The Ramsey Show - App - Life Transformation Starts Here (Hour 1)

Episode Date: December 17, 2018

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Dave Ramsey Show. Where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. This is your show, America. Thank you for joining us. Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Candace starts us off this hour in Miami. Merry Christmas to you, Candace.

Merry Christmas. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So I kind of have a what would you do question in these shoes. My husband has been involved in a custody battle with a contagious ex who's also an addict for a while. And a guardian ad litem was assigned to the case. And he was assigned to pay 50% of the guardian ad litem's fees. However, the fees have racked up so high.

And we've been making payments that we can every month. But today in court, she said that's not enough, and the judge decided that we needed to pay her in full within 30 days, and it's over $20,000, and we don't have any money. And I'm just kind of wondering, what would you do in this situation? What did your attorney say to the judge? We can't even afford an attorney. She has three. We have none. The addict has more attorneys than you have?

Her parents are billionaires. Oh, okay. And so they're paying their half, her half of the guardian ad litem? Yes. Okay. All right. Hmm. What a disaster.

How old are these babies? One is 13. She's with her mom now just recently. And the other one, one is 12 and he lives with us full-time okay and uh how long is this going to be ongoing forever until these for the next six years i mean i don't know we're really we've asked for mediation we've asked to just to finish this um they've scheduled another date to talk about mediation but not agree to mediation. I've never seen something so hard. It takes months and months just to get a court date. Meanwhile, the guardian at Lottam gets paid every month.

Yeah, and her bill to us, so think about doubling it, is in the thousands of dollars a month, and we only have a few hundred dollars a month we can pay her. Okay. This is what happens when you don't have an attorney. Well, I don't know. I mean, if it was a one-time bill, you have a debt to a lawyer, a guardian ad litem, and you could just change where the debt sits.

And if you have the ability to borrow the money, you would go and borrow it from the credit union, and you'd have a $20,000 bill at the credit union instead of a $20,000 bill at the other. That's not like going into debt. You're already in debt. So that doesn't bother me the thing that bothers me is what are you going to do six months from now when you gotta do it again yeah or a month from now when she builds another two thousand dollars yeah yeah that's what i'm saying we just don't make i mean i've been helping out as much as i can um we've kept our finances separate because of the issues but i've been helping out as much as I can. We've kept our finances separate because of the issues, but I've been helping out as much as I can.

But, you know, he only makes $4,000 a month. And what do you make? About $6,000. Okay. And so you have $10,000 a month income. Yeah, but we're paying all of the one-child expenses, including private school, and we're not allowed to take them out of private school.

Okay. All right. So, I mean, if you're going to continue this battle, you have to find $2,000 a month in your budget, or you have to discontinue the battle. Well, we tried to discontinue the battle, but they won't. You know, we said we want to like finish this and wrap this up and we just kind of get told we'll what the schedule something else

for that like we're not really being given the option to just what is it what is it that the other side wants though they won't actually tell us i'm guessing they want the kids back with her and other things too but um i don't think that's really going to be on the table as far as even though the guardian ad litem doesn't love us for not paying. Like, she agrees that the situation is better the way it is. But I just don't. I think the lawyers on her side are interested in making as much money as possible. So they have no problem drawing this out. Yeah.

Well, it's also a strategy to starve have no problem drawing this out. Yeah. It's also a strategy to starve you out, and it's working. Yeah. Okay. Well, you're going to have to get legal representation because you cannot afford to carry this on for three more years. So if we go in more into debt to get legal representation, does that just set us up? Yeah, because you're getting ready to go more in debt anyway.

Every time they send you a bill you can't pay, that's called debt. And so you've got to adjust your budget to be able to pay this to survive, or you've got to adjust the situation to fit your budget, and that means legal representation. And so you've got to get a lawyer to go in and have some reasonable discussions with a judge here. It doesn't surprise me that the judge wants his guardian or her guardian at light and paid. That's logical. And you not paying is not okay. I get that from the judge's perspective. But the fact that this thing is tied up and is running, you know, that's just running sand through the glass here every time, I can't.

It's untenable. It's just untenable. It's not sustainable. So you've got to break the tie somehow. Surrendering, hiring a lawyer, or adjusting your budget to fit $2,000 a month. And that you adjust your budget by cutting expenses, getting rid of stuff, or by whatever. I mean, you could tell the guardian ad litem, we can either pay the private school or we can pay you. Which would you rather?

So remove that requirement that the kid's in private school. Remove that requirement. Help us somehow get our budget go go meet schedule a meeting with the guardian of the item go sit down and show them your budget and go what would you do how are we supposed to survive against the billionaire parents and see if you can get some coaching here and get or maybe they've got a suggestion a legal maneuver i don't know but uh that would be one thing you could do is schedule a meeting with them. And I'd do that today and just share the situation.

It's not that we don't want to pay you. It's that we don't want this to go on forever and ever, number one. Number two, we can't. We don't have the money because you've got these requirements put on us on this other kid. So, you know, you can go that direction. But I don't know how to solve it exactly. But really, it sounds like as I go through it in my mind, there's three possible scenarios. Surrender, adjust your budget, or get legal representation that causes the situation to be adjusted.

One of those three things. Meantime, you've got a $20,000 bill. If you can borrow that much plus $10,000 more to get you a lawyer if that's what you want to do, I ain't a problem with that. Because it's debt you already have. I'm not telling you to go into debt. You're in the debt. You're there. It's just a matter of where the debt sits.

It's like I've got credit card debt or I've got a car debt. You borrow on your car to pay off the credit cards. There's still the debt. You're just moving the debt around. So this is not Dave Ramsey telling you to go into debt. He's telling you to move it because you're going to have to. The court's going to make you on that. You don't want to be in contempt of court on paying somebody a judge told you to pay.

That's not a good place to be. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. You've heard me talk about ID theft for years and how it's only a matter of time before you become a victim. But I ran across some numbers that even surprised me and shows the real nightmare that people go through when they become a victim. But I ran across some numbers that even surprised me and shows the real nightmare that people go through when they become a victim. Of the 16 million victims of identity theft last year, yes, 16 million, 26% of them had to borrow money from family or friends. 22% of them lost even more money by taking time off work and 900,000 victims took out payday loans. This stuff is a freaking nightmare. That's why the only plan I have for my family and my entire team

is through Zander Insurance. Zander takes over all the work to solve these problems and more, along with the systems to reduce your risk and protect your money if your accounts get hacked. Visit Zander.com or call 800-356-4282. It's the smartest, most me on the show will be Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality, my daughter, and also number one bestselling author and host of The Rachel Cruz Show. If you want to talk to Rachel, jump in. The phone number is 888-825-5225.

In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions, Tom and Janine are with us. Hey, guys. How are you? Hey, Dave. We're good. Welcome. Where do you guys live? We're from Elkhart, Indiana.

Oh, cool. Well, good to have you. And here to do a debt-free screen. Yep. Love it. How much have you paid off? Paid off $160,000 in about six and a half years. Way to go.

And your range of income during that time? Special circumstances during the time. So it started off about $40,000 and we're up to about $130,000. Wow. Very cool. What do you all do for a living? I'm in purchasing. And I'm in customer service for an RV company. Oh, great.

Very cool. So what kind of debt was the $160,000? Forty of it was consumer debt, credit cards. Home equity loan was probably about another ten. And the house was the balance. You paid off your house! I'm looking at weird people! I love it!

Way to go, you guys. Congratulations. Six and a half year journey. Yeah. What's this house worth? It's 130. We're still in our beginner home. It's probably about 130, 140, somewhere in there.

Awesome. And it's paid for. It's yours. It's paid for. How does that feel? Feels fantastic. No payments in the world. Yeah.

I think it hasn't hit us yet. Last payment was made on Thursday. Oh, yeah. Oh, it'll be next year before you start going, wow, where's all this money coming from? Yeah. I mean, it still feels just amazing. I mean, financial peace doesn't even capture what you feel. Yeah.

It's surreal. It really is. There's a sense of release that you didn't even anticipate because you didn't know that you were that tight. It's amazing. Very cool. Yeah. And we got pretty gazelle intense. Gazelle intense at the beginning. And the last 12 months, we paid off about $50,000 in cash flow between saving for a wedding and college.

Another $20,000. Wow. Yeah, so $70,000. And sort of got gazelle intense about my health, too. I lost about a pound per thousand. Whoa, good for you. So how much have you lost? So far, 70 pounds. Way to go, man. That's amazing. Yeah. Congratulations. What a life transformation you guys have been through. Yeah, it's been incredible. That's powerful. How fun. Well, I'm proud of you guys.

Well done. Well done. So what started this journey six and a half years ago? You know, six and a half years, sick and tired to death. You know, just the typical story. And then we realized we were staring down two years from my oldest, my daughter, which was unable to be here today. She was going to be in college. And he was two years behind her.

So we were wondering how we were going to pay for that. College bearing down on you woke you up. Yeah, I was the nerd. So, you know, I was always looking at spreadsheets and how much debt we had and what it was going to cost, and realized that the amount we were paying per month or per year would probably cash flow college, and knew we were pretty much maxed out on debt, and knew that there wasn't any room to add debt. So it was like, okay, we get rid of this debt.

We can pay for school. At least pay for the first one. We didn't know how we were going to do the second one. Well, at least we got a head start on it. And our two children have really, were old enough at that time to completely become our partners in that because they were old enough to understand it. They were on board.

They worked their butts off getting scholarships, and then we kind of stole. Obviously, you like people to steal your ideas, understand it. They were on board. They worked their butts off getting scholarships. And then, you know, we kind of stole, obviously you like people to steal your ideas, but we stole your idea about when, for your kids' cars, matching what they put into it. The 529 Jenks plan. Yeah. So we told them any money they made and saved, we would match it. And they made it challenging for us at times because they were savers. They became savers early on. And so between the work that they did in the classroom and outside the classroom financially and us matching that, we were like, we would rather benefit the whole family this way than benefit the bank. Absolutely. Well done. So Olivia, she's working on her PhD. She's in her first year out at CU Boulder.

Graduated debt-free, money in the bank. Ian's in his third year, first semester of his junior year, debt-free. Again, money in the bank. Wow. You know, just you talk about what you've got to do to get through college, and these two have knocked it out of the park. Wow. Very cool.

So how did you get connected up with us? I was on YouTube just trying to figure out ways to get tax breaks and, you know. Reduce the tax liability. Yeah, legally reduce your adjuster gross income. You know, just trying to find ways to get some margin in our lives. And came across you, and I think the first couple nights probably stayed up until 3, 4 in the morning trying to figure out, okay, how many baby steps are there? What do you do on each step? Yeah, just constantly going through it.

And I think finally emerging from the bedroom one time, and I'm like, did you ever hear of this Dave Ramsey guy? And I said, yeah, about 10 years ago when our church was doing the whole church Dave Ramsey class, and you thought you knew it all and didn't want to take the class. When we first got married, I enjoyed investing, enjoyed reading about personal finance, knew a lot of the rules, saving three to six months and investing the power of compound interest. But that was the key when I found you and found this is the order in which you do things. The clear path changes everything.

Yeah. To sit and try to do, to try to save 15%, to try to pay off your debt, to try to. All at once. Yeah, all at once. Can't do it. It's overwhelming, and you realize, okay, well, if you start here and you follow this, you'll end up at your destination. There you are. Baby step seven.

You were there. House is paid for. Nothing left to do now but finish up a little bit of college tuition and become very wealthy so way to go very proud of you who were your biggest cheerleaders other than your own family you know i'm pretty private the age we we don't speak too much of it we've got some close friends that we talked to and and um that shared friends and family um but yeah it was our children our children were huge yeah well and it was inspiring because they were on board so quick and we started seeing how it was going to affect their future

oh and then some of their friends their wider circle of friends um because you know they're not shy about sharing it too and we started realizing this is not just about us. Right. And so getting younger kids on board to not get into debt is so much easier to stay out than to try to get out. Great job. Yeah. We got a copy of Chris Hogan's book for you, Retire Inspired.

That's a number one bestseller. And we're also at the first of the year, send you the new one, Everyday Millionaires, because you're going to be one. And outrageously generous along the way. That's your next chapter, and you've got to keep going now. Well done, you guys. All right, it's Tim and Janine and Ian from South Bend, Indiana.

$160,000 paid off in six and a half years, making $40,000 to $130,000. House and everything, baby. It's all gone. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We's all gone. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Wow. Oh, I lost 70 pounds while I was doing it. There you go. Wow. This is how you do it, people. You get to decide.

You don't get to decide all the stuff that comes against you. The only thing you get to decide is what you are going to do. And there's a bigger part of success that has to do with what you're going to do than what happens to you. You get to decide. You're Americans, not Americans. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Are high health care costs getting you down? Are you confused trying to navigate your options? Do you wish you could find an affordable, biblical solution to your health care costs? Based on New Testament principles, Christian Health Healthcare Ministries, or CHM, helps Christian families, churches, and ministries join together as the body of Christ to share their major healthcare costs.

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The first one was Smart Money, Smart Kids that she and I did together, teaching your kids, teaching your parents how to teach your kids how to handle money. I never could get all that right when I was saying it. And then her next number one was Love Your Life, Not Theirs. She also co-wrote the best-selling book, The Graduate Survival Guide, with our own Anthony O'Neill Ramsey personality. The Rachel Cruze Show video series on YouTube is highly popular, to say the least. Millions and millions of you watching it. And another episode comes out today. That's right.

Thanks for having me on. Sure. Yeah, we're excited about this one. It's all around giving. So we say it's the most fun that you can have with money. And so we dedicated a whole show around it because of not only the time of year that we're in with December, but also it's a really fun topic to talk about.

So we had some fun guests on and just kind of making that part of your motivation on your journey as you're paying off debt and you're investing for the future and you're looking forward. All of that is incredible because it gives you freedom, but you ultimately get to do the most fun with money and that's giving and living life with an open hand and having the freedom to do that i think it's

the only subject on money that we talk about uh that has almost no pushback almost no one says no you should be less generous no almost no you know sometimes people want to cut split hairs on you know the doctrine biblically on the difference in tithes and offerings or gross and net or something like that. But it's very minor stuff. And very few people say, no, you should give less. Right. Right. Right.

No one should give. Generosity is a universally accepted principle. I know. That's funny. I honestly haven't thought about that, but it is. It's so true. And I'm like, and what does that speak to, like, in the human heart? Right.

Like, we know there's something that lights you up when you hear about giving, when you hear stories. There's something contagious about it. And I think we all feel that. And so being able to do that on a crazy level once you get your money under control, it's what's fun. So it was great. Well, if you've ever been down really financially in the. And someone reached over and helped you. Oh, yeah. You never forget it.

So receiving is a part of the giving story. Right. Receiving generosity is a part of it. When your mom and I were broke, we had been broke for so long, it felt like, for years. And it took us like three or four years to slog through the bankruptcy and everything else. You were tiny. And I mean, obviously, there was no vacations because we were doing good to keep the lights on and where we had been doing anything we wanted to do back when we, quote, had money,

unquote. But a couple at our church were doing very, very well, and they were taking a business trip, snow skiing, and they included us and just paid for it. Oh, wow. Yeah. And it was like everything because it was just like, oh. I mean, we so desperately needed a minute that wasn't focused on how broke we are, that wasn't focused on this, and they paid for dinners and the skis

and the trip and the airline, the whole thing. Dang. Super generous. Yeah, they were. They were unbelievable. Yeah. Unbelievable generosity. Yeah.

And funny how it comes back around, though, how much that trip has cost me. Of doing to others, right. No, in the sense that I, you know, like, for instance, they have a ministry drilling wells in Haiti. Oh, and you've repaid them, sure. And then we've drilled several wells in Haiti that costs a whole lot more than a couple ski trips but yeah but still it was just the and we didn't do it out of obligation and anything like that it's just it was always a a way to tip your hat and say wow I remember back when

when you were kind yes oh yeah you never could actually Winston's mom as you were saying that I remember her telling me when her and Winston's dad got married they got married super young and she was like oh we would just wait for that paycheck to come, and we could get groceries. They were just these broke college students there in college when they got married. And she talked about this lady, and she could still name her name, and she said, and she rang my doorbell and just had five huge bags of groceries and just said, just take them. It is. It's those little moments.

So it could be something more extravagant, like a ski trip, or something as small. And when you do that- Some bags of it changes everything. It does. Right. And so and I think being able to be the giver, being the receiver is part of that. And what a blessing. You don't forget that.

But studies have shown that you have momentary happiness when you are the receiver. Right. It hits that pain point. You get you know, you have that fill, but you have longer term happiness when you are the giver. Right. Like, how fun is it for you to be the one to take someone on that trip or to pay for those groceries?

And so, yeah. The funny thing is the receiving changes your moment, but the giving changes your character. Changes who you are. It changes who you are. Yep. You cannot ever be the same. The more generous you are, the more you are transforming your character as you go along.

When you can't help because you're moving on the spectrum of being selfish to selfless, right? Exactly. And part of this show and on the Rachel Cruz show, a huge motivator of us in life is to get people, to get you all in a place where you're not just looking down constantly at your own money, freaking out, feeling out of control, that we're getting you in a place where you have power over your finances,

you're having that freedom so that you can look up, right, and see others and see that need. And so, yeah, on the show we had Amy Brown from the Bobby Bones show. She came over. Pimpin' Joy. And yes, and she has so many incredible causes that she's a part of. So it was just fun talking to her about taking this one pain point from her mother who passed away from cancer and choosing joy

and what they're doing with all of that. They adopted to two kids from Haiti and getting a part of that and understanding, okay, you know, the need outside of even just America and how you can take these points in your life that have impacted you and you can just do just such incredible good. So she's doing it on a large scale, but it was fun to hear her story and how motivating it is because it is we talked about it on the show, but it's true. It's just contagious. Like when you get one little ounce of it, it changes you. And so that's why I always tell people.

Her and Bobby Bones on the show, that's a huge show. And they use that platform with that whole movement. And it created millions, tens of millions probably of generosity. It was pretty amazing. It's incredible. And so that's a great story. And that's on your show this time. Yes.

So she'll be on. And then we have a financial peace university coordinators that came on because they were so incredibly blessed by just going through financial peace that they were like, okay, we want to get in and actually give of our time and coordinate. So they've coordinated like dozens of classes and just the life change that they were able to be a part of. And other people's stories was just incredible. They said they would just not, they would not change that for anything.

So it's just fun seeing the different ways you can give your life away. And one of them is money, but there's also time and everything else. And so when you just make that a part of who you are, there's just this joy that comes that doesn't come from buying stuff. And we say all the time, it's okay to buy stuff. We want you to get to a place where you can buy a great car or you can take that great trip. Stuff is not bad, but it does not create joy.

It's fun and you can enjoy it, but that true immeasurable joy, it really only comes from giving, and it is the most fun. It's weird, yeah. We are made in our Father's image, and He gave His only Son. This Friday, by the way, we'll be doing the giving show here on the Dave Ramsey Show. We always dedicate the three-hour program, the last broadcast, live broadcast day prior to Christmas, to giving, and we'll take your calls with your generosity stories where you gave or received very inspiring stuff. That's a fun show. It is a fun show.

And so that goes right along with the Rachel Cruz Show, which the latest version dropped today on YouTube. Yes, that's right. So you can find it on YouTube right now. And, of course, you can also go to RachelCruze.com. It also airs on Facebook, the Facebook Live as well. And so these shows, the Rachel Cruze Show comes out a new one every other week. And if you've never watched it, it is not a typical YouTube show. It's more like a TV show, really, the way it's put together.

I mean, it's got some YouTube elements to it, the way it's put together. But it's, you know, very, very well done. Our team spends a lot of time, a lot of money producing and putting it together. And it's very, very well done. Booking the guests, having the right people, and having the theme the whole bit. And a new one drops every two weeks or hits the YouTube every two weeks. You can watch it on Facebook, YouTube. You can subscribe on YouTube and check the box,

and it will send you an email anytime someone you subscribe to posts a new video. So it'll let you know every time Rachel posts a new video. Or if you subscribe to this show, The Dave Ramsey Show on YouTube, anytime we post a new video, it'll send you an email if you check the box letting you know. That's how my personal email is set up that way. So I know when any of our Ramsey personalities post on their YouTube channel and I can stop and watch it if I haven't seen it before. Some of these I view ahead of time, obviously, but some of them I don't. And so this week's episode, all about giving, all about generosity. Back with your calls for Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality, bestselling author,

and host of The Rachel Cruz Show, right here on The Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you. I'm going to go ahead and get going. Joining me this half hour, answering your questions, Rachel Cruz, host of The Rachel Cruz Show. New episode on giving it YouTube and Facebook today. RachelCruz.com or just look up Rachel Cruz on YouTube and you'll find her without any trouble. Also, our number one best-selling book, the first one together, was Smart Money, Smart Kids. And if you're a member of Financial Peace, if you have a Financial Peace membership, you have access to that whole class as well, or the number one best-selling books on sale right now for $10. Tori is with us in Kansas City. Hey, Tori, welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show.

Hi, how are you all doing? Great. How can we help? Merry Christmas. Good. Yeah, thank you. You too. Okay, I'm actually needing some parent advice.

I have an 8-year-old who is brilliant, and I'm not just saying that because he's my kid, and he actually passed all the tests necessary to get into the gifted program, but because in the classroom he does, you know, the bare minimum answers the questions, they're not going to let him go until he does, he shows more initiative that he needs more of that one on one. And I guess I should say, like, he does the bare minimum, because he turns the page over and he just draws, like he's such an artist. So I, my question is, do either of you have any ideas that I could use to help motivate him so he, you know, will go above and beyond on his schoolwork so he can, you know, proceed and get into that gifted program.

Because he passed all the tests for it. They just have to see, you know, the need before they'll actually put him in. I'm just an old dad now, an old grandpa. So I'm not a family therapist, okay? So you're not getting much of an opinion out of me. But this kid's obviously brilliant um is he verbal oh yeah yeah so if i had a conversation with him i'm gonna roll i'm my eyebrows gonna come up i'm going gee he's got a vocabulary like a college student

yes okay so he grasps critical thinking skills pretty good yep Yep, absolutely. All right, I got an idea. Rachel, what do you think? Where do you go, parent? I haven't raised an eight-year-old yet. I don't know. What would you say? I think he's bright enough to reason with. That's why I was asking that.

If he was 13 or 14 or 15, I know exactly what I would do. But I think I'm going to treat him like he's that age. And I'm going to just sit down and say, my job as your dad, and Rachel's heard this talk, okay, like all her whole freaking life, okay? My job as your dad is not to make you a great kid. It is to train you to be successful as an adult. My job is to give you the skills to win at life, the spiritual skills physical skills the academic skills the relational skills my job is to the bathing and hygiene skills that would not have been rachel as much as it would have been her brother but anyway i'm sorry you know but anyway you see what i'm saying you're

going to you're going to brush your teeth why not because it me, but because my job as your dad is to give you things that benefit you. Teeth is one of them. Okay? Those benefit you. And this is going to benefit you. It's not about the grades, and it's not about how smart you are. You're obviously smart. You're too smart for your own good, and it's going to be a

problem for you, my son. And so you need to learn something more important than academics. You need to learn initiative. Right. That's what I was so you're you need to learn something more important than academics you need to learn initiative right that's what i was thinking and you need to learn the character trait of perseverance and the character trait of leaning in and knocking things out and you're going to develop this character trait or i'm gonna knock you out i'm kidding i'm kidding but not much in other words my job as your dad is to make sure you have these skills. Right now, you're not exhibiting that skill. And it's not optional.

You're going to exhibit that skill. Right, because for me, it's not necessarily the grades. It's more the motivation, right? It's the, like, what's going on behind it. And I would say a little bit, though, when I heard he's eight years old, right? So he's in the third grade? Second. Second grade, yeah.

So, I mean, I think that there's some grace in this conversation, though. I mean, he's only in second grade. So, I mean, I think that, like, he's going to be fine. He's smart. He knows what he's doing. I don't even know. As a mom, like, it's very interesting that he draws, right? You can pick that up.

You're like, okay, he's interested in that. Like, what kind of outlet can we do for that part? But it's more the motivation. Because even mom and dad were not strict parents on specific grades. Honestly, if we got Bs, even if we... No, but I was tough on you on effort. I'm going to finish?

Yes. Even if we came home with not great in a certain subject and I got a C+, some of my friends, they would be grounded and it was all this crazy stuff. Mom and dad would be like, if you tried, if you truly did your best, the effort, that's what it is, and we're going this crazy stuff. Mom and dad would be like, if you tried, if you truly did your best, the effort, like that's what it is

and you were going to move on. And so I think that's it. Don't idle eyes, or for me, the grade, it's the effort behind it. So for him and his situation, I would be more focusing on the effort.

What's causing you to daydream and to kind of be, I'm seeing you do, you know, not lazy, that wouldn't be the word, but I'm seeing you do other things. Yeah, but the kid's good. Like he's making good grades. He's not a bad kid. I but the kid's good like he's making good grades he's not a bad kid i didn't say that but he's being lazy

because he's not keeping his eye on the ball well but he's making good grades though that's a skill you want to give him yeah that's where i struggle because i'm not a very motivated person either so i guess i don't know how to teach motivation and initiative other than because i tell him you know in the morning till i'm blue in the face hey you need to you know try to instead of writing one sentence write three instead of taking one book test take two like you know and i tell him that but he just doesn't do it well again it's a it's a decision um and you you cannot motivate other people. You can only put them in situations in which they want to be motivated. And so in our case, it would be you're going to put forth the effort. If you busted it, I mean, I had one kid who would study hours on a math test,

and the best possible score was a C. And that's fine. You gave it. You leaned in. You gave it. You busted it. And then I had another kid that would drive through, do a drive-by on a piece of homework and get a B plus and should have had an A. And then try to BS their way through trying to get an increasing grade on nothing more than their mouth.

That may have been me. I don't know anybody like that. But I'm not even looking at you right now. But Rachel would talk a teacher blue into a grade rather than go do the work. But, yeah, and so you just got to coach them through. But, hey, we turned out good. You turned out good. We turned out well.

But, listen, you learned to work, too. Yes, yes, yes, yes. And that's it. That's it, Tori. I'd have a little grace as a parent. Remember, he's eight years old. Yeah. But it's the motivation behind it that you want to start teaching. Exactly. That's it. That's it, Tori. I'd have a little grace as a parent. Remember, he's eight years old. Yeah. But it's the motivation behind it that you want to start teaching.

Exactly. That's good. What's the character trait exemplified here? And our friend Andy Andrews, I love that saying. Yeah. You and I have co-opted it from him, is I'm not trying to raise great kids. I'm trying to raise kids who become great adults. That's right.

That's right. Yeah. And Meg says that, too. Meg Maker talks about the key is the character trait. What character trait are're trying to develop. And you can give grace around a lot of stuff if you've got the character trait. That's right. And the character trait is initiative or work ethic or a reasonable level of ambition involved in this discussion.

That's right. And that's what I'm going to make you do as your dad because I love you. You're going to do it. And that really was not optional around our place you're going when we do yeah totally totally yeah you know there's a lot of grace around a lot of things but and sometimes some of our friends who were super strict parents thought we were sloppy on things that we allowed you all to do that that you know we didn't feel like we're sloppy because we had character indicators that you doing those things was going to be okay.

Right. And it was not trying to control the behavior. It was trying to control the character that created the behavior and teach that. And when you do that, that's when the kid is going to work. It's going to work out. And that really works for the whole money subject to teaching kids about money. Right. And it's more, I mean, in essence, it's the why behind your doing it.

You know, it's not just the behavior. It's not just the, okay, I'm going to make you work for the sake of working. No, we're making you work because I want you to earn money and learn how to handle it. I want you to learn responsibility. I want you to learn accountability, right? It's the why behind things. It's like the teen entrepreneur toolbox that Anthony did. It's not about the amount of money you're going to make as a teen entrepreneur at 14 years old.

It's about the lessons you learn about yourself. During it, yeah. And how the free enterprise system gives you unlimited potential, which you have as a teenager. And as you go into your adulthood, you see that. You believe anything's possible. Yeah. And for parents, like your kids are at such a great, when they are in your house, they're at such a great age that they're able to learn these lessons, whether it's motivation and grades,

like Tori was saying, or building a business, like with the Teen Entrepreneur Toolkit, or learning to give, save, spend, whatever the issues are, they have a safe environment. They're able to fail very minimally, right? There's only so much they can hurt themselves

in that sense. So they're under your safety, and what a great place to learn. And so for parents, take advantage of that, especially with the kids and money. I mean, learning to give, save, spend, work, all of it. They learn so many things from you. That's a generosity subject we were talking about a minute ago. Yeah, that's true, too.

So be sure and check Rachel out there. The SMART Conference, she'll be speaking January the 12th with all of us in Dallas. Money and Marriage event, the big one, is in Nashville with Les Parrott on February 14th. If you don't have Valentine's Day plans, that'll be a fun one. Thanks for stopping by, Rachel. Yeah, thanks for having me on. That puts this hour of the Dave Ramsey Show in the books. Hey, it's Kelly, Dave's phone screener.

We finished 2017 with a bang as the fourth most downloaded podcast of the year. Thanks to all of you for listening and helping us spread the word.