The Ramsey Show - App - My Roommate Isn’t Paying His Share of the Rent (Hour 3)

Episode Date: February 10, 2023

George Kamel & Kristina Ellis answer your questions and discuss:   "My roommate isn't paying his share of the rent", George & Kristina read song lyrics Dave Ramsey from ChatGPT (lyrics below), How to get health insurance when your job doesn't provide it, from the blog: Health Insurance FAQs, Handling larger expenses in Baby Step 2, George tells his story. Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6 A Song About Dave Ramsey by ChatGPT Verse 1: He'll teach you how to save your cash And make your money grow, He'll show you how to live below Your means and let it flow. Chorus: Dave Ramsey, he's the man, With financial wisdom in his hand, He'll guide you through the ups and downs, On the road to financial soundness. Verse 2: He'll teach you how to pay off debt And not to live in fear, He'll show you how to invest For a future that is clear. Bridge: He's got a plan for you and me, To live a life of financial glee, So listen to his words of advice, And you'll be living the good life, twice. Outro: So take his advice and run, And you'll see the money come, Dave Ramsey, he's the man, With financial wisdom in his hand. Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

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might enjoy this, might benefit from the financial advice we are doling out here on the show. Let's go to the phones. Ethan kicks it off in Orlando. Ethan, welcome to the Ramsey Show, my friend. How you doing? Hi, I'm doing good. What's going on? Something I'm wondering about is my roommate isn't quite able to make the rent every month, and I'm wondering how I can get him on a budget. And then if at the end of the lease, he's not able to pay back the money we've lent him over time, do I just write that off as stupid tax or hope that he can end up paying me back?

He's not able to or he doesn't want to? I don't know. He makes room for his groceries and his other stuff, but he ends up being late every month on the rent. What's his reaction? Are you like buddies with this guy or is this like a true roommate? We found this guy on Craigslist. Yeah, the three of us,

we've all been friends for several years. Okay. Since early high school. When he can't pay, what does he say? Is he just constantly bumming money off you guys? Is he remorseful? Is he like slapping his pockets like,

oh man yeah yeah he seems a little sorry but he more just lets us discover oh looks like we got a late fee what okay well we haven't paid on time okay why did that happen who is this money getting paid to who's the landlord uh just like you know huge you know renting huge, you know, renting company. Well, I think that's the next step. If this guy can't pay is they get to evict him because he's not making rent and you find a new roommate who can, and you have that hard conversation. Okay. Cause it seemed, it felt more like from their perspective, the,

the company that it's more like, you know, total bill needs to be paid and they don't care who pays it. But you think you're saying it's more like, you know, total bill needs to be paid and they don't care who pays it, but you think you're saying it's more like a roommate- Can they split it into different payments or do they need it all as one giant lump sum and they go, hey, you roommates, you figure out who's going to actually write that check. We all have accounts on the website, but they just see what it is at the end of the month. It's just one tab that we're all chipping into. I would talk to them and say, hey, listen, we're on the lease. Two of us are paying just fine. This guy's not. What are our

options here? Because right now you're just enabling him by allowing him to take this interest-free loan every month. I mean, how far behind is he on rent? In total, it's like $1,500 because he he hasn't paid, he's never paid the electricity bill. What? How is he okay with this? Because we've been patient with him, but, you know, after these few months, I've... You don't be patient with idiots. They'll drag you down with them.

This guy's a grifter. Yeah. How have these conversations gone? Like, have you had these real conversations with him where you're just like, hey, dude, like, we can't keep doing this yeah what we've done is i've given him like payment plans where he said all right we're gonna do this much this month this much that month i projected out for him for the whole year and he's like gee thanks and then uh next month he didn't quite make it and it's like well what happened to the payment plan he's like okay okay well even the

fact that he says gee thanks like his response to your generosity and to you floating him this money is g thanks is there's not respect there dude i i'd have his mattress on the lawn and change the locks and say you don't live here until you pay rent and that's not because i'm a bad friend or whatever he's putting you guys in a terrible financial spot and now using you to enable his stupid behavior. I don't know that you can legally put the mattress on the lawn. Listen, I don't know that you can legally not pay rent for a year and make your friends give you loans and put you on payment plans

even though you're not the landlord. Well, and that's where I would change it from a friendship relationship where this is all one group of friends paying rent and like george said i would call the landlord and say okay this dude's not paying we may need to evict him we need to figure this out like we need to know our options i'm gonna say you've got one month to come up with that 1500 bucks you owe and then you are on time every single month in fact you're early and if you're not you can't live here anymore because we need someone who pays reliably on time that was the agreement when you signed that lease are you willing to have

this conversation because part of it is like george said to be enabling like this is not a budget meeting this guy doesn't want to pay and he's not really being your friend like the fact that he's putting you in this financial situation and really taking advantage of you is not a good friendship. And if that's what I'm saying, if you go to the company and make them the bad guy, that will at least put some fuel on this thing. Yeah, I can imagine that he doesn't quite notice the gravity of it. Like if he didn't have such nice friends, he would be evicted. Like, that would have happened. Exactly. But you know what happens

when you do it one month and the next month, it just becomes normal. And so he gets used to stupidity instead of having to actually change his behavior. I mean, this guy's working, right? He's making money.

Yeah, he works at, like, an oil change place. And if he can't afford to live there, he just needs to find a new place to live. It's not because I'm a bad friend. You guys can still be friends with him when he moves out. In fact, you'll probably be better friends with him

when you're not part of his landlord situation. Yeah, it's made things awkward. Yeah. What's your rent? What's the cost? A total $24.50 a month. And you guys split that three ways. Another like $100.

Yeah. Well, I pay a little bit more since I have the master bedroom, but yeah. Okay. So what's his share? $700? No. Yeah, he plays like $790 and then another like $60 or whatever in utilities. And he's not paying electricity for some reason.

Yeah, he just hasn't done that yet. When does this lease end? At the very end of August. Okay, and are you planning to renew this lease? I hope I know the answer. No, we definitely can't, you know. Yeah, he needs to be gone. The back of my brain wanted me to you know find a place that's

two thousand dollars a month with him but you know when i asked him okay what can you afford he's like i guess 700 and it's like well what do you mean you guess that you need a budget i mean you're i'm happy to gift you total money makeover to gift to him i don't think this guy is going to crack the cover of it to to be honest. Because he doesn't want to change. He's not coming to you for financial advice. He's coming to you for handouts. Has he once said, man, I'm just

my paycheck's are tight. Can you help me figure this out? Has he once said that? No, he's never had me sit down with him. I think that's very telling. He never asked me to. I think you need to channel your inner George energy. Dude, I... And get aggressive with them. I think that's very telling. They never asked me to. Mm-hmm. I think you need to channel your inner George energy. Dude, I... And get aggressive with him.

My little man syndrome comes out in these situations. I'm just not putting up with that crap. Your life is too important. Your financial future is too important to let this goober stick around and put you in a bind with this weird personal loan situation where now you have to start hassling him for the money.

Going, where's my money? Where's my money? I'll get it to you next month, bro. He's out. You're also not his parent. The fact that you're like trying to talk to him about money and he's like, gee, thanks. That's like something that like a child would say to their mother. Like not two grown adult friends.

I'm fuming right now. I'm sorry, Ethan. You got to go through this. Find better friends is A1. But next step, let's get this guy out of here. you're listening to the ramsey show 888-825-5225 i'm george campbell joined by christina ellis this hour well christina Christina, I have been playing around with this new tool called ChatGPT. It has taken the world by storm. It's a very fancy AI tool where you can just give it some prompts and it can spit out things and all of its knowledge

comes from 2021 and previous. And so it's not quite Google, but it's fascinating. One of our engineers had some fun with this and said, give me a song about Dave Ramsey. And here's what the robots out there decided would be a great song. We're going to do this in a few parts, Christina. We're not going to sing it because we want to stay on air, but give us the first verse and chorus. All right, let's go, chat robot. Verse one, he'll teach you how to save your cash. He'll make your money grow. He'll show you how to live below your means and let it flow. Dave Ramsey, he's the man with financial wisdom in his hand. He'll guide you through the ups and downs on the road to financial soundness. Off to a rocky start. All right, let's continue to

verse two. He'll teach you how to pay off debt and not to live in fear. He'll show you how to invest for a future that is clear. Dave Ramsey, he's the man with financial wisdom in his hand. He'll guide you through the ups and downs on the road to financial soundness. He's got a plan for you and me to live a life of financial glee. So listen to his words of advice and you'll be living the good life twice. Back to the chorus. Dave Ramsey, he's the man with financial wisdom in his hand. He'll guide you through the ups and downs on the road to financial soundness. So take his advice and run and you'll see the money come. Dave Ramsey, he's a man with financial wisdom in his hand wow well okay i think it's safe to say that human songwriters have job security the robots have not yet figured out how to replace true creative art and truthfully they don't even know how to rhyme yet i mean those are some pretty

rough rhymes but it was better than i thought it would be by a robot. There actually was money content. The concepts are there. If it wasn't a song, maybe like a haiku, I would buy it. But financial soundness, I don't know that anyone's ever used that term. And that didn't rhyme. No, it felt like just like the kids bop edition of Ramsey. You know, you remember those commercials growing up? I do. Wow. And Financial Glee. I haven't heard that one either.

I kind of like that. To live a life of financial glee. So here's the challenge for you all listening out there. If you want to add music to this, you want to sing it, the power is in your hands. So here's what we want you to do. We're going to put these lyrics in the show notes on podcast in the description on YouTube. And if you so choose, again, on your own volition to come up with some music, some melody, take some creative artistic license here, you can email us ask at Ramsey solutions.com with your song submission, and maybe we'll feature it on the show. It's a big maybe

it's a big maybe this was so a big maybe. This was so bad. I don't know that I ever want it unearthed ever again. Yeah, I'm like, the bar is not super high, y'all. Like, I have a feeling we've got some creative people out there that can do quite a bit better than the robot. If you can polish this thing up, you might have a music career ahead of you. So ask at ramsaysolutions.com. You can check out the lyrics in the show description, podcast show notes.

Send us your final song you've made from these somewhat okay lyrics. Wow. Have you used ChatGPT yet? I've played with it. It's pretty fascinating. It does a decent job depending on what you feed into it, the prompts that you give it. It's kind of wild. Yeah.

Some of the prompts and some of the output, I'm like, uh-oh. There's going to be some interesting waves in the future. If there's a complex topic and you're like, hey, explain to me this topic like I'm five years old and make it fun and light. And it can do that. So we can, you know, you can talk about, I don't know, 401ks or something. There you go. So check it out while you can before they start charging for it. Because, you know, they're going to monetize that thing in no time that's wild i wouldn't recommend taking financial advice from

it yet what a time to be i grew up in the era of ask jeeves do you remember ask jeeves i do it was like the original google gosh george that makes us sound old i know i had a geocities website too myspace that was my thing that That's right. Editing the HTML backgrounds. Love it. We feel so old. Yeah, that's a little painful. That hurts a little. Gen Z's like, what? What is MySpace? What's that? Top 8? Oh my gosh. I love it.

Well, let's get to the phones here. Jason is awaiting in St. Louis. Jason, welcome to the show. Hi, thanks for having me. Sure. How can we help? So I'm recently getting a changing position at my current job. Well, I'm not going to be offered health insurance. And we started Financial Peace in January.

And we really kind of jumped off with it all. You know, we knocked a lot of debt down. I think it's like $ like 70 000 we've paid off in the last like month and a half awesome payments and you know getting rid of some debt um so i was just kind of curious on the best way to go about getting health insurance because my wife is self-employed and doesn't obviously qualify for it, your unemployment. And I looked at the marketplace and like private insurance and it's, you know, like anywhere from like 900 to a thousand bucks a month. We don't have any medical conditions.

We don't take any prescriptions. So it just kind of seems like a waste, you know, to spend that kind of money. But I just don't want like, and we have a six year old, you know, to spend that kind of money. But I just don't want, like, we have a six-year-old, you know, so I don't want anything to happen. Yeah, you need health. It's a non-negotiable that you need health insurance. It doesn't matter how healthy you are today. It's about the what-ifs in life. And medical bills can rack up to six, seven figures very quickly.

Yeah, and we don't want to, you know, deflate our boat that we're doing right now sure when you changed job positions did you know that it would be an insurance change did you have insurance before this new position what's kind of that yeah yeah so i did know um but um i'm trying to just let my wife get her business growing um so we knew that we're gonna have to pay out of pocket i didn didn't realize it was going to be this much. I talked with a broker, and she recommended, like, a short-term insurance that kind of covers, like, the catastrophic stuff. So I don't know if you guys were familiar with those. Yeah, I mean, there's things like COBRA as well.

When you leave a job, there's kind of that gap insurance. But you need something long-term because there's not – your situation isn't changing anytime soon as far as work and employment and benefits. It could. So I'm, I'm waiting for a night shift to open up. What kind of work are you doing?

A nurse. I'm a nurse. And there's no health insurance provided as a nurse? Not as a PRN position. So I pretty well pick up shifts whenever they have available. Like I work in a float pool. So I have like nine hospitals throughout one hospital system that I float between.

So like I can pick up at any of these places. So like the work's not going to be an issue, you know, finding it. I just have to pay more out of, you know, out of pocket for my health insurance. Are there other positions that would provide health insurance? Um, there are, um, but like I said, Are there other positions that would provide health insurance? There are. But like I said, the position I'm currently in is a very good paying job. So I just really need to wait until the night shift opens up.

So that's going to be the tradeoff is because it's a better paying job, you're going to have to use some of that better pay to cover the more expensive health insurance through the marketplace because it's not going to be subsidized through your employer. Yeah. Will the night shift provide you with insurance? Well, like if you do get that position? Yeah, it will. So I'll be back to a full-time position and it'll work better. Like I said, with my wife being able to go her business more and then we don't have any help with our son, like childcare. Okay. so this really is a temporary thing in the ideal scenario. Yeah.

Okay. Like I'm not going to say in this long term. That's why I was looking at the short term. Have you connected with one of our Ramsey ELPs, endorsed local providers, or was this an outside agent? It was an outside agent, just a local one by me. Okay. I'd get a second opinion.

If you jump on to RamseySolutions.com, click on Trusted Services, then click on Insurance, and then Health Insurance, they can help shop you all the types of insurance you might need depending on your situation, depending on how long. And just know in the meantime, you might have to tighten up that budget and go, this stinks that we're paying $1,000 a month right now, but we've got to get the right coverage. Don't skimp on this in the short term because it can lead to financial ruin if you start skipping

around on this. Yeah. Okay. Man, but congrats on the new position. Hope long-term we can find you something with good health benefits. I mean, it's one of the main reasons people choose a job is the benefits and especially health insurance, because it's an insane situation here in America and a lot of other countries. So get that taken care of ASAP. Never have a gap in health insurance and connect with one of our Ramsey ELPs at ramsaysolutions.com. They can help independently shop all of the different companies out there to get you the best rate. This is The Ramsey Show. welcome back to the ramsey show i'm george campbell joined by christina ellis this hour on the ramsey show we're here to help you figure out the right next steps for your money. And sometimes we do that through live events on the road.

And we are so pumped to do that with our Building Wealth Live Tour coming up starting next week. All of the Ramsey personalities are going to be scattered across these events. And it's a proven plan for your money that will work even in this economy. So you can catch us in Indianapolis on February the 16th. I'll be there with Dave Ramsey, Rachel Cruz, and Jade Warshaw. February 23rd, you can go to Austin, Texas to see Dave Ramsey, Ken Coleman, Dr. John Deloney, and Jade Warshaw. Then we're headed to Salt Lake City on April 24th with Dave Ramsey, Rachel Cruz, Christina Ellis, and myself. And finally, we'll end it in Anaheim, California on May 2nd with Dave, Ken, Dr. John, and Christina. Tickets start at just 49

bucks and you can get a four pack starting at 175. These seats are going fast. Our last fall tour sold out, so you don't want to wait on this. Reserve your seats now. RamseySolutions.com slash events is the place to go. You ready to hit the road, Christina? I am so excited. These events have been electric. Oh, I've heard such great things about them. And it feels like the baby personalities, the new ones are finally spreading their wings. You made it onto the tour bus.

Yes. I love it. We're going to have a good time. Join us for that. All right. Let's go to the phones. Tim is in Virginia Beach. Tim, welcome to the show. Hey, thanks for taking my call. I appreciate it. Yeah, what's going on? every time we start to get some traction, a big ticket item kills our momentum. Uh, like, you know, something that's much more expensive than just what the thousand dollar emergency fund covers. Um, just in the last probably five years, we've had HVACs that have completely died. Um, we've had, uh, we had a pipe burst in our house and unfortunately homeowner's insurance

wouldn't cover it. That cost us about four grand out of pocket to take care of. Um, we have four vehicles, my wife and I, and our two adult kids, um, we are paying payments on my wife's car, but my, mine and my two kids are older model cars. And just this week, my son's car was in the shop to the tune of $650, and my daughter's car was in the shop to the tune of $750. Ouch. And it just makes it feel like, you know, we actually keep $2,000 in our emergency fund just because so many times something hits us that's $1,000 or more and just wipes it out.

So we've started keeping $2,000 in there. That seems to be a good number that we can take care of something right away and not have a car parked for a couple weeks waiting to make more money to cover the expense. But what would be your advice? Because, you know, listening to all the teachings and the stuff, you know, maybe they've been discussed on your shows, but I don't really hear people talk about how to handle those big expenses, especially like when things go wrong in the house and you're trying to work the baby steps. And it's like, man, it just is like gut punch to have, you to have some of these things happen, and you just don't really have the funds, and you're facing,

do we finance or what do we do? Well, how much debt do you have total? Let's talk about Baby Step 2 and where you're at. What is your total debt? Okay, so our total debt, we have about $28,000 in credit card debt. We owe $15,000 to his left to pay on my wife's car. We have a little over $40,000 of student loan debt. And we have our home.

We have about $180,000 to pay on our home. Okay. And what is your house? We got a long road. We got a long road ahead of us. Well, what is your household income? Oh, well, that actually is pretty good. So I make, I bring home 90,000 a year and my wife has just recently got into travel nursing. And so she's making, she made 120, she makes about She made $120,000. She makes a little over $120,000 a year. Oh, my goodness. So combined, you're over $200,000?

Yes. Well, this past year, yes. For 2022, yes. We were right at about $180,000 the previous year was our gross income. How much debt have you paid off thus far on the journey? You said you've been doing this for 10 years. How much have you paid off thus far in the journey? You said you've been doing this for 10 years. How much have you tackled? Well, we paid off cars, and then we have had to finance my wife's car,

and that's a whole other story in itself. We paid off several credit cards. What is her car worth today um about what we owe i think the current car facts on it is about 15 five and we i think we owe just shy of 15 000 on it okay well here's the good news with this newfound income this debt is gone this year and there's nothing that's going to stop you because what i'm hearing is okay we had a 600 repair's nothing that's going to stop you. Because what I'm hearing is, okay, we had a $600 repair, $400 repair. That's not enough to completely halt the debt snowball when you're making 200 grand. And so I think a lot of it is more emotional than it is financial. There's a lot of other expenses. And while my wife and I are both on this plan,

you know, I mean, you know, full disclosure, you know, like, like our daughter does not work. She's a, she's a college student and she goes away to college. And that is like, you know, we, she, she has, we give her $800 a month to help cover things while she's in college. Plus we pay for, you know, we pay for everything while she's in college. So I know that that could probably be argued as to why we do that or not, but it is what it is. Is her room and board paid for, her meals already through the school or what? So she's got a scholarship. She's an athlete,

so she's got a partial athletic scholarship, and then she's got an academic scholarship. And the rest of it is she's actually taking student loans out for the remain for the other part of it but yeah i mean very very easily she's another thousand dollars a month but you guys are bringing home easily 10k a month and take home pay yes so that's the real question where is that ten thousand dollars going let's get on a real strict every dollar budget and go, where is all the money leaks happening? And some of it might be, hey, honey, we can't give you 800 bucks a month anymore. We're going to bring it down to 100 for basic living expenses. Well, and Tim, I kind of feel like there's a bit of a laissez-faire attitude about it.

Like baby step two, if you're really following the teaching, it is gazelle intensity. It is, we are getting rid of this debt. We are mad. We are running as fast as we can. And with $200,000, you can pay this off in a year, but you can't if you're just kind of chilling and you're just kind of like, well, this and well that like you got to get really intense and serious. Life has just been happening to you and you feel out of control. But there is another world where you go, oh, I'm in control. And yes, there's going to be little bumps in the road that come our way.

But just looking at the numbers here, if you wanted to pay off all $83,000 in the next 12 months, you would need less than $7,000 a month going towards that. You bring home over $10,000. And so the question is, how can we get our expenses down to three or less in order to throw seven plus at the debt? It's just a math equation if you take the emotion out of it, right? On paper. Right. On paper, you can do it. But emotionally, it's just like, oh, it's out of control.

There's so many expenses. We can't. So the question is, are you guys actually sitting down and doing a budget together every month going, here's what we're going to do. Are we agreeing to stick to this? Well, yeah, probably not as good as we should. And I'm not going to make that part of it up. Well, we can help with that. I want to gift you guys one year of every dollar premium so that it connects to your bank.

You're seeing all the transactions come through. There's a paycheck planning tool. You're going to feel more in control of every single one of those dollars than you ever have before. So don't let lifestyle creep make this money disappear because now we have a great income. We have a little cushion. We'll get to the debt. We'll be able to cover some things. I want you to live like you're broke college kids again. Yeah. Instead of vision for when you went, when you want this done, say, you know, a year or 18 months. And let the fact that you've been on this plan for 10 years and it's not really, you haven't seen the progress you've wanted.

Let that make you mad and go, this time we are going for it. We are going fast. We're going to knock this out. And it's just for a season. So that after that, you have freedom and you feel peace and it feels great. Are you willing to sacrifice for one year or are you going to look up 10 years from now going, well, we're still on the horse trying to make our way to debt freedom. Dude, you guys make $210,000.

You have 83 to pay off. This thing has gone in the air and I want you to do a debt-free scream and call us back and share that story of that fire that got lit under you guys to finally get this thing out of your lives. We're cheering for you, man. This is The Ramsey Show. Our scripture of the day, Psalm 107, 9. For he has satisfied the thirsty soul, and the hungry soul he has filled with what is good. Frederick Douglass said, the soul that is within me, no man can degrade. Love that.

So good. So George, walking through the baby steps, it takes patience, right? We've seen so many things out there in the news about crypto and this get rich quick kind of culture. But we really want people to follow God's and grandma's ways of doing money sometimes. I mean, it takes time to do it right. But you're building a lasting foundation. You're building something that's real and that can really carry you throughout life. And I think a lot of people watching the show, they see you on here just crushing it, sharing all this wisdom. But a lot of them don't know your story. They don't know that you have literally walked out these steps in such a

powerful way. So I think we'd all love to hear just a little bit more about your journey and kind of what it's looked like. Yeah, well, Christina, I'm celebrating 10 years as a Ramsey team member, which you're like, this guy looks like he's 14. How is that possible? I'm in my 30s, guys, but thank you. Skincare matters. And so here's the short of it, Christina. I grew up with immigrant parents that immigrated from the Middle East, Egypt and Syria in the 80s to America, and I was born here. So I was a first generation citizen. And so I grew up with kind of seeing them adapt to the American culture. And they did such an incredible job raising us, they got educations. And, you know, we were the normal kind of middle-class family. And I always just thought like, well, you're, if you're middle-class, you're just, you stay middle-class,

like you kind of are how you're born and nothing changes. And I grew up falling for a lot of the same traps. And so when it came time for college, it was, well, we'll, we'll figure it out when we get there. Well, we got there and figuring it out meant we'll just take out student loans and we'll help co-sign. You know, this is what they knew what to do. Yeah. And so I ended up going $36,000 into student loan debt. And of course, I opened up the credit card because I was told you got to have the credit score. You got to have the credit history.

That's how you're going to live your best financial life. And so I ended up opening up an American Express and a Discover card. And I was weighing the 5% cash back at restaurants this month and on my SkyMiles over here with Delta's American Express card. And all of a sudden I was $4,000 in credit card debt because I was already broke. Yeah. And I never learned the money principles. You got totally normal. Yes. And so I grew up with all of this. And in 2013, I got an internship here at Ramsey Solutions was a temp. And I went through Financial Peace University. And it was like the

veil was released. And I was like, oh, my gosh, the system is designed to screw you. The whole thing is designed this way. And parents and guidance counselors and teachers, all these well-meaning people just sort of fell for it and it became normal. And I think that's important to highlight that when you started here at Ramsey, you were an intern and you were over $40,000 in debt. Yes, I had a negative net worth of $40,000. And, you know, fast forwarding 10 years, I went from negative net worth to a baby steps millionaire in 10 years. And y'all, I don't come from money. I don't have any rich uncles. Like I just did the hard work. I think we need to pause for a second. Y'all, George is a baby steps millionaire. Like

what in his thirties? That is amazing. Started out with negative $40,000 and in 10 years is a baby steps millionaire. Thank you. That's incredible. It has been a journey, Christina. We did our debt free scream. My wife and I, we paid off our house back in 2021. And she works here. We met here. Beautiful love story for another time. But meeting someone who's on the same page with the same values, with shared vision and goals, that catapulted us on the journey. And so many people feel stuck because they're not on the same page with their spouse because they haven't done the hard work of digging in and getting to those roots. But my passion is to help

people avoid all of these traps and this toxic money culture that has held so many people back, especially my generation, the millennials, and now Gen Z, who's feeling screwed by the president and the economy and what the other generations did to them and inflation, and it's impossible to live. And I'm going, guys, you're right. Okay. That can all be true. And it's not your fault, but it is your responsibility. And this idea that it's all out of our control, that we can't rise above the system is malarkey because I did it. And I'm going, oh, I don't need the credit score. Oh, I can just pay for a car with cash. I can do manual underwriting when it comes to getting a mortgage and I don't need a credit score to do that. Oh my gosh. And so once you kind of see the underbelly of the system, you can't

unsee it and it makes you want to stay away from it. So I cut up the cards back in 2013. I never looked back. And in 18 months of doing side hustles, I was doing Uber, Lyft. I had the Nielsen people meter, which tracked everything I was listening to on radio and TV to make an extra 20 bucks. I was stocking up on lean cuisines when they were on sale too for five for $10, just so that I could create as much margin as I could to get out of debt. And so 18 months later, I got out of consumer debt. Later on in life, met my wife, we bought a house, we saved up a huge down payment and paid it off in 26 months. And so that's my story. And now I just want to shout from the rooftops. It's possible for you too, because I'm not special. And that's what's so important to realize. There's so many people in our generation,

like you said, that just feel like they got the wrong hand, that there's no way that our generation can build wealth. And you did it in 10 years. Like that is just such a shining example for everybody who thinks that it can't be done. And we're not talking, he didn't come here as a personality. He came as an intern. Like you started and you worked your way up. And I just think that is so incredible

and something our generation needs to hear that it can be done. And even though like we were talking about patience, it's like when you really zoom out, when you're in it, 10 years feels like a long time. Oh yeah. But when you really look at it, 10 years to go from $40,000 in debt to a baby steps millionaire, that is incredible.

Thank you. Well, I've always loved this quote. People underestimate what they can accomplish in a year. They underestimate what they can accomplish in a decade. And so it took having a long-term mindset and having a vision beyond what I'm doing this weekend. It was going, where do I want to be five years from now, 10 years from now? When do I want to retire? And I feel the empathy of people going, I don't want to work a job I hate for 60 years

just to hopefully retire like I saw my parents. We don't want that for you. That's why Ken Coleman's here to help you move from paycheck to purpose. And that's why we want you to invest early and get out of debt first so you have the margin to do it. But once you realize the system is designed to screw you over and that if you follow the trends, you're going to fall for the traps and that normal leads to nowhere, then we can go, okay, so what does it look like to rise above the system, to follow these baby steps and go, all right, we're going to get out of debt because that creates margin. We're going to have an emergency fund because then we don't need the credit card companies and buy now, pay later and all the traps out there and the HELOCs and the 401k loans.

We become the bank. And now we have margin to invest 15% and we still have margin to help our kids go to college debt free instead of seeing them in the shackles of student loan debt. And then we can pay off the house early. Then we can build wealth and give like no one else. And man, the freedom that comes with that, especially when you're in your 30s and you still have the next 30, 40, 50, 60 years of your life to just build wealth and give and have the freedom, which by the way is what everyone out there is after. They want margin.

They want options. They want freedom. They want meaning. And the way they think to get there is by following the crowd and following this toxic money culture that says debt is the path and all the wealthy people I meet, well, they said debt is the way they built their wealth. No, those people are either scheme salesmen with online courses telling you how to get rich quick, or they're entrepreneurs who make millions of dollars. And so them using a credit card does not equal this is what I should do. So for the average person like me, who just works a job, gets a salary, this is what you can do. So for the average person like me who just works a job, gets a salary, this is what you can do. Cut the debt out of your life, use the debit card, have the emergency fund,

invest for the future. And I love what Proverbs says about this. Wealth gained hastily will dwindle, but whoever gathers little by little will increase it. And it's just such a great reminder of delayed gratification and patience and going, you're right. I don't need to get rich quick tomorrow. I can just find a job I love to do and invest for the future and have money to go on vacations and leave an inheritance to my children's children. That's what this whole plan is about. So if you're listening out there and you're going, I don't know if it's possible for me. Listen, I don't care if you're in your 20s or 30s or 40s or 50s or 60s. If you can fog up a mirror, there is hope for you yet. But it starts with this moment

today where you go, I'm not going to keep living the way I've been living. I've got to do some things differently. And I want to leave that legacy. Yeah. So with all of the temptation, all of these, these things that are saying that it can't happen, like how do people keep the blinders on and stick with it for the long haul? Well, you control your inputs. You control the things that are being fed into your brain, whether that's the headlines, your favorite news network, your broke friends, the whole life insurance salesman

who is pretending to be your financial advisor. You have control over the voices that speak into your life. So if you have the wrong ones right now, get you some new ones. Go join a Financial Peace University class, cut the friend out of your life, turn off the news, stop doom scrolling Instagram, and finally get control once and for all and rise above this awful, awful toxic money culture. So good, George. Such a shining example. Well, thank you, Christina. It's been an honor hosting with you this hour. Thank you to all the folks in the booth. We got Austin, Ben, James, Connor, Zach, the whole gang's in there. And you, America, we'll be back before you know it right here

on The Ramsey Show. Hey, it's George Camel. If you like what you heard in this episode and want to know more about getting started on the Ramsey Baby Steps, go to ramseysolutions.com and click on the Get Started button. We'll help you figure out the best next step for you based on your specific situation. That's ramseysolutions.com and click Get Started.