The Ramsey Show - App - Learning To Let Go of Your Financial Mistakes (Hour 1)

Episode Date: December 7, 2023

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is The Ramsey Show. It's where we help you win in your life. We're going to help you win with your money. We want you to win in your work. We want you to win in your relationships. We're here to coach you, encourage you along the way. The phone number is 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225. Joining me today is Rachel Cruz, the incomparable, the graceful Rachel Cruz.

And she's our money expert. All the adjectives. I kept it simple. I don't want to get too long in the list and make it look like flattery. And I'm Ken Coleman. I'm going to help you in the areas of work. How about more income? That bigger shovel to get through the baby steps faster.

I want to help you there. So we're going to work together to help you. Phoenix, Arizona is where we go. Brandon is joining us there. Brandon, how can we help? Hey, guys. Thank you for taking my call. I really appreciate it.

I just found the Baby Steps and the Ramsey Solutions about two months ago. And I have to say, y'all have been a blessing. I've been listening to you guys on my podcast while I side hustle for Uber. And then also reading Rachel's book, Know Yourself, Know Your Money. And I read the Baby Steps Millionaire book by Dave in like a day. Wow. That's awesome. You're binging it all, Brandon. I'm going all in.

It's long overdue. What's driving it? I love the intensity, but what's driving it? Yeah, so I just retired as a major league baseball player after nine seasons professionally, two in the major leagues. And I've also gone through some hardships just in terms of a relationship. I had an engagement fail back in 2021. And then I also had basically my career just got derailed by injuries the past few years.

Sorry about that. What position did you play? I was a pitcher and I had three elbow surgeries, two Tommy Johns and an ulnar collateral ligament. Oh my God. Yeah. So basically I'm transitioning. I'm going to church. I'm tiding for the first time ever in my life, which is crazy. I'm just kind of ashamed of that just given the amount of money I made as a professional athlete. But that's the reason I'm calling. I know I'm long-winded, but how does someone like myself who's transitioning into a new career path deal with financial mistakes of my past and letting go of that shame and guilt that I feel? And then also, too, I've

got a kind of a, I'm in a little bit of a budget situation that I could really use some advice on. All right. So real quick, I want Rachel to dive into this, but have, so do you have any money at all? Cause as a pitcher, you probably did well. Yeah. Well, that's the thing is like I made out of the draft, I was given $300,000 signing bonus. And obviously after taxes, that's a lot less. It turned into $185,000. And I was drafted in 2016. And unfortunately for me, I didn't have parents.

They are still in the rat race. They are still in debt. And they didn't really, they're kind of, in terms of Rachel's book, kind of the type of parents that they didn't talk about money. All I really saw as a kid was there was never enough. Let me ask you this really quick. Did you sign a contract or was that the only money your initial contract? What kind of money do you have right now? Okay. Sorry. Um, I have 28, $28,000 in my Roth IRA. I have $50,000 in individual brokerage account. Um, and then I have about $45,000 and a MLB 401k plan. Uh, and then in terms of like checking, I've got about $2,000 there. And then I'm working on rebuilding my emergency fund.

Unfortunately, I've only got about baby step one of $1,000. Are you just Ubering? Is that the only income you're bringing in? No. So I actually just got a job. I won't say the organization, but I accepted a coaching position for a major league team in the minor leagues. When will you start that? Yeah, so my first paycheck comes in december 15th but unfortunately it's a drastic difference in salary and earnings what will you make as a minor league coach yeah entry level uh development coach i'll make 40

40 000 this year but they pay for my housing um during the season so really like it but yeah do you have any debt yeah so right now um like i said i dove in with you guys um i have i kind of was keeping up with the joneses throughout my career like i said, and, uh, I have, uh, uh, my Tesla model Y that has about an outstanding balance of 42,000. Uh, I'm currently listing that on Facebook marketplace and auto trader trying to sell it. Um, so I'm, I'm underwater there cause the value's only about 37, 38. Um, and then, uh, I have a house, which is, this is the biggest thing why I'm calling. The house was built in 2021 with $60,000 in earnest money down. After my engagement failed, I went to the builder and asked for the earnest money back.

They said no. So I had no choice but to move in. And the mortgage is $3, hundred and sixty dollars a month uh three and a half percent interest rate and then utilities is usually about uh the total is that is that all um is that all your debt is the car in the house car and car in the house and i have like two thousand dollars in credit cards but I pay my credit cards off every month to zero. I've never been late with the payment.

You've never been late but you have $2,000 on it so you're going to be paying it in full at the end of December? Yeah, exactly. But your mortgage is too much. Is that what you're getting at too? Exactly. So like I'm in a situation where it wasn't too much when I was a player sure yeah yeah

and your life has changed so your living situation will probably change too um have you where will you go for well I guess you don't want to say the city which is totally fine yeah so what I would do Brandon honestly if I were you number one you asked about the shame and the guilt earlier in the show here's the hard thing about money is I could tell you right now Brandon like I'm a mom and I'm killing it as a mom this season of life. And but, you know, I don't have a number to that. Ken could be like, my husband game is out the roof. I'm the best husband ever in the world. There's no number to that.

Not saying that. What's sad is like what's sad is that the is that our money and what's hard is it has a number. There's a number that follows follows us around. So as much as which is very true that you're present in your future, Brandon, can be a hundred percent different. The way you're looking at money and even the stuff you're diving into content wise is going to help that mindset shift. The thing that sucks is like your numbers follow you, right? And I think that it's that reminder, not for it to be shameful,

but to say, hey, I don't ever want to go back there again. And so let me just encourage you, Brandon, you're doing all the right things. You're selling the car. You've got a new job coming up. I would get rid of the credit card. I'd go all the way in on this plan and just see. And I'd sell the house if you're moving somewhere else for this organization. Yeah, because you're going to be, I mean, right training. I don't know much about baseball, but you're going to be gone a lot. You're going to be gone a lot of the a lot of the season anyways.

So, Brenda, I would rent somewhere. I would rent a cheap one bedroom somewhere. You're going to be living somewhere else for months out of the year that they're going to be paying for, which is amazing. So take advantage of that. And yeah, I would I would sell this house again. This house was a dream when your life looked different. You were a baseball player. There was a girl in the picture and your life doesn't look that way. And so as Dr. John Deloney talks about, what's our reality? What is the

reality? And grieve what has been lost because it is sad. The career change and a relationship change. But where you are now, you have to focus on this reality. And this reality is that this house, it's too much for you. It's too much. And it's become a burden. So I'd sell it. Yeah, I absolutely agree. And, hey, you're restarting. You've been through so many injuries. You can do this. This is The Ramsey Show. Merry Christmas, everybody, from The Ramsey Show.

It's that time of year. I'm like, why haven't I said that already? I know. Someone said it earlier on the show in the week when I was hosting. And they said they answered the phone, Merry Christmas. And I was like, thank you. The raspy voice you've come to know and love is Rachel Cruz. We're not sure what's going on. She's working on it. She's got the lozenges working during the break. She's not sick. I have no fever. No, no, no mask. No, she's doing great. I'm doing good. But you may not recognize her voice, but that's Rachel.

And I feel like I'm a little raspy, so we don't know what's going on. But I'm Ken Coleman. She's Rachel Cruz. This is the Rabes Show. We're here to help you win. We had a call earlier this week. I think I was on with John, and we were talking about someone wanted to cash out their 529 that their grandmother gave them.

Oh, okay. But she wasn't doing it for school purposes. And so I was telling her not to cash out her 529 because you'd be hit with income tax 10 penalty and i was like but you can roll it over to a rough ira yeah uh because it's been open for more than 15 years and she was like what i didn't know that was possible and i was like it is possible the body administrator i got so excited wow and my voice just voice. Just cracked. Went out. Gone. And I told Winston that night, who knew I was so excited about 529s going over to Roth IRAs.

Well, don't get too excitable on the calls today because I feel like your voice is working hard here. I know, I need to like. So here we go. Time for question of the day brought to you by our great friends at Neighborly, Ramsey Show, question of the day, of course, always brought to you by Neighborly, the hub for home services. Soon you're going to have a lot of family over. That's going to make some people start

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You know, I think you'd be hard-pressed to find somebody. Today's question comes from Michaela in New Jersey. My husband and I don't agree with... Oh, no, Ken. I got you. My husband and I don't agree on money. I'm currently pregnant, and I want to be a stay-at-home wife with our son, and my husband wants me to be

out in the workforce. Ouch. We can't come to agreement and I need to know what I should do. Wow. Okay. I'm so glad. No, it's okay. I'm glad you're here on this one because this is not a work question. This is a marriage question. Yes. You know know disguised as a work question um so they don't agree on money rachel now she's preggers right and naturally wants to be a stay-at-home wife but the husband is probably freaking out i'm speaking on behalf of all men we start to get controlling because we really want to provide and he's nervous about the money they already don't agree about money we don't know why but we've already got tension there. And now she's like, I want to come home and be with the baby. And he's like, no. And she's saying, we can't come to agreement. What should we do?

Yeah. And that's one of the problems, Ken, that we see a lot. When you don't agree on money with your spouse, it's usually not always just about the money. It's usually because there's a value system difference, right? And that's like the core, right? It's not just, oh, credit card, not. You start to really dig into these issues and you realize, well, we have different values and it's coming out as money issues. And that's what I'm interested in this is I'm like, there's probably a values difference. And I have, it's funny, I have different friends in our lives. And some of the guys will say, no, my wife is, she's so smart. She's capable. She used to work and bring in great money she can and if the kids are in school all day why doesn't she and then i have

other friends that are down the other side where they're like no i'd rather her be home because everything's taken care of at home i can go make them like it's just so funny to hear these two different sides i always lean the first way you do i'm being honest i'm gonna be transparent yeah that with stacy you're like yeah stacey's got a master's degree. She's made six figures before and she's doing some part-time stuff now, but we got three teenagers. It's expensive. Got to buy two cars. My default is always that way. And I'm always the guy because she'll bring up, well, there's so much going on. And I agree agree she is the CEO sure okay but I go I'll help with laundry yeah I'll tag team that stuff so that I'm always like I don't there's first of all

dinner's never on the table anyway god love you Stacy that's just not how we roll I'm okay with that totally not a problem you know that I'm not a caveman you know what I mean or not out of the 1950s you know sitcom uh but I understand that I tend to go that way too because I'm always thinking let's max out our possibilities right right and that comes from and the reason I'm owning this is because I believe it comes from my own scarcity yes yes what do you agree yeah I could totally see that and that's my thing too is or the the value of not being home full-time right and not saying that you feel that with stacy but some people could say well that value is unquestioned

yeah right no i know that's not you i know that's not you yeah no i know but you're right you're making a very good point i'm just wondering about mckayla and her husband like if his value is like no let's it is a scarcity mentality possibly like what you're saying ken and let's bring in as much as we possibly can because why not? And hers is, no, I want to pull back and be with the kids. So again, for me, what do you do?

How do you get on the same page with that? I'd get some counseling and get to the heart of where we disagree on money. And to your point, why we disagree on money, when we get to the bottom of that, these other decisions take care of themselves. Yes, yes, exactly. So it's really tough. I hate to hear that, these other decisions take care of themselves. Yes, yes, exactly. So it's really tough. I hate to hear that, especially with a baby on the way.

Oh, I know. Oh, those motherly instincts kick in. 888-825-5225. Kyle is joining us now in Orlando, Florida. Kyle, how can we help? Hey, how are you guys doing? Ken and Rachel. Love the show. Been listening for the last couple months. Thank you. Two weeks ago, Dr. Maloney said something that kind of triggered me and made me think for the last two weeks. I've been trying to call in. I got an inheritance from my father passing away.

I'm 27. He passed away when I was 20. So kind of saved that money. My grandmother passed away last year, so got inheritance from her as well and kind of been accumulating this money. I bought a house, and I still have in my bank account $90,000 cash liquid in my high-yield savings account and $125,000 in my brokerage account

that me and my girlfriend, we do discuss going on trips and going away and what, what to spend money on and what things that we need and what we can kind of hold on for. And I realized something that Dave Maloney said that I'm almost like afraid to spend money. I have like a decent amount of a nest egg over 200,000 and own a house can make the payments. And I'm almost like nervous spending money. I have like a decent amount of nest egg, over $200,000 and own a house, can make the payments. And I'm almost like nervous spending money. And even if it's like a $2,000 or $3,000 trip, I'm like, well, how am I going to pay for this? Even though I'm sitting here with a decent amount. So I wanted to call in, kind of get some insight on like, how do you kind of deal with

those thoughts? Kyle, are you on a monthly budget? I am. Yeah. So everything's paid for. Mortgage is $1,500. I do use credit. I know it's a big thing. No, I mean like a budget, meaning you have your income for the month, all of your expenses from cable subscriptions, insurance, food, restaurants, groceries. You have it all listed out before the month begins. You know exactly what you're going to spend money on On every single category Usually the answer is no I'm very impressed if that is true

You really are on that detailed of a budget every month If I interviewed people that know you Would they say you're tightwad? Food tends to move around That one tends to move around the gas and the food But definitely the main stuff you want to get, like the money. Are you a tightwad? Kyle, Kyle, real quick.

Are you a tightwad? Would people say you're tight, you're uptight about money, super frugal? Yes. Okay. The reason I'm asking that, Rachel, I think you wrote a book called Know Yourself, Know Your Money, and I think it's really wise. It's got to be from his past, yes? Yeah, I mean, your childhood can dictate a lot of this.

How did you grow up, Kyle, with money? So I grew up with divorced parents. So my dad was an ex-cop, so he was based on a pension. So he did have a very strict budget. And I think I got a lot of that from him, just kind of knowing where every dollar is going to go. Yeah. Going up, so. Kyle, do you have our EveryDollar app, by chance?

No, I haven't used the EveryDollar app. Okay. I have, I guess, first and foremost. Okay. If you hold on the line, Austin's going to pick up, because I want to give you EveryDollar Premium, which will connect to your bank. And this is a budgeting app. So why I'm saying that, Kyle, is because with money, you always want to be doing three things, giving, saving, and spending,

all three things. And when one of those is deficient, you don't get the full freedom of what money has. And one of yours, which is spending, not mine, yours, is deficient, Kyle. So what a detailed budget like EveryDollar, I want you to do it. It's going to help give you permission to spend. And Kyle, I want you to save every month towards a $3,000 vacation. And when the money hits, when you plan it and you have that $3,000, go on the vacation. You almost have to force yourself to spend. But a budget will give you the guardrails and the guidance where it's not questioning, oh gosh, is this okay? It's permission. It's telling you it is okay.

So hold on the line. Every dollar premium for you, Kyle. Thanks for the call, Kyle. This is The Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me in studio this hour, and we're here for you. We want to help you win with your money. We want to help you win in your professional life as well as in your relationship life. Those three areas are always tied together. We want to help you win in all those areas.

If you're not winning in one of them, it's going to affect the other. So we're here to take your calls. We'd love to coach you and cheer you on. 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225 888-825-5225 okay Baltimore Maryland is where we're going next and that's Brittany Brittany how can we help hi hi Kim hi Rachel um thanks for taking the call um Rachel I hope you so better, dear. Thank you so much, Brittany. Of course. So I honestly just need quite a little bit of insight here. I am trying to figure out ways to either make more money and save more money.

I barely make $30,000 a year. And after pretty much all of my bills, I have about $10 left in my name. What are you doing? What's your job? I am a medical secretary for a hospital. Okay. And let me ask you this. What is just, I mean, in your head right now, top of the mind here, what's up the ladder look like for you?

If I could just magically wave the pencil around and we bumped you up based on some skills, some experience, what would that look like for you? If I could just magically wave the pencil around and we bumped you up based on some skills, some experience, what would that look like? And then what would the financial payoff be? What would the new salary be? Well, targeted right now, at least a good maybe $70,000. I'm not too greedy. I honestly just want to feel like I'm not drowning. I actually took out a loan against my 403B to take some IT software testing classes. And I'm actually finishing those up this month, but still, you know, have to put myself out there and look for a job which could also take months as well. Well, hold on a second. So the mindset there has to be, you're already identifying companies and positions that this certification will prepare you for, in other words, qualify you for, and you're starting to make connections now. So you have to have the mindset that I'm shaking

the tree to see what opportunities could be there and maybe waiting on me. Does this program have a placement program with it where they help you get placed? They do not. They kind of just basically help with your resume and LinkedIn profile in which I am currently in the internship, but haven't finished it yet, although I have already started putting my resume out there just to kind of get the ball rolling. What technology work will you be qualified to do day one? Is it programming? Is it code? It is actually software testing, quality assurance engineer. Okay. And is that where you said a minute ago, I didn't understand

you and that's my fault. You were talking about a $70,000 salary. Is that what you've identified as a potential option coming out of this? Yes. Okay, great. So I want to turn you over to Rachel on the budgeting side of things, because I don't want you to wait, okay, to start getting your money. And by the way, if you can work two or three extra jobs right now for some additional income, that's going to help what Rachel's going to coach you through. I just want to push you into that. You need to take the bull by the horns here and get after it. So I want you to connect. I'm going to give you a book called The Proximity Principle, okay? That's my gift when we're done here so that you're connecting with people and it's going to walk you

through tactically and practically how you begin to make connections so that opportunities come your way because that's going to be huge for you. But income alone isn't going to fix this problem, Rachel. No, it's definitely going to have to be so much of a mindset shift, Brittany, for you because even talking to you, you're so kind and sweet. But there's a part, though, that I'm like, yes, as Ken was saying,

grab the bull by the horns. Like there's kind of that aggression too that I want in you that I'm sure is there. What's your just, I'm curious your family dynamic. Are you married? Do you have kids? I am single, no children.

I live in a one bedroom apartment. And honestly, I was thinking about moving in with my dad for maybe like two months or a year just to kind of save up some money. Because I could have barely made $30,000. Yeah, how old are you, Brittany? 34.

34, okay. And what's your debt? What's your car payment, credit cards, all of that? So I have about $4,500 in credit cards. Like I said, I took out a loan for my 403B, which is only maybe at like $2,100 right now. But probably the second part of my advice meeting is that I actually did something really now that I know is stupid. Last year, I was going through a hard time and actually kind of, long story short, got taken advantage of by a friend. And it's something I know I shouldn't have done. I put my name down so that she could get an apartment. But I basically wanted her an

apartment in my name because she was having trouble with her own kids and I was going through my own heartbreaks and things like that and was feeling really vulnerable. But long story short, she did not pay any of the rent and it racked up about $11,000 in debt in my name now. Okay uh and it's the eleven thousand dollars that's that's separate than the 4500 credit card and 2100 403 correct okay perfect what's how much you how much you own your car i don't my car is paid off okay that's great great news um okay so here's here's the good news the good news, Brittany, there's a lot of upside to your income. There, right now, in this time between now with this career you have

and hopefully going forward, which you're getting your training and all of that, which is great, between now and then, if I were you, Brittany, you could move in with your dad if you want. There's a part of me that I'm like, you're an adult. You can do this, right? You can do this. There's a sense of dignity there that I think is really important. But I think it's going to be an uncomfortable season, meaning the amount of hours that I

would encourage you to work, Brittany, because there's not much expenses to cut. You're living on $30,000. And so there's nothing to really cut there, right? So the income side though, to me is huge. I'm like, even if you took four nights a week, Brittany, and said, I'm gonna drive Uber, three of those nights, I'm gonna do Instacart too. Like you do some extra side hustle work,

which actually can bring in a good bit. I mean, some people are seeing two, $3,000 on side hustles. So even bringing that stuff in, you're going to be able to pay. I would pay off your debt smallest to largest. So I'd pay off that 403B loan, ASAP, get that out of the way. And then the $4,500 credit card debt, I would cut up your credit cards today. I would force yourself to live on what you can. And we talk about the four walls that are really important, Brittany, your food, your shelter, utilities, and transportation.

And I know I said earlier as I was talking with you that I wouldn't want to move in with your dad, but listen, if there's a season that you're like for six months, for rent, all of it, like if I can cut some stuff because even my four walls are tight, maybe that is an option. What is your rent? My rent is $1,300. Could you get out of that how quickly? Is that a month-to-month, or do you have to finish out a lease? I have to finish out a lease that is up in June, the 1st of June.

Okay, so that's six more months. Yeah, I'm with Rachel on this one. I'm going to say six months from now, if you get after it, I don't think you're going to have to move. I think this is about you going, what must be true for me to make an additional $300 to $500 a week? Now, if you break it down like that, it's not as intimidating. But if you go, okay, what do I have to do?

And if I get out, like you can knock that $2,100 loan out very quickly. Next on the list is the $4,500 in credit cards. And honestly, the stupid tax of the $11,000 debt, that's the biggest one. You can actually do this. You've doubled your income over the next six months to eight months on the technology side of things. You start networking and connecting like your life depends on it. You're going to get a good job. And now it's about managing the mistakes that you've made. Go, you know what? I'm not an

idiot. I've made a mistake or two or three. Big deal. And Brittany, any savings you have too, I would throw at this debt to get this moving. I think for you, having some confidence and some quick wins for you, Brittany, it's possible and it's needed for you. Because once you're out of this debt and you have a fully funded emergency fund, you're a whole new person. There's a level of confidence that you're going to have in yourself knowing that you can do this hard stuff. And you're going to learn from those mistakes, not going back into credit card debt, not being taken advantage of from a quote unquote friend that screwed you over. All of these things, Brittany, are lessons to learn and do something different the next time, which you will.

So these numbers are great. I think working extra is going to be your best bet. Yeah, absolutely. This is The Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. I'm joined by my colleague and friend, Rachel Cruz.

Merry Christmas to you. I hope you are not stressing out over all the things around Christmas. And it's become about getting, getting, getting, and then the stresses around giving the thing that everybody wants to get. Just remember around this time that it is ultimately about giving and make sure that you don't lose yourself in the music or the moment, as Eminem said once famously. Did you like how I just transitioned right into a little rap from Eminem? Just Eminem.

Yeah. Shannon Coleman and Eminem. He would say, lose yourself. He'd say, go the eight mile. Don't lose yourself. Nice. Good reference there. Good reference.

Slim Shady. Slim Shady. I used to be called Slim Sh no i didn't uh but i tell you smoking cigarettes and listening to eminem apparently i know i know we're going off the going off the range um little fun thing um let's i want to find out uh next segment uh what your one of your favorite christmas movies is and maybe we maybe we'll do an object lesson out of it. Okay. I'm taking over.

I did on the last, on the Rachel Cruze show, the Christmas episode that comes out, we did my top five favorite Christmas movies and the money lessons to learn from them. Oh, this is what I want to do. That's even better. You took my horrible idea and you went, that's what I want to review. And you're going to love them. I can't. Actually, it's going to be really great.

So you're going to have to hang around. Next segment? Next hour? Next hour. And you're going to love them. I can't. Actually, it's going to be really great. So you're going to have to hang around. Next segment? Next hour? Next hour. So you got to hang around for that. All right. Let's go to Izzy.

By the way, I always, I think my name's very boring. James likes to have fun with it, with the puns. Like you were very Kenertaining. He does those things. But what if my name was Izzy? I think I would be much cooler. Izzy is cool. And Izzy is in Boston. Izzy, how can we help you?

Hi, guys. Thank you for taking my call. I love your name. Can I tell you that? Love your name. Thank you very much, Ben. I like yours. Thank you. I appreciate that.

My question is, so I've obtained a bachelor's degree in biology this past summer, and my next step is to try to get into PA school and become an emergency medicine PA. But what I would like some advice with would be, is it okay to take out loans for PA school? And if not, what advice do you have for me to pursue this career path and take on as little bit as possible. Okay, so walk me through what you think the path looks like, maybe the next couple steps or years, and let's attach some money to that, meaning what it would cost for the education necessary

and then maybe what you're making. Can you kind of fill me in on that? I think I can answer the question a little better. Yeah, of course. So right now I'm on baby step two and I have about $1,400 in credit card debt and in student loans, I have about $25,000. Okay. And that's it? Yeah, that's it. I've paid off, my car is paid off and I don't have any other sort of debt. Okay, great. But what the next steps look like right now, I'm searching for

schools and both within Massachusetts, but also outside. And what will happen is, is I would start applying to programs in April. Now, the thing is, is that most PA programs do not allow you to work while you're in school because it's so rigorous. But also, I'm in the most competitive state, and also one of the most expensive programs is in Boston. But if I were to move out of state, I would have to take on living expenses. But right now, I live with my mother, and I only pay the utility bills, which is about $500 to $600 a month. So what will the PA program cost you then in Massachusetts? In Massachusetts right now, the programs that I'm looking at, it ranges from $115,000 to $130,000. And what's the path,

what's the salary coming right out of PA school? Coming right out of PA school, especially if I want to work in emergency medicine, which is what I do right now. I'm a nursing assistant in the emergency room. So fresh out of PA school, I would probably, and if I move to Mass, you know, the salary varies from where you live in the state, but I think I'd want to work in mass. It would be about $115,000 to $120,000. Okay. And what are you making right now in that role? Right now, that's a thing. So in the emergency room, you do not get paid much as a nursing assistant. I make about $15 an hour base pay. So this past summer, what I've done, I love landscaping. So what I did is I opened up my little gig, and I was able to make pretty good money.

I'd pay off a good chunk of my debt, but I can't do that in the winter. So I'll continue working. All right, let me ask you this. I love your hustle, by the way. Love it. All right, I have one more question, and I'm sure Rachel and I are going to weigh in here. Based on your current degree that you just got,

what's the best paying gig you can get with that biology degree? Yeah, so I had a feeling that you guys would ask me this question. The thing is that I haven't thought much after I obtained my biology degree because my plan was always to go straight to school. And then my cousin, you know, he got me into listening to you guys. And, you know, I just, I've always seen my mother kind of live paycheck to paycheck. And I just, I don't want that. We don't want that either. Yeah. So you got to answer the question for me. I never thought beyond. So you don't want that either. Yeah. So you got to answer the question for me. I never thought beyond. So you haven't looked at it. Yeah, which is fair. Totally fair.

Yeah, totally fair. Because you're what, 22, Izzy? I'm 24. 24, okay. Here's what I want you to think about, Izzy. I want you to think about, let's split the difference between the $115 to $130 is what it's going to cost you for a student loan, okay? Let's just say it's $120,000 for conversation. I want you, you don't have to do it right now, but I want you to reflect sometime today on how long it would take you to pay that back. And I want you to also think about if I told you to pay cash, which is what I want you to do, how long would it take you to save up? Could you save up $30,000 a year? Well, at $30,000 a year, it's four years to be able to pay cash, yes? Yes.

Or cash flow your way through it. So the question is, living with your mom, the cash option is best for you because you do not want that stress because even at making $115,000 coming out of this degree, after tax, I want you to run the numbers. What is your after tax situation? And I want you to do, it's almost like a pre-budget. And I think you're going to go, oh my gosh, I don't want to sign up for that. I'd rather be patient. And could I save 30 grand a year? Okay. Which gets me through, gets me to four years,

or can I cash flow flow and if it's going to cost me x amount per year i'd love to know what that number is per year okay and then can i live with my mom and i know pa school is hard and they don't encourage working but what is the other option being miserable and being in debt yeah izzy i i don't know why it's like the people pleaser in me sometimes that I'm always like, I know our advice is not what you want to hear. So I always hesitate to be like, I'm sorry, Izzy, what you're going to hear, you're going to think, oh my gosh, Izzy, six months ago before her cousin told her to listen to Ramsey. But I'm so glad we got you because our advice is going to

be different. Because normal would just say, oh, of course you've got to go into debt for PA school. And of course you need to go right now. You just finished your undergrad. Of course, that's the next step. I mean, it's exactly what your mindset was. And Izzy, I can't tell you how many calls we take on this show of people that have debt, of people that took on this amount of debt

and the stories of even, you know, they get married, they meet someone, get married, have a baby, something is wrong, you know, and they want to stay home because of, I mean, like health stuff. I mean, life happens. And when you take on debt, you're taking on risk. So what we want to do is eliminate risk from your life because that gives you peace and it actually gives you money at the end of the day. And so the most peaceful, wisest route, Izzy, and this is what I would do if I were you, I would say, hey, I'm going to put

all this on pause for three years, which means you'll be 27. We talked to 35 year olds that want to go back to school, right? So I'm like, you're early in the game. You have the time. You have the time. And to say, I'm going to go try to find, you're smart, obviously. So I'm going to go try to find a job making 60. And I don't, and honestly, I don't care what it is. It may not be in the medical field. We're going to just go make it because izzy listen and if you stay with living with your mom i'm okay with that because you're gonna pay off the 26 the 26 400 that you owe your credit card debt and your student loans you can pay that off in the first year keep working that job for two years save and save and save you'll have enough to cash flow that first year of PA school. Do your landscaping stuff in the summer.

You can make a killing on that and just stockpile cash. And when you go through PA school, you will be writing checks. When you get out of PA school, you're going to make $120,000, and it's all yours, Izzy. And you're starting that off at 27 years old. It's unbelievable. Unbelievable. That's going to be the wisest, peacest route for you, Izzy. You're awesome. I'm so glad you called. Thank you, Izzy. We believe in you. This is The Ramsey Show.