an investment. The investment aspect of them is a freaking joke. The only investment is into your relationship and how she feels. Okay? But I've got, I don't know, I don't even want to say how much, tied up in diamonds.

And I have no expectation that they're going up in value because they generally don't. It's just a crock. Okay? So don't get all caught up in that. The second thing about diamonds you need to know is they're marked up as much as anything we buy. Furniture and diamonds, double. They're double. Okay, so when you walk into the mall jewelry store, it's double what you can get it from a diamond broker for.

And so start doing some research and learning because you can get double for bang for your buck. And you need to learn a little bit about the purchase process, the carrot, the cut, the clarity, those kinds of things, and what makes a good diamond. But again, don't get all caught up in one flaw that the naked eye can't see in the thing, and so it's a two instead of a one or whatever, because it's not going to matter. If anybody gets their eye down that close to it, they don't need to be looking. It's fun to learn i i would just get with uh somebody in your life that's bought some in the past and or uh if you can find a great diamond broker in your area that will teach you a little bit but don't get caught up in the uh and shop around the last thing is if you could really get

somebody knows how to put a glass on their eye the best place to buy one's pawn shop because it'll be it'll be a third of what you'll find in the retail and you might you but you might pick you might buy a piece of glass too and not know what you're buying if you don't get somebody knows how to put a glass on their eye and look at it with you so i would be scared to do that if i didn't know the pawn shop owner. If I don't know anyone like that, a broker, that's a pretty safe bet. Yeah, but again, you've got to go in there like you do anything else where you're doing an investment purchase, and you're going in with finding somebody with the heart of a teacher to teach you about it.

Okay. Okay. And the last thing is this. You're not going to mess this up because there's absolutely zero research between the correlation the size of the rock and the success of the marriage but there is a lot of research on husbands who uh take a knee and they propose and then they and followed up with and i got this at a pawn shop hey it depends on who you are and where you got mine to punch up my wife would have been so happy

that's incredible but yeah yeah other people wouldn't but here's the thing there may be some inverse relationship this as the rock is too big the failing of the marriage is predicted but because it seems to be we're concentrating on the wrong things here which is the relationship versus the rock has she so has she talked to you about it like what she's looking for yeah i mean she she's given me her expectations which i mean she's aware of how important it is for me to get out of baby step two so she's giving me yeah but i i don't option you take a month off and go do this and do it right but no it's not a ten thousand dollar purchase in my mind and it's not a one thousand dollar purchase okay so pause baby step two to build up five thousand dollars

based on what i'm making and then buy it resume baby step two to build up five thousand dollars based on what i'm making and then buy it resume baby step two that's what i'm there you go and here's the thing i know a lot of guys that will have this conversation with the person that they're going to get engaged to and then the person tells them hey this is what i would love this is kind of what the kind of band i would like and the guy goes rogue because he thinks oh actually i'm gonna get and so man if she's honorable enough to tell you then listen listen man this is this is test number one for many many tests to come over the years just listen i'll just tell you i don't buy them anymore at all unless sharon does the design she does my wife does not do surprises

is she not happy with the surprise because i'm always wrong right so i just that's what she's no she loves surprises she doesn't like other ladies like it they like that they like the you put time and effort into it and so forth but i've made that mistake a couple times and i'll never do it again so no we don't buy anything shiny without sharon actually approving being in on it so you could go that route if you want to go really crazy. This is The a smart move. I get questions all the time about where to start and what to do first. One of the most crucial and affordable first steps to take is to protect

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It's not that expensive, it's not complicated, and you need to do it now. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Building wealth is a really hot topic right now. It's all over your social media. It's jamming up your email inbox it's on the talk shows and podcasts the late night news everyone's got an opinion on how to get rich quick and how crypto or single stocks or zero down real estate gold whatever is the way to do it oh and throw in inflation for a big dose of fear on top of

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You get free samples, free shipping, new promos all the time. You'll save even more. Use the new promos all the time you'll save even more use the promo code ramsey and you'll have the best deal today's question comes from james in alabama james writes i'm in an embarrassing situation i'm 36 years old and i'm a hoarder i have over 50 000 invested in to video games comics toys. This is consuming the home that my mother and I live in, which is making her unhappy. I have about $15,000 in debt and earn about $35,000 a year.

I'm really starting to wake up after watching your show and I've been thinking about selling 99% of my stuff and living a simpler life. I just feel lost in the process and I have trouble letting things go. How can I change my mindset about these things I've collected? It's tough. Dave, this is one of those challenges that people start trying to solve the immediate problem right in front of them.

And you can do that, but something that is going on in James' life,'m going to guess is deep-seated that he needs to go do some hard work he's 36 still living at home he's packed up stuff he's he's running and hiding this is a person who's very anxious um and he's probably got some childhood trauma that he's dealing with so when i feel people get in this situation i just can't break three i can't break i can't break this person needs to go sit down and talk to somebody. So the hoarding is the symptom, not the problem. Correct. Right. It is usually a response.

It almost always is, actually. Some sort of anxiousness or trauma response. Yeah. I've had some stuff go on, and I just start collecting and collecting and collecting, and I don't want to let go because I might need it. It's preparatory, and all of a sudden you look up and you can't move in your home. Right. And this guy distinguished for me because i've got this friend who might be a little bit ocd and uh he's got collections of things i have a collection of

water skis i have a collection of um wine i have a collection of guns i have a collection of whatever right and um those things are things i got drawn into and usually the community around them um and that they represent and or the memory or something um and so i just enjoyed the process and they and they sometimes not all of them but some things run their course like i i used to buy a lot more guns than i buy now yeah but i've kind of got the i'm kind of full i haven haven't bought a bunch of guns. I don't buy anywhere near the volume I used to. So it kind of ran its course, so to speak.

But what's the difference between a collector and a hoarder? I would suggest a collector is somebody, like you said, that has a good community. This is something you do. This is something you enjoy. That thing that you're buying doesn't own you, right? Okay. And so I get a paycheck. I can't not go buy this thing.

Okay. It's an addiction. I see. And if I said, if Sharon came to you and said, we have to sell some of these guns, your initial response is, I can't do that. Oh, I see. Not an intellectual argument, not a, well, why would we do that?

It's, I can't part with this. And so you can look at somebody's house who's a hoarder and say throw it away you're asking them to peel back layers of security that they've walls that they've built literally okay and so this starts with man the fact there's even a even a difference between someone who's a very aggressive um because i can remember like times i've been in a zone zone like I got on a hunt for that thing because to complete the collection. You're a hunter. And I enjoyed that part of it

but that's different than I can't live without it spiritually. And you also did it differently when you had resources and finances than when you didn't. Oh yeah, yeah. It's a very, very small percentage of the world. Of your net worth, right. It's not like you made...

Okay, I'm feeling better because I was kind of worried. Well, if you ever need to unload some of your wine or guns or bourbon, holler at me. And I know a guy. But, so James, here's the thing. I want you to reach out to a friend.

Reach out to a pastor in your community that you trust, a counselor. Reach out to somebody and say, I'm ready to get well. And this is going to be hard. And you're going to have some stuff you're going to have to deal with. You're going to have to go back and revisit some stuff that's going on in your life.

But the fact that you're ready is so good, man. It's hard to get people here. It feels like if he were to come up under this and start getting well, the result would be the release of these things. It can be that you just start shedding stuff. It wouldn't be as much of a tearing. Right. It feels like right now there'd be a ripping sound, a tearing sound.

And when that happens, you'll find somewhere else to plug this. So you can hire a crew to come clean your house up, throw everything away, and that addiction will just jump to something else. Yeah. Right. Yeah. The problem is still under there. That's right.

Somewhere. That's right. But good for you, James. Yeah. And you know, here's the other thing. I've bought real estate from people that were hoarders. Yes. And tremendous problem even getting inside to see the house on the inside.

The shame from a true hoarder, someone who's really dealing with a psychological issue to that, the shame around it is unbelievable. You just called something that's important. A lot of people think I'm a hoarder, and then you go to somebody's home who's a true hoarder, and you go, oh, I'm not trashed. It's completely. I mean, stuff smells. Magazines to the ceiling.

Smells bad. Always smells bad. It's always nasty. It's animals. It's different. Oh, it's gross. It's different. It's so gross.

Yeah. Yeah. I bought houses like that, and we had entire dumpsters outside after the you know maybe even the hoarder had passed away and we bought it from the estate and gone in and cleaned it out it's amazing it's mind-blowing when you go in there so anytime you're about identity change it starts with looking in the mirror and saying i'm worth more than this and let's start the healing there but good for you james i'm proud of you brother yeah very good stuff very good man yeah that's very smart to recognize that and here's the other thing he did really good that i think is a sign for his healing is he put numbers around this and

he started recognizing they were out of balance because he put them in the email he did two things that were great i make 35 i got 50 and i and i owe 15 yeah i heard the three numbers. And I want to sell 99% of this stuff. So he did two things. He put numbers around it, and he took full responsibility. He didn't say, I have this because of this. He said, this is on me, and I've got to make some changes. Where do I start? And this starts with saying stuff out loud to somebody else.

But still, even though that's a really good first rung on the ladder, he's still got to get up under it. it's gonna just his parts of his heart are gonna leave that's it and he needs to detach from the heart before the stuff leaves that's right that's exactly right that's a great way to put that wow this isn't a matter of just throwing stuff away in america we've all got just about everybody's got stuff itis of some kind if i get that i'll be happy if i could just get that car i'll be happy if i could buy billions and billions of dollars that we have in storage was a billion square foot of storage space yeah i don't know it's ridiculous yeah yeah we spend more on storing stuff than most countries gdp bonkers stuff that we don't use yeah we're the only country in the

world that when someone moves they have a box labeled seldom used kitchen items. It's like, yeah, I've got to, I'll be happy when I get that thing from Ronco. That's the big difference. The two sets of knives. Can you be happy without that gun? Can you be happy without that car? Would it be cool and nice? Of course it would.

Will I still be worth being loved if I don't have that? Yeah, I quit buying cars for other people a long time ago. That's one of the things going broke. I still got really nice cars. Again, I got really nice cars, but they're for me. I love that. It's because I like driving. And I don't really care whether you like it or not, because I like it.

That's a whole different thing than I used to do in my 20s. Whole different thing. This is The Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today here on The Ramsey Show. In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the Dead Free Stage, Zach and Becky are with us. Hey, guys, how are you? Great. How are you? Better than I deserve.

Where do you guys live? Fargo, North Dakota. Fargo, North Dakota. Fargo, North Dakota. It's a bit of a haul to Nashville. Just a little bit. Did you drive or fly? We flew. Flew.

I guess. I hope so. My goodness gracious. How cold is it there right now? I don't want to know. That is a great answer. Says the guy in shorts in Tennessee. I like it. All right.

How much debt did you guys pay off? $170,000. Very good. How long did this take four and a half years or so wow and your range of income during that time 45 to 105 oh nice jump okay cool what do y'all do for a living i stay at home with the girls and zach flies fly you're a pilot yeah yeah i do a small cargo uh company fly ups right okay very cool i thought you were a superhero that's fantastic thank you yeah that's worth the cape yeah so the uh 170,000 in debt was what car and student loans whoa sally may go to big chunk huh yeah unfortunately flight

school oh flight school ah there it is all right well she still had to be kicked out yes ugly woman didn't need her own bedroom in your house. All right. I like it. Way to go, you guys. How long you been married? Five and a half years. Okay.

So one year into marriage, you decide go gangbuster on this. Tell us about what happened. During our marriage prep course, we had a financial teacher, I guess, during our weekend retreat thing, whatever. And it happened to be one of Zach's professors that he looked up to. So it was like, we already kind of know his story. Yeah, so he shared his story, and we kind of thought it was really cool. And we kind of dropped it after that for a little bit.

So he kind of had a Ramsey story? Oh, yeah. He did the whole thing. I recommended your Total Money Makeover book. Okay. And you did none of it immediately. Correct. Right, because we were still in school. There's not so much we can do, what we thought. And what student listens to the professor? Exactly. It takes like six months to brew. So you're married a year in. What woke you up? What was like, oh God,

we've got to do this um it was like a couple months after we got married we read the book together oh um and then just started knocking them out um the first year we were pretty strong and then um i was teaching at the time um we got pregnant we thought you can't do this when you're pregnant you know so we kind of laid back a little bit went davish um we ended up moving to sioux falls south dakota for six months i stopped teaching because i stayed at home with our oldest daughter abby and zach started at this current job he has now but like a lower salary yeah lower on the totem pole um We moved back up to Fargo because there was a better opportunity with the job. Now he's kind of like

the head guy of Fargo, so that's cool. Bumped up our salary. Had another kid in the midst. And just kept working on our salary. And her brother met with some smart investor pros in Iowa and we're like, oh, well, we should look into that too.

So stopped the Davis and went Gazelle Intense. Ah, okay. Yeah, finally figured it out. Babies and moves, we turned the heat up and down. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And finally turned the heat up and knocked it out. So then after we met with Tana, our SmartVestor pro, she kind of kicked us in the pants and...

Had us set a goal, and we actually knocked that goal out of the water. All right, there we go game on hey i like it you got there yeah you got there i like it it's a good and that's a real story that's not somebody that's too fake to be believed y'all really did this yeah the last like year we paid um over a hundred thousand it was a year and a half i guess over a hundred thousand so so the vast majority of it just lately yeah yeah. Yeah. Wow. So I've met with a lot of students over the years, and they look at a number this high, and they kind of just quit.

Yeah. Like, that number's high. And you all chipped away at it for three years. How did you keep from getting frustrated and just killing each other? I mean, we were kind of our biggest... We were just killing him. It was his day. Right.

Yeah. I watched the show, and no one would have ever found him, right? Yeah. Right. Right. Right. Yeah, I'll take the blame on that one. No one would have ever found him, right? Yeah, right, right, right. But yeah, it was just kind of, you know, we wanted to see the loan number go down and our money in our pocket go up. Right, change the family tree for our girls. Give them something to look forward to instead of just a mountain of debt.

So that was kind of the big motivating factor. And we just wanted to live our lives instead of paying out to the banks. So have you had that moment where you've paid off everything and your check is deposited and you get to keep all of that? Yes. So now it's going towards our house. Well, we had finished our six-month emergency fund, so now it's just saving for a house

that we don't have right now. So it's just, there's a lot like... Shifting the intensity to getting rid of our money. Well, now it's to get something you want it's to get rid of something you hate right that's more fun

yes it is good for you guys well done I'm proud of you what do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is

stick to a budget we didn't have beans and rice necessarily but off brand mac and cheese is really good yeah yeah I'm with you alright

yeah sticking to the budget you know just keeping an eye on all the little purchases and it all adds up. Yep. The little things make a big difference. We sold a lot of stuff on, like, Facebook Marketplace. Raising our incomes acted door dash for a while. So any little thing helps. So what do you tell people the key?

Okay. At the 18-month mark, you met with a smart investor pro, you set a goal, and that's when the intensity kicked in. Yeah. And you never let up during that 18 months and did most of the work during that time. Right. What do you tell people that key was? What was it that all of a sudden went, okay, fire on, we're doing this? I think we were just tired of being the Dave-ish and it's not really going away very fast.

We just really need to keep up with the intensity um i think it was tana that had suggested like writing down our um debt snowball and putting it on the fridge so you see it all the time and that didn't really affect him so much but it was like in my face all day long since i stayed home with the girls um so and then just having all sorts of like charts and stuff that you can color in or whatever it was helpful for me yeah anything visual yes it's helpful yeah visuals very and then just having all sorts of charts and stuff that you can color in or whatever, it was helpful for me. Yeah, anything visual. Yes.

That's helpful, yeah. Visual's very motivating. And is it true that your kids will survive if they don't have everything that they wish? Yeah. They don't agree with that at the time, but you have to learn how to say no when you're at the grocery store and they want all the fancy cereals that are garbage for you anyway. It's actually gotten to the point where we were going to go out to eat one night and our older daughter, she's like, well, we can't go out to eat. We have to save for buying a house.

Yeah. So we were like, well, we have gift cards for that because we have gift cards from Christmas, you know, so. No, mom, no. Put the box back. Now we're rationalizing to the six-year-old. We have cereal out of the bag, mommy. Yeah.

Yeah. That's the way to go. And she's three and a half and she's like, we can't have Chick-fil-A. We don't have money for that. We have to save for a house. Oh, good. Perfect. That's so perfect.

Oh, that's good. She's going to be listening to my show in a few years. That's fantastic. Yeah. Way to go, you guys. We're very proud of you. Very impressive. Who were your biggest cheerleaders outside the two of you?

Our girls, I guess, if it's outside the two of us, yeah. Her brother was a pretty big supporter, too. What about the professor? Oh, he was. And him and Tana. We just didn't see him as often since we left Grand Forks after that. Oh, I see. Okay.

Does he know you did all this now? Yes, he's watching right now, I think. Oh, that's good. What's his name? Dan Malott. All right. Well, give him a shout out. Very good.

Thanks, Dan. And Tana. This is a life that was changed Malott. All right. Well, give him a shout out. Very good. Thanks, Dan. All right. Very cool. And Tana. Now, this is a life that was changed right here. Well done. I love it, guys. We got a copy of Baby Steps Millionaires for you. That's the next chapter in your story, how ordinary people build extraordinary wealth,

how you can too. It's the number one bestseller and our gift to you. Another number one bestseller, Total Money Makeover, going to give you one of those, and you can give it away to somebody and disturb them the way Prof did for you. That'll be good stuff. So well done, you two. Very well done. Zach and Becky, Fargo, North Dakota, $170,000 paid off in four and a half years.

Most of it in the last 18 months, making $45,000 to $105,000. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We a debt-free scream. 3, 2, 1. We're debt-free! Yes! Yes! Whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop!

Yeah! What a great couple. $175,000 is a tall mountain to climb. It's a big old mountain, yeah. It's a big mountain to climb. And most of it's student loans. I mean, and that's the big topic out there, that it can't be done.

It can't be done. Yes, it can. Yes, it can. Zach and Becky from Fargo, North Dakota just did a mic drop. Yes, it can be done. They did it. And they're walking social proof

that you can too. You can do it when you're pregnant. You can do it with a kid. You can do it while you're renting. You can do it when you're trading jobs. You can do it. You can can do it while you're renting you can do it when you're trading jobs you can do it you can do it you can do it well it's just a matter of it has to be front and i like the front and center thing with the visual yeah that just gets in your face messes with you constantly reminding you very very good very good stuff this is the Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today.

Drake is with us in Kansas City. Hi, Drake. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hey, Dave. How's it going? Better than I deserve. What's up? Well, pretty much I was lucky enough to live with the best dad anybody could ever ask for. Best friend growing up, all of that. Long story short, he passed away a few years ago and left me a pretty good chunk of money. It's in a trust fund right now.

I won't see any of it until I'm 25 years old. I'm a college student right now. I won't see any of it until I'm 25 years old. I'm a college student right now. I'm 22, so I've got about three years left to go. Basically, I have a few ideas of kind of what I should do and how I should save it, investments like real estate and stuff like that down the road. But pretty much, I just wanted to see kind of if you were me or if you were in my shoes,

what would be some things you would do with a big chunk like this. How much is it? I've got about $550,000 in the 401k and then about $438,000 in cash. And I've got about $18,000 of my own right now that I have access to. Okay. And you're 22. How old was he? He was 53 when he passed away.

Wow. What happened? Yeah. Sadly, it was a terminal disease, Lou Gehrig's disease so it was yeah I'm sorry pretty rough

sorry for what you've been through I appreciate that a couple of things more than anything you just need some principles to guide you instead of specific tactics let me give you some principles number one principle, go slow.

There's no reason to be fast. Number two, don't put money in anything you don't understand. Just because somebody says it, they know this or they know that, or you read an article on the Internet, God help you, don't do that. Or because even Dave Ramsey said to do it, don't do it. You don't put money in something unless you understand it. If you understand it, you can learn from people like me to where you understand it. Then you can go forward.

But just because it's shiny and flashy and cool and the cool kids are all doing it does not mean you put money in it. As a matter of fact, that usually means you don't. The other thing you can remember is this. Having studied wealthy people for the past 30 years, I find that their investing strategies are, by and large, very boring. They're not super uber sophisticated. They don't do limited family partnership double backflips.

There's no weird stuff. All these things you hear that the rich have secrets, they really don't do limited family partnership double backflips. There's no weird stuff. All these things you hear that the rich have secrets, they really don't. They go slow. They know what they put money in. They understand it. They don't put money in something unless they understand it, and therefore they don't lose it, and it generally makes some money. But they're not trying to hit the home run every time.

They're just trying to make money on their money just steady right and so uh it doesn't matter what you put money in as long as you understand it and you know you know what it is and you do it so um you know so i know a lot about real estate i grew up in the real estate business my parents were in the business when i was a kid i got my license when i turned 18. I'm very, very comfortable with real estate. Consequently, I have a bunch of it. Okay. Right. But someone who's scared to death and has never done it or never dealt with a tenant, you would want to go super, super slow, test it a little bit, test it a little bit, test it a little bit. It's second nature for me though. Okay. Same thing with mutual funds. I really do not have any investments personally except mutual funds and real estate.

That's all I have. Because I got really comfortable with it. It doesn't have to be sexy or cool. If the cool kids don't like it, I don't really care. I'm not investing for them. Right. You know, Dave Ramsey doesn't understand. Dave Ramsey's got several hundred million dollars.

Dave Ramsey understands something understand. Dave Ramsey's got several hundred million dollars. Dave Ramsey understands something, okay? All right. So, you know, that's just, you know, that's, but that's what I find when I talk to, you know, the person you're talking to, if they've got a little gray hair, it's probably a good idea because I was young and rich and lost everything. I didn't want his opinion when I started surveying people about how money works because he was an idiot. He lost everything. didn't want his opinion when i started surveying people about how money works because he was an idiot he lost everything that's me i'm talking about so but i did i did high leverage get rich quick real estate and it bit me in the butt

because i violated a lot of common sense rules so all of that to say do that the last thing i'll tell you is this in the multitude of council there is safety and so if i were a 25 year old millionaire sudden sudden millionaire i would uh build a board of directors for my life not that tells me what to do a board of advisors i'd have a high quality insurance broker an estate planner a tax attorney an investment broker all that i can call and speak to about taxes about insurance about real estate a good real estate person i'd have a little collection of people that i you don't necessarily have to call them all together at any time but they need to um they're there to advise you with the heart of a teacher they're not there to tell you what to do. They're not there to be arrogant and act like they have their God's gift to whatever.

If you sense that arrogance, run from them, but get some teachers in your corner because you have to go slow and you have to invest only in things you don't understand. The one thing I'd add, Dave, is I didn't understand this until I got older and started having money. Don't use this money to leverage this money to go get some more um the number of folks who said hey you want to put 10 in on this or 25 in on this or hey we're all going in to buy this apartment you want to put 15 on this they they like me as a friend but what they really want is my money to make their picture of what they want to do come true and it's easy to take that money and think you can parse it out and make a bunch of people happy and make a bunch of money over it. You end up spreading it all out, and you can lose that money quick.

The only ship on sale is a partnership. I'm not in any partnerships. I own it. Or I'm not in it. It's okay. And that means I've got lots of friends that do all kinds of stuff like that, but I don't do it. My life is low drama, very low drama. It's just downright boring.

And I kind of like it that way. I like it that way. That's right. It was intentional. Max is in Canada. Hey, Max. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Let me try again.

There he is. Max is in Canada. What's up, Max? Hi. How are you doing, sir? Great. How can we help? Great. I'm going to try and be as straight and transformative as I possibly can. I'll just give you a little overview first. Right now, I'm just finishing up my last year of university. I'm

graduating this May. I have enough funds to be able to pay off my student loans, which I've done, as well as $10,000 for my initial starting emergency fund, I guess, for six months. Way to go. Yeah, the one thing I wanted to throw in, too, is I read Ken's Proximity Principle book this summer, and it was an absolute game changer. So if there's any other university students watching or anything, I'd highly recommend that book. My question for you today is I've been able to land a full-time job that I'm going to be starting this summer after graduation. The company currently does not offer anything in terms of retirement matching. And I'm kind of looking at my different retirement options.

I know that you recommend about 15%. So I'm looking here in Canada. We have a TFSA, which is similar to a Roth IRA. But that's not a traditional retirement account. How this one works is I can put in $6,000 per year, and that money grows tax-free. I'm wondering when it comes to retirement, would it make more sense to max that out first

before putting money into a traditional retirement account? We tell folks stateside to do Roth before they do traditional because it grows tax-free. And if I'm understanding what you just presented to me, I'm not an expert on Canadian retirement plans, okay? But if I understand what you just said, this is more of a Roth. It's $6,000 and it grows tax-free. The traditional grows after tax. And I mean, it's a pre-tax investment and it grows with taxation on the whole account, correct? Yes, sir. Okay, so it's just like our planned state side, the way you described it.

It's a traditional versus a Roth. So we always tell people to do a Roth first because the tax-free growth is going to amount to a whole lot more than, obviously, the after-tax effect of the other account. So pretty simple. Sounds like you really got this on the run, Max. Way to go. And to all the parents out there with little kids, I want you to imagine 15, 20 years from now, your kids in the last semester of college, do you want them to have a conversation like

he just had? How do I start investing my money after I've got my emergency fund? Or do you want them to be making a phone call saying, how do I pay all this student loan stuff off? And that starts when your kids are really young with some decisions you make, conversations you have as parents. Have those conversations. Have a plan.

There we go. Nicely done. That puts this hour of The Ramsey Show. Did you know over 18 million people listen to The Ramsey Show every week? A lot of those people listen on one of our 600-plus radio stations across the country. To find a station near you, go to RamseySolutions.com slash show.