The Ramsey Show - App - Insight On Commercial Real Estate Investing (Hour 2)

Episode Date: November 29, 2018

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Music Music Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Thank you for joining us. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Joining us at the bottom of the hour, Ramsey personality Chris Hogan and millionaire expert, author of the book Everyday Millionaires, coming out in January on sale now. He's going to be with us for a half an hour answering your questions, and we'll be talking about everyday millionaires and how to get there, how to be one of them, and what they look like, and who they are, and how they think.

And taking your questions as well, if you want to ask Chris a question, you can go ahead and call Kelly now at 888-825-5225, and we'll put you in line for the bottom of the hour. Kelly is with us in Bowling Green, Kentucky. Hi, Kelly. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi there. How are you? Better than I deserve.

What's up in your world? Well, my husband and I are thinking about selling our home, and we wanted your advice. We listen to your podcast every day, and your ministry has been such a blessing to us so far. Thank you. Yes. ministry has been such a blessing to us so far. Um, yes, uh, we have, so the reason why I called is because we've been working your plan since about January. Um, and we are in a lot of debt because of student debt. So, um, my husband is a physical therapist, um, and he has about 93,000 in student debt and I'm an interior designer and, and I have about $17,000. And then we have a car for about $14,000.

So we're $123,000 in debt. His income is about, I'm giving you all of our specs because I listen to podcasts all the time. His income is about $90,000. Last year I worked for a company, and I made a lot of money at, um, that I probably won't make now because I'm independent designer right now. So last year I made 107. So, um, what do you think you'll make next year? Um, probably I'm on track to probably make around 50 this year.

Okay. So what's the deal with the house? Why would you sell it? Okay, so we're thinking about relocating to Lexington. So we've always played with the idea of selling our home, and it would get us completely out of debt, and then we could work the plan and buy a house for cash is what we're thinking. We have two small young ones.

We have a two- and four-year-old. And so we want to be able to save for them to go to college, and we don't want them to be in the same situation or ever feel like we have felt. Good. So the house has more than $124,000 in equity? The house has $100,000 in equity. So if we sold it, it would be $100,000. So we would still have about $23,000 left.

Gotcha. Okay. So we have been playing with the idea and going to look at rentals up there and thinking about renting for a year and then saving for a house. Yeah, that sounds like a good plan. I mean, you could get out of debt during that year and build your emergency fund and then start saving for a house. You might end up renting two years, it sounds like,

depending on how much money you can make up there. And can he make the same kind of money there? Yes. He's already talked with potential PT friends that have job openings. So, yes, he could at least make $90,000, maybe even go in the home health and make $110,000, $120,000. Way to go. And then you can start something up there as well, right? Yes, I can take my business with me and build clientele.

Okay, very good. Okay, so that is a good idea. The deal is this. None of this is because of debt. It's because you're wanting to move to Lexington. Right. Well, yes. Yes, we had to.

So in the process, it so happens that as you move to Lexington that you sell your house and you're going to get out of debt. But you're not moving to Lexington because of the debt. Right, yeah. So you're doing this anyway is the point. So, yeah, definitely sell your house and definitely pay off the debt and definitely finish up that other $23,000 and definitely do your emergency fund and then definitely start saving for a down payment on a house. And, yeah, yeah, I mean, this is a move you weren't going to make anyway.

So, absolutely, you do that. Good question. And I think you got this, kiddo. You're doing good. Blair is with us in Lexington. Hi, Blair. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave.

How are you doing today? Better than I deserve. What's up? I hear you. Listen, I'll make it real quick for you. My wife and I have recently purchased some land next to our house, and what we're wanting to do is it's got a building on it, and it's adjacent to our land,

and we're just wanting to find out if what would be the best way to go is to just, you know, tear the house down, resell it, or add it to what we have got right now and maybe sell it later on down the road. The house on the land that you bought? Yeah, it needs to be. It costs too much to fix it up. Okay. All right.

So it's kind of, you know, it's pretty junky right now. It's just sitting there empty, right? Yeah, it's just so high. Okay. And you bought sitting there empty, right? Yeah, it's a sore eye. Okay. And you bought the land? Yes, I did. You already own it. Yeah, it's about three-quarters of an acre.

Okay. All right. Cool. And what will it take to tear it down? How much money? You're looking, I'm going to roughly, I've not had a price on it yet, but I'm roughly going to say about $1,500, $2,000. $1,500 or $2,000 to tear it down? Yes, sir.

Do you have the money? We've got it, yeah. We can take it out of the savings, but that's what I don't want to do. I don't want to deplete our savings completely. Okay. And how much money do you have in savings? I'm going to roughly say, right off the top of my head about $20,000. Well, you wouldn't be depleting it completely.

You'd be depleting it by $2,000. Right. You'd still have $18,000. Right. So what's your household income? Well, I'm retired due to health reasons, and I get about, if I'm more roughly, say about $1,700. $1,700? A hundred. A month. Oh, okay. reasons and i get about uh more roughly say about 17 a month 1700 a month oh okay all right good yeah yeah all right well i mean i guess you got two choices right you save up in addition to the

money that you've got uh in order to tear the property down or you use some of your savings to tear it down but i wouldn't tell you to borrow money to tear down a house when you got $20,000 no i never no we're debt free i don't want to get into that yeah good that's that's so either use your savings or you look at the eyesore for a while while you save up enough money to tear it down um and that that's what you've got to look at is just but it doesn't scare me to go from $20,000 to $18,000. I don't think the difference in those two is going to make or break you if you face a situation and you need some money. Usually, it's going to be, you know, you might be $10,000 off one way or the other in that situation. So a couple grand out of $20,000 doesn't paralyze me with fear for you.

I think you'd be all right to do that. But would I spend the whole $20,000 to tear paralyze me with fear for you. I think you'd be all right to do that. But would I spend the whole $20,000 to tear something down? No, I wouldn't. I wouldn't. I wouldn't want you to be sitting there broke with a clean piece of land next door. That's not a plan. But if it's only a couple grand out of that $20,000, that seems all right. Or save up and pay for it if you don't want to touch that savings.

I don't mind either way. It's good. But as you said, we're not going in debt. As you said, we're going to pay cash for it if you don't want to touch that savings i don't mind either way it's good but as you said we're not going in debt as you said we're going to pay cash for it either way this is the dave ramsey show Why in the world would you trust some random guy in a cube when getting your mortgage? Do you really think he cares about your long-term money goals? Well, he doesn't. Those companies care about getting you into whatever home loan program they're pushing that week. When it comes to ordering a cheeseburger, the meal deal works fine.

But let's get real, people. We're talking about the largest investment you'll probably ever make. So don't be naive and trust an order taker who pressures you into a prepackaged loan. My friends at Churchill Mortgage have been helping my listeners for over 25 years. Call Churchill Mortgage and get custom solutions from an expert within 10 minutes. It's simple. They'll shoot straight with you and quickly show you the real way to save money. Call 888-LOAN-200.

That's 888-LOAN-200. Or visit ChurchillMortgage.com. This is a paid advertisement. NMLS ID 1591. NMLSconsumeraccess.org. Equal housing lender. 761 Old Hickory Boulevard. Redwood, Tennessee 37027. Sean and Sarah are with us, and they're in Saratoga Springs. Hey, guys, how are you? Hi, Dave. I see on my screen you're debt-free. Congratulations.

Thank you so much. How much have you paid off? We paid off $32,483.82 in 11 months. Good for you. And we also cash flowed about $30,000 worth of other stuff during that time as well. What kind of other stuff for $30,000? There were some medical bills that happened during that time as well. What kind of other stuff for $30,000? There were some medical bills that happened during that time, other emergencies, and we were also saving up for our wedding and our honeymoon.

Wow, very cool. So what was your income range during this 11 months? We ranged from about $70,000 to $110,000. Cool. What do you all do for a living? So I am a wedding photographer, and Sean is? I'm an industrial hygienist and compliance engineer. Cool.

Well done, you guys. So you just got married, huh? Yeah. So we actually had a small ceremony about a year ago with just our family, and then we had our bigger wedding just this past summer. So we were doing our debt-free journey right after our ceremony, and we paid off all of our debt about two weeks before we went on our honeymoon. Okay, very cool.

I love it. Way to go. So what started you on this journey, the way you're doing this? This is so cool. So we actually, somebody I knew was taking Financial Peace University, and I looked into it, and I convinced Sean to come along with me to Grace Fellowship. And we took the class, and that really just started our journey because we really enjoyed going to the class and learning about everything.

And we got really into it, and I listen to the podcast every day, too. So that's also a big part of it as well. All right. Very cool. Well, congratulations. How old are you two? We are 28. And you have no debt.

How's that feel? No debt. How's that feel? Amazing. Yeah, it was great to come home from our honeymoon and our bank account be the same that it was when we left. Yeah, there you go. That was the coolest feeling. That's a good place to be.

Well done. So who were your biggest cheerleaders outside of the two of you? Oh, outside of the two of us? So that's kind of a funny question because we didn't have many people because a lot of people around us have the idea that credit cards are very important. So we had a hard time convincing people that this journey we were on actually works. So I would say we definitely, I got a lot of inspiration from listening to other people's debt-free screams and looking on Instagram and stuff. But we were really each other's like like, biggest cheerleader this whole time.

Gotcha. So you are completely weird. Yeah. Well, we were weird before we were debt-free, but now we're, like, extra weird. I love it. I'm proud of y'all. Congratulations. Very, very well done.

Thank you. What do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is? Well, a couple of key things. Teamwork is a big thing. We have to be on the same page. Communication was a big thing, especially at the beginning. Maintaining your budget and just having big, big discipline and following everything that you're teaching and keeping to the budget and just planning together.

And also the envelope system I think was also super helpful. I mean, people look to me like I have three heads when I go into the grocery store with an envelope full of cash, but it really makes you think about what you're going to spend your money on because, like you said, there's an emotional reaction when you use cash versus a card, and it really is true. There's even an emotional reaction from other people, and it's not their money. I know.

They're like, what is that? Oh, that's such a good idea. Oh, man, I should do that. I spend way too much money. I'm like, you should. Dave Ramsey, look it up, Financial Peace University. I, like, plug you every time I go into a different store. Every time she gets it.

Wow. Well, thank you, guys. We appreciate that very much. Well, we're proud of you guys. Way to go. Very cool. We got a copy of Chris Hogan's book for you, Retire Inspired. It's a number one bestseller, and that, of course, is the next chapter in your story for you to be millionaires now. And one of those everyday millionaires that Chris talks about, right?

And outrageously generous as you go along yeah you're in a position to do cool stuff very well done all right sean and sarah saratoga springs 32 000 paid off in 11 months making 70 to 110 count it down let's hear a debt scream all right three two one Let's hear a debt-free scream. All right. Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Yeah! Woo-hoo! That's how you do it right there, man.

I love it. That is so fun. That's so fun. Speaking of Chris Hogan, he joins us at the bottom of the hour if you've got a question for chris about investing about what it takes to be an everyday millionaire and we'll be talking about that we'll also just be taking your questions about life and money jump in ramsey personality number one best-selling author getting ready to be number one best-selling author again with his everyday millionaire book which is selling like hotcakes, man.

Wow. I mean, they're just the pre-sales on this book are absolutely amazing. And we'll talk a little bit more about that. But we'll take your calls for Chris right now. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Sherry is in Cincinnati. Hi, Sherry. How are you?

Hey, Dave. So I've heard you refer to yourself as Uncle Dave, and that's who I need advice from, Uncle Dave. I'll give it a shot. Awesome. So I'm currently working a job that I've had about a year, and there are pieces of it that I love and pieces that I don't know, that I don't love. And so it is, right now the company is going through a lot of changes, and the stress level is extreme.

So even though there's pieces that I love, there are quite honestly days that I just don't know if I can take it much longer. There's been other people, like my peers that have worked with me, that have been with the company 25 and 30 years, and have actually left because they just can't take the stress of it. What's the stress being caused by? By some changes that the company is going through. It's a customer service type thing, so it's affecting our customers,

and they're really angry, and it's just a mess. So the stress is dealing with angry customers. Angry customers. My team is really upset because everything that they do is now ten times harder, and it's just a real mess, to be honest with you. Okay. How long have you been there? You said you've been there one year, and you're thinking about changing.

What are you going to change to? Well, that's what I'm curious about because I make more money than I've ever made before, so I'm a little bit scared to do anything. So I don't know if I should try and either stick it out another year and save enough money and just pay the house off and then I could do what I want. So my options would be that, to stick it out another period of time to get the house paid off, be to think about opening another business, my own company, and doing kind of my own thing, or trying to find a job similar to what I do and just try and

just say, okay, this is just too much, and find something similar to do. So what do you make? And I just, $70,000. $70,000. Okay, cool. Uh-huh. Well, that's an income that is replaceable. Well, I think you, you know, all you've identified so far is that you want to go from something.

You want to get out of this mess, right? Possibly, yeah. And you haven't really figured out what you're going to. And that's the answer to your question. When you figure out what you're going to, it'll tell you whether to go or not. I'll give you an example. Let's say you found a job that was working for a great company where they weren't pissing off all their customers all day long, and you were making $80,000.

Well, that'd be like a no-brainer, right? Right. You take that job in about 13 seconds, you know? So what you need to do is get out there and poke around and see what you can stir up. Or let's say you dreamed up a business idea. You used Christie Wright's business boutique book and that kind of thing, and you came up with a business idea, and you look at it and you say, man, I think I can make 100 doing that.

Well, I mean, that's kind of a no-brainer then, right? Why would we stay in the mess? If the only thing you can find is 30,000, well, now you've got to think about whether you stay or not. But I think just because it's the most money you've ever made in your life doesn't mean you can't make more. You can make more as likely as you can make less. So get out there and poke around and see what you've got. Options give you power.

And you don't have options yet. All you've got right now is frustrations. So get you some good, solid, well-thought-out, logical options in front of you, and those options will speak to you about whether it's time to leave or not. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. You've heard me talk about ID theft for years and how it's only a matter of time before you become a victim. But I ran across some numbers that even surprised me and shows the real nightmare that people go through when they become a victim. Of the 16 million victims of identity theft last year, yes, 16 million. 26% of them had to borrow money from family or friends. 22% of them lost even more money by taking time off work.

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Chris Hogan joins me this half hour answering your questions. The phone number is 888-825-5225 if you want to talk. Welcome back, Chris. Well, thank you, sir. It's always good to be with you, Dave. All right, let's go to Tyler in Baton Rouge. Hi, Tyler. Welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show.

Hey, Dave. How are you doing? Better than I deserve. Your question for Chris and me. Okay, I'm making anywhere between $80,000 to $100,000 per year. I'll be 27 years old next month, and I plan on having my house paid off within the next three years. Wow. I'm currently saving 25% of my income.

I'm also investing, you know, 15% of my income, so that's right at 40% of my income. Mm-hmm. What percentage of my wealth, after I have my house paid off, which percentage of my wealth should I put towards going into real estate? And what percentage? Because after I pay my house off, I'll be able to invest 40% of my income.

You're doing so good, though. You're doing such a good job. Congratulations. Very well done. Well, thank you, sir. What I would tell you to do is probably slightly adjust what you're doing right now. I would have you saving 15% of your income only into retirement until you get your home paid off and pour everything else on the house until the house is paid off.

Then once that's paid off, then I would jack my retirement savings on up and saving some of your other money towards purchasing real estate with cash. And there's not really a percentage. I mean, I can't think you can have too much paid for real estate. Would that be a bad thing? Absolutely not. I was just wondering, like, what would you personally recommend, you know, as far as, like, okay, if you have a net worth of $1.2 million,

like what percentage would you recommend tied up in real estate versus mutual funds? Yeah, and looking at this, this is Chris. Are you in love with the idea of real estate, or are you interested in it? Absolutely. I mean, I love the idea of commercial real estate, really, where I'm at. There's a lot of areas that are developing, and when I get to where I need to be, there will be a lot of opportunity for me to invest. Right.

Well, I agree with Dave. I don't think there's a set percentage. But talking about commercial real estate, you're talking about a bigger dollar amount. So it's going to take a little bit of time because, as you can imagine, with Dave and I, if you're going into real estate, it needs to be cash only. Absolutely. Absolutely. Right. So being diversified, you have in your 401K, you have in some commercial real estate building or two.

I don't see an issue with that at all, Tyler. I just think you have to be careful. You know, don't let any deal that involves debt be something you're interested in. So, Tyler, what I would do, what I have done and what you're going to be in a position to do when your house is paid off is just max out the 401k and max out a Roth IRA. And if that's all you do other than save up and pay cash for real estate, save up and pay cash for real estate, and you've got all your money tied up, basically, I mean, you might end up 80% real estate. If you do that, that's going to be fine as long as it's all paid for. You chose real estate over the stock market, and there's nothing wrong with that. You like real estate. If you do that, that's going to be fine as long as it's all paid for. You chose real estate over the stock market, and there's nothing wrong with that. Do you like real estate?

Oddly enough, my personal net worth is heavy in real estate because I love real estate, number one. But number two, I stole a bunch of it in 2008, and it shot way up in value. And so that value change has been so dramatic versus what I paid for it, number one, and versus what the stock market's done that my personal net worth is heavy real estate, way heavy. But I'm fine with that. You don't want to be completely illiquid and have no cash and no investments. So I've still got all my retirement stuff, which I'm 30 years or 40 years ahead of you. So it's millions and millions of dollars is tied up in mutual funds in my retirement stuff.

But it's still a fairly small percentage of my overall net worth. And I'm fine with that, as long as you're paying cash. Now, Dave, I have never known you to steal anything in your life. So what do you mean in 2008 you were able to steal some real estate? Well, I mean, I got the best possible deal on it. We got, you know, we were buying stuff at 25 cents on the dollar from these banks that were the stuff, foreclosure stuff that they'd gotten back in the real estate crash. When the crash happened, it was one of the best things that ever happened to me financially. I remember hearing you talk about that.

I remember when everyone else was running around like chicken little everybody else was freaking out and i remember you talk with us in staff meeting and you said you had this moment of clarity that regardless of what the market was doing there was one thing that wasn't in your life and that's debt you didn't have that risk and so you were calm well and i had a pile of cash at the time that's right and um and i just dumped i mean i dumped into real estate because it was a bargain it was on sale and um bought and i haven't bought a whole lot since then other than this building we're building which is i've dumped a bunch of money into that but um but it's just you have this sense of calmness but it also causes you you know once you get past millionaire status where you've done this study with millionaires, and I was, at that point, I was a multi-millionaire

already, but once you get past that, what happens is you are in a position to super accelerate wealth building without any risk. And that's what happened there, because I was sitting on, you know, we're just using the number, I'm making the number up, but just say I was sitting on $10 million cash and I bought $100 million worth of real estate for that. Yes. That's super accelerated. Yes. But it's because I had done the stuff to that point that puts you in a position to take advantage of a market swing. Right. And Dave, I'm going to talk about this on the Chris Hogan show coming up, but I've got a lot of people asking about investing in real estate. I know you are a real estate fanatic.

You are. It is your life. That's what you started in this game with. How do you know the difference between when you're interested and when you love it? You know, is real estate something that's for everybody? No, it's definitely not for everybody. You got to be able to deal with the tenants. You know, whether it's residential or commercial, you got to be able to deal with the tenants

and uh there's a hassle factor to real estate that you don't have with mutual funds mutual funds you go the mailbox and open the envelope right real estate's not that way you real estate involves work i mean my son-in-law rachel's husband winston runs all our real estate we got a full-time property management firm back here so um you know you gotta have you got there's a hassle factor associated with it and even with winston running everything i so um you know you gotta have you got there's a hassle factor associated with it and even with lincoln running everything i'm still you know he still brings me decisions to make right uh regarding real estate that you don't have that with mutual funds but i make more money on real estate than i'm doing mutual funds too okay so would your advice be for someone to start with one

residential property yeah pay cash cash yeah pay cash for it and and keep that for a year or two to see how you like it? Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And see if you can handle the hassle factor. Right. But there are people that every little thing with a tenant is a drama. Every little piece of heat and air system going out is a stress. Right, right. And if you just look at it as a transaction and you get to the point you've done it, I've done it so long that it's an easy thing.

And again, like you said, I grew up in the business. I love the business. that it's an easy thing and again like you said i grew up in the business i love the business and but it's not for everybody that's right if you don't want the hassle or the there's extra stress and extra hassle but there's extra money right well and we had a couple in here yesterday uh that were in town uh coming out of idaho and they her sister was living in their home, renting from them. And that's exactly, they had the headache and heartache. Yeah, because they had a tenant that they couldn't evict. That's exactly right.

Or they emotionally couldn't or relationally couldn't or whatever. Right. And so that's not an investment at that point. That's just charity. Yeah. Well, and the blessing for them was that it didn't have to be as much of an irritation because they were debt-free. Yeah. You know, the property was paid for. Yeah, but be as much of an irritation because they were debt-free. Yeah. You know, the property was paid for.

Yeah, but it's still charity. It is. Oh, it is. It's no longer an investment at that point. You're just, I bought this property. I mean, I've got a friend who has a condo that he paid for, and he just uses it to put missionaries up when they come to town. That's cool. You know, he doesn't, it's not an, the investment, only investment part of it is it'll go up in value, but he's making no cash on the thing right now.

I mean, he pays the HOA fee, pays the electric bill and all that but it just uses it he just keeps one of his condos open as a donation and that's fine if that's what you want to do with it there's nothing wrong with that idea but that's what that couple was facing yes it really was one more on this topic investing in land is this this smart? Just getting dirt? It's probably the worst investment because it doesn't create any income. Right. You want income-producing property. It's fun. I've got a big farm, but it's just because I want to help hold the earth together.

Somebody's got to own that piece of dirt. But it's not really – it doesn't make me any money. I have to pay taxes on it every year. I've got to, you know, take care of the fences. It costs money to own it. And it doesn't go up in value generally as fast as other properties do. Okay. Very good.

In general, it doesn't. Good discussion. Chris Hogan's with us this hour. We're taking your calls about investing and about money, as always. And Ramsey personality Chris Hogan here. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. there's a lot of confusion out there on the idea of what a net worth is, isn't there, Chris Hogan? Yes, there is, Dave. And we've got to clarify it for people.

So let's get this right, right now. To understand your net worth, you take what you own minus what you owe. Now, by own, what I'm talking about is your investments, your home if it's paid off. You might have some vehicles. Who knows what else you've got? But all of those things together, minus what you owe on equals your net worth. And it's so important to know this because you need to know where you are right now as you begin your journey. You see, Dave, I'm weird, just like you.

I've got this vision that I want to create more millionaires in the United States because the American dream is alive and available. Absolutely. And if people can understand where they are and understand that process and that drive and those decisions, we can get there. So we've got a free tool to help them. Yes. It's called the Net Worth Calculator. Now, you all know me. I love giving away free tools.

I want people to be informed. And this is real quick and easy. It's about five or six questions you'll answer. It'll give you an understanding of where you stand right now today. Now, understand, where you are right now doesn't have to be where you end up. But we've got to know. We've got to keep score. So I want you to go to ChrisHogan360.com slash net worth.

Or you can even text in, Dave. I'm hit now. You can text the word Hogan to 33789, and you can do your net worth calculator right now here in about a few minutes. We turned your name into a thing. Text the word Hogan to 33789. Michael's in Fargo with the perfect question for Chris Hogan. Hey, Michael, how are you?

I'm great. How are you, Dave? Better than I deserve. Your question for Chris. Well, I have a question. I'm looking down the line for retirement funds. I have three kids. I'm turning 36. How do I save up $1 million? That's all I want for retirement.

Michael, that is a fantastic question, and you've got three kids. That means you've got three motivators, right? How old are your kids? They are four, two, and about seven months old. Love it. Congratulations. You are busy, two, and about seven months old. Love it. Congratulations. You are busy. I can tell you this.

I can tell you. We did the largest study ever done on millionaires, Michael. We talked to over 10,000 of them. The number one thing that they use to help build wealth and to help get them there. Are you ready for it? I'm ready. They're 401K. And Roth IRAs.

And Roth IRAs. So these things, there's not a magic formula, but using those things, being consistent month in and month out, Michael, follow the baby steps that Dave's been telling you about for years. You get to that investing 15%, use an investment professional, and use that 401k, and my friend, you can get there. Now, if you were to save, how old are you now, you said? I'm turning 36 next week, Dave. Wow. What's your household income?

My household income is about $99,000 a year. Very cool. Very cool. And, well, if you're out, once you get out of debt and you have your emergency fund in place and you follow the baby steps, if you start investing 15% of your income into retirement, that's $15,000 a year from age 40 to age, say, 70 as an example, that would probably be about $6 million, roughly, somewhere in there. And so you're going to be just fine. And by the way, a million is not enough. It's okay to get started with that.

That's a good target to have. But with the kind of money you make, you should be a multimillionaire when you get to retirement. Besides that, you're not only going to make $99 for the next 40 years. You're going to make more than that. Your income is going to go up as you go along. You know what? That's something I've heard you talk about, and I need to make sure I emphasize that to people. As your income goes up, you want to be careful that lifestyle doesn't go all the way up, that you stay in control.

Yeah. Yeah, and that's why we keep a percentage on investing, 15% of your income, no matter what your income is. And if you do that from age 36 to age 66, say 30 years, and as your income goes up, if you're investing solidly in good mutual funds, and as you said, this is the number one thing we found. Number one. It's kind of boring.

It really is. There's nothing sexy about it. Number one. It's kind of boring. It really is. There's nothing sexy about it. No, I was expecting something, Dave. Like some kind of, you know, magic genie in a bottle or something. Yeah. Just tell me something. And it wasn't. It's being consistent.

And also, in the book, Everyday Millionaires, I talk about the attributes of these millionaires that we studied. And it's amazing. Dave, consistency, intentionality with their money, hardworking. You know, these are people that are goal oriented. Did not inherit their money. No, didn't.

And they didn't strike it lucky. And they didn't go to Ivy League school. We're talking about regular everyday people that have done this. And it won't be an accident when you win, my friends. It just won't be. But what we have to do

is set our sight and start to make some different decisions. And you know what, Dave, around this time of the year won't be. But what we have to do is set our sight and start to make some different decisions. And you know what, Dave? Around this time of the year, you know the other thing we got to do? We got to keep our guard up. Yeah. I was in the store the other day doing some shopping for the boys and a lady said, Sir, would you like our store credit card?

And I just looked at her and I said, No, ma'am. And she stopped and she moved on. But I grabbed a little pamphlet, Dave, and was looking at it. And it's highlighting all the benefits you get, the rewards. And it said, you deserve more. And I thought, wow. You deserve to be in debt more. That's exactly right.

Or you need to give more of your money to them. You deserve to give us more of your money. Yeah. And I thought, you know what? We got to let people know. You got to keep your guard up. You do. You really do.

I don't think Santa Claus likes that. I don't think that's cool at all. No, it's not. I'm going to address it on my show, too, next week when I get on there. I'm going to talk about that. That fine print that nobody looks at. I'm going to tell you the truth about it. The Chris Hogan Show.

Just go to chrishogan360.com and you can definitely figure out how to tune in. So Joanna is on the Ramsey Baby Steps Facebook community group, and she says, I've reached Baby Step 4, putting 15% of my income away. I think I'm ready to start investing

in a Roth IRA for retirement. Does anyone even know where to start? And of course, the answer to that is to sit down with somebody and get some help, right? That's right. Absolutely. And Dave, you know, we've vetted people all across the country. We've got smart investor pros that are available to you. And all you have to do is plug in your zip code and you can find people in your area. Have that conversation. And with Roth, again, ladies and gentlemen, when you hear that word Roth, I want you to get tingly. I know I do because you're talking about tax-free money. See, because you're using after-tax dollars, this money is going to grow in the Roth IRA tax-free. You've already paid the taxes on it. And so right now you've got an opportunity to do up to $5,500 if you're below age 50. And in 2019,

they're going to bump it up, Dave, $500 extra. So it's going to go to $6,000. So you've got a great opportunity. Cool. There we go. All right. Ding, ding. And that's just around the corner.

It is just around the corner. It's cool. Yeah. So just go to DaveRamsey.com or ChrisHogan360.com. Click SmartVestor. And you fill in your information. It drops down a list of the SmartVestor pros in your area, Joanna. And then you sit down.

You pick one, the one you want to talk to, the one you want to meet with a couple of them, interview them if you want to. That's fine. But they're people that our team has gone through. And you're going to get advice that sounds like Chris Hogan or Dave Ramsey. And you're going to meet with someone that is not trying to twist your arm or be slimy and sell you something, but instead has the heart of a teacher. Because you and I both know the financial world, Chris. A high percentage of the folks in the financial world are salesmen. There's only a

small percentage that are teachers, and teachers are who you want in your corner. No, you're absolutely right, Dave. The people that will look you in the eye and will listen to you. They want to understand what it is you're trying to accomplish before they start telling you what you need to do. I want people to talk with me, not at me. And the SmartVestor Pros, that's what they're going to do. You're going to feel so much better. And Dave, a lady told me, she goes, Chris, I finally went in and met with the SmartVestor Pro. She goes, I was scared.

I said, well, why were you scared? She said, I thought I was going into the principal's office. I thought I was going in to have somebody tell me about what I haven't done and all this. She goes, I was expecting judgment, but I got hope. And I was like, yes, ma'am, that's exactly the truth. They're not there to judge you. They're there to help you.

So don't resist or stand back. Get in there and let somebody look at what you have. Little tweaks can lead to big gains. We just need to get the right insight. Investment's not DIY. You don't do it yourself i don't work on my own car anymore it's too complicated i used to do that you know when i was a broke redneck and cars were simpler both but uh i can't work on them now they're too

complicated and i would break something and you know you don't if i'm not even gonna work on a car as cheap as that is compared to your investments which is millions of dollars potentially you want somebody in your corner to help coach you through this. And we did find a high correlation, not as high as I thought we were going to see with the millionaires in the study, but we found the vast percentage of them, the larger percentage, do use somebody in their corner to coach them. A lot of them do DIY it, though. Right, and they do. I mean, I think that number was hovering around 80, 89%.

We're using an investment professional. So, again, it's not an accident. Winning's not an accident. Get professionals on your side, look at your game plan, and make the right decisions. So, check out. If you haven't got the Everyday Millionaires book yet, it's coming out the first week of January. We'll ship it to you. You can go ahead and buy it now, and we're going to throw in about $50 worth of extra stuff.

You're going to love it. Chris Hogan, thanks for dropping by. Thank you for having me, Dave. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Hey, guys. This is Blake Thompson, Chief Production Officer for The Dave Ramsey Show. This hour's up, but you'll find more on our YouTube channel, where we have over 6 million YouTube views each month. You can find debt-free screens, millionaire hour clips, Dave rants, and so much more.

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