The Ramsey Show - App - My Wife Is in the Dark About Our Financial Situation (Hour 1)

Episode Date: June 12, 2024

This is the Ramsey Show. Welcome aboard. We're here to help you win in your life, win with your money, win in your work, and win in your life, win with your money, win in your work, and win in your relationships. 888-825-5225 is the number. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me this hour, and she'll be taking the money questions. I'll jump in on the income questions related to your work.

You ready to go, Ms. Rachel? Oh, yeah, Ken. Summertime, summer, summer, summertime. Here we are. We are here. In June, living it up. And the weather could not be nicer in Middle Tennessee. A nod to our lovely studio audience out there, great looking people today from all around the country. So let's get to it. Michael's going to start us off in Columbus, Ohio. Michael, how can we help today? Hey, I'm pretty much drowning in debt. I'm 27 years old, and I got about $350,000 in my house that I owe and about $120,000 in eight different accounts that I'm owing.

And I'm just kind of trying to figure out what the best route is. I have a 401k loan. I have doctor bills. I have $8,000 in IRS. I have two personal loans, one auto loan, one travel trailer loan, and $20,000 on a credit card. Oh, my gosh. Okay. So how did you get here, Michael? What's kind of the backstory? What's

caused all this? I think previously, I didn't make much money. And then I got a job where I started making more money. So I just started spending more. And then I think it became a habit. And then I started trying to pay off my debt. So I started consolidating debt with a loan, paying that off or not paying it off, but consolidate it and then rack up all my credit cards and, you know, finance more stuff. And then I consolidated again. And I probably did that two or three times. But now I'm kind of, I'm right at the edge, I would say. Yeah, for sure.

I mean, it's, you're bumping, yeah, half a million dollars in debt, including a mortgage. So the consumer debt is what I would probably, what I want to talk to you about first and foremost, because this is where, are you behind on payments? No, I've been making payments, and I've tried, I'm pretty much minimum in all my payments other than one loan, which I was doing the snowball before. And then I pretty much fell off of that. And I'm just kind of I'm at a point where I'm just kind of like maxing out. Yeah. Yeah. I just try to figure out where is the basic beginning first steps are of this.

OK, I should be taken. What kind of what kind of career are you in now how much are you making uh i'm in uh energy and utilities for uh i'm alignment so i'm probably it kind of floats depending on over time but the last two years i made about 180 wow yeah. Income is great. There's no question you've got a good income and you've got some potential future here. This is getting control. Yeah, of you, Michael. I mean, that's what it is.

I'm like, it's a, and in your case, it is that classic example of people that have the issue, right, of debt, not controlling the behavior and thinking mathematically they can work their way out by getting into more debt with, you know, a different interest rate or, you know, trying to kind of move the puzzle pieces around. But at the end of the day, it's, yeah, it is you. And so, I mean, we can sit here for sure and kind of talk through some of this on a logistical side. But I think the head knowledge, I think you may have, Michael,

you said you were doing the snowball at one point. I think for you, there just has to be this I've had it moment and you just haven't had it yet. This could be it as we're talking and where you're at currently, why you called in. But there has to be enough pain in your present situation for change to occur. And and that's going to be my biggest thing with you, that there's going to be a plan, and it's going to be long and excruciating, and it's going to take a lot more hours that you're going to be working. It's going to be,

your life is going to look 180 degrees different than how it does today in order for you to get out of this. Are you committed to do that kind of change? Yeah, I think I am. I just had two kids. I have two under two. Oh, wow. I mean, I just had two kids. I have two under two. Oh, wow.

I mean, I can't be living like this. Yep, totally. What's your biggest need? I know what you started the call with, but what do you really need help with? I think Rachel just nailed you really well. So what is it that you really want from us today? What I want from y'all is to kind of help me figure out the best route I can do this. Ultimately, what I want is time with my family. I'm sick of working, you know, 60 to 80, 90 hour weeks. I want to get back down to 40, 50 hours a week and just be able to live on that. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So I love that. That's a good target. Yep, for

sure. So I think, Michael, you know, the debt snowball, like we talked about, because you listed out a lot of debts at the beginning of the call. So what I would want you to do is sit down and list all of those out, the total of them, and the smallest amounts, not payment, not interest rate, the smallest amount to the largest amount. So this could be in your credit cards, $20,000 of credit cards. If it's multiple credit cards, split those totals up, right? I mean, each credit card is its own debt. And list that out. And what I would say is I think getting quick wins for you guys, Michael,

is going to be huge. And I say you guys because your wife, are you married? Yes. Yeah. I mean, your wife has to be as committed as you are in this. Where is she at with everything? She's, to be honest, like I've been, she's a stay-at-home mom, and I've been, I would say she's more in the dark about everything.

I need to be more open with her. What's your spending situation? Are you guys spending way too much, or have you already started the process of tightening the belt? I believe I've been tightening the belt. She has been too. She doesn't know. She doesn't know how bad it is. By the way, in the way you said that, if this were a court of law, I'd be all over this as a lawyer. You just said, I have, which that tells me what's really going on. And Rachel just pointed it out. Yeah. So michael i think there's two big things as we leave this call because i don't think we're going to be able to solve all of this

in you know one segment here on the show um but two things i want you guys the biggest piece is going to be the relational piece michael and when you said that she's in the dark some you're gonna you're gonna have one of maybe the hardest conversation you've had in marriage thus far. And I want you to rip the bandaid off. And I want you to be a thousand percent honest down to the penny. And she's probably going to be pissed. She's going to probably feel a level of betrayal, a probably a level of I've been in the dark. How has this been happening?

And I had no clue. I mean, you're going to go through some crap, but that is one of the most beautiful things that can happen for you guys. I mean, honestly, because finally it's off of your plate, Michael, I can't imagine what you've been carrying around. I mean, the amount of stress and everything has been on you. And that's not to her fault. She doesn't know. But there's going to be something about bringing

all this to the lights, Michael, for you, instead of you trying to manage everything and pay the payments and do the thing, work extra and figure it out on your own, that you have a, and you guys can be a team in this. And it's going to be really hard. But I'm telling you, it's one of the best things that you guys can do together in your marriage. You may need some marriage counseling after this. I'm serious. Well, I was going to say, let's help them. Let's do every dollar premium. Well, I was going to do a couple things at the end. Oh, I'm sorry. I'm jumping ahead. I'm Kris Kringle over here. No, it's just the two things. So the the conversation michael with your wife is really important that's number one as we leave this call please do that number two you need some quick wins you had a car loan that maybe you may just

need to sell the car get a quick win on that do the math if you can't pay it off in 12 months get rid of the car there was some kind of trailer loan or something if you sell that like you guys need some momentum starting and some of the best ways you can do that is sell stuff that you have debt on. So do those things, but also stay on the line because Chris Kringle, what are we going to give Michael today? Every dollar. We're going to get you an FPU. And also I want to line you up with one free coaching session with one of our financial coaches. This'll be therapy 101 and kind of get the therapy process potentially started, but a real coach is going to walk you through how you guys walk out of this going forward.

You guys can do it, Michael. Hang on the line. We'll take care of you. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. We are here for you to answer your questions about your money, your work, your relationships. And I'm Ken Coleman and Rachel Cruz joins me. The phone number is 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225. Lindsay is going to join us now right here in our neck of the woods, Nashville, Tennessee. Lindsay, how can we help

today? Hi, thank you for taking my question. I am writing in with a relationship money question, actually. So back in college, my parents loaned me about $18,000 to go to college. It was $15,000 in principal and $3,000 in interest to help me pay for college under the agreement that I would pay it off within three years of graduation. Fortunately, I was able to do that. But after listening to many, many episodes of your guys' show, I feel a little bit, you know, taken advantage of. And my question is, is it worth expressing my feelings to my parents now, despite the loan being paid back? Or do I just accept the lesson, don't borrow from family and try to do better with my own kids going forward? Okay, I'll start because I think I represent my colleague here.

I don't know that we can answer that question without understanding why it is you think they took advantage of you. Based on what you've laid out right now, it doesn't sound like they took advantage of you. So what are we missing that makes you feel like they took advantage of you? Correct. So I knew the full amount when I signed for it. You know, they told me things like, you can go get a loan from a bank, but God forbid something happened while you're paying them back. You know, we're your parents. We would be much more understanding of that situation should it present itself. And I guess it's the whole charging interest thing that I guess doesn't sit right. Okay, another question. You've paid this all back, as I understand it, correct?

Correct, yes. When did the tension arise over the interest? In the middle of it, before you started paying it back, or after you got done with it? Paying the whole thing. More so after I got done with it. How long after you got done with it? Paying the whole thing? More so after, yeah, more so after I got done with it, you know. How long after you got done with it? It was about a year after. What changed? What changed? So, I'm digging here on purpose. Rachel, thank you for giving me a little leeway here. It's a fair question. It's a very fair question. So, let me explain it to the audience and to you one time,

and then I want you to answer this. So you paid it back. You paid back the full $18,000 and about three grand of it was the interest. Is that what I'm understanding? I was $18,000 and three of it was interest. That's what I'm saying. So okay, so you paid it all back, all right? And a year after you paid it back, at some point, at some day, a year after you paid it back, this started to bother you. So that tells me something happened. What happened, or dare I ask, who happened? So I got married a year after, a little over a year after I graduated college, and my husband and I were talking about it, and he was shocked that they charged me interest

and thought it was horrible that a parent would charge a child interest on a loan. And you believed him all of a sudden. Yes. Had it occurred to you before his comment that that might be a horrible, despicable thing in someone else's eyes? Be honest. Sure. It had occurred to you?

You're telling me at some point you were like, I appreciate what my parents are doing, but I think this is a little, this is a bit shady. No, no, no, no. Sorry, sorry. I misunderstood your question. I know. I'm playing lawyer. I watch too many television shows. Here's my point. The husband said this, and because of his understandable influence on you, and probably just by his sheer reaction, which he, by the way, has every right to his opinion, this totally shifted

everything. So I'm going to get out of the way and let Rachel weigh in, but I'm going to tell you my opinion now. I've gotten everything I need to know. Okay. So my opinion is it's too late and I don't think there was any tension or resentment at all until your hubs opened his mouth. He has every right to open his mouth. He has every right to opine on what your parents did.

I don't like how he said it because I think he should have been wiser and more mature. And if he was on the phone, I'd tell him this. He has every right to his opinion, but he's now created some tension and resentment after the fact and only from his point of view. And so for that reason, no, I don't think you should bring it up to your parents. And I think you need to figure out how to process this. Maybe it's therapy. But to create tension now, to me, seems foolish. Yeah, I think what's hard for me, Lindsay, where it does not feel like they took advantage of you is because everything was up front. If you had called, and we've had these calls of people called they said oh my gosh

we pulled my credit report after i got married to buy a house and i had a student loan on there my parents took out a loan i remember signing papers at 18 but they never told me you know that's deceitful uh people parents that um that loan with strings attached that we'll give you this money maybe for a down payment on a house but you guys have to live this close to us. We have to see the grant. You know, there's strings attached in relationships. It's kind of gross. Like this sounds like, even though we're not for,

you're exactly right, we are not for family members loaning money, period. But the way they did it, Lindsay, it sounded very clear, very upfront. And the reason they did it from what I hear is they did it from a situation that a it's less risk with the loan being held to them it was not a hey we're gonna give you a deal we're gonna charge you and now if the three if the three thousand dollars um was unreasonable

interest right if they're charging you 50 interest and they're taking advantage of you that's gross and weird but did they do that they pulled the average interest rate and they just said, hey, just do the loan with us. Because if something happens, their words, we can give you grace period. It won't hurt you financially. That's a very good point. That's the reason they did it. It wasn't a mathematical, you're going to get a deal from us. We're going to give you this half off. So Lindsay, I don't think they took advantage of you. I think you knew exactly what you were signing up for. And I think that the reason they did it was so that a bank wasn't involved, but it wasn't a financial deal on their end.

It was just a, hey, here's this. Did they charge you the going rate on interest? I mean, Rachel brings us a very good point here. Well, no. So it would have been about, what is that? 20% maybe? It was $1,000 for every $5,000 that I borrowed from them. Okay. All right. Yeah, so that's a little bit, that's a little high. Are your parents super tight? Yes, very. Okay. So I actually, I'm glad you brought this up, Rachel. Sorry, I know I was diving in a little bit. Not truly interrupting because I don't like that. Go, Ken, go. Okay.

Well, I personally wouldn't charge my kid interest. And again, we don't loan our kids money. Right. Nor am I going to. Right. But I'm trying to put myself into this. Sure, sure. So remember the little classic, we tell you what we would do?

Okay, we wouldn't do it. But if I'm sticking myself in, I think it's a little tight. I think it's a little tight i think it's a little tight sure but they didn't do anything but take advantage is a really strong language i don't like that language feels like it was deceitful and i don't think they did i am gonna say though lindsey i so i have another follow-up question i can't wait for rachel to get involved in this potentially so the timeline for all of our viewers and listeners here quick review. It was a year after you paid it off that hubs and you have the conversation. He gets, he gets upset and it affects you. How much time between that first moment where he makes the comment and this phone call today, how much time has passed? Uh, years. We've been married for

almost three years. Oh, wow. That really concerns me. I was very intrigued by this so here we are are you saying three years ago is when he first got alarmed and you started questioning this deal three years ago yes all right yeah so you've been sitting on this for three years and it's the loan's been paid off for three years as well four loans been paid i got i'm sorry i'm sewing the timeline here the question is, Rachel, doesn't that concern you? I'm very concerned. Concerned? What do you mean that she's just resenting?

This resentment is just boiling up. And she's calling us, and I'm glad you called us. Stop talking about it. Get over it. I would release it, Lindsay. I really would. I think that, yes, they're probably cheap to a degree. Probably.

Yeah, they're cheap. They're big time cheap. But they didn't do anything deceitful. You knew exactly what you were signing up for. And so I think it's one of those things that, again, thankfully you have the money to pay them back and all of it, but the deal is like this is another reason, right, why we don't loan money.

So I'm glad you've been watching the show, Lindsay, because you're exactly right. I would do this because it does feel weird. And not only does it feel weird because you owe your parents money when we talk about that, but it's also weird in this situation when you look back and you're like oh gross i don't like how that felt so like all of that is standard and this is the ramsey show welcome back to the ramsey show all folks. If you are debt-free, you're walking through the baby steps and you're going, man, I got to learn how to turn that corner, Rachel,

from that gazelle intensity that you really need for one through three. To enjoy life. And you start to go, and we get these calls all the time. People are going, I mean, I did it. I got to learn how to spend money. We get those calls every week. then then i've got an idea i've got an idea for you baby steps four through seven people who's a new idea are you are you coming up with this on the spot ken no no i see what you did there no but but but i'm saying some of you are going i need to learn

how to transition from gazelle intensity to actually living like no one else. So I got an idea. What if you went on a cruise with me and Rachel and Dave and John Deloney and George Campbell and Jade Warshaw and some of our friends, and you went to places like Turks and Caicos? And then after you did that, you went to St. Thomas. And then we got to go to Puerto Rico. Yeah. Hello.

And then while you're there. U.S. territory. And then you're down there. Thomas and then we got to go to Puerto Rico yeah hello and then while you're there territory and then you're down there let's go to the Bahamas and so I'm sitting next to the Bahama mama herself you got a little tan going on I noticed today we went to the beach last week yeah okay I thought you had a little more color thanks and so this cruise is actually a thing we're going on a cruise y'all we are doing are doing, it's called Live Like No One Else Cruise. It's seven days, all of those locations. We're going. Rachel will be there bronzed up.

I mean, she'll be ready to go. All of her Walmart, beach gear, all of the things. Are you going to have like a special Instagram? This is my cruise outfit. I'll tell you my outfit. Rachel Cruz cruises. There you go. That's good. I'm really working it here.

You're known for this. If people don't follow you on Instagram, you always have these deals. Yeah. Well, if I find a good deal personally, I'm like, yeah, I'll share it out. And I'm getting fed up. Can I tell you I'm getting fed up with it? Because I love your outfits. You know this. You love the way you do it. But every time you got a deal. It's not every time. I feel like every time I see you now. It's once or twice a week. People love it. You know this. You love the way you're... But every time you got a deal... It's not every time.

I feel like every time I see you now... It's once or twice a week. It feels like a little bit. People love it. Hey, listen. I'm kidding. The ladies out there appreciate it. First of all, I'm kidding. I know.

But I am jealous that you're always got this new deal. Thanks. Thanks, Kim. Well, but the new deal is happening right now with this cruise, you guys. March 22 through 29. Of 2025. So it's a $600 deposit to secure your cabin. And again, we're going to hang out.

It's going to be a week-long cruise. It's going to be a ship full of people that have lived like no one else. We're speaking. We're going to do Q&A. We're going to be hanging out. And I just secured this new thing right before we came back on the air. Rachel's a reader. And I love this about her.

She loves to read. She loves to go on the air, Rachel's a reader. And I love this about her. She loves to read. She loves to go on the gram and talk about her books. I think I convinced her to have a little book club on one of the decks. Every afternoon at 2 o'clock. I told her, I said, I'm excited to have a cocktail in the afternoon with a good thriller book on the deck of the boat. Would you be willing to read to people? I got to see.

Like maybe one chapter from the latest book Rachel reads. I think it would be a huge hit on the fourth deck, say around 2 o'clock. I bring 20 copies, hand out. Cocktails and copies of books. There you go. You just do one chapter. You hand out a chapter, and they sit, and everyone reads it. So you never know what's going to happen on this cruise.

You never know. You never know. We're a good time. I'm trying to get her to agree to do that. And we're a good time. Eddie Cullen will be there, too. I see him in the control room uh so here we go here are the dates march 22 22 rather through 29 2025 600 bucks right now secures your deposit yeah just as the deposit yeah sorry everybody's like 600 yeah that's the deposit that secures your cabin it's a nice cruise ship too and it's very nice

we saw pictures the other day uh the website to book and by the way it will sell out uh ramsay solutions.com slash cruise couldn't be any easier ramsay solutions.com slash cruise some of the suites are sold out already they are um is there gonna be any karaoke by any way by any chance oh i'm sure that's a classic cruise situation i will not be i will not be uh i think he's like half the week okay yeah darn so he's gonna come for a bit very exciting ramsey solutions.com slash cruise move on it now you want to go and plan that trip boy it is going to be a lot of fun and i and i look at those destinations by the way turks and caco st thomas Puerto Rico, the Bahamas I've been to all but one oh I've never been the Turks okay I don't know if I have either so a lot of fun yeah primo destination uh should be a lot of fun and uh we'll see there'll be more surprises I'm sure and fun stuff happening all the time I for one I'm going to show up for the book club

on the deck with you good spy novel. Deck E on the starboard side. Starboard. Don't know what any of that means. I should wear a sailor outfit one day just for fun. Like one of those old school ones with the shorts. No? Ken's going to have too much fun on this cruise. Kelly, the producer's terrified right now. Let's move to the calls to help

her come out of her catonic state there. Sage is up in Austin, Texas. Sage, how can we help? Hi, sir. It's a pleasure to talk to you. Good to talk to you. What's going on? So my question is about getting into debt responsibly. We own our home, we have a mortgage, and we also have a three-year-old son who is on the autism spectrum. He's a really good boy except for his diagnosis, and he has a problem with escaping.

He's a really good escape artist. He's gotten out of the house multiple times. We fixed that. We put locks everywhere on every window and whatnot. But now the issue is we'll be in the front yard with him, and it'll be like my father, my husband, something like that. You know, we're just playing a normal game. And then out of nowhere, he'll just bolt. He'll go right into that busy street or I'll turn around and he'll quietly try to creep away to walk over to his friend's house. And we, we all, we always catch up. Well, almost always. Um, there was, there was a couple of times that there was one

time actually that he was brought back by a police officer and that was very heartbreaking and very traumatic it's a dangerous situation so we want to install a fence in our front yard and we know that a lot of families especially children have to have safety fences it's almost

like a necessity but it's also really expensive. It's about $5,000, and I want to—I don't want to go into debt, but I would put it on the credit card. But I'm also a Christian, so it's said that we're supposed to be in debt to no man, and I'm wondering, what's the responsible thing to do here? Well, we're not going to tell you to put it on a credit card. I'll give it to Rachel here pretty quickly.

I just want to point out as a father, I'm putting myself in your shoes. This is not easy. And you've got a lot of hoops that you have to jump through and a lot of safety precautions. But if I was in your shoes, I would not put anything, any debt on this. I would not do this.

I would not go into debt to debt on this. I would not do this. We're not going to debt to build a $5,000 fence because he's always looking to get out. And even with the fence, you're still going to have to watch him because it's not going to be long before he's old enough to figure out how to get out of the fence. And at this point, I would not, if I was going to take my kid outside, I would go, when we go outside, we're on high alert here. We're not doing what normal people do. We always are. Well, but my point is, is then he shouldn't be running away if we're on high alert. And the fence is a part of the fix.

It's not the fix. But I think you guys could save up $5,000. You could sell stuff to come up with $5,000 pretty quick. But until then, I wouldn't be out in the front yard with him. Or the yard, period. Rachel, is that harsh? Yeah no no front yard in the spring no front yard in the summer i mean i mean say you guys where are you guys at financially do you have any savings yes ma'am we do we have a little bit in savings how much about i think savings. Okay. Do you guys have debt? No debt, you said?

Yes. Yes, we have a mortgage, and that is $204,000. The reason why I was thinking about putting it on a credit card is we got this offer. No, no, ever. No. I just don't even touch it. Yeah, no. And I wouldn't.

I wouldn't, Sage. I would take part of your $3,000, but you guys need to be building that up even more how much you guys make a year uh he makes forty thousand a year forty thousand okay so yeah i mean i i wouldn't i mean you called the ramsey show i'm we're not going to tell you to go into debt um over anything it's a pretty black and white issue here on this show especially and and that is a there's a spiritual element to that i mean you mentioned being a christian it's not a sin. Debt is not a sin. You can still go to heaven

if you charge it on this credit card, right? I mean, it's not a sin issue, but it's this idea that, yes, there is a spiritual, emotional component to debt that is very real. And then there's also just the financial side. And you guys, you don't have the money to afford this right now.

And I think that this is a wake-up call too. And I've had friends with similar diagnosis with children and it's terrible. It's heartbreaking. It's so difficult. But to know Sage in the future, you guys need to be really, maybe you working extra, you working some,

you guys need a good emergency fund in place because there's going to be tools that you guys are going to need to tap into for him in the future. And offense is just the starting point. But no, I would not get in the habit of going into debt for this stuff. I would save, pay up, and just know that there's going to be further expenses for him in the future. This is The Ramsey Show.

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. The lovely, the talented, the gracious Rachel Cruz joins me this hour. 888-825-5225. If I'm going to be co-hosting with you, it just occurred to me, I looked in the monitor, I'm going to have to get out in the sun. I feel like we're a fair, similar shade. Not to me, but I feel like a little extra pale, but you over here getting the vitamin D these days. Let's go to Jill, who is in Grand Rapids, Michigan. Jill, how can we help?

Hey, thanks for taking my call today. It's great to talk to you guys. You too. What's happening? Well, I have a question, and I kind of wanted you guys to weigh in on a little debate in our family. Oh, we love getting in the middle of debates. We love a debate. Yes. Well, this love getting in the middle of debates. We love a debate. Yes. Well, this is going to be kind of a fun one. So my daughter is 22 and she just graduated from

college with some student loan debt. And about a year ago, she was able to get on the pre-sale and buy three tickets for her, my older daughter, and myself to go to a Taylor Swift concert in Indianapolis this coming November. Now, hold on, Jill. Jill, I need to warn you. Before you go any further in setting this question to debate up, I am sitting next to quite arguably one of the biggest Swifties I've ever met. I don't know if I'm the biggest.

That I've met. Well, then I met the right person oh no okay my daughter has the right person okay keep going keep going okay so you know we had this back and forth over the phone as because she was um tried to buy the tickets you know and it's this fast furious thing when you're trying to buy them at on the you know their actual sale date and anyway she was able to get them and we got them for like 209 dollars a piece wow is that hold on hold on is that a good deal that's a fabulous deal like the resell the resell on some total splurge i thought that was such a splurge you know it is relative to the way you see money people were spending thousands of resale. Okay, $209 each? I'm just keeping score.

Right. Okay, keep going. All right. And Rachel just said it, right? So now I'm seeing these resale prices. Oh, it's crazy. Oh, it's crazy. It's insane.

Yeah. And so I told her, like, look, you know, we we're trying to I know where you're going with this Jill to pay down why don't you why don't we sell those tickets and we knock out so much you know but the practical mom comes out of me right like why don't we sell those tickets and you can knock down so much of your student loan but but you'd be so far ahead, you know? And she says, absolutely, it's non-negotiable. It's a bucket list item. She's like, probably you, Rachel, a swifty, and this is, you know.

And it's her money, right? Yes, and no, it was my money. Oh, okay. It was my money. I paid for them. But, you know, I mean, this is, and for me, too, I'm looking at, like, you know, she's iconic. I would love to go to her concert. And, you know, my daughter, of all the people that she could take, she wants to take her sister and me.

You know, I mean, that's great. It's going to be a fun thing. Oh, my gosh. Rachel's heart is breaking. I am so looking forward to it. I'm so looking forward to this. Okay, so hold on. All right, stop.

Again, practical mom. I know. I'm going to be practical. You ready? Here we go. Let's start breaking to this. Okay, so hold on. All right, stop. Again, practical mom. I know. I'm going to be practical. You ready? Here we go. Let's start breaking this down. Okay. It's 209 times 3, okay?

So I got $627 if my math is... But if she resells on what was... No, no, no. We're not to resell yet. So you spent $627. Correct. What would your take be? Rachel, now walk us through. What do you think you could make on these tickets?

Okay. So I just like briefed it today before the call. And like, okay, so we're in the 200 level of seats, right? You know, so good seats. Good. 600 level seats, like nosebleeder seats, just sold for like two2,000 a piece. 400 level, $3,000 a piece. And there are some 100 level that just sold for $4,700 a ticket. So we're easily talking about $4,000 easy. I'm thinking they would average out between $3,000, $4,000 easy. Yeah, per ticket. Per ticket.

I get it. Uh-huh, uh-huh. And where would the money – and so if we did that, and so we would be netting, let's go $3,500 a ticket to be modest. And so what are you looking at? $10,500? $10,000. $10,500. How much is the student loan debt?

Yeah. What's it going to? $24,000. So her student loan debt is $24,000? Correct. And that's what you would want to put the money towards absolutely 100 of it will go to there all right and you initially invested 627 dollars that is correct and the only reason that you can that that you can net let's just call it 10 let's call it shy of just shy of 10 grand, is because you bought these tickets. Would you be putting $9,000 plus towards her student loan if you hadn't bought these tickets?

I would not. All right. I'm going somewhere. I think, well, I don't care what anybody says. I wouldn't resell these tickets. What? Are you shocked at his response, Rachel? Yes, Jill.

This is the Holy Spirit moving. No, no. Let me tell you what. Right in front of your eyes. Dare I say why? She wouldn't have put that money. Here's the deal, Jill. You weren't planning to cut a check for $9,500 to put on your here's the deal jill you weren't planning to to cut a check for nine

thousand five hundred dollars to put on your daughter's student loan ever i was not so my whole point is this is like a windfall right if i if nine thousand five hundred dollars fell into my lap i might do that i get it but this is your daughter's and it's a once in a lifetime concert oh yeah i agree you go jill go to the concert i agree well you were just shocked at I get it, but this is your daughter's, and it's a once-in-a-lifetime concert. Oh, yeah. I agree. You go, Jill. Go to the concert. I agree. Oh, you were just shocked at what I said, or was that fake?

Because I was so thankful that we were together on the same team, that our opinions lined up. I thought you were going to be Scrooge. Tell Olivia, please tell Olivia that we're going to the concert. Oh, Olivia, you get to go to the Taylor Swift concert. And she has the new Torture Poets. She has her new torture poets uh she has her new album she has a whole new sets a whole new thing yeah i i just i mean i i will tell you this and it's fan i have a set list playlist and jill it's fantastic i went i went to two i went to two i went to the national one and then i flew my husband out to seattle with me to go to the other one. No kidding. Listen, I...

It's really good. I'm looking forward to it. It's so fun. I just... Here's why I'm saying that. You weren't going to do this anyway, and I think your daughter said absolutely no way, and I think it creates an unnecessary tension. She's 22.

She needs to pay the thing off herself anyway. There's a lot of reasons. I want our audience to know I'm not just... I just think when I look at something like this, this is about the emotional, not the financial. And could you go to a Taylor Swift concert in the future? Yes, you could. But I think you're looking at this and you're going, oh my gosh, and who wouldn't consider the resale value? Believe me, I would be thinking about it, but it comes down to it. I'll just say this. This is a personal anecdote. I'm no Swifty. She doesn't particularly do anything for me at all, but I have

a 15-year-old daughter. And when my wife and I were in Europe last year for our 25th anniversary, we got a text from Sweet Josie and she had gotten invited the night before to Taylor Swift's concert at the Titans football stadium. And it was, and so we were like, of course you can go have fun. It was a gift from her friend's dad, blah, blah, blah. All right. So we returned from Europe. And one of the first things I asked my daughter was tell me about that night and to see her describe that night. And then I had a friend six weeks later who worked for Taylor Swift's merch company it was a new friend we had cigars and I say really you work for Taylor Swift blah blah blah he goes yeah do you want some merch for your daughter I was like if you would make me dad of the year he put a bag

and I mean giant bag of Taylor Swift was it era's tour stuff the latest tour on my front porch and here's here's the story you for the audience for giving me a little latitude. When I walked in my house, Kelly, and said, Josie, come downstairs. I got a surprise for you. And I told her the story. I didn't buy this. This is from a friend of mine. She cried when she began to open up hoodies, long sleeve tees, t-shirts. And I said to myself, I don't get it, but I get it. So my advice here is everything will be all right if we just keep dancing like we're 22. Your daughter's 22! She is.

It's perfect. I don't know about you, but I'm feeling 22. I had to pull the lyrics up. I cheated. And she will not be down bed praying at the gym now. So we're going. Yeah. This is what happens when Dave goes out of town. This is the show that we

all needed, America. This is it. This is the segment we all needed. You know, you can't be grumpy Grandpa Dave in this situation. Jill, this is bucket list. Make memories with your two daughters. And then she needs to pay off that debt. She needs to pay off the loan. She needs to pay it off but tell her to get to it man she's just getting through to get the tickets was hard enough jill knew the lyrics this is Take care.