The Ramsey Show - App - My Wife Kept This Secret for Two Years (Hour 1)

Episode Date: May 28, 2024

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is the Ramsey Show. It's where we help you win in your life. Winning in your money, winning in your relationships, and winning at work is the goal. We can help you do that. 888-825-5225 is the phone number. That's 888-825-5225. I'm Ken Coleman. Dr. John Deloney joins me this hour, and we team up to help you. So the money questions, the relationship questions, the mental health questions, the work questions, all of it is open for you. 888-825-5225. Let's get started in Grand Rapids, Michigan. And Josh is going to kick us off this hour. Josh, how are you doing? Good. How are you?

Good. What's going on? Yeah. So I was sent in this message the other day, probably get some feedback on it. And yeah, my wife and I have been married for about three years now. And we decided when we got pregnant with our first kid, that she'd be a stay at home mom. I was able to financially support that all as well. And then a year into our marriage, when she stopped working,

found out she had about $60,000 in student debt that she was paying on. So, um, that's awkward, huh? Yeah. Yeah. So with that being said, um, it's a private loan and we're three years into our marriage. Second kids here, um, just bought a house cause it was cheaper to do so than renting with where we're at. And now I'm kind of feeling the push and pull of having her get a job because what was a 2% interest rate is now a 10% interest rate because it's a variable loan. And she co-signed on that loan with her mom. So I'm feeling a bit of obligation to keep these payments up and active,

even though it's pulling quite a bit from our monthly income. Hey, bro, you're playing at the periphery here. This isn't the main issue. The main issue is the woman you dedicated your life to and said, I do too, lied to you and had a huge debt and you were making decisions and y'all were moving full steam ahead with one version of your life, not knowing there was another version. Have you dealt with that? We call it financial infidelity around here. And we use that level of, um, that depth of language because it's that serious. Yeah.

So have you dealt with it? Have you, yeah. Have y'all dug into that? Yeah, we're working on it. So, like, it's been two years now since this came to light. Why did you go buy a house on top of that then well with our second kid we were paying about fifteen hundred dollars a month with for a two-bedroom apartment and now our mortgage is only fourteen hundred um yeah but you traded a hundred bucks a month for what yeah we were wanting to upsize. There you go.

That's what you wanted. Yeah, and you came up with a math problem that achieved what you wanted. Here's the deal. Y'all are not trafficking in reality. You're just not. Okay. And until you get to the bottom of, okay, we have a new $60,000 debt we have to pay off

because your mother-in-law is not going to pay it off. Right. And it's 10%, which is an astronomical rate. Yeah, pretty gnarly. Yeah. So I don't know that you can afford for your wife to stay at home because of the choices she made and then lied about to you. And now you all set yourself further back by having a home because you all want to continue to perpetuate this fantasy. You can't afford this house, but you got it. And so now you got it.

And so y'all have to make some hard decisions in the short term, especially for the next few years and rewrite this ship. Right now y'all are taking on water and you're just pretending that you're not. And you are, you're taking on water relationally. You're taking on water in your trust. You don't trust her as far as you can see her. And then you're taking on water with the finances, man. And you had this picture of this stay-at-home mom these two kids this house and you borrowed your way to it but you're in a mess so uh josh two years this happened two

years ago and you call us today glad you called us by the way we want to dive into this but but john's making a very very good point here i think you're at the end of your rope or pretty darn close to it. You decided to call us today. This was two years ago, and you chuckled when John pressed you. So I'm just kind of repeating back to you what we're seeing here. So where is this deal? Is she not willing to go back to work? Is there still a huge amount of tension in this?

Give us the real, real where you stand today before you dialed the phone number. Yeah. So I've been kind of pressing her to find employment again and start working again. How's that going? It's been very, pretty lackadaisical for the past six months. Yeah. So you don't trust her and then now you're really frustrated at her because she's not pulling her weight in your opinion to help out with this undisclosed rock that she uh revealed around your neck right okay are you talking to her when you sit down with her are you talking to her in financial terms hey we have this many bills and we have this much money i need you to get make a job get a job that makes this much money.

Or have you talked to her about, hey, we have to build a new marriage because what we had was a farce. It wasn't real. And we have to build something new. And part of building something new is reestablishing trust together. And here's what I'm going to need to trust you again.

I need you to be on the same team with me and build something new together. And there's a financial component to that, but I'm terrified that we're going to keep drowning in this mess. But if you just keep approaching her with a spreadsheet, yeah. How are you talking to her about this? I'm very like futuristic because I want to be debt-free as soon as possible and trying to get on the same like hey we have things we can look forward to but this is like a ball and chain the 60 grand so she doesn't feel that she no

no she thought so little that grand, she didn't even bother to tell you about it. Yeah, it's almost like Josh and John. It's a question for both of you here. Did she withhold that intentionally or was it just literally a, well, whatever? Well, when she started staying at home, we had switched our finances to a local bank, and then I started seeing these automatic withdrawals of $500, $600 a month. And I confronted her about it, and then that's when it came to the attention that this is my student loan. Yeah, but what I'm saying is, did she do this intentionally?

Or do you think it was just kind of a, well, whatever, I don't even worry about it, so I don't bring it up? Yeah, I don't think it was intentional. What do you think? I feel like it is. Dude, you can't hide $60,000 to a guy who's like intent on being debt-free. Right. Right? Right.

I think you came in and you're like, dude, I'm never going to borrow money. We're going to be debt-free. And she went, whoopsie-doo. That's what I think. And got quiet about it. And maybe she didn't outright lie and say i don't have any debt either but she sure didn't say well hey i've got a sixty thousand dollar uh rock on a chain around my neck all right doc that music means we gotta hurry what are you prescribing here i think he's got to sit down and be real honest with her i think he needs to take 24 hours

and write down what he's scared about and write down how just how angry he is and how much he doesn't trust her. And then with compassion, he has to sit down and say, here's where we really are. Will you build something new with me? And hope she says yes. Yeah. And Josh, I'm not clinically trained, but I got a lot of common sense. And that last question we went through with you is you got to start to acknowledge that you feel like she did lie to you and you need to stop covering that up so you can heal from it with what John is saying you need to do. Thanks for the call, man. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Dr. John Deloney joins me this hour. The phone number is 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225.

Before we get back to the phones, we want to stay here for a minute. John and I were talking during the break, talking to the crew, and that last call, very interesting. If you're just joining us, very quick review, and then we're going to step into something. It's something we want to hear from you, the audience. So if you're watching via YouTube podcast, you can comment on this. Okay, so our last call, guy finds out two years into the marriage that his wife has sixty thousand dollars worth

of student loan debt does not mention it she does not mention it in the dating relationship in the engagement and only mentions it after he finds out when they change banks that there's a withdrawal to the tune of five, six hundred bucks a month coming out. So Kelly's sitting in for James today, our fearless leader, and she's amazing. She gave me some data. A recent poll found that 40 percent, John, of Americans have ended a relationship because of financial missteps, bonehead moves, obviously maybe some financial infidelity, as you called it, as we've called it here on the show for a long time. So 40% have ended a relationship.

So to the audience, we're going to do one step here. This is fun. We have, I don't know, close to 50, 60 people in the lobby this afternoon. Show of hands, if the answer is yes, would you end a relationship over poor financial decisions? If yes, raise your hand. Everybody's freaking out. There's some people and they're like, well, I'm married right now. So only two, oh, three. We have the third person. Okay. So, all right, John, relationship guy. I mean, it feels like a huge chunk of your show is always relationship questions.

What do you think first about the 40% of Americans ending a relationship over finance? Is that piece of data? What does that say to you? I have to believe it's because they weren't honest about their financial issues. Yeah. Or they, yeah, secretly bet the farm on Dogecoin. What about just not seeing things eye to eye um i mean i think it depends like i have to have a seventy thousand dollar new truck i just

started a lawn business all right and someone might say that guy's financially irresponsible well that's that's a much bigger picture just gets cast on financial irresponsibility um we hear all the time on the show, I don't want to get married yet until Ken's paid off his student loans. Well, I think that's dumb. Yeah, I agree with that. Both my wife and I married somebody with student loans, each other, right?

And then we partnered together to knock those things out. Same thing with Stacey now, yeah. So that isn't a reason. Having debt is not a reason to not continue into a relationship it is how what is this person's relationship with money and integrity and i can imagine somebody looking at somebody and saying i want to build a future with them and the way they do life is not

going to end up in a good future and so the way they're spending money the way they're um being dishonest about money the way they always got a scheme or a scam about money. Yeah. I can see ending a relationship over that. I absolutely would. I don't think you end a marriage over it because you should have done your homework before the marriage. Right. But certainly, yeah, if you're dating someone and you're thinking about it.

I mean, I know that I've been on calls when I've co-hosted this show where I've sat there and listened. And one of the money personalities is kind of going through the thing. And I'm sitting over here just biting my tongue, waiting, waiting, waiting, waiting, waiting. And then I go, I'm going to tell you something, man. This needs to be solved now. Because if you guys can't get on the same page financially, this is going to eat your marriage up. You agree with that? A hundred percent. That's a full stop.

Yeah. We can't get on the same page about that. But I think it always comes back to what the old man says, what Dave says. It's just a symptom, that's right um if i mean i could get mad at you for how you just spent your like our your paycheck or borrowing money that's just a symptom of i can't trust you right that's a relationship killer that you got to deal with that's exactly right that's where you don't tell the truth that's a relationship killer right yeah yeah so what say you uh certainly for those of you on the youtubes if you want to jump in and comment on it what do you think i feel bad for that guy by the way just kind of revisiting

that in fact actually just real quick i want to come back to that so because you know we're digging a lot we didn't you could tell he was holding back you gave him some some action he's trying to honor his wife he was better yet he's trying not to dishonor his wife. 100%. And she lied to his face. Yeah. But this is, just real quick, coming back to you, I mean, this is not a financial issue.

This is a marriage issue first and foremost. It's an integrity issue. They've got to get that figured out. Right. And it just feels like maybe she doesn't think it's that big of a deal. Now, we're only getting one side of it. Yeah. So speak to that

because there's always two sides to that yeah that couple comes in and sits with you where are you starting well i'm starting with what what was it about this relational dynamic that you felt like you had to go into the rest of your life with this secret a thinking he's so dumb he's not ever going to know you're just going to secretly pay off 60 grand right siphon off 60 grand from the household budget um and bigger than that when he when you hear him talking about how important being debt-free and how much having freedom in your home is at what point did you like what was it about that dynamic you didn't bring it up yeah are you a terrible person or is he unsafe um what's going on here? I'd start there. And then you find a lot out about their dynamic,

like what's safe, what's not, what kind of jerk this guy is or how great he is or how ashamed she feels or who knows what. I thought it was very telling that he's calling us after two years. Oh, he's at a breaking point. He chuckled and said, we're working on it. They're not working on it? No, not at all. And I think that's, again, it's easy if they broke up today it would be quote unquote because of the money

yeah it's not it that's right it's because she deceived him about the money and then would not participate in making it right yeah right it's like somebody who cheats on their spouse and then says okay to re-establish trust I need to see your phone every day. I ain't looking at my phone. Right? That's the issue there. I have no interest in making this thing better. Good stuff there. I hate that, man.

Phone number's 888-825-5225. A lot of stuff revolving around money, and it's not always just the money issue. Let's go to Michelle now, who's waiting for us in Cincinnati, Ohio. Michelle, how can we help? Hi. Thank you so much for taking my call. Sure, what's up? My mom unfortunately passed away unexpectedly in February. So sorry about that. Thank you. Me too. And I have come into a sizable inheritance. I'm the only kid, and she wasn't married when she passed.

So it's more money than I've ever seen. How much? About $1.5 million split across different avenues. So there's $440 in investments. Okay, $440 in investments. There's $600 that,000 in investments. Okay, $440,000 in investments. Okay. There's $600,000 that's in life insurance money. That's just right now sitting in an interest-bearing account until I know what to do with it. Okay.

And then there's $350,000 that is going to come from selling her house, which I'm in the process of doing now. That's what you'll net? Yep. Okay. So what you'll net? Yep. Okay. So what's your question? We've got about two minutes, so we want to make sure we get to your key question. My question is, my goal is to invest most of the money, but currently my husband and I have a mortgage sitting at $307,000 and it's at a three and a quarter interest rate. And I was wondering if you would advise that I take some of the inheritance money and completely pay off

our mortgage because that's our only remaining debt. Yes, instantly. What was your mom's name? Okay. Loretta. Loretta. So imagine yourself having a cup of coffee with Loretta this morning and here in Nashville, it was kind of cool, it was kind of chilly, and it was beautiful out. And you smile at Loretta, at your mom, and you say, hey, mom, you know that money you left me? I don't owe anybody else anything on our house ever. We're free because of you.

Would Loretta pound the table and go, how dare you pay off your house? Or would she smile and say, yes. Yeah, she would definitely smile. I think that this money was set up, you know, so that I would be set up and I just want to make sure I'm, you know, doing the right thing with it. Well, yes. And let's look practically, if I heard you right, you got $600,000 from her life insurance policy that's sitting in a money market or interest bearing account right now. You've got the $600,000 sitting there. So we're telling you to cut the check today. I'd honor her today. I'd go have a big dinner tonight and celebrate her, toast mom. Yeah. Have them set a table for three. Oh, that's cool. Right? Yeah. And maybe order her favorite dessert and do something fun to thank her for this special day

because I would be free of that mortgage if I were you. Right now. Right now, as soon as we hang up, which we're going to go ahead and do that for you so you can do it. Thank you. So sorry for your loss, but excited for your future. And this is what legacy looks like, moms and dads. This is what it's about right here. It's amazing.

Wow. A life well lived and what a great legacy that we'll live on for a long, long time. This is The Ramsey Show. This is where you get an honest and hopeful opinion about the problems in your life, your money problems, your relationship problems, your work problems. This is The Ramsey Show. So excited that you're with us. I'm Ken Coleman. Dr. John Deloney joins me and we're here for you. The phone number is 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225. All right, for those of you out there who like a deal, and that means all you people.

That's the Ramsey audience right there. All you rice and beans people i'm waiting on the discount every time we put out a new book oh we always hear on social media i'm waiting man exactly i gotta wait until it's in the budget and uh we like hearing that we do want you to buy our stuff but we do want you to uh do it the right way and so our may may campaign this is an exciting thing here. We always have this awesome, awesome offering of stuff, all of our stuff in the month of May. And Friday, coming up this Friday, is our last day to shop the May sale and get the best-selling products with the best prices.

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That won't cut my bacon bill. Help a brother out. My bacon bill alone. I've got two giant kids that are just filling out. Yeah, Paycheck to Purpose under $16. And, by the way, more bestselling books so that you can get confidence to win in your money, in your relationships, and at work. RamseySolutions.com slash store. RamseySolutions.com slash store.

Again, the sale ends Friday at 1159 p.m. So there you go. Don't miss that. All right, back to the phones we go. San Francisco, California is where Gabby is. Gabby, how can we help? Hi, Gabby. Hey, Gabby. Hey. So first of all, I just want to say my fiance and I love the show so much. Um,

but I'm calling because I wanted to get your guys' advice. I got accepted into nursing school, and that would prospectively start in August. Last year, while I was finishing up my nursing prerequisites, I actually got a job in local government, and I just wanted your guys' perspective or advice on whether or not I should stay at this job or whether I should go for it and go into nursing school. Okay. Before we tell you what we think, I'm curious about what you're thinking right now. Where are you planning right now before you get anybody else's advice? I've honestly been back and forth. I feel like there's no wrong answer.

The reasons why I don't want to go into a nursing school is because I'm getting married in March of next year. So, you know, there is a wedding to be paid for. And then I'm also a little bit nervous about not working for two and a half years while I'm in the program. By the way, very good reasons. Let's have a little hypothetical. What if you didn't lose your income? What if the income was still there and you could go to nursing school without any loss of income?

How would that change your decision? Or would it? I would totally do it. Wait a second. What? You're telling me with no financial risk or hardship, you would jump into nursing school? Why? It's just, I mean, when you put it like that, I know I'm being sneaky, but there's a reason. Tell me why. Why would you jump at it if you knew there was no financial hardship or sacrifice? Because it's something that I've always wanted to do. I've always wanted to be in healthcare. And obviously I've been working at this for a really long time. And yeah, I would love to be a nurse. I want to be a nurse.

I don't enjoy my job really here, but it's a comfy, you know, I work in local government. It's a comfy job, great benefits. I get every other Friday off. I get to work remote. Like, you know know there's so many things that are good about this job oh just so comfortable until the day it becomes miserable i want to bring in my psychologist expert pal before we get into the money side of this john i feel like i've dug enough here oh there's the sandbox. What do you think, buddy?

I was just trying to keep a quick note, Gabby, of what is Gabby's soul worth? And what I got was good insurance and every other Friday off. I will tell you, the cost for my soul is way higher than that. Come on. And yours should be too. Yeah, that's the thing i i don't really i don't really like what i do i mean it's just it was just a job to get me through and to

save money until i got into nursing school but honestly um my family makes me feel a little crazy for wanting to leave like a comfy and your family's broke okay here we go by the way you're talking to the two worst possible hosts you could have called on this issue because i wrote a book called from paycheck to purpose so that's all i think about is meaning in the soul and then you've got a psychologist here who you know i can't even get through half a sentence without him knowing what i'm thinking so so john let's camp here because this is the problem. We've got a family who is projecting their own fears, dare I say their own failures, on Sweet Gabby. Is that right or am I wrong?

Tell me if I'm right. The things that they didn't do in their life, they probably were paycheck to paycheck. They were grinders. And then you got this magic thing called a government job, which is stable. It's got a pension. Pardon me while I choke over here.

Are you crazy? Right? Are we on to something, Gabby? Yes. No, that's exactly what it is. I live, I mean, the cost of living is high here. I make about $95, which is. Which is about $3 an hour in San Francisco.

Yeah. And by the way, you know, which is about $3 an hour in San Francisco. And by the way, you know the San Francisco government is not what we would call stable. Am I right, Gabby? There's a lot to be said. All right, so let's dive into the money piece, because we've already established that you're going to nursing school, if you want our opinion, and we know why you're getting pressure. By the way, we're not demonizing your family at all, but we can kind of call out some stuff and say some stuff that maybe you don't feel comfortable saying, right?

And we're not even going to make you agree, because we already know we're right. All right. But, okay, how much money did you save? You said the purpose of this government job was to save money for nursing school. So here we sit. Did you save any money? And if you did, how much? I had about $15,000, but I just had to get my car repaired recently, so I'm down to about $10.5K. But I have about $20,000 in a 529 account. Okay. And how much is nursing school going to cost you all in?

$15,000. How much? $15,000 and a 529 account. Okay. And how much is nursing school going to cost you all in? $15,000. How much? $15,000. Okay, good. So we're great. So now, John, we've got the wedding, the wedding planning, and she's got to save up for that. We're going to cash flow that because that's the other thing that you're bringing up. And then we've got the month-to-month expenses. So two quick questions. How much do you think the wedding is going to cost? And then quickly tell us, how are you going to survive during nursing school without the cushy government job? So the wedding, my fiance and I budgeted about $30,000. We've already made payments towards it, so I'm estimating about $20,000 left. I have set a deadline for myself for August to save as much money as I can while I'm still at this job. And then my fiance also has money saved, and obviously he's also going to be contributing. So we're going to be able to cover that cash, right? It's looking like it. All right, so how are you going to take care of yourself during nursing school?

So my fiance, God bless him, he's totally reassured me and taken on the responsibility and has said, you know, I'll get us through and I'll take care of us. Do you already live together? But, yes. Okay. Two weeks ago, a friend of mine who's a comedian and her boyfriend, now husband, who's a comedian, I said, why don't y'all just come over to my house and get married? And they did. The Delonys threw a wedding.

Did you do the service? I did the service. Did you get online? You did the whole thing? Oh, it's amazing. You're ordained? And Josephine was the flower girl. Perfect.

It was perfect. Here's what I'm saying get married right now today get through nursing school together and then throw an amazing wedding party just just get this thing done go to nursing school gosh we gotta do an online service where you for a premium where you marry people i'll say by the way for a small part of your fee, I'll sing. Actually, we'll have to pay people for that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was a bad idea. Good stuff. Hey, thanks for the call.

This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. Hey, if this show is helping you out, we would love for you to consider subscribing, leaving a review, and sharing the show with someone that you think it can help, whether you are on podcasts, radio, YouTube, and all the other platforms that I'm probably unaware of. 888-825-5225 is the phone number, 888-825-5225.

I'm Ken Coleman. Dr. John Delaney joins me this hour, and we're here for you, taking your money questions, your relationship questions, your work questions, all three of those areas come together if you are winning in life. And they also are fragmented and fractured, if you will, if you're not winning, so we want to help you. Shauna's up next in Amarillo, Texas. Don't sing, John. Shauna, how can we help? There it is. I knew he couldn't resist. Shawna, how are you? Hi. Thank you guys for taking my call. I'm good. Good. What's going on?

I was calling because I have started reading the Total Money Makeover and I'm wanting to get started on my baby steps, but I'm having a hard time with my budget getting started. I'm a single mom and I stay at home. I am unemployed and I'm only getting about 50 to 150 a week currently,

just odd jobs and selling things out of our home. And I guess my question is, how do I increase my income as a single stay-at-home mom? And I'm stay-at-home because I can't afford to send them to child care. Right. Are you getting child support payments? Is that how you're sustaining yourself? No. I actually just donate plasma and I babysit when I can, in addition to selling old toys and furniture, just whatever I can get rid of. So you are, you and your, tell me about the child. One, two, how many? I have a four-year-old

and a 10-month-old. Oh my gosh. A four-year-old and a 10-month-old. And if I heard you right, you're making somewhere between $600 to $400 a month. Am I hearing that right? That's correct, yes. How are you feeding the children? We currently are receiving state benefits. How much? And we get about, I'd say about $800 for food. Anything else? I'm trying to get the entire financial picture. What's the total amount of money you've got coming in between everything you've told us so far and any other benefits from the state? My children are on Medicaid. I'm still young enough that my dad is carrying me on his health insurance.

Okay. And we're living in HUD housing, so I only pay about $28 for rent. Okay. But you're just barely scraping by. All of our utilities. Okay. Yeah. All right, let's talk about your support system.

Any family or good friends in the area where you are? I've got most of my family here with me, and they help me when they can, but most of them are working 40-plus hours a week. Okay. And the other ones are not old enough or too old to keep up with my children. Does your family go to church, or do they have any kind of community outside of church, outside of the immediate family, where they would know maybe some grandmas who are retired? Yes, we belong to a church here that I've grown up going to, but I haven't.

That's mostly my family as well, too, about half of the church I'm related to. Okay, so let me tell you where my brain is going, and I'm really going to recommend that you try this. If you strike out, you strike out. One of the things I would be looking at is, is there a grandmother, somebody who's retired, and they're still young enough and vibrant enough to where they could potentially help out during the week for you, because I understand that there's no way

you can send your kids to a traditional daycare. But I'm trying to get very creative here, and I think you ought to ask. You have nothing to lose. Do you understand what I'm saying? Yes, sir. Because if you could put some of that money, you don't have a lot of it, but if they could help out some, that could give you more options. My concern is, are you going to be able to knock down a full-time or at least a substantive part-time job with the four-month-old, or excuse me, the 10-month-old? I'm not thinking so.

I was recently offered a job, but it was only going to be $12 an hour. And after the child care cost in our area, even I found someone. No, no, no, no. Listen, I'm sorry. I'm not talking about going out and putting the kids in shock. I'm saying working from home, which there are a lot of remote jobs. There's customer care where you're just customer service. I'm going to ask you a few questions in a second.

We'll try to come up with some other ideas. But my point is, how much time do you really have to actually work with that baby? I see. I was managing to work 30 hours when she was from two months to about four months old or six months, something like that. Okay. That tells me a lot. John, what I'm digging here is I want to know what your commitment is because right now you've got some family support, but not as it relates to child care, does it sound like, but if you're willing to work the 30 hours and you've done it before, then once baby's in bed, you may have to work harder than you've ever worked in your entire life to get a baseline here. So real quick,

and I want John to jump in as well, but just let's talk about your skill set. Give me two or three things that just baseline level, you've got some talent. You were good at it in high school, whether I'm, Ken, I'm organized or I'm really good at talking to people. I'm looking for just some basic skills that you know you have to offer. What are they? Give me two or three. I'm not afraid of hard work. In high school, I helped remodeling houses. I've worked in child care.

I've worked in retail. I think I'm pretty versatile when it comes to work. Okay. All right. So here are a couple things I hear right away. I hear that you can talk to people. So there might be some remote sales positions where you're smiling and dialing. Maybe you've got some leads depending on the company. Certainly there's a lot of stay-at-home jobs where people are doing customer service. So essentially you're answering a customer service

hotline. They teach you on how to do it. I would be looking for things like that right now to see if I can get 30 hours and if I could be making 15 to 20 bucks an hour. But you've got to be looking for stuff like that where you can say, I've got experience. Here's what I've done before. And they're looking for people. And these jobs aren't glamorous, Shauna, but we don't care about glamour right now, do we? No. Yeah. John, I want to bring you in here what are you hearing yeah two things one is just a continuation of what you were just saying um you work real hard and you've you're not scared of hard work and so i'm wondering if there is something to be said for the next six months the next seven months is this ideal

absolutely not you are not in an ideal situation. You know that. We all know that. But somebody in your family gets home at five o'clock and you go throw boxes until midnight and you make $20 an hour at the late shift at Walmart and then you come home and then you do that again and you do it again. And you're a single mom who's so tired it's hard to even open your eyes and you are blazing a trail through a forest that nobody's traveled before for those kids and they're going to look up and yes you're going to miss some time yes you're going to be exhausted yes you're going to be stumbling around and in two years three years four years you're going to have your own place and you're going to have some security that you don't have right now okay but we're at the level of radical yeah the other thing is is i spent 20 years out

in west texas i know you are on a precipice that if you don't act with this like decisively soon you're going to cross into the matrix it's almost impossible to get out of the poverty matrix you know i'm talking about yes sir okay you're right there on the edge aren't you yes okay i am going to do something and i haven't even made this phone call but i'm going to make the phone call um two of my mentors lynn and steve jennings who own jen Counseling and Associates out there in Amarillo, Texas. They're going to give you two free sessions, okay? Yes, sir. And I want you to go meet with them with the goal of finding work and finding the – because you've been knocked down recently too, haven't you?

Yes, sir. Yeah. Yeah. And you have so much to offer. They're going to stand up for you. And Jennings and Associates, Lynn and Steve, we have not talked about this but i'm just i just know your hearts and so you're going to take care of the sweet woman i want you to stay on the line shauna but you have to decide we're going to get radical radical radical right now and i will not become another

statistic and then we're going to wrap some support around you and like ken said you're going to have to go ask some uncomfortable questions. Will you help me? Will you help me? Will you help me? Yeah. And let's do this too. Sean, we're also going to give you my Get Clear assessment in the new book, Find the

Work You're Wired to Do. Not for the short term, but I want you to begin seeing that there is a path that John's talking about. But first and foremost, you've got to do everything that John said. We'll give you that tool because we want you to be looking forward. This is The Ramsey Show. We'll see you next time.