The Ramsey Show - App - I'm About to Take On a $300k Student Loan (Hour 1)

Episode Date: June 22, 2021

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Welcome to the Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Christy Wright, Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author, is my co-host today as we talk about your life and your money.

It's a free call, and some say the advice is worth exactly what you pay for it. The phone number, 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. David is with us in Baton Rouge to start off this hour. Hi, David. How are you? Good, Dave. How are you?

Better than I deserve. What's up? So me and my wife, we are running into a little bit of an issue. I actually teach your class to high school students. Awesome. Awesome. Yeah, and so I am really trying to follow you by the book, by the key. But what we're running into right now is I make $26.50 a month take-home pay. We have $11,000 in savings.

And my wife just graduated with her master's in speech therapy in May. Wonderful. And she brought in $20,000 in student loans with that. Now, I know your step-by-step says to pay $10,000 of our $11,000 and throw it towards a debt, but we are expecting in the next two weeks our first child. Good. Well, you're not working the baby steps then. You push pause on the baby steps. You don't push play until baby comes and mommy comes home and everybody's healthy and everybody's okay. But yeah,

you would not be paying down debt during the pregnancy. Okay. So yeah, we were planning on setting aside $10,000 to a separate savings account and attacking it fairly aggressively, but it's still there if we need it. Well, you won't need it once the baby comes home. If the baby comes home and mommy and baby are okay, why would you need to do that? Okay, yeah, that makes sense.

But if everybody's not okay you got the money right now you know you cover the emergency that's what it's for right now but if you're gonna once they come home and is she going on into speech therapy once uh you know six or eight weeks or whatever from now yeah we're playing that by ear we're not sure exactly when she's going to start working but i'm hoping in the next uh you know few months after the baby comes home that she's going to start getting into work is she going to work working, but I'm hoping in the next, you know, few months after the baby comes home that she's going to start getting into work. Is she going to work somewhere for a practice or a company, or is she going to do her own thing?

No, she's going to be working for a practice. Okay. Good. She already had clients up, and they're being very generous with when she can start. Oh, that's wonderful. Good. Well, she ought to make really good money with that degree, and that's a wonderful field, and both of you are in great fields. And so, you know, if you want to hold it until she goes back to work, that's okay, you know.

But the bottom line is really having a baby that's healthy and everything's going okay becomes part of your budget then, whether it's daycare or formula or diapers. And, Christy, I mean mean obviously i got not i got the seventh grandbaby will be here any minute and and you've got little babes little kids so um you know the the truth is is that your budget doesn't other than daycare your budget does not change that substantially diapers a little bit formula a little bit but it's not like thousands of dollars a month out of your budget just because you had a baby. No, and what's interesting is after a couple months of living on this new budget with a baby,

it gives you a sense of confidence of knowing that you can. I think it's the unknown that's scary, especially to new parents going, oh my gosh, how much are diapers? How much is formula? How much is all this? Okay, give yourself a couple months, just like when you set your budget the first time, you were learning what this is like. It's going to be just like that and sure it'll change a little bit especially if your wife goes back to work and daycare and all that but you work it into the budget you live the budget a few months and tweak it as necessary and then before you know it you're like oh this is just our new normal with our family of three which is great and it's not as scary

because it's no longer unknown yeah and the little critters are not as expensive as everybody carries home and i mean they're not they're expensive but it's not it doesn't break the bank it's not like two hundred thousand dollars a year or something no and rachel chris talks about this but you don't need all the things that the list of things you could get for the baby is infinite and you will learn what you actually need and what you actually use and what you actually want and then everything else you can let go. So it's just going to take a couple months to figure that out, and that's okay. Yeah, yeah. Good stuff, man.

Congratulations. Yeah, congratulations. That's wonderful for you. Christina is in El Paso. Hi, Christina. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Thank you for taking my call.

I really appreciate it. Sure. How can Christy and I help? Yes. So my question is, my four-year-old twins are getting ready to start school and I wanted to, you know, get in a career to be able to help my husband out so we could get out of debt. And I wanted to know if it would be a good idea to invest in a career as a real estate agent in this market right now? What's drawing you to that? Well, I mean, I really want to be able to help out my husband.

He's the only one working right now, and he's basically bringing home. Yeah, but why real estate? Oh, real estate. Well, I was thinking it would be good money. And basically, I went to school for cosmetology when I was out of high school. And that didn't really bring in that much money. And we do have a lot of debt. And we're just trying to get out of it quick and, you know, look into a brighter future soon. It's just we barely started our debts noble and we just want to, you know, get out of it as quickly as possible. Christina, I hear that. And that's a noble thing to want. I will encourage you that there are a lot of career paths that can make good money and you're going to need to want more than money to be really good at it and to stick with it for the long haul. So I think it goes back to Dave's question, why real estate?

Is there anything else that draws you to that particular field other than money? Because it's going to need more than money to sustain you. Especially real estate can be hard, and there's some upfront costs and that kind of thing. So when you think about what you want to do. You work when other people are off. Yeah, weekends. So when you think about what you want to do. You work when other people are off. Yeah, weekends, nights. So think about what you want to do. Yes.

Well, I did want to, you know, focus in my career, but it's just that I recently got diagnosed with arthritis. And basically what I was doing was a nail technician, and that's just too much on my hands now. But I am interested in selling houses, and it looks like a bright future to me. Well, real estate's really hot right now. That's not in question.

I mean, obviously, you could get into the business. It's very difficult because there's not much inventory to make a quick sale. You know, we're hearing multiple offers and all the offers are over asking price. And so the few listings that are out there go rather quickly and rather competitively, which is tough for a brand new agent. But it can be done. I mean, you're going to have a few dry months. You're going to work for two months or three months or four months with no money coming in. And if you're prepared to do that, that's okay.

It's a wonderful career. I've had my real estate license since I was 18 years old. I've not been practicing in the business other than as an investor in a long time. But you can do it if you want to do it. If you just think it's quick, easy money, it's not. It's not. It's not quick, and it's not easy. This is The Ramsey Show. Your number one wealth building tool is your income.

For business owners, this comes as no surprise, as you're used to putting in extra hours and watching your bottom line. That's why Christian Healthcare Ministries, or CHM, is a great option for those who are faith-focused and budget-conscious. CHM is not health insurance. Rather, it's a health cost-sharing program. It's not harder, but it is different. To learn if CHM is a fit for you or your business, visit chministries.org slash budget. Christy Wright Ramsey Personality is my co-host today.

Open phones at 888-825-5225. Marissa is with us in Trenton. Hi, Marissa. How are you? Hi. Thank you so much for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So I am 29 years old. I have been working as a nurse for the last six years. I am a single mom.

My daughter is six years old. And I made the big financial commitment to go back to nurse anesthesia school. Wow. So, yes. I paid off my undergraduate loan, which was $30,000. My parents did help me and support me through the way. That was paid before going into school, as well as my car, and I have no credit card debt. The school now will cost me about $250,000. And with interest, it'll be about $300,000. I've been with my boyfriend for about four years. And besides paying back the loan, we're looking to get married in the next few years

and have more kids. So I just wanted to see what your thoughts were on coming up with a plan, I think I could realistically pay off this almost $300,000 in the next three to five years, but it's very daunting, and I don't know how to balance that with having a wife, getting married, and having more kids at the same time. Okay. You've been listening to us not a long time, I take it. For the past few months, my boyfriend actually turned me on to this show, and I've been listening a few hours every single day. I just don't know how to make the baby steps really work for me. I saved $30,000 to live on for the three years that I'm in school.

Yeah. Okay. thousand dollars to live on for the three years that i'm in school yeah okay um well to start with let's pretend that you had already graduated and you had this loan you would have you'd be making how much three hundred thousand a year right two hundred thousand a year where i'm where i'm training i would start at $205,000. Okay, and you make what now? I actually just stopped working because... But what were you making when you just stopped working? I was making $75,000. Okay, which makes a difference of $140,000.

So you could pay off $300,000 in two years if you continue to live like you were living right before you stopped working. Yeah. Which would be what I would tell you to do were you already here. But you're not already here. In 30 years of doing this show, I've never told anyone to go into debt to go to school, and I'm not going to start today. So I'm Mr. Dream Killer today. I love the idea of you being a nurse anesthetist i love the idea of your income going from 75 to 205 and i think those are accurate numbers by the way i don't

think you're living in a dream world i think that's about right based on what i the number of nurse anesthetists i have coached over the years. And by the way, I think 205 is his floor. I think that's starting. I think it'll head towards 300 pretty quick, especially if you pick up OT and other things. You could knock that debt out very quickly. The problem comes into play in that you're talking to a guy who has coached people where this plan didn't work,

that your mother became ill your child became ill you became ill there was a car wreck there was something and you're two hundred thousand dollars into this and you don't complete or you get married you have more babies and you want to stay home and you don't want to work at all which you don't know what you're going to want in three years or five years with a different family and situation but you have that debt anyway i just want to clarify i'm actually in the program already i'm in the second year of the program oh so you've already taken out the loan that was not what you said i'm confused you've already taken out the loan for the program. You're in it.

I'm in it. I'm in the second year. So we're living off my boyfriend's income. He makes $90,000. By the time I'm finished, he'll make $130,000. So I'm not paying for living expenses right now. I'm living off my savings. And we're planning, when I graduate, to put all of my paychecks towards the loan,

and he continues to pay for living. Okay. When are you all getting married? That's the thing. I think he says we probably would have been doing that now. We really pushed everything off because of my going back to school, taking out the charge. Why does going back to school keep you from getting married you just go down and get married we want a really small wedding okay then just go get married go tomorrow

what's this painter get off the ladder yeah and we're renting right now. What's that got to do with it? Renters get married all the time. Yeah. I just feel guilty. I don't have any money to put towards a wedding or a house. You don't have any money whether you're married or not.

You have nothing to feel guilty about. You're playing house. You might as well get a piece of paper that says it's okay. It's going to bring a different level of being a team and attacking these financial goals together when you're married. I'm really afraid for you. I mean, if he decides to walk off, you're screwed. I could live with my parents if if i had to you kind of missed the point didn't you oh you mean with paying back the loan okay so um now i i don't know what the

question is now i think you're all i think you have your plan i guess you need to execute your plan uh it would be a different plan than christy and i would sign you up for uh we hope good things for you we want good things for you we're not mad at you we don't want anything but to come to you but blessings but um yeah i these plans of going this far into debt to get a valid degree with a great income like becoming an attorney or becoming a medical doctor or becoming a nurse anesthetist. They only work when they work. But the guy that didn't pass the bar four times will tell you that that $185,000 worth of law school debt is not a freaking guarantee. So I worry for you, kid.

I just don't want bad things to happen for you. I hope it all works out. I hope it all plays through. I hope you come out making $205,000. He's making 205 he's making 135 and he finally gets around to marrying you or you finally get around to marrying him and then you've got a 340 000 or 50 000 household income and you pay off this 300 in like one year 18 months 24 months that's what i would do but um you know i if that's your question yeah that's what i would do but um you know i if that's your question yeah that's what i would do i would attack it like a vengeance and the first thing you need to do is quit borrowing if he's got enough income coming in and you're sharing income as if you're married i

wouldn't recommend that but apparently that's what you're doing so then maybe if he's got 130 coming in maybe you don't have to borrow some dadgum much if you're married it'd be no question that would be what you should do i'm not sure he should pay for his girlfriend's education, though. Matter of fact, I'm sure he shouldn't. Let me try that again. I've never told anybody to do that either. So, God, I get so confused. You're like, what am I saying?

What question are we answering here? What have I committed to? What have I signed up for? How did we get here? Man. Oh, okay. So um here's the deal let's backtrack a second because we have about a minute before the break so let's say you're out there and you're facing this exact dilemma the mountainous amount of tuition to get a an equal mountainous amount of income if it all works out perfectly. And sometimes it does, admittedly.

But it doesn't always. We all have to admit that, and we can't act like it's 100%. It's a lock. It's not a lock. Doesn't always happen. Maybe there's another way to get at this. Maybe you're working for a hospital company who wants you to commit to being their nurse anesthetist, which they're recruiting for and having trouble getting right now.

And you promise to stay there three years in return. They promise to pay your tuition. And you go ahead and lock down a contractual rate at which you're willing to work. That way you don't have any debt. So the way it's run, yeah. Or maybe you get a fellowship and you're working a fellowship at a med school and you're teaching grad classes and other things while you're doing this and you get through.

Maybe you work overtime like crazy as a nurse and pile up lots and lots and lots of money and you pay cash for your education. But it takes you three years longer and you don't have all the risk. These are the things we would tell someone facing similar situations to do. This is The Ramsey Personality is my co-host today.

Open phones at 888-825-5225. So Christy has a passion for the topic of life balance. And it's not a subject that I have particularly loved talking about. Because I think sometimes it's code for, I don't want to work much. And yet you've hit a nerve talking about this and you found a way to talk about it that you and I are both excited about. You and I love to debate. And this is a topic that we have loved to debate about for the last decade. But we have found a common ground.

And I think the thing that frustrates both you and I is the way that it's misunderstood, as if somehow, we are all seeking this perfect 5050 split in our life, or we're going to do everything for an equal amount of time, we're gonna have, you know, 15 minutes of quiet time and 15 minutes of exercise and 15 minutes, none of that is realistic or even desirable. And so as I have been researching this coaching people for, coaching people for years and years, and certainly trying to create it in my own life with three kids and five years and working and traveling and so on, I just started asking a different question. Instead of asking, how do I balance it all? I started asking, what if we could create a sense of balance even in our busy lives?

And where does that come from? And what does that look like in a practical, tactical way versus always feeling guilty all the time, no matter what we do? And it sent me on this search that I think is really helpful, not just for people that need more time or feel like they want more hours in a day. It's even helpful for the person listening that's trying to pay off their debt, that is focusing intensely in this season of life, being gazelle intense and saying, these are my priorities.

It helps you understand, hey, where your money goes, where your time goes, when you can control those, you've got a pretty good handle on how you're spending your life, and they correlate more than we realize. Yeah, you always say you don't find time, you make time. You make time for what's important to you. And, you know, that's been kind of my thing with this life balance thing. Just so, because the people that I know that are successful at anything are not balanced evenly.

Right. They're not doing everything equally at any given time. I mean, if you're a successful parent, you are out of balance. Your children are a priority. And they should be okay if you have a successful marriage your marriage is a priority yeah um probably not uh you know uh memorizing every football statistic of college football in the fall yeah which i love college football but i've never done that but But, I mean, I know football widows, and it's not because their husband is a coach, and it's not because their husband's a player.

It's because his butt is on the couch. Remember that. And that's out of balance, but it's really not. What it is, it's prioritizing the wrong things. It is, and you know what? This idea of priorities is interesting because when we say priorities, we talk about it as if we have one set of priorities that are fixed and they are in concrete. These are my priorities.

God, others, self, and that. That sounds like a nice Sunday school answer. That's not. That's not practical. In any given season, you will say, okay, in this season, I'm all in game on at work. Or it's the summer. I'm going to take some vacation. I'm going to play with my kids.

In this season, I'm training for a marathon. My exercise is a higher priority. Within each season, you're going to have a more specific, more current, relevant, practical, tactical set of priorities, and you should. Now, if you don't do anything except work seven days a week for six years and you don't know your kids' names, that's not priorities. That's not okay. It is a priority, but it's a wrong one.

Yeah, there should be an ebb and flow. And I think the thesis that I have unpacked in my book coming out this fall is life balance is not doing everything for an equal amount of time. It's doing the right things at the right time. And when you do the right things at the right time, whatever that is, you feel that sense of balance you've been looking for. Because when it's game on at work, it's game on at work. When it's time to go on vacation, I'm putting my phone away.

I'm going to play in the beach and be with my kids. But when you can focus on the right things at the right time, it gives you permission to not only actually experience your life, but enjoy it and be proud of how you're spending your time. Finally. And it allows you to intentionally pay a price to win. So I just thought of it. The reason I've been frustrated with the other version of life balance.

Oh, I'm so ready for this. What is it? I just figured it out. I never thought about it. All these times we've been arguing about it. Was if you live like no one else, later you can live and give like no one else, is in conflict with this evenly, perfectly balanced, nurturing. Right, because you're saying focus. Because then I get people that call me up and go,

hey, my poor children will never see their father. Well, for six months. Boo-hoo. Because you work, okay? Get your butt up and work. And I'm not saying you never see them, but you work a bunch of OT for six months. Why?

So you change the rest of your life with your children. Right. That's what I did. Right. And my children aren't in counseling. Right're not in rehab centers right they're all walking with jesus they're all married and got kids you know i mean they all made it out of old day of working and work you know was not a singular priority but there were seasons that we had to do we had to do what it took to go in right and so so a very practical thing I tell people to ask themselves is this, and you can start this right now today if you're watching or listening.

What's right right now? What's right right now? Oh, that's good. That's good. What's right right now? Okay, there's a million things I could be doing. What's right right now? I'm on the Ramsey show.

That's what's right right now. I could be thinking about kids. You ought to actually be concentrating. What's right right now? When I'm at home and my kids are trying to show me what they did at school or tell me what's right right now, I'm going to focus my kids are trying to show me what they did at school or tell me what's right right now, I'm going to focus on them. What's right right now.

And it gives you permission to not say, you don't have a lot going on. You always have a lot going on. What's right right now? This thing. I'm going to focus on this. I'm going to be present here. And then in any given season or week or day, as your priorities shift, you give yourself permission to shift and adapt and change them with the changing seasons.

Yeah. I mean, my son just did one of these Spartan races. you give yourself permission to shift and adapt and change them with the changing seasons yeah i mean my son just did one of these spartan races and so and he's got a new he's got a new baby on the way yeah so he you know his workout was really extreme because i'm getting this thing knocked out while before baby comes because once baby comes there's no sleep and i'm not i know this because my sisters have babies and so that's what he's saying and so i've got to go you know but that's right right now uh four months from now that won't be right anymore right what he's saying and so i've got to go you know but that's right right now uh four months from now that won't be right anymore right and he's got a whole different set of priorities right you know it's and should exactly and what's interesting is when you have things you

want to do with your money or your time this is so in alignment with what we teach about money but when you have things you want to do but it's not right right now it helps you let go of that temporarily because you're not saying oh that dream has died forever nursing let's go back to nurse anesthetist it's not oh that's not never it's just not right now yeah it's not whatever whatever that thing is for you whether it's uh something you want to buy somewhere you want to go so you know there's things i'd love to go to europe with my husband matt when i got three little babies that's not right right now we'll go someday. But right right now, I don't want to be away from my babies for two weeks.

Okay. What's right right now? It gives you permission to say, yes, what's right right now and know that something that may come back around at a different time when it's right then. And that's okay. Yeah. And that happens. So if you have this sense of being overwhelmed, this sense of anxiety, you know, we're getting over into Dr. Deloney's area because there's so many things pulling at you.

Yeah, that's a good way of clearing it out. Not everything pulling at you is right right now. And that, you know, I've noticed this with generosity. You know, we budget an amount going into the Ramsey Family Foundation. Did you know that there's always more good things that we could spend that on than there is money, that we could invest in in God's name than there is money? There's always more good happening in the world than the Ramsey Family Foundation can finance. We have a tiny little sliver of the world that we're supposed to take care of and help with that. And the rest of them get a no. Because it's not right.

We're going to pick the ones that are right right now. It's still prioritizing your money, prioritizing your time. Yep, exactly right. That's powerful. That's good stuff. Are we revealing the book title yet? Yeah. Let's just decide.

Yeah, let's do it. It's yours. You can decide. We'll do it. So we've been working on this for a long time, and it's really cool to see how all of the stories I've heard have really led to this. So the book launches for pre-sale July 12th, and it is titled, take back your time, the guilt-free guide to life balance.

And I love it. Guilt-free. Guilt-free. Let's get rid of that guilt. Take back your time. There's so much action in that. Oh, you know I love that. Take it back. Take it back.

Take back your time. I love it. So if you want more tips and encouragement about life balance for free, Christy Wright will participate with you in that. Just text her. Text life balance to 33444. Text LIFEBALANCE to 33444. We'll be right back. Christy Wright Ramsey personality is my co-host today open phones at 888-825-5225 Dan is in Iowa City Iowa hi Dan how are you better than I deserve Dave how are you just the same sir

what's up awesome first I just wanted to say thank you to you and Christy for everything you guys do. You guys are so awesome and such an inspiration. So I really appreciate you guys. Thank you. Thanks for saying that. My question today, Dave, is about early retirement. So for background context, I'm 24. My annual income is about $37,000 a year. I have no debt. My car is paid for. And I heard you say a couple know, a couple of times that when you, before you get married, when you buy a house and then you get married, you realize you

bought the wrong house. So I don't know when I'm getting married, but I wanted to call in and see like, what, what would you prioritize in my situation? Would you prioritize early retirement? If, if the goal was reachable and say five years? Or would you put the money in a mutual fund towards a sizable down payment or preferably a cash purchase on a home, a small home? Okay, let's go back a second because you're 24 and early retirement is in five years. So you're from 29 years old on for the rest of your life what are you going to do i would like to start my own company um i want to do something in e-commerce that um sort of like is my ministry tool i'm a part-time photographer outdoor photographer and i you know a lot of my friends like 98 of my friends okay so retirement, you don't mean go fishing. By retirement, you mean you don't have to work a regular job and you can go live your dream of owning your own business.

Yeah, exactly. Just financial freedom and just supplemental income from investments. Gotcha. Okay. All right, good. Well, I think you can start making moves towards that now. I don't think that requires that you be financially independent. A lot of people don't.

Right. As a matter of fact, it might be your shortest path to financial independence. Because if you've got your business up and running, you might make more than $37,000. That's true. Yeah. Yeah, what made me ask the question, Dave is because, um,

I, I listen every day and have for about a year now and, um, I'm on, I'm on baby step. I guess you'd say, I guess you'd say four. Um,

uh, so I've been investing 15%, um, but wanted to know like, okay, what do I prioritize? Because my expenses are so low. Yeah.

So like rent aside, um, my, my yearly, Dave, are only $2,000 a year. That's wonderful. Just with my only bills are car insurance, phone. So you're living at home. That's really it. No, so I just, I usually, I move around a lot, so my rent is kind of hard to say what it is for a full year, but it's usually between $350,000 and $450,000.

That's more than $2,000 a year. Yeah, I just wanted to do retirement just so I could basically set up early retirement so that when I'm in a place where I don't have a rent or a mortgage payment, I would be able to focus on that. Okay, let's change the word from retirement to you just want to build some wealth. Okay? Sure. So I think you can begin to work on your new idea for your business as a side hustle.

Don't you, Christy? Yeah, sure. Start that now. You're going to learn a lot in the process. You don't have to wait until some magic five years from now or certain income to be able to do it. Start now and learn about what you want to do and what the market needs.

Yeah. Let's get that going and let's start that and get your income up. And when the income gets close to what you make now, go ahead and start working and living your dream. Don't wait until you have a pile of money to go live your dream. It's not necessary. Sure.

I haven't. I started two businesses, both of which were very successful, one of which failed later, my real estate business, but I started both of them with literally nothing and got started. So you can do that now and ease into this and organically let – you can take all the money you make in the business, pour it back into the business and just live off of your day job, and that's fine until you get the thing up and running. And so if that's working, then that doesn't require any investing.

Then we can say, oh, let's redirect all your cash towards paying cash for your first house. And that's probably what I would do at that point. I would just go that direction. So because, you know, and then if you do buy a house and it's the wrong one, you can sell it and buy another one if you get married. All that kind of that joke and all that stuff that we talk about. But it's joke based, in fact. But but the but yeah, that's that's, you know, I don't think that you need a half a million dollars and a paid-for house in order to start your business.

You know, what's interesting is, you know, he's young asking this question, and it's actually similar to what we were just talking about before the break where your priorities change. And when you're young and you have a small sense of what you want to do but you can't predict the future, none of us can, you can say, okay, what do I want to do based on what I know today? Based on what I know today is I want to build wealth. I want to start a business. Let's start it on the future. None of us can. You can say, okay, what do I want to do based on what I know today? Based on what I know today is I want to build wealth. I want to start a business. Let's start it on the side. I'd like to get married, but I'm not dating anybody. I'd like to buy a house, but I don't have the money yet. So let's just do what we can do today with what we know today, what we have today. That phrase you said earlier, what's right right now. Right. And then in three years, five years, get married, buy a house. What's right then? Good. Roberts in San Antonio. Hey, Robert, how are you? Hey, Dave. Doing great. How are you? Better than I house. What's right then? Good. Roberts in San Antonio. Hey, Robert, how are you?

Hey, Dave, doing great. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? That's what I thought. Hey, listen, I've got a business decision I've got to make. I'm 66 years old. I've got a business that I'm having some offers on, and I'm a veterinarian.

And some of these corporations that buy veterinary clinics offer three to three and a half times the gross. And that doesn't include real estate. Now, I don't have any shortage of money. I'm in pretty good shape. I just don't know if I should sell or not. Well, what's the long-term plan if you don't? I'm just going to keep on working. Till when?

You're gone? What happens to it when you die? Till the day they bury me, I'm going to keep working. Okay. What happens when you die? What happens to the... What happens to... Then I go to my wife, go to my kids. Yeah, and then they sell it for three times gross?

I'm sure they'll just appreciate their value, yeah. Okay. So what's the pressure to sell it now? I don't hear any. Well, I mean, it's just appreciate their value. Okay. So what's the pressure to sell it now? I don't hear any. Well, I mean, it's a lot of money. And sometimes I get locked into just my life and working and all my hobbies and things. And I don't look, you know, and that's why I need a different perspective. Yeah. need a different perspective yeah well i i will you know it sounds to me like you would have

some joy stolen from you if you weren't working down there oh yeah that's that's go ahead go ahead you go ahead well the hard part robert is sometimes people call in and this is a similar question where you can do either but we can't tell you what you want and it kind of comes down to what do you want you're 66 years old what do you want i think you want to work at another 10 years anyway that's what i think just listening to you i want to keep working and things if i sold the damn thing i'd have to work for a corporation yeah no thank you you don't want to do that no thank you you you. You've done this yourself too long. This is your baby. Let me tell you.

Here's what I would do. Before you make the decision, I think this will answer your question. Order a book when you hang up. You can jump on Amazon or whatever. From Simon Sinek, the book is called Infinite Game. Infinite Game. Yeah, what you're being tempted by is a finite game and putting closure on this and turning the key. Infinite game. Don't take the cash off the table while the hand is hot that you've done something wrong. And I've got good friends.

I have a good friend that sold his business for $400 million, and the last time I was with him, he cried. He hates his life. He works for this publicly traded company now, and he said, I hate my life. I would give them an extra $50 million on top of the $400 million if I could buy the thing back and let me have my soul back. That was his comment. And I kind of think I'm hearing a little bit of that in your discussion. I got a question, Dave, about the terms of something like this. Because is it always the case where, in Robert's case or your friend's case, where you have to work in the business?

Or can you sell it and walk? You could sell it and walk. But they probably want him to stay a while because you're probably a big part of the secret sauce of that one yeah yeah oh yeah i'm part of the recipe yeah yeah i think you're not going to want be wanting to work for a corporation i'm just listening to you i'm not telling you what i would do i know what i I would do. I wouldn't work for them. And so I do think you need a long-term handoff that's better than tossing the keys as you fall back into the grave. That's not a good handoff.

But I don't know that you're ready to sell it and work for a corporation for 10 more years either. So somewhere in between there is probably a better plan. I've read it. But read that book, Infinite Game, by my friend Simon. I think you'll like it. This is James Childs, a producer of The Ramsey Show. You can listen to all our shows with the Ramsey Network app on your smartphone. Browse by topic or even send clips to your friends.

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