The Ramsey Show - App - I’m Struggling To Budget With My Income (Hour 1)

Episode Date: November 28, 2022

Dave Ramsey & Dr. John Delony discuss: Adjusting investments to save for a house down-payment, Learning to budget on increased income, How to know if your mortgage is too high, What to do with a family heirloom, Paying back an estranged parent. Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6 Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

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🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the pods moving in storage studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW

as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. We help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships in spite of having to spend time with your family over Thanksgiving. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey personality, host of the Dr. John Deloney Show, number one best-selling author of Own Your Past, Change Your Future,

is my co-host today. We're going to answer your questions. You jump in. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Benjamin is in Atlanta. Hi, Benjamin. How are you? Good.

How are you, Dave? Better than I deserve. What's up? So I'm trying to figure out how much of my salary I want to contribute to my retirement plan. I'm currently contributing the recommended 15% to a 401k plan, but I'm now working for a company that gives a 200% match up to 4% to that 8% of my salary that I'm putting into my 401k. And on top of that, at the end of the year, they contribute another 10% to my 401k as profit sharing. What they put in does not count in our equation.

Okay. What you put in. 18%. You would put in 15% of your household income into retirement at Baby Step 4. Correct. Did I catch you? Is that what you were calculating the company in there? No.

Right now, I am putting 15% in, and my company is putting 18% in. So that's a total of 33% of my salary. That's pretty phenomenal. You're going to be rich. salary. That's pretty phenomenal. You're going to be rich. That's going into my, yeah, it is pretty fantastic. So my question was, since the match is so high on top of my 15%, can I afford to only contribute 10% of my salary to a 401k and put that extra 5% towards saving up for a house and later paying a monthly payment on a house. Okay, so you're trying to figure out a house down payment, not paying off a house.

Correct. Okay. Baby Step 3B is saving for the down payment. That's what we call it before you get to Baby Step 4, which is 15% of your income going into retirement. Now, here's what people do, and it's okay with us because baby step 3B is a temporary thing. It's just while you save a down payment. That's all you're doing.

Okay? And while you're doing that, some people don't even start baby step four. They do zero. Some people do up to the match, and some people do the full 15%. And how fast can you save the down payment? That's a trick, right? So anywhere in there you want to go, and it sounds like, you know, if you want to back it save the down payment that's a trick right so any of the anywhere in there you want to go and it sounds like you know if you want to back it down to 10

that's fine but that is not me saying you live in a house you own a house and you should back down to 10 so you can put more on your house mortgage and baby step six no i am not saying that that's for all the other listeners that's not for you gotcha okay but in your case you know in it whether you got a match or whether you didn't some people just choose to do nothing some people choose to do match the three percent and some want to go ahead and do the 15 and just try to save the down payment above that um right you could do any of those is fine because you shouldn't be saving for your down payment longer than three years max okay how old are you i'm 24 wow what's your income uh 68 000 dude if you stick with this you're gonna be so rich john's right and i'll also

say this benjamin at 24 um i've had a couple of different places where I've worked where they've had incredible matches like this. And at least in my, after a couple of decades in the workforce, every time it has shifted. That overwhelming, we're able to put this much money, it tends to be kind of a bonus is the way that that people will look at it so we're not going to add to your um salary because that's ongoing but we're going to do this every year those that has whittled away in every job where i've had that type of of uh generosity

and so don't build your life expecting that to happen year over year over year build your life build it build your life expecting you to have to do it and anything your company does it's called gravy on the biscuit yeah if you set that up emotionally john's right then you're going to keep going uh because you're not like oh well i can't do it now because i don't get the match no i felt like um as a young guy i thought they were taking something from me right like it was hey we're able to hey, we're able to do this, we're able to do this, and then 2010 hit, 2009 hit, and we've got to back down some of our retirement match.

Well, it felt like you were taking something from me, right? And it wasn't. It was a cool thing they were able to do during times of plenty. It was generosity. That's right. And then it couldn't, yeah. That's right. But I had built my life as though you owed it to me,

and that was on me, not on them. Yeah, but that's also the way it has to do with the narrative and the way you explain it. That's right. Yeah, that's good. Good question. Benjamin, you're doing great, man. Excellent. Proud of you.

Way to go, dude. Angela is in Los Angeles. Hi, Angela. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Hi, John. I'm very happy to be on. Good to have you.

How can we help? Thanks. I just had a quick question or advice. I need your advice. So I found you guys back in May, and I would binge watch for months. I binge watched. And finally, I decided to call for motivation because I was unhappy at my job, and I called George, and he kind of told me, you know, get another job. And I did, so I put my resume resume out and i got a call from a local

government job and they paid me about twenty thousand dollars more than what i had already but then what i was already making dad gum george is worth his white and gold and he's a small guy that's not a lot of weight but man good for him yeah he gave me the motivation i needed you know get there. But now I just can't seem to get back on track to the baby steps that I'm struggling. And when I tell you I'm tired, I'm tired of not having enough money, or at the end of the month I'm exhausted, and it's harder now. So you make more money and you're doing a worse job handling it. Yes, exactly.

Oh, George. George, it's all George's fault. So what's your challenge? Like, you're making this new money. Yeah, why did you get lazy then? I would have got more intense. I feel like I don't know. A lot of changes at work, you know, it's a few months that I started,

and I feel like every time I get anxious now, I just spend. Yeah, and now I have more money to spend, and it's harder. Sorry. You have, you're doing a lot of feeling, and here's why the baby steps are so remarkable. They take your feelings and your thoughts out of the equation. Yeah, they take your feelings and they stomp on your feelings. You just do what's the plan.

You follow the plan. Like, I don't feel like working out. It doesn't matter. Here's the workout you're doing today. I don't feel like, I feel like spending. I feel like getting online. Who cares? Here's what's next in line.

And so getting on a plan is really good for this. And you've got to adjust your identity. You're somebody who makes good money now, who does really well. You are not somebody who spends when they get anxious. And I want you to start there and reverse engineer that life. Does that make sense? Yeah, stop saying that's who you are because it's really not who you are. It's not who you are.

Who you are as a lady makes $20,000 more than she used to because of George. That's right. And then who you are as a lady that's not managing it as well. Oh, wait. No, you're the lady that's starting to manage it better as of today because of John. You're going to get on a plan. So there you go. You're going to get on a plan.

Yeah, absolutely. One of my buddies who's a multimillionaire said, you know, your stuff started working when I submitted myself to the plan. Ooh, it's a powerful word. It's a powerful word. It means the plan is going to kick your butt. This is The Ramsey Show. dr john deloney ramsey personality is my co-host today number one best-selling author well black friday might be over but you've still got plenty of names on your christmas list right well then check out all the deals in our one day cyber monday sale uh you can get our best

seller sellers for as low as five dollars if you're ready to crush your goals see there it is john crush your goals next year the 2023 ramsey goal crusher planner. Goal planner will help you keep focused, get organized, and crushing. The new 2023 planner has Ramsey's five essential guidelines for goal setting so you can create specific and measurable goals for your finances, relationships, spiritual growth. First time ever, it's on sale. Get yours before they're gone. Of course, this is set up.

It's a full calendar it's a beautiful book to you guide you through the whole year and for your holiday get together get your friends and family off their screens with dr john deloney's questions for humans conversation cards they have the new year's deck the uh christmas deck sold out by the way these fun conversation starters make connecting with each other easy get everyone talking with questions like this one. If we had to buy a plane ticket right now for a trip together next year, where would we go? Home. This is a season to share hope and give generously.

We all know that someone who's struggling today with their money, their relationships, we've got tons of deals on every single bestseller that we've had everything at ramsey solutions.com shop the cyber monday one day sale today ramsey solutions.com hey i got one of these cards i want to do with you the question for humans for humans yes so you're presupposing i'm human okay that's good start no you can you can you can use this with robots, too. Okay. It's very good. What two words would you use to sum up this year, and you can't say dumpster fire? Oh, why not? Oh, no, it wasn't a dumpster fire. Sweet and sour.

Sweet and sour. How so? I got lots of sweetness, lots of good things happened, and lots of sour things happened. Lots of tough stuff? Yeah. Huh. Except that's three words Joe Biden but yeah hey that is incredible I got two words for you made in America that's fantastic fantastic I love it no matter hey no matter what happens you're always that one

family member that can take any innocuous question and bring it back to politics and that is day ramsay that's day well i used three words then i just said and you didn't catch it what's one thing you become obsessed with this year this year just this particular year uh more than other years building projects i've got about three things or four things coming out of the ground right now and i keep driving around looking at all of them being built it's a lot of fun do you like that oh man i'm like a little kid with a dumpster or the dump truck yeah when as soon as like they hand you the keys they do the cutting are you already thinking about what's next i'm'm done. Yeah. I was done before that.

But, I mean, when it's done, it's done. But I love the planning and the coming out of the ground. And we've got the new Ramsey Event Center, and I'm building a huge event barn on my farm and a couple other little building projects. And that's just fun. What about you? What are you obsessed with?

Man, I'm just thinking about what I got obsessed with this year. This was the first year that things kind of settled in here at work and because there's a whole new craft for me learning something completely new like how radio works and interviews work and podcasts work so this year was the first year i really got intent on trying to learn how to do the craft not just survive right so the way i describe it to my friends over thanksgiving was when you're skiing and you first are learning and you're coming when the boat takes off and you're just getting blasted with water and then there's a moment you get on top of it and you're just excited to be on top of the water but you're holding on tight and this year was the first year i got comfortable

on top of the water now we can figure out how to do this thing so that's the other metaphor i love with us you know the first year i went snow skiing and i wasn't sore oh man yeah i like that that's fantastic i wasn't using every muscle in my body to stand up snow skiing that's one thing other than golf i don't understand but that's a that's a different that's a different different subject i was gonna i thought you were gonna say deer hunting with your son that's been he's old enough now he's 12 it's like it's like a thing now we spent there's deer hunting and then there's deer hunting with your son yes and then there's we spent eight hours in the woods yesterday and then eight hours the day before nothing and to see a 12 year old boy knows even i was like back there looking at my phone just to sit for eight hours i thought me and his mom are doing something right and he just was patient and

then we got in the car and he's disappointed he's like we'll get him next time dad and so it's teaches you these lessons of patience and of uh all these cool cool moments that you get to spend with your son so it's been great that's cool yeah not a chance i could do that oh man it was tough i would be a nervous wreck it was eight hours tough. Eight hours and sit there. Just sit there. Just waiting. I would shoot myself. Just waiting. Hey, here's pretty neat. When it's six hours and all of a sudden a deer comes up and it's the wrong size or it's

too far away. That's not neat at all. And watch a 12-year-old have- It's like people who go fishing and don't catch fish. Have patience. No, it's so good. I go catching. I don't go fishing.

Building character. It's not character. Perseverance and all that stuff. Wrong weapons. Courage. Building character. It's not character. Perseverance and all that stuff. Wrong. Weapons. Courage. Wrong weapons. It's a mile away.

I'll get him. Get the 50 Cal. Oh, my gosh. Yeah, you want to do that, Dave? I know. Don't do that. I know. Get the hate mail.

Get it going, people. Get it going. Come on. We're just talking about shooting Bambi, so there you go. It's all over now. The PETA people can line up oh all right there we go that's questions for human cards right there look at that creates controversy and politics always you're just gonna love these cards people they're gonna be they're gonna be endearing there's ones for dating for friends for family get-togethers

for kids schools if you're a teacher I want to create hate mail and trolls. I do. I have proposed that one. I want to have one to end, like a friendship ender that's just, Trump is the smartest man alive, true or false. I just want to, like, we're going to put those things out on the table. We're going to divide friendships up so, so good. Lots of shaming questions. They'll be fantastic. COVID mask questions. Yes. Lots of shaming questions they'll be fantastic covid mask questions yeah lots of

questions and mass saved america true or false they're gonna be fantastic vaccination one two three four booster so good yeah yeah you're gonna find out hey you know what we're probably we weren't gonna make it as a friend group so we're gonna call it now or if you really want to break up with somebody i don't really fit in these are the these are the cards for you these are the cards for you you could have the most obnoxious questions that would be yeah we really can't do that because it would probably cause trouble but and we're here to bring hope and joy and peace and yeah but but sometimes hope and joy and peace comes with uh separation truth that's right boundaries and all right now people don't even know what this is okay these are cards it looks like a deck of cards that's right and they've got

conversation starters and none of them are snarky or sarcastic or political no there's no politics there's no covid there's no covid's in them we put no covid's in these at all you can't get covid from it and you can't talk about covid because of it okay as a matter of fact it heaps your crazy butt relatives who talked about it all through thanksgiving dinner from dealing with you have to no we can't talk about that we have to talk about this and you throw a card down that's right and then you can say what's something you're obsessed with this year and you can't say covid and i will say this my daughter josephine i left a deck of the parents kids she brings it to dinner every night. She wants to get the cards.

She wants to get the cards. And we've even answered some of the same ones again. She wants to do it again. She wants to do it again. And I think her body is telling her, hey, this is a way mom and dad plug in directly with me. This is a way we're all at the table together despite our best efforts. And so we play Monopoly. They're great for kids.

See, I get too competitive with kids oh see i get too competitive with monopoly i get too competitive oh the one that kills me is the game of life because it's not and it's also got credit cards in it now you can get a credit card with the game of life so game of life so it was it's like how do you tell people you were born in the 14th century thing without telling them yeah you mentioned the game of life yeah that's it when did that game come out oh god man it had to be the 60s or 70s i mean i had electricity when i was a kid i know i'm just kidding so back when there was dinosaurs roaming there a little short arms and on the back of the cover wagon, y'all would play life.

On the back of the cover wagon. Very cool. When we were going across the prairie. This may have been the greatest sales pitch segment of our careers. I'm saying that Black Friday can't top Cyber Monday after that. If nothing else, we've sold out of all the questions for human cards ever made. Go save your families and go get them. Yeah.

Go get them. It is a lot of fun. It's almost as much fun as John and I have just babbling about nothing and blowing an entire segment. This is The Ramsey Show. We'll see you next time. សូវាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប� Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey personality, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. This is The Ramsey Show. Christine is with us in Cheyenne, Wyoming.

Hi, Christine. How are you? Great. How are you doing? Better than I deserve. What's up? Thank you so much for taking my call. So my husband and I are new listeners of yours, and we're on baby steps four, five, and six. We have no debt except for our mortgage. Good. But we're concerned that our mortgage is a bit high um it doesn't quite follow your ratios so i just wanted to talk that through with you and see if we should keep going on or make a change okay in this case our ratios uh don't matter as much in the case of a mortgage payment as a percentage of your income, as why we have the ratios.

Now, that matters a lot, okay? The why is simply if you use up all your money on your house payment, you don't have any money. It's called house poor, right? And that will cause you, if you're living with a super high house payment, even though you're already out of debt and you're baby step four, five, and six, it'll keep you from investing long term keep you from your generosity goals um and it in some cases if it's super high if people people feel forced uh to take a car payment because they don't save up

for a car because they don't have any room to save up for a car or something like that so that's the reason we tell people to not get a super high house payment like most of the culture tells you to do that and so once you kind of understand that then you can kind of back into your particulars and say you know okay what are we what are we violating on the 25 percent of your take-home pay on a 15-year fixed and um and how is that going to be okay given that we don't want to be house poor? So how much is your house payment? $3,900. Say again?

$3,900. And your monthly take-home pay is? $11,000. Okay, so you're about 34%. Right. Okay. And what do you guys do for a living? My husband is in supply chain.

Is what? He's in supply chain, and I stay home with our kids. Supply chain. Oh, God, I can't hear. Okay, supply chain. All right. And he's killing it. So how many raises is he?

Because the last two years don't count. What do you guys feel like the trajectory of his income is? Is it going to go up substantially in the next three years? I think so which makes this conversation not needed moot right okay yeah because i mean if it goes from 33 to 28 to 25 with three raises because your house payment stays the same your income goes up then we're not worried about you being house poor long term, correct? Correct. Yeah.

So that's one fix for this. But if he had two wild years based on supply chain backup and he crushed it and he's going to settle back into $9,000 a month, now you've got a problem. Exactly. So what are you looking at on his income, do you think? I think it'll go up. I don't think so. It'll go down if it goes down you need to reevaluate this house okay if it goes as long as it is has an upward trajectory

in the next 36 to 48 months you're not going to be stuck there with all your money going to a house payment and not being able to fund your kids college fund or having an air conditioner break and you got to get it go to a credit union to get to be able to pay for it right right although we do have the emergency fund that's right that's right yeah so just don't get yourself to where you're there that's the whole point of the thing you see uh and yeah so you don't you don't need ramsey to tell you how to manage your life you just but you but a good rule period whether ramsey's in your discussion or not is don't be house poor don't have a house payment that takes up all your money makes you broke and so um but i think you sound like you're okay it's not ideal if you were

getting ready to buy a home i would tell you to back off don't be so house, you know, but you're there. I wouldn't tell you to move over this. You're not trapped and hopelessly mathematically disabled, you know. So I wouldn't tell you to do that. But you don't have any room. It's got to go up. It can't go back. And you don't have any wiggle room because if it goes down much and stays down very long, you're going to be forced into a different property.

But right now, I think you've got a lot of house. And in Cheyenne, Wyoming, that's a big freaking house. That's a big dog right there. Well done. Good for you. I bet it's fun. Michael's with us. Michael is in West Virginia, Huntington, to be exact.

Hey, Michael, what's up? Not much, Dave. How are you? Better than we deserve. How can we help? That's right. Hey, real quick, before my question, I's up? Not much, Dave. How are you? Better than we deserve. How can we help? That's right. Hey, real quick, before my question, I just wanted to tell you, I've been a disciple of yours since 2006.

Someone bought me the Total Money Makeover, and I've followed it ever since. And about 10 years ago, I met my wonderful, beautiful wife, and I was very pleased to find out she's a disciple of yours as well. The only problem is she hadn't really heard of you. She had been following your ideas. She was a follower of common sense. Common sense, the Bible, and your grandparents, as you say often. That's it.

I just wanted to tell you that because it was a match made in heaven, the two of us, and we followed your plan, and we still follow the principles. Thank you. You'll laugh when I preface this, but this is a Thanksgiving weekend discussion kind of question that I'm going to pose to you and Dr. John. So I had a grandmother pass away about 10 years ago, and for the most part, her estate has been essentially distributed and everything was fine there.

We found out kind of recently that one of the things that has not been dealt with was a diamond ring that was given to her by her father-in-law. It's not an engagement ring. It's just a diamond ring that was given to her by her father-in-law. It's not an engagement ring. It was just a diamond ring that she's held in her possession. Her verbal wishes as she was getting up in years was that the ring was to be sold and the proceeds from that were to be divided evenly among the families. She has three daughters. We all get along well.

Everyone loves each other. Everything is happy, and no one's really in any dire financial straits. No one really needs the money. But the issue is now, what do we do with the ring? And as I was talking with some family over the weekend, one of the suggestions was to go ahead and sell it. We understand that it'll price for about $18,000. Don't know that it'll sell for that.

Let's be conservative and say that it'll sell for $10,000. There are family members that may want the ring, but that kind of goes against what our grandmother's wishes were to do with the ring as she passed away. And then kind of a third option, which we're not sure if this would even work, would be to actually cut up the ring. And we're told that that could be a very risky proposition and you don't know what you're going to get from the ring. So in any event, I just wanted to hear your thoughts. I know you've talked a lot about what people their wishes and as they're passing on and i just want to hear kind of your your idea for your thoughts on what would be a good idea you know in these things i try to just switch moccasins and walk in your grandmother's

shoes a minute and go if i if i was if it was me what would i care you know so this is not a uh a sentimental thing it was not her wedding ring it was not um something like that it was simply a uh a piece of jewelry that's valuable that she owned exactly that's all it was so there's not a lot of emotion to it um so, you know, I don't think it's, from what you described to me, it doesn't sound inconsistent if you guys had it appraised and, you know, one sister wanted it and the other two bought her out for the other two-thirds or even for a discounted amount. Let's say we got it appraised.

I think we can actually sell it for $15. But, hey, you know, the other two sisters will take four instead of five each and that kind of thing and just buy each other out and let one of them that wants it have it i don't think that's inconsistent and you put some you put some extra stipulations on your what your grandma said she didn't say if anybody is in dire need of cash sell this thing she said sell it and y'all split it so just because y'all aren't starving or broke or in desperate need of cash, sell this thing. She said, sell it, and y'all split it. So just because y'all aren't starving or broke or in desperate need of money right now doesn't mean that we're not going to do what she said, right?

Sure, exactly. And Dave, what you suggested sounds great, but it just feels kind of slimy to us. But we think that may be the best solution. I don't think it's slimy at all. I don't hear any slime in it at all. If everybody's in agreement to it, if it creates an argument, then there might be some slime there. But if Sister A wants it and B and C want to be bought out at a slight discount below what it'll actually bring,

I think that's a generous thing for everyone. What's slimy is if Sister A wants it and thinks she's going to get it for free. Yeah. That's taking advantage of Grandma. Yeah, and then the other two get nothing. Yeah, that would be a little weird. Yeah, just buy them out. It's not an unusual thing in the States, by the way, host of the Dr. John Deloney Show, number one best-selling author, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today.

Our question of the day comes from Blinds.com. They have a 100% satisfaction guarantee. That means even if you mismeasure, you mess up, you pick the wrong color, you mess up like I have, they'll remake your window blinds for free. It's a you screwed up guarantee. Yeah, you get free samples, free shipping, and new promos all the time. You'll save even more. Always use the promo code Ramsey. It the time. You'll save even more. Always use the promo code RAMSY.

It's magic. You'll get a better deal. All right, today's question comes from Melissa in Wisconsin. She says, I've been following the baby steps, and I'm very proud of how I've grown financially and personally. I have no debt, and I'm saving for retirement. During college, the relationship with one of my parents became very strained, and that parent took out a $20,000 Sally Mae student loan without consulting other family members.

This parent is the only person on the loan, and my name is not on it. I know legally I'm not obligated to pay it back, but morally, what are your opinions on me paying it back to this parent? We've been estranged for years due to other circumstances, and I used the money in college for books and room and board i've tried to consult other close christian friends and my counselor who did not think i am obligated to pay it back since this person has made very poor financial decisions multiple bankruptcies and has not respected boundaries with me what are your thoughts i've got i'll start you start you're stuttering yes you're standing i've got a strong you have

a lot of thoughts i do um okay let me there's a lot of a lot of different words we can use here i would agree with your counselor that you are not obligated to pay it back morally or ethically but has nothing to do with the other or ethically but has nothing to do with the other person's behavior it has everything to do with the deal that was made they took out a loan without your knowledge and without you promising to pay it therefore you do not owe it you did not handshake you did not verbally you did not certainly not on paper and certainly legally did not sign for it so you're not legally ethically or morally obligated to pay this loan period it has nothing to do with being estranged it has nothing to do with it makes it weirder

it has nothing to do with the other person's financial misbehavior and bankruptcies that makes it weirder but none of that is your fault and does not change your moral obligation one way or the other your moral obligation is based on your promise that was never made by you and so you don't have a moral ethical or legal obligation now if you want to be generous for some reason or another then we can talk about it but it's not an obligation i i like that you said that here's where i was struggling with this let's say you did melissa let's say you did take this money out and you shook hands hey mom i need some more money for room and board and books have gotten more expensive and your mom said great i'm going to take out this loan this parent plus loan and

you can just pay it back even though you don't qualify to take out your own loan then you would pay it and she ends up making very poor financial decisions has multiple bankruptcies doesn't matter you pay it anyway doesn't matter that's right so this external behavior is not i'm not going to let that affect my moral cause here um i'm with you david the reason i took pause here is i'm thinking in my situation if i have a parent who's struggling they got me through college i'm just torn on it i was torn on i would probably try to figure out a way to pay it back it would just be generosity though it's not an obligation that's right and in my mind too it would be a what's it how does it affect your particular life okay you have $2 million in checking.

Well, write a check and pay it off. It's like buying a biscuit. Right. Okay? You have no money, and you're just now coming out of Baby Step 3, just starting. You're 26 years old. And your mom's guilt-tripping you.

You make $75,000 a year. And her voice in your head that you haven't even heard in a long time in person is guilt tripping you uh then no that's just uh psychological backflips there you go you're just doing you're just doing gymnastics in your own brain they're like somehow it's going to make her okay somehow it's going to make your relationship okay that you wave this magic money wand over it and everything's going to be okay nope not going to happen uh and so this does come down to two things number one is are you obligated answer is no number two do you want to be generous and for me if i were in your shoes that would be that it's not a big deal that you can't that twenty thousand dollars you're you're a doc and

you make four hundred thousand a year now i don't know whatever scenario we don't have her income or her net worth here um but uh you know i kind of smell in the verbiage that this is a 26 year old making less than a hundred thousand dollars a year and doesn't have any money well and to add on to that this feels like and dave we don't talk about this enough. We probably should. The number of parents who mortgage their souls for the kids to go to school, and they circle back 10, 15 years later asking kids, I need that money. Without having a deal. We never had a deal.

I got you through college. Now I'm looking at my retirement. Hey, I put $20,000 on the line. When are you going to pay me back? Well, that's the same idiot, though common that says you owe me because i changed your diaper oh yeah you know that's the same you know i fed you when you were three shut up you signed up for that that's right you know that's not that's just bull right there so uh sorry mom that's how this works um you know but the uh um yeah so um a lot a lot of stuff going on here but but i think i don't want to be the psychologist here you're that

you're that's your job but in my mind it sounds like um you probably intellectually rise but some part of your little girl self, Melissa, wants it to be that the script is rewritten if you write a $20,000 check that suddenly mom's okay and your relationship with mom's okay. And that's not going to happen. And it's not ever going to be the same. That's right. That house burned.

Yes. And now you've got to build something new. And if part of you building something new is, I'm going to go back to everybody who played a role in my life and I'm going to be generous to them, that's cool. that could be a part of your house that you're building for you into the future it's not going to save mom it's not got anything to do it's not going to save them that's right this has got to do with you that's right yeah but it's not a moral ethical christian obligation that you pay someone else's debt that's right it's that simple and that's what

a parent plus loan is. And then I think it is good. One more time, let's circle back for the sake of people listening, because we have a student loan crisis that is of epic proportions. Moms and dads, do not take out student loans of any kind, and do not take out a parent plus loan and then saddle your kid with it when they're 30 suddenly at Thanksgiving dinner. Okay?

That's relationship Russian roulette, number one. Number two, it's morally, ethically wrong. Number three, it's financially stupid. Okay? Don't do that. And so, you know, this idea that, you know, send the kid to college at any cost, including the cost of all our futures, mine and yours. We're going to all go deeply in debt so you can get a degree in left-handed puppetry.

And so this has got to stop. It will work out for me down the road. Like I'm cashing out some of my retirement so that you can make it okay for all of us. Yeah, you can take care of me because you'll be the one that gets an NFL contract. It just doesn't work that way. No, it doesn't work that way. You can buy my buy my house later no that's not how it works darling yeah that can get real real tough uh kevin hart has a great bit about that about it's not a bit it's very serious about he got his first royalty check for i think it's 250 000 bucks and he said in his

head it was oh fantastic now i can get mom a car i can get mom a house i can get brother a house i can go ahead and get myself take and then after the management management took their cut and after the agent took their cut and after sam took their cut it was not nearly the amount of money right and so we get to counting and playing monopoly in our head with this imaginary stuff that's going to come down the road and it just doesn't work out this families get confused i was with a friend of mine this weekend. That's his. One of his parents passed away and he's trying to protect mom because he said now that dad's gone, all these people and he named the ethnicity. OK, we'll be coming around mom and we've got to protect mom from these people you know and it's family within that particular culture and he said i got to protect

mom from that and uh because they're gonna come gosh they they you know dad's gone they're gonna smell there's there's money and it must be there coming that's right the sharks are circling you know the money and it must be there because the old man's gone. Now we can get the old lady. She's a soft touch. We can get the money out of her. Yikes. Yeah. Woo. Wow.

That's the thing, man. That's the thing. You people and your families. Mine's perfect, Dave. Hey, you know the saying around Ramsey. If you think there's not crazy in your family, then it's you. This is the Ramsey Show. Hey, it's John Deloney, co-host of The Ramsey Show.

Did you know over 18 million people listen to The Ramsey Show every week? A lot of those people listen on one of our 600-plus radio stations across the country. To find a station near you, go to RamseySolutions.com slash show.