The Ramsey Show - App - My Cousin Borrowed $5000 and Won't Pay It Back (Hour 1)

Episode Date: March 2, 2021

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🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studio, this is the Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. I am John Deloney, joined here with my good friend, you know what, he's better looking than me too mr chris hogan and today we're going to talk about your money your life your relationships what's going on in your heart in your mind give us a call at 888-825-5225 that's 888-825-5225 chris how are we doing man i'm good buddy and i am ready to take the calls. Don't try to butter me up, John, because you and I will fight on here. We will disagree, but you know what? That's part of being real.

We don't disagree. We do, actually. Well, we tangle up a little bit. It's because I'm the kind one, and you're a bit rowdy. I just like data and facts and common sense. That's not your strong suit, and that's okay? I love the people. We got a place for everybody.

And you gave people the number, but they can also find us on social media. At Ramsey Show, you can find him. At John Deloney, you can find me. At Chris Hogan 360. The bottom line is, is we're here for you. Now, the way this show works is you pick up the phone and call. You tell us your issue. You tell us the stuff that's going on in the relationship.

If you're battling some depression, some frustration, irritation, or anxiety, Dr. John Deloney is going to give you an answer. And if you've got a money question, you've got to call in, and we're going to talk about it. I'm going to walk you through it and try to give you some guidance. Because when you have a game plan, John, you can have success. I'll give a money answer, but it won't be as right as yours. I don't know about all that.

I'll keep my mouth shut. Listen it won't be as right as yours. Well, I don't know about all that. I'll keep my mouth shut. But especially, listen, we definitely want the opportunity to referee. And what I mean by this is for you to call in with the situation, and you let Dr. John and I weigh in and give you an answer, and that way we can give you a verdict. And then you can go back and make stuff happen. Man, now you're a lawyer and a judge. Sure, we're doing all of that.

I get false confidence when I got you on here. We can do some stuff. All right, pick up the phone and call us. Seriously, 8're doing all in all. I get false confidence when I got you on here. We can do some stuff. All right, pick up the phone and call us. Seriously, 888-825-5225. Again,

that's 888-825-5225. We really would love to be able to talk to you. All right, we're going to the phones. First and foremost, we've got Jesse on the line. Jesse,

how are you? Hey, how's it going? Oh, focused and not finished, buddy. What's on your mind for John and I to talk about with you today?

All right, all right. So we got a bit of a situation here. Your parents left on a week-long vacation. Basically, so this has been going on probably for the past five years. But I lent my first cousin. I lent him some money. I lent him $5,000 a while ago, and he still has yet to pay me back.

And he told me originally that he just needs it for a job. So I was like, okay, no problem, it's family, I'll lend him the money. And then in two weeks, he didn't give me the money, and I guess that job fell through. And I've been asking him especially like you know right after i called him all the time like kind of um almost calling him too much like you know where's the money where's the money what's he said it never and i was i just

said to him directly like hey you know i i know a lot is going on but um you know i did lend you that money and like if you can please pay, pay it back, I was even willing to do like a payment plan, things like that. And like, he gave me a little bit. So I think now the balance is like around, um, still like $3,000, but now there's no relation with him. I don't talk to him whatsoever. I used to have really good relations with him. Um, you know, his mom, my aunt, his kids, everything, but now it's just completely done and broken. Now, I'm just at a point where I don't know if I should just keep going with it and just keep asking because that really didn't seem to work.

I even asked his mom. She even paid me a payment one time, and now I just don't kind of know where to go from here. All right, Jesse. So you lit him $5,000, and he's paid you back around $2,000? Yes, exactly. And now he's acting like he doesn't know you. Oh, yeah. You're a stranger. He actually said that I'm in the room for being childish and not knowing about responsibilities.

Because he does have a lot going on. He has a family. And he kind of put it on me where I'm in the wrong. But I was willing to help him and to do a payment plan. I understand. I understand. And so I can't wait to hear Dr. Deloney chime in on this. But I'm going to go ahead and go first here.

If you lent him $5,000 and he paid you back $2,000, let me do this. I'm from Kentucky, so it takes me a minute. You've got a $3,000 lesson here, baby. You've got a $3,000 lesson. And you know what? That's why we talk about whenever you start to get involved with money and family, and you had understanding. You said this is a loan. what that's why we talk about whenever you start to get involved with money and family without some some and you had understanding you said this is a loan he called it a loan but now he's acting

like it's not and i think the best thing for you to do is to let it go and for you to be able to move on because i mean obviously are you working do you have a job yeah yeah yeah are you what do you know about the baby steps um i'm familiar with them yeah i'm currently paying off all my debt uh right now don't don't play with me jesse my girlfriend and i what do you mean you're familiar with them what kind of debt do you got um i have some student loan debt i have 17 grand in student loan okay Okay. I have a car payment as well as also 17. Okay. And how much are you making right now? I'm making 40 grand a year.

Okay. So if I'm you, I mean, it sounds like you've kind of gotten there. You're frustrated and irritated about it, which you have every right to be. But I'm going to count this as a $3,000 lesson. Move on with your life and let this be one of those learning lessons, unfortunately, because it's not worth the relationship you know uh and it sounds like it to me it's more of your cousin's issue than yours yeah when jess when you when you loan money to family don't don't give it to them for all of your badgering um you can put a price tag on the cost of that relationship, and it was $2,000.

You beat him up. You got $2,000 back. Does he owe it to you? Yeah. Are you going to get it? No. And now you're going after his mom, too. What you got to ask yourself at the end of the day is what's it worth, right?

What's it worth? You got a taste of his character. You got a taste of or, and that may not be a fair statement. You got a taste of some messy situations he found himself in. Either way, it is what it is. I'm with Chris, man. Let it ride. Have some peace in your heart, dude.

And it's a $3,000 expense there. You got a $2,000 price tag on that friendship. Man, don't go after his mom. Just stop. Just stop. I really would. And it's hard, man. I mean, especially because, you know, I know Jesse used the language loan all alone. go after his mom just stop yeah i really would and and it's it's it's hard man i mean especially

because you know he i know jesse used the language loan yeah alone and the buddy and the cousin cousin yeah cousin called it alone yeah right that's why he paid back some of it and this is one of those things where it can change the family dynamic right but i'm gonna say both of them are at fault here oh yes and you know what i'm not even gonna say the guy asking for money because i've been in situations myself man i get pretty desperate yeah like uh and i i may ask a question i normally wouldn't ask right in those moments someone who loves me is gonna have to put up that boundary and protect me if help me for myself right yeah and say man i'm not i love much. I'm going to give you some money,

or I'm going to say no to you. Well, you said it the right way. It's one of those where if you're in a position to do it, give it. Give it away. And that way you just mentally, you don't have any kind of hurdles or issues in the relationship. Every time you see him, it's not that weird.

Hey, bro, I'm calling you. I'm getting after you. I'm getting after you. Where's my money? You don't want to do that. That's rude. All right, y'all, we're coming back. I'm getting after you. I'm getting after you. Where's my money? You don't want to do that. That's rude. All right, y'all. We're coming back.

Stay tuned. This is The Ramsey Show. One of the questions I get all the time is, which life insurance company should I use for my term life policy? A valid question since there are hundreds of companies out there with rates all over the place and riders and add-ons that are simply a waste of money. You need to get this done and make the right decision. That's why the only company I use and have recommended for over 20 years is Zander Insurance. Zander is a broker who shops the top term life companies for you and finds the best rates available from the only plans I recommend. They also save you time.

Whether you want to work online, over the phone, or via text, their team will cater to your needs and help you make the right decision. This is an absolute necessity, and Zander has made the process easy and convenient. Call them at 800-356-4282 or visit zander.com for instant online quotes. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I am your host, Chris Hogan, and joining me this hour is John Deloney. And we are excited to be here to take your calls. We're ready, people.

We are properly caffeinated, wide awake. John drinks tea. I drink coffee. But it's okay. You said that so dismissively. It's just the difference between the two of us, and it's fine. But listen, we want you to call. Listen, be quiet, John.

I've got to tell the people the number to call. The number to call is 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225. Love to hear from you. I harassed this man, but he is doing great things. Listen, tea drinkers are people, too. They are. I drink coffee, and I'm sitting here defending tea drinkers.

They're all right. It's fine, John. Listen, he's got the Dr. John Deloney Show, where he's got new episodes on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. You can catch him on YouTube. And any place that you listen to podcasts, you can get real straight talk on relationships. You can get information on mental health challenges. The tools that you need to cut through the depression to get clarity and understand the steps to take, you can do it.

And you've actually got a quick readout, John. His book, it's called Redefining Anxiety. And a lot of people in 2020 found out. They got a little wound up. They got a taste of anxiety on a level probably people didn't understand. You know, we walk through life thinking we control a lot. And some folks say that 2020 reminded us we lost control. No, we didn't.

It just reminded us a little control of over anything that we have. Yeah. Right? Very, very little. I mean, you think about it. It changed the way we work. Yep. The pandemic. very little i mean you think about it it changed the way we work yep the pandemic it changed the

way that we interact with family with each other with each other church yeah i mean there was a lot of stuff yeah and i think you know you've you've told me before if left unchecked and not really dug into it could have lasting rippling effects man, my colleagues who are mental health professionals across the country, you talk about white knuckling it. Yeah. There's people that are terrified of the downstream ripple effects. People don't make good decisions when they're leaving a season of this magnitude of a mental and psychological and physical challenge, right?

Yeah. Dave always says we don't make decisions when we're stressed. Man, we are coming out of a season of some of the most heightened stress any of us have ever endured. Like hundreds of thousands of people passed away. And, man, we've got to have really band together over the next couple of years to recognize, man, we're all in this thing together. Yeah.

Be with one another. Because one ridiculous decision on top of another on top of another ripples through these communities, man. It can make a mess, right? So we've got to get clarity on it. And we've got to understand it. We've got to get real with ourselves and get the right plan. And so, you know, I've talked about controlling the controllables.

That's it. And that is a factor with your money, but also in life. So give us a call. We're here to help you gain control. We're here to help you get a clear vision on the next step, the direction you're going. And we'd love to talk with you. That number again, tough call, is 888-825-5225. All right, going to the line.

I've got Alex is on the line. Alex, how are you? Hi, Chris. How are you doing? Oh, buddy, I'm focused and not finished how are you today um i'm doing good so uh i got a quick question for you um i uh we just started a business about a year and a half ago and the business is doing great uh we're good we're i mean it's just two months in and we're projecting it maybe tripling what we did last year.

Things are well. But I've got a kind of dilemma because all these people keep coming to me like, hey, man, you guys need to apply for this PPP money. There's like money. Everybody else is getting all this money. You know, I know a realtor friend. They got $27,000. This person's getting $20,000, getting all this money you know i know a realtor friend they got twenty seven thousand dollars this person's getting twenty thousand dollars like all this stuff and i've got two philosophies on it like i've got no problem finding every single tax deduction to

keep the money away from the thieves right but again on the other side of it is, is this a handout? Because I'm not looking for a handout. I'm looking to keep the money that I earn. I'm not looking for the government to give me money that I don't deserve. And so all these people tell me, well, well, you know, everybody else is doing it. Everybody else is going to do it. Like, why don't you do it too? And I'm sitting here thinking, like, you only have principles when it matters.

Like, you show your true character when it matters. And is this a handout or is this like getting tax money back? Right. Okay. I just need to. Let me tell me this. What line of work are you in? Plumbing.

You're in plumbing. And how many team members do you have? Three. And you said business, you opened a year and a half ago. Business is not just doing well, it's doing great. You're saying you're about to triple your profits, your revenue from a year and a half ago. Is that correct? Right.

Okay. And business has been good for you. So I'm going to tell you this. This PPP loan, and I'm glad you called it a loan because that's exactly what it is. People started calling it a grant. People started calling it X, Y, and Z. Here's the reality. The role of that money for this loan, which you and I both know, Alex, a loan is something

you pay back. With this, it could be used for rent. It could be used for paying your team members. There were specific things it could be used for. Here's the issue. People are just now following through and trying to submit to find out how much of this is actually going to be forgiven and then how much they're going to owe. So I'm going to tell you this.

A lot of the people that are telling you and that are hyped up about, hey, we got this free money. First of all, number one, it wasn't free. It was a loan. And the amount of paperwork they're having to jump through right now, I'm going to tell you something. They've got a rude awakening happening because people are submitting these. And from what I've heard from at least four of my banker friends, on average, about 45%

of them are being declined, which means that people are now going to start to get the payment plan that they're going to need for this money. So if I'm you, I'm avoiding this like the plague. Even when businesses were calling in during the pandemic and talking about it i was trying to let advise them do everything but this like this is not something that is ever going to go away so if you owe the money you owe it to the government uh they'll take as long as they have to to come get it or or come after you so it's not something I'd advise. And I love his heart on principle, right?

Yeah. So you find yourself out on an island, right, when you start looking around. And this is not just about the PPP loan. This is about anything, right? I've got this principle that I want to work real hard, and if I need help, I'm going to ask for it. I don't need any help, but everyone else is just taking this. This is a free fall. Am I an idiot here? Right?

Am I missing out? Yeah. What am I doing here? And his heart, I've got a principle that says, I don't borrow money. I work really hard and I want to keep what's mine. Fair. Right. And that's it.

Yeah. So should I go ahead and violate my principles because everyone else is? No. Yeah. No. No. Right. I really wouldn't.

And the mindset around it, again, you're having to submit paperwork to find out how much of this is going to be forgiven or what your bill is going to be. And let's be honest, man. We don't have this money to be loaning. What do you mean? We, the people, do not have this money to be loaning what do you mean we as we the people do not have this money to be loaning it doesn't exist and so we're gonna pay it back it's the government soon no it's the government we're all gonna pay it back later we print it we just print more christopher no i know man listen to me it's a problem we're all gonna Listen to me. It's a problem. We're all going to have to pay this back. It's a problem. It is a problem.

Whenever you start adding billions and trillions. With a T. Yes, to the bottom line, and we're doing it with the stroke of a pen, that's going to be a problem. We're going to have to. That bill is coming. It's coming. And you know who's going to pay for it? My kids.

All of us. My grandkids. Yeah. All of us. All of us. People who had no role in this no participation in this are gonna be on the hook for it because i couldn't say no yeah because i couldn't have hard conversations i couldn't live within my means and are there people across this country struggling holy smokes yes right i'm all about helping my neighbor. Yes. But when good folks like this say, am I crazy for living within my means? Right.

No. Or that you had businesses that were making millions upon millions applying for this PPP loan. It's like, come on, people. Wake up. Get a grip. All right, listen. Stay tuned. When we come back, we're going to take more calls and dig into more of your questions.

This is The Ramsey Show. I'm Chris Hogan, and hosting along with me this hour is John Deloney. We are excited to take your calls and talk about the things that are on your mind. Let's do the blinds.com question, John. As we look at this, you and I know blinds.com, 100% satisfaction guaranteed, means even if you mismeasure or pick the wrong color, they'll remake your blinds for free. You get free samples, free shipping, and with the new promos they run every month, you'll save even more. Use the promo code RAMSEY to get the best deal.

Rules and restrictions apply. So today's question comes from Paula in California. She asks, I have a universal life policy I've been paying into for 25 years. I no longer need a policy as I no longer have anyone who depends on me. I called to see if I could cash it in, and it's not worth much, but I feel like I should keep the policy since I've paid so much into it. What is your advice? Okay, well, I mean, looking at this, Paula, first and foremost, if you're saying you don't need it anymore, that means you're either A, built up enough wealth that you're self-insured so you don't have a reason for it. You've got money to be able to take care of your expenses.

Or you don't have anyone that's depending on you or your income. So, I mean, with this universal life policy, this is a whole life policy. So, essentially what happens with this is you end up paying on it for your whole life. But when you die, the only thing the family would get is the death benefit portion of it. So any of the cash that you've built up would go back to the insurance company. What? And so, oh yes. I didn't know that. Yes. So here's what I would do. I would definitely get with an insurance ELP, find out what the surrender charges are in this and what cash is in it, and go ahead and deal with that. Pull that out. You're going to pay taxes, obviously, on the gain of that.

But go ahead and pull that out. Then you can start to use that towards your baby steps. So if you're baby step six and you've already got your house paid for, then what you could do is you could do some giving with that or some extra investing. But if you don't have a need for it, there's no reason to let that sit there. Now, let's say you're out there and you've got whole life or universal life and you say, oh, Hogan, Dave said it's not good. I got to get rid of it. Slow your roll. First and foremost, what you have to do is get a term policy full and in effect. Okay?

Don't cancel anything until you've got another policy full and in effect because you might be deemed uninsurable. You might have a health situation, and if you can't get anything else, then you have to keep that. You want to hold on to that. But you want to get term life insurance 10 to 12 times your annual income so if you're making 550,000 a year or you know then you're looking to get 500 to 600,000 in term coverage and xander can help you with that so one of the coolest things in my life is i get to just sit on this show next to you and dave and and learn stuff and last week i learned some stuff sitting with Dave talking about whole life. I feel like I just learned something else. So this is not a theater. This is me almost speechless, which is a rare thing if you ask my family members.

Because I didn't know this is how this worked. So let's say I go get a whole life insurance policy. And they say, great. So tell me if this is how this works, Chris. I say, I want a $100,000 policy, and they say, great. So tell me if this is how this works, Chris. I say, I want a $100,000 policy, and they say, great. In fact, if today, whole life policy, $100,000

if you die. And there's a cash benefit of $25,000. But you've got to give us $200 a month just for the rest of your life. Right. So I say, great. So I live 10 years 15 years and i'm just giving them 200 bucks 200 bucks 200 bucks 200 bucks when i die my family didn't get that money they get the death they get the death benefit so if it was a hundred thousand dollar

policy with a fifty thousand dollar death benefit yeah and you pay on that all of your life, they're getting the $50,000. Now, that's if you haven't taken out any loans. So if you took loans out against it of $10,000 or $20,000, and you only had a $50,000 death benefit but a $20,000 loan, now when you die, the family's only getting $30,000. So really, I just paid for somebody else to have an awesome life you paid a heck of a fee and a heck of a premium for life for a very small amount of dollars to get back to let me have half of my money yes yes that was nice of me well and so it's the mindset around it of you know what's why we tell people you want to buy a term and invest the rest so term is going to be term life insurance is the cheapest way to get it.

And I know I've talked to people and they say, you know, from an estate planning standpoint, investing standpoint, they'll look at whole life and things of that nature. But I'm talking about for the average everyday person of looking at it, of just having wanted to have coverage. If something happens to me, money's coming to my family. And that's where term life insurance is going to be your best deal so it's one of the it's it's it's like folks who overpay their taxes because they feel like they get a bonus at the end of the year right yes it's not a bonus no it's

not a bonus it's your money but the government was holding on to it because make an interest on it make an interest on it and then they give it back to you. How nice of them. And so we've got to get smarter. And so if you're out there from teachable moment here, if you're out there and you've got life insurance through your job, I want to tell you that's not the way to go. Because if you lose or leave that job, you've also lost and left behind that insurance. So get term life insurance outside of your job. That way you've got the coverage. If you decide to go start a business, you decide to go do X, Y, and Z, do it. Now, John, another thing with life insurance.

If you're planning to have another kid or adopting another kid, you really want to look at this and rethink your life insurance. Do you need to increase it? Do you need to add more to it? And please don't forget, if you've got someone that's working in the home, they need to make sure that they have coverage as well. Because if you're the one working and something happens to you, the family's getting money. But if they're the one at home

taking care of kids and something happens to them, you also need money. Because you're going to have to hire someone to come take that to work to help the kids or you're going to have to move closer to family. So this life insurance stuff is serious business. You can learn more. Go to RamseySolutions.com or DaveRamsey.com.

Learn more, but really look at where you are this year and get the right amount of coverage. Again, 10 to 12 times your annual income is kind of the benchmark there of how much you want to get in place. And again, make sure if you've got someone working inside the home, they're covered as well. And I've said this before on this show, and I'll say it again. Man, I've been behind closed doors at 2.30 in the morning looking at a spouse whose husband or wife has just passed away in the other room, and they were the breadwinner, and they look you with, it's a very particular look when they look at you and they say the scariest words I can hear, which is, what do I do now?

Right? Like, I got to go to work on Monday because we can't pay rent next. You know, I don't know what to do. Right? Because we had nothing. Right? And nothing got me on the life insurance track faster than sitting with person one, person two, person three. I'm not going to leave my wife in that situation.

I'm just not. I'm not going to leave my kids in that situation. They need to be able to stop and grieve and go through their life and not have to worry about, hey, mom's got to go to work tomorrow. So, I mean, if you're out there and you've got someone, depending on your income, whether you're taking care of a niece, a nephew, a grandkid, you really got to look at this and think about it. Now, John, I've told people, if you're single, and you have no one depending on your income, and you've got an emergency fund, which could take care of your final expenses, then life insurance is not something you need. But if you've got people depending on your income, it is an absolute must. And you know, a lot of people are fearful of it because they don't know.

And I'm just going to tell you straight up because it's what I do. They're going to come in for life insurance. They're going to get your height, your weight, and they're going to get fluids. Okay? You're going to get fluids. And then from there, it'll take six to eight weeks in order for them to put the policy full in effect. And so get it done. We have no reason to delay, no reason to hold back.

We've got to make sure we get this stuff in place all right gotta get gotta handle it and so you know that's just one of those real things we got to talk about sometimes just because people can think can get scared and if you fear what you don't know most people as you were know if it's fear they freeze well and same as making a will getting life insurance doesn't increase the likelihood that you're going to die. No. Right? And people will think that.

I know they don't like to think about it. I don't want to talk about it, so I'm not going to do a will. I'm not going to do this. That's right. It doesn't increase the likelihood. No. It does increase the likelihood that when you die, which, spoiler alert, happens to everybody, that the people you love are going to be taken care of.

That's right. Right? That the state isn't going to be figuring out where your kids go and who gets your house. And your family's not going to have to go rush off to get to work. Hey, quick quiz from some unnecessary knowledge I know. You know what it's called if you die without having a will? Huh? It's called dying intestate.

Now, you can win Jeopardy with that one, baby. Listen, stay tuned. We come back to the Ramsey Show. We're getting back to the phones because you got questions and we got answers. Stay tuned. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Chris Hogan, and hosting along with me this hour is John Deloney. And I can't tell you how excited we are to talk to you. We're about to get to the phones, but I just want to let you know the phone number.

The number to call is 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225. Phone lines are open. Kelly is standing by and ready to take your call, and we'd love to talk to you. All right, we're going to get to the phone line. We've got a caller here. We've got James. He's calling in from Milwaukee.

James, how are you? Hey, I'm good, guys. How are you doing? Oh, we are focused and not finished, buddy. What's on your mind today? All right. So similar to a previous caller, I've got a bit of a situation here with a rental property of ours. My wife and I are amateur landlords at best, but it's been fairly lucrative for us over the past eight or nine

years. Looking to get out of it. But we do have a tenant that's been in our best property that we're going to be putting up for sale soon that hasn't paid rent in about a year. Went through the eviction process and actually got the notice to serve him and ended up not going through with it because it was February. He had no place to go. And so we let him stay with the agreement that he would really start to pay back what he had owed. He was back at work. Things were turning around. But that money hasn't come to us. So he owes us about $30,000 at this point. And just wondering what the best way to proceed with this is.

We want him out, but I also want that money. So is it a civil lawsuit once we get him out of the house? What does that look like? Yeah, this is tough, man. I am sorry. Because it sounds like you have been beyond understanding. Like, you guys have really tried to work with this guy, haven't you? Correct, yes.

And he's made no effort to pay you whatsoever? No, he hasn't paid in about a year. And the rent is, you know, it's a really nice house. It's about $2,900 a month that he pays us. So he paid for the first, you know, year or so, and then he ran into some hard times. And I know he's gotten stimulus money, and I know he's back at work, but none of that money has really come to us. Will he meet with you? Have you all sat down and had just a conversation over a table?

The only time he met with me is when I showed up. It was a little surprise visit. We actually don't live in the area anymore, so it's about a two-hour drive to get there. Gotcha. I got other stuff going on at this point, and I just want to be done with it. But obviously, we need them out. But you guys are going to sell this property? Yeah, and we should clear a couple hundred thousand when we sell it. That's good.

But from the principal standpoint, I want the money that we're looking for. No, I understand. And you are going to have to consult with an attorney. You really are. And here's the crazy thing, James. Not only are you going to have to consult with an attorney, but you're going to have to do some math on, A, what's it going to cost me to try to pursue this? And then, all right, and keep reminding yourself, as you well know, you still have $30,000 that you haven't received. And so now you're going to spend more money to potentially not get or get some money.

And so that's what I mean in that consultation with the attorney is to understand the likelihood and the probability of you getting any money. I love the fact that at least you're going to sell it and you're going to net out what that property is worth. But you've got to do kind of a cost-benefit analysis in that consult, and you'll pay $500 to $1,000 to sit with the attorney to walk through it. But in that meeting, you want to know how do you have to properly notify him that it's being sold uh also when he has to vacate and that vacating process for him to get out uh for you to be able to show it and sell it and all of those things uh you've john his guy's been over backwards

yeah the the chances you're getting that money are very very slim right yeah so unless this person is just piling up cash and has zero character, which I think is a low probability, right? I think more realistically, he fell on real hard times, has nowhere to go, and took advantage of somebody who wasn't going to kick him out, was going to work and work. After month two, month three, suddenly the rules don't – I mean, I'm going to keep plugging along, right? So you look up and it's a year later. I think you're right, Chris and James. I think you're going to have to sit down and do the hard math, the soul math. What is it going to cost you in sweat equity? What's it going to cost you an attorney to go after somebody?

Even if you get a judgment against him, they're going to say, great, you owe me $30,000. He's going to smile at you and say, it might as well be $30 million, dude. I don't have it. Right. And they're going to evict him. And then it's going to be on his credit report. You're going to high five. Then they're going to evict him and then it's going to be on his credit report you're going to high five then you're going to have a lawyer bill right that's right um at some point you think of it this way if there was 30 000 in a box two hours

away who wouldn't get in the car and drive over there and pick that up right so at some point you got to get in the car drive down there have a conversation um go through the eviction process have that i mean it's been a year right that's it's super, go through the eviction process. I mean, it's been a year, right? It's super generous. Go through that process. I just don't think you're going to see the money. I don't, man, that's a lot of sweat, actually, a lot of money to not get anything. I really don't.

And, you know, the other side of it is, is James, go in the bigger picture math of what that property's worth. You are selling it. I think this is, this call, my friend, is going to be a lesson for a lot of people. When you are looking to rent, not only do you want to get quality people with references, but security deposits. And it's still that chance. There's still that percentage chance of people going crazy or not doing what they're supposed to do. And that's one of those life lessons to look at this. And so have a consult with an attorney.

Get some guidance. You and your wife sit down and really be prayerful and careful on how you're going to go about it. Because what I don't want to see you do is to spend $100,000 going after $30,000. And at some point in your head, you'll feel validated. But ultimately, mathematically, and I like what you said, soul math, mathematically speaking, you're going to look and you go, I lost twice. I lost three times with this, and there's a better way to go about it. And if you're listening to this and you've fallen on hard times, which is 100% of us, right, 99.9% of us, fallen on hard times, times and we found ourselves in a situation where we need

somebody to step in and help us out whether that's with wise counsel whether somebody has reached out and given us you know we i've had envelopes show up in my mailbox during seasons of my life when people are struggling somebody says hey i understand like james did and they come to you and say oh man your life fell. You're in our best house. We're going to let you stay. We're going to ask you to step up when you can. Man, if you don't do anything

that next month and that next month and you don't communicate, someone is helping you out, here's the meta lesson here. Don't ever help anybody out. I'm the guy always running around saying, help out your neighbors, help out your community. And we get a year here. No communication, no nothing.

And I don't want the message being, don't ever help. No, I agree. People fall in hard times. They do. But man, if somebody helps out, if somebody's helped you out and you're listening to the show right now and you're not doing right by them, and you may not be able to come up with $30,000, call them. Communicate. Call them.

Yeah, I would tell people, you know, I used to be a debt collector many, many years ago. I would have loved to have seen you come to my house. A long time ago, yeah. I would not have answered. But as well as PD, pre-Dave. Yeah. But, you know, on this side of it and being a financial coach, I would tell people, if you can't pay, you can at least pay attention. Communicate.

And that paying attention is communicating. Call them. Don't be a hostage in your own home with the bill collectors calling you. Pick up the phone, call them. Communicate about your situation. But John, I would tell them this. If you're somebody communicating to a collector, don't expect their permission. Don't expect them to be

understanding. That's not the goal of the communication. The goal of the communication is information exchange. Let them know, listen, I know i owe you x y and z this is what i can afford to send in this is what i plan to send in by the 30th right and then do that stick to that but call them like you're saying call them communicate on the front end over communicate as much as possible when you're in somebody's debt whether it's a a gift like James gave this tenant or it's money like a previous caller, it lays on you like that. We call it that shame blanket.

It does. It's heavier and heavier. And the thing that feeds shame, right? It's an old Brene Brown thing. Secrets and silence. It feeds that stuff, man. So if suddenly somebody does you a solid and suddenly the next month shows up you can't pay, then you've got to swallow it.

Call them. Yeah, you've got to pick up the phone and call them. Let shows up you can't pay? Yeah. Call him. Yeah, you've got to pick up the phone and call him. Let him know what's going on. Talk about your situation. He's taking care of our neighbors. Oh, man, what a fun hour. Listen, I want to thank everybody for tuning in. Thank all the callers for calling in.

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