The Ramsey Show - App - My Life Is Upside Down...How Do I Get Back on Track? (Hour 2)

Episode Date: September 30, 2021

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Thank you. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Real Studio, this is The Ramsey Show. It's where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by my colleague, Dr. John Deloney. And the phone number to jump in. This very important conversation, your future, your life, your contribution is 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. To the phones we go. Lisa joins us now in Denver, Colorado.

Lisa, how can we help? Hello, Ken. I was originally calling for you, but if I think seriously about it, I think it might be a Deloney question. Oh, I promise you it's a combo whether you wanted it to be or not. So what's up? I have a job opportunity. It's the same job I do now.

Which is what? I'm in sales. I sell science and graphics. Ken, Kim actually called your show two months ago. You told me to take the job. It was a different job. Take the job. But it wasn't a money move. So I didn't do it. My boss gave me more money. Now I have another opportunity for even more money. $17,000 more just on the base salary. The commission structure is another 6% better than my current job. On paper, it is the right thing to do. The healthcare package is better. The 401k package is better.

I mean, everything is better. I ghosted this company who pursued me back in July. I didn't show up to an interview, and then he reached back out. Conversations are going again. He thinks I'm the right fit, even though I showed to be a terrible employee during the interview process. I am so apprehensive. I cannot pull the trigger. I cannot make the decision. So that's where John Delaney comes in.

Well, before we get to John, I want to go back. No kid can pull this thing apart. Well, no, we're going to work on this together. But I do want to go back to the, you said you called my show two months ago, and I told you to take another job, which means leave where you are now. Why did I tell you that? I don't remember the call. Give me the quick version.

Sure, yeah. So it's the same, before it was the same exact job for the same exact company, but it's a franchise. It would have been a different location. It wasn't a money move. Um, they're ultimately, I mean the issue at my, at my place of employment, you know, I want, I wanted to own one of these franchises one day and the, I was, when I was hired, it was understood that they would train me and mentor me throughout the process to become a franchisee. Right, and they haven't. And they haven't. And so I told you, so I'm just trying to get caught up really quick, and so I told you take this other opportunity where there's a ladder.

Is that about right? That is correct. Because that's what I would tell anybody who called in okay great so okay yeah and so yes let's get to the apprehensive stuff um what are you so afraid of name it specifically so specifically this job is set up different. Everything is done third party. I'm more like a graphics broker and less like a side. Like where I work now, we make everything in-house. We work directly with the customer. Here I'll be working directly with the customer, but I'll be giving. What are you scared of? Elisa.

What are you scared of? You sound like a politician, like at a press conference. I didn't get a straight answer. Elisa, tell us. What are you so afraid of? Well, one, I'll be working from home, and I'm terrified politician like at a press conference. I didn't get a straight answer. Elisa, tell us, what are you so afraid of? Well, one, I'll be working from home, and I'm terrified of that. I don't think I have the discipline to work from home. Great.

That's one thing. What's another thing you're afraid of? I am also the sole breadwinner. My husband is a stay-at-home parent, and I'm afraid the ramp-up period where I start making commission will be too great. And going into the winter seasons and Christmas time, if I was on baby step three, I would do this in a second, but I'm not. I'm on baby step two, and I'm scared to make the move now. I feel like I'm jumping from the ship to the dock instead of just stepping over.

But it's the same exact job. Yeah, but I thought you said that you there was 17 grand thought the 17 grand was already there that didn't even count the uh take account for the commission yeah that's yeah that's just a base dollar it's 57 000 a year right i make 80 now so i mean if assuming that i don't sell anything for a year then really it's a 23 000 cut i know that i'm not going to sell anything for a year i'm going to sell a $23,000 pay cut. I know that I'm not going to sell anything for a year. I'm going to sell stuff, but, but just, you know, the first few months. Okay. So, so Hari, so let's stay right there. Let's okay. That's the monster under the bed, right? Okay. Other than the stay at home. And I think John, I would love John to speak to that

because I think there's some stuff there. I think you got to listen to that because I tell you right now, I could not work from home. I just't. But let's talk about the financial piece. I'll let John tackle the other. The financial piece is, okay, what would need to be true for the first two or three months that we would need to cut back on? Where would we cut? How would we adjust our budget? What would we do differently just to pad that to where you're not in a desperate situation, you're just in a hustle situation? There's a big difference there. Do you understand what I'm saying? Yeah, but're not in a desperate situation, you're just in a hustle situation. There's a big difference there. Do you understand what I'm saying? Yeah, but I'm in a desperate situation.

I went and got a different bank account the other day because my other bank account was $1,500 overdrawn, and I didn't want my direct deposit to go somewhere. I mean, I am in a desperate situation. Okay, well, that's breaking news to John and I, so that would have been nice to know that. Yeah, lead with that one. Well, that's new, and I've never dealt with the money situation that I've dealt with now. I paid off $40,000 in debt, and then all of a sudden I'm just screwing up royally. So I actually wrote down here, Monster, this has nothing to do with your job.

No. You're a woman who's scared to death. Yes. And you are on a ship that you think is sinking, and you are looking for the first place to jump off of. And right before you jump every time, whether it's your husband, whatever, someone's holding you by the sock and you're not jumping. But you've got something going on at your house that you're not safe or you're not okay

or something's not right. No, I'm an alcoholic and I have a gambling addiction. There we go. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I'm totally fine with admitting to those things. And I've been praying about it and I've been working on it. And all of it is getting better, but I don't know if all of those things need to be better before I take the job.

At least it's not getting better. You're in the hole $1,500. You're now opening up new checking accounts to go under in. You've got a husband that's at home that's not working. You're in a desperate mess. Yeah. So I'm going to tell you something right now. He needs to get a job.

He has to. Yeah, but y'all wouldn't. I'm fine with getting a second job. I did that for a little while. Okay, so my dad died. I had two cars stolen. You need to get a second job. He needs to get a job, but you wouldn't say that to a stay-at mom i absolutely would yeah i would too i absolutely would wrong answer you don't know i

mean i hear dave say all the time like oh i love it when moms can stay home but you can't but he can't stay home you guys are drowning elisa here's what i'm hearing i'm hearing an addict and i'm hearing an addict who's great at going to war. I'm not going to fight you. Ken's not going to fight you. You need help. You don't need a new job. Yeah, definitely no one will need a job. You need money, and you need help.

Your husband needs to get a job. You've got to get clean, and you've got to have a season of peace. ASAP. Last thing you need is the stress coming with a straight commission or a heavy commission job stay where you are

a second job will keep you busy make some more money Hubs has got to get out to work and you guys got to get help you can do this

though you've done it before you can do it again this is the Ramsey Show work doesn't have to suck there's a reason you can't shake the feeling you were meant for more than just another job 61 of people aren't even engaged at work, let alone doing work they love. That's why Ken Coleman, America's career coach and national best-selling author, wrote his new book, From Paycheck to Purpose, The Clear Path to Doing Work You Love.

And it's available for pre-order right now. If you're looking to change jobs, get hired, or trying to figure out the work you were looking to change jobs, get hired, or trying to figure out the work you were uniquely made to do, you need this book. Ken walks you through the proven stages that landed him his dream job and thousands of others. Plus, if you pre-order from Paycheck to Purpose today, you'll receive our Get Hired bonus pack, valued at over $100 for free. It includes the audio book, e-book, resume, templates, the Get Hired digital course, and more. Pre-order from paycheck to purpose at Ramsey Show.

I'm Ken Coleman, joined by my colleague Dr. John Deloney, and we are taking your calls this hour here on The Ramsey Show. 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. Let's go to Ryan in Des Moines, Iowa. Ryan, how can we help? Hi, guys. Thanks for taking my call today.

I appreciate it. You bet. What's up, man? So my life was kind of upside down when the pandemic hit. Things were upside down when the pandemic hit. My house flooded, and then my family split, and then there was a custody battle, and then I lost my business. And the hits just keep coming. And that was before the pandemic. And the email was probably pretty depressing to read.

But I've got custody of my son and just having a real challenging time getting refocused, trying to find a new purpose in life, while at the same time taking good care of my son. There's not a lot of help from outside, from family or anything. And I'm just having a challenging time. Basically, my cup is empty. So I don't know which way to go. Are you running your own business? You working for somebody?

What's, give me your work status. Well, the business I had closed during the pandemic. Oh, no. And so,

since then, I've been doing some landscaping and stuff on the side to keep things going. But that's not the direction, you know, that's not the career that I want. Yeah. Was the business, was the business the career you want was it the dream job no no no it was

something that i started part-time while i was in college and it turned into something bigger okay and then it became yeah and then um how much money were you paying yourself probably still try to pursue it but since it closed i, I'm thinking a new direction. Good. Well, we've got a lot to tackle here. Real quick, what was the amount of money you were paying yourself? I mean, what's that number we need to get back to financially on salary? At least $50.

It was just a small business. Okay. You called the right guy. You've got Ken Coleman here. Yeah. He is a magic on fun. Well, I listen all the time, and I read the proximity principle. Yeah.

And I got about three quarters of the way through it, and I thought, wait, I'm not clear. Right. Well, here's what I want to do. I want John – John's got to talk with you. You've been through a 12-round heavyweight fight, and I want to applaud you for staying up. You're hustling for your son. What would you do? I think you've had a lot of time to think, man, over the last three years.

You've been taking some shots. What is it that you want to do? You know, I thought about it. I knew you were probably going to ask this. If I had a choice, I would wake up tomorrow and I'd be on a plane and I'd be doing an archaeological dig somewhere. No joke. Tell me what you love about the archaeological dig we're going back into something but let's just what do we love about that um the history the learning about different cultures civilizations uh how we got to where we are now uh how we

survived back then um that that to me if i was going to simplify that kind of work, that's a form of research. Do you see where I'm going with that? Sure. Digging, researching. You're a guy. You've always been that way, yes or no? Absolutely. Absolutely.

I love to learn. Yeah. Well, a couple things. I want to fast-forward the process for you. I want John to come in on the stuff you're going through, but here's what we're going to do. At the end of this call, I want to give you a link and a code to my Get Clear Career Assessment. You've probably heard me talk about me on the Ken Coleman Show, and we'll dive into next steps. But there are some really great clues there. You're a guy who likes to learn. You're a guy who likes to analyze what you're learning, that researching, diving for answers. I think there's a tremendous clue there, so I don't think you're very far away from tremendous clarity.

But I want you to take the Get Clear Career Assessment, and then I want you to call me on the show. Will you do that? Absolutely, man. I appreciate it. Because we can make up some serious ground. But I want John, I mean, he's going through some stuff. Well, we just, that's a good question. There was no infidelity, at least as far as I know. It just seems like we just couldn't work it out.

I begged and pleaded, and she wouldn't stay. So I'm going to walk through a few things with you, and I'm going to say them real direct, but I'm saying it because I love you, okay? You bet. You lost your home. Yes. Somebody looked you in the eye and said, I don't love you anymore. I'm leaving.

Right. Your business went away. And Ken and I have both looked at the research that when you lose your job, it can be as devastating as the loss of a loved one. And the reason I'm saying it this starkly, you lost your home, you lost your connection, you lost your purpose, is, brother, you should be feeling low right now. You're not broken. The feelings of I don't even want to get up and I'm grinding out a landscaping job, I'm mowing yards to put food on my son's table tells me you're a man of character. You're a man of strength.

And you're going to make somebody else happy someday. You're going to build a new home. Your son won the daggum lottery getting you as his dad. Your body is reeling. I love Ken's analogy. Brother, you just went through a 12-round

fight. The Nevada Athletic Boxing Commission will not let you fight for months after a heavyweight bout like that. They make you take time off because your body's got to heal. It's what you got to do. And so think of this. You were on a boat and it was a nice one and it wrecked and you and your son washed up on the ocean. You got nothing. And you started finding food. You started hustling. And I want you to use this opportunity to sit on the beach and look at the sunset, hold that boy who loves you so much,

and think, dude, all of this can be ours now. You hear what I'm saying? Yeah. I'm proud of you as a dad, proud of you as a community member, and once you recognize, you can see a fighter on the UFC they'll open their eyes after they got knocked out and they say what happened and the referee leans down or their doctor or their coach leans down and says brother you got knocked out

and then you got to go heal and then you figure out what's next and I want you to A. acknowledge the depth of the trauma but also acknowledge the strength you are finding and the path out of this you you heard me say it earlier in this show, little step after little step after little win after little win. And you're going to look up in one year, in two years, in five years,

and the sun's going to come up. You're going to have a home. You're going to have a great job because you're going to get on Ken's stuff. You're going to follow his principles to a T. He's got a brand-new book coming out. I'm going to let him give it away when you call his show. If you call his show, he'll give you a copy of it. Roger that. And that son, here's what

your son's going to get. He's going to get a ringside seat to what happens when a man gets punched in the mouth and knocked down and gets back up. And loves and is vulnerable and is committed. It takes little step after little step. This is legacy changing stuff. This is family tree changing stuff. Got it?

10-4. Ryan, you're standing today, and I want you to hear something. You still have purpose. You aren't throwaway, even though your wife walked away from you. You're not damaged goods. You still have purpose as a dad,

first and foremost. So here's the deal. Whether it's landscaping or a little bit better gig right now, until you get completely clear on what the path is, because we're going to get you clear with the assessment. We're going to get you qualified. We're going to get you connected. We're going to get you started on that path to what you really want to do.

You're going to get promoted. You're going to step into that dream job. And all the while, you've been a great dad to this young man. Do you understand what I'm saying? You are not damaged goods. Your purpose has not evaporated. Do you hear me? I appreciate it.

Yes, sir, I do. I'm going to give you a little hack, okay? Here's the hack. There's a neural circuit in our mind when we talk to ourselves in I and we language, and it activates our fight or flight response. When we start thinking, should I buy this? What should I do? What job should I take?

It fires our body up, dumps adrenaline and cortisol into our bodies. It sends us into fight or flight. When somebody else comes to us and says, hey, what should I do about my marriage? We're able to answer that. Well, you should do this and this. Quit being a jerk. Why don't you try helping with the dishes? Because our brain has a different circuit for dealing with them problems.

So tonight I want you to sit down and I want you to write Ryan a letter in the third person. Dear Ryan, and I want you to start with the words, I love you and man, I'm proud of you. And we, or you've got punched in the mouth. I want you to write to yourself in the third person about what tomorrow's going to look like. Your body's not going to take off on you. And then tomorrow you're going to wake up, the sun's going to come up and it's game on, baby. I love it. Ryan, hang on the line. We're going to get you a Get Clear Career Assessment. Kelly will get that to you. Take it.

Do it. Call me on the show, and we're going to get that path going for you. Great stuff. You're a hero, bro. Your best is still yet to come. This is The Ramsey Show. Thank you. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by my colleague, Dr. John Deloney. We're here taking your calls about your life.

888-825-5225 is the number. That's 888-825-5225. If you've been paying attention to the real estate market, you've noticed that the competition between buyers out there is intense. I talked to a friend the other day, John, said they put in an offer on a house and they were one of 23 and all of them were over asking price. This is the reality all around the country, not just here in middle Tennessee. And that's because inventory is low. When inventory is low, it means that more buyers buying rather than sellers selling. It turns the pressure up on everybody.

And this is not a time to go into this as an amateur. Low inventory is here to stay. To win in this market, you need a pro by your side. Our agents, our endorsed local providers, help you buy or sell. They've got years of industry success and refuse to compromise your financial goals no matter how tough the competition is. Go to ramseysolutions.com slash agent. That's ramseysolutions.com slash agent and find a trusted agent near you.

888-825-5225. 25 offers, man. Yeah, that's true. Right here in a local neighborhood where it was a new house, new construction. They were all excited about it, talked with their real estate agent, got the offer ready, and then they found out within hours, yeah, there's 25 more offers. They were in the low range. They weren't the lowest. And they offered over asking. And so there's your supply-demand. Not a time, to our point, to be messing around. Because you can get fleeced.

I mean, you'll really get in trouble. Oh, big time. It's a bidding war. Yeah. So anyway, crazy stuff. All right, let's go to New York City, New York, the Big Apple. Lisa is there. Lisa, how can we help?

Hi, good afternoon. I'm calling because my husband and I just bought a property in Florida, and we are planning to move, and we're very excited. Now, I started a business when my son was born. I'm a child psychologist, and back then I wasn't, but I got my PhD now. And I started a business that was child care, and it was supposed to allow me to stay with my son until I figured things out. And then it turned out into two locations and a lot of great clients. And I just really, really, really love what I built and really, really love what I do.

And I have a relationship that I wouldn't be able to have anywhere else with my clients. But the point is that I can't stand New York one more second. I can't be here. I need to get my son and my family out of here. I can't take my clients with me and my business with me. My husband wants me to sell. He wants me to just sell it. We already kind of ran the numbers and I know how much I

would get for it, but I have an emotional attachment to my business. And I also, I can't bear the idea of leaving my kids. Um, even though I'm no longer in the classroom, I'm no longer, I'm just your owner. So my, my question is, um, you know, I thought of going and leaving a manager, but it's just not the same. The kids are not going to get like right now. I, you know, I thought of going and leaving a manager, but it's just not the same. The kids are not going to get, like right now, you know, if they need anything, I jump into the classroom. I know how to do assessments. I just make sure everybody's doing well mentally, physically. It's just, it's what they need. And if I'm just the owner, I've worked for owners before.

I know how it works. It just becomes a business. So what would you do? Dr. Lisa. All right, listen, listen, listen. I'll let John talk to you about what the emotions are because you're definitely, and I get it. But I think there's two stark realities that you just laid out for everybody number one you you're if you keep it open and you don't sell it then you're managing from florida and you're still going to feel all this guilt that you're feeling

right now like the kids aren't being taken care of because you can't pop in the classroom and if you sell it to somebody else and go to florida you're still going to be dealing with that guilt so this is a bunch of guilt doc i hear bunch of guilt. I don't think you can make the decision based on this. I think you've already made the decision to go to Florida and you know what it's going to yield in the sale. And so I think, John, I think she's just dealing with guilt. That's what I'm hearing. Yeah. Lisa, this is going to be not a great analogy, but I'm going to get as close as I can, okay? So everybody listening, apologize. Apologies up front. So let's say that a mom brought in a little kid to meet with you.

And she'd gotten a divorce from dad. And she hadn't yet told the kid. And the kid keeps asking questions. Where's dad? Where's dad? where's dad where's dad where's dad as a child psychologist you would look up from that sweet little baby and you'd stare mom in the eyes what would you tell her oh my god um well first i'll get to know the child and i'll try to establish some sort of connection. But what would you tell mom?

That I'm there for her and that we're going to try to make this work and that I'm going to be there and I understand I'm a mom and I understand what it is to try to give everything we want to our children and that I think she came to the right place. One more step. Maybe I didn't ask the question right. Here's what I'm getting at. You would tell mom that she's got to let her child know that a divorce has happened. So, wait, we're assuming that mom didn't tell?

That's what I said. Mom has not told the kid yet. Oh, my God. And the kid is asking, where's dad, where's dad, where's dad? What would you tell that mom? The kid has no idea. Oh, no, definitely, yes. This is a conversation for mom to have.

Yes, absolutely. Yes. I didn't get. Oh, no. Definitely, yes. This is a conversation for mom to have. Yes, absolutely. Yes. I didn't get that part. Okay, so you need to have that conversation with Lisa. Oh, my God. You've made your decision. Yeah. It's over.

And the last person that wants to have this conversation with Lisa is Lisa. You know that you have to sell this business. If you were in Florida, you wouldn't buy a business in New York and try to run it long distance. That's what my husband said. So, you got to sell the business.

You know that. And I think you have to be honest with yourself about this one cool thing. You built an awesome business and you helped hundreds of kids and families. Yes. And you got to grieve the crap out of it.

Yep. Because that stinks. But can I also say you need to celebrate it. Yes. Grieve that you're going to miss this unbelievable, beautiful organization that you birthed that served families well. And that is grieving.

But also celebrate what you did. And can I also just say, this is a little bit on the tough love side. John can cuff me for this on the commercial break. But also celebrate what you did. And can I also just say, this is a little bit on the tough love side. John can cuff me for this on the commercial break. But you know what? You are replaceable. Yes. And if you sell it to a really good owner, they're still going to take care of those kids.

And you're going to have to let that go. Because the reality is, it's time for the next chapter in your life. And there's a lot, millions of children that need help and support and love in Florida. Do it again. And you know that. Do it again. Repeat the process. Because you know what's really breaking?

This is my take. And John and I are friends. I trust him implicitly. I don't even mind if he corrects me right now in the ear. I think that you're not so much grieving, you're not so much upset about the kids aren't going to be served. I think you're just really sad to kind of walk away from doing this thing that you really stink and love.

And I think you're almost acting as if you can't do that ever again, and this is goodbye forever. And I think you're missing the point that that work, that missional result that really makes your heart break right now, that can be gotten somewhere else in Florida. That's what I think. That's you. That's exactly right.

Is that fair? Are we on the nose? It feels overwhelming because, you know, I did it, and it was tough work. And I overcame so many obstacles. It was insane. Like opening a business in New York is insane, and everything was insane. And I overcame, and I won, and it felt so good. And I was just like opening a business in New York is insane and everything was insane and I overcame and I won and it felt so good and I was just like yes and then the pandemic came and put

everything in perspective and and I just felt that you know I was like wow um it's both in Lisa it's both in yeah you did win you did overcome you're a. You're an overcomer. Yeah. And it's time to go to the next chapter. Yeah. Oh, I got an analogy. Hey, this Sunday night, Tom Brady's walking back into Foxborough to play against the New England Patriots. You know what? Guy won six trophies there. It was time for him to leave.

Cash the check, Lisa. Hold your shoulders back. You helped a lot of families and a lot of young kids, but you know it's right for your family and your life to move to Florida. And find a way to fulfill that mission in Florida. Love on some families and build something that continues the legacy of who you really are. Lisa, you're a rock star. So proud of you. This is the Ramsey Show. Welcome back, America. This is The Ramsey Show.

I'm Ken Coleman, joined by my colleague and Ramsey personality, Dr. John Deloney. And we are here for you, 888-825-5225. We're just talking life, money, your work, your purpose, relationships. That's pretty heavy stuff today. Yeah. And you know what? We're okay with that. Absolutely. That's what we're're okay with that. Absolutely.

That's what we're here for, man. I mentioned that earlier, and I just want to mention it again. We will change your name. Kelly's the best in the business. We'll change your name, your location, because we want you to feel safe and the ability to be vulnerable

that we're here to just help you take some steps forward. So trust me on that. We'll do that. I had somebody call in. We shot an episode of the john deloney show this morning and somebody called in and found out they had hiv and um just couldn't catch their breath and their parents had found out in a really

odd weird way and um i asked who you've told and the the person said, you. Yeah. And I got nobody. And unfortunately, especially the last 24 months, last 18 months, we've just found ourselves completely isolated, completely alone. Not a lot of places to turn. But that's been happening for years and years before. The last 18 months has been revealed. But, man, if you find yourself, I just don't even want to turn. That's what we're for. That's what we're for.

Yeah, you know, and I'm so glad you said that, that john that's our heart and dave ramsey did it for years we do it every day here but i just want to point that out because nobody has to know your name and where you're from if they've got some voice analyzing whatever but i just want you to feel safe that we're here to help you and we will steer you in the right direction if we can't give you something on the air we can find it and we are wanting to help you, and we will steer you in the right direction. If we can't give you something on the air, we can find it, and we are wanting to help you. So I just feel like there's somebody right now that's listening. And you may not know who I am, which is fine. You don't know who John is.

Maybe you do know who we are, whatever. I'm telling you, you need to call. Yep. 888-825-5225. Let's go to Joshua in Albuquerque, New Mexico. Joshua, how can we help? Hey, guys. How's it going? How's it going, Vince, for taking my call, how can we help? Hey, guys. How's it going?

How's it going, Vince, for taking my call? You bet. What's up, man? So I have a question. My wife and I own our own business, and we've been doing Dave-ish for a couple years. And we actually got to a point where we had paid a good deal off, almost got it there, and then when we started feeling that relief,

well, things kind of went back really Dave-ish. So we're now in FPU. We started that this month and are really going game on. And so one of the things that we've recently figured out is that, I mean, we've been using every dollar for a very long time. However, we're not sure exactly. Our giving, I'm under the understanding, and, you know, I was raised in church, so tithing is an automatic thing.

However, we've been doing that, like, for September, specifically 10% right off the top from the business revenues. Um, and my wife and I had a discussion this morning to where she was saying, you know, I don't know how we're going to pay all this off if we're giving away all this money. Um, you know, when we could be using it to pay off debt. Um, so I guess my question boiled, boiled down is should we be giving based off the revenues of the company or off of, you know, what's left over after, off the profit, I guess? Yeah. Well, what are you paying yourself each month? Is it a set amount or is it fluctuating? Right now, it's fluctuating. Last year we paid ourselves $60,000 each as CEO and CFO. This year is probably going to be a little bit different.

We've had less to actually, we put more into the business. We put more into the business, so it's not quite as big. But we have a, our accountant is actually a randomly certified accountant. So they've made it to where what we pay ourselves basically pays our taxes, what they've estimated as our tax payments, plus our 401k payment. Okay, but you understand why I'm asking this. I mean, let's be very clear. We've got a lot of people listening here. We're talking about the biblical concept of tithe. Is that right?

Correct. Okay, so you called us. I mean, I can tell you very clearly what our position is, what Dave has said. I'll tell you what my position is on this. But, I mean, I don't want to get too much into Christianese, but, I mean, there's this concept of the priesthood of the believer, right? And that's between you and God. But the Bible is pretty clear, a tenth of your income.

So the reason I asked you what you're paying yourself as your income, that to me is where you start. You called in, though. Is that what your belief is, or do you believe that you need to pay off of what the gross revenues or the net revenues of the company are. Tell us where you stand at this moment. Well, I think where we're trying to get the happy medium is that I've always believed that it was 10% from jump. That's the very first thing that you that you take out and then from there everything else gets paid and because my belief is and i've seen it happen in real world um is

that that ends up i don't know how the math always doesn't work out up front but somehow it always takes care of, you know, mysteriously. Right. So here's the point then, and I'm so glad you shared that. You called two guys and asked us our opinion on this, and the reality is, is I think the Bible's pretty clear that you pay a tenth of your income. What your company brings in, and I'm just going to make this example up for easy round numbers, if your company brings in $300,000, but you only pay yourself $150,000, I personally would, if that's what you pay yourself, then I would tithe off of the $150,000, not the $300,000 that the company takes in. And so that's my position on that. But again, if you want to pay it off of the company's revenue, it's not like that's wrong.

It's not like God's going to go, hey, you gave me too much, and I'm a little bit upset. I mean, there is tithe and there are offerings. And I think, honestly, that's between you and the Lord, and I think that's between you and your wife. And this is a marriage issue. And if she's kind of going, hey, I think you have to sit down and go, okay, what do I really believe? There's want to, and then there is have to, if we're talking about obedience here in a spiritual discussion. Do you understand what I'm saying?

Yeah, absolutely. And I think where we are right now is, you know, so we find places to donate, and we, you know, she made the comment the other day that, you know, we donated, you know, whatever it was, $14,000 last month, and we're eating rice and beans. Well, now let me jump in for a second. If we're saying donate is different than tithe, or are we saying it's the same bucket? Well, same bucket.

Charitable giving, we gave to the church. We had a couple of charity events that we gave to, things of that nature. Okay, but listen, Joshua, I kind of agree with your wife. If you're trying to pay off debt, I wouldn't be doing charitable giving. No, absolutely not. I would be tithing. I would be tithing. That's scriptural. That's what we believe at Ramsey Solutions, okay? But I would not be doing charitable giving, so I don't think it's all in the same bucket you're putting it all in the same bucket but that's i think your wife is right rice and beans and you're giving money to charity i think she's right john so i i like to find places where scripture and science interact uh crosses

over which is interestingly all over the place all over the place. All over the place. It's crazy how that works. And I think it's important to step back and call out the obvious. Josh, you're important to the world, and I'm glad you're here. God doesn't need your money. He's a big boy. There is a spiritual and a psychological and an emotional and a relational strength and submission and orientation towards gratitude, towards realizing this is all passing through our fingers. And you and your wife are arguing over a math problem and it's a spirit it's a it's a heart problem okay so sit down and don't starve over charitable charitable donations over the

top line versus the bottom line give your 10 off of your income and they feel the gratitude feel the thank you feel the this is just passing through i'm holding i'm a steward of god's money not i'm gonna blow my marriage up over the top or bottom line here. Good stuff. Joshua, work this out. Hey, I want to thank Ben Hill, our producer, our associate producer and call screener, Kelly Daniel, my colleague, Dr. John Deloney, and you, America. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for The Ramsey Show.

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