The Ramsey Show - App - Life Is Too Short To Choose Money Over Happiness

Episode Date: September 11, 2024

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I am Rachel Cruz, hosting this hour with my good friend and bestselling author, Jade Warshaw. And we're here to answer your questions about life, money, relationships, career, anything and everything. We are here for you. So give us a call at 888-825-5225. All right, up first, we have Charles in Tulsa, Oklahoma.

Hi, Charles. Welcome to the show. Hey, thanks for having me. Absolutely. How can we help? Yeah, I was just recently notified that my company plans on laying me off in the near term. Sorry. I'm trying to write down a long-term financial plan, and I'm writing out my assets.

And I'm just kind of looking at what I have down, and the vast majority of my stuff is not liquid. I mean, it's either a retirement account or it's equity in my home or whatever. And I'm trying, if it came down to it and I needed to access that money, what would be the best way to go about doing that? Okay. So you don't have any savings right now? Anything liquid is what you're saying? Because if you know ahead of time, because like because my question is three months of savings okay great well i mean this may feel pollyanna but you're not laid off now you know you're going to be in the near term what does that mean does that mean 30 days three months six months they couldn't give me an exact date um but they said most likely jan. My manager was kind of doing me like a really solid

and he wasn't really supposed to tell me this information. If you're an insider. Insider. So I would make it a goal not to pull money out of your house equity-wise, not to pull it out of retirement because you wise not to pull it out of retirement because you're going to get dinged with penalties and taxes um because i mean it's between yeah you have four months to continue to save and look for a new job right i mean so i mean in a perfect world yeah the goal is to do that and i'm just trying to do last-ditch efforts yeah i'm trying to write

down a plan i feel like you have to focus i think you're focusing on the wrong part you're focusing on what do i have to depend on if i don't get the job as opposed to focusing on what will i do to get the job because if i'm you i'm taking those other especially the retirement the how i'm taking that off the table like it's not even an option so i feel like you've got to go into this pretending as though that money doesn't even exist, because if you go into it with even like just a piece of that in your brain as an option, then when the time comes, like let's say the time does come and it's getting close to the wire, you're going to be like, well, at least I have this money here.

And yeah, it's dangerous. Yeah, I think I mean, this is the extreme stance we even take, Charles, is that we say not to pull money out of retirement unless it's to avoid a bankruptcy or a foreclosure. So, I mean, yeah, so I, to Jade's point, I would act like it's not even there. So financially, Charles, how are you? Are you living paycheck to paycheck? Do you, you have three months of savings, which is big. So, so yeah, it sounds like you're in a good spot.

Well, yeah, my original goal was to get out of, because I started watching the show earlier this year, and my goal was to get out of debt this year. And the only thing I had on my card was my car payment. And I took a radical stance, and I was my card, my car payment. And I took a radical stance and I sold my car and I traded it in for a car that has $300,000 on it. So I'm, I'm debt free with three months of savings. So if anything, my, my,

And what kind of line of work are you in? Yeah, I'm in accounting. Okay. Listen, you're going to land on your feet, no problem. Yeah, I think you're, I mean, I appreciate the due diligence of the plan and everything, but I would encourage you, Charles. I think you're in a better spot than you think you are. I mean, you have no debt.

You have three months of savings. If I were you, between now and then, I would just be stockpiling cash. I would get that up to a six-month emergency fund just in case. And then as an accountant, I mean, you'll have plenty of opportunities to find a job. And then when you plug into a great job

and you have too much savings, maybe you could say, okay, I'm gonna take some of that, maybe put more towards my retirement. But maybe between now and then, focus on just stockpiling cash. Are you able, like legally, or with the stipulations of your job are you able to start kind of creating a book of business on the side so that you kind of have that as a bridge i do corporate accounting so not

not specifically clients got you okay stuff like that well i would start networking too charles right between now and then i mean talking to companies that are looking for someone and nothing's stopping you from talking having no no and i was told like two hours ago so i'm trying to do like i i started sitting out okay that's fair you're still writing in your journal like you're still writing in your journal. Like you're still trying to make heads or tails of it. Yeah. I got like a bunch of stuff for now. And then I'm just trying to create a plan of action and figure out what to do next.

I know I have a eight year old son now. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So from, from all that, I mean,

yeah, if I were you, I would just be saving money. I'd be looking for another job. And if they're going to lay you off and you find a great opportunity, then it's time to say, okay, that door is shut and I'm going to walk into something else. I mean, in that sense, that's not a selfish thing or you're not leaving them high and dry. You're taking care of yourself in that situation, too. Right, right, right.

Exactly. So great. I mean, I don't, like, if I leave early, like, it is what it is, you know. That's right. Yeah, if you're going to be laid off, for sure. I'm like, yeah. Well, thanks for the call, Charles. I hope that's helpful.

Yeah, and I appreciate that he called us two hours after he found out. Because there is probably a level of, like, panic and, oh, my gosh, what he was doing when he called us was, like, getting all my ducks in a row, which makes he's like already going to okay what if i run out of money but when you let the drama settle and the emotion settle it is amazing how you can and he's put himself in an incredible position right i mean this is a totally different conversation yes he has no savings has a car payment has you know is living paycheck to paycheck then there's going to be a you know a whole other level of hey this is this there's me more pain to this absolutely but that's one reason you do all of this, you guys, is to set yourself up for the unexpected. And we always say the emergency fund is there.

After you are debt-free and you have a fully funded emergency fund of three to six months of expenses, which is what Charles has, that it takes a crisis and turns it into an inconvenience. That's right. Hey, did he say it was his leader who let him in, or was it just somebody he worked with? I think he said his leader. I was going to say, like like that's probably another piece of this is just to make sure it's accurate yeah information and not like hearsay or like

office rumor that you're yeah because that can happen as well right you jump you jump off this train that wasn't even yeah right because of what people are saying at the water cooler but i think he did say it was his Leder. Yes. Okay. Yeah, I think we're getting nods. But again, Jade, I think too, that padding of planning is great of what he was talking about. But getting yourself in that position that when life happens,

because it's not if, it's when, and it may not be a job layoff, which I feel like we're hearing more and more of. I don't know. I feel like we're getting more calls of that. But the health of one of your kids or family members, I mean, stuff is going to come up. And to put yourself in a position, not that money, money does not make you immune to life, right? But it does give a buffer when those hard life events happen. It can soften the blow. It can. Absolutely. Yeah. So great. Well,

Charles, again, thanks for the call. This is The Ramsey Show. Statistics show that half of Americans don't have enough life insurance or they don't have any at all. I don't understand this, John. Why don't people want to take care of their family? They think they're not going to die or something? Well, I used to be one of those guys. I didn't even think about it. And one of my buddies said, hey, the only reason to not have life insurance is if you hate your wife and kids. And I immediately went and got term life insurance. That's a gut punch. For decades, Dave, I've sat across people who've lost a spouse. They've lost somebody important to them.

Me too. And they don't know what to do next. Terrifying. You're going to have a crisis here. You know, you got two options while you're sitting and talking to a young widow. She's concerned about how she's going to invest all this money properly and not mess this up, or she's concerned how she's going to eat tomorrow. That's exactly right. These are the two options. It's saying I love you to your family. Term life insurance.

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You know, we were just talking March. It still seems like a far way away a little bit. But with kids and school calendars, we've already like we've started talking about. You got a plan. Yeah, you do. You do. So even if it feels far, you guys, it will be here before you know it. So we are doing a live like no one else cruise.

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All the Ramsey personalities and some great guests. And it's a seven day cruise, March 22nd through the 29th 2025 and again you don't want to miss this unbelievable incredible vacation it's going to be so fun so that's in March you can go to ramseysolutions.com slash cruise to put a deposit down and book your room. Love it. All right. Up next, we have Richard and Maria from Tacoma, Washington. Hey, guys. Welcome to the show. Hi. How are you guys? We're doing great.

How are you all? Pretty good. Good. It's fun having both of you. We usually have a single caller, so I'm glad we have two. Are you guys, what's going on? Are you guys married? What's happening?

This means debate. I know it. Does it? Yes, we are married. All right. So how can we help? So we need to get a truck because we'll be moving to upstate New York within the year. So we need a vehicle that can handle the snow.

So we both have agreed we want to buy a used around thirty thousand dollar truck okay we differ on how we want to buy that truck okay so we have we have fifty thousand dollars in savings right now not including our iras and 401ks and then so she wants to buy the vehicle outright and then i want to use our uh we both have pretty good credit and then i want to use a sizable down payment to try to get our apr under 4.6 percent so that we have more money in our savings okay so you have more money in your savings is why you want to do your way maria why do you want to just pay for it outright i don't want to have any debt or any car payments and i would just like to buy it cash and not worry about it anymore all right i have a question what portion of the 50 000

would you consider to be your three to six months of expenses that that's the other 20k that's why we set the uh mark at 30k for the truck so 20k would cover your emergency fund and then 30k okay well i mean Richard you called the Ramsey show so I think you know what we're gonna say uh I know yes I know uh yeah so I mean I understand Richard the mathematical side right some people well not with car payments it's the one part of I mean I understand him wanting to have the savings more savings yes yes but realizing that Richard, that you're going to be paying four to five percent on an asset that's going down in value where you could have that possibly invested even in just an index fund making 10 to 12 percent, your money could be working for you way more. And just for fun, you said you'd want to put down a decent down payment. What,

what were you thinking you would put down on the $30,000 value of the car okay so $15,000 so then let's let me see if I can make you feel better about this so what's you guys's income uh we make what will it be around $100,000 okay and so how long without a car payment how long do you think it could take you to save up that additional 15k because in your mind that's what you'd be parting with is fifteen thousand dollars that was the part that made you feel uncomfortable right otherwise you would have been willing to put the full down payment like pay the thing in full so how long could you save up how long how quickly could you save at fifteen thousand with no car payment probably like five or six months. Yeah.

So that's, I mean, we're talking about something that is almost less than half a year in order for you to be completely free, for you not to be investing in, to Rachel's point, a depreciating item. I'm not even going to call it an asset because it's going down in value. So I feel like that, I feel like we made a good case. Yeah, that makes sense. Are you convinced, Richard? that, I feel like we made a good case. Yeah, that makes sense. Are you convinced, Richard? Yeah, I am.

You know, what I think is hard, though, because again, when we talk about money, naturally, the math is going to come in, people's emotions come into all of it. So it all, that all makes sense. But the part that you just can't calculate, though, Richard, is this level of not having risk, of having autonomy completely over your life and Maria's probably thinking too right what like you know god forbid something happens who knows um there's no risk at all right we just talked to a caller that's about to be laid off and he has no debt he actually sold his car to get out of car payments

has an emergency fund and then You know That life change for him Is going to be Very small Impact wise Financially Than the opposite So I know you guys Have savings

And you're probably thinking Well we could just cover it You know If something happens But there's still A level of risk And the other part Of just

Of being owned I mean honestly I'm like having Toyota Motor Company Having a part of your paycheck Every single month, there is something emotional there that can't go into a spreadsheet. And we had Dr. Arthur Brooks on the show a few weeks ago, and he talked about the science,

scientifically what the brain does when you have debts. There is a level that you're, you know, you're not safe. Like there is something there in eight that people don't talk about so there is a freedom here Richard that again maybe a little painful parting with the cash but I would I would encourage you guys this is why you did that this is why you saved is to be able to use your money and not use other people's money and then there's a practicality of I mean we're going to talk about this later in the show but insurance costs are going up and to be able to enter into a car with no car payment, it frees you up to be able to deal with those fluctuating

costs that have to do with just life in general, whether it be the cost of your insurance going up or the cost of groceries going up. There's a lot going on. And so to be able to clear out as much variable as possible in your life, for me, me it's worth it yeah absolutely maria how are you feeling i'm feeling good okay so she's like i won so how does this work though because we talk to usually just one of the spouses calls in our show and usually it's usually it's maria that calls in and it's like hey i want to pay cash for this car my husband doesn't want to so we're usually talking to one of the spouses and we talk about you know the idea of being aligned values wise with your money so i'm curious for you guys if you will share you don't have to but you know what is what does that

conversation look like for you all is it is it richard you saying all right maria i hear you i hear jade and rachel i'm going to just make the decision or what what does those conversations look like when you get off the phone do you think the conversations are honestly very good because the only thing we want is to just make the best choice for us and we just want to save the most money and i i've totally agreed with him and i'm like you know we can do it your way or we can do it my way um the it was just the reason i want it my way is just to not have that feeling, oh, we have debt. And he feels the same way too.

But, you know, with his reasoning, it was also, could we get a little bit more money in our savings doing it my way? And I'm okay with doing it his way, but, you know, I also just had my idea. And I think our talks about money are great we pretty much agree on everything did you guys have debt prior to this that you paid off together no oh okay so you've been living a debt-free lifestyle yes oh okay so Richard you were like we could just see what it might feel like you're like I'm willing to dip a toe in the water that's funny that's funny how the other side lives

They live with stress and payments Richard Yes, and I'm terrified to live That way And I know I would be insanely stressed But I also know that we've got about 10 months until we Move and need that vehicle

So I was hoping In that 10 months, we would save up, you know, solely have a car savings. 100%. Well, based off the numbers that Richard gave, as quickly as you could save up $15,000, I think that that's actually pretty feasible.

So very good. Yeah, you guys could continue to save and make the cushion even more. Yeah, that's a great point because it's in 10 months. Well, you guys are awesome. I appreciate, I appreciate you both

calling in and talking through it because, you know, there's a spirit of humility there too, right? Of just saying, hey, we want to be on the same team

and we want to do this well. We have the end goal is the same. How we get there might start to kind of weave a little bit, but hearing each other I think is great.

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Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Rachel Cruz hosting with Jade Warshaw, and you can give us a call at 888-825-5225. We are answering your questions about life and money. Up next in San Francisco, we have Maria joining us. Hey, Maria. Hi, ladies. Thank you so much for taking my call. I'm so excited to be on the Ramsey Show. Oh, I'm so glad you called. How can we help? Okay, so I'm 50 years old and I have only $100,000 in my retirement. And I own two investment properties. I recently adopted my daughter, who's two now, and my priorities have changed.

Yes, Congratulations. Thank you very much. So I want to know if I should be just selling my rental properties, what to do about, um, increasing my retirement. I have $15,000 in credit card debt, um, which I am in the process already. I've had three credit cards. I already paid one off. Okay. Good job. Um, yeah. And, um, yeah, so I need your help and you do to tell me, um, if I should just get rid of these properties. How many is it? Um, there's two. So, um, one is a, just a simple duplex and the other one is two flat plus a basement apartment. How much do you owe on each and how much are they worth? Could you sell them for?

Yeah. So the one that the duplex is worth $144,000 and the other one is worth, I'm sorry, I owe $144,000 and the other one I owe $396,000. Okay. What could you get them for? The one that's $144,000, I could get $242,000, which I haven't earned much equity on it. I bought it for $180,000. It's ridiculous. And then the other one, which I recently bought three years ago, that I can get $550,000. Okay. All right. Okay, good. So yeah, $250,000 pretty much you could cash out before taxes and fees and everything. Okay. And then your retirement, you have $100,000. How much are you making a year in your job? I make between $100,000 to $120,000. I work for the school district, so I make $100,000 during the school year. And then

over the summer, I can work privately. So I make about $20,000 more. That's great. That's so great. And you have the credit card debt of $15,000, any other debt or is it just that? Um, just that I don't have student loans. I don't have car. Um, the one thing that, the one thing that I do have is, so I'm in California right now and I'm living in my parents' home, but I pay the mortgage. Um, they helped me out by buying this house back in like 2013 because I was, I made the big, the big mistake that you guys always say not to do is buy a house with a fiance before he was my husband. That was a bad decision. And so my credit got hit, so I couldn't afford anything. So my parents said, you know what, instead of renting, you want to just buy a house and you pay the mortgage. So I've been doing that.

And their plan is to, yeah, for me to, this is my house, like to own the home. So they would transfer the loan, the title, whatever, over to me and the equity is mine. Okay. When will that happen? I mean, we couldn't do that right away. It's just a matter of finding out what the process is and if that's even doable with the type of loan that it is okay um do you have any liquid savings i have uh another problem i have two thousand dollars in my bank account right now. I had, I had, um, $20,000, but I used that money one to pay off

the last credit card, the one credit card. That's good. That's right. Uh-huh. And then the other, the rest of it was, I went to Chicago where I'm originally from and I was not working. So I lived off that to pay. Yeah. So now I only have $2,000. Okay. So the good news is you don't have a ton of consumer debt. It's the $15,000. You could probably knock that out fairly quickly with your income. And then you've got these assets, about $250,000 of equity if you were to offload them. So you've got options here. And then the next part of the equation is just assuming everything continued going as it is now, right? You're 50 years old. Let's say you plan to retire at 65. You've got 100,000 saved in retirement now. If you just

kept contributing, once you clear out this credit card debt, you save up three to six months of expenses. If you just contribute 15%, just contribute 15 1500 a month for the next 15 years you're going to retire with over a million dollars so that's okay that's as it sits now which and as a teacher will you have a pension well is there a good question yeah yeah so i'm a therapist and yes i i only have a so I'm currently working through an agency and they don't offer a pension, but I was working through the district directly in the past. So I do have somewhat of a pension in California and in Illinois, but that only adds up to like 60,000 right now.

Okay. Well, that's great. 60,000 a year is what it'll end up being. No, that's 60,000 that's there yeah just a lump sum oh I hear you yeah when do you have okay do you have access to it like when do you if it's just a lump sum when do you get access to it and it is it something that you could take and reinvest until you're ready for it um I don't know if I could take it and reinvest. I know I have access to it once I retire,

but I don't know if I could pull it now and put it. Is it growing well? Do you know what percentage it's growing year after year? I don't know that. Those are the questions that I need to ask. No, no, you're great. And I think, yeah, I would find that out. Because I think the more information you have, Maria, around the situation, even Jade just

plugging in, you know, your info for the next 15 years and an investment calculator, like, oh, a million dollars. Okay. This is feeling, this is feeling better, right? So, so what I would do if I were you, I would sell the two properties. I mean, at this point, I think, you know, being in real estate and all of that, it's not paid for, and I think it's going to cause more stress. And I think you need the money. I mean, I think at 50 years old, you know, being in real estate and all of that, it's not paid for. And I think it's going to cause more stress. And I think you need the money. I mean, I think at 50 years old, you're going to be able to do some really great things investing wise for your future with that money. Did the income you quoted include the profit from the rentals? No. Okay. How much do you make for those per month? So right now, the one that's the single house, that one,

I was making about, let's see, Christine, about $800 a month. The problem with that is that... $800 a month in San Francisco? No, no, no. That's in Chicago. Oh, so these aren't even in your... These are both in Chicago and you're in San Francisco. Yeah. Even more reason. Then I would definitely sell them, Maria. Definitely. I would not be a long distance landlord with, with this bill. Yeah. So, um, if I were you, I would find a great real estate agent. You can actually go to

ramseysolutions.com slash real estate or slash agent. And there's Ramsey trusted agents in that area. And you can interview a couple of them, check out them and use one of them because they, you know, basically do exactly what we teach and they're going to help you through the process. But I would say that I just bought even the one that I just bought like three years ago. Yeah. Yeah. It's long distance, number one. And to your own point, you could use access to that money because the next step then is I would get with a smart investor pro. And if you find out that the deal with the parents house and all that is going to be a longer than five year play, like you could invest this money for the short term. And then when you're ready to come back to it, that could be the money that helps you have your own property in cash. Right. But wouldn't I get dinged with taxes if I just use the equity from these two properties?

If I just invest them rather. You will pay some capital gains. Yeah. But it's been over a year. So. So, yeah, there will be. There will be some taxes, but there'll be taxes when it sells eventually as well. Yeah.

Yeah. So I would I would offload. I would want my plan. One more detail on there, my plan is to be closer to family in Chicago, so I wanted to buy a home in Chicago, a single family home for my daughter and I. And when the time comes,

you could do that, but you're kind of, you're projecting really far in the future, and there's nothing to say that you're going to want to live in either one of these properties that you've been renting out for X amount of years.

Yeah. I mean, I, yeah, usually, you don't want to move back into something that's been've been renting out for X amount of years. Yeah. I mean, I. Yeah. Usually you don't want to move back into something that's been rented out to families for the last five to six years. You're going to want your own thing. So, yeah, Maria, I would sell those. I would use that money, pay off the credit card debt, get a good emergency fund of three to six months of expenses, and then sit down with a smart investor pro and look at your yeah, look at your income, look at the cash you have and your investing strategy going forward. Because I think that's going to bring you peace knowing that you and your daughter are going to be taken care of, you know, in the next, you know, five to 10 years down the road. To find a Ramsey trusted real estate agent that can help you buy or sell your house the way we

teach, visit ramsesolutions.com slash agent or click the link in the show notes. The Ramsey Show question of the day is brought to you by WhyRefi. WhyRefi refinances defaulted private student loans and builds a custom loan based on your ability to pay. Now, you guys, private student loans are different than federal student loans like Sally Mae. So to learn more about this custom refinancing option and a lump sum payoff option that you can qualify for after 24 months, go to yrefi.com slash Ramsey. That's Y, the letter Y, refi.com slash Ramsey

may not be available in all states. Okay, today's question comes from Matthew in Oregon. He says, my wife and I are debt-free except our expensive townhome. We bought it in 2022 with a 30-year term mortgage. Our monthly payment is about $4,200 a month, including escrow and PMI, while our net take-home pay is $8,750 a month. Wow. Our annual gross income is $110,000, which means our housing costs take up about 40% of our income, which limits how much we can invest. We both have the potential for income growth, but today's high cost of living is challenging, especially with four kids.

We're in baby step four, five, and six, but still feel trapped. It's hard to see a finish line of no mortgage payment. Should we stay where we're at and wait for our income to grow or sell our house and move? This is one of those reality moments, Rachel. I think that if you're truly engaged in what's going on financially in your home, these are the moments where it's really tough because for those of you who don't know here, we teach that your payment shouldn't be any more than 25% of your take-home pay. And the reason for that is once it creeps beyond that, especially beyond 30%, is you really do start to feel that. And you start to experience what we call being house poor and your blessing on the house now becomes a burden, right? Because you're not able to have the margin to do the things that life calls for. mean in this case it could be anything from child care it could be

anything from they're wanting to pay off their mortgage and they don't have any margin yeah well and if you're in baby step four you're funding 15 of your income in your retirement so automatically that's taking it you have 45 of your income to live off of that's before food and utilities and everything yeah so it does it starts to dwindle um not always like in the right spots right and so and if you give 10 forget about it that's right yeah that's right now you're down to 35 and for basic living so yeah it's almost that feeling of like we work too hard to feel this broke you know what i mean like we shouldn't feel like this um and it is because 40 of your income is going to housing and so yeah um yeah i mean i i would be looking elsewhere because you say an expensive townhome which i'm assuming

is a really nice one um probably in a nice area yeah and so i would be looking for other options you know you may be getting an older home it may not be near the city because that's usually where prices go up that's right the closer you are to the city um so you may be moving out and all of it which i know with four kids i know it's so easier said than done just like oh yeah get up and move i know that that's like yes could be changing schools all of this but the quality of your life and going to bed at night and having peace and not stressing and not being you know to this point of like on a like you just feel like oh my gosh i just go to i go to a job and i have no progress in my life like that is daunting that's for the birds you go think about how much time you spend at work you go to work all day eight hours a day some people far more

than that and then you you feel like you have nothing to show for you can't enjoy your life you can't do the things that make you feel like you're making progress in life then there's the part of this uh equation rachel where they do see um a way for their income to go up now there's the part of this equation, Rachel, where they do see a way for their income to go up. Now, there's been times people have called in the show and they're like, hey, I'm at 30 percent of my income, but I know that I have a raise coming up in the next 12 months. Yeah. And if we get that raise, you know, it'll equal out. And so there's a part of that where if they said, hey, we see a place where we're going to get, you know, a 15% increase. Both of us.

Both of us. And that's going to happen in the next 12 months. Maybe there's a part of this where you can ride it out. That's right. But only if that's 100% absolutely going to be true. Yes. Yeah. Don't be on a wish and a prayer of it may be happening.

And then you're stuck in the cycle for the next four to five years because that's going to be exhausting. Yeah. All right. Let's go to Will in Miami. Hi, Will. Welcome to the show. Hello. How are you? Doing great. How can we help? Yes. So my parent, my father bought a car years ago. This is a Mercedes. He's a retiree surgeon and he now works as a surgical assistant. Here, since all the recession and all the all the economic problems we've been going through the country, that area of health, he hasn't been able to get a job for the last year. He has some stuff on and off, but he hasn't been able to have a stable job. The payment for this car is $500 a month, $550 plus insurance.

That rounds up to somewhere between $650 to $700 a month. And because he doesn't have a job right now, it's been really difficult to maintain all the expenses. What's he doing to maintain it? I mean, right now, all our family family is working we are immigrants and everybody contributes you're paying for your dad's car payment no i'm not i'm just saying that everybody's paying their first share but uh the car right now is one of those crazy expenses. Are you in the same, are you all under the same roof? Yes. Okay. And so explain to Rachel and I kind of how that works. When you say everybody's paying their fair share, what does that mean? So between my sister and I, we, our rent is $3,000. My sister and I pay about half of that. Okay. And the rest of the expenses

are covered by our parents. Although we didn't start paying until recently, until about six months ago. My sister just graduated from college. I still a student okay how old are you well oh i'm i'm 28 i'm just a late bloomer student that's great i was just curious that's great okay so it's just you and your sister the the agreement is we all kind of live under one roof but together you guys pay for half of the rent and we pay for the other half and everything else yes and so you're concerned that since your dad is not working, how is he affording to pay for this Mercedes or this expensive car that he has? I mean, to be honest, we cannot afford anything right now.

Even though we are able to cover the basics, that doesn't cover the credit card debts my parents have. That's why I believe that the car is one of the things that is taking them down. Oh, go ahead, Rachel. Well, so, okay, a couple of things, Will. Where did you guys immigrate from? I'm just curious. Oh, we are originally from Venezuela. Okay, yeah couple of things, Will. Where did you guys immigrate from? I'm just curious. Oh, we are originally from Venezuela. Okay, yeah, yeah.

We've been here for eight years. We became citizens last year. Okay. The only reason I ask is I do find, even in the Hispanic culture, there is this gathering of family, right? There is more than just the standard American. It's like, oh, Americans,

I just feel like we're more independent, and you just kind of run on your own track. It's like, oh, it's, you know, Americans, I just feel like we're more independent and you just, you know, you run on your own track. Where other countries, other cultures, there is more of this like family oriented life. So I'm not saying one is wrong or the other will, but as a 28 year old guy,

and I know you want to support your parents and be there for them and all of it. For your own dignity, Will, as a man, emotionally, I do want you to somewhat separate what your parents have chosen with their own lifestyle versus what you're choosing, right? So they've chosen to, or he's chosen to have a Mercedes, okay? That's his choice. You have not done that. The credit cards, I don't know if the

credit cards are paying the light bill to keep the Keep the you know the house going That's one thing but if it's credit card Debt that's coming from your parents That charge their own cards for their own lifestyle That is that is their money And their choices It does get a little bit confusing

When you are living under one roof So I think well emotionally I would detach myself from your parents' choices. And until they start affecting you, which they might soon, Will, there may be a point that you say, hey, I'm going to have to make a different decision for my life. Yeah. And I may have to go get a job, pause school, and do something different because I'm not going to be taken under because of their bad choices. But here's the thing, Will. Jade and I joked earlier. We were like, it takes a lot of therapy to realize you can't change people. You cannot change people. So I hope that helps, Will. You're an awesome son,

and we wish you the best. Thanks to all the guys in the booth. Jade, thanks always for being a great co-host. Thanks to our live studio audience here in Nashville. Thank you, America. This is The Ramsey Show. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I am Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with my good friend and bestselling author, Jade Warshaw. And we are here to answer your questions. So give us a call at 888-825-5225. We'll be answering your questions about life, about money, relationships, career, anything or everything. We are here for you, America. All right, up next, we have Josh in Sacramento, California. Hey, Josh, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me and taking

my calls. Absolutely. Straight to the point. I for having me and taking part in my calls. Absolutely. Kind of straight to the point. Straight to the point. I live in the People's Republic of California. I'm trying to leave this state. What I have a problem with is it's kind of financial and life career as well. So right now I'm a federal government employee.

I am seven years out from retirement or when I'm eligible. My wife is a nurse. She makes really good money in California, and they make her earn anywhere from $90 an hour. My goal is to, one, sell my house, transfer to a different position and to a different state within the same agency. Just because I have a very toxic work environment going on right now and I need to get out. But the problem is if my wife leaves the state of California,

she'd go from $90 an hour to $30 an hour, which is a huge financial cut. She'd also probably lose her 401k as well as that. We did talk about doing foster to adopt in the event that we did move. But my question to you, I guess, is am I just being – cutting my nose off the spite of my face and just try to deal with it, knowing the fact that I have seven years left of retirement, my house will be paid off in four years. You sound like you're at the end of your, like, rope. You sound really frustrated. Oh, I am.

I'm very frustrated. Yes, I'm very frustrated. I've wanted to transfer and get out of the state for 17 years of my career. Does your wife want to leave as well? Besides the money. I know she'll take a pay cut, but just in general? Her family's here, but she realizes how frustrated I am. And like I said,

my boss is just utterly horrible right now. And it's been going on for a long time. Oh yeah. Yes, it has. So my question to you is, my being emotionally stupid by wanting to leave just so I can quote unquote have a more happy life to trade one

stress for another for financial stress. Is it California? Like, okay, so if you work for the state. It's California. The state sucks. The high taxes, getting out of everything. Alright.

Okay, you are, yeah, you're at your wits end. You're done. You're done. Okay. So if you were to leave, what would you do and where would you go? I'd basically stay with the same travel agency. I would go from what I'm doing now to basically do just a different function or job function, but just to the same pay.

Is there a different... I would get it a little bit... It would be a lower cost of living, which would be $13,000 a year. Where? But I'd imagine that... So it'd be from California, possibly to Georgia. Okay.

But I'm wondering if... Why Georgia? Well, that's where the position is at for my agency. Have you ever been to Georgia? Okay. Have you ever been? Yes, I have. Okay.

What's your wife think about Georgia? Sections of it she hates. Okay. Because here's the thing, Josh. I mean, I can hear you're frustrated and I mean, I could only imagine. I mean, I understand it is from like just the state perspective that you're frustrated with. And then

on top of that, you have a terrible job. You go and work somewhere for 40, 50 hours a week yeah in a miserable place so yeah you're you're not in a good this isn't like a good headspace for josh so my question is um you're not the only one in this equation right so your wife is is gonna have as much of an input um in this in this decision too because um i think that there there has to be this you know i don't know but if she is not on board resentment later on in life you know moving away from family yeah going to a place she hates she's going to end up being you in four years possibly i don't know but

that's a warning sign it's just like you guys need to be so tight-knit on this decision because it's a big deal to move across the country um yeah so so you guys need to lock arms and like be full like we are in this together the the good the bad the ugly we are in this together because i don't want your marriage to be destroyed in the process either right and i want to be able to give her a voice too and her frustrations may not be as deep as yours um and i don't want her and i and honestly josh the motivation for her, I'm like, I, there's a part of me that I'm like, I would hate for her to do it just to,

just to make you happy. Cause, cause Josh is frustrated. So we got to go do what Josh wants to do. Right. So like there needs to be a level of agreement upon you guys. And I thought plan B too, which I know you hate California,

but is there a different position you could take where you guys live? A different job, a different opportunity, at least to get out of the toxicness of that job and then just have the frustrations with the taxes in California? I don't know. But if you and your wife agree to move to Georgia, then make the move. You're not. No. Leaving a job seven years away from retirement is not stupid because the work is you're, you're in a terrible situation. So no,

that is not stupid to leave that. No, I listen, I, I am of the mind that if one spouse is completely unhappy, then the, neither, nobody's happy.

That's true. So I do think that probably a move is good, but if she has come out and said, I don't really like Georgia, then Georgia has got to be off the table. You've got to pick a place where both of you are like yeah i feel yeah i'm up for that adventure and i mean there's 50 i don't want to say 50 states what is it now 49 no it's 50 but don't the other territories count okay so there's 50 states and then some territories depending on what history book you look in okay and so there's a lot of options here is what I'm saying. Going back to the conversation

about the 401k quickly, what made you say that she'd lose her 401k? So, so, well, I wouldn't say she would lose her 401k. What she'd do is she would stop contributing to her 401k. So she'd be able to take it out. Yeah. You just transfer it. You just transfer it. Right. Okay. I just want to be clear about that. So I guess the issue is me is you know i've only got seven years left my mortgage will be done in four years on my house my wife is like going from 90 an hour to basically 30 if she decides to work if not then it's like it's a huge let me ask let me ask you this is there any world where you're like i is there any world where you're willing to ride this out longer because you're the person who brought up in just seven years, I'll retire.

And in just four years, I'll have my car paid off. So, or I'm sorry, my house paid off. So do you really care about those things? Or do you know what I'm saying? Like, are those things that you're weighing in or are you beyond that? So here's the problem. Emotionally and mentally, I and mentally, I am checked out. The problem is I don't want to live life on the emotional aspect.

I know logically, financially, it makes more sense to stay. However, I don't know if I can emotionally and mentally handle it for any of those years. Yeah, mentally and emotionally is going to be, because you could be debt-free and still be miserable in your job. And you're not saying this is after six months you've said for years for years you've been upset yeah i thought out most of my career probably about 10 the last 10 years of my career so it's safe to say that you have sacrificed a certain why have you stayed in it josh i'm curious what was that why have you stayed in it for 10 years? The pension and early retirement.

Okay, so this is a good lesson for America, that money does not equate to happiness. There is a level of your life that, as adults, we have to decide to bring a level of peace and to work a crappy, I would say a different word, but we're on a family-friendly show, crappy, crappy situation just to make a paycheck. You guys, it's not worth it. It's not worth it. Life is too short. Life is

too short, Josh. So you and your wife, I would sit down. You guys, yeah, pick a place on the map and say, we're going to transfer. And we may even be in different careers, but we're going to find a level of peace and enjoyment. And we may make less, but people that make less and live within their means and work somewhere, they're happy. So yeah you gotta yeah josh y'all gotta make some changes for sure and you should have made them eight years ago if i'm being honest not to shame you but it's true we need to make some decisions here josh we're rooting for you come to nashville this is the ramsey show what does the future hold for business? Ask nine experts and you'll get ten different answers. Economic growth or a recession.

Business taxes will go up or down. AI will help us work or it will replace us all. But there's no such thing as a crystal ball. That's why more than 40,000 businesses have future-proofed themselves with NetSuite by Oracle, the number one cloud enterprise resource planning system. Ramsey Solutions uses NetSuite, and you should too. Whether your company's earning millions or even hundreds of millions, NetSuite helps you respond to immediate challenges and seize your biggest opportunities. With one unified business

management suite, there's only one source of truth for the visibility and control you need to make quick decisions. NetSuite's real-time insights and forecasting help you see into the future with actionable data. And when you're closing the books in days, not weeks, you can spend less time looking backward and more time focusing on what's next. And speaking of what's next, download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine Learning at netsuite.com slash Ramsey. It's free at netsuite.com slash Ramsey. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. So one of the, I would say, pillars of winning financially that is so key is doing a budget, being intentional with where your money goes, where your income is going,

because your income is going to help you live the life that you want. And that includes being debt-free. That includes having savings and investing and spending and giving and all the things. It comes from your income. So being intentional with that is really important. So our app, EveryDollar, helps you do that. And it's fantastic. And we have people, gosh, I mean, millions that are subscribed and that are building budgets every single month. And we love sometimes to walk through those. And Jade, you do this a lot, even on your social. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, I put out a call a while back and I said, hey, if you want me to review your budget, you know, fill out this Google Doc.

And so many of you got back to me. And it's really been fun to go through budgets. And so, Rachel, today, one of those budgets that was submitted, we actually have Natalie on the line from Chattanooga, Tennessee. So, Natalie, you told me, are you there? Yes, I'm here. So you told me it's you and your husband, right? You're a mortgage analyst. No, I'm not. I'm actually a stay-at-home mom. Stay-at-home mom. Is anybody a mortgage analyst? No, my husband is a chemist. Oh, wow. Why don't I have that on here? All right. Well, stay at home, mom, a chemist. Is it right that you make $80,000? Just about that.

Yeah. So I want to say his income is about $73,000. And then I make around an extra $6,000 a year through like a fixed side hustle that I'm doing. And then I also have another side hustle on top of that. Cool. Good for you. And so after taxes, after some little bit of investing you're doing and after insurance, you guys are bringing home around $4,884 a month. That's what you put on your form. Yeah. Yeah, that's correct. Yeah. Just around 4,900. Yeah. That's pretty much what I've calculated. Okay, cool. So with everything that you said you have in your budget, which as a matter of fact, we can pull it up on the screen here. So let's just kind of like go through this budget so

everybody can see up at the top, that black number, $342. That is your margin. That's what's left over after we've put in everything that you said you spend money on every single month. So just going through here real quick, we see the mortgage here, $1,556, which is a little bit over the 25% that we talk about. Water, internet, all that looks good. Sewer looks good. Groceries, $800. Is it just you and your husband or you have kids as well?

So we've got four kids, yeah. Wow. The grocery budget is... Listen, that's great. Yeah. For a six... Then you can do it for $800. That's fantastic.

Amazing. Yeah, I'm trying to... Yeah, I do a lot of cooking from scratch and I make bread, like all that. My girl. So I've really slimmed it down. That's great. I find that to be actually very impressive.

Okay, so transportation, $250 on gas, phone, $140. Like, this is a bare-bones budget. I see auto insurance. It looks like you've got term life insurance. That's really good. But then we see that there are three debts here. A student loan, which if I click into it, the balance is $11,000. And then you've got this car payment yeah we we've shaved the the first student loan down to eighty seven hundred nice yeah we're checking away at that yeah so we're putting trying to put like a minimum of a thousand dollars a month to um that first loan okay so that's that's a great segue so we see that your margin is $342,000. How are you coming up with this full $1,000? Where is that money coming from? Well, I think when I originally submitted those numbers, we had still had some cell phones that we were paying off. So we've taken care of those.

Okay, great. little extra margin there. And then just through my other side hustle, we try and meet that $1,000 minimum is kind of our goal each month. So we're trying to hit that at least. And then whatever we can make on top of it, we've been just throwing up the debt as well. Okay. So it sounds like, so there's kind of like four areas that we really look for where people can cut. Like there's more than four, but there's like four key areas that we kind of zone in on when we really look for where people can cut like there's more than four but there's like four key areas that we kind of zone in on when we're looking at someone's budget and it feels like you're doing two of the four which is your side hustling like you're bringing in extra money we're usually looking for people to bring in like an extra 800 to a thousand dollars

you're doing that it sounds like uh we're always looking for areas where we can cut costs and your budget is super bare bones you know with kids and kids and having an $800 grocery budget, I feel like that's a green check as well. But then there's two other areas that I am wondering about. You did, at least when you submitted this, you told me that you guys are investing $200 a month. So, yeah, actually, we stopped investing. I finally convinced him. Nice. Okay.

So what that set up. That's adding to the $1,000 too, probably. Correct. Good. Wonderful. I think it was actually closer to like $250 that was coming out of his check every month. So we got that extra money as well. So we're not currently investing.

So that's three green checks. And then the fourth one is your withholding. Like, do you guys get a tax return every year? We do. Yeah. And it's usually a pretty good amount. I should probably have them double check that. Yeah.

So the refund is usually a pretty good amount. A basic way you can look at that is to just see, okay, what's the refund? Let's say it's, I don't know, $ thousand dollars or six whatever it is divide it by 12 and then you're like hey that's money that i could have back into my budget every month so if i were to give you homework coming off this call it would be that so that going into you know uh the new year for sure that you guys are having more money in your budget but i love that you made the progress on the student loan because the way i calculated it here, I took a look at your budget. If you could get the amount that you're paying extra on this debt up to $2,000,

like if you're paying an extra $2,000, you guys are out of your debt free in less than 24 months, which is just sounds so amazing. I mean, that's great. I feel it for you. I mean, seriously. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, it's powerful what happens to when you actually start living on a plan. How long have you guys been doing living on a budget and doing every dollar? Yeah. Well, so we've been on a budget for forever, but I would say we've been really intentional about paying off the debt since March because we've just had kids like every year in the last like six years so that's just really been the focus and now that we're like you know taking a break from like having babies and being pregnant and all that we're like all right let's tackle this debt you know so good because I was

going to say when you start living intentionally like with the budget every single month you may find oh yeah that was money going out there that I forgot about. Or I forgot about that Apple subscription or whatever, you know. And it could be $20, $30, $40 here or there. But for you guys, I mean, that makes a significant difference, you know. For sure. Yeah. And I think that was the issue. in March decided like, hey, we're going to do this. It was kind of me sitting down with him and saying like, I'm really sick and tired of like trying to like pull from savings every month

to like me, you know, because there's always that deficit of like, hey, we're overspending, so we need to pull from savings, but then we're not really going anywhere, if that makes sense. So Jade, on the first debt, the first student loan, how much is the payment a month? The first student loan, the payment is $184 a month. Okay. Because that's another great thing too, is that's another, you know, almost $200 freed up once that's paid off to throw at the next step too, right? So like you can count that quote unquote is found income too. Yeah. Our goal is to have this first debt completely paid off by either February or March because he typically gets

he gets an annual raise but also a bonus check that comes with that so whatever we get from that is literally just going to pay off that first one whatever's left over obviously up until that point and then we'll move on to the next one because you have two more so if I had if I had a piece of homework for you it would be to increase that margin with more side hustles. If you're doing $1,000 now, try to increase it by $1,000. And if you do that, then you're able to pay off that student loan and far, far exceed your timeline there.

And then if you do that, it frees up the money, like Rachel said, and you could pay off the $18,000 Chrysler in six months, just over six months, seven months, which is exciting. But I did want to ask you because last time I saw that you submitted this, you had $4,000 in savings and you had $2,000 in single stocks. And so that's also money that has the ability to be liquidated to put towards this. I'm not sure where that came from. We just have the emergency fund.

So we've just got the thousand dollars. But no, I don't know if maybe I put an error in there. Oh, okay. Okay. We really got no extra cash. Yeah. I guess that's probably the mortgage analyst, you know. Yeah.

Who knows where he came from. But this is great. Good job, Natalie. I love that. And Jade, you're so great, though, of walking through it because it's the truth. When you start living on purpose like that, you start to see like the nooks and crannies of your money situation and let it work for you.

That's the power of using your income. So great. Thanks for the call, Natalie. This is The Ramsey Show. There's a time in your life and in the baby steps for renting, but you don't want to do it forever because when you rent, you're still paying for a mortgage, just somebody else's. Plus,

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That's churchillmortgage.com. This is a paid advertisement. NMLS ID 1591. NMLS consumer access.org. Equal housing lender. 1749 Mallory Lane, Suite 100. RentWin, Tennessee 37027. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. We just went over a budget live here last segment. And Jade, you're actually going to be doing a webinar, walking people through the every dollar budget, how to budget, what budgeting looks like, how you actually put this into practice day in and day out. Yeah, we're just doing a live training. It's going to be Thursday, September 12th. So tomorrow, and you can get the clarity that you finally need with your money. And we're going through just like we did with Natalie before the break. We're going through those four areas where you can find money in your budget because most of us, Rachel, could do with

an extra thousand or two thousand dollars in our budget. And it's real money that's waiting for you to find it. Right. So we're going to walk through that budget with you. And here's the thing. Over one hundred thousand people have registered for these free trainings in the past and they have come away with it with the tools they need to manage their money. And so really now it's your turn to really get involved. And yeah, don't wait. And we answer your questions when we do these webinars where they are live. And, you know, we'll sometimes pull up a question or you can comment. And if anything, honestly, seeing other people, I mean, it's up to 7,000 people that can be in it live. I mean, you're seeing everyone comment on the side.

That's what I love the chat going because it's people from all over and all have a similar goal. Usually have a similar emotion around it with a lot of you know fear and shame a lot of people that live paycheck to paycheck their entire life and they're trying to make a change so uh it's really motivating to see other people on the journey so make sure to check it out and they can sign up yeah you can sign up you can go to everydollar.com slash webinar to sign up and or you can click the link in the description if you're listening on youtube or if you're listening on podcast. So that's tomorrow, September 12th. All right. Up next, we have Blake in Bowling Green, Kentucky. Hey, Blake. Welcome to the show.

Hey, Jade. Hey, Rachel. How y'all doing? We're doing great. How can we help? So to expedite this story, I bought a farm, but come with a house at 17 i paid 60 000 for it and put 20 000 down i cash flowed all the renovations and now my wife and three kids we all live here and we've outgrown this house and we're going to sell it i would say the house and farm is conservatively worth $350,000. Wow, that's great. And we owe $35,000 on the farm. But the question that I have is my wife has $80,000 in student loans.

Do we take some of this money that we're going to use to build another house and buy another farm? Do we take that equity and put it all towards the student loans? Yes. Yes. Yep, I would. Because I wouldn't encourage you guys to go back into homeownership until you're at a point where you have debt paid off in a fully funded emergency fund. And the equity you're about to get is going to be able to do all of that, plus be able to put some money down on a new build or a new construction loan. Is that the only, Blake, is that the only debt you guys have is this $80,000? We made a bonehead mistake and took out a loan for a camper um in in march which we've dove headfirst into your all's um plan and trying to pay this debt off we paid 15 000 in the past

three months good for you guys that's. So we owe 18 on the camper. Okay. And yes, that's the only debt we have is really the camper. Okay. Yeah, I would pay both off then. How much do you guys make a year? About $200,000. $200,000.

Okay, that's great. Yeah, I mean, always kind of my friendly warning, if we were all hanging out, I'd probably say this to you, is whenever you get a lump sum of money, and we find this with people that may get money from insurance or they be able to do that in one day um it's a really amazing gift to be able to do that but also you're skipping a little bit of the sacrifice in the process to get out of that debt which usually makes people never want to go back in because they've had to get extra jobs and sacrifice lifestyle and they feel this pain associated with debt and getting out uh and you guys aren't going to have that necessarily. I mean, you're going to kind of go through and wipe it out, which again, is such a gift. And you guys have been so smart on all of it. So I think, though, it takes an extra step of you and your wife sitting down, shaking hands, pinky promising. I mean, all the things that we're never going back into this because, you know, you're going to have to. And I heard

that from you a couple of times of, oh, gosh gosh we made this mistake and that mistake so um that's my only level of um of advice when it comes to you guys going forward um that the behavior really has been changed and and i believe it has for you guys the way the way you're talking but um but i'm excited for y'all i mean that's great I mean you'll come out You know after Gosh you'll pay taxes and all of that So yeah you may have Enough how much of a house

New construction loan are you guys going to take out Do you know We don't want to take out any more than About $450,000. Okay. So I'm thinking with all this debt paid off from home equity, hopefully we can put down about $200,000. Yeah, possibly.

It might be a little thin because you'll be paying some taxes. So, yeah, I would run some of those numbers, but it could be close. And then i would want you guys to have an have some cash to aside just for an emergency fund above what you're going to put down we do have a 25 000 three to six month emergency fund put up oh blake all right so you got 25 grand yeah okay that buys you that buys you a little bit more yeah for sure and if you guys wanted to just have fun pay off the camper today with that money before you know put the house for sale and everything i mean you could yeah you could you could do some of this now the other problem that

the problem that me and my wife are going back and forth on is her student loans are able to be forgiven because it's like a public service forgiveness. If she pays monthly for 10 years, then the entirety of the loan is forgiven. Yes. Is that something we should look into? No, I wouldn't for two reasons. Usually to get that forgiveness, you have to be in some type of line of work for that long to be able to qualify for it, which kind of just puts you in this position of being forced into something you may not want to be in and then honestly blake if

i'm being frank i mean in 10 years who knows what's going to be out there where congress is going to be who's going to be president i mean who knows between now and then and so the idea that you guys can do this on your own and have power over your situation without anyone else's influence or dependence on anyone else there's power in that and there's going to be more hope in you guys changing your lives and doing this than waiting for a program but i hear you know we get that question sometimes and and i get the benefit and for some people they've been in something and it's a year out then i'm like all right well if it's you're out yeah but i would not force myself into a box to be able to qualify for it and again if it's in you know eight to ten years

who knows what's going to be happening in dc i don't trust it right personally i don't trust it either yeah so um i hope that helps like well done you guys you i mean i can't believe you you guys bought that property again we'll say this for sixty thousand dollars when was this i bought it when i was a senior in high school in 2016 oh wow okay and you put twenty thousand down on the sixty thousand dollar property yes wow way to go and now it is three hundred and fifty thousand dollars that's incredible blake well done you guys i mean you you guys have made some smart decisions. And make sure again, with the with the sale of that, make sure you again, all the all the check marks are, you know, all the boxes are checked when it comes to taxes, capital gains, anything like that. Make sure you you do that your due diligence, making sure that's all covered. And

if you need a tax pro, Blake, or even a real estate agent, you know, you can go to Ramsey solutions.com and check out our trusted pros there to be able to help you through some of it. If you need that additional help, make sure to check them out. But yeah, that's, I mean, that's a... It doesn't get much better than that. That's a story everyone wants, I think. Oh my gosh.

So in 10 years, it appreciated like crazy. Yeah, that's really great. I'm happy for them. That camper is my only question mark you want to sell it i want to get rid of you know you know what everybody's not a camper person and they're they're camper people so i'm not going to you're not jade would you camp or camper i i would glamp uh-huh i'm with you i'd lamp my husband went uh away this weekend with some friends yeah and they basically stayed in a

house that didn't have air conditioning or walls or it was basically camping. And he like had the he like brought an air mattress. I was like, you are crazy. So yeah, but like, I'm sure you guys, I'm sure the camper was nicer than that. So yeah, you guys enjoy. Hey, you guys, health insurance costs are only moving one way, and that way isn't down. And if higher costs aren't enough, the wait times to see your doctor are longer, and it's harder than ever to get anything approved through the bureaucracy. So if you feel like the system is working against you, try a biblically-based alternative to health insurance, Christian Healthcare Ministries.

CHM is a health cost-sharing ministry that's helped hundreds of thousands of families like yours a biblically-based alternative to health insurance, Christian Healthcare Ministries. CHM is a health cost-sharing ministry that's helped hundreds of thousands of families like yours take care of over $11 billion in medical bills since 1981. And CHM has also helped them stay true to their values and avoid miles of red tape. And CHM support goes far beyond meeting financial needs. They'll also help meet spiritual needs. Members become part of a family who will pray with them and for them when they experience a medical event. So listen, y'all, there's no better way to take care of health care costs. CHM programs start as low as $98 a month. So learn more today and join at chministries.org slash budget at chministries.org slash budget. So one of the expenses that is hard to face as adults, but it's true. There's a couple of them, but one of them is insurance. And in recent years,

or recent months, I mean, i guess close to 18 months now they just seem to keep going up up up home auto i mean it's just it continues to rise and according to quadrant information services home insurance rates are about 23 percent higher than they were last year car insurance is up 39 compared to december of 2019 yeah it's it's a lot and the factors that are playing into it it's interesting so even if you look at like car insurance i mean you do have to think about where you live in the united states uh is climate a issue or do you live in a place where there's tornadoes and so there's hailstorms and it damages your vehicle. You know, it could be something like, I mean, wow, I just had to completely blank my brain out there.

No, but I mean, but yeah, you think about whether it's got tornadoes, rain, hurricane, anything that can be damaging your vehicle. Climate's a thing. And then you think about models, right? We're doing a lot more electric vehicles. There's more technology inside of them. And so there's that part of it.

And so by and large, we're seeing an increased amount of car accidents, which is interesting. electric vehicles there's more technology inside of them and so there's that part of it and so by and large we're seeing an increased amount of car accidents which is interesting okay so there's that's playing into it um some people would still say supply chain although part of me is like i feel like that's it's pretty much caught up i feel like do you remember though in that in that height of covid you would drive by a car lot and there would be like no cars it was so eerie and now now they're pretty full i would say the car lots are there might be some cars still on back order but i think for the most part you can yeah you can get if you need it and so you know a lot of people are probably like well what can we do about it and this right in here rachel is where what we teach really does play in because if you do buy a car in cash you run the if you buy

it in cash it's used then you are qualifying yourself for a lower rate. And so that right there is a good motivation. Obviously the car model that you choose still plays a part in it. How old you are still plays a part in it. So all of that plays a part. So there are some ways to get around this, but even when you do all those things correctly, there is still the idea, like it is getting higher. And that just, I mean, the truth is that that just that just sucks yeah and it's one of those expenses too that you're like I can't do anything about it right like when your property tax goes I mean whatever it is you're just like oh my gosh I just feel you feel stuck you feel trapped because you have to have it yeah but yet it's one of those things that just continues to rise I mean you could raise your deductible that's something that

you could do um you know there's another thing about if you buy your car in cash and you have enough money saved up that if something were to happen to that car you could replace it in cash then you could drop off like uh comprehensive insurance uh because you're like hey if something happens national like natural disaster something that's crazy i have the cash that i could actually repair it if i need to yeah yeah so there's things that you could do to save on it um but there's just a big part of this that it is you know it's frustrating yeah for sure yeah so there's other things that you can do um whether look for discounts you can even bundle policies and then you'll get a better deal yeah that way

but i would again shop rates because sometimes the bundles, it really is helpful. And sometimes if you're shopping from just like one carrier and you're not comparing prices, you may not be getting the best price. So make sure to do your research there. And I mean, the same thing's happening also with home insurance. We're seeing certain states are not willing to cover things that they once did. And again, some of this is linked to climate, some of it's linked to natural disasters, that sort of thing. thing and i mean we had a call the other day where a lady called in she said i'm being dropped from my insurance because my state has decided that they don't cover you if you have a flat roof and it's like okay great you know and so all of this at the very least it really ties

in what we teach and trying to put yourself in a position where you can have as much peace as possible so if these things do crop up it it's not a disaster. It's like, okay, this is very inconvenient because I've set myself up. I can deal with it. And so that's how this works. If you want to work with an independent insurance agent, you could contact a Ramsey Trusted Insurance Pro. The good thing about our Ramsey Trusted insurance pros is they are going to advise you and help you do things the way we teach and so that's what you're looking for they're not tied to any one carrier and they'll put pull quotes from all companies to help you pick the best deal so you can go to ramsey solutions.com slash bundle to get connected and to start saving money on your

insurance because it is a part of the budget it's just part of it part of the life part of the budget. It's just part of it. Part of the life that we live. Yes. All right. Up next, we have, is it Shay in Chicago? Hey, welcome to the show. Hi, thank you so much for having me. Absolutely. I'm going to make this quick. I'm thinking of doing a voluntary repossession of my car. And I'm just wondering if that's a good idea.

Well, I'm going to call it. Well, let me rephrase that. I call it a voluntary repossession but i'm really trying to get rid of some debt i'm tired of paying a car note i thought that was the right idea yes but can we sell it can we sell it that's my goal i'm hoping to try to sell it to the dealership um and i'm assuming of course can we sell it private sale ah i'm not well i currently pay on it so i'm not sure if you can okay to be, I guess. Okay. So here's what I would do. I would not give it back to the dealer.

I would not do a voluntary repossession, even though that's not what you meant. I would never do that because that's going to destroy your credit and just be heartache. And I wouldn't sell it back to the dealer because they're not going to give you the best price for the vehicle. If I were you, what kind of vehicle is it? It is a Buick Encore GX. Okay. What year?

2021. Okay. is it it is a buick encore gx okay what year 2021 okay i'd get on kelly blue book today after you get off this call and i'd see how much can i get for this private sale what do you owe on it um 22 000 okay and just your best guess if you're like hey i have done a little bit of research what do you think you could get for it i'm hoping to get at least 20 000 okay so if you thought that giving it back to the dealership would give you $20,000, then I bet blue booking it, you might be able to break even on this. Just based off of what you've said. Yeah, Shay, what's causing you to get rid of it?

Is it just because the payment is so high? Yes, and honestly, I'm just trying to get out of debt. I want to be able to pay off. My mom and I just bought a family duvet. So I want to put my money into paying this off, not a car not a car yeah do you have any other debt yes i do have credit card debt nine thousand dollars okay anything else no how much do you make a year um i make seventy three thousand dollars a year good for you that's so great okay what's caused you to to just up and say i got how i want to get out of

debt I don't want to do this anymore I'm just tired of living the life that I've been living I don't feel like I'm living like a 25 year old you know I'm making okay money and I'm not seeing the benefits from it yeah for sure well done I mean that's that's a good why we usually say people that start saying god something's got to change uh a lot of it comes like that to say i work hard and i don't feel like i have anything to show for it it's just this feeling of i mean there's nothing and i'm and yeah and you're 25 making 73 000 that's a lot that's great where'd the credit card debt come from because you've got a good income honestly poor decisions um and then also before i got this car, I had a car that was giving me trouble.

So I was putting some money into it, put it on my credit card, trying to get it fixed. And it honestly still ended up going out on me. So see, I love this car. I love when people stop and realize that they have a choice. Like you don't have to keep going the way you've been going. You have a you can opt out of that lifestyle and you can go you know what yeah i want to do better than this i want to feel like i'm making an impact i want to feel like my income matters i don't want to keep living like this so bravo i think so great shay have you been have you

plugged into the ramsey baby steps at all no i have not okay so i would i would encourage you to to um yeah dive into some of the stuff we'll have christian pick up and we'll we'll give you financial peace university which is our our nine week course that we always say every high school Yeah dive into some of the stuff We'll have Christian pick up And we'll give you Financial Peace University Which is our nine week course That we always say every high schooler should have taken But at 25 if you can get this Shay because there's a process Because your emotions there

The decision in Shay has been made That I don't want to live like this anymore So now the best way to be effective Of this and to actually see a lot of Impact is to have A step-step process of what you do. So, Shay, we have what's called the Ramsey Baby Steps, which the first thing you do is gonna get a $1,000 emergency fund.

The second thing you're gonna do is pay off all of your debt, smallest to largest. So it'd actually be you getting rid of this car, which is great, and then knocking out the credit card. So if you have multiple credit cards, write each of those out separately, smallest amount to largest amount, regardless of the interest rates. Pay minimum payments on everything and pay off that smallest credit card first and work your way up. I would be getting a side hustle. I mean, I would do anything

I could to knock this out. And again, you make some great money. So even limiting your lifestyle, living on a budget, doing a couple of those things is going to help you and then your next goal shay will be to get a fully funded emergency fund three to six months of expenses saved in the bank okay and what i mean could you how would that feel right now if you had no debt and you had five months of expenses saved in the bank how would that feel amazing amazing so good okay stay on the line. Christian will pick up and we'll give you some stuff to help you on your journey. I'm so glad that you called in. I know.

So great. Okay, those of you that are watching on YouTube or listening on podcasts, make sure to download the Ramsey Network app. We'll have the third hour there. If you're listening on radio, keep listening and we will be here in the next hour. Thanks to all the guys in the booth.

Thank you, Jade, for a great hour. And thank you, America. This is The Ramsey Show. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships.

I am Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with my friend and bestselling author, Jade Warshaw. And we are here to answer your questions. So give us a call at 888-825-5225. We talk about your life, your money, relationships, career, anything and everything. So give us a call. Up first, we have Jessica in San Diego. We actually had a couple here earlier in the lobby from San Diego.

Hi, Jessica. Welcome to the show. Hi. Thank you for having me. Oh, my God. I'm so excited you guys took my call. Oh, I'm so glad you called. Yes.

How can we help? Okay. So I have a little bit of a sticky situation. I'm in a serious relationship with my boyfriend. We've been together for about a couple years. We both have children. I have three younger ones. He has two adult children.

We just bought a house. Well, he bought it, but we live together. And his old house, he is having his adult children, who are 18 and 21 living there with zero response, zero financial responsibility. And I just need, I have some serious concerns, you know, like if this is going to be something longterm and I just need some help

helping him see like his financial support is kind of like hindering their ability to become more independent they're 18 and how old 21 I mean the hard part here you said you've been together for what a year or two years over two years over two years so the the hard part is it's his house and they're his kids. That's the hard part. And, you know, you're the girlfriend, not necessarily the fiance or the wife, that kind of thing. So you have to tread very, very lightly here.

And you live in the house with him. So that can make it feel like, hey, I have more of a say in this than maybe you actually do. What's it, what is it? So you're concerned that, hey, you're holding back the kids from, you know, being adults because they are adults. But what's the other part of this? Is there something that you think he should also be doing with his money? No, I mean, like, it definitely doesn't, like, cause any sort of sort of like he's fully capable of doing that. But previous to them living in there, he was renting a home out, had a profit. I work in real estate.

So I'm just kind of like, you know, from a professional standpoint, I'm like, why would you do that? Like, you know, you were making money off of your other home. And then his daughter had some issues with two different roommates. And it's just like turned into a big debacle that I guess that made more sense because either way he was paying for her apartment. But I think she is 18. I mean, like,

you know, I mean, I, my only grace in this is they're 18 and 21, which I guess legally they are adults, but they're not 35 and, you know, 40 or something, you know, I mean, they're, they're still, I mean, 18 David, Sharon Ramsey're not 35 and, you know, 40 or something.

You know, I mean, they're still, I mean, at 18, Dave and Sharon Ramsey were, I mean, I'll be frank, they were still supporting me in college. And when my sister moved back to Nashville for six months, she moved in with mom and dad. So my just question is, Jessica, like I understand, you know, the profit side, the money side of it that you're coming from but i mean have you talked to him about it because i mean has he because has he said oh yeah for the you know probably for two years i'm going to do this till they get on their feet and she leaves college or goes another year in school and has room i mean like what is he saying about it because

he's probably not saying oh yeah jessica they're going to stay in there until they're 30. well it's just kind of like a string of excuses that she has reasons why she can't go to school or she has reasons why she can't work full time. Is this the 18 year old? No, that's the 21 year old. Has there been other parts of his parenting that have bothered you with them, the way he's handled other situations, not just this one? No, it's very isolated. They have like some issues with their mom. So they are very guarded when it comes to me. So I don't really like have a whole lot of interaction with them. But him telling you stories over two years, if he's like, oh, yeah, I saw them this, you know, does he do things

With them Financially or otherwise That you're just like Oh that's enabling That's enabling I'm just wondering If this is a pattern In who he is

Or if he's just Stepping into his kids life For a season And helping them Oh yeah No It's a pattern And I mean

I have like I said Three other children And I mean Are you guys Combining finances Or are you living Strictly on yours And you're like Paying rents To live mean, I... Are you guys combining finances or are you living strictly on yours and you're like paying rent to live in his house? How are you guys doing financially?

Yeah, so he's mostly financially supporting the both of us. I mean, we have talks of getting married. We... Yeah, I mean, we just haven't quite taken that step. Okay, interesting. How long have you been talking about getting married? About a year. Yeah, I mean, we just haven't quite taken that step. Okay. Interesting. How long have you been talking about getting married?

About a year. Okay. Is he going to, what's the saying? Piss or get off the ladder? Piss or get off the pot. Paint or get off the ladder. Cook or get out the kitchen. Keep going on for days. There's a part of this that um there's a part of this that

you do kind of have to tread a little bit lightly with because of the reasons i stated before but there is a part of it that as if you're vetting him for marriage material you do kind of want to know how much does your opinion matter and how what he does when you state your opinion what he does with that information so when you have said to him, Hey, you know, it feels enabling. It feels enabling.

What does he say? Yeah. Yeah. So when it comes to the, his children and anytime, like I kind of like speak up about it or talk about it, he gets very protective and just kind of like shuts down. And I know that it has to do with, um, he and his ex wife were got divorced when they were very little, and they went through a traumatic time

just kind of going in between two households and have some long-term mental issues with that, if you want to say. He's very protective about them in that aspect and just kind of like I feel like he does it out of guilt almost. And he doesn't want them to, I mean, he's said it in the past. He doesn't want them to turn their back to him. Yeah. Yeah.

Which is a very normal response with parents that, especially through a divorce or something, you know, that they overcompensate with things or money to to keep that relationship going um so that that's very common yeah so jessica i mean i don't know i don't know about you jade my i'm trying to think if we were all sitting down having cocktails what i would say if you were my friend just counseling because you're blending how like you're blending past lives blending households blending like if you get to the point of he proposes right that is because truly with what you're saying as things are i don't see there being the switch that flips the moment he proposes where suddenly you're able to speak into all of this and da da da da

simply because he had a whole life for 20 and 17 years with these kids where you weren't a part of that and so that's the complexity that I see here and I'm like you're not going to get beyond this until you guys kind of enter into that together because it sounds like there is trauma there it sounds like he has layers of guilt and whatever else there and so part of this you have to figure out how much does this matter to me because they are adult children and well you know yeah and I think too Jessica I would ask myself if I were you what's really bothering me is it really that he's not getting rents from this house or is it that he's not having enough money maybe for the future is it because I see this as a string and this will be part of my life like what really is going on and that's the concern I would

probably bring to him not your kids shouldn't live there. It's, and again, never pointed at you. It's me. This is how I'm feeling about the situation. Um, that's what, that's what I would do. But again, Jessica, you're not his wife. You're not a fiance. I mean, there's, there's, there's not much of a say you can, that's what I'm saying. You can't really say anything. Yeah. So bring up your concern up for your own self. And then again, we're pro therapy around here. So check it out. So how would it feel if you looked up and you accomplished everything you wanted to accomplish for your goals for the year?

I'd feel pretty good. Yeah. Rachel feel pretty great. Yeah. But sometimes it doesn't happen. You sometimes need to get organized when it comes to your calendar and your goals. And that is why we are so excited about the new 2025 Ramsey goal planner. Here it is.

I'm like, is that a law space? Yeah, that's right. That's right. That's right. I'm grabbing it, grabbing it to the side.

And it's just beautiful. So it features that monthly and weekly calendar stickers, a vision board, goal setting system, savings tracker. And you have content in there about money. I talk about your spiritual life and your faith. It's big. It's worth noting. Like if you're listening, it's big.

And when you look at it online, you can't tell like how substantial it is. Yeah, that's true. Yeah. I mean, it's quite a goal planner. And people in this world that know goal planners, this is a good one. Come on. We, that's true. Yeah. I mean, it's quite a goal planner. And people in this world that know goal planners, this is a good one. Come on. We have perfected it.

Yes. We have perfected it. So you can get it today for $49.97. And these, since they are calendar-based, we only buy a certain quantity because once the year starts, people don't want it. So there's only a limited time left. And again, they're selling out pretty fast already. So you can go to RamseySolutions.com

slash store and check that out. A bit of advice, if I may. Let me tell you, every year I buy one as a gift and then I'm like, oh crap, you got to get one for yourself too. The minute you buy one, you're going to be like, I have to, you're either going to get one for yourself and realize it's a great gift and need to get more, or you're going to buy one for someone else and realize I should have gotten one for me. So just put two in your cart. I'm telling you. They're amazing. I'm just telling you. She knows. She knows. So great. Okay. Let's go to the phones and we have Landon in Oklahoma city. Hi Landon. Welcome to the show. Thank you. Absolutely. How can we help? I have a twin brother that I bought a house with when we were 18. We paid cash. But I'm starting to realize, I'm starting to, I mean, I've realized for a while now that it was a pretty bad decision.

And I'm trying to figure out how to get out of the house with part of my money without ruining the relationship. What'd you guys buy the house for? Uh, so it was a cheap house. It was only $40,000. Okay. What's it worth now? Probably a lot less than what we got it for. A lot less? Because, yeah, we basically, when we bought the house, we had no idea how to buy houses.

Okay. And we didn't get anyone to look at the house first. The lady that sold us the house said that the pipes were all brand new and we were kind of gullible and just believed everything that she said. Oh, you didn't get an inspection or anything? Are you living in the house or is this just a property you have? We're living in it. When did you buy it?

At 18. I know. How old are you now? 22. Okay. So, yeah, it's been four years. Have you guys, I mean, has it run down? At 18 I know how old are you now 22 Okay so yeah it's been four years Have you guys I mean has it run down Is it not livable So it's

Livable but there's quite a bit That needs Repairs we would spend about Probably 10,000 repairs Okay just to get it back to the original Quality that it was in Now is this from where did you get that number from? Just estimating mostly.

From someone in those industries, like someone looking at mold, someone looking at piping, someone looking at roofing, like people in those specific industries? Yeah. Okay. I'm just making sure that it's a fair quote. What's your twin think? If you say to him,

listen, man, let's cut our losses. Let's sell it and split whatever we get. What does he say? I've tried my best to convince him. He's not down for it.

In his eyes, why get rid of a house that he already owns, basically. And I just don't want to be in the title with him anymore. Can he buy you out? He does not have the money to buy me out, no.

And in you guys' minds, when you guys said, we're going to buy a house together, what was the plan? Because the plan certainly wasn't, we're going to live together forever as stepbrothers. Like, you know, you guys surely had an idea of when it's time to exit out of this, right? Yeah. Well, I figured

that was the plan, and at the time, we had talked about just moving in short-term, but he's now seeing more for the long-term, and it's going to be a long time before he even comes close to having the money for that. How much do you guys owe on it uh we don't they just bought it sorry you bought it in cash okay

i mean i don't know like this is the hard part right when you do yeah these family deals oh for sure so i mean what i would probably do i mean because you want out you're not gonna you're not gonna get your money unless he goes and takes out a $20,000 loan, a mortgage on it, does something to give you your half. If anything, I may just get it evaluated today and just say, if we sold it today, how much would that be worth? And I'm hoping, Landon, in four years, I mean, I understand you're saying internally it's not great, and it's a $40,000 house. So let's just say it's $40,000. Let's say you just, it is what it is.

That means if you guys sold it and after commissions and, you know, everything else, taxes that go into it, you know, let's just pretend you clear, you would clear, you know, $17,000. I mean, I would just create a little document to say, okay, I'm leaving. I'm going to go do my own thing. But when you sell, I'll give you, you need to say, okay, I'm leaving. I'm going to go do my own thing. But when you sell, I'll give you, you need to give me $17,000 because I'm not going to be paying money,

my money to be repairing it, right? Because it will be unfair landed if you did move out and he did all this work and then he sells it for $100,000. You shouldn't make the profit off that because you didn't put the money into it. Now, here's the thing though. Both of you guys' name is on the deed so i

would get the deed off yeah i would just deed it to him but you guys don't owe anything so there's no mortgage there's no there's none of that which makes it easier yes so yeah just put it in his name but i would have it i would have i mean i would have an official document written up yeah because if he like if the brother tries to take out like a line of credit yeah it would be it would be it would affect you so you've got to get off the deed line of credit yeah it would be it would be it would affect you so you've got to get off the deed yes yeah and then i would have a lawyer or so i mean it sounds really official and then but i mean it's 17 000 but you know in my mind is what i'm just estimating but if you really want it i mean i would i would write it up where it's where it's

clearly communicated that when he sells this is the profit you get and you just wipe your losses for now and move on with your life move on because i wouldn't be put yeah i would trust your gut not putting money into this um and i would tell him i'm sorry i mean i hope your relationship i mean sadly it does come down to this sometimes with families but hopefully your relationship isn't on the line for a forty thousand dollar house you know and i mean you've sunk four years into this it's not like you turned around six months later and said, never mind. I mean, four years is a substantial amount of time.

And, I mean, I gotta believe both of you will go on, you'll meet, you know, a nice honey, and you'll get married, and you'll have kids. Like, this can't last forever, so. Yeah, so that's another thing is I, the reason I also want to get out of this house

Is because I've been dating this girl for two years And we want to get a house together Yeah And I would not get a house with someone I'm not married to Landon You did that once Unromantically with your brother But it's the same concept So learn from your mistake with your brother

It's the same idea So please learn from your mistake on this one Alright I do have another question Involving It's the same idea, okay? So please learn from your mistake on this one, okay? All right. I do have another question involving, basically, I've always wanted to fly some, I wanted to be an airline pilot. All right. I looked at the price of that,

and it's a lot more expensive, and I don't really know how to go about doing that in the cheapest way possible, or if there's someone I could talk to about that. Yeah, I mean, what's it cost? It's been a while since I've looked at it, so I don't really remember. So first step is you're going to look in and you're going to find recently what is it cost. And then after that, it's about saving up so that you can do the program.

How long does it take once you enter the program? I believe it was close to a year or two. I'm not really sure. What are you making now, Landon? A year? I'm making like $26,000, but I've been doing a gig recently that basically doubled that.

Good. Okay. Yeah, I would work on just getting your income up and then, yeah, be saving on the side for what you want to do in the future for sure. But Landon. I would work on just getting your income up. Um, and then yeah, be saving on the side for what you want to do in the future for sure. But Landon, I would, um, just talking to you the past few minutes, my big sister advice to you, uh, is I, I would be doing some research into anything in life that you want to do. So, you know, you kind of bought a house on a whim,

didn't do the research. You think you want to go to flying school, but it's been a while. How do I, you know? Yeah. I want you to really focus in on when you want to do something, whether that's a purchase, a wedding, a purchase of a wedding ring,

a, you know, changing career fields. I want you to go all in and understand and talk to people in all these sectors of life because you can learn from people and processes versus your own mistakes. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back. I am Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with Jade Warshaw, and we are taking your calls at 888-825-5225.

Up next, we have Jennifer in Dallas, Texas. Hey, Jennifer. Welcome to the show. Hi, Rachel. Hi, Jade. Thank you for taking my call. Absolutely. I have a question.

I'll get right to it. So we are in Baby Step 2. We've paid off $45,000 in the last 11 months. Nice. That's great. And so,000 in the last 11 months. Nice. That's great. And so, yeah, thanks to you guys. And so I was going through the budget, and I was trying to find ways, areas to cut down.

And so I went on Zander per y'all's recommendation, and I did the quotes, and I was actually able to get twice as much life insurance coverage for actually $50 cheaper per year. We're clapping for you, Jennifer. I'm so glad. Oh, it's the best. Right. So, well, I was too. I was so excited. I was telling my husband, there kind of is. So anyway, so I was telling my husband and then ironically, a couple of days later, I got a notice in the mail from our current life insurance policy. And it it was saying that the coverage was until we were 95. So that kind of made me think twice about it because Xander was only for 20 years yeah but I'm thinking

let's play that out for a second because do you if you do what we teach which if you're not really sure how to run that out we can do that for you but there's a point where you do want to reach kind of that feeling of self-insurance where is where it's like I if I have this it's great but I don't need it. And so that's why we do those different terms because at a certain point, you can say, you know what? I'm good. Like if something happened, I'd be fine. I can cover the hospital bills. I can cover this and that. And so this idea that you would need to be insured until you're 95 is not necessarily- How old are you, Jennifer? 33. 33. Okay. So let's just pretend in the next 20 years, Jennifer, that you,

uh, are you married? Yes. Okay. How old are your kids or do you have kids? Um, we have three all under the age of 11. Okay. Perfect. Okay. So let's pretend, um, just doing rough numbers here. Okay. Let's just, let's fast forward the tape in 20 years you're 53 you're married your house is paid off you guys um you know your your net worth i would say you know 401ks and all of that if you're investing into retirement let's just pretend we ran numbers in an earlier segment let's just say you got a million dollars it'll be a million million two million yeah going in you know that you'll have at retirement and again you're you're 53 in this scenario your kids are going to be 31 29 27 they're living on their own they're off you know no one is dependent upon y'all's income and if something happened to your husband jennifer or happened to you

which is why you have life insurance is the other people in your life do you think you could live off of, you know, having just food, bills, electricity, and let's pretend you got, I don't know, again, a million dollars in investments. Do you think you could do that? I mean, I think we could. We're pretty motivated. We're almost, we should be finished with baby step two in about six months. And then from there we said, okay, well, what are we going to do after that? And we did your calculator online and we, if we just flow all of our intensity over to our mortgage, we kind of have an ambitious goal of having our mortgage paid off by 2030.

So, I mean, that would be pretty insane, but I think we could probably do it. So, yeah, I mean, on paper and it makes sense, but I guess I'm just having those are the real numbers there, because if you don't have any debt, if you've got let's say you got a nest egg of to Rachel's point 200 or 2 million dollars you're living off the interest you're living off 10 percent to say that 200,000 a year with no debt is not enough because the purpose let's be clear the purpose of insurance life insurance is for the people who were dependent on your income so if something were to happen to you and they were dependent on your income, that would be for them.

Well, your kids are married and grown and out of the house and it's just you living in a paid for house. And Jennifer, let me say this too. You look at different terms. You know, 20 years is just one of the terms and maybe they offer a different term or maybe you guys do this. And again, the amount of money that you're going to save

between the term life and the whole life Just invest the difference and that's going to be a whole other stream of income that you could do just for you know the fun of it Um, and maybe you guys get 10 years down the road and you're like, you know, I need I want another 10 Yeah, uh to get us into retirement then just re-up the policy right in your 40s. Yeah, so you can keep yeah You can be you know proactive on this and you know what Jennifer this is one thing you know if Dave was sitting here because he says it all the time dad um that he has life insurance on him just because Sharon wants it that's what he says oh that'll be

me he's like Sharon Ramsey will be fine if I die but for some reason she just likes to know oh a little a little extra milk cherry on top Because it's really inexpensive Especially if you're healthy and you're young So to that point If it's something that you just want to have I would do it though through term I would just do a longer term I would not keep whole life until you're 95 though

Because you're going to be paying so much I'm assuming this old policy I'm assuming it's whole life I mean it says What's it say? what's the exact like wording universal cash value what's the it says um if it's still your 95 well it says guaranteed premium for 20 years but then it has the expiration date of j 2086. Is this on the old policy or the new one? This is the old. I pulled it up while I was on hold and I'm scrolling. What do you pay for it?

That could give us a good indicator. What do you pay? For the old policy it was $612 per year. And with Zander, it's only $564 a year. That's not much difference. With double the... Twice as much coverage. Yeah, but twice as much. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, because with Primerica, it was $681,000 would be... Oh, it was through Primerica, the first one? Yeah, that's what mine, my husband, our kids, but

through Zander, the total coverage would be $1.3 million. Okay, yep. And it's cheaper. Yes, for sure. So regardless of what the policy is, I would just go with the cheaper policy where you're going to get the most bang for your buck. And Jennifer, your kids don't need life insurance either. I would not waste money on that. No way. Well, those, it was free. I think they called it a rider policy. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. It just gives

like a few, like $10,000 per kid. Yeah, but don't re-up that when you switch to term. Okay, so I'm since my Zander policies are in effect, I got the emails that everything is active good i'm i'm free to cancel yes and if you want to call them i won't be making a mistake no so if you want to double

check because life insurance is a big deal right you don't want to mess it up so but if your new zander policy is inactive or is active and you want to just get on the phone and call them, they're wonderful. So just get on the call, get on the phone and just talk to an actual human there and just double check, you know, double check confirmation numbers, all of it, and just feel good about it. You know, get there like green light, then go and cancel the whole life. I didn't want to go several years down the road and then have to call back in and they tell me I'm paying a stupid tax. Yeah, I canceled something. That's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no. I hear you. I hear you. But yeah, I would

just double check that it really is active and you feel good about it on their end. Then I would go cancel the whole life for sure. And again, Jennifer, remember you can all with life insurance and you guys are still so young. You're 33. So even when you're 43, you could look up and say, hey, let's just add An additional you know 10 years Or maybe you guys are killing it way more Financially than you ever thought you would be and you're like Oh yeah I feel good without it but sometimes you just want it Right that's me that's fine

Well that's that's very helpful Thank you all so much yeah absolutely Thanks for the call Jennifer yeah this is A A great example I feel like Of these parts of money you you guys, that can feel so overwhelming. There's a lot of questions around it. There's industry lingo. It just can feel intimidating. So whether it's taxes or insurance, real estate, investing, like all of these parts,

you want to have people in your corner that you trust. And that's why we do. We recommend people like Xander. We have Ramsey Trusted Pros in all these different areas, because we want to partner with people in your communities that are going to help in these parts of your life money wise, that we can't always get into the nitty gritty on the show. So take advantage of that you guys, if you go to RamseySolutions.com and go to Ramsey Trusted Pros and just you know, check out what we have there. Because again, having good people in your corner that are going to help you propel on this plan is so, so important. Our scripture of the day comes from 1 Peter 1, 6. So be truly glad.

There is wonderful joy ahead, even though you will endure many trials for a little while. Duke Ellington says a problem is a chance for you to do your best. That's a positive outlook. I like that. To the problems. So good. So, so good. All right. Next we have Brian in Orlando, Florida. Hey, Brian, welcome to the show. Yes. Thank you. Absolutely. How can we help? So I just had a question. So I own two houses. They're right next to each other. They're there.

The mortgages are paid off and I actually have a 200 percent equity and 175 percent equity in each one. Amazing. Great job. Yeah. I mean, that's not part of I'm doing pretty good. I have a life insurance policy. It's a $500,000 variable life policy that had about $120,000 in equity, but I took out $60,000 in debt on it. It's at like a 2% interest rate. And that is really my only debt aside from I have like a $50,000 solar panel

loan. I got a solar roof combination. So those two are really like my only two aside from I have a $50,000 solar panel loan. I got a solar roof combination. So those two are really like my only two debt. I'm just kind of worried about what I should do with the equity I have in these two homes. The housing market's probably like a little too inflated to buy another rental. The one house I do rent out for $2,600 a month, and I'm just kind of wondering what I should do with equity. With the equity, what are you saying? Are you planning on like borrowing on these houses, taking the equity out? Are you thinking about selling?

I'm kind of worried about the housing market coming back in and having my equity eroded. And then so I want to use it while it's still high, I guess. Well, then I would just sell the house and cash out and use that money and go and invest it or put it in something else. But wouldn't it be wiser to just keep it as a rental and then just get that income? Not if you're taking the equity out of it. Well, that's kind of like my only income right now is that rental house. What were you doing career-wise before all this?

I used to be a network engineer, and then I started trading professionally. And I did pretty well. I had a couple good years, but then I also had a couple bad years. So it hasn't exactly been stable. So really, it's just like the rental income I have. And then if I happen to do well that year, trading-wise. What's your rental income? It's $2,600 a month.

Okay. That pays for my health insurance and my cost of living and, you know, insurance and stuff like that. So I'm kind of like have that locked in. And then for like eating and everything else, is that coming from your day trading? Yeah, pretty much. Okay. And then just to clarify, that's like my one stable stable income and then everything else is just kind of like all over the place. So I kind of was thinking of using the equity to buy another house, but I'm kind of worried that if I buy it, I'm going to like buy the top of the market, you know? And didn't I hear you say that you have a $60,000 loan and a $50,000 solar loan? Yes. So $110,000. And that's on the life insurance? No, the $60,000

on the life insurance, the $50,000 is a lien on my house that I actually live in. So there's three properties total? There's two properties. Okay. So one you live in, one you rent? Correct. Okay. Brian, I mean, if I were to be honest, you have a lot of risk in your life. And I'm going to be honest too, Brian. How old are you? 45. Okay. And it sounds like, because you called in the Ramsey Show,

and if you know anything about us, we're pretty old school. We're pretty boring when it comes to money. It is kind of this live below your means, invest consistently. That's why I live off the rent, and I kind of live like a college student, but I'm getting up there in age And growing out of my day trading It's kind of hard I know but Brian But your day trading

And statistically speaking Day traders actually end up Losing money long term Than they do gaining it You're trying to take equity Out of a house And borrowing on it You borrowed on a life insurance policy

You sound like my Instagram reels That I hear from these like Influencers that are like You know selling you all these ways To get rich I think you're trying to just hit it big and I would simplify your life Brian I would I would that's what I'm trying to do okay so okay perfect perfect so um yeah this whole like life insurance policy situation I would I would make that a goal to get out of that whole scenario because it's yeah I hate that yes that's the one thing it adds a lot of stress to my life that i don't need totally yeah so i would go get a job um i would start there and i would be making an income and you're a smart guy brian so i'm like

you could make i'm gonna start out there i don't know what were you making before uh anywhere from 60 to 80 perfect so let's let's go on the high end because you're smart. So we're going to go $80,000 a year. You're going to get a side hustle. Your life may look different work-wise than it does now, but your house is paid for, both of them. So I would just keep those. Those aren't your problem. And keep that $2,600 coming in as income, which is amazing. So add that to all of this.

That's another $24,000 that you're making a year in rental, which is awesome. I would not borrow on it. And I would use all of that, Brian, to pay off the solar, pay off this life insurance stuff, cancel it, get term life, simplify all that. And then here you are with two paid-for houses, no debt, get some cash in the bank, and start investing wisely not your day trader

stuff go do boring mutual funds you know that have a long-term track record i would just i would you're you know a lot of the stuff you're doing is that kind of glitz and glam it's just kind of this like it feels kind of that get rich quick to a degree way that we live in 2024 with our money and i would just pull all that way back and i promise when you start doing that brian your stress and your anxiety will go down because you will have full control over your money and you're not trying to play all these different games yeah so so then don't take out equity to like buy like another rental property don't do any of that no i would pay off all your debts first the solar panels and the and the life insurance stuff i would make that your first

goal do you have any cash available any liquid cash uh about 40 000 oh that's good okay so i mean that that's kind of like in my trading account i guess yeah i mean i i would because i'm yeah because you'll have another job um i wouldn't do the trading stuff. It's just risky. I mean, obviously, you may know what you're doing to a degree, but I just feel like that's a, yeah, it's just more of a risky move. I would have a- The older I'm getting, the less riskier I'm finding myself to be. Totally, totally. I'm trying to get more stable.

Are you married? Yeah, I am. I have two kids. Okay, how's your wife? How's she feeling about all this? Ah, I mean, she's got her own stuff going on. So this is just my own personal issues. Okay. Do you guys talk about money together a lot? Not really. I mean, she brings in just the same amount as I do with the rental. So,

you know, income, we cover food, we cover cover our costs Based on those two things She doesn't worry about it because the house is paid off So she doesn't have any housing costs Okay I'm going to take this call It's just kind of a sign of God Because I think you have a lot ahead of you And I think for the good Brian I think your marriage can change in this process

Because You'll find that you and your wife Have been living on these two separate islands, financially speaking, which, whether you realize it or not, starts to bleed into other areas of your marriage. It really does. You feel like roommates almost financially and then eventually emotionally to a degree because you kind of have these two separate lives.

And there's something beautiful about coming together, working a plan together that not just financially gets you all in a better spot, but it actually changes the relationship. It deepens the connection of where you're at because you guys are working as a team for the first time ever. So I know you didn't call in for that part, but it's one that I would really push you to. And if you hold on the line, Brian, Christian's going to pick up and I want to give you Financial Peace University. It's our nine lesson course. And it kind of just goes through the basics. And we'll throw in a total money makeover book to Christian. Y'all can get through that one faster. But I would challenge you guys kind of reset how you've been doing this and simplify it and work together with your wife on this because she's bringing in an income. You guys could really propel this change forward really fast. Does she have a lot of debt?

No, I helped her pay all that off years ago. No, that's great. That's great. Yeah. I don't know. I think there could be some good change for you, Brian. I think that you kind of felt this wake up call at 45 and I think that it's for a reason. I think some good stuff's ahead. Yeah, absolutely. Oh, man. Well, change is hard. It's a shift, and it's kind of scary when you do new things,

so you're going to feel that challenge, but it's worth it. Yeah. Cheat codes, they just don't work. Like, you have to actually do the work. You got to work and put in the time and put in the effort. You can't just kind of like play angles to get successful. Yep. So good. All right. Well, that does it for this, this hour of the Ramsey show. Thanks to all the guys in the booth. Thank you, Jade. Thank you, America and our great audience out here in the lobby. And remember to take control of your money and create a life you love. Take care.