The Ramsey Show - App - My Coworkers Earn Way More Than I Do (Hour 1)

Episode Date: April 13, 2021

Debt, Home Buying, Career Sign Up for a FREE trial of Ramsey+ TODAY: https://bit.ly/3rZTUAx Tools to get you started:  Debt Calculator: https://bit.ly/2Q64HME Insurance Coverage Checkup: https://bit.ly/3sXwUn5 Complete Guide to Budgeting: https://bit.ly/3utmVXi Check out more Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3fHhbVE

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host, Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, radio host, and best-selling author is my co-host today. You jump in, we'll talk about your life and your money. The Ken Coleman Show is all about careers, jobs, getting one, getting a better one, living in your sweet spot, but doing something of purpose that matters.

And Ken can answer questions about all of that kind of stuff. So you jump in, and we'll talk about your life and your money, and your jobs and your career as part of that equation. 888-825-5225 is the number. That's 888-825-5225. Aaron is in New York City to kick us off this hour. What's up, Aaron? Hey, thanks so much for taking my call. Sure, how can I help? So I am on baby step two. I have about $6,000 in credit cards and a car that's about $10,000 owed. And I am coming into some money, about $6,000 from a bonus for my job. And I was curious if you would consider selling the car. I make about $40,000 a year.

Or if you would just use the $6,000, pay off the credit cards, then pay off the car. B. Yes. Use the $6,000, pay off the car. Unless you just hate the car. But the car is not an unreasonable car, given a $40,000 income. A $10,000 car is not an unreasonable car. Okay. I take it you're single, from000 car is not an unreasonable car. Okay. I take it you're single from the language you're using. Yes.

Okay. And so that is your entire household income is $40,000, and you have a $10,000 car, correct? Yes. Yeah. We tell folks don't have anything with motors, wheels, or anything like that added together that equals more than half your annual income because anything with a motor in it goes down in value.

And so if all this stuff adds up, in other words, you've got a bunch of dadgum toys in your life and they're all going down in value, you don't have to scratch your head and wonder why you're broke. We know why you're broke. Toys are fine. They just need to be a good ratio to your income. I've got lots of toys, but they're a small percentage of my income and so you're you're 25 of your income with this car so yeah throw your bonus at your credit cards dude uh chop them up continue to work your baby steps knock that car loan out and you're going to be sitting in a really really

good shape really good shape so ken uh the job numbers are you were talking about it before we came on the air yeah and this is a um i thought i knew something i i'm learning i knew nothing i couldn't i mean i've got in my mind i've got states that are wide open like our state of tennessee's wide open and then you've got the communist state of California where everything's shut down by a draconian governor, right? And so I figure the entire economy is just sitting on the sidelines, sitting on their hands in some of these states, and the economy is booming in the other states.

But you're saying these numbers coming out, the federal numbers coming out across the whole nation, blending these different states together, obviously, and these numbers, the job market is really good. It's way better than you think, and here's the good news, Dave. These numbers say it's going to absolutely explode in the next few months, in the next quarter. Here's where we are right now. End of February, 6.7 million private sector jobs were posted.

That's up from 6.1 million at the end of December. So as we went into the new year, that's how many jobs. So we're seeing a nice trend in private sector jobs that are posted. All right. And here's the way of looking at that. 8% more job openings in February 2021 than there were in February 2020. Now, some of you are going, okay, I'm trying to remember. When did COVID shutdown start?

Really in March. In the month of February, obviously towards the end of February, we were learning new information. okay, I'm trying to remember. When did COVID shutdown start? Really in March. In the month of February, obviously towards the end of February, we were learning new information, and things really ground to a halt in March, Dave. But we had negative unemployment in February. 3.4%. Oh, we had 3.4%. But that's historical. That was the lowest unemployment rate in the history of the modern era where they really took those data and they really crunched it. So we had the greatest unemployment rate, if you will, not greatest, or the lowest,

the best it had ever performed. So now we're seeing more jobs. So what we're seeing is the United States economy is creating new jobs. So we lost 40 million jobs in the COVID downturn, right? That's right. And the unemployment rate today is what? Low six as well. That's what it was reported last month.

We're waiting on those numbers to come out in April. I think you're going to see those numbers drop into the low fives. You might see it in the four. There's no way to really predict that, but based on these numbers. So the overall economy from a jobs perspective has bounced back. It's bouncing back. It's not even finished. Let me tell you where this is happening, Dave. In the areas of manufacturing, pharmacy, construction, and logistics, and think logistics, a lot of technical jobs there, you're seeing 50% growth in jobs. So what's going to happen in the next few months? I think we're going to get very close to where we were in February of 2020, pre-pandemic,

where there were more jobs available than there were people who were unemployed. Why does this matter? Well, number one, you're getting a steady diet of negative news all the time, that the sky is falling. Yeah, because I don't even watch the news, and I thought it was worse than this. No. And the second thing is, understand, folks, there are still a lot of states. Remember, California, New York, New Jersey, just giving you some examples,

not a political statement. This is a fact. They're still not fully opened up. And if you look at the hardest-hit sector in the American job economy was what we call leisure. So that would be your bars, your restaurants, hotels, certainly the airline industry. They're not back. They're not back. So when we see, hopefully, a full comeback in the summer, I think we're going to see one of the greatest periods of job expansion.

That means companies offering more jobs. And think of the economy, Dave, and how jobs that didn't exist a year ago now exist. So what's that mean to a guy that's out there listening who doesn't have a job right now? It means you better be ready. And that's why you need to come to my Get Hired event. I just slipped that in there right there. April the 27th. But, I mean, does this mean that that guy that's out there doesn't have a job right now,

he really should be looking and looking different and better because people are hiring and it's almost full up. That's exactly right. And it's only going to increase. I mean, when it's three-point something or four-point something unemployment, economists call that full employment. Yes. Even though there's technically people not working, it's like everybody who wants to work is working. And to your point. And some's what happens in that situation that we described last February. People will start to pay you more.

The market value for a job goes up. We saw this last year where young people coming out of college were getting paid more than people that were already on the job and experienced. Why? Because the demand, this is a supply-demand issue, just like in housing or any other commodity. Supply-demand. We are about ready to move into a place where it is going to be a really good environment for the job seeker, for you to get hired

and make more money, bigger shovel, get out of debt faster, and position yourself to pursue the dream job. That also works for not only someone who's sitting there unemployed today, but someone who just wants to change jobs. Yes, sir. A lot of opportunity. A lot of opportunity.

A lot of opportunity. I want to make more money. I want to do something different. And so getting qualified right now, getting prepared for this, you've got to have your head on a swivel. The job market's heating up, and it's going to get better. And anybody who's intentional about where I want to go, why I want to go there, what I want to do when I get there, now's the time. Now let's plug the Get Hired. Yeah, April the 27th, live from our Ramsey Solutions studio.

We're going to have a couple hundred people live. Multiple ticket prices. Live stream anywhere. $20 to start. And you're going to walk them through how to get hired. Get clear, get qualified, get connected so that opportunities knock on your door. You can get the job you want, the job you need. Get out of debt and do work you love.

It's going to be a great night. It is going to be a great night. Go get your ticket, RamseySolutions.com slash events. Tickets start at $20. Love to see you there. It's a live stream. $20. You paid more than that for lunch. It's a pretty good investment.

Paid more than that for lunch. Yeah. No matter what time of year it is, focusing on your family's financial plan is always a smart move. I get questions all the time about where to start and what to do first. One of the most crucial and affordable first steps to take is to protect your family and get term life insurance. I know it's not glamorous, but all the other steps mean a lot less if something happens to you and your family has no financial protection.

Getting term life insurance needs to be a top priority. I recommend 10 to 12 times your income and lock in rates for 15 to 20 years. This gives you plenty of time to get out of debt and build wealth. I've been recommending Zander Insurance for over 20 years, and they understand and live this strategy and will take the time to help you find the most affordable term life rates. Go to Zander.com or call 800-356-4282. It's not that expensive, it's not complicated, and you need to do it now. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality again.

Host of the Ken Coleman Show. Doing the Get Hired event. If you're feeling stuck or disengaged in your current job or you dread getting out of bed to go to work, then this event is for you. Get Hired livestream event on Tuesday, 27th. At this one-night event, you'll learn how to get clear on what you do best, get qualified for the job you want, and get connected. You can join Ken on Tuesday, April the 27th to take control of your career and start working toward what you were born to do. Tickets start at just $20.

Text HIRED to 33-789. HIRED to 33-789. Our question of the day comes from Blinds.com. They have a 100% satisfaction guarantee. That means even if you screw up or you mismeasure or you pick the wrong color, they'll remake your window blinds for free. Free samples, free shipping, and with new promos all the time. Always use the promo code, the magic word, Ramsey.

Today's question comes from Sam in California. He asked, my wife and I have $20,000 saved for a home down payment. I currently work in sales, but I don't know what career path I want to take in the future. Should my priority be figuring out the career question while we have money saved, or should we purchase a home and hope career clarity comes later? Well, this is going to come down to personal preference on this, but I would not necessarily forego buying the house. If you save the money and it's a part of the big plan, I would go ahead and move forward on it. The only exception to that, Dave, would be when you ask these four questions about getting qualified.

You've got to get clear first, but once we get clear, and that could take some time, you've got to ask yourself, all right, so what education do I need? This does not necessarily mean a four-year degree or a graduate-level degree. This could be a certification, some basic training that would, again, qualify you to do the work you want to do. Could be getting your real estate license. Could be that. There's a cost associated.

So the education question is the first thing. What do I need to learn? The second question is the experience question. What experience do I need? The third question is the economic question. How much is it going to cost me if I've got to go get some experience? I've got to go get some education. And then the fourth question is, based on that third economic question, is what's my expectation for how long this is going to take? That's how we

come up with a plan. Now, if Sam does this and he gets clear and he realizes, okay, I'm going to need about five to 7,000 to get qualified to do it. He's got a couple options. They could delay putting the down payment on the home and use some of that, or they could go ahead and buy the home and then save up. It's going to take some time anyway. So that's what I mean home and use some of that, or they could go ahead and buy the home and then save up. It's going to take some time anyway. So that's what I mean by it depends. But in this situation with you not being clear, I'd go ahead and put the down payment down on the home and begin to get clear.

Take the career clarity guide. It'll get you started. I don't know if this has to be in the new career, but it would be really helpful to have a clue what it looks like. Yeah, so that way I don't want you to be the one. Because that's going to tell me, if I'm going to go, for instance, I mean, I think most extreme thing would be like, I'm going to go in the real estate business. You might make zero money for six months. Right.

And you don't want a brand new house payment. That's right. If that's what you're stepping into. So that would tell you. That's right. No. So that would tell you no. So I think clarity would be very important before you make the decision because that's going to tell you if you need to spend money on education or if you're going to have an income gap while you get up and running in the new gig.

That's right. But once you have that figured out, if it doesn't prohibit you, if it doesn't use up too much of your down payment money or give too big a gap in your income to make the jump, then you can buy the house and make the jump later once you know where it is you're going and how long it's going to take you to get there. That's the key. So I think I would do that.

Again, you don't have to be in the new career to buy the house, but you should have a clue. This is general vagueness. That's right. Because I don't want you walking in frustrated two years or a year after you bought a house and go, I quit. You did what? We have a house payment. That's exactly right.

What'd you do? I'm going to kill you. Right. And that's where the priority thing comes in. It becomes apparent. So again, those four questions I gave, that's after you're clear. Then you run it out and go, what's the plan to get to where I want to go? That's going to determine the money question.

That determines, okay, do I want the house now? Can I cash flow my qualifying process? And so that's why that works together. Always get clear. That's stage one. Stage two is get qualified. And that's how that works. Michael is in Atlanta. Hey, Michael, welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hey, how's it going? Better than I deserve. What's up?

So I'm currently on Baby Step 2, and I'm starting a process where I do the debt snowball and really wipe out my debts. Baby Step 2 says you should pay off all debts except for the house using the snowball. And in my case, I wanted to see if that would be the scenario. My debts are probably a little higher than average because I'm running a practice and a business. Okay, so what are you talking about? You've got a business debt that you signed personally for, so it's a personal debt. But how much is it?

Yeah, ultimately, so right now my practice debt is about $800,000. And then my college tuition is about $185,000. College tuition. You mean student loan debt? Correct, yes. Student loan debt goes in Baby Step 2. $800,000 practice goes in Baby Step 6. Okay.

Yeah, so you consider that as part of like the same concept as paying off the home early then yeah yeah and i would call it um here's a here's a kind of a correlation on that if you will although the numbers aren't as many zeros but if you're if you have a home equity loan we put it in baby step two if it's less than half your annual income if it's more than half your annual income we put it in baby step six with the house. So pray tell, please tell me you have an incredible income with this delicious mess you've made. Luckily, the first year of the business, my take-home was pushing $250. So luckily, I'm producing more than I'm spending, and I have the ability to snowball a debt.

Okay. So you said practice. You're a medical doctor or? A dentist. A dentist. Excellent. Okay. The most expensive form.

Okay. So you netted $250 last year. Correct. That's my net income. What do you think you're going to get this year? I'm aiming to up at the $300, but I'm taking a step at a time with COVID. Things went all over the place, so we'll see. So you're going to try to put at least 200 a year towards this mess, right?

That's at least the plan. Yeah, I'm still living on almost a college budget. I like that. I like that. That's hard to do when you're making a quarter of a million dollars a year emotionally, but it is the right thing to do and the smart thing to do because you have a large mess to go with your large income. Yeah, but that's a scary number to look at, so that's my motivation. Yeah, and I think if you – here's what I'd be looking at,

how stinking wealthy you're going to become instantly when you clear the table on all this debt. I mean, you've got a million dollars here in just student loans and practice debt alone, and so when you clear that million dollars off the top of your head and you're making $3,350, you're going to make so much money so fast it's going to be unbelievable. But the temptation is to drag that out for a lot of people, and that's a huge mistake. We've worked with a lot of guys and gals in the dental world over the years, and you guys spend more money than mds do

on your practices and on your education it's it's shocking but the good news is you got a good practice that you stepped into so i'm glad for you yeah play through baby play through good stuff wow yeah got to keep the eye on the prize i hope you folks heard what dave said because it's such a huge mountain right but then you got to go what's it like on the prize. I hope you folks heard what Dave said. Because that's such a huge mountain, right? But then you've got to go, what's it like on the other side of that mountain? And that's when you start piling up money. And you go, okay, how long do I want to be a dentist? Well, 25 years.

Well, you know, you bust it over the next two, three years, you know, four years, backs. Really get after it, and you're on the other side of that mountain. Well, it's really fun, you know, once you get up there. And, you know, I think of, there's a great story of Sir Edmund Hillary who climbed Mount Everest the first time, and he was with his climbing partner, and they finally get up there. You can imagine how difficult that journey was way back then. He finally gets up at the highest point, and you're looking out. That's really this idea of getting over debt.

If you get so consumed with how difficult the climb is, many people fall off. But if you're going, hey, I want to be the first person to summit that, I'm going to summit that, that's what we're about, that's the vision. When you get up there, here's what's great. On the other side of these debt-free screens that you hear on this show, people are now looking out. They've been looking up during the journey, but then when you finally get up there, and Edmund Hillary looked at his friend who's climbing Sherpa partner, and he said, I think that's the next one we're going to climb.

Isn't that amazing? On top of the world, five minutes later, think that's the next one we're going to climb. Isn't that amazing? On top of the world. Five minutes later, I think that's the one we're going to climb. But now the vision is this way. Yeah, you start seeing different. It's a different viewpoint. And it is half the battle in the stuff we talk about around here, from Dr. John talking about mental health to money to careers to uh you know all the different types of things we get ourselves into around ramsey so much of it has to do with the view it has to do with

the perspective and uh you know they say that it's easier to make a second million sure it is because you've already done it once and you believe you can do it it's always easier i know i've done it twice because i was so stupid I had to do it twice. There you go. This is The Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. Ken Coleman, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today here on the air. This is the Ramsey Show. Allie's with us in Omaha, Nebraska. Allie, my screen says you're debt-free. Congratulations.

Thank you, Dave. Thank you so much for having me on today. I am so honored to talk to you. You too. How much have you paid off? I paid off $29,173.53. Very cool. How long did this take?

Yeah, five months on the dot. Excellent. And your range of income during that time? Yeah, so I was right out of school. I didn't work my senior year, and so I was making, you know, like $0. During rough and off debt, I made what would have been equivalent to about $90, and then now I'm back to about the average for a nurse, like $65, $70. So you just dove in and took all the OT you could get?

I absolutely did. I had two jobs, sold calligraphy signs, had all kinds of stuff on Facebook. I was busy, busy for five months. So you graduated, passed your bar, and dove in? Yep, you got it. Passed your boards, I guess I should say. Yep, boards. So what kind of a nurse are you? So my full-time job is in the NICU.

I am at a level four in Omaha, then I do rehab hospitals on the side. Wow. Good for you. So what made you so fired up to knock this out so fast? I mean, you're a ball of fire, kiddo. Yeah, thanks. So I had a friend posting on his social media about how he had found you and how your principles are really changing his life.

And I grew up with a family who, you know, we talked about Dave. I knew about you. I had gone to college, and honestly, for my first three years, I was debt-free. I was on a full-ride scholarship. But then with my nursing degree, I changed institutions from my prerequisites to my nursing school, and so my scholarship didn't transfer for my senior year. And it didn't sit well with me that I was going to have to take out loans for that fourth year. So I had already kind of been game planning how I was going to pay off fast. But then I started researching you and

reading your books and listening to your podcast, honestly, obsessively about Christmas of the previous year. And yeah, the math initially really was what started the ball rolling. And, you know, once I started out of school too, I started having conversations with my patients and patient family members, you know, parents in the NICU who were choosing between time with their infant in critical care and going home to their families and their other children. And just, you know, it became so much more so quickly. Once the journey started, it was so easy to catch fire and knock it out. Way to go.

Man, you're on fire. How old are you? Thank you. I am 23. I was 22 when I was paying off all this debt. My goodness. How does it feel to be free? It's amazing, honestly.

It has already had such an impact on my future to be able to put all of my money toward exciting new things. You know, I am getting married this fall, which I'm super excited about. Yay. Yes, yay. And so we're excited to have a debt-free marriage

and starting off in all of those best ways we've been able to save for retirement. It's light. I feel like my peers are concerned about the next steps because there's always the next step, the next thing. I get to look forward to the next step, and I feel really blessed. Wow. Well, because you chose a hard path that ultimately ends up being an easier path. You live like no one else. So now you can live and give like no one else.

You're an inspiration. So what do you tell people the secret to getting out of debt is? You did it. You're a professional. Thank you. Yeah. So a big part for me was the mindset. I just never let myself even think, like, I'm tired, you know, I'm done with this.

Because if I did, then the defeat road just came up so quickly. So it was really keeping the mindset. Accountability for me was huge. I think I sent you some pictures of some Post-it notes stuck on my bedroom wall, maybe. Yeah, they're showing up on the YouTube channel. That's fantastic. Yeah, yeah. So each sticky note represented two hundred dollars and initially it was practically from the floor to the ceiling and so i would post every two weeks i'd make my payment onto

my instagram for all my friends and whoever to see and it got to the point where i would like i'm a night shift nurse so you know i be working Thursday night into Friday morning and coming home, and people would be messaging me, where is your debt post? What have you paid today? Wow. And so the accountability was massive for me for that as well. Wow. Well, she set up her own group on Instagram.

Oh, yeah. That's amazing. Yeah. Well done. Well done. This is a key thing here, Dave. Allie, I want to congratulate you and comment on this and if i've got it wrong that's fine correct me they're not gonna bother me but i think there's

something about the right applause when you started posting those things on instagram and people started paying attention they saw oh ally's doing this like every week this is showing up and they see your progress i'm just curious was the encouragement from people uh reading those posts was that also not just accountability but also some applause that gave you some juice? Totally. Yeah, definitely. And especially when I did get some messages while I was paying off all my debt, a friend saying, you know, I don't know where to start. I don't know how to do this.

And so I was able to call them and talk through starting of a budget or a game plan they might be able to attack. I've been passing out your total money makeover books, Dave, like crazy. It's been really awesome to watch everyone else get on fire with me because it's become kind of this group shared vision. And yeah, I mean, honestly, the encouragement that I got each week was so awesome. I had friends who are older than me and have gone through your program before sending me money for coffee on my way to my sixth shift, you know, and they were just being so supportive. You know, like they see how hard I was working,

and they were so encouraging, so supportive. You're an amazing young woman. I'm so proud of you. Very, very, very well done. Well, we're going to send you a copy of rachel cruz's latest book know yourself know your money uh ken i'm pretty convinced if we could get about 50 000 alleys going we could change this whole nation that's about all it would take i think we could tip we could tip over all the idiots out there pretty quick if we had 50 000 alleys it'd be done yep

it changed the whole world way to go i'm so happy for you you're so you're so bright so so loud so uh so so you know just so much coming out of you it's pretty amazing very very cool all right alley in omaha nebraska 29 000 paid off in five months making 90 to 65 all the OT and nurse can stand. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Alright. 3, 2, 1. I'm debt-free! Yeah! Wow!

Pretty amazing. I don't want to have a baby in NICU, but if I did and she walked around the corner, things would be a little better. Well said. Wow. Talk about infectious. Man.

I'm smiling just because she's smiling, and you can hear her smile. No question. She's fired up, man. And, you know, there is something between that, and it's amazing. Over the years of doing this, this is how we ended up coining the phrase, personal finance is 80% behavior. It's 20% head knowledge. Your behavior flows from your beliefs. That's right.

You would never act on something you don't believe to be true unless you're a psychopath. So otherwise, you know, farmers would never plant seed if they didn't expect a crop. And so there's a belief that causes that behavior that action of planting and in her case she believes and it's amazing to me i i talked to people making 120 000 a year and they can't figure out how to pay off 20 000 because eeyore is their spirit animal and then i talked to people like her she's straight out of college she had zero money and passes her boards goes get six jobs all in nursing at one time i'm exaggerating but i mean she went crazy because she just was

on fire i mean she was just burning at both ends and and knocks this thing out in 29 months dave you said something that's so huge folks don't miss what he said belief belief in what you're doing belief that you can do it but also the belief of others i just had the thought i was sitting there listening to her story in today's world more than ever because of social media and 24-hour news and the woke mob and all the things we're so worried about criticism what other people say and we ought to be we ought to not be worried about criticism we ought to be looking for the right applause from people who go yeah you can lose that weight yes you can pay that debt off yes people who go, yeah, you can lose that weight. Yes, you can pay that debt off. Yes, you can get that training.

Yes, you can get that job. You can do that. We need applause. That extra bit of belief from people who know why we're doing it and believe that we can do it is a game changer. Man, if we could offset some applause for all the trolls. Yeah, stop worrying about the critics. Amazing.

This is The Ramsey personality is my co-host today. He is host of the Ken Coleman Show, heard on 75 plus radio stations, plus a podcast and an ever popular show on Sirius XM. It's all about careers and jobs and finding your purpose. So jump in and join the Ken Coleman Show. And you can join Ken today right here. The phone number 888-825-5225 brent's with us in boise idaho hey brent what's up hey y'all thanks for taking my call sure how can we help questions

for ken um so i just started um a new job a month or two ago um and i accepted my salary, and I was happy enough with it. And then I found out that my coworkers are making about 50% more than I do, like 45%. What do you make? And I was wondering, I'm making $22 an hour. Doing what? Medical lab scientists. And they're making $33 an hour. Yeah, $32.

Are they measurably more experienced than you? No. How did you come about this? We're all dealing. How did you get this information? I'm from them. There's two of us that work on this. There are two others and then me that were working on this one.

We're dealing with COVID. Well, I got to lean, I got to tell you, I got to lean a little bit on Dave. I got some thoughts, but Dave is hiring a lot. No, no, but you've got a unique perspective in how many people you've hired and fired in culture development. But so this is really challenging, okay, because this is all psychology and you're human. And so you've got to you're going to have to rise above this is the straightforward answer, because if you don't, this is going to eat you alive. And I don't think you'll last very long. This is the the natural comparison and comparison is a cancer.

The only person I try to compare myself to is the me of yesterday. And that's hard. But that's what you got to do. Because if you're saying things are equal and it's an equal playing field, they don't have any more experience than you. They don't have any additional certifications or all that stuff.

This is a really nasty situation to find out about. I got to tell you, I'm a slight bit cynical, maybe suspect that you got the information from them. I'm not saying they lied to you, but the whole thing just stinks. And if you want to be there, here's the last piece, if you want to be there in the sense that it's the ladder you need to be on for your career and where you eventually want to get to, and you've got to be on this rung to get to the next rung,

then you're going to have to really suck it up and be the better man here and stay out of this kind of stuff and earn the next rung. If you can't handle that, then you're eventually probably going to self-select and have to get out of there, and I'm sorry that it's happened to you because it's a real devastating psychological blow. It's a really good question you brought to the forefront here and the interesting thing about it is your tone when you're asking the question is not whiny you're just like it's it's like a curiosity to you

which is a positive thing so there's not a you're not angry or bitter or something like that you're just like this doesn't make sense it's like a, right? I mean, there's a riddle here. And so I'm going to join you in the riddle. Why would you, if you were to guess why the discrepancy in pay, what would you guess? Because they are, I mean, it's a business or hospital, and they're just trying to get as little or pay as little. I came from a—

So you don't think it's an oversight? You don't think they saw something different in your qualifications than the other guy? You don't think there's a logical explanation other than just sheer they didn't want to pay as much and they thought they could get away with it, and they did? And they did. I didn't want to pay as much and they thought they could get away with it, and they did. And they did. I didn't come in. I thought the job was a technician job, not a technologist job. And so when they gave me my pay, I was like, well, this is really exciting.

Yes, I'll take this because it's like $4 more than I thought it was going to be. And then I found out what the job really entailed. I am a biochemist, not a medical scientist. I see. Yeah, I've been learning to play golf, and I figured out the secret to happiness is low expectations. Yeah. So, yeah, you had low expectations, and then you got a $4 more, and you thought, this is

wonderful, and then you found out you're $10 under, and it's all about expectations. What Ken said, it's a psychological problem. So, what is the environment like? What's the environment like between you and your supervisor or your hiring, the person that did the hiring with you? Is this an open, conversational, good people, or is it very chain of command, real shut your mouth, get your work done? I mean, is it authoritative? That is a great question um the only time i've met my supervisor is the day i was interviewed she went on leave right after that and then has since come back from leave and has never stepped in and i'm a night shift and so i

haven't she's gone before I come in. Yeah. Well, what I have figured out is that there's going to be a difficult conversation. It is going to be in your head, and your head's going to explode eventually, or you're going to have a difficult conversation. And the trick is how to sit down with her and have a difficult conversation. And one of the things we teach leaders to do, and you're leading up in this situation, is to just, if there's an elephant in the room, go, hey, there's an elephant over there. Don't act like he's not there.

And so let's just call out a couple things that we know here. Okay. Number one, when I interviewed for this job, I first thought it was this, and then I found out it was that, and I was $4 more than I thought. And so I was really happy and I'm grateful. And by the way, I am grateful for the job. And I haven't gotten to talk to you a lot because you've been out on leave and, of course, I'm night shift, but I'm swinging by this afternoon to have a five-minute meeting with you and I want you to hear nothing but gratitude from me. But I got to talking to the other guys in the lab and I found out that I'm the only guy with the exact same qualifications that makes 22 and they all make 32.

And what I want to ask you is, what can I do to make myself worth 32 to you guys? Because I'd like to measure up, and apparently I've not done that yet. And that pretty well exposes the crap without you going, you people ripped me off. That's the other way to approach it, in which case you just get fired. Brent, really quick, I want to jump in and ask this question.

Are you able to do the market research and be able to show that there's a range of income and that the work you're actually doing does pay higher? Is that something you can find the evidence for and show that in the marketplace? There is. They are actually above average that in the marketplace? There is. They are actually above average, what the other two are making. Yeah. Well, what I would do is I would just say all of this. Yeah, I would say, number one, I'm happy at 22.

I'm not coming in here to gripe about them making more. And number two, I know that the pay around here is above average in general. But what I'm trying to do is figure out how I can be more valuable to this place so that I can be worth it, and you put me in for a 32 instead of a 22. But I want to earn it, and I want you to tell me how I can be the best person I need to be to do that. And I don't want you to hear anything from me but gratitude. Listen, if your boss gets twisted up about that, your boss is an idiot. There's your sign.

That's not a long-term stay. Yeah. And if they go, shut up and get in your corner, you accepted the job, then start looking for another position. But I don't think they will. I think you're bringing it up. And what you're doing is you're exposing the fact that all of these facts are here. Oh, by the way, you can also say I accepted the job at 22. So I did this deal. And so I can't come in and gripe about the deal.

I'm not here to gripe about the deal. I took the job. And so, you know, the fact that somebody else makes more does not make me unhappy. But what I do want to do is I want to figure out a track that I can get on to be of value to this place to where I can join them in that kind of an income because that would make me feel really fulfilled, and I would know that I did a good job for you guys. And that kind of – just keep talking about it that way. But, you know, A, I took the job. I did the deal, so I got no gripes because if you'd have been 32, if it had been 42,

if it had been, you know, whatever number, you'd have taken the job. And so you took the job, know and just admit that and admit that you're you're grateful and that we don't have a relationship because i'm not seeing you and just put all these things that are facts out on the table so that that there's nothing swirling around as a side uh communication that's not happening and be real careful with your body language, your tone, and your pacing. And be real calm like you've been with us and not whining. Keep your octave down. No high octaves.

This is The Ramsey Show. Have a friend or family member that needs a daily dose of Ramsey advice in their life? Let them know about the Ramsey advice in their life? Let them know about the Ramsey Call of the Day podcast. It's a quick hit of advice about life and money in under 10 minutes. Check out the Ramsey Call of the Day podcast wherever you listen to podcasts.