The Ramsey Show - App - My Fiancée Owes Me Money...How Do I Handle That? (Hour 3)

Episode Date: March 4, 2021

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Coming to you live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions and broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studio, this is The Ramsey Show. It's where America hangs out to have a conversation about life. I'm Ken Coleman, and I'm joined by my colleague, Dr. John Deloney. We are Ramsey personalities. We both host shows as a part of the Ramsey Network. He hosts The Dr. John Deloney Show.

We'll talk with you one caller at a time about your relationships, your mental and emotional health, parenting's involved in that, all kinds of stuff, toxicity at work. Hello, you'll deal with some of that. I mean, it's just all over the board. And I, on the Ken Coleman Show, will talk with you about figuring out what you were created to do in your work, increasing your income, moving up the ladder for more impact.

That's what we talk about. And we also talk about money as a result of those conversations. And, of course, our role here on the Ramsey Show. So, what is your question? How can we help you? 888-825-5225 is the number. 888-825-5225.

Let's go to Atlanta, Georgia, where David joins us. David, how can we help? Yes, I was calling. I need to get some term insurance, and I was trying to figure out how much to get. Okay, tell us your situation. How old are you? Tell us about your family situation. I'm 53 and married. I have two kids that are in college. Okay, so what's their plan? Are they almost out of college? How young are they? What are they planning to do? I've got one that's a junior in college

and one that's a freshman in college. Okay. So she'll be graduating like after next year. Okay, and what is your income and your wife's income if she is working outside the home? My income is around $160,000, and hers is about $66,000. Okay.

So call it $220,000-ish. Is that safe? Right. Right. Yeah. My take on that is, you know, if – and let me ask you this, too, before I say this. What is your investment situation? Do you have any debt?

Let's fill out the rest of the financial picture. I have no debt. I do have a mortgage on the house for $314,000, but the house is probably worth like $650,000. Oh, wow. Fantastic. In retirement, I've got probably not, I'm sorry, not $900,000, $560,000. Okay. So at this point, you are not, because of your investment situation, you're not self-insured. And so what I would recommend, and Dave would recommend, too, is 10 times your income. So you could do that just on you if you wanted to or your wife, but because term insurance with Zander Insurance is so affordable, to me, I would do the $2 million, $2.5 million if you want to do that. I'd run rates on it on just 10 times your salary as well.

And I also think because of your financial situation, I'd look at what it would take to pay off a house plus take care of your wife and the two girls. And again, you're not having to take care of the girls. One of them obviously is a a junior one a freshman but what would you want you know your life insurance policy to do if you went much earlier than expected and i think that helps you frame up that 10x number but i think for you uh anywhere between one and a half to two and a half i think is the right amount two and a half million uh one and a half to two and5 million. And you could also look at potentially a separate policy if you wanted to. Just run the numbers with one of our – with Wiesander Insurance,

and you're paying off the house as well. Okay, and would you suggest a 15-year or the 20-year? I'm 53, so I didn't know if I needed to do the 20 or the 15. I think 15 because that gets you to 68. But no, no, no, do 20 because you're healthy right now. Are you healthy? Pretty healthy guy? Yeah, I'm pretty healthy.

Yeah. So here's what's great. Every guy I know would answer, I'm pretty healthy. So I don't know if Dave would ever get this detail, but you and I will, so let's do this. So I did this two years ago, David. Okay. I re-upped, okay, because I was in way better shape than I had been before. And I actually, for the week of the test, I went like super clean.

Yeah. Dropped an additional four pounds, and the cholesterol in the blood was top rate. I got the best rate possible. So, David, if you're 5 to 10 pounds from being, you know, some real savings, I'd do the 20 years. Yeah, man. Some real savings. Yeah.

Awesome. Do 20 because that gets you to 73. That's enough. Yeah, the longer you go, the longer you wait to buy this policy, the more expensive it's going to get. Yeah, so do it now. All right. What do you think?

You knocking out the cheeseburgers for the next 10, 15 days before they get out there to the house? Well, I think the catch is they kind of get you on that because they say, have you lost weight within the last certain amount of time? So there's kind of a catch there, but I'll try to lay off the cheeseburgers. No, trust me. You need the good, whatever the good cholesterol is, and you've got to get rid of the bad cholesterol. I'm telling you, David, you can do this, man.

And then here's the other thing. This is all rounding out in time for the summer bathing suit season. So we are saving money. We're looking better in our swimsuit. The wife is excited. There's a trifecta of goodness here, David. David, you made one phone call, and we made every part of your life better. Yeah.

We gave way more than you expected, which is what we do here on the Ramsey Show. We'll give you full holistic advice. We'll give you the whole nine yards. Call Xander. They're who do. Xander Insurance. That's who I trust with my family. Who I'm with as well.

Right. That's who I trust. That's who Dave recommends. But more importantly. They're great. That's who I use to take care of my family in the event that i pass away they're great and on this show i've said it multiple times i'm going to keep saying it again one of if i look back and i think through the crisis stuff i've been involved with those usually two in the morning three in the morning

there's very few people the neighborhoods are asleep and i roll into a house with my you know with one or two partners. There's police officers there. There's EMS there. There is few things on earth more harrowing than sitting with somebody who's just lost a spouse, and they look you in the eyes, and they say, I don't know what to do next. Because they're going to have to go to work on Monday because they don't have any life insurance. They don't know if there's a will. They don't know what comes next. Yeah. Because they're going to have to go to work on Monday because they don't have any life insurance.

They don't know if there's a will. They don't know what comes next. They just know that we don't have enough money and savings to cover the electric bill next month. That's right. And so don't do that. Get life insurance. Yes.

It's worth it. Get a will. Take care of your family. Something happens to me. The house is paid off. And Stacy and the kids are set. I'm in that weird moment where you're more valuable dead than you are alive. By a margin.

Yeah, I know. That's how that works. By a margin, man. Yeah, the Zander folks took care of us. You know what we need is we need, like for these people, these large insurance policies, we need some sort of, we need to invent the old, remember the old days in the, Kelly Daniels, a history buff like me, you had the tasters for people who would taste. Back in the day, you took out a king with a glass of wine.

Oh, yeah. Do you know what I mean? That was the real deal. Yeah. And so we need that. You and I need some sort of instrument to check the toxicity of our beverages. I just hope my wife loves me is all. She does.

She does. She does. Hey, it's tax time, John. I'm done. I did them. You're done? I did them. Did you use smart tax? I used smart tax at my kitchen table. It was awesome. Alright, well listen, your taxes don't have to be that

complicated. Text the word tax to 33789 to learn more on our smart tax program. Text the word tax to 33789 and use Ramsey Smart Tax. It's a game changer. It's what I used, and it was awesome.

It works. Hey, don't move. More of the Ramsey Show coming right up. As we continue to face challenging times, I hear that a lot of you have been calling Zander Insurance to see if term life insurance plans are still available. The good news is the insurance companies are starting to loosen up the restrictions that they had put in place at the start of the pandemic, making coverage available to even more people.

So if you haven't dealt with this yet, I'm not sure what you're waiting for. Regardless of what's going on in the world, we're going to get through it. But the responsibility of protecting your family has not changed let this crazy season motivate you to get your priorities in order and check the big things like life insurance off your list rates are still low zander makes the process simple and most of you have the time right now to deal with this call 800-356-4282 or visit Zander.com. Zander's team will get you the affordable coverage to give your family the peace of mind they deserve. Welcome back, America. You're listening to The Ramsey Show.

I'm Ken Coleman, joined by my colleague, Dr. John Deloney. The phone number to jump in on the conversation is 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Let's go to Dayton, Ohio, where Rhonda joins us. Rhonda, how can we help? Hi, guys. Really nice to meet you both. Good to talk to you. I am looking for some advice on what to do

as far as relationship goes with money. We've been married for 36 years and we don't do well together in any way shape or form we have gone to several different extremes where we just each did our own thing and then i tried to step back and said okay you handle it all and that got kind of scary and

he didn't talk to me doesn He didn't tell me anything. And I looked up and went to a bankruptcy because he wasn't paying the house payment. And I didn't know. Now the tables have turned, and I make significantly more money than he's making. And we're still not talking. And we have been to counseling. I don't know what to do anymore, and we're getting too old to continue this, honestly, because I'm going to retire one day, and I'm going to be debt-free,

but how can I be debt-free if we're not debt-free? Now, when you say you're not talking, you mean not talking at all or not talking about money? I'm not talking about money. Okay. Do you talk about everything else? Mostly. Mostly, yeah, we do, actually. How would you describe your relationship?

Let's take money off the table. How would you describe your relationship on a scale of 1 to 10, 1 being nonexistent and 10, you're in puppy love? No, we don't have any puppies right now, but I'd say we're probably a seven. A seven? A seven. Because what I hear in your voice is exhaustion,

borderline resentment, and you, if I had to guess, tell me I'm wrong, okay? If I had to guess, you're experiencing what millions of women have experienced over the last 15 25 years which is once they begin to gain that economic independence they don't got to put up with this crap anymore and at the same so it's not that well the reason i'm not there is because i love my husband i and I'm not trying to get anywhere. But you are right.

I am pushing back. You're absolutely right, and I know that. Does he have separate bank accounts? Did I understand that? Am I picking that up? Oh, well, yeah, there's another nightmare. We finally put our accounts together, and we were supposed to be talking about it and doing things right and we ended up filing bankruptcy and and then he took his money out of the account

and so for the last several years we we actually finished a bankruptcy i know like some of the only people in the planet that actually finished one and we did but um he he turned around and took took his money out during the bankruptcy and said i'm going to pay the bankruptcy payment and then we'll use yours for this but i don't want the bankruptcy payment to get messed up and so he took his money out and now the banks have been over for four or five years and the money's still all together but the only money in there is mine yeah so and i looked up and he took the money out. I'm like, what are you doing? So I go back to him.

I said, dear, what is this bill? Oh, well, that was this. Well, oh, that was this. It's like, okay, what's going on with your money? Where's your money? Well, you know I don't make that much anymore, so it's... I'm tired. Yeah.

I'm tired. And I'm trying not to be. Well, you can't... I really am. Don't try not to be tired because that's going to, it's just going to result in you taking those feelings. And that's, that's, that is what resentment is, right? When you just smash and crush and hide those feelings, they just smolder and burn from the inside out, right?

And that you can't come back from resentment. It's so hard to return from that. It sounds like you're married to somebody who um has all kinds of struggles is that fair is he struggling with all kinds of things over the course of your 36 years yeah that's fair and i i really am in my heart i've talked to i can't count the number of people i've talked to over the years. This is rare. You're talking, your marriage is a seven.

I'm assuming your intimate life is awesome. You laugh together. You play. You share meals. You share chores. And this much heat comes from the money part. That's so, so rare. Well, I love my husband.

Does he love you? He knows it. Absolutely. But not enough to be honest and open and a person of integrity and character when it comes to money. Not knowing that his wife is so exhausted that she's falling apart underneath this burden. Right? Because if you tell me somebody loves me then they don't the person that's walking alongside life with him doesn't feel like this does he know that you are this exhausted

yeah and what's his response uh we'll talk about it later nope Nope. Then I'm going to disagree with, I'm going to disagree, well, I'm going to tell you this. If you walked in and I was coaching you two in my living room, I would tell you your marriage is at a two, not a seven. Yeah, it's not even close to a seven. And I'm going to tell you something else. I don't think this is a, does he? I'm going to lose him, huh? No. I think you love him.

I think you love a fantasy. I think you love a fantasy. I think you love a myth. But here's the thing, John. I'm going to say this. I love saying things, and then let you clinically explain what I'm saying. It's like I'm going to drop a fact, you give her the formula. This is not about how much he loves you. Nope.

He's broken. I think he does love you, but this isn't about he needs to love her better. I think this guy is really, really broken, and he's trying to just keep his head above water. He's trying to fill a hole, or maybe several holes, and his money behavior

and everything else, John, is a derivative of that. That's what I think. I don't like to characterize people as broken. I'm sorry. No, no. He's he's can i say that absolutely okay um and he's hurting big time yeah um this is somebody who's been struggling with who am i my role power suddenly his wife over time starts making more money starts getting more more of a voice. And at some point, and again, this isn't just this family. This is a pandemic of men struggling over the last 25, 35, 45 years

of being told, y'all are the cause of these problems. Not understanding what my role is. Not understanding what hard work looks like. Plus feeling my feelings. Plus being able to sit down. I don't have the tools in my toolkit to have hard conversations.

I'm going to do it tomorrow. I'm going to do it tomorrow. I'm just going to do it tomorrow. And the women in our lives, the kids in their lives are the casualties here. And the chief casualty is just the men, right? So here's the thing.

You got to come to the table with your husband. At the end of the day, you're going to have to make peace with a guy that you're married to. You say you love him. You say it is what it is. You're going to have to go one more shot and you're going to have to say, this has to be different.

And then you're going to have to have what they call in the clinical world. They call your, or what moment are you going to leave? Cause if you're not, then you got to make peace with it and then get on about your life. If you are going to leave, you've got to have that hard conversation, preferably with a professional in the room because you don't want to be making threats and threatening to walk away. But you're at a place now where you've got to make the decision.

If the person in your life won't change, you can only control you. And you're going to have to either say, this is a guy I married. This is what it is, what it is. We're going to ride this out. Or you're going to have to make some other life decisions. Right? But that sounds like where you're at. This is 36 years.

It's almost four decades. Right? Yeah. Oh, man. This is really tough. Yep. And I want to encourage every single husband listening to this. Yeah.

Check in with your wives. Check in with the people you are married to tonight. And here's the deal. Get healthy. I do believe this man loves her, but this isn't you and I grabbing him by the collar and going, love your wife better. No.

This is he's got some hurt and some pain and he's trying to salve it and she's in a really tough situation. But do not quit. I want to hug this guy. I want to hug this guy. I do too. Do not quit. Rh want to hug this guy. I want to hug this guy hard. I do too. Do not quit.

Rhonda, don't quit. Please, don't quit. We're not going to quit on you. We got more of the Ramsey Show coming right up. Thank you. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by my colleague, Dr. John Deloney. You need to find out for yourself why Blinds.com is the number one online retailer of custom window coverings. You get free samples, free shipping, and with the new promos they run every month, you'll save even more.

Use the promo code Ramsey to get the best deal. Rules and restrictions apply. Today's question comes from Jenny in Florida. She says, I work for a large retail company who was able to stay afloat during the pandemic because we were considered an essential business. I was very fortunate to keep my job, which I love. However, our company just announced to us that there would be no merit increases this year, not even a cost of living raise. But we are going to receive our bonuses.

For me, it's probably about $2,000. I really love my job. But is this a red flag to start looking elsewhere? What? No. What are you doing? Jenny, let me reread your question back to you. You start by saying, I love my job.

But our company said no merit increases this year which by the way uh the standard increase about three percent yeah yeah in american businesses let's go back let's go back before that my large company survived the pandemic yeah hey hello we survived many did not no and their jobs did not so we survived yeah and i love it continue And while they're not going to give a merit increase or a cost of living raise, they are going to give out bonuses. Ken, you and I don't agree on a lot. And for both of us to be like, what are you saying? Dude. Yeah, Jenny, I appreciate the question.

No, that's not a red flag. You ought to be running in the neighborhood, around the backyard, in the living room, singing in the shower. I'm so grateful that I get a bonus this year while many people are unemployed. So, no, this is not a red flag. I get a bonus doing a job I love. Not only is this not a red flag, John, this actually speaks to the viability of this company. Yes.

That they were able to give out bonuses. They managed their books well enough during the pandemic to. That they were able to give out bonuses. They managed their books well enough during the pandemic to actually be in a position to give out bonuses. And it wouldn't surprise me. I've got zero data. I'm way into your territory here. We're going to see this more and more moving forward because if a pandemic can come out of nowhere

and wipe us out, right, and our most expensive thing is ongoing, ever-increasing payroll, it makes sense to me that we're going to hand you a big pile of cash at the end of every year based on how this goes, but we're not going to strap ourselves

with this ever-increasing payroll, because then we have to continue to increase our costs, etc., etc. Man, if you love your job, and you're working for a company that can navigate this and still write your bonus checks. Yeah. Somersault time. Yeah.

Now, we don't have time for co-host counseling live on the air. Right. But you just told America that we don't agree on much. That's not true. That's not true. I want to talk to you about that. Why did you say that? We agree on a lot.

We agree on a lot of things. Do we? I'm just kidding. I think we do a lot you said it not me politics and economics we love to bicker back and forth right yeah we have different views but it's not like we're you know oh i didn't yeah i didn't mean that as a careful what you say people think that we're fighting during the commercial no no no i'm just having fun with you all All right. 888-825-5225. 888-825. Did you like my co-host counseling?

I thought that was kind of a funny line. You just went right over it. We could skip the... I didn't get what you were saying. I didn't know where you were headed with it. No, I like that. We could counsel each other right here on the air. We should do that.

You want to talk about some political topics right now? No. No. By the way, before we get to the folks you want some advice don't talk politics with anybody no especially maybe not even your wife or your kids i just think it's gotten to the point where it's like it's ludicrous what what is the point like the dog i think that one of my doodles would argue with me at this point if i just said something in the house look at me like you're wrong. You're wrong. So much vitriol, too.

There used to be a day where you could sit around, you know, a martini or a beer with some people and just talk about all different points of view and everybody like, huh, that's interesting. Cool. Yeah. Not anymore, man. No, I'm going to dump your grill over and me and my kids were taking our ball and we're going home.

Yeah. So dumb. Catch a wine glass in the temple. So dumb. Don't talk about it at all. Not good. Anyway, 888-825-5225. That's some good life advice there.

888-825-5225. James is joining us in Denver, Colorado. James, how can we help? Hey, how are you guys doing today? Well, we're having a blast. How can we help? So I'll try to keep it short, but I've got a couple of attributes to this question. So about a year ago, I gave a personal loan to my girlfriend of about $3,000.

Of that, she has paid back $1,500, So she still has $1,500 left on the agreement. Since that time, three things have happened. Number one, because of the pandemic, she had to take a different job making about half the amount of money she was making. Number two, we both started Financial Peace, and we were both on Baby Step 2. And number three, we recently got engaged. We're getting married in about six months. Given all that's going on right now, I kind of feel like it would be best to just forgive the rest of the loan. It doesn't feel right to me to keep it. But I'm also afraid because our relationship has always been a 50-50 partnership that it's going to come off

like I'm trying to lord over her or be better than her. And i also have all this debt still to pay off so i was wondering uh should i just go ahead and and try to tell her not to pay it back and how do i approach that without seeming weird okay you sound weird you do sound weird because I would never utter the phrase, my fiance owes me money. In a billion years. That sentence can't come out of my mouth. No. I don't know how it comes out of your mouth. I don't think this is a her issue.

This is a you issue. This is a we issue. John, my goodness. I don't even know where to start. Yeah, there's a lot here so if you are not able to have a conversation that says hey i did something stupid we didn't know we didn't know about um the we didn't have the wisdom about loaning money to people that were in romantic relationships with or friendships or family right give it away or say no dude. Dude, we're done with this debt

repayment situation. If that becomes a lording over, a power struggle, man, you guys got to get to a premarital counselor tomorrow, right? You are not in a position to be getting married because, dude, the conversations y'all will be having about kids and work and where we're going to live and family and I'm sick, I need some support, they get harder and harder and harder. This is a simple one. Absolutely. When is the wedding day? About six months.

Six months from now? Yes. Six months from now, you walk down the aisle. She doesn't owe you any more money. I guess if she breaks up with you today or you break up with her, then we can talk about that. But if you're getting married, it becomes our money. It's our thing. I mean, I married Stacey.

She had a master's in broadcast journalism. I married her student loans. Yeah, yeah. It wasn't like, oh, I'm paying. Every time I wrote a check, I didn't go, well, I'm paying your master's degree off. That's right. No, you're in it together. So, James, you'm paying. Every time I wrote a check, I didn't go, well, I'm paying your master's degree off. That's right. No, you're in it together. So, James, you said you're both 50-50.

Is that a hard? Who is this more challenging for? I feel like it would be more challenging for her. Because that has always been a great sense of pride for her. That she is, you know, her own person, she's making a way in the world. I feel like it's something that comes from the way she was raised, her family dynamics, certainly something that I personally would push back against, and I agree with everything that you're saying.

Oh, well, then I think you just have to have a straight up conversation here to say, hey, you are who you are. You're an independent woman. You're all these wonderful things. I loaned you some money. Big deal. It's going to be our money. Don't even think of it that way. You're going to help pay this whole thing off anyway. Yeah, and this whole 50-50 talk, brother, it's.50-.50 and you're about to become one. You're about to become one. You're going to have to get with somebody and work on that before you all attach yourselves to each other forever, man. And don't be very careful about psychoanalyzing your fiancé.

You'll need to get with a premarital counselor today. Yes, absolutely true. All right. We're not done yet, folks. Don't move. More of your calls coming up next. This is the Ramsey Show. Welcome back to the ramsey show i'm ken coleman in studio with my colleague dr john deloney who is uh deciding now to join us everything okay over there words with friends on the phone

before we come back from commercial break got to tap you on the shoulder and say hey you know no games for me he's trying to solve some things I want to point out that we did not have a plate of barbecue. We threw that out there. We thought maybe it would magically appear earlier in the show. Did not happen. Got to have a plan, evidently. Bobby, the engineer, is falling down on the job back there in the control room. The guy is a world-class cook.

Can absolutely grill, smoke. I mean, he needs his own restaurant. He does. He is his own mean, he needs his own restaurant. He does. He is his own restaurant. He is his own restaurant. Bobby, I was just saying, you were doing engineer stuff earlier. It would be great during the show, next time Deloney and I co-host, to have a big giant platter of all things Bobby barbecue.

Some sausage, some brisket, some chicken, some pork, some beef, and all the sides. Or as we say in the South, fixins. That's F-I-X-I-N-S for people who aren't from the South. That's an actual word. All the fixins. Do you say that in Texas? No. What do you say?

Beans and cornbread. Ted's selling. No, fixins. Fixins includes anything. Anything that's on the table that's not an entree is a fixin'. And there's 0% chance Bobby's going to share. Not true. That's wrong.

Hey, you know what? He talks to you that way, bring it in here. We'll put it on this side. And I'll just do the Heisman, and I'll just eat while he's answering relationship calls, and I'll wipe the mouth, and we'll get into the other stuff. All right. We're having fun here. Bobby really is a world-class cook

and I really would like to have some barbecue during the show. And we'll just do it when Dave's not here. He doesn't care. 888-825-5225 I'm really getting hungry. I really am. You started a whole thing inside my heart and mind here, man. Exactly. 888-825-5225

Back to the phones we go. Savannah, uh is where we're gonna go oh you know what i'll get to this in a second let's go to uh kevin uh in savannah georgia kevin how can we help hi guys i appreciate you taking the call you bet um yeah yeah so to give you some context me and my wife got married about six months ago uh we've been doing super good we paid off um over $23,000 in college debt. Way to go, bud. Thank you. Thank you. We have about $1,700 left. Now, my question is, so she recently got a offer, actually earlier today, for a different position in Pennsylvania.

And right now, we're kind of deciding whether to stay in Savannah, where we make about $80,000 gross, or go to Pennsylvania, where we'll be making about $90,000, so about $10,000 more. That's about the difference for the two positions. I work remotely, so I can work either in Savannah or in Pennsylvania. And to give you a little more context, most of our family is in the Northeast, in Pennsylvania and New York. But we have been here for six months. We're plugged into our church. We've been doing very great going to life groups and all that. So my question is, should we just focus mostly on the money, making a little bit more money so we can start putting retirement savings and start investing in our future?

Or should we just stay here knowing the expenses are a little bit less and kind of doing that? Interesting. So, John, I get these calls a lot on the Kevin Coleman Show. Yeah, I can't wait to hear, man. So, well, Kevin gets to answer this. I could say what I think, but that's not what this is about. Right. This is about us guiding them.

Kevin, there's two of you in this marriage. I want to know what you and your wife, give me the two separate votes, your vote first, her vote. As it stands right now, which way are you and your wife, give me the two separate votes, your vote first, her vote. As it stands right now, which way are you leaning? That's a great question. So, I mean, Olivia, her name, we actually don't know. We love Georgia. We've been here for six months, like I said.

We love the South. We went to school. I live in Kentucky, and in Virginia, she lives in Virginia and South Carolina. So we love the South. We think we want to stay here and raise our kids. We haven't done yet, but in the future. But we're super tied down. We're not too sure.

We've been praying about it. I've been fasting about it this week. We just don't know. We're not really siding anywhere. Well, I think you just gave us a clue. I think in that answer, you just kind of indicated you guys really love the South. And you have, at some point, maybe through the short six months of your marriage, you guys have kind of imagined a life in the South.

Am I right? Uh-huh. Okay, so here's the deal. In this situation, I think you guys, I love that you're praying about it, you guys are talking about it. I think you guys do the old-fashioned pros and cons list. I love a pencil, got one right here.

I love a piece of paper, got some right here. I draw a line. Pros and cons for each of the moves. Pros for staying. Cons for staying. I don't think there's any cons other than the fact that you say, well, my wife's going to get a $10,000 bump, but you said there's a cost of living.

I would actually run those numbers, John. I'd run the cost of living increase plus taxes in the state of Pennsylvania, and I would compare it to of living increase plus taxes in the state of Pennsylvania, and I would compare it to your current income plus your taxes cost of living in Savannah. That's a pretty easy side-by-side comparison. You can get pretty close there. And I think I would do that for your brain, for your logic,

because ultimately after the brain gets engaged, John, I think it comes down to the heart. That's right. And, Kevin, I know how tempting it is when you guys have a plan, and the plan probably went something like, hey, we're going to live here for a few years, and then we're going to end up moving back northeast with all the family, and then suddenly you like it, right? And you get plugged in there, and moving back home maybe isn't quite what it might have been cracked up to be, and we had a plan, but, man, we really like it here. Well, we kind of beat you to it, So I have the pros and cons list here.

Atta boy. Yeah, in a very kind of macro sense. So the difference is about 5K, give or take. So we won't be making, you know, crazy tons more. But we are going to be closer slightly to our family. So our kind of thinking is that she has, so the hospital here that she's working at, it's a little bit larger. And the one in Pennsylvania is a little bit smaller. So she'll have kind of growth potential a little better over there.

So that's kind of the side on that end. So we might be making more, maybe two years on the line. How old are you, Kevin? I'm 24, and she's 24 as well. Okay, so I'm going to give you a magic gift. You ready? Uh-huh. It doesn't matter what you do.

You can't lose. So true. You stay for two more years. She's a magic gift. You ready? Uh-huh. Doesn't matter what you do. You can't lose. So true. You stay for two more years. She's a hospital employee. She's clearly good. She's going to have another opportunity. Y'all move to Pennsylvania

and realize, what did we do? This was disaster. Parents are annoying now that we're married. They're hassling us all the time. Come back to Georgia. Come back to Nashville.

Come back to Huntsville, Alabama. There'll be plenty of opportunities. Yep. So whatever you do, look at it in 24-month chunks, 36-month chunks. You're not tied into anything. This isn't the end of time for y'all. It's not a forever thing here. Okay?

Trust your gut, Kevin. I know you called because you're like, I'm going to run this by John and Ken, and I'm hoping they're going to say that one of these is the clear winner. That's what he was hoping for. It's not our call because there's not a clear winner here. And I think what you said is beautiful. I'm going to tell you that. That's beautiful because I think of some of the moves

Stacey and I made early in our first year. We were in Richmond, Virginia for one year and then we took a great opportunity to come to Nashville. Well, you know what? You could look at it and go, God directed our paths and he did. But had we stayed in Richmond, it wouldn't have been... It would have been great, too.

You know, we overthink these things. Absolutely. And I got to tell you, John, I'm a fan of getting your brain out of these decisions. You're free. I think it's the heart. You're free.

I think... I don't... Listen, Kevin, I'm having some fun with you, brother, but this is all positive. I don't believe you that there is not a clear winner in your heart

it might be John 52 you know 48 it might be one of those deals it might be really close but I don't believe

that given the just let's look at it let's get our head out of this deal which he's done the head stuff the good head stuff John I don't know what do you think? I think he wants to stay

I heard that too he loves the South and i think they're trying to talk themselves into moving across the country for five thousand i'm gonna add something else to it i don't think they're trying to talk themselves into it i think their family is trying to talk them into it and it gets back to this deal we don't want to let down the people that we love the most but we're going it does make sense that anybody any normal person would want to be near their family until you go- And make $5,000 more. And then you go,

but that's not what my heart wants. That's right. And my guess is she could walk into the place that she works right now and say, hey, I have this opportunity, and they're not going to lose her for $500 a month. Follow your heart, Kevin. That's right.

I don't think there's anywhere close. Oh, I love that, dude. You can't lose, brother. You can't lose. You can't lose. Hey, our scripture today, got a little out of order because I got excited about the barbecue, love that, dude. You can't lose, brother. You can't lose. You can't lose. Hey, our scripture today. Got a little out of order because I got excited about the barbecue, but hey, we're still getting it in, John.

The scripture today, Philippians 2, 3, do nothing from rivalry or conceit, but in humility count others more significant than yourselves. Today's quote, one of my mentors, former leader, had the privilege of working with this man, John Maxwell. To add value to others one must first value others that's good

I tell you what not a lot of words but a lot of depth one of the great curses of our time yeah we don't value each other enough

no we don't place the right amount of value on people hey I value you and you too man appreciate my colleague Dr. John Delaney.

I want to thank our producer, Ben Hill, our associate producer, Kelly Daniel, and you, America. Thank you because we do this for you. This is your show, and this of The Ramsey Show. Did you know The Ramsey Show is one of the most popular podcasts in the world? Subscribe or follow today wherever you listen to podcasts.