The Ramsey Show - App - My Husband Wants To Borrow Money Against Our House To Buy Guns (Hour 3)

Episode Date: February 24, 2021

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🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host, Ken Coleman. Ramsey Personality is my co-host today as we answer your questions about your life, your money, and with Ken here, especially your career. Yeah, looking for jobs, thinking about telling the boss to take this job, and well, Ken can help you. Little Johnny Paycheck reference there.

Just got to brought that in there. I love that. What a great song. Yeah, it's a classic. A bunch of young people need you to finish that line. The I love that. That's a great song. Yeah. It's a classic. Bunch of young people need you to finish that line. The song is take this job and shove it. Yeah. And we're trying to help you do that.

Don't jump. Yeah. Don't jump. Absolutely. Find the right job. Keep paying off debt. You don't have to go backwards and your debt snowball. You can actually pursue work you've always wanted to do and not stop the baby steps.

There you go. We get that question a lot which is a it's a natural question phone number tell you how phone number triple eight eight two five five two two five johnny is with us in san antonio hi johnny how are you hey doing great guys how are you doing better than we deserve what's up great thanks for taking my call so i'm uh in my mid to late 60s and i'm thinking about retiring soon, and I want to know I've got some money in savings, and I wanted to know if it's better to put it towards the mortgage

or do some kind of investments, IRA, and if you have an ELP in San Antonio, you would recommend. My income is $75,000 annual. My wife's Social Security is about $850,000 a month. We have investments of, we have a fixed annuity of around $40,000 and an IRA. My wife has an IRA of $16,000, so that's a total of $56,000. Cool. Mortgage is $238,000 on a 2.75 30-year fix, and we're four years into it.

Good for you. Well, as you probably have heard, if you listen for more than about three minutes, we talk about the baby steps all the time, which is the clear path to wealth, and the idea being we're out of debt. So you're out of debt, everything but your house, right? Right. Cars are paid for. The house is the only thing.

And you have your emergency fund of three to six months of expenses in place your rainy day fund right right good yeah and savings right now i've got 33k and i'm getting another five thousand dollar bonus good uh we do have 5k allocated for a new range that we need to replace that's's the only major expense. Your next goal is continue putting 15% of your household income into retirement and to continue to build your nest egg, and let's get this house paid off. That's baby steps four and six. And so lean into that house, and let's get that thing finished off. You said you owe $200 and something on it, right?

Yeah, $230. Yeah, and that becomes a big goal because if by the time you quit work if you have a really nice nest egg and a paid for house you have a very stable situation uh if when you retire you still have a home mortgage it's destabilizing it's less than stable because you've got that stinking payment laying there staring at you. And it changes the last 30 years of your life to live in a paid-for house dramatically. So well done. You're on your way. Tamron is in New York City.

Hey, Tamron, welcome to The Ramsey Show. Thank you so much for having me. How are you doing today? Better than I deserve. How can we help? I am calling. I recently, I have a question that relates to college and when it is okay or sensible to derail the plan and borrow for college. My husband and I, we actually didn't even discover your system until during the pandemic.

And we've paid down a lot of debt. We've sold a rental property, set up our emergency fund. Wonderful. You made a lot of progress in one year. Well, selling the rental property gave us a large sum, and we're blessed to have terrific careers. But my oldest son is a senior in high school this year. And last year, he expressed an interest that his dream school was a prestigious private university that's around here. I graduated law school from there myself. So tugged at my heart,

and I was supportive of him that if he did everything that was necessary and got the grades and kept everything up, as long as he could get scholarships and aid and the out-of-pocket expenses for us was less than $25,000 a year that we could afford to pay cash through the school's payment plan and that he could go there. My sophomore, however, he had some trouble when he started high school last year, and he was getting into trouble and he was making poor decisions. And then when they closed the schools down, he kind of continued to go down a scary path from our perspective. And he asked us if he could go away to a boarding school, to a military school that's not too far from where we live. And seeing that that was best for him, we immediately in December agreed and enrolled him and sent him.

But I'm now paying $2,500 a month for him to go to school. And our budget only has after all of the bills and essentials like food and clothing allows and haircuts, like really the full budget only has about $4,000 to spare in it. What's your household income? I don't know. Right now we're at about $240,000, and I will be wrapping up my clerkship, my post-law school clerkship. So I would expect that next year it will be closer to $300,000,

if not over $300,000. Which will give you the money to send the other one. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And that's why I was... There's not a plan where I derail and put you into student loans. We've been going back and forth. To answer your earlier question, there's not a plan where I put you into student loans.

Okay? There's two options here. One is we figure this out or Junior picks a different school. Okay. And his future is not ruined based on that. Mm-hmm. And pause. listen pause is doesn't mean never doesn't mean stop it's he could do his first year somewhere else that's right years three through four yeah uh or two through four at the at the uh dream prestige school again if he lines up all the scholarships and it's 25 000 out of pocket with no student loans.

He can also work towards this. I mean, he understands what's going on in the family, and assuming you guys are – there's some harmony there, and he's as healthy as an 18, 17, 8-year-old can be about his brother's situation, he can work and kind of help out with this process as well and say, hey, here's where we're – I think this is a family meeting. I think you sit him down. He knows what's going on, and just say, hey, here's where we are. This is reality. Student loans is not an option.

We're not going to do that. This is what Dad and I have been doing. You've seen us getting out of debt. Bring him in the bigger picture and say, hey, life happens sometimes. It's not fair. It's sad. And you didn't do anything wrong. And yet it's affecting you.

But still, it is affecting you. And so here's what we're going to do. Let's pretend that you lost your job, and you couldn't send him to that school. You'd have the same conversation, and it wouldn't be his fault. You would have lost your job, and he would have had to deal with that. Kids can deal with this. So hold on. We're going to send you a copy of Anthony's book, Debt-Free Degree. I want you all to read that as a family, and I want you to commit to working some kind

of a cash flow game plan to some school that you pay cash for. This is The Ramsey Show. Let me tell you a story about two families that are very much alike in a lot of ways. Both families have two working parents and a couple of young kids. Each has debt and a struggled to make ends meet. But they're starting to make headway with their budgets and smarter decisions with money. They have dreams and plans, and the only real difference is that one family has the right amount of term life insurance, and the other doesn't. Big difference.

If one of the parents die, and that does happen, their well-being would be destroyed. Paying for the mortgage, utilities, food, and that does happen, their well-being would be destroyed. Paying for the mortgage, utilities, food, and other bills would be impossible, let alone saving for education or retirement. That's why every day I talk relentlessly about getting term life insurance. Just go to ZanderInsurance.com or call 800-356-4282 and see how inexpensive it really is. Be the family that takes those deliberate steps to be different and responsible. It really does make you the hero of your story, and it puts you on course for better things ahead. I know what it feels like to think you're never going to be able to save money.

I know what it feels like to think you're never going to get out of debt. But you can actually do it. And we can show you how. It's what we do inside of Ramsey Plus. Ramsey Plus is our step-by-step plan that gets you quick wins so you can make faster progress on your debt, and once that debt's gone for good, you get more money back in your pocket. The best part is you can try it for free.

Once you become a member, you'll also get benefits like the federal classic e-file with ramsey smart tax free included the audiobook of rachel cruz's brand new bestseller know yourself know your money free included and of course financial peace university and of course every dollar premium version and of course you're going to finally get your money under control and we're going to show you exactly how to do that you can try it for free but before before becoming a member just go to Dave Ramsey dot com slash Ramsey plus and check out the free trial Dave Ramsey dot com slash Ramsey plus Rivers, California is on the line. Ken is calling. Hi, Ken.

How are you? Hey. Hi, Dave. Hi, Ken. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. How can we help? So it's going to start off sounding like a sob story.

It's going to turn out with a good ending. I've actually become debt-free, went through a disability thing with a failed back surgery, turning 53 next week. But, Dave, I've done FPU coordinating multiple times. I'm just here to tell you, as everybody does, that your principles work, the baby steps work. And if I can do it, anybody can. When I went from being, you know, high on the hog, owning a successful business to disabled, I lost a lot. But I didn't lose hope, and I kept plugging away. I kept doing the FPU coordinating, even after all that. And I've counseled people. I've helped people out. The principles work, obviously.

I enjoy helping people. Here's my question. I won't ramble on too long. I'm looking at the coaching program. I've always done financial coaching as a ministry, though. I've never charged for it. And turning 53 next week, I'm getting up there. I am disabled. My income is only just under $2,000 a month here in California, which being debt-free, mortgage and everything, is a good thing. I'm just wondering, with Ken there, you know, with the career and everything

else, is it a good idea for someone in my situation to save up, might take me six months to a year to do it, to get that certification to do it as a ministry? Well, ministry, or would you charge for it? When you say ministry, what does that mean? I've never charged. I've always just done the financial coaching for free. It's just something that I've enjoyed giving back doing. I really feel like with my story, it's very relatable. A lot of people feel like, wow, this guy can do it any way he can and stay positive, you know?

Yeah. Well, look, when somebody asks me, is this a good career move, I walk them through the sweet spot analogy, which is very simple. Our creator gave people talent, things you do well, and you're supposed to use those as tools to do work that you love, that fires you up when you think about it, when you do it, and then allows you to accomplish, to produce results that mean something to you. We know that this means something to you. So the question is, if I talk to everybody that knows you, Ken, would they say that you're a good communicator? Yes. Oh, yeah.

People are calling me all the time. I know. I'm helping people in my family right now. That's right. And you're good at instruction, which is what it takes to be a good coach. Communication. And you've got to be good at communication. You've got to be good at instruction.

You've got to have a heart for people. You have all three of those. So the answer is, yeah, this is a good move. I would just challenge you. I have no problem with you doing it pro bono or as a ministry. But I just sit here and I look at your situation and I think you could, because there's no financial pressure on you to make money as a financial coach, that's a good thing because this takes time to build this. This is a one-to-one, we build one client at a time um i just wonder why you wouldn't

eventually charge because our team can not only uh train you how to be a really great coach but how to build your business are you opposed to it no no i just never have i've done hundreds of appointments you know and i think you're i think you're going to do some of both if i'm you uh-huh yeah i think you're going to start charging for some and then occasionally you're going to do some of both if I'm you. I think you're going to start charging for some, and then occasionally you're going to see someone you just need to help, and you just want to do that. And you just want to give them a leg up, and you want to get them started. But the Ramsey Preferred coaches who have gone through all of the training

and then that we send leads to, some of them are making pretty substantial incomes. The top ones are. And so let's just pretend. Let's just say you made $100,000 a year doing this for fun. Then you could also give away a bunch of your services as well, right? Sure, sure, yeah. There's no reason you can't do both. So here's what we're going to do.

I'm going to pay for it. I want you to go through the training. Oh, that's great. You need to go through the training. Oh, my gosh. Seriously? You've earned it. You're the man. my gosh seriously you've earned it you're the man i mean you got listen wow having a testimony is a wonderful thing getting one's a pain in the butt the truth and you have been through that's the

truth so yeah i want you to go through the training is something i don't usually give away it's a pretty expensive item but uh madison pick up and we'll get him through the first series of courses i you can talk to the coaching team and figure out what the proper way to get him started on this is. And just tell him I said this one's a gift on me. That's so cool. You know what? You see what I just did there? This is what I told him to do.

Yeah. Go make a bunch of money and give some away. Give some of it away. Because he's going to be in a situation where he can do financial coaching for somebody who maybe is going through something he went through. A physical injury that rocks your world. And I got to tell you, man, it's dadgum pain and medical bills. We see them in our counseling offices, our coaching offices every day all across America. It's a real, real thing without a doubt yeah

gene is with us in colorado springs hi gene welcome to the ramsey show hi thank you so much for taking my call without going into all the gory details my husband and i have separate accounts um We just put the house in both our names. I have no debt. He already had a home equity loan on the house plus a car loan. Now he wants to borrow more money to buy some firearms. And with the house being in both our names, it's joint tenant, it's not survivorship. I would have to sign some papers to say I consent to him getting a lien on the house.

Should I do it? To buy guns? Yes. How old are you guys? I'm 68 and he's 76. And how long have you been married over 15 years okay i have a huge gun collection i'm a gun guy i can't possibly imagine borrowing on my house to buy a freaking gun i'm a gun guy i'm your husband okay i i? I would be on his side, but I can't possibly imagine what gun purchase there could be that justifies borrowing on your personal home to buy it. What is he buying, a tank?

No, they're single shot, high wall, low wall, whatever. And he went to a gun shop, and they had these great deals, and he knows he could get a lot of money off selling them. Yeah, he doesn't need to get in the firearms business at 76 years old by borrowing on his home. No, I don't think this is a good plan and if he called me i would tell him not to do it and so i'm going to tell you not to allow your home to be done because when this all goes sideways and he can't sell these guns uh for whatever reason as an individual or a collector or whatever he's getting into here i can't tell the flip he's getting into but uh it must be in a very expensive collectible gun of some kind it it sounds like. Yeah, it sounds like he's got a great deal.

He thinks, oh, I can buy this now, hold on to it, and sell it. From a gun shop. He's going to steal it from a gun shop. Yeah, like they're going to give him a deal so he can make a lot on it. I got questions. Yeah, I'm thinking, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, warning, warning, warning. Because that's what retailers are known for, Dave. Yeah, they're known for giving things away at cheap so you can make more money on it later.

Yeah. Gun shops are known for having no idea the value of the guns in their shops. We're being sarcastic, Gene. Your husband's plan sucks. Don't get into debt to do it. And that's from a couple of gun guys. Oh, my gosh. Wow.

I can't believe I told somebody not to buy a gun. I know. It just happened right here. Yeah. That's harder than telling them not to buy a boat. Wow. I can't believe I told somebody not to buy a gun. I know. It just happened right here. Yeah. That's harder than telling them not to buy a boat. Wow. This is the Ramsey Show. Our question of the day comes from Blinds.com. A 100% satisfaction guarantee means even if you mismeasure, you pick the wrong color,

they'll remake your blinds for free. You get free samples, free shipping, and with the new promos they run every month, you'll save even more. Always use the magic word, the promo code Ramsey. Today's question comes from Amy in Nebraska. She writes in, I have a job interview coming up for an entry-level position as an assistant manager for a coffee chain. If salary is not brought up by my interviewer, when is the best time for me to ask about it? You ask about it when they offer you the job.

Because presumably, not always, but presumably when they offer you the job. Because presumably, not always, but presumably, when they offer you the job, Amy, they're going to tell you what they are offering the job at as an hourly rate. And at that point, then you can discuss that. But I would not ask about it early on. I always tell people, Dave, in the interview process, you want to convince that hiring manager that you will help them win. We've got to remember that. They're people, too, and they're looking for somebody that's going to help them win. And so there will come a time in this particular question where the hourly rate, the salary, whatever that is, is going to come up. I would not bring it up.

They get completely through the interview, and you're walking out of your first interview, and you still have no idea what the pay is. You don't ask? fair question but in this situation um you can you have a good idea what an hourly rate is going to be at a coffee shop you have a pretty good idea and you can find that out uh pretty easily you have a ballpark range i mean it's not going to be something like seven eight nine dollars an hour you're probably going to be in that low range would be $10. With the minimum wage politicizing that's going on right now, you're probably going to be in that $12 to $15 an hour. So you shouldn't walk into an interview like that going, I have no idea what I can and can't do.

So it's a good point to bring up, but you have to have an eye on the type of work and do your homework prior to the job. That's what I teach. You can find out what people are paying. You can find out if it's a good coffee shop to work at before you ever show up. So I agree with the general sentiment that you would not – if someone – I teach our guys here in recruiting.

If they lead with what do you pay, what are the benefits, just to end the interview. Yeah, totally agree. Because they're here for what they can take, not what they can give. Yeah. And so it's over. Yeah. And so that's the other end of that sentiment, right? But I would be perfectly careful at the end of the interview if nothing has been brought

up. To start with, that's a really sucky interviewer that does not cover some of what's going on in the interview that is true but uh if that's the case uh you get to the end of it and just go hey i really appreciate our time our conversation i think i can add value here if this were to work out what is the general yeah i'm fine with that i'm fine with that what's the range i'm fine with that or something like that yes just so i kind of so i kind of know what to anticipate and then you can go that because that you may want to rule them out yes you may not want to go through three interviews and get hired for half of what you think you're going to get well you're not going

to go through three interviews for an hourly wage like this for an entry-level job so i that is good context that i agree with my point is this when you're going for an entry-level position you need to have already done your homework on that place. Do they treat people like they're just robots and soulless people and they're just moving, burning churn through this? Do some homework. Find out. It's just a great place to work. You can do that very easily. It's not difficult with all the resources we have in this world. So with that being the context, I'm always wanting people to show up at that interview and absolutely blow them away so that they go, they want you. And the time comes, then you decide.

That's good practice for a real job. It is. Because you're not going to bring up salary. You're not going to bring that up in the first interview. No, you better not. It's bad. I mean, I had a young guy. I'll never forget.

Way back. I mean, we had 10 people. And we had this young guy. I ran into him. I was speaking to church he came up he was real enthusiastic afterwards i was talking to him for 20 minutes and i said you know he said are you hiring for anything i said yeah you know and he came over and he sat down it was so disappointing because he was such a rock star in so many ways but the

first thing out of his mouth is okay what's this pay and what are your benefits package it makes me cringe hearing on it's because because he you know he instantly revealed his heart yes which is i'm here to take rather than to add yes and i can't come into the business i own with that attitude yeah i'm here what can i take versus what can i add you better put some water in the bucket or there'll be no water in the bucket. And remember, for entry-level jobs, you're up against a lot of people. It's a factory. So I want you to put your best foot forward. I like what you said.

I'd be okay with that. But I want you to win the position, win their trust and confidence. When they offer it, then you say. You're probably going to do that in that first interview. Yeah. To your point, they're not going to do six interviews like we do. And they're shuffling people through. And so you want to be classy.

Did you fog up the mirror? Well, in some places, that's the case. Yeah. You can get hired. Smile. Pass the drug test and fog up a mirror. Yes. You don't even have to smile.

I can prove that by some of the people that serve coffee. So I'm just telling you. Bad experience, Dave. I won't bring up a brand. No, don't. All right, Sierra in Orlando. Hey, Sierra, how are you? I'm well.

Good afternoon. How are you guys? Better than we deserve. How can we help? I have a question about taxes. This is the first year that I will be doing mostly contract work. I work as a PA, a physician assistant, and I reached out to, I think, two ELPs or three, and I got kind of three different answers, and I'm just confused.

One of them recommended that I open an LLC. No. And then pay myself. No. Okay, I didn't like it. The other one said, yes, open the LLC, pay your own payroll company. No. But they're wanting money monthly.

No. And the third said, just pay 25% every three months to the IRS. Ding, ding, ding. There's your answer. That's the one you want. Okay. Yeah. What I would tell you to do is just open a separate checking account in your Social Security number.

It's a DBA, Doing Business Ass. And you have a little separate business account, and you put all of your income into that business account. When you want to pull money out of that and take it home to buy things at home or pay bills at home or pay debt at home or whatever, you'd hold back 25% over into a separate savings account to pay your quarterly estimates, and unless you make over $100,000 a year, 25% will cover it. Yes, it's probably between $8,000 to $10,000 a month. Unfortunately, there is an LLC now open.

That's okay. It's not the end of the world. If you want to run it through that now that you did it, that's okay, because it will have its own EIN number, and you just run it through that. But it serves exactly the same purpose. You just added the paperwork and the expense of the LLC to the process, and now you've also added a new tax return to the process because you get to file a tax return on the LLC. So you get to file a tax return plus the LLC to the process, and now you've also added a new tax return to the process because you get to file a tax return on the LLC.

So you get to file a tax return plus the LLC files one. I want to ask you about that, Dave, for her. Shouldn't she just shut that down? Then why go through all those extra steps? I mean, I know she opened it. She paid money probably for somebody to help her get that. Yeah, you know, it's just not that big a deal to file the tax return. It's not worth it to shut it.

It's a hassle because you've got one extra tax return. Yeah. But, you know, you're going to have a Schedule C on your personal return if you don't do the LLC. So you've got some forms to fill out anyway for taxes. So, you know, it's not the end of the world to do that. I definitely would not use a payroll company to pay yourself. That's nightmarish uh but i i don't recommend solopreneurs unless they have lots of money an llc is not there for tax purposes

it's there for risk management it's there for if that company gets sued you don't want to be the individual that owns it uh so as an example i actually own absolutely nothing now i don't want to be the individual that owns it. So as an example, I actually own absolutely nothing now. I don't own a thing. It's all in LLCs, in corporations, in trusts, and all of my real estate is. My cars are even in an LLC. So if there's a car wreck, you can sue the company that owns the cars because that's who owns them. I don't own them. And so the liability, it's a risk management tool is all it is.

It's to get the risk down. It is not to get taxes off of you. So I don't use LLCs for tax purposes. They don't really serve one. And in her situation, get educated on all those write-offs of being a 1099 or contractor. You'd be surprised how much you can write off. Now that, you're good. Your tax ELP would be great for it. Absolutely. This is the Ramsey Show. Thank you. our scripture of the day romans 8 18 for i consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worth comparing with the glory that is to be revealed to us.

Robert Hughes said, The struggle you're in today is developing the strength you need tomorrow. Well, that's the truth. Brandon's with us in Salt Lake City. Hi, Brandon. How are you? Hi, I'm doing great. How about you guys? Better than we deserve. How can we help? Wow, it's a pleasure to be talking to you both.

I'm very thankful for the opportunity you guys are there to help me out. I'm currently in the job application process. I'm a senior in college, and I'm currently, so I've applied to a position that I really, really would like for a large corporation. But the one problem is I'm trying to be proactive and trying to contact the, or anyone, a recruiter just to say, hey, this is my job application, trying to stand out from all these candidates. But I can't find a recruiter because there's hundreds of them in this company um i do have a contact for i'm actually connected with the person i'd be applying for um on linkedin great but i i'm

i don't know if it would be wrong for me just to jump the whole recruitment process oh yeah and contact them directly oh yeah but ken's gonna tell you how to do that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, what are you worried about? If you reach out to them directly, they're going to blackball you? Is that what you're talking about? Yeah, kind of like, oh, this is annoying. He's not following the directions. And you've already applied.

You've already applied, correct? That's correct. I applied about a week ago, yes. Yeah. Well, it's a major company, so they've got a big, big system, and they've got a process. So, you know, one way you could go about this that I think would not get you in hot water, you've got the person who's hiring LinkedIn information. So you're a pretty resourceful young man.

I do a handwritten note, just something simple. Hey, just want to let you know i've applied recently and uh love the company if i ever get the opportunity to work here here's why i'd want to work here really short sweet yeah let me give you another line to enter into that okay yeah go ahead and just in that note go hey and there's a fine line between showing initiative and being just weird i want to be right near that line yeah acknowledge that you've done some homework yeah but i'm okay with that because a handwritten note is not creepy no you find their email and they're wondering how in the world you get that but if i read that and i'm the executive on the other side i'm gonna go that's funny yes i like this i love that dave that's a great suggestion very very good i think

the handwritten note is the way i would go but now what i would really work on is through all of your contacts yeah here we go here this is the proximity principle and we're looking at your web of connections we know from sociology research that the number one way to get jobs is through acquaintances so get outside of your family and friends that's that close personal network picture spider web we're going to go out okay so now we're looking at everybody we know on social media how many people you think they know so let's just i'm using this example say you got 500 friends on media, how many people you think they know. So let's just, I'm using this as an example. Say you've got 500 friends on Facebook. Well, how many friends do each of those 500 have?

And you've got to get aggressive there and just ask for people to help you. Don't be weird about it. Does anybody know anybody that works at X? Boom. I'm applying. I've already applied to company XYZ. Do you know anybody that works there? And let's see what that yields.

And then I would go to the personal context, but outside of social media, same deal. Reach out to everybody you know. Hey, I just want a shot at an interview. That's not asking too much. That's not creepy. That's not arrogant. That shows desire. And you'd be surprised what that will yield.

But you've got to really work hard. And then let the chips fall where they fall on the official submission. Because you're going to go through the system. I'd have you look at the Ken Coleman resume guide. We've got six templates in addition to the free one at the resume guide at my website, kencoleman.com. Check that out. Submit the resume that way. You know, stand out.

Let's just give it to him. Yeah, that's free. Madison, well, that's six templates, too. Oh, give him the six templates. Yeah, give him the six templates free and use those to reach in. And he's also, if you'll read the stuff, the downloads that are free at kencolman.com, it'll show you how to build the letter to get in contact. Now, I'll add one other thing to Ken's system, which Ken's system's flawless,

but it's almost an old sales technique I used to use. If you do get an actual interview, during the interview, ask when you should follow up and set an appointment for the follow-up. Love that. That way you're not pestering. That way you're just following through on what you said. And they said, well, we'll know in a couple of weeks. Would it be okay if I contacted you on Friday the 14th? And they will say yes.

And then when you call on Friday the 14th, they go, yes, like Brandon said he was going to call. He called. That's a good sign for him. But also, then you're not trying to chase somebody in phone tag or you're not trying to, you know, you're not worried that you're pestering them on a follow-up. Because the follow-up is set.

You schedule your follow-up, and then it's not pestering. It's expected. Then let it go. I mean, one of the worst things you can do is just keep emailing somebody. Look, if they want you, trust me, they're going to get back to you. Do a great job. Do your best job in the interview. Do a follow-up.

We have a touchpoint timeline free guide as well. And get six other places to go after while you're going after this place. That's right. Don't sit around and wait. Good idea, yeah. Yeah. So hold on. Madison will pick up, and she'll get you those templates and a copy of Ken's book,

The Proximity Principle. We're going to set you up, man, for going to get the job you want. And listen, I need you to call Ken Coleman on his show and let him know if you get this job using these techniques i want to hear the story yeah we get a lot of fun emails this stuff really does work and here's the other thing you know if it doesn't work let's let's let's really figure out how to open up our connections because what people don't know dave is is that they know everybody they already need to know i know that seems intimidating is the one degree of separation. It really is.

When I was a kid, we played this thing called the match game. You've got grandkids now. Yeah. We played it with our kids. Oh, good. And so it's this idea of you just start turning over the tiles. Okay, I saw an elephant here. I'm looking for another elephant. It's the simplicity of, I've got to be diligent.

I know everybody I need to know. I've got to keep talking about simplicity of i've got to be diligent i know everybody i need to know i got to keep talking about it i got to keep asking people will help if we ask the right way yeah that's exactly right and don't folks that are out there okay there's a lot of people looking for jobs and ken can coach you on this you can get all the the you need. Ramsey Solutions will hire 340 people this year if we meet our hiring goals. However, we will have 25,000 applications come in. If you simply fill out an application and that's all you ever do, there is a high probability that we will have missed out on hiring you. It's true.

Might as well play the lottery while you're doing that it's really a long shot in today's world with so many people applying for so this thing of i filled out a hundred thousand applications on monster.com and not a one call me back well no crap not a one did you know our i use zip recruiter and did all this multiple filings at one time and zip recruiter isruiter is great. We advertise for it. Yeah. But you cannot just mass, you know, just throw enough mud against the wall to see if something sticks. You've got to find that singular connective spot with someone that knows someone that knows someone inside. And, you know, Joe's friend works over there,

and Joe's friend's name's Sally. And Sally is going to get you know at least have a connectivity point well here's another thing i got an email at the last break that a friend of mine had sent a lady who wants to work here right and sent her and i send them over to hr and that doesn't mean she's gonna get hired but she's not in the stack anymore oh no she's at the top she's at the top of the pile. Well, she may be at the top of the wrong pile. Right.

But she's not in. She's getting a look. That's the issue. There's going to be a real consideration. Chances go up when we get interviews. We're trying to get an interview. One thing we get all the time on the Ken Coleman Show, Dave, is people say, okay, Ken, I did what you said.

I really, truly don't have a connection to somebody in the company. And so the next best thing is with the resume guide and the resume templates at KenColeman.com, we have flipped our resume. And the HR team- Could you send that to that guy on LinkedIn? But here's the- Yeah, absolutely. You can reach out.

But what we've done in our resume, and our HR team has worked with me on this. We've got a world-class HR team at Ramsey Solutions. The top of our resume, Dave, says who I know. So if you don't have a connection to somebody in the company, let's use Ramsey Solutions' example, then maybe you should get a great endorsement from somebody who is a world-class financial advisor, smart investor pro, who we may not know personally, but they're in our network. Or if you're going into technology, get a great reference from somebody who's a big shot in that field. It'll make them go, huh?

Yep. And look at you. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus. Have a friend or family member that needs a daily dose of Ramsey advice in their life? Let them know about the Ramsey Call of the Day podcast.

It's a quick hit of advice about life and money in under 10 minutes. Check out the Ramsey Call of the Day podcast wherever you listen to podcasts.