The Ramsey Show - App - My Dad's Finances Are in a Mess Since My Mom Passed Away (Hour 2)

Episode Date: December 17, 2021

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🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Thank you for joining me.

Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey personality, host of The Dr. John Deloney Show, an extremely popular and exploding podcast. The numbers are absolutely amazing. He is my co-host today. We're taking your calls about your life and your money. The Dr. John Deloney Show is all about dealing with mental health issues and relationships and boundaries and anxiety and all of these kinds of things. Be sure and check it out.

It's an amazing show. It's a fun listen. It comes out on podcast here in the Ramsey Network. If you want to have a discussion with John, you can call in today at 888-825-5225. He'll be part of your answers all day. And, of course, you can also email him and be part of his show by being a caller on the show. Email askjohn at ramsaysolutions.com. Or call and leave a voicemail, and producers will get back with you and put you on the show at 844-693-3291. John, what is the, I don't know, the call that stands out in the last several weeks?

Oh, man. You've had some pretty ridiculous ones. Tough ones. You've had some scary ones, some sad ones, some funny ones. The one that stood out the most is the, the, the woman who, um, was married to a guy in recovery and, um, she came home and he'd stepped in the bathroom and he had started using again

and she didn't know. And then she lost him and just processing grief and that her guilt of what I should have done and I should have known, but I didn't, and all the woulda, shoulda, couldas that comes when you lose somebody that you love, and what are the signs, and what does grief look like now? And that was a rich call, and she was open and honest. And she's articulate, too. I mean, she's a brilliant lady.

Absolutely. I listened to the call it was uh her ability to articulate all the different angles and feelings and the hope of that whole grieving process of dealing number one living with an addict that was uh not hiding it from was hiding it from her was not acting out to her knowledge he had never been using while she was while they were married it was all before and then he had been dry and then then he relapsed and dies one night in OD, right? And so, yeah, that call was amazing. And, yeah, her ability to articulate what was happening,

and yet you know what it's like being in the ocean and thinking, I'm drowning. It doesn't stop you from drowning, right? That water still waves over you, and you're still bobbing up and down in the ocean, and so you've got to ride it out, and it's hard, and it's messy. But those are beautiful calls, and you walk alongside folks during hard moments, man. That's what the show's about. And what's interesting is that we all learn something about ourselves,

even though we've not been in that exact situation. We think, there's a little piece of that that I wonder about inside my soul. There's a little piece of that over there wonder about inside my soul there's a little piece of that over there and when she said that thing and so we all plug into that it's not just watching her go through it or is it always when it's all of your callers are that way there's almost always something where i go oh yeah i get that when i used to do crisis work with police department and we'd i'd show up to a scene that was just a mess and tough. I, I began a ritual when I got home, which was to stop in my kid's room. And it was usually two, three in the

morning. They have no idea I'd ever did this. Um, but it was one of those moments that I'm not going to take one moment for granted. So I'd stop and open their door and just pray over my kids and just watch them breathe and sleep. And one, that helped me remember, like, I'm home now and I'm safe here. I just saw some stuff that was tough. But more importantly, I'm not going to take a minute for granted. So even if you aren't married to an addict or you're not dealing with divorce, you're not dealing with trauma, everybody's got stuff. And, yeah, you're exactly right.

You take little bits and nuggets of it, and it just helps you breathe a little bit deeper. All right. Starting this hour off with Carrie in Columbia, South Carolina. Hi, Carrie. What's up? Hi. Nice to talk to y'all. You too.

How can we help? Really quick before I tell you. Yesterday, I was listening to y'all's podcast, and I started cracking up when y'all were talking about not sharing your income with your kids totally when they're young, because in South Carolina, all state employees' incomes over $50,000 are public domain online. And so I was like, well, I hope my kids never learn that. They will, Carrie.

They will now. You just told them. Yeah, that was helpful. Well, at least, I'll say, we just moved back from overseas, so my oldest is language delayed and ESL student. so at least hopefully it'll slow down her Googling. There we go. Just don't teach her how to spell Google. You'll be all right. Another question about retirement, and if you have time at the end, I'd love to squeeze in a car question, too, but it just depends. So both my husband and I, I'm with the state of South Carolina. He's with the city of Columbia.

Supposedly, we're supposed to have the same retirement options, but he's getting the runaround from his HR, and they've apparently never had to transfer someone out of the city system into the state system. We both have mandatory 9% contribution, but normally you have the 401k option or the pension option with the state, but the city is telling them they're not sure how to transfer him into the state program. So I'm trying to figure out, I know you say, you know, if you have a pension that it's still, you know, you still want to contribute the 15% into your own retirement that you control. Well, that you put in. If I do this, if he gets a pension, it'd be like a quarter of his income.

Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no, that you put in. How much do you have a mandatory nine, right? We both have a mandatory nine. Okay, then you need six more and then a little more because you don't control the nine, but not an entire nine. What would you recommend? I don't, because obviously it makes no sense to go all the way up to, you know, nine plus 15 on his.

No, I wouldn't. I wouldn't do 15. I wouldn't do 15 on top of the nine on either one. So would you do more than six though on his? Not on either one, I wouldn't. But what I would say is that nine, you don't have as much control over it, and so I'm going to discount it some, but you decide how much. I mean, you can discount it three, you can discount it four,

and then that makes you're going to count five of it, and that means you need to put ten more in somewhere. Something like that. It's just because that's the weak part of your plan. It's weaker. You're going to make less on that nine than you are on the other six if you just put six on top of it to get to 15. And so I'm going to beef it up a little bit.

So instead of six, you know, you could say I'm going to put in 10, and you'd be in really, really good shape. That's probably what I would do, something like that. But that means at that point that you're actually putting in 19% instead of 15%. Whoop-dee-dup-dee. You're still going to get there. You're going to be fine. You have plenty of room in your budget.

Once you're at baby step four to do that, you're not really going to run into a problem. But it just has to do with the portion that you put in and you do not have control over is a weaker result than the other portion that you have control over. And so I'm not going to count it completely, but I'm going to count it somewhat towards your 15% baby step four. And when the HR department won't help you out, get up in their grill. There you go. Yeah, you got to be really assertive and just go, this is not okay. You need to get this answered.

I need to fix this. It's not okay. I'm not going to be a jerk, but just go, this is not okay. You need to get this answered. You need to fix this. It's not okay. I'm not going to be a jerk, but I'm also not going to go away. I'm going to be your problem, so fix your problem. That's how bureaucrats act, right? There we go. This is The Ramsey Show. I saw some recent financial statistics and there was some pretty troubling news. When families were asked

how long it would be before they faced financial hardship, if a spouse died, nearly one-third said they'd be in trouble immediately. Another 44% said they'd be financially drained within six months. People, it does not have to be this way. Term life insurance plans are just plain cheap and companies have made it even easier by not requiring exams in many cases. There really is no excuse to leave your family in this situation by not having life insurance. This is why I talk about Zander Insurance every day. They're committed to protecting families with the only products that I recommend, and their team keeps the entire process simple and affordable.

Go to Zander.com for quick online pricing or call 800-356-4282. This has to be a priority. If your family is in this situation, is my co-host today. Kendra is in Dayton, Ohio. Hi, Kendra. How are you? Hello. Thank you for taking my call.

Sure. What's up? Okay. Baby step six. We have a house that's worth around 400. We owe 250. We are at a 22 year fixed. We couldn't get it down to the 15 at this point. We have about 140,000 worth of repairs and updates and things that we need to do to sell. We're looking to sell in three to five years and downsize. So I recently got a better job, so the shovel's a little bigger,

so I'm trying to figure out do we pay down the mortgage or do the updates. What's your household income? It's around $200,000 now. Good. So if you pay down the mortgage and you don't do the updates, how are you going to sell? Exactly. Yeah, so I think you do the updates.

What in the world is wrong with this house? $140,000 on a $400,000 house? Falling in? yes and no it has um it's just some parts are dated and was when we bought it um but it just matched what we needed for our family yeah but what's wrong i mean what are you talking about doing for 140 000 any one time so it says repairs and updates. I always want to parse those apart. Yeah, it's both.

It's both because the kitchen and bathrooms need updates. And this is per realtor coming in and saying, okay, here are things I recommend in order to get, you know, the best price for the house kind of thing. And within our neighborhood. And so it's a deck where the wood is literally falling through. Somebody fell through the steps. So it's an air conditioning unit that needs replaced. It's roof, it's windows, siding. Those are more the repair side than the updates,

the kitchens and the bathrooms and flooring. Wow. You guys have let this place run down to nothing. We were doing the steps, and that was the struggle. You just now got to baby step four, five, six? Yes. Okay, cool. That's good.

Only within the last six months. All right. Number one, separate the updates and repairs. Do the repairs first. Okay. The deck that's falling is not expensive, number one. Number two, it's months. All right. Number one, separate the updates and repairs. Do the repairs first. Okay. The deck that's falling is not expensive, number one. Number two, it's dangerous. Fix that.

The heat and air is working. They quoted us out like $20,000 for that. $20,000? Yeah. What deck is this? And that was one of the cheaper bids. It's large. And so that was one of the cheaper bids.

Okay. Well, just try to figure out if there's a different way to skin this cat. That sounds a little bit, you know, that still sounds out of control. The first one was $40. Okay, they all sound out of control. One of them sounds twice as much out of control as the other one, but still. It's wood and that is out of control right now. Okay. Well, bottom line is you just need to segment these items, make a list, and prioritize them,

and begin to cash flow through them. Number one item is most dangerous. Number two is next most dangerous. Then once you get past dangerous stuff or leaking or repairs and get over into updates, maybe you do some of the updates maybe you don't maybe you just sell a house with an outdated bathroom and and that was that yeah exactly that's where we're struggling or do we refinance no you don't need to refinance it's 100 you're trying to get out of that we We're not trying to add debt. That was not one of your questions. Correct.

You make $200,000. You have three to four years to do $140,000 worth. And so if you add that by three, that's $50,000 a year. You can get it done in three years and just make your list out and just systematically begin to work down the thing. It's not all one project at one time. Correct. And when I was talking refinance, I was talking about putting money towards the principal to get it down to the 15-year fix, not borrowing against it. Yeah. Well, no need to pay to refinance to do that.

You just pay extra on the mortgage. But you're not able to do that until you get this stuff done. Whatever you choose to do to get the house market ready, whatever you choose to do, the more you study it, the more you think about it, the more you get bids on it. And by the way, you know, in the next six months, do as little of it as you can because let's give some of this craziness time to some of the crazy to bleed off of the construction world. Because the construction world is in full-on crazy mode right now. Yes. construction world because the construction world is in full-on crazy mode right now yes and so let it you know let's not get in too big a hurry uh because lumber might come back down matter of fact it probably will it's you know once they start bringing the trees out of the forest again

you know that kind of stuff it's it's a supply demand issue and so um you know uh but but uh you know the way you eat an elephant is a bite at a time, and that's how I would get at this. I also want to make sure over the next three to five years, I've made this mistake a couple times, Dave. I have a goal that's three years away or five years away. I'm going to try to get through a school program or something like that. Man, I lose three years of life because I don't like where I'm at. I'm always looking at what tomorrow's going to be. And so I want to balance that $140,000.

You're not going to get all these things done and all of a sudden the sun's going to come out. The sun's going to come out anyway. So make your plan, work towards these things, and then enjoy the house while you're in it. And sell it. And sell it. At some point, just call it a day. I'm done i'm out of here drew your life drew's in raleigh hi drew welcome to the ramsey show hey what's up

better than i deserve how can we help so i have a question i am 20 years old um i'm making about 41 000 a year right now i I have $20,000 in cash and $20,000 invested in a mutual and a Roth. And in the near future, probably about the next five years or so, a marriage, you know, that will be coming, buying a house and stuff like that.

So I had a question on is, or if you would recommend being gazelle intense for a few years to build well um i don't have any debt so i was curious if you get intense for a couple years in the beginning to build the wealth if that would be worth it or if you would suggest you just stick with the 15 that you recommend well you don't have a house payment today and so the 15 is not what we would recommend we'd recommend that you max out whatever retirement you can while you're meeting some of your other savings goals see the yes i would be intense to use your you know i'm not sure it's gazelle intense gazelle intense is you have absolutely no life until you get yourself out

of debt. And I don't think I'm going to prescribe that for you. But I think you would be very intentional versus intense and say, okay, I'm going to have this segment of my money that I enjoy. And all the rest of it I'm going to use to pile up and build wealth during this short period of time. I'm going to be really intentional, and I may have a little smaller enjoyment budget than some of my buddies who blow their entire freaking paycheck because I'm grown up beyond my years. I've already matured beyond my 20 years here, which you have, just by asking this question. You're a pretty impressive young man.

And so, yeah, I think that's intentional. But when we're talking about gazelle intensity, we're talking about you have intensity we're talking about you have no life at all yeah until you get your dadgum debt paid off and that's that's the best way to get out of debt that's not necessary for you to have a really sweet situation five years from today and i think you got to look at what are you not doing meaning if you have a traditional eight to five job and you go home and you're going to spend from 5 o'clock until 9 o'clock playing video games in your 21, get another job. Start work and grind.

If you've got friend opportunities to hang out with your buddies and create community, of course do that stuff. But I'm a huge fan of people in their 20s really busting it and getting after it. But like Dave said, man, you've got to breathe, too. You've got to breathe. Yeah, intentionality just means that, you know, we're not going to go from Friday night to Sunday night and spend everything we made in the previous five days, which is what most people do, particularly at 20 years old.

Then they spend the next three weeks trying to pay it back. Yeah, and trying to figure out how we're going to eat because now we don't have any money to eat next week. And so that happens all the time. Yeah, and trying to figure out how we're going to eat because now we don't have any money to eat next week. And so that happens all the time. So, you know, we're just moving way to the other side of that coin. But this idea that you sit at home and do absolutely nothing and you cheap out on every single thing and you don't buy a bed and sleep on the floor or something. You know, no, we're not saying do that.

Go on a date. Yeah, and have some money set aside for enjoyment. We'll be right back. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today in the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage. Tim and Sarah and Gunnar are with us. Hey, guys, how are you? Great. How are you? Welcome. Where do you guys live?

Atlanta, Indiana. Okay. Very cool. Which is near? We're just north of Indy, about 30 minutes. Okay. We'll call it Indy. Okay.

Indianapolis area, and you're here to do a debt-free scream. How much did you pay off? $105,000. All right. How long did this take?? $105,000. All right. How long did this take? 28 months. Oh, ding, ding. And your range of income during that time? We went from about $150,000 to right around $210,000. Wow. Nice jump in 28 months. What kind of debt was the $105,000? We were pretty normal, Dave. Lawnmower, motorcycle, student loans, truck. You financed a lawnmower, huh?

Yeah, 0% interest, right? Pay for it later. That's great. So, what got you on this journey 28 months ago? We blew it out for Christmas in 2018 and almost went bankrupt, spending all of our money there. And the day after Christmas, our furnace went out, and we didn't have the money to pay for it.

And looking at our income, we make way too much money to not be able to afford an emergency like this. So I had to go to the bank and get a credit card to pay for a furnace. And I said, never again. Something's got to change. Yes, absolutely. It's this level of stress, this level of uncertainty is not okay. So what did you do?

What was your journey like from there? I'll say the first thing we did, my sister got us, was the Financial Peace University for Christmas. So that really kicked us off. It was perfect timing, I think. Oh, okay. So the same Christmas that the furnace went out, Financial Peace University is under the tree. A little cold in there, but the FPU is under the tree.

Do we read it or use it for firewood? That's right. So who had the conversation with who? Well, I've been listening to Dave since 2006, and I wanted to go on this journey 10 years ago, but we didn't see eye to eye on it, and life kind of took hold of us, and we got back on track shortly thereafter because of the furnace. Okay, so you got the box out from under the tree, and both of you went to class? We did, together.

All right, and was it hard to go to class, or when you went, were you just so ready that whatever it said, dude, we're going to do it? No, we were going to make it work. Yeah, we were ready. Both of you? Absolutely. At the same time this time? Absolutely. At the same time this time. Yes.

At the same time. I think that goal setting, too, in the book, when you sit down and talk together about what your future will be, that's really significant for me. And I think that a lot of people don't realize that you have to have a goal to work towards. And so doing that together was helpful. Yeah, dreaming about the future and making it very, very, very clear of what that's going to be. Just a crystal clear picture of it. Yeah. This is what life's going to look like, and we're going to pay a price to get there, but

it's worth it. We're going to get there. Absolutely. Very cool. 28 months later, $105,000 later, you're done. That's right. That's pretty cool. That's very exciting.

That's pretty cool. What do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is? Well, for me, it was Ramsey Solutions, the Ramsey Plus app, and Every Dollar Budget. Being able to actually see how that app tracked every single dollar, almost every penny that we spent, was eye-opening. I think we both had some aha moments when we realized how much we were spending on fast food alone. So that was it for me. moments when we realized how much we were spending on fast food alone. So that was it for me. Well, paying for food with cash is huge because you get to keep that money in your wallet instead of swiping it away with the debit card. It doesn't seem like it's there anymore.

You don't realize it's going away when it's a debit card. You don't feel it. Right. Or a credit card. You feel it with cash. Yeah, but with cash, it's like, ouch, we just bought something. So you've got this extraordinary, handsome young man with you here. 2018, you blow out Christmas.

2019, 2020, I'm assuming Christmas looked a little different in the Gunner home. And yet I see him still smiling and breathing. Tell us about that transition. I don't think he realized really. I don't think he felt it as probably as we did, but we're also doing Financial Peace Junior with him now. So he's at an age where he can comprehend all the things that we're listening to and doing together,

and we've been practicing debt-free screams for a long time together. Contentment was huge for us. It really didn't seem terribly sacrificial for us to to start this journey we spent a lot of time at our dinner table instead of going through the fast food and we spent uh time doing things that don't take a lot of money like going fishing and and that doesn't cost a lot to go to go fishing and it's really really meaningful so yeah contentment's huge yeah it's uh it's a i think it's a secret weapon it might be the most powerful of all financial principles

is to be able to be content uh you can avoid debt you can save you can be generous you can do all kinds of things when you're content yeah but discontent man it costs like a lot of money because you spend a lot of money trying to find contentment, and it's expensive. So have you guys had that one month where there's no payments, but the check still deposits? Oh, yeah, we've had a few now. That's awesome. Look at you smiling, man. Tell us about it.

Well, when you get at the end of the month and you're doing your budget, you're like, oh, man, we've got this much left over. I'm just going to go ahead and slip this into this account or add that 15% to our retirement or add it to his college fund or maybe go eat out at a restaurant or take a trip to Nashville. It's really... Do you know what? You can see your face, man.

You just lit up just thinking about it. That's incredible, man. Good for you guys. That's awesome. Well done. Very well done, you guys. Outside of the two of you, who was cheering you on? My sister is our biggest cheerleader.

She's the one who sent the FPU kit. Yes, actually, she's listening live right now. That's cool. Hey, Laura. Well, thanks, Laura. We appreciate the business. We appreciate you taking care of your sister. That's awesome.

Very, very cool. Good. And then, Tim, you and I met at Entree Summit, so you've taken this stuff to your business too, huh? Well, it was kind of ironic. It explains part of the jump in pay. I took a new job, and my boss is a big Ramsey person, and we didn't know that, but I was a Ramsey person, and she was a Ramsey person, and she took me to Entree back in May, and then we're going again next year in Florida, and really looking forward to it. But I try to really live and embody these principles every day in my personal life,

and at work, too. That's awesome, man. Yeah, that's a great jump in pay. Well done. Good, guys. Excellent. Proud of you. Well done.

Now you're free. How's it feel? It feels amazing. Great. Weight lifted off all of our shoulders, and we can breathe for a little little bit and then jump right back into four, five, and six. Now it's intentional, not intense. Right. So you're going to get there before you know it.

So very, very well done. We've got a copy of the Legacy Journey for you. That's the next chapter in your story to go on and be Baby Steps Millionaires. That's the next thing in your story to go on and be Baby Steps Millionaires. That's the next thing coming up for you. And, of course, on top of that, we've got a copy of the total money makeover for you to give away. Put it under somebody's tree right before the furnace goes out. That's right. For sure. Yep.

That's how this stuff works. Got to pay it forward now. All right. Tim and Sarah and Gunnar, $105,000 paid off in 28 months, making $150,000 to $210,000. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free!

Woo! That is awesome. That's so cool, man. I know that childhood trauma sticks with you through your whole life, but also standing on a stage in front of lights with your mom and dad, who for 28 months have been sacrificing, and you got to come do this weird thing, a debt-free scream. There used to be this guy back when I was a kid back in Tennessee that did these debt-free screams. And that was before Daddy made his first million. That's right.

And you're sitting there telling your kids that, and you got $20 million. Yep. And that's Gunnar. Yeah. And that's those moments when you can tell your kids, yeah, Dad used to be grumpy. And then all of a sudden, he smiled all the time. And we started going fishing, and he tried to cook. That wasn't great, but Mom helped.

And then it's those moments like everything changed, right? Yeah. That's called changing your family tree. That's incredible, man. And you know what? The interesting thing is that if you're listening to us right now, you can do it. You can do it. You. Yeah, I'm talking to you. I know you're driving on the interstate, you can do it. You can do it. You.

Yeah, I'm talking to you. I know you're driving on the interstate and you think I'm not talking to you. I'm talking to you right now. You can do this. I'll shut up. Stop your whining. You can do it. This is the Ramsey Show. Thank you. Homeowner's insurance can be one of those set it and forget it kind of things.

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They'll shop among a bazillion different companies, get you the best possible deal. Text HOME to 33789 and talk with a trusted insurance professional about the right coverage for you. Text HOME to 33789. Sarah's in Columbus, Ohio. Hi, Sarah. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Thanks for taking my call.

Sure. What's up? So a year ago, my mom passed away, and my dad asked me for help. She left a huge financial disaster, which shocked everybody. And so I've been helping him over the last year, and we've paid off $36,000 in consumer debt, car loan, and credit cards. Good. And then he has a house payment. He owes $21,800 on the house.

And he has about $60,000 in a 401k. And his budget monthly is really tight. I have $94 at the end of the month left over. And I was thinking about pulling money out of the 401k to pay the house off to free up more money monthly because there's, you know, there's a $400 dental bill. How old is she? 83. Yes. Okay.

That's what I wanted to hear. Let me kind of walk through how I got there so that you can decide if you agree with the advice I gave you, okay? But the reason yes is this. $60,000 is not enough to fix his problems. Any more than $40,000 is. Right. His nest egg is not big enough. You've got other issues, you know, because it's not 600,000 or it's not 300,000. You follow me?

Yep. The difference of the impact that 40 will make on his life being in the 401K versus 60 will make on his life, the difference is not measurable. It's so small. Okay. You see what I'm saying in other words if you told me you had 40 or you had 60 it wouldn't matter it still just doesn't have enough it's just short right and you've done everything else you've scratched and clawed and gotten this

other mess cleaned up good for you you're really doing a great job helping him thank you for doing that um so but but uh uh you know and you're not really pulling money out of this 401k to live on either, are you? He's not. Right, no. And so not pulling money out of 60 or not pulling money out of 40 versus not having a house payment at 82, yeah, get rid of the house payment. That's how I did that. Okay, great.

Thank you. Thank you for calling. Ouch. Yeah, that hurts, man. So, you know, if you're 20-something and you're listening to the show right now, that 82-year-old guy is supposed to inspire you to get your crap together so you don't end up there. Because $100 a month invested from age 25 to age 65 is $1,176,000. $1 million you will have if you invest $100 between now and 65.

20 years later, you'll be that guy. And that should also inspire every young couple out there to talk to one another so that when one of you passes away which they will there's not a surprise yeah one of you handles all the money and that one dies the other one is not only broke but they're clueless right and scared and terrified and thank goodness sarah was there right to step in and help but both of you working the plan together working your money together knowing what's going on i mean in our situation it's gotten so freaking out of control and complicated we have this huge family meeting that includes the leaders of the company here once a year if dave dies this year here's how it's going to go down and we go through tickets this and this and this and this it it's

rather entertaining unless you're me so That's what I'm saying. There's some people. It's my Monty Python meeting. I'm feeling much better. It's just a flesh wound. But, yeah, I'm not going. But, yeah, I mean, we plan it out because I don't want that to happen because this is complicated for my kids to be overwhelmed

or their mom to be overwhelmed and so forth. And it's a lot of moving parts. And so it's really everybody needs to know. That's a really good point, John. All right, Abhi is with us, and let's see here. Abhi is in San Francisco. Hi, Abhi. Hi, Dave.

Hi, Dr. Dallin. How's it going? Great. How can we help? Yeah, so I just wrote down one question that I had, and I would love to get your opinion on it, and I would like you to answer it as though I was your son and you wanted me to, and you were coaching me like that.

That's how I answer them. All right. Awesome. But before I started, I just wanted to mention, Dr. D, I love your show. I love the Rocket Diaries stickers and horse glasses. So keep it going. That's all I'm going to say. All right.

Thank you. So I'm on baby step number three, and my safety net is $50,000, and I will get there by the end of the year. My partner and I are moving towards fiancé status. So if we get married, our combined income will be $210,000 per year pre-tax. She's having a hard time understanding why credit cards are bad and why I would like not to have credit cards in my future family. She wants to keep her credit card around and be off chance that we go through our emergency fund for any reason, and her parents get sick, and she really wants to go live with them. So if I was your son, how would you address this problem with my fiancé, girlfriend, if she's unwilling to draw a line with our family?

And kind of basically told me, I'll do whatever I need to do in order to take care of my extended family, even if it means putting my future family in debt, stuff like that. And I just wanted to ask if Dr. Deloney could speak about... What is her cultural heritage? We're both Indian, so it's like we always take care of our family and all that stuff, and I'm fine with that, but I'm just trying to understand, like, if Dr. Deloney had this issue, how would he deal with it? How are you convinced in life to go against the norm as well?

Let's talk about the money part first. Well, the thing is this. Where someone says, if it bankrupts my current family because of cultural norms, I'm willing to do that to take care of my extended family i i i don't necessarily believe that flex um that sounds like somebody trying to let you know before we get married that my family is everything to me and um if someone's truly saying that then that's somebody that i'm going to be apprehensive about tying myself to because they're telling me up front. You're not as important as they are.

You are the least important person in my life. Right. Of those I love, you're at the bottom. Right. And if our kids come along, they're going to be at the bottom too. That also sounds like a grandiose statement that somebody who's not yet engaged, not yet married makes. I'm going to do this and this and this. Well, congratulations.

You know you're not. You've never held your baby, right? But I think it comes back. There's a level of fear that she sounds like she has. Yeah, she addressed that with me as well. She said, you're asking me to do all these things, but we're not married, so I'm fearful that if you break up, then I'll be stuck in a situation where I'm not totally aware of how to handle it so i'm fine with that but i'm just

thinking like if we do get married yeah in order for you to get married you need to be in agreement that's exactly right whatever whatever the agreement is you need to be in agreement because i'm not you know thinking you're going to change someone after marriage either one of you is a bad bad bad plan that's right but now here's the thing from a reality standpoint a mathematics standpoint if you make 210 000 a year and you have 70 000 in your emergency fund and you still need a credit card as a backup for a potential emergency that is not a mathematical fact. That's a psychosis. Right. That's mythology. That's a ridiculous fear that is not based in reality. Right. And so that's silly.

Yes. Is what that comes down to. So that's screaming that I've got other kinds of insecurities going on that we need to understand. And sometimes that is, someone, a child is told their whole life, you will have a credit card for emergencies will have a credit card for emergencies. You have a credit card for emergencies. And you will take care of me. And it's just a matter of looking down at the math.

No matter what happens, you will take care of me. That's right. They're told that, too. Absolutely they are. So I think you've got to get on the same page, man, and start way at the beginning addressing the fears that she's bringing into this relationship. Yeah. And you can't really expect her to do things. Yeah. Yeah. That's really expect her to do things. Yeah.

That's exactly what we would do. Hope that helps. Feels a little vague, but I hope it helps. Sorry, man. This is James Child, producer of The Ramsey Show. Did you know The Ramsey Show is one of the most popular podcasts in the world? Subscribe or follow today wherever you listen to podcasts.