The Ramsey Show - App - Is It Still Okay for Me To Retire Early? (Hour 3)

Episode Date: November 17, 2023

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. I am Jade Warshaw. I am joined by George Campbell and the two of us will be your hosts for today. Give us a call. The number is 888-825-5225. Those phone lines are open. Christian will screen your call and we will talk to you about what's going on in your life. And just to be clear, this is a money show, but it intersects with so many things in your life, your career, your marriage, your relationships. So many issues are affected with your money. And so we understand that. So give us a call. We'd be happy to talk with you about that. Let's go straight to the phone lines where we've got Joe in Jacksonville, Florida. What's going on, Joe? Hey, I was calling in. I was wondering

how do I go about dating when I come from an affluent family? Many girls' parents will see me as a big dollar sign instead of seeing me for who I am. And I was wondering what your thoughts are because I face that problem with many families. How do they know? That's what I was going to say. Usually when you meet a girl's parents, they ask you what your parents do for work, which is a very normal thing to ask somebody.

And then when you tell them, you come from it. Can we ask you what do your parents do for work? Well, it's more of my family. I have multiple cardiologists in my family between my cousins and everyone. Okay. And that's your leading talking point when you're on a date? I don't understand how your whole family comes up in this situation. Well, not when you're on a date, but when the girl brings you around her parents and what's your okay so what's your family's net worth like just your immediate family what's the net worth of your parents

um it's substantial 10 million 20 million uh yes okay so i would not have garnered that just from you talking to me i would have thought oh they're doctors that's great um if if if i said to you joe what do your parents do and you said oh they're in the medical field and i said really uh well what do they do in the medical field if you said oh my dad's a heart surgeon and my mom's a anesthesiologist real talk i would be like okay they got some coin. Like I would just derive that. But I don't think that I would even think to ask further. I wouldn't go, really?

So how has that calculated? So how are they getting to the point of knowing? Does your family have a name that people recognize in the community? That is correct. Yes. In Jacksonville, Florida. Okay. So is there a name on a hospital or something like that?

Yes, yes, it is. I see, okay. So it's much more obvious than you having to bring it up and talk about it. Exactly, that's correct. What does the family have to do with it? What is your fear going into this? They see you as a dollar sign. What does that mean to you?

Well, it just really worries me because i have to wonder what they're telling what you know the girl's parents are going to tell their daughter when i'm not around um you know what um like don't let him go make sure you do you know i get it i get it taking more interest in me than other other people yeah, I think you're going to need some discernment as you date to just go, is her heart in it? Would she have married me if my family was broke? Is that really a big factor? How are you finding these dates currently?

Well, you know, just around town and church, things like that. You know, I try to stay off the internet, but, you know, that's kind of this day and age. Yeah. So the people in your church, um, they must know your family. Yes. Yes, that's correct. So there's part of this that there's part of this that could be very real. And there's part of this that could be perceived, right? Because, uh, if I go back, if I go to my home church, people know, Oh, Jade, she works for Ramsey. She's on the Ramsey show. Like she has this cool job, but it doesn't really change.

I could talk myself into thinking they're going to see me different and they're going to talk to me different, but it doesn't really change anything because they've been knowing me for 10 years, however long I've been at the church. So is there a piece of this that you're just worried about it or have you seen it play out and actually be a reality? There was an instance where I was talking to a girl at a wedding that I'd met and the father wanted to get his daughter and leave the wedding. Everybody was leaving. And he asked the groom what my name was. And he told the father my name and the father said, okay, well, we'll just wait around and give them a minute to talk to each other weird i mean that's weird but that's also like i feel like there is you should

expect for there to be some like jerk moves or you know dumb people are going to have dumb moments for sure but i definitely don't want that to talk you out of dating a really nice girl and because here's the thing you're whether wealthy or, you're going to go down the line with plenty of girls saying, I liked her. And then it's not going to work out. Regardless of having wealth, you might get to the point of thinking this is the one and then it doesn't work out. I think that that's happened to everybody. Right. And so I think that you're going to know pretty early in whether someone has ulterior motives or not. And maybe that's you developing kind of your own spidey sense or a little sneaky screening tests that

you do when you're talking to people. Or there's a little checklist of red flags that you look for when they're talking to you. Are they talking about money in a way that you think is a red flag? Are they asking you more questions about your family than they're asking about you, right? I think it's you going, okay, what is it that I need to be looking for when I'm going on dates? Also, who is it, like, if somebody is setting me up, who do I trust to say, oh, I have a friend, you know, they'll be, you know, because I do think that um I think that the circle of people that you get in is really important because people know

each other right and it's like at my church the folks that I roll with at my church they know people and I know that the people they know are good people and then I since those people are good it's like it's almost like birds of a feather flocking together. True. And so I would probably just decide like, hey, I don't really, there's certain people that if they say, hey, I have somebody I'm going to set you up on a date with, I'm like, okay, no, thank you. You know? Yeah. I also wonder if he got out of his own circle, Joe, would that help?

Because they don't know you from Adam at that point. That's also good. You know, to where they're seeking you out for the right reasons. And my worry is that it's going to be more paranoia in your head of like, oh gosh, they're trying to get up the family's money and they don't really care about me. And that's what I don't want you to have. I would just walk into it and just be Joe and take things slow, ask the right questions, you know, establish boundaries, be transparent. That's the best thing you can do in these situations and over time you'll vibe it out and you go no that's a good family those are good parents they're not out my money and that that's always going to be a factor though you know yeah

rachel ramsey when she was in college and met winston winston was like dave who's that guy yeah and so that was a big factor of there was no weirdness there yeah i think honestly think, honestly, I think a lot of it could be in his head right now. He had that one moment that kind of freaked him out, and that can definitely make you gun shy. But my guess is most people are not looking at, most people probably aren't making that connection. They're just like, oh, your last name is Jude. That's great.

I'm not thinking St. Jude. It must be them. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, you guys. Health insurance costs are only moving one way, and that way isn't down. And if higher costs aren't enough, the wait times to see your doctor are longer, and it's harder than ever to get anything approved through the bureaucracy. So if you feel like the system is working against you, try a biblically-based alternative to health insurance, Christian Healthcare Ministries. CHM is a health cost-sharing ministry that's helped hundreds of thousands of

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It's very, very cool. And you're recording the audio book as well, George. That's awesome. Yeah, I just wrapped it. The team's editing it right now, and we're doing an enhanced audio book. So it's got some music transitions. We're weaving in some conversations and phone calls and things we've done to just spice it up for the listener. I love that.

That's very, very cool. I try to break the mold, Jade. You know, I'm excited for that because I've heard your audio on a couple of different projects. Remember when you did the fine print? Oh, yeah. That was one of my favorites, that narrative. You've got a good voice. Similar narrative vibe.

Thank you. I appreciate that. You've got a good voice for that. And you have a new book, Money's Not a Math Problem. I do. It just launched this week. I do. On pre-sale, and it's coming out in December. So I a good voice for that. And you have a new book, Money's Not a Math Problem. I do. That just launched this week. I do. On pre-sale and it's coming out in December.

So I'm very excited for you. You can check out all of those books at ramsaysolutions.com slash store. And of course, we bribe you with some goodies for buying it early, including with mine, the free audio book and ebook. Now that you told me it's going to be like zhuzhed up, I'm kind of- You're jealous? You can, there's still time to zhuzh. Maybe a little bit.

I do my own sound effects. That's pretty good. Pew, pew, pew. Boing, oing, oing, oing, oing. That's pretty good. Let's go to Elaine. Did I say that right? Elaine in Phoenix, Arizona. She spells it differently.

What's going on, Elaine? So I was planning on retiring next year at 45. I'm 44 now. Had a few financial setbacks over the last two years and just kind of wanted to double check my math that it still makes sense to leave my nine to five. So, wow. Okay. Leaving the nine to five. Can I ask a question? Are we leaving the nine to five to do something else or you're just like, I am done using my energy to do any sort of work? I'm the type of person I'll always do something, whether that is going to be something that's super monetarily rewarding is sort of to be determined.

Okay. So how much do you have in your nest egg? So I have about $500,000 in various retirement accounts and then some investment accounts. I also have about $250,000 that's coming to me from the sale of an old primary residence that will be added to that. I own my home, so I don't have a mortgage. I own my car. I don't have a car payment. I don't have any significant sources of debt other than the fact that I have a child who is, you know, a huge money pit. Love him, but huge money pit.

What's your personal home worth? $640,000. Okay. And you live in Arizona. Okay. So what's your game plan? Let's say you retire next year. What is your game plan and why do you feel like it's now set back? So I went through a pretty nasty divorce last year. It cost about $180,000 over the two years that we were in court. And then I got laid off last year as well. So I had about six months of no income. And so really, I just want to spend some time and focus on my kid and watch him grow up. And I had some health complications as well.

So just slow down so that I can be here long term for him. Okay. And then what's your plan financially? Let's say you retire next year. What is the game plan as far as using these retirement accounts and the cash that you have to sustain yourself? Because what if, let's say you live to 95, that's a 50-year retirement. What's our plan to not run out of money? So, I will not live to 95. Our DNA is terrible, but... Hey, come on, Elaine. Don't say that. Don't say that. They're doing... God will now spite you by making you live to 100. Well, what percentage were you planning to pull off of this?

So I've been running various retirement calculators and basically drawing down $45,000 a year until I retire. And you're working alone or are you working with a professional? I'm working alone. I would strongly, strongly, strongly, strongly advise you to get with a professional? I'm working alone. I would strongly, strongly, strongly, strongly advise you to get with a professional. Matter of fact, I'd love if, Christian, can you set her up with one of our SmartVestor pros, set her up with that information so you can find a pro in your area? Because I want you to sit down with somebody who's going to run these numbers with you every

single possible way they can run them and actually be able to give you a number that has been tested to say, hey, here's realistically what you could do and hopefully never touch the principle of this. And because I'm sure I think that a number does exist for that, but I just don't want it to be you doing some quick calculations based on something you saw on the internet. And I'm not trying to be ugly. I'm just saying I want to make sure that this is the right move. But bigger than that, I do think that before you pull the trigger on this, I think you need to know what's next on the corner for how you're using your time. And I know you have a kid and kids take up a lot of time. But as far as productivity and how you want to spend your days and what

you do with your very, very useful to the world skills. Okay. And I think my hope is that that will come once I'm able to sort of focus and rest a little bit. That will, my purpose will become clear. What if you called this, hey, I'm going to take a year. I'm going to take one year versus I'm going to retire retire early that's a very different decision to make that i think would give me some peace if i'm in your shoes i got suckered back into going to work i tried that um i was going to take a year off and i made it four months and somebody pulled me back in what kind of work did you do i'm in software um so i do like software architecture do you love that work i used to i hate it now okay so much because you just did the most for so for you just i've been doing this

since i was 20 years old i've been doing this my whole professional life and it's just it's the same problems every day um i just want to solve a different problem, I guess. What would it, I'm just, we're just talking at this point. I'm not, what would just a career shift look like for you to be like, you know what? I did that. I don't want to be in software anymore. I want to, you know, sew blankets, like whatever, whatever it is that you've just decided. This is what, you know what I'm saying?

Like taking the time to just spitball things. Matter of fact, Christian, make sure she gets, Ken's get clear assessment and some of those goodies, maybe even paycheck to purpose. Cause here's my thing, Elaine. I really don't want you stepping out into this to nothing else. I want you to know, like, even if you called and said, hey, I'm going to retire early.

My church really needs somebody to lead this initiative and it's going to give me the time. That's what I want to focus. Like, I never heard something that you're stepping into. And I'm not going to lie. That bothers me a little bit. OK, I mean, I guess I'm stepping into being present for my kid because I can't be right now. I work so many hours. Yeah.

And I know that only lasts for another probably 10 years until he hates me and lives in his room and never speaks to me again. But... How old is your kid? How old?

He's only four. Okay. Look, I respect that. I'm not mad at that. Being a stay-at-home mom is a full-time job, so I'm not going to dispute that one bit.

So, look, get with somebody, talk with them, make sure to run the numbers and see what it really will take. And look, I'm proud of you. I'm not mad at all. I'm super proud. It's not every day, George, that someone calls and says. Yeah. This is an impressive situation. She's 44, has $1.4 million net worth. That's just what the number she threw out. And realistically, she could make these numbers work for a long time, but I do want to make sure that it's invested the right way that will help this money sustain itself for a long period of time. Now, 50 years, I don't know. I think we may have to go back to work eventually. We've seen that from the, this is fire. Financial

independence, retire early. And we've seen some members of that community go, oh gosh, I retired at 34 and we had $700,000 and now we're running out. And also've seen some members of that community go, oh gosh, I retired at 34 and we had a, you know, $700,000 and now we're running out. And also I need to save for junior's college and I don't have an income. And so they're starting to get panicked and worried, inflation, housing, everything's going up over time. So we have to be cognizant of what the next 10, 20, 30 years could look like. I read an article recently and don't quote me on this because i literally skimmed the article but it was one of the founders of fire i think went back to work for those very reasons it was like hey i got kids going in college and this is not necessarily what it was cracked up to be don't quote me on that but go see if you can find that article because i do remember

reading it thinking wow that's interesting but for me the bigger piece of it george is um being productive with now don't get me wrong this is not towards elaine if elaine is like i have a four-year-old now i'm gonna stay with my four-year-old that is a full-time job she's like you know what life is more important than just work i want to watch my kid grow up i think it's a very noble thing to do especially after what she's been through now as a single mom going through a messy divorce i think she does need some time to grieve. Yes. But do we need to call it quits and never work again? I don't know that that's the solution. Right. I mean, based on her job alone and based on the fact of how in demand she was for her job, she has a major contribution just

with her mind. It doesn't have to be software, but she's got something that she can do, you know, once her kid goes to college, like she said, when he's ready to lock himself in his room. Done. So I'm proud of you, Elaine. Hear us say very, very, very good job. Impressive. This is The Ramsey Show. You're listening to The Ramsey Show. I am Jade warshaw george camel is sitting to my right and we are your host for the day give us a call we'll talk about your life and your money or the things that are affecting you regarding your life and your money the number is 888-825-5225 give us a call and we will help you sort it out let's go straight to the phone lines where we have Stuart in Billings, Montana. What's going on, Stuart? Hey there. Thanks for taking my call. I'm kind of at a crossroads right now in my life. I just had to put my two weeks in for my current job. I've been kind of

miserable there in insurance. And I've been looking into taking an online boot camp to start a new career in data science or data analytics. But part of the problem is that that obviously has a tuition cost incurred. And I have existing student loan debt for my undergraduate degree and some other miscellaneous credit card debt that I've been working on. How much? Grand total is just close, just shy of $60,000. I've got $35,000 in student loans and the remaining in credit cards and other personal loan debt. Okay. So what would it cost to do this data science degree or certification?

The boot camp, I think, roughly is $9,700 if it's paid in full. There's several different programs out there that have a variety of costs. It ranges, I'd say, somewhere between $8,000 and $15,000 depending on the program. But the one I'm looking at in particular, they claim to have a 90% job placement rate and 100% money back guarantee if you don't find a job within the first six months after completion. And you just pay the flat rate? It's not like, hey, this is over the course of three months and you pay this this month and this month. It's just a flat. The flat cost, if you pay in full, is $9,700 for the one I'm interested in.

Otherwise, you can finance it or make it an installment. No, we don't want to do that. How long is the boot camp? It's 16 weeks. 16-week boot camp. And during the time of the 16-week boot camp, you're not able to work or do anything else. Are you going on location somewhere? Is it online? How does it work? It's online. They say the average workload is 20 to 25 hours. It's self-paced. So you can actually work full time. So I could theoretically go find any other job and work full time in the day and then do this at night. Sounds like you would need to. How are you going to pay for the bills?

Yeah. Um, that's a great question. I was thinking about trying to find a different full time job and also working part time on the side, but I, I'm also trying to figure out how I can make all that happen. Um, but I think the bigger concern was that I just wasn't, um, going very far in the current career I was in and needed to find something that I could actually enjoy going to work to do. And I think something in this data science field would be right up my alley. It's just a matter of how do I get there.

How old are you? I'm 28. Have you, I like how you're thinking in the way of you're like, I started this job and I'm not going anywhere. I don't enjoy it. I think I might enjoy this. I'd like for you to get a little bit more clarity on why you think you might enjoy it before you invest $9716 weeks. And maybe that looks like finding somebody who does it and interviewing them, just digging into it a little bit more. Like, can I shadow you for it? Like, what does your job look like? And really dig into it.

We're going to give you Ken's Get Clear assessment because I really want to make sure that this really is the right field for you. But let's put that on pause for a quick moment because what I really think, no matter what you decide to do, if you're like, no, Jade, after further research, I know 100% I want to do this.

I think that's great. But I do think that you'll feel better about it if we can start cleaning up this initial debt in the process or first. So what would it look like for you to find a job that pays what you were making or more? That's a great question. I mean, for context, I was netting $2,700 a month after taxes and deductions and had full healthcare coverage and a matching 401k. So it's hard to find something exactly like that right now, at least.

And right now you have no income? No, I've still about two and a half weeks left of working there. I just put in my notice. And that's just because you could not work another day. You were like, I'm fed up with this? That and some other circumstances that I can't really get into, but it's just... Like ethical stuff? It wasn't a great...

Yeah, not from my own side of things, just wasn't enjoying what I saw on the inside. And I just was having a hard time with my mental health getting through the days. And I just knew that this was the right choice to move on to something different. What's your undergrad in? Political science. Political science? Okay. Yeah.

What I would do if I were you is I would be focused right now. I would be getting on Glassdoor. I'd be getting on everything, and I'd be looking for a job that seems like something that you could stomach or enjoy for the next two years, year and a half. Sure. Where you're making, I want you to get to 40,000, right? Yeah. Okay. And as much as you can, as much as you can, but I want you to matching what you were making before. And I want you to get this debt cleaned up. And in the meantime, if you can't land that full-time job, we got to get enough side hustles to create $2,700 in take-home pay. And that might mean delivering people, packages, food, Instacart, Uber Eats, DoorDash, Uber Lyft,

you name it, in order to bring in enough income to sustain your life right now until you land that next job. But I'm with Jade. I would pause on this. I love this dream of doing data science, but let's pause. Let's find something sustainable. Let's clean up some of this debt, and then we can cash flow this $10,000 program and hopefully increase our income and do something we love. Very, very good. Thanks for the call, Stuart. That was not easy, but I think he needs to clean up his mess first. Let's go straight to Rob in Dallas, Texas. What's going on, Rob? Hi, good afternoon. Thanks for taking my call.

No problem. I'll start by saying I'm on baby step four, five, and six, and I've been working through a question with my SmartRester Pro. We have about $12,000 that I got as a bonus at work to invest towards potentially a 529, which I've already invested in. I'll start with my question. Based on Ramsey principles, why is the 529 a better idea than prepaid college? And I have some specifics for kind of our scenario. Well, for me, the reason

I like a 529 is because there's no limit on how much you can contribute to it. So for me, that's great. And there's not an income limit of what you can or can't make in order to contribute to it. So I just think it's a little bit free, freer in that sense. And with the 529, you don't want the prepaid. You want something where you're able to choose the investments and the investments are growing. And something I like about the 529 is they're state specific, but you don't have to choose the one that's in your state. So you can literally work with somebody to find one that has the perks that make the most sense for you. So I just feel in general, there's a little bit more freedom in it. but that being said there's not a right or wrong

answer in your case if you're wanting to contribute more um than what a um contribute more a 529 would be good for you more than what's driving you to the prepaid option well thank you for asking. So I have two kids and I have 70K saved for my oldest child and 34 in a 529 in good growth stock mutual funds. the younger one would cost 162k when they turn 18 and 144k when they uh the older one turns 18 right now i can take 66k and hand that to the state of texas and buy four years of prepaid tuition i wouldn't do the prepaid option. I would do something where you're able to choose the funds that are invested in and have a little bit more control. You're going to get more bang for your buck with that for sure. And there's a lot of restrictions with these prepaid plans that make them not as great deals. You think you can't pay for books, housing's off the table. There's some restrictions on what schools you can go to.

I don't think you can transfer it in as many cases, right? As you would with the... Yeah, I would look into all the fine print on these, but we don't suggest a prepaid plan. I'd stick with the 529. And 162 is a lot. Let's try to get some scholarships, grants, and maybe choose a more affordable school. I love that. This is The Ramsey Show. This is The Ramsey Show.

Thank you for listening. I am Jade Warshaw, your host. This is George Campbell sitting right. Thank you for listening. I am Jade Warshaw, your host. This is George Campbell sitting right next to me, your other host for the remainder of the show today. Give us a call. The phone lines are still open. The number is 888-825-5225. Our scripture and quote of the day,

each one of you should test their own actions. They can take pride in themselves alone without comparing themselves to someone else. For each one should carry their own load. That's Galatians 6 verse 4 through 5. Freddie Mercury, lead singer of one of the greatest bands, I must say, Queen, and on my top list of best male vocalists. Fight me if you want to. 100%. He said, someone will always be prettier. Someone will always be smarter. Someone will always be younger,

but they will never be you. Come on, somebody. That's what I'm talking about. That's a word. That's a word. That is. Ooh, love that. I had to let that marinate for just a moment.

That was good. All right, let's go to TJ. He's in Philadelphia, PA. What's going on, TJ? Hi, I'm fine. Thank you for taking my call. You're welcome. Thanks for calling. How can we help? So we are just now starting Baby Step 2. I've been learning about the Ramsey process, and we are in a bad place from stupid mistakes. We're just now starting Baby Step 2. Okay.

I have all the numbers for you, but the question is, my husband is starting to work overtime and is also working a second job, and he's worried about missing basically the lives of our two little kids for working so much for the next three years. Yeah. Look, that's a real concern that people have. And it's one of those things where you've kind of got to weigh both sides of it and find the right balance in the middle because your family is extremely important. Having time with them is extremely important.

And getting out of debt is important. And setting them up by way of setting yourself up for the future is extremely important. So let's lay out these numbers and then let's see if we can help you strike the right balance in getting this thing done. Fair enough? Okay. Yes. So what are the numbers? What's the debt?

Okay. So, like I said, we're trying to turn over a new leaf here. We have IRS debt. We have 2023 taxes that we procrastinated on that we need to save up for $5,000 of that. Okay. We have my student loans for $6,500. Okay. And then we have back IRS debt for $12,000. And that's the back debt.

Okay. And then student loans for twenty four thousand dollars so okay student loans for six thousand five hundred and six thousand student loans for twenty four thousand yes okay anything else that's all no credit cards no car loans nope no credit cards we we broke those up. Okay. How many kids do you have? Two. Two? And what is your combined income with you and your husband? It's $74,000.

And do both of you work? No, I'm a stay-at-home mom with the children. How old are the kids? Age is two, and my daughter is three months old. Okay. So this is not as bad as i thought it was going to be when you first started talking i was waiting i was waiting for it to be different so maybe that makes you feel a little bit better i don't know maybe it doesn't but um i'm looking at this and automatically i'm going to tell you to put the IRS debt, the back debt first, that $12,000.

Even though we always say do your debts from smallest to largest. In this case, the IRS always comes first. So because you've got the back debt, let's do the $12,000 first and then do the $5,000. So $12,000 IRS debt, $5,000 IRS debt. Then we're going to tackle the $6,500 student loan. Then the $24,000 student loan. So that's the order of importance. Next things next, let's talk about this budget. Are you on a budget? Yeah. I mean, I like to just write down everything on paper, but yeah. We're going to change all that today. We are going to rock your world, TJ,

because we're going to make sure you are set up with the best budgeting tool out there. It's called EveryDollar. And it is going to make your life, you're going to walk away today and you're going to go, oh, thank God. Because tonight you're going to log in and you are going to create your budget. And you're going to know by the time you go to sleep tonight, okay, like after all the bills are paid after all the necessities are paid for this is how much money that we should have left at the end of the month and then i do have a number for you if you'd like what is it um fourteen hundred dollars is what's left and that's with overtime and the second job? Yes. And with beans and rice type of stuff.

Okay. What's your grocery budget? I've combined gas and grocery at $500 for the month. Oh, that's combined gas and groceries? Girl. I'm hoping. Are you guys investing at all right now? Does he have a retirement plan at all?

Well, he's just starting a new job, so he's planning on not investing right away. We want to do that after we get out of debt. Good. I'm just wondering where the $74,000 is going to figure out how we get more than $1,400. Because $1,400 a month, that's less than $17,000 a year, and you're sitting there with $47,000 of debt. And that's too long to sacrifice for four or five years. We need to speed this up. What's your mortgage?

What do you pay every month in your mortgage? $10.90. Okay, that feels reasonable. Yeah. Well, I think, and this is just me, I think that you will benefit from every dollar. And I think you might find areas where some money is slipping through the cracks

where you can go, okay, maybe this is it. Because here's the thing with pen and paper, you're not doing things in real time. You're always having to circle back and go, okay, what was that? Okay, what was that? Where with every dollar, every single day, you're getting that update of this is how much money I can spend. So that's still going to be a very big deal. But what I really want to get to is finding a way with side hustles in order to bring this number up. I want you at least, I mean, what would it look like for you to bring in $500 and your husband to bring in an extra $500 every month? What would that take? Yeah, I thought about getting a job myself, but he said that he didn't really want me to work.

He wanted me to be at home with the kids. That might be true, but if you're not going to work, then he has to do double the work. So is he willing to do double the work? It sounds like he's concerned about that because the whole crux of this call was he doesn't want to miss out on the kid's life. You're at home with them all day. So maybe there's a piece of that that you can take off his plate is what I'm saying. Okay. And I think it sounds like a lot, but George and I talk to people all the time who side hustle, they do Instacart and they're bringing in four and five and six and $800 a month. I even know people now, let me go on record on saying, I don't know if you're supposed

to do this, but I know people who take their kids and do their instacart oh yeah and so they're able to have one car you said you only have one car yes then maybe it's you drop your husband off at work then you go do your instacart shift you go back home the kids take a nap you do another instacart thing and then you go pick him up i think there's a way that you guys can do this where it's not he hasn't seen the kids in three years like we don't want it to be like that we want you to um that was my titanic voice that's pretty good you there's a there is a balance that you can strike here and i do think that it's with you picking up some hours in the day taking the kids with you and because i don't want them to work

24 hours a day you know i want them to be able to see these kids I mean you got two and three months the truth is a lot of people will spend the next 30 years with stress and anxiety and the kids watch their parents grow up fighting about money because they didn't want to sacrifice for those two or three years while they were young and I don't remember anything you know third grade I think is my first memory Jade so truthfully he while he's gonna have the guilt of I'm missing out on all this, the kids are not going to have trauma because dad worked overtime when they were two. And I want to set you guys up for a great financial future for the next

30 years, 40 years. And I'm okay with sacrificing right now to get there. And I think Jade's right. There's a balance. I think you have some skin in the game. And truthfully, being a stay-at-home mom is a choice, and that choice comes with consequences. And one of those is we don't have two incomes. We have to figure something out to clean this up. And this isn't forever. And the good news is, here's what I want to leave you with. The good news is you are the average.

Like, you are the person. The average person is out of debt in two years or less. You're that person. You guys are going to get your income up. You're going to have $2,500 of disposable. I'm throwing at debt money and you're going to make this gone. You're going to pay off $30,000 a year and this is going to be gone in two years. An extra 500 or a thousand bucks changes this whole situation. Dramatically. So hang on the line. We will get you every dollar premium and also sign up for a webinar. Rachel's doing every dollar.com slash budgeting in just a few days. She's going to walk

you through how to use this thing. Ooh, love it. All right, guys, that does it for this hour of the Ramsey show. Remember, you can tell me that you won't do it, but please don't try me by telling me that you can't. With Jesus Christ, all things are possible. This is The Ramsey Show.