The Ramsey Show - App - In Debt for a Lawn Mower? NEVER, NEVER, NEVER! (Hour 2)

Episode Date: November 1, 2018

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🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Thanks for joining us. Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Coming up at the quarter hour, at the 15 mark, Les Parrott will be joining us, national best-selling author

and one of our speakers at the SMART Conference. He's one of America's at the smart conference he's one of america's leading experts on marriage and relationships got a new book out we're going to be talking to him about that and talking about the upcoming smart conference coming up in dallas so if you've got a marriage question less is your man and uh you can call in right now kelly will open up some lines and we'll get you set up for about eight or ten minutes from now. The phone number here is 888-825-5225. Andy is going to start us off this hour in Tuscaloosa, Alabama.

Hi, Andy. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Afternoon, Dave. How are you today? Better than I deserve. What's up? All right. Got a couple things. One, my wife and I you today? Better than I deserve. What's up? All right. Got a couple things.

One, my wife and I, we are completely out of debt. My mother-in-law is still in debt, but she is working on baby step two. She is 60 years old. She has no long-term care insurance and basically no life insurance. We went to our independent insurance agent, and he has always recommended term insurance for everything that I've done with him. He offered us a plan that's $180,000 over 30 years, but it's a variable universal life insurance.

I know you tend to not like those, but the reason that he said to use them is because we don't have to meet certain expense requirements, and we don't have to requalify every few months or every few years. I don't know what the term was, but every year or so. It's one of the biggest scams that has ever happened to the long-term care industry. It's a scam. You need a new insurance agent. It's absolute garbage that you would tie your long-term care insurance

to variable universal life long-term care insurance is long-term care insurance when you these guys will bundle they will bundle poop with anything to get to get long term to get their dad gum life insurance crap tied into it it's unbelievable you go to buy car insurance they try to attach life cash value life insurance to it and this is the same thing now they're polluting the long-term care insurance industry no no no no no no do not buy variable universal life on a dadgum 60 year old absolutely mathematically horrible because here's what happens every year her life insurance cost goes up inside of that so the amount of money going to savings goes down until the lines cross and now

the premiums won't even cover the life insurance cost it erodes the savings back out they use all that up and then the whole thing so implodes these life insurance companies are doing on their dadgum horrible universal life policies are getting sued left and right and they're doing these huge settlements everywhere because these things are imploding and falling in on themselves and to attach that to your long-term care insurance pretty much ensures that no pun intended that your long-term care insurance is going to implode. So, no, get long-term care insurance and probably need a new life insurance agent because this one can't add. Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no.

Hope I wasn't unclear. Sean is with us in New Orleans. Hi, Sean. How are you? Dave, I am fantastic. I have to tell you, it is such an honor to speak to you, bud. Thank you so much for taking the call. My pleasure. How can I help? Look, I talk the talk, understand, have read the books,

have attended the FPU classes, have facilitated FPU classes. Wife and I have gotten out of debt except for the house before, and then stupid is as stupid does. I've got all the tools in the toolbox, but I'll use that hammer backwards every now and then. And we find ourselves willingly and through our own volition backing a little bit of debt. Not too much. We've got about $28,000 mainly in a vehicle, also a lawnmower we bought. Have a plan to attack this and get this knocked out between the next 8 to 12 months, depending on the decision that I think you're going to hopefully clarify for me. With sinking funds, it's what kind of got us in trouble the first time.

What is the role of sinking funds when we're in that baby step two and three? It's like things on the horizon, like braces, high school tuition. These are things I know are coming up, but I'm not incorporating them into my monthly budget because I'm trying to attack my debt. So it kind of just pops up on me like, surprise, surprise, here I've been the whole time, which then causes us to make poor decisions. So you've led Financial Peace University twice, and you don't know how to put upcoming braces

into your budget. I've led it once, and the braces are a new problem. Well, I mean, any kind of upcoming expense, you put it into your budget. I've let it once, and the braces are a new problem. And I understand what you're saying. Well, I mean, any kind of upcoming expense, you put it into the budget. Christmas is going to be in December this year. I looked it up. It is. It is.

So, yes, the Christmas vacations, we have that incorporated into our sinking funds. But just any other thing, just the routine stuff, it's like once we're out of debt, we find ourselves, hey, now we're getting ready to start attacking our, you know, fully funded emergency fund and then start to work on our retirement savings, which we have not stopped doing. But your monthly budget has to incorporate annual expenses. Everything. Whatever your annual expenses are.

Got it. And you have to build that in. But that didn't cause you to buy a lawnmower on credit. Not at all. Not at all. Absolutely. Look, I own it. And hopefully, we were joking online just now on the YouTube page about hopefully you

don't call the ambulance on me. How much do you owe on your lawnmower? $4,500. I bought it three months ago. We just moved out. We purchased, built a home on five acres and purchased a lawnmower, have plans to have it paid off in the next, again, next six to ten months with the vehicle that we purchased and the lawnmower.

It's not smart, Dave. If it were smart, I would have, it would be the Sean show. I realize that. I don't understand. I mean, I think you've got, you're going to have to reach a different level of conviction, not just shame. Well, and I think that's where we are and we are here now. We are sick and tired of being sick and tired and doing the things that we know aren't wise and just it's it has reached the point and we're there we we are fired up and ready and it had that gazelle intensity that we had when we first started out but i don't know if it's just just again the way ambulance but

it's just time just eats up at you and you're like what am i doing this for it's such a hard long race and it is and i know it needs to be to be successful. And we are both at that point now and ready to do what we need to do. What do you make a year? Too much. About $140,000 combined for the household. Okay. And I have on a monthly basis, we have right now for our snowball about $2,300.

I'm just intrigued. So were you just, do you feel like you were just emotionally lazy? Yeah. You know, I think, you know what it is? I think that you work so hard and you sacrifice, and I think it's a badge of honor. And it's because you're doing something that's good. No, no, no, no, no. Not a lawnmower.

Oh, okay. I'm saying, I mean, how do you walk in Home Depot and go five grand in debt on a lawnmower? That's just got to be emotional laziness. And that's what I mean about commitment. I'm not picking on you. I'm shaming you. You're doing enough of that of yourself. But if I'm you, man, I really want to get down inside this and fix that. Because you've got to put that back together and go, never.

Never. Never. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Because you've got to put that back together and go, never, never, never. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Okay, things are getting pretty weird out there. I thought the Equifax breach was bad enough. It exposed the personal financial info of half of all Americans. Now we have breaches affecting almost every U.S. citizen, and the data stolen is more personal and equally dangerous. One company had over 230 million consumer files hacked, which included not only the home address, but info related to religion, pet lovers, smokers, you name it. And the businesses were not any luckier this time, with 110 million files hacked.

It really is no longer a matter of if, it's when you'll become a victim. That's exactly why the only plan I've ever recommended is through Zander Insurance. They cover all types of identity theft for families and businesses, and they take over all the work if you become a victim. I use it for my family and my entire team. Call 800-356-4282 or visit Zander.com. That's Zander.com. As promised, number one best-selling author and psychologist, Dr. Les Parrott, is with us. Man, this guy is the top guy on marriage out there and relationships.

If you have a marriage question, we're going to open up some phone lines right now, and you can jump in. Relationship questions, this is the guy. He speaks with us at Smart Conference every year. We just finished doing a sold-out event up in Kansas City just the other day. And absolutely amazing. And they've been doing, Rachel and him, have been doing marriage and money events all over the place. Another one of those coming up in Phoenix, Arizona next week.

Yeah, absolutely. In Phoenix. I can't wait. I'm going to get some Tex-Mex while I'm there, too. There you go. Well, welcome back to Nashville. Yeah, absolutely. In Phoenix. I can't wait. I'm going to get some Tex-Mex while I'm there, too. There you go. Well, welcome back to Nashville. Yeah. And you guys are in town because you and your wife are doing an event tonight at Brentwood Baptist. We are. We're doing fight night, an event on conflict, a date night for couples. Laugh while you learn and learn how to fight better. So but can I say something right at the top here, Dave? I go

to so many places to speak. I'm in so many different organizations, corporations, all that kind of thing. You have something so special here. And the people, it's not just the content. Everybody loves the content. You're changing lives. We all know that. But it's the people. There's something so magical about what is the chemistry of this place.

I can't explain it. But it is so fun. And I'm telling you something, doing these money and marriage events with Rachel, I think you can retire because she's got it locked in. I mean, she has dialed it in. Well, the two of you together are a one-two punch because you're both comedians to start with, and it's a lot of humor in that event. We have fun, absolutely.

I'm a big believer that people should laugh while they learn. It's boring just to have a couple talking heads up there, but if you can have a good time and improve your life in the process, that's a good combo. So Smart Conference is coming up in Dallas after the first of the year here. And I'm trying to look here. January 12th is when it is. And then November 8th is the last money and marriage event in this calendar year. But then we're doing a special money and marriage event February theary the 14th here in nashville that's gonna be fun that's gonna be destination deal lots of people coming in from out of town to have the nashville experience you know valentine's

right money and marriage event with you and rachel that's gonna be amazing for people that don't know the whole concept is i get up for the first hour and i talk about talking you know so many of us don't know how to have good communication and I crack the code for your personal talk style because everybody's designed uniquely for a conversation. And then Rachel comes back for the second hour after intermission and walks us through

some incredible, life-changing talks that every couple needs to have. And there's no guilt, there's no shame, it's just fun. And people, they're walking on clouds as they walk out of that place. It's cool it's good it's good content money and marriage les parrot rachel cruz coming up phoenix next week uh the 14th of february uh in nashville kansas city april 1 des moines iowa april 15 dallas texas may 16th so you got this new book out. This thing is great. I love this book.

I endorse it. Look at that. I'm on the back endorsing it. Very, very cool. Love Like That. Five Relationship Secrets from Jesus. Well, just put it out there, right there in the subtitle, man. Just pop it, man.

And you would think Jesus could give us some relationship secrets. That would make sense. Yeah, some relationship secrets. That makes sense. That would make sense. Yeah, this is a special book to me. You know, I've written, as you know, many books on marriage with my wife, Leslie. This book is the result of a personal quest. I have just always struggled with this idea of how in the world are we even to come close to loving like Jesus? It seems impossible. doesn't it?

Walk the extra mile, turn the other cheek, love your enemies. Are you kidding me? How do you do that? And I felt like such a failure, and I thought, this is the heart of all relationships. This is what it's all about, and I want to get a handle on this. So I wrote this book for me as much as I did anybody else, and it's been a long time in the process.

But I really wanted to get practical. I wasn't interested in the theology or the philosophy of it. I wanted practical steps. How do you do this in your relationships? Not just marriage, but work colleagues, friendships, your parenting, even with total strangers. How in the world can you even come close to loving like Jesus? And by the way, Dave, I knew if I was to have any credibility with this, I had to be vulnerable.

This was a book that is not standing on a platform and saying, here's how you do it. I don't have this dialed in. In fact, I knew, who was it that said many years ago, oh, that my enemy would write a book, right? Because you write a book on loving like jesus uh in fact i remember just a few days after the book came out my son jackson who's 15 i wasn't at my peak at parenting and some interaction we were having and i remember he's got a great spirit but he walked away from me and he just he just kind of said under his breath well love like that you know that's only a teenager can do.

Exactly. You want this dagger back? Oh. Okay, so out of the five different chapters, the five relationship things that you learn from Christ on how to love, which one of these is the easiest for you? Which one's the hardest? That's a great question. Nobody's asked me that question yet.

I looked at kind of the intersection of where Christ's teaching as well as salient examples come together. That's how it came to these five things. And I think probably the easiest one, none of them are like, oh, I got that. Check that off my to-do list. But the first one is

be mindful. If you want to love like Jesus, you've got to see what other people don't. And do you remember that film? Have you ever seen this film? Sometimes they show it in corporate settings for different training things. Have you spotted, did you spot the gorilla? Have you ever seen that little, okay. I show this sometimes to my college students and it's so fascinating. Two basketball teams and they're throwing a basketball back and forth. And you're just simply, the instruction I give the students, hey, just count how many times a basketball is thrown to each team member. So they're focused on that.

It lasts for about two minutes. And then I flip the switch, and lights come back on. I said, so how many of you spotted the gorilla? And they're like, what? What are you talking about? And they think I've, like, lost my mind. I said, well, let me show it to you one more time, but this time don't focus on counting the basketball tosses. Come out right in the middle of this little two-minute thing.

A guy in a gorilla suit comes out, looks straight in the camera. He's about 10 feet from the camera, beats his chest, stands there for about maybe 15 seconds, and then walks off frame. Well, the place, the auditorium goes nuts. They're like, that's a different video. You deceived us. No, it's the exact same video, but we didn't see it. And the same thing happens in our life. And it all has to do with how we perceive things and

what we're focused on and our intentions and our agendas. That's why we can't see things that others don't. We have agendas about everything. But I think that one... In the political season, you see this big amount. That is true, isn't it? People are completely blind because of their agendas. And you can't see somebody else's

perspective because of it. They can't even see the other person right now. I mean, it's completely a fog. Exactly. So I think if I had to label one as the easiest, I'd work at that one most intentionally. Well, you're a counselor. That makes sense. You should. It's awareness, right? It's consciousness.

But the toughest one, I think, is the last one on the list. In fact, I even start the chapter by saying, I've written the whole book, but I've been putting off this chapter, self-giving. If you want to love like Jesus, you've got to give yourself away. Now, that's tough, man. How do you do that? How do you even get practical on that? But this idea of being able to put yourself in somebody else's shoes and see the world as they see it, offer them grace,

and to do that with intention, that's a tough one. But I go through practical steps I do in each chapter. And by the way, there's a little self-test for free that you can take. I have it online for each chapter. And so you can kind of measure. I'm very big, as you know,

into assessment and measuring things. What gets measured gets managed. And so I give my readers an opportunity to kind of take a little assessment and then see how they're doing after a week, after a month and so forth on these things. But that one, you know, give yourself away by emptying yourself for empathy. You know, when was the last time you did that for Sharon? It's not something we walk around going, yeah, I'm going to do that right now. Yeah, I think I'll just go home and do that right now. And take the rest of the day off.

Oh my gosh. Yeah, I thought bold would be easy for me. It probably is. I think you have a gift for that. Speaking the truth. That one's probably the easy one for me. And that's the risk of rejection. Yeah, I think the hard one's probably the approachable, as I'm looking at them.

The book is Love Like That, Five Relationship Secrets from Jesus. Seemed to be a national bestseller as well. Most of Les Parrott's books are national bestsellers. We'll come back and talk more about that and talk more about some of the other things that are going on with Les Parrott and our organization. He's everywhere. And we'll talk with you if you've got questions about relationships right here. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Are high health care costs getting you down? Are you confused trying to navigate your options? Do you wish you could find an affordable, biblical solution to your health care costs?

Based on New Testament principles, Christian Health Care Ministries, or CHM, helps Christian families, churches, and ministries join together as the body of Christ to share their major health care costs. Christian Health Care Ministries is the original health cost-sharing ministry, a Better Business Bureau-accredited organization CHM members share to pay each other's medical bills. It's not insurance. It's Christians financially and spiritually supporting each other. It's what Christian Health Care Ministries has done for Thank you. Christian Healthcare Ministries is a proud sponsor of Dave Ramsey Live Events. chministries.org Number one best-selling author and psychologist, Dr. Les Parrott,

featured on Oprah, CBS This Morning, Today Show, CNN, Fox, The View, everywhere else, everything. USA Today, New York Times, everything. One of the leading experts on marriage and relationships in America today. Regular speaker at our smart conferences that we do about twice a year we just finished a sellout up at kansas city and dallas texas on january the 12th there's a few tickets left um also he's in nashville to do the um fight night a date night uh for fighting yeah have a good fight a date night for your marriage here's the deal man if you know how to fight a good fight conflict really becomes the price you pay for intimacy right if you think about it conflict's not all, man. If you know how to fight a good fight, conflict really becomes the price you pay for intimacy, right?

If you think about it, conflict's not all bad. It can bring you closer together if you know how to do it well, and that's what the night's about. You know, it's interesting that I've heard you say that a bazillion times, the SMART conference as well. And we were talking about this organizationally. Pat Lencioni says a company that can do conflict internally well, a healthy way of managing conflict and having conflict, embracing conflict, has a competitive advantage in the marketplace. And what you're saying is your marriage does too.

Yeah, because you're real, you're authentic, and you're known. You can't get known unless you put it out there, right? And the same thing, I think, works in a corporate setting, in a business setting, too, where people can be authentic and say what's on their mind. And before the break, we were talking about this book, and one of the things is being bold, and that's what it's about, right? Being bold enough to say what's on your mind, risk rejection, and be in a place where you're still going to be accepted. Yeah, because what happens is it builds up, if not, and it spews. And then it becomes contempt, which is not healthy. That's exactly right.

And contempt is one of the most toxic things. You've heard me talk about this so many times. But contempt is like poison. We should outlaw it in Congress. It's terrible for any relationship. And that's, you know, when we belittle people, we try to cut them down to size. And that does nobody any good. It's the eye roll.

Yeah. Man, you really got me. You could get my talk, I think. Oh, man, I take notes every time you do your talk. It's world-class communication, man. The book is Love Like That, Five Relationship Secrets from Jesus. You can get it anywhere great books are sold, certainly Amazon and Barnes & Noble and so forth. And so be sure you check that out.

Matthew's in Rochester, Minnesota with a question for Les. Hey, Matthew, how are you? Good. Yourself, Dave? How are you doing? Better than I deserve. How can we help you? Yes. So I just had a quick question. I've been trying to get my wife on board for some time. She's getting a little bit closer, but not fully 100% on board. Every time I do a budget, she's like, you do the budget. We'll do it once a week. But when the time comes, she just sort of,

her body language just rolls her eyes and she tells me that I talk about it too much, which I probably do that, which I'm trying to get less of, but I'm not sure where to go from there because we make too much money and we work too hard, and that's what I feel like. I feel like I'm a little bit more passionate about it, so I'm not really sure of what to do. So how to pull her into not only the budget committee meeting where you're laying out your spending together,

but also some of your goals. Right. Les? Yeah. So, and I'm guessing that you are just hardwired to do this more than she is. Would you say that's true? That's very true. Yeah.

Your personality is that. And that's not unusual at all. In fact, when you have two people that are as gung-ho and hardwired as you, and they come together, you've got a whole other problem, right? Right. Because there's too much octane in the gas tank. But in this situation, Matthew, I love your question. We hear it a lot.

And one of the things that I would suggest is to, first of all, just make sure that she feels understood. And do this from a genuine place. Make sure that she feels understood about what is it that is boring, whatever maybe her fear is. And one of the best ways of doing that is just to kind of dip down into her life story on money. In her home growing up, how was it handled? And to kind of understand that background can give you some insight and some empathy for her. And then it sounds like you're already aware of this, but maybe taking your foot off the gas pedal a little bit so there's no guilt.

Guilt is a terrible motivator. And so if she's feeling like, oh, I just can't ever measure up to what he wants, and so why try? That's not good, right? And so those two things, if you can help her feel understood and generally try to get in there and really understand, ask questions, you know, in a way that is is compassionate. Don't don't interrogate her. But in ways that she feels like, oh, man, he really wants to understand me in this area. You'll be surprised at how when one person begins to make some positive changes that the other spouse admires, like a mobile hanging from the ceiling, that person has to find the new balance in things and comes on board to do that as well.

But, Dave, you've heard this question a million times. What am I leaving out? What else is Matthew? I think you answered it exactly like I think it should be answered. It's kind of like, you know, lose a few battles on some of the little nitsy things, some of the little Davisms or whatever that you've been pushing so hard. Lose a few of those battles to win the war. The war is unity. Right.

Unity will supersede you, you know, if you maybe not intense enough on the dead snowball. Well, the intensity will come through the unity faster than it will be just trying to dial her passion level up on this issue. Right. Right. That's exactly right. And that comes through, like I said earlier, get to know her fears and get to know her anxiety around that. And she'll be joining you soon. Thanks, Matthew.

Annette is with us in San Antonio, Texas. Hi, Annette. How are you? Hi, I'm fine. Thank you, Dave. Thank you is with us in San Antonio, Texas. Hi, Annette. How are you? Hi, I'm fine. Thank you, Dave. Thank you, Les, for having me. My question is, my husband is an executive at a bank, and he works daily about 13 or 14 hours. And when he comes home, he's not emotionally or actively available.

He doesn't actively listen or pay attention to myself or my child. How do I talk to him? Sorry, I'm getting emotional. How do I talk to him about that without showing my anger and my resentment? Well, I sense the pain in your voice, Annette, for sure. You don't have to be a psychologist to pick that up, and I really appreciate you sharing the question. Do you think that your husband's aware of it?

I have spoken to him before about it, about six months ago, and he said he would try to, you know, work a couple of days from home. He listens, but I don't know if he hears. I don't know if he hears. I don't know. Yeah, okay. Do you feel like this is for a season or that this is just a rat race? He's just stuck in a wheel. I think he's stuck in a wheel.

He's 51, and I think he's scared that he can't find another job to pay him what he's making now. So he's just taking on whatever work they throw at him and not wanting to say no. Yeah. Well, I'm a big believer in empathy. It factors into nearly every answer I give couples on nearly any question because it's so transformative. So the more you can put yourself in his shoes and understand that and let him know he is understood by you and not attacked by you, and I just sense from just the tone in your voice you're not kind of an aggressive person with him. Would that be accurate, that you kind of tiptoe around his needs?

Right. I'm not aggressive. Right, right. And so I think that if you don't, once he feels like he's understood by you and why he's working his head off and just, you know, it's out of fear, it sounds like. But once he understands that from you, I think, and Dave, you tell me if you back me up on this, I think it's time for a come-to-Jesus talk. It's like, hey, this is our life, and this is something that is impeding our relationships with our kids, or at least our child, you

mentioned one, and something's got to give. Something's got to change, and I need to either see a professional and walk through this with you, or something dramatic has got to take place. And that's really about being bold, right? You can't just go through your life and say, okay, whatever. I think this, on a scale of 1 to 10, I think this is a 12 for you. And so far, he's heard that it's a 2. I don't think he's heard you yet because you're so soft-spoken about it. And we're not telling you to be belligerent,

but I think he's probably a little thicker than you're giving him credit for. You're going to have to hit a little harder to get his attention. And that's what Les is saying. And I agree with him. Dr. Les Parrott, the book is Love Like That, Five Relationship Secrets from Jesus.

Be sure and check it out. Thanks for stopping by, my friend. Thanks, brother. Always good to be with you. Good to be with you. This is the Dave Ramsey Solutions, Jeremy and Jennifer are with us. Hey, guys. How are you?

Hey, Dave. We're doing well. Cool. Where do y'all live? We live just a little north of here in Gallatin. Oh, Nashville. Okay, perfect. Well, good to have you.

Thank you, sir. And here to do your debt-free screen. Yes, sir. How much have you paid off? $65,425. Love it. How long did this take? 28 long months for us. I hear you. And your range of income during that time? We started out about $77,000, went to $92,000, and we should be about $110,000 this year. Good. What do y'all do for a living? I'm an HR manager at a manufacturing facility. And I'm operations manager at a sign shop. Cool. Very cool.

Good to have you guys. So what kind of debt was this $65,000? You're looking at two normal people here. We had $30,000 in student loans. We had $21,000 in credit cards. We had $21,000 in credit cards. We had about $3,500 in a personal loan.

And the last was $11,000 in a car loan. You had everything. Yep. You were normal. How long have you guys been married? I've been married a little over four years. Perfect. So what happened 28 months ago that's put you on fire?

You did, right? So in January of 2016, we took Financial Peace University at our church. It was a Wednesday night class. I talked him into taking the class, and before we even figured out how much it was, I was like, we're taking this. He committed to it. And then I told him how much it was. He was like, how are we even going to come up with that?

So, yeah, we made it happen we took financial peace university and then you know we've been day followers ever since love it so jeremy how'd she talk you into it uh well it was just it was a class like she said it was offered at church you know we had the girls doing their wednesday night programs and so i was thinking myself okay you know we're getting pretty tight where at the end of the month, you know, it might be on the credit card to put the last tank of gas before we get, you know, to payday. So I said, okay, let's go see what it's all about. You know, we got into class, had a couple other people in there from Sunday school we knew,

so it was easy to kind of relate with them as well. And it was an eye-opener to see how much debt we really had and how weighed down we were. And like you say, the freedom. The freedom wasn't there to really do anything we wanted. Before the class, we never had fights about money because we never talked about money. Our finances were completely separate. We lived in the same house. We have two children.

And I was pregnant. We were about to bring our second child into the world. And we were like, what are we going to do? How are we going to do this? So the weight was there and it just hadn't cracked open yet. Yes, sir. And then you go in there and you start looking at this and you go, wow, there's another way to live. Wow. So what do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is? Because you guys did a remarkable job. This is a lot of debt. Yeah, it was.

Well, the first thing was definitely be on the same page if you can. Husbands, wives, whichever side you're on, listen to your spouse. You know, it'll be worth it at the end. It'll be worth it if you catch it early and not have those financial fights further down the road and also have somebody who's a genius with spreadsheets and can budget it out so which would be jennifer that would be jennifer okay so how hard was it when you had really completely separate financial lives the first night you sat down and started talking about combining them because we were forcing you to do that,

that must have been a WWF night right there. We waited a month after starting your class before we did it because I was like, no, I'm a little bit of a control freak when it comes to that. So I wanted to see what, you know, make sure that we can make it work joining it together. And when we joined it together, we realized how much power we had. And so it wasn't that hard. No, it wasn't. And you got to kind of look at yourself too, you know, as being married, both of our debts were both of our responsibilities, you know, where you're combined into one household. So you have to pick up the other person as well.

So it was a big part of us listening to each other and carrying each other's burdens. That's a big deal. Very well done. So you did it. You don't have any payments. How does it feel? It feels amazing. It's been long, but, you know, now you can see all these future things, these future plans five years down the road, ten years down the road, a beach house, whatever, college funds for the girls.

It's very feasible. The program after the first two or three months, it's a mind change. Once you get in that mind change, everything else is cake after that. How do you feel, Jennifer? I think it's amazing. I know a lot of the times, even now in Baby Step 3, we're still in Baby Step 3, we follow the Debt Free community on Instagram. And it is like having a room full of cheerleaders. So even when people around you just think you're crazy talking about Dave, you can go on there and have a place to share your story. And, you know, I fell off the wagon a couple of times when it comes to the budget and have grace with each other.

So it's awesome to see the future. Very cool. Well, good for you guys. Who was your biggest cheerleader outside of each other? The parents were actually pretty good cheerleaders. And we had, like I said, a couple people in our financial peace university that were doing the same thing. So we kind of kept each other accountable. Yeah, you can cheer each other on that way.

And hold each other accountable, both. It's kind of the same thing. But, yeah, very well done. But very cool. Congratulations. Thank you. We're proud of you. I know that. Way, very cool. Congratulations. Thank you. We're proud of you. I know that.

Way to go. Thank you. Thank you. And you brought the kiddos with you. What are their names and ages? We have Jazlyn, that is seven, and then Little Miss Janelle, who is two. Oh, all right. Perfect.

All right. All right. Got the debt-free sign and everything. Ready to go. Oh, and the Cheetah and the Gazelle, the whole bit. Graphic arts going here. Well done. Well, we got a copy of Chris Hogan's book for you, Retire

Inspired, and that's the next chapter of your story. To be millionaires now, you're on your way, and outrageously generous. Way to go, you guys. Jeremy, Jennifer, Jasmine, and Janelle, Nashville, $65,000 paid off in 28 months, making $77,000 to $92,000. Count it 28 months, making 77 to 92.

Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Way to go, you guys. I love it. Woo! There you go.

That's good stuff. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Thanks for being with us, America. We're glad you are here. Lisa is with us in Atlanta, Georgia. Hi, Lisa. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi.

Thank you. It's such an honor to speak with you today. You too. How can I help? Yes, I have a, thank you. It's such an honor to speak with you today. You too. How can I help? Yes, I have a question for you. I'm currently in baby step two. The only thing I have left to pay off is my student loans, which is about $18,000. And I've been told that it's a pretty good chance I may lose my job at the end of this year. And I wondering yeah if i should keep paying extra on those or if i should stop so a pretty good chance would be greater than 50 50 yes they're looking for people

to leave voluntarily and if they don't get enough people then they're going to start involuntary so depends on how many people leave on their own and you think you'd be on that list it's hard to tell i hope not but what do you make a year 75 000 what do you do um i'm an analyst i work in telecommunications okay good for you okay cool well number one i start looking for a job if they come in and tell you they're going to fire you, we're going to voluntarily lay people off because this place is going down. We're not doing well. It's time for you to look for a job, don't you think?

Yeah, I've been looking. It's just with my – I've been with the company a really long time. I don't care. You're not going to be with that company very long because they're about to get ready to fire you. Most other ones, my starting salary is going to be a lot lower than where I'm coming in, which is what makes me think about hanging on. But you think I should just move on?

Well, I think if you keep looking until you can find something that is where you're not taking a huge pay cut. But if I can find something with a similar pay, I'm going tomorrow. Yeah, most of what I found is like 25,000 or so less because i don't have a degree yeah well i mean i'm gonna keep working that in other words okay and even if you interviewed with one of them and said with all this experience can you go higher you know okay get in there and negotiate but yeah i think you need to temporarily stop your debt snowball and stop your baby steps and pile up cash because I think you've got a storm coming here. And it sounds like you are going to lose your job at the end of the year.

And I want you to go get a new one right now as fast as you can. And in the meantime, I want you to pile up cash as high as you can pile it to get ready for the storm that's coming. Because I think you've got it. I think it's really coming. I don't want you to be in denial about it. That puts this hour of the Dave Ramsey Show in the books. Hey, it's Kelly Daniel, associate producer and phone screener for The Dave Ramsey Show. Did you know that in 2017, Dave Ramsey Show listeners paid off $50 million of debt?

That's pretty impressive. And it could be you this year. Keep listening for more inspiration.