The Ramsey Show - App - Is It Time To Make My Side Hustle a Full Time Gig? (Hour 1)

Episode Date: July 11, 2023

Ken Coleman & George Kamal answer your questions and discuss: The right time to buy a house,  When to make your part time gig your full time career,  How much college students should really expect to make, Do Baby Steps Millionaires need life insurance? Working at a dead end job for the benefits, Living off debt Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET Here's an EveryDollar deal just for our listeners: get a 14-day free trial PLUS $15 off your first year of premium. Click the link below and start budgeting today! www.everydollar.com/george Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3cEP4n6 Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6 Interested in advertising on The Ramsey Show? https://ter.li/s64ye3 Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the pods, moving and storage studio, this is The Ramsey Show. It's where we help you win in your life, specifically your money, your work, and your relationships. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by my colleague George Campbell. We're here for you this hour, 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225. We've been called the root beer float of the Ramsey show.

A lot of duets with the Ramsey personalities and Dave. Every day brings a different duet, as I like to say. I like that. So hope you like the root beer flutes. Well, the explanation is two ingredients. This is from a fan review. They said two ingredients that are great on their own, but when brought together are magic.

Yeah, I didn't want to go so far as to that big of a compliment of ourselves. I said it's from a fan. I don't agree, but it's a great kind. I don't know what the beverage we are today, but we are here together and always enjoy being with george we have a lot of fun and so let me set the tone here of course we're gonna take your money questions george is ready to go he's got his bomber jacket on i got my pen he brushed his teeth just moments ago back in the bathroom i ran into him he's freshly brushed and flossed and george can

answer your money questions and and i'll weigh in but i'm here to answer any work questions and we talk about money george you got to think think about work. Your income is your greatest wealth building tool. How can you make more money? How can you enjoy work? If you're feeling stuck, but I'm in the baby steps, can I move? Can I pivot? The answer is yes. I'll take any work-related questions. Maybe you're dealing with a toxic boss or coworker and you just, hey, you know what? I just need to be encouraged. I need to stay the course we'll take some of those questions and uh so we're ready to go we've told you what to expect and uh let's do it terry is up first in tampa florida terry how can we help well let me hit the button that helps to get terry on the line well i'm trying to hit line two but i trust that

ken knows how to hit a button so i think we uh we have it's all good just a technical difficulty there you are terry i'm sorry you're well you're welcome here on the ramsey show what's going on i was calling because i was wondering if it is a good time to buy a house as a woman in her early 20s now what does a woman have to do with, or a woman in her 20s for that matter? That's true. So the real question is, is it a good time to buy a house? And that time has nothing to do with necessarily the time in which we live, but what, George? Your financial situation. Boom.

So talk to us about that. What makes you think you are ready or are not ready? Well, I think I'm ready because I finished paying off my $30,000 in student loans. Awesome. And I have a bit of money saved for my future, future family, all of that. When I say good time, I don't mean due to the market or anything like that. Just as we all know, your 20s can kind of be a little bit of a roller coaster and we don't know what's to come in a few years. So financially, I believe I could buy a house. I just don't know if it's a good time for me. Okay. So you have no debt now. Do you have an emergency fund of three to six months of expenses? Yes. And then beyond that, do you have a down payment saved? Yes. How much do you have saved for the down payment?

I have $45,000. Amazing. Wow. And what's your income? About $130,000 to $150,000. It's commission-based, so it varies. Wow, Terry. You are incredible. What do you do? Real estate. Wow. Way to go, Terry. And you're renting right now?

I'm living rent-free. I've been saving at my parents' house. Incredible. You've been doing all the right things, and I'm so proud of you. Most people that call and they go, like, I'm going to buy a house, they're flat broke. And you are the opposite of that. George, what time is it? I don't know. Is it game time? Is that what you're going with this? I want to know what time it is, George. It may be time to buy a house, Terry. I think it might be. Now you're in Tampa. I don't know what the housing situation is there, but you're in real estate. So you can easily run the

comps and I'll tell you how to do it the right way so that you step into this thing with some peace and wisdom. And that is to stick to a 15-year fixed rate mortgage, which is insane in the real estate world, I know. But it's going to allow you to pay off your mortgage in 15 years or less and allow you to still have money left over to live your life and invest and do all those things for your future. So if you get a 15-year fixed rate mortgage where the payment, the mortgage payment is no more than a quarter of your after-tax income, so after taxes but before your deductibles, insurance, investing, you name it, let that be 25%. And if you do it that way, that might mean, you know, you have a great income. What's your take-home pay now? $10,000 or more?

Take-home pay, yeah, about. Great. So then we go, okay, with a $45,000 down payment, and we want to keep the mortgage payment at around $2,500, how much house can we buy? And let your budget dictate your home price versus what you feel and what you want. And that helps you step into this thing with a lot of peace and wisdom. And then you can start shopping. That sounds awesome. Good plan. Terry, you can start shopping. That sounds awesome.

Good plan. Terry, you are awesome, and this is exciting. So, again, George, you feel good about that, don't you? I feel really good because it has nothing to do with her being a woman or her being in her 20s. There's men in their 60s who aren't ready to buy a house. There's women in their 20s who are absolutely ready. I love it.

All right, next, let's go to Trey in Sacramento. Trey, how can we help? I'm doing good. Thanks for taking my call. You bet. What's up? We've got about two minutes here, so get to the point, and we'll try to help you out as quickly as possible. Yeah, no problem.

So my side hustle has actually taken off quicker than I thought, and I'm trying to figure out when the appropriate time would be to get away from my standard job and move full-time into the entrepreneurial life. Right. What is the side business? Digital marketing. Nice. And what do you do for a full-time job, and how much do you make? Pretty much the same thing, and I make about $25,000 a month. Okay. A month. Wow. Way to go, Trey. Let's slow clap for Trey today. $25,000 a month, that's a pretty good number. So here's the short answer. For me, and I want George to weigh in on this as well if he has a different formula, the answer to that

question, when should you walk from the day job to the side hustle, is when you are making close to, if not the exact same amount you're making now in your day job, and you have a minimum, this is me, a minimum of six months of your income in the side hustle bank account that is set aside to pay you. That would be the time. That's when we go, all right, I'm out. George, are you there yet? What are you making with the side hustle versus the full-time job? So this month I'll do about $24,000. Oh, wow. He's right there. You're right there. And you're doing that full-time job? So this month I'll do about $24,000. Oh, wow. He's right there. You're right there. And you're doing that part-time? Doing it part-time right now. Hopefully

you can go full-time at the end of the year. I should be able to build up that six months like you can. Well, making this much money, it's not like you have $24,000 in expenses. No. So you have an astronomical income compared to your expenses. Do you have any debt? No debt besides the house. How much do you have any debt uh no debt besides the house how much do you have in the side hustle bank account uh about 50 right now yeah so what's yeah so you're getting there yeah i like having six months in there that is and by the way six months that you hopefully don't touch because you're at the point now where you're already bringing in as much as you're making now you have very little personal expenses so i would say you're within a couple months of making this happen i like your timeline

with with his caliber i'm like he could leave today and go do it i think he's gonna be fine but there's gonna be a lot cushion there if he waits a few more months nothing wrong with that yeah he's gonna have an astronomical career ahead of him as an entrepreneur can we talk about terry and trey my mind. Supercallers. Is this going to be a weird show of unicorns? I don't know, but I am impressed. They need to be behind this desk.

TNT. Crushing it. They're tearing it up. I love it. Don't go anywhere. He's George Campbell. I'm Ken Coleman, and this is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey show where we help you win with your money, your work, and your relationships. I'm Ken Coleman joined by George Camel. And we are here for you this hour. The phone number to jump in is toll free. It is 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5-2-2-5.

And callers are standing by. We'll get to them. But first, George, you've got an article in your hands. And I've talked a lot about this on the Ken Coleman Show because we're helping people win at work. And college grads have got an overinflated view of what they could make and should make. Is that a fair way of saying that? That's a very fair way.

And you get some more data on your hands. Yeah, this is pretty wild. As hiring demands increases from CNBC.com, the average starting salary for the class of 2022 is projected to be more than $50,000. Okay, checks out. However, current college students expect to earn twice that, $103,880 in their first job, according to one report. Yeah. That's a problem. It is a problem.

It's not realistic. The market's not there. The question is, and I've not seen any of these articles that offer an opinion as to why. I think I have an opinion, but what say you? I interviewed a bunch of high schoolers, and when I talked to them, they all were like, well, yeah, I'm going to make six figures when I graduate. And I was like, what makes you think that?

Right, right. There's no reality. It's just kind of this wet finger in the air, and I think I deserve, and the way things are going with the economy, you need to make $100,000, so I'm just going to go make $100,000. Yeah. And so here's what's dangerous about this. If you are one of these young people, and you're listening and watch this, listen, we're not bashing you right now. I don't want you to hear here's Ken and George, the old cranky guys, like the Muppets, those two Muppet guys that sat

in the top, you know, the balcony. Um, yeah, those guys, here's the deal. Here's, here's why I want you to really do your homework on what the jobs are offering and what you're going to look at. And George just gave you the number because when you have unrealistic expectations, George, you are going to have unmet expectations. And so that starts you off right out of the gate with a certain amount of resentment. Yeah. And cynicism. And frustration and everything that comes with that. And so this is interesting. So the number is they're expected to start at, you said it was 55? Well, they're expected to start at just over 50.

Oh, just over 50,000. But their expectations are that they're going to make 103 plus. And it says 10 years into the careers, students anticipate making more than $200,000. Yeah, well. So they are way overestimating their starting salaries. One report says by 88%. And so they need to understand what degree am I after, what are the jobs on the other side of that degree, and what do those jobs pay in my area with my experience?

Are those the steps to take? Yeah, I agree. And so we want to know, okay, what does it look like? They've got to know the industry. And then more importantly, young people, listen listen go hang out with women and men who are winning in your industry and then say hey if i'm gonna make or if i if i want to make two hundred thousand dollars in 10 years what would need to be true like let's just get some real coffee and some real knowledge it's so that you have an idea of what what you need to expect

now i want to flip this for a second in my my hands here, I've got an article. I like that. I bring my own sound effects. And this is an op-ed on Fox News, but listen to this. The world is changing as it relates to college degree and professional success. Now, George, you know this. I talk about this all the time ad nauseum next to your desk. And it makes me nauseous. It does. I talk about it too much. I'm very passionate about it.

But the leveling of the playing field is here, and it's good for people who don't have a degree. Now, there are people that are listening and watching us right now that they feel stuck because they don't want to go get another degree because either they want to pivot and they feel like they need that qualification or they don't want to stay in the same field that they're in with the degree they have. And they think, oh, I need a degree. Maybe not.

But here's how it's changing. The headline here is employers are wising up. Between 2007 and 2019, George, the share of job postings requiring a four-year degree rose more than 60%. Wow. They called it degree inflation. So it was a little bit of a monkey see, monkey do. Everybody's doing it. We don't want to be the ones that aren't doing it.

And we felt like, well, we're going to get the riffraff. We filtered the riffraff out because if you don't have a degree, you're not as good as somebody else. And I'm being honest. I'm not trying to play on some populism here. Well, it's kind of like the credit score. It's just an easy way to go. We're too lazy to look into their finances. The credit score tells us. It's a great call, George. Great call. So that the degree and the credit score have become somewhat of the same

thing. It's a measuring tool, but does it actually matter? We know it doesn't. You bought a house without a credit score. That's right. And we teach this all the time. All right. So real quick, though, here's what's interesting. In 1990, this is the same time that we begin to see a real difference in prime age workers who are earning between $60,000 and $80,000 a year. All right, so 38% earning between $60,000 and $80,000 a year had a bachelor's degree. Okay, today the proportion is 52%. So it's about degree degree degree but listen to this four and ten recent college grads work in jobs that have not traditionally required a college degree and in that case the college graduates in non-college degree requirement jobs are earning more than ten thousand dollars less in other, the way they write that's confusing. Sure. If you have a

college degree, you're making over $10,000 less than your compadres who have no degree. Wow. So all that to say, two questions that I teach for our new audience members. If you've never heard me say this before, there's two questions you can ask. Is a degree the only way to get the job I want, or is it the best way? Now, you got to dig, but the research is readily available, George. It's not a mystery. No. And the answer is no to either one. Here's the great news. There's more and more jobs coming online. You have state governments. I didn't mention this. Eleven states now have removed college degree requirements for you to get a job in their executive branch. 11 governors said, we're changing it. So I just think this is a trend that is not stopping. It's a great shift. I'm very happy about this shift.

And the truth is, anecdotally, as we take calls on the show, the folks that have degrees, they call in and they go, I'm making 40 grand and I'm 100,000 in debt. The folks that don't have degrees, they call in and they go, well, I'm 19 and I make 80 grand as a weld'm 100,000 in debt. The folks that don't have degrees, they call in and they go, well, I'm 19 and I make 80 grand as a welder and I have no debt. That's right. And I go, who would you rather be? And guess who's not desperate for the raise and not struggling and anxious in their job? The guy who has no debt, who's making 80 grand with no college degree.

So I'm just tired of this system that's pushed all of these kids through to focus on a degree without thinking about what's on the other side. Well, let's not forget that we pushed them into this. They were told it was the right way to do it. And then they come out of school and the debt payments are killing them. They don't feel like they're ever going to climb out of the hole of the student loan. And then a politician comes along. And they promise that we're going to wipe away $20,000 worth of your loan. And they hold on tight for years.

And then you find out that some judges wearing black robes said, nope, can't do it. And they're left holding the bag. And that stinks. And so look out at the future. Look at the now and go, wait a second, do I need a degree? And if we look at the technology field alone, George, just the technology field, there are so many what I would call technology trade schools. BethelTech, BethelTech.net, tell them I sent you.

I endorse them. They have a nine-month program. Less than $15,000, George. Wow. And they're starting at $75,000. Some are making $100,000 coming out. It's a trade school. And it's less than a quarter of the time, which means you have income coming in nine months later, potentially.

That's right. Then let's look at the trades. As you mentioned, welders, electricians, plumbers, carpenters. The field is wide open. They are desperate for people who could come in and work. And you and I were at a conference recently where Malcolm Gladwell, on the stage at our Entree Leadership Summit, said that he was talking to a well-known professor at an Ivy League school,

and he said, what would you tell your kids about their future, his young kids? He said, I'd tell them to get into trades. That's powerful. This is an Ivy Leaguer, you know, an elitist, and if you will, for people like to make fun of him. is, is he's even saying the value is not there. Yeah. And so all that to say, this is we have this conversation because George, so many people make bad financial decisions under the guise of, well, I had to do it. Well, we've let the degree dictate what job happens versus letting the job dictate whether or not we even need a degree. There it is. We've got to make that change. And if you want to learn more about this, we explore it in our documentary called Borrowed Future.

It's completely free on YouTube. There's also a podcast series I hosted around the same topic. And it will open your eyes. Watch it with your kids and start the conversation now. Also, we have a great resource at our website, ramsaysolutions.com, called Debt-Free Degree. It's a great book, easy read. You can go to college without the debt we want you to. All right. More of your calls.

People are lining up. Don't move. Quick break. Right back with more of The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. I'm joined by my colleague, George Campbell. We're here for you this hour, taking your questions about money, about work-related issues that have some tie to money,

and relationship issues around all of that. George and I are here for you, 888-825-5225. Let's stay right here in our backyard, Nashville, Tennessee. Jessica is there. Jessica, how can we help? Hi, guys. So excited to be talking to you. So I'm toying with my next career steps, and I'm considering possibly going back to school, and I'm not sure where in my budget that saving would go or come from. Okay. I just need some help.

What are you doing now and what do you want to be doing? I'm currently a corporate field trainer for Crumble Cookies, and I'm considering going back to school for accounting because I have a little bit of a passion for finance that I've started to discover. Well, before you do that, if George and I give you good advice, we'd love for you to drop off a box here at wouldn't hurt us. That would be great. I love the crumbled cookies. I can make that happen. Oh, I'm terrible. That's terrible, but I couldn't help myself. All right. So you're absolutely certain that accounting is the direction, but what's that look like long-term for you? If you imagine kind of climbing the ladder, do you want to go higher than an accounting role?

So I'm not absolutely certain. I'm just considering it. And before I do anything, I just want to make sure that I have the money to do it because I don't want to take out student loans. I've never been in debt, and I refuse to be in debt. All right, so before we go that step, though, I want to make sure that accounting is the path. So before we even talk about the money, and I love that you're calling us. Okay. I love that. But the step before we get the money saved up is, do I really want to go into accounting? Or do I want to be a financial analyst? Do I want to be a CPA? And I really want you to practice what I call the

proximity principle. In fact, I'm going to give you my book. It was the number one bestseller, and it's called The Proximity Principle. And it basically says this, in order to do what Jessica wants to do, she's got to be around people that are doing it and in places where it is happening. And this is if we decide to do it, but you can begin to use the proximity principle to get around people that are in that field. This is coffees. This is lunches, breakfasts. Hey, I want to hang out with you, and I want to learn more about what you do, the ins, the outs, the good, the bad, the ugly. What was the right path for you?

And we want to determine, do I need a degree? After we determine, is this something I actually want to do? And so if you figure out, is this something I really want to do? Because I've talked to people, and I've essentially done a term paper and my heart has said, yes, this is absolutely what I want to do after talking to people, observing them, shadowing them, whatever that looks like. And then we go, okay, do I need a degree for that to go that path? You might need a certification. You might need the degree. But if you do all of that and you go, I absolutely know that I know that I know I want to go that direction. And now we know we need the degree. Then we say, all right, now I'm going to

cashflow it. Okay. Are you there? Do you feel like that's definitely the path? No, it makes sense. And I am there. I have a couple of friends who are accountants and I've been talking to them and slowly researching it, but I definitely need to amp it up. Yeah. Good. So what have they said about the education path? Are you going to have to get a bachelor's to do this the way you want to do it? The people that I've been talking to, they actually are, they, I mean, you can get a bachelor's, but they have their master's. And from what they've said, their master's has actually given them quite an income increase. But where I would start, I would start with a local community college and start with associates before I went any further.

Ask some of those folks if there is a precedent or a practice where companies see potential in someone like you and they pay for your master's degree if you stay with them? I would look into that. Yeah, that's a great question. So what's it going to cost at the community college? From looking at it, I think it was about $4,000 a year.

Okay. And how much money do you have right now? You said you have no debt. How much do you have in the bank? So in the bank, I have $38,650. Wow. That's amazing. So you could pay for this thing today without even touching your emergency fund. Well, my emergency fund is in the bank, but it's in a high yield savings. Yes. But I'm saying as far as your cash, your liquid cash goes, you could pay for this thing today with no problem. Because you were

asking about how do I budget for this? You kind of already have. Yes. So that's kind of what I've been trying to figure out is like, where in my numbers does that come from outside of my six months expenses? Because I have that. I'm not going to touch that unless there's an emergency. And then I have savings and I'm using my savings to fund my Roth. And that should, I have more than enough to max it out for this year and starting into next. Great. And then I have an investment fund, like an investment line item that I'm using to fund a brokerage account that's going into mutual funds. Okay. So those are all great things. I would just, if you filter this through the baby steps, you've got the emergency fund, let's invest 15%. Anything beyond that, let's use to throw

at this next goal of getting the degree. So that might mean pausing the investment in the brokerage account. You may be over 15%. Do you have an employer retirement plan? Yeah. Technically, total, I'm 20% because I do 15% of my own in my budget. And then I do, and that funds my personal Roth. And then I do 5% because my company does a 5% match. So I do 5% match to my company's Roth 401k. Cool. Jessica's just an overachiever.

You're crushing it. So I would just dial that back down to 15%. Let's get school paid for. Let's get through this program. Are you a homeowner? Is that a goal for you? No, it is a goal for me. In the next, I'd like five years or less.

Cool. I would get through school. Let's get this accounting job. And once we're there, you're probably going to have a pile of money knowing you. And so you'll be there in no time. And it sounds like you're doing everything the right way. You're wanting to go slow, do community college, then see what you need. Don't just get more degrees to get them, like Ken mentioned, and see if these companies will pay for it.

Maybe they'll start you out with a bachelor's and you'll work your way up through that. Yeah, I love that. And you are on your way. So, Jessica, very impressive. You're going to do great things. I absolutely love hearing from a young person who's looking at it the right way. This whole hour has just been like rock stars. Yeah, so fantastic.

Let's go to Jose in San Diego, California. Jose, how can we help? How are you guys doing today? It's an honor to talk to both of you. Well, it's our honor, sir. What's going on? Well, I'm at a crossroad in my life. I'm 52 years old.

My wife is 46. And as of May 1st, we are on baby step seven. Wow. Look at you, Jose. Yeah. So my question is that it's kind of still surreal two months later, you know, not having a home payment is surreal. And sometimes I feel like I'm confused. But one of the things that I need some direction is a life insurance.

I still pay on both of us. I just did it for this whole next term. So I have a term for until I'm 62 or 500,000. And my wife, like I said, is 46 years old, and I have her through age 60 up to 300,000, and I'm just wondering, should I continue to do that? Where are you guys at as far as your net worth? The last time I checked, which was around a month ago, it was 1.7. Awesome. Another milestone that I just hit was all my retirement

accounts and accounts that I have in possession in banks and all that. It just passed 1 million, so that's where I'm at right now. That is incredible. I'm so proud of you. Well, you have term life policies? Yes, both. Okay. So these are pretty affordable, I imagine. Yes. Between both of us per year, it's a little under a thousand. I would just keep them until they expire and run them out until 62 and 60. That gives you guys another, what, 10 years and 14 years, and that'll give you some peace of mind. I mean, 1.7 million is great, but again, if you've got the house and the retirement

accounts, you could survive, right? If something happened to you, God forbid, your wife's going to be okay. No house payment, a lot of money in these retirement accounts that she would inherit, she would be fine. Yes, that's what I was thinking. I just heard sometimes Dave talking about self-insured. So I just crossed that road. So I needed some- You're probably there. I just don't think there's enough. There's not enough going on where I go, the thousand bucks gives me some more peace of mind for the next decade. We've already got the plans in place.

We're paying for it. We locked in the rate. Let's just keep it going. And by that time, you're going to be multi-multi-millionaires and have plenty of money to be self-insured. You're doing all the right stuff, man. I'm so proud of you guys. Well, George, I got to tell you, the callers we've had in this first hour are high achievers. This is unbelievable. These are all great problems to have. The future is very, very bright. You all are doing some great stuff. But hey, if you don't

feel like you're where they are, you can get where they are. We're here to help. Don't move. More Ramsey Show coming up. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show where we help you win in your life, specifically your money, your work, and your relationships. A lot of new people joining us all the time. And if you're new to the program, we've got a get started button for you because you hear some terminology like baby steps. And one and two and three and four all the way up to baby step seven and you hear a lot of different things gazelle

intensity and things of that nature and if you're new we don't want you to feel like you're trying to figure out all of the vernacular we want you to get an idea where you are in the journey so that the conversations you hear on the show begin to make sense you can do that by going to ramsaysolutions.com and click on get started that's's RamseySolutions.com. Get started, and we'll get you caught up and get you plugged in right away. Connery is up next in Salt Lake City. How can we help? Hey, guys. It's wonderful to talk to you today. Good to talk to you. So my question today is, should I keep working at my company just for a scholarship? Scholarship to what? Okay. Scholarship to a undergrad university program. A little bit of context here. I just graduated with my bachelor's in chemistry and I'm working at an internship in retail essentially is

what I'm doing. And my wife just got accepted to a nursing program, and the scholarship that is awarded is a full scholarship to cover her tuition, and this is dependent on FAFSA. So right now the scholarship is good for one year, and then the other contingency is I have to continue working for the company for a, you could say a lower wage, sub $40,000 a year in order to get her through school without going further into debt. Should I stay in the position or switch over to the retail side of the company and work for a lower wage? Or should I leave and work for a company making that $50,000 plus a year that you guys are talking about?

What would it cost if you paid for the schooling? Total value of the schooling, it's about $3,500 per semester. So $7,000 times two, we're looking at about $14,000, $15,000 up the door. Okay. Well, let me ask another question. If this nursing scholarship wasn't even on the table with your company, would you even be calling us about this question? No.

Of course not. So that's why I always ask that question. I want to know where your head is. And I think for $14,000, I would take the better job with better possibilities, and I'd work a second job, and she could work a second job. You know what I mean? I have just $14,000 in today's economy. I think the two of you putting your heads together could come up with the $14,000 a

lot quicker than you probably realize, and you're going to be much happier and the better job. Got it. So long-winded answer of saying, no, I would not stay in the lower-paying job just for the scholarship for your wife. If you can go make $60,000 instead of $38 of 38, you're going to just go pay for that scholarship on your own anyways and feel more fulfilled instead of held back. And so I don't like these situations where you're purposefully limiting your income in order to have a little gain on the other side.

It's generally not worth it. And in this case, it doesn't sound like it based on the numbers. If it was a $100,000 scholarship, we may have a different conversation here. Now, Conor, I thought I heard you starting to say but a second ago. Oh, no, I just wanted to understand. No, that's awesome. That was the question. That was what was keeping me up at night. Is the $14,000 enough to keep me at a lower wage or should I figure it out another way?

You know, should I keep networking and using the other principles? Now, if you just go find that $60,000 job, it will kind of solve itself, right? If you go find a higher-paying job, this kind of thing goes away. Okay. And you'll get creative and go, all right, we're going to figure out how to pay for this ourselves now. You guys got this. I mean, this is great.

So I love it, love it, love it. Let's go to Jamie in Toronto, Canada. Jamie, how can we help? Hey guys, thanks for having me. You bet. What's up? I'm wondering if I should sell my house to pay off debt. What's causing you to go to that kind of conclusion? How much debt do you guys have? We have $350,000 in bank loans and $170,000 to family. Whoa. You mean bank loans? Are you talking about mortgage or is this personal loans? No, no. Lines of credit. Oh, wow. This is all consumer. Kind of, yeah. It's consumer debt.

Where did all this money go towards? Well, my wife has been in a surgical residency for the last five years, and so that's quite costly. And I, as a result, have not really been working as much to take care of our children to get her through her residency. Wow. So you guys have just been living on debt to survive while she's in school. Basically, yeah. Basically, I'm a chiropractor myself, and she's a just newly graduated surgeon. I had a practice going in a different city, and I was doing great there. She got into her residency. So we had to shut down my practice seven years ago, moved to a new city, started to build momentum and a new practice. And then we had our first child and our second child. And all the while she's putting in 80

hour weeks and getting through her surgical residency. Wow. So why shut down your career versus, you know, or, Hey, we're going to get daycare so we can keep some income going. It just didn't sit right with me to put my kids in, in daycare. We, they, they, they do do some daycare, but the amount of hours that I'm able to put in, like I'm, I'm, I'm working, don't, I'm not not working, but it's incredibly limited and zero focus, if I'm being honest with you guys, basically on cruise control until now.

This is why this decision has come up. I just told myself, I'm going to coast until she finishes her residency and I can finally buckle down and do what? And hammer away again. You're going to go back to work?

You're going to go back and build your practice? Yes, exactly. How old are the kids? Three and four. So now all of a sudden you're fine with them being in daycare because she's going to be busy and now you're busy. So now you're fine with it. No, actually the situation's changed.

So she now has a job. She's found a full-time job back in my hometown. And so we'll have all the help we need with family. My old practice is still there, and my partner's begging me to come back. Oh, wow. Now that changes the question, George. So what's the income today, and what do you think it will be? Today it's, oh my God, close to nothing.

I make like $1,000 a week. I put $1,000 a week in my pocket when it's all my god close to nothing i make like a thousand dollars a week i put a thousand dollars a week in my pocket when it's all said and done and uh she earns uh she doesn't earn much right now because she's on a resident salary or just you know was and um how are you guys paying the bills i'm dead man debt so you're just compounding the debt problem what will it be let's go back to hometown you're in there with your partner. She's got the new job. What do you anticipate that income being? I used to do about $30 a month.

I don't anticipate that off, you know, day one, but I used to do $30 a month. And I think she'll do closer to $40 or $50 a month. So that kind of allows us to breathe a little easy. Is the house back there? No, the house is here in Ottawa, but I have a building in Sudbury in this other town. And it just came up. One of my tenants just gave notice for vacancy. So I'm thinking of moving into the building. All right. We got about a minute left. So I want to give it to George here on what he thinks you need to do. What's left on the mortgage and what's the house

worth? $150 left. $6000 it's worth. Oh, man. So you could walk away with what, do you think, after fees? $500,000. Okay. I'd sell it today. And you could clear almost all of the debt. I could clear it all. All of it?

You said you had $350,000 and $170,000. I mean, yeah, you're right, not all. But the other stuff I'm not worried about because I've got time on that. I think it's time to be worried. I think what got us here was just going, well, I'm not worried about it. We'll figure it out. And then compounding debt, and I feel the weight of this, and I'm not even a part of this situation. So I would absolutely – Absolutely, man. I would sell this house, and you might be able to, in a better world, clear this debt quickly with $80,000 a month coming in.

But right now, the reality is the house is on fire and you are going into debt every single week to keep this afloat. So I would sell it ASAP, clean this mess up and get income back in your life, no matter what it takes. And this is never an option ever again. Oh, my goodness. I'm glad they've got a way out. And so that's good news. Wow. Hey, great hour, George Campbell. I want to thank Kelly Daniel sitting in today for James Childs and the team behind the glass for keeping us on the air. I want to thank you, America, for listening.

This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, it's Ken. If you like what you heard in this episode and want to know more about getting started on the Ramsey baby steps, go to ramsaysolutions.com and click on the Get Started button. We'll help you figure out the best next step for you based on your specific situation.

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