The Ramsey Show - App - Pay Off Debt by Selling the House? (Hour 2)

Episode Date: January 3, 2023

George Kamel & Ken Coleman answer your questions and discuss: "Should I take a job just for the benefits?" "Does it make sense to sell our home to pay off debt?" Saving money by living in military housing. Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6 Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

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🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Pods Moving and Storage Studio, it's The Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. I'm George Campbell, host of the Entree Leadership Podcast,

fine friend and co-host of Smart Money Happy Hour, joined by the host of the Ken Coleman Show, you guessed it, Ken Coleman himself, next to me, taking your calls on money, on career, on life, whatever's on your mind, America. Maybe you got some goals that you have set out for 2023, some resolutions. We want to help you get there and give you hope in every area of life. It's a free call at 888-825-5225. Anne kicks us off in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Anne, welcome to The Ramsey Show. Hi there. Happy New Year. How are you all?

You as well. We're doing great. How can we help today? Good, good. Well, I have two questions for you. So the first one is how to approach my individual contributor role when I really don't have a desire to move up into management, although I do value recognition and achievement. And then my second question is whether or not it's a wise move to join the Air Force Reserves or the Air National Guard within the next year or two, knowing that the past two years have been full of a lot of change and a lot of trauma for me. So it's kind of a twofold question for you all. Okay. Wow. Now we get some real depth here. So

let's go for number one first. Does that sound okay? Sure. That's great. So the heart of your question is what? I heard what you said. Okay. I want to grow or I want to be recognized. I love the way you put it. You want recognition, but you don't want to be promoted into a leadership position. Am I understanding that? That is correct. I love growing accounts and I love earning more money and being wise with that money, but I don't necessarily want to move into a management role. Whereas my organization I'm at right now is run by former consultants who are really demonstrating that up or out kind of method of dealing with attrition. And I'm also getting some mixed messages from my direct manager who very kindly has said, I'm the best person on the team and

she needs me so she can't promote me. So I'm getting some mixed messages. And what I really want to do is be the best individual contributor I can be and be wise with my money. That's really what I want to do. So it sounds like to me, the message that matters is your direct leader. And I would tell that leader, hey, this is a match made in heaven because I don't want to lead. In fact, I get a little bit of anxiety when I hear that these consultants that are leaders are kind of going up or out or whatever. I feel like I've gotten that message, but I got to tell you, I'm as happy as I can be in the role that I'm in crushing it. And I want to get more,

I want to make more money and I want to make the organization more money. So I make more money so I can manage my money. Well, I want to stay in this type of role. I'm happy to be your top performer. Please protect me. Cause I don't want to be promoted into a leadership role, but this is what's weird about George,

uh, our Western hemisphere, the way we, we treat is what's weird about, George, our Western hemisphere. The way we treat promotions, it's like, well, you got to move up the ladder instead of going, what do you want to do more of? Do you want to make more money and do a little bit more of this? Why does it always have to be, I'm going to pull you out of the seat where you're crushing it and put you in a seat where you may not want to be. You may not want to lead people, but you might be the best salesperson. So they go, well, she needs to be over the sales team and lead them.

So you're miserable. Yeah. So I think the answer to number one is reaffirm what your leader is telling you and going, I'm as happy as can be. Protect me. And I want to stay here. All I want to do is keep performing better, get paid more, and spend that money wisely. That's what I think. Okay? You got that one? Okay. I like that. I like it. Love it. Thank you.

Now, the second one, because I want George to jump in on this retirement thing, but I've got to ask George, when you say you've been through a lot of change and trauma, whatever you're comfortable sharing, I'm just curious what that has been and how long that's been going on. Sure. No, I'm very happy to share. And there's actually some great changes in that, but also some changes that were just a lot to deal with and heal with. So in the last two and a half years, I got sober. I moved across the country.

Thank you. Thank you. I had a major surgery and a traumatic divorce. I lost over 110 pounds. I changed companies and I was finally diagnosed and treated for ADHD. So lots of great things in there, but also lots of things that make me pause and say, okay, I want to make sure that I'm making the right decision because this would be like a 20, it didn't have to be a 20 year commitment, but I'm looking at a 20 year commitment and the reserves or the guard, because it's important to me. I want to serve my country and do something beyond myself. All right. So that leads to what I was really going to dive into and let George talk about it as a retirement option. Sounds like to me, you want to serve your country more than you're just trying to juice your retirement benefits, but that is kind of a benefit. Pardon the metaphor here. Is that what I'm hearing? I would say that's correct because I couldn't even tell you the

dollar amount that those, that retirement would would be it's much more about serving my country um also family lineage my grandfather and my father both served and this is really important to me would it stress you out your current family relationship life i know you're just recently divorced i'm so sorry about that but with this extra time uh in serving our country do you have margin for that to where it's not a negative? Would it affect other parts of your life, your job, anything like that? No. In fact, at my job, most of us have served in some capacity.

I'm also single and happily child-free, so I don't view it. I don't think it would. I mean, here's the truth it would take away from my yoga on the weekends that's what it would take away from we can live with that exactly namaste

I would do it and I would do it for the only reason that you want to serve your country and anything else is just an auxiliary benefit that's nice to have but I would never do it for the retirement benefits. And it sounds like based on what you told me, your heart is in the right place with this. And I would pursue it if I were you. If that's where your heart's saying to go, then the retirement benefit is just part of the package. Do you have retirement as part of your

current job? I do. I do. However, I've worked at startups for the last about eight years or so. However, have had very steady employment at startups, but we all know how startups go. So that's always kind of in the back of my head. Like I've got a great retirement, consistently putting 15% a year towards that, but I do feel a little bit behind. I didn't really get my first like grownup job until the last about eight years or so. So a little bit of it, yeah, there is part of me that wants to make sure I'm playing catch up, but that's not the main motivator behind that. Are you debt-free? I am. I'm debt-free. I'm on Baby Step 3B right now. That's fantastic. So soon you're going to be a homeowner. That's going to help you build wealth.

What's your income? Yes, sir. I make $125,000 a year. Oh, I love it. You are going to retire with plenty of dignity and plenty of time to enjoy as much yoga as you can handle. You'll probably be teaching the class by then based on how I'm talking. Well, we are so proud of you. Honored to talk with you, Anne, and thank you in advance for serving this great country. What a cool call. A lot to manage there, Ken, but she's very well-spoken. And if I was hiring, I'd hire Ann. Yeah. That's great. And I think, by the way, she said learned

ADHD and she's, but there was a woman that was highly focused and she's live and just rattling it off. And I think the serving is a great way to heal. Huge. This is The Ramsey show happy new year to all of you listening out there. And while most of you are saying good riddance to last year because it was hard enough just to keep gas in your car and food in your fridge, money's still tight. And you're wondering right now, is 2023 going to be any different? Well, guys, you do not have to live through another year of stress and worry, regardless of what is happening in the economy. And that's why I want you to watch Building Wealth in 2023, our free live stream event on January 12th, because we want to show you that you can still make progress on your goals. You can build wealth. You can have peace with money. Even in this crazy

inflationary time, regardless of what's happening in the White House, you can do this stuff. So during this event, you're going to hear from myself, Dave Ramsey, Rachel Cruz, Dr. John Deloney, and Ken Coleman. We're going to talk about how to set goals and create margin so that you can build wealth this year. We're going to have some fun and you're going to leave fired up for 2023. And even if the economy still feels out of control, you don't have to. You can control the controllable. So register for this free live stream. Go to ramseysolutions.com slash wealth. That's ramseysolutions.com slash wealth. That's ramseysolutions.com slash wealth. George, I have a non-money question, but I think the audience would like to weigh in

on this. All right. All right. How long can you say happy new year? At what point? In other words, at what date on the calendar in January, James, you can weigh in on this. James, our fearless producer. What is the date by which you go, you stop saying Happy New Year? Because everybody's saying Happy New Year, and I want to keep it going on the calls today. Is there a date? I've got a hot take, Ken. I think the further the relationship, the longer window you have, and I think 30 days is the longest window.

Yeah. So friends and family, you get two days. I go January 15th. I think on the 16th longest window yeah so friends and family you get two days I go January 15th I think after the on the 16th it's time to where it's drop it we're all we know we're all happy well by then I'm just learning to write 2023 instead of 2022 what do you say James to me like a couple days like oh I'll say it to people at work today because it's the first day back seeing them but starting tomorrow if you see James in the hallway. I don't have a problem.

Like you said, how much you know the person. If you don't know them very well and you're scraping the bottom of the barrel. If it's the teller at the bank and it's January 17th, they might say Happy New Year. That's okay. I have the same question about that first email to somebody in a professional context of the New Year. At what point do you not say say hope you had a wonderful holiday season your year's off to a good start like is it february 1 yeah holiday season gets a little tricky too ken there's a lot of holidays how long are we stretching the season for the older i get

folks the crankier i get on this issue i just think if you want to say happy new year fine don't expect me to say it you're turning this into a seinfeld bit what's the deal with happy new year what do we do well i just think we all know that we want you to have a Happy New Year. I don't ever see somebody and go, crappy New Year? Who says that? Can I tell you something? This is embarrassing. I'm going to admit it to you and all of America.

When I was young, I was a young kid. My grandma said Happy New Year, and I said back, no Happy New Year, and she cried. And I will never forget that moment. I've never felt worse in my life. I don't know. I was probably 10, 11. Wow. Maybe 13.

I got no clue. That's very emo. I was such a punk little emo kid. Yeah, it is. And I still feel bad to this day. So grandma, if you're watching, I'm sorry. Have you written her a letter?

I apologize profusely. Okay. Through her tears, Ken. It was, oh. Never do that to your grandmas, let alone anyone. You know what you're doing there? You're owning your past and changing your future. Wow. Yeah, there it is. Plug in Dr. John Deloney's book.

Free mention for Dr. John Deloney there. All right, before they take us off the air, let's get to a call. It's a free one. 888-825-5225. Hey, that's important stuff. It was. All right, you're right. You call the show to talk about your life, and the unnecessary Happy New Year's need to stop at some point. The only thing more important is Ashley's question question and she's waiting with bated breath in huntsville alabama i'll let it go ashley i'm sorry and happy new year to you hey happy new year thanks for having me yes so i had a question for y'all today. My husband and I just finished Baby Step 2. We started watching you guys last year. Ended up paying off our car loan early and some credit card debt. And so we're on Baby Step 3, currently saving about 10% for retirement while we fund our

emergency fund. But my question is, last year we ended up moving to a new primary resident. We have about $400,000 left on our $427,000 mortgage, and we left our residence that we used to live in, put it up for rent, and we have about $150,000 left on that mortgage. So I guess my question is, do we need to sell, because we've considered moving back to our old residence just to get rid of our big mortgage, do we sell one of them to move to the other, or do we sell the rental? And then my other question is, my husband and I don't agree on whether or not we need to pay off our loan because we have a low interest rate on both the primary

and the rental house. And so he kind of wants to keep it for that full 30 years, and I'd like to try to pay it off earlier. That's like saying, hey, do we want to keep getting punched in the face? Because we're not getting punched that hard in the face. So my take is that I want to get rid of all debt that's stealing from my income. And once you do that, you're going to have total control of every dollar coming into your household. So there's a few things here I just want to point out. Right now you're doing Ashley's plan, which is fine, but you're asking for our advice and that's going to be the Ramsey baby steps, which is we are saving up that emergency fund and we're not investing a dime into retirement until that's fully funded. So that's one,

you said you were investing 10%. So I'll bring that 10% down to zero temporarily while we get the emergency fund in place. And on the housing situation, could you guys move back into that rental? What made you move in the first place? We were looking to get into real estate and to try to get some extra cash flow from a rental. Found a house we liked that was a little bit better because we're thinking about starting a family here soon. So just wanted some bigger space. What's your household income? Right now with both both of our jobs, it's $180,000. And then the rental is bringing in about $25,000. Okay. And how much more space for this little one?

We moved, it was about 1,200 square feet. And our current home is now about 2,500 square feet. Okay. So it sounds like you need the extra space in the 2,500 square foot one? I mean, yes. Would it be tough to go back? It has been good to be bigger. Okay. It would be very tough to go back. Yes. Because based on the numbers, it sounds like you guys can healthily afford the mortgage payment making 180 a year, but I would sell the old one. I would never encourage anyone to have two mortgages at once. The way, if you went back in time, I would say, hey, let's pay off your primary residence.

And then if you want to save up and pay cash for an investment property, you can do that. But right now there's a lot of risk hanging around. You're trying to do 17 things at once and you're not making the progress you should be making with your income. Okay. And I mean, how much time have you all spent as a couple just talking through, if you did, what George told you to do? Like what that windfall and how it would fast forward everything, how it would bring more peace. Have you guys sat down and really dreamed and kind of talked about what if? We have. We just don't agree. My husband's biggest thing is that we have such a good interest rate on both homes that he just thinks it's like wasting money to pay off the home, in a sense. Well, I think that mindset is going to continue to hold you guys back when you look at, well, it's a low interest rate, so let's just keep it hanging around our necks for fun.

So I get that. I get that that's his response, George. but but i mean are you sitting there going how much money would you make on that house if you sold it what's it worth we could we could probably make at least 270 to 300 on it 270 to 300 000 that's what you would make well that would be the sale price of the home and we have 150k left on the loan so you could get 150 okay but see so that's the number so if i'm sitting down with your hubs and let's say i'm playing older brother with them i'm going okay dude you want to hang on to this house and you're making 25 000 a year on it but that doesn't include i'm guessing that's your gross that doesn't include expenses and upkeep is that correct correct yeah so you're not making 25 000 all it takes is one roof to be replaced in an hvac so let's just say let's round down let's just say you guys are making 18 on it

okay net versus the 150 after realtors fees or whatever let's just take those numbers i'm looking at that going what would that do for us This dude's getting all excited about 18 versus 150 and no debt. My goal is to owe no one nothing, including the mortgage payments. His goal is to hang on to as much low interest mortgage debt as possible because that's somehow a path to building wealth. And so we fundamentally disagree in that regard. You can try to change his mind. You can go through Financial Peace University with him, read the total money makeover. That's our plan, is complete freedom. Not let's try to be real estate gurus with a million dollars of debt hanging around our neck.

Yeah, cast some vision about where that 150 would allow you to fast forward your life. He needs to see that. This is The Ramsey Show. Are you sick of planned obsolescence? You know, when companies make products crappy so you have to buy more of their crappy products? Well, me too. And it's why I love companies like Grip6. Grip6 is all about quality products meant to last forever. That's why their comfortable, bulk-free belts, slimline wallets, and lightweight wool socks all come with a lifetime warranty and simple returns and exchanges.

So check them out at Grip6.com today and get up to 20% off with the promo code RAMSEY. This is the Ramsey Show. I'm George Camel, Ramsey personality, joined by my colleague Ken Coleman, and we are taking your calls at 888-825-5225. Now, many of you have a goal to pay off some debt this year, and so we want to inspire you right now on the show with a debt-free scream. And to do that, we've got Dylan and Crystal joining us on the debt-free stage. How are you guys doing? Doing well.

Yeah, doing great. Where are you guys from? We are from Denver, Colorado. I love it. And how much debt did you pay off? We paid off $67,178. Wow. And how long did that take?

About 28 months. Awesome. What was your range of income? We started out at $77,000 and ended around $107,000. Awesome. What do you guys do for a living? So I am a nonprofit program manager. I worked in fraud prevention at a bank, but currently unemployed.

Hey, Dylan, do me a favor here. I'm producing the show all of a sudden. Pull that mic up closer. Yeah, we want to be able to hear you. My bad. There we go. Hey, guys, I got this, okay? It's okay.

Ken's got it. I got it. I love it. So $67,000, what kind of debt was that? So it was a lot of student loans. We also had a car loan. We had some credit card debt. I think that was most of it, yeah.

And some money that I stole. Whoa. Whoa, hello. Hold on. So you were in fraud prevention at the bank. Did this happen while you were in fraud prevention? No, no, no. Okay.

He's exaggerating. A little bit. A little bit. Wow. So long story short, my mom had some money set aside for me for college, and she trusted me with it. She wrote me a check, and I and I said yeah I'll use it just for school and then I was unemployed for a little bit and started dipping into it a little

too much so I finally confessed and said I need to pay this back is she here with you she is she's right here this is not the first time she's hearing this I assume no okay good she seemed unfazed by this information so so I was hoping so. Yeah, so, okay. Wow. Okay, so that's what you mean by you stole it. Yeah, I got you. Misused, yeah.

Misused. He's not going to jail. No. No, that's good. Paid it all back. That's great. But it was a big turning point for us, so. Yeah, so what brought you to that I've had it moment where you guys said, we're doing

whatever it takes to get rid of this debt? Yeah, so we were both raised the Dave way. We actually both did FPU as kids in our respective families. And Dylan's mom is actually a coach, a Ramsey coach. Oh, awesome. So it's in the family, but we both as young adults just made choices that sounded good to us but weren't wise. And so his thing being one of them.

And when we were about to get engaged, that was really when we were having those big conversations about, you know, what do we want our life to look like when we're married? And so we started planning out before we got married, how we were going to move forward financially. Whoa. So how long you guys been married? We got married March of 2020. So almost three years. We got married right as the pandemic was happening. So we were one of those living room weddings. Wow. And so soon after you got married, you were like, we're doing this plan. Yep. We got to work. Yep. It worked out with the pandemic to where there was a lot of online food ordering. And so we did a bunch of door dash and driving as dashers, not buying. Yes. Thank you for making sure people understood.

Absolutely. Yep. Just did a making sure people understood. Absolutely. Yep, just did a lot of side gigs. I took a serving job at a restaurant a little bit later on. He was working on finishing school as well. So yeah, we just hit the ground running. Wow. Yeah. Sounds like you guys were pretty busy.

We were. Yeah. How'd you keep up that communication, the encouragement? Who walked alongside of you? What was that like? Yeah, I mean, we had so much support from our family and our friends which really helped when we had to make those tough calls you know every every week when people wanted to hang out of yeah we can we can do some stuff um but we can't do we can't eat out all the time um but yeah we just we had conversations all the

time about here's what we're running after especially when we were tired we were like we need to go have a dreaming conversation so we would go and dream about the kind of house that we want or the kind of travel we want to do and that really helped keep us motivated yep the life we want to live yep and Dylan I gotta ask your mom's a financial coach was she a part of this was she kind of like breathing down your neck or was it like, hey mom, we got this? What was that situation like? Oh man, she was amazing. She just presented herself as a resource but said, hey, it's a choice that you have to make. So I'll let you guys do your thing. But if you ever have any questions, let me know. And we definitely called on her a few times for, do we do this or that kind of decision. Wow. So parents, if you're listening, that is how you do it.

With healthy boundaries, very gently, not forcefully. That's incredible. Wow. And I'm sure she's proud because you guys went through financial pieces, kids, and it didn't quite stick the first time. What do you attribute that to? Just kind of your youth of just like, well, this stuff doesn't matter. I'm not an adult yet. I was definitely one of those people that was like, I'll just have the credit card and I'll

always pay it off. And I did. I never got into trouble with that, but I definitely, the wake up call for me was after my first year of my big girl job, I did my taxes and saw how much I made. And I was like, I don't have that much in my bank account. Where did it go? Yeah. Oh my goodness. Yeah. And you can speak for yourself. Yeah. I just decided my parents didn't know what they were talking about with credit cards, so I got some and just, you know, they talk about the free spender. I'm like 9 out of 10 on that test.

I woke up one day with like $26,000 in credit card debt, and I was like, I couldn't breathe. I was making less than that per year. Wow. Yeah, I was having panic attacks. And eventually I had to call my parents and say, hey, I've hid this from you. And I need help. Wow. Yep.

How did that feel when you finally let that out and shared that with your mom and dad? Oh, man. It's kind of like, you know, when you have to throw up. You have all this pain. But once it's out, it's like, oh, that was painful. to throw up you have all this pain but once it's out it's like oh that was painful but oh i can breathe now that's a good analogy you guys are different people than you were three years ago five years ago you've totally transformed has this affected your marriage too oh absolutely i think just having a common goal um having to make hard

choices together we're both spenders um and so we're often having to help hard choices together. We're both spenders. And so we're often having to help each other stay on track. Yeah. And from the day that we got married, we've always shared a bank account. I'm not, we're not on anything that the other person's not on for that reason. That's great. So how does it feel to be completely debt-free?

Oh, it feels awesome. We can actually- It's just sort of levity and chillness to you. I'm like, yeah, we're just vibing right now. Yep. We can actually work towards something now. We got ourselves out of the hole. Now we can go up.

So what would you tell people, that other couple that's out there, they have a pile of debt, maybe they went through financial peace and it didn't stick. What is the key to debt freedom? Yeah. So there's two things.

There's like practical steps and then I guess emotional steps. For practicality, what we did is we got one month ahead on our expenses or, you know, our paychecks always go to our savings account. And then at the beginning of the month, we make a budget based on how much is in that account and transfer the money to our checking for all the bills and things. So that's a practical thing that we do. Yeah. And then on the emotional side, like I said, just keeping that dream central. So constantly reminding ourselves why we're doing this because it makes a lot easier to say no to the right now things if you're saying yes to the long time things. What are you willing to sacrifice now for a better future? A great question to leave us with. You guys are incredible. We are so proud of you. We're going to make sure you don't leave today without the live and give box to gift to someone

else, to use it for yourselves. It includes two of Dave's bestselling books, Total Money Makeover and Baby Steps Millionaires. That's the next chapter in your story. And of course, one year membership to Financial Peace University. Maybe you can show someone else who didn't stick the first time. You say, hey, go through this with us. We're going to lead a class and this one's on us. We want to show you the way. So we'll make sure you guys get that. Thank you. We're so proud of you. All right, let's get to it. The moment we have all been waiting for. We've got Dylan and Crystal from Denver, Colorado. $67,178 paid off in 28 months, making $77,000 up to $107,000, door dashing and all. Count it down.

Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free! And the crowd goes wild. Yeah, yeah, it's fun. It's fun to see, you know, it never gets old to watch people recount the journey, and then the countdown is kind of the final moment where they break through, you know, the ribbon, and they just did it, and that's what it's all about.

Here's a young couple with their entire life in front of them. Favorite statement from the scream is when Crystal said, hey, now we can work towards something. Now they're dreaming. If you live like no one else, you can live like no one else. That's going from surviving to thriving. That's what this plan is all about. Way to go, guys. We are so proud of you. And it's available to you, America, if you want it.

It's there. It's on the other side of sacrifice and intensity and slashing expenses and making more money. When you do that for a short period of time, the rest of your life is going to be incredible. You can do this. This is The Ramsey Show. សូវាប់ពីបានប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្� You're listening to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell. Join this hour by Ken Coleman. Well, about this time of year, folks, we get flooded with calls because everyone is looking for a fresh start with their money, especially after a tough couple of years. So if that's you, you can't wish for things to change and expect it to happen. You've got to do some different things with your money. You've got to have a plan and we can teach you that plan in Financial Peace University. This is the course that will help you rethink how you manage your money and you're going to learn step-by-step how

to pay off debt and build wealth. And nearly 10 million people have gone through Financial Peace University. They followed this plan and changed their lives. I am a recipient of that. This plan worked for me, and it can work for you. Don't try to reinvent it. Don't try to do your plan. It just doesn't work. We've dialed this thing in. When you intentionally follow this plan with a focused intensity, this year can and will be different. You're going to have more peace in your finances and your life. It's the best thing you can do this year for your money. Start Financial Peace University right now at ramsaysolutions.com slash FPU. That's ramsaysolutions.com slash FPU. All right, it is time for our question of the day. Randy emailed in from the great state of Arkansas.

He writes, I am trying to decide if I should keep my job as assistant branch manager at a bank making $31 per hour or take a new job at a superior courthouse making $24 per hour as a legal process clerk. At the bank, I have to pay around $300 for health benefits per biweekly paycheck. And the courthouse benefits are paid 100% by the court. Both jobs offer opportunity to grow. I'm 35 years old, married with two kids. What do you think I should do? Well, Randy, I think you should do the work or

do the job that puts you on the ladder to grow where you really want to go? And this entire question seems like it's built on benefits, George, the cost of benefits. So you're the numbers guy, George. All right, so he's making $31 per hour right now at the bank. But he has to pay $300 for health benefits per biweekly paycheck. So I'm guessing now that's $600 a month. Is my math still correct, George? That sounds right. All right. So $600 a month. $7,200 a year. $7,200 a year. The question is, is that before or after taxes? My guess is that's before taxes. I would hope that's the

benefit. I don't know. But either way- Let's assume that. Let's assume that. But either way, you're looking at $7,200. So if we just take the $31 per hour and you put that course of year, if he's just doing 40 hours a week and you play all that out, do the math on that, then you look at it from an apples to apples. But I think he's still better off in the bank situation. He's making almost $15,000 more at the bank. Okay. So if you subtract, and again, I don't think it's... Minus the...

He's losing by moving to the courthouse, even though they're paying for the health benefits. Yeah, so you've just got to look at the numbers. What happens is, when you don't look at the big picture, George, then there's emotion instead of facts. The emotions go, ugh, I'm paying $600 a month for health care, and at the courthouse, I'd pay zero. Well, you're making a whole lot less. Yeah, I never want to make any decisions just based on a benefit alone. Never, ever, ever. That's my professional advice.

Don't take a job based solely on benefits. Would you rather be an assistant branch manager at a bank, or would you rather be a legal process clerk? That's right. And which one are you better at? Which one do you have more passion for? He puts in there that both jobs have an opportunity for growth. Well, again, let's look at them side by side. Where does each job take me? Okay, if I grow here on the bank side, where does that take me? If I grow here on the courthouse side or whatever the city or municipality or the county, where does it take me?

And which direction do I want to go? That's the decision process. And my guess, just a hunch, that in banking there is a higher trajectory for salary growth. There's no question. State or municipal government. Unless he's going to go to law school and become a lawyer, I think it's going to be tough to get to a much higher level of income. So he's 35 with two kids. I'm sticking with the bank job for now. And maybe that's not even the career path. Maybe there's something totally different out there for you. You got to explore that. Don't just settle because

you go, well, it's a good, safe job. I provide for my family. Go after something that really gives you the juice, as Ken would say. Oh, I love hearing you say that, George. Thank you. Great question. Thanks so much for emailing in. It's open phones right now, 888-825-5225. Let's talk about your life, your money, your work, your purpose.

Ian is up next in Annapolis, Maryland. Ian, welcome to The Ramsey Show. Thank you very much, sir. Thank you guys for having me. Absolutely. How can we help today? So my wife and I have been huge followers of Dave Ramsey for about the past 10 years. I'm active duty Navy, and I have been for about 14 years now. And we move every three years. Now, my question for you guys is, right now we have finished baby step five. We have no debt. We have our daughter's college is completely paid for.

We're trying to figure out, is it better to buy a house or keep living in military housing and saving five grand a month until we retire from the military? How many years would that be? So I'm at 14 now. I'd be about six or seven at the earliest. And you're saving five grand a month? Not including our 20% to our TSP or our 401k. Wow. On top of that, you just have five grand in cash

you can put in a savings account every month. Yes, sir. So we're putting it right now, we're putting about $3,000 into our non-retirement account, and we're putting about $2,000 to $2,500 in our money market account. Cool. The non-retirement, is that being invested, you're saying, in a brokerage account? Yes, sir. Yes, sir. S&P 500. So we're putting three grand to just an S&P 500, and we're putting about $2,000 to $2,500 every month into our money market. Essentially just a savings account. Yes, sir. Okay. So you've got an index fund growing over there. You've got the savings account. I think there's a lot of wisdom there. And you're saying, hey, five to seven years from

now, this money could turn into $, 500 grand. Yes, sir. Right? And paying cash for a house. I love that plan. And what's the other side of the coin here? We move every three years. Obviously, we bought a house at our last command. Absolutely loved it.

We did really well with selling. I just didn't put that money into our index. And now we're, you know, we have about a year and a half left until we move again. And we're just trying to figure out, everyone's telling us, obviously buying, buying has done really well for us in the past. But right now we're happy in military housing. We don't pay bills. We don't pay utilities. We're just trying to figure out, are we making a mistake living in military housing? I don't think you're making a mistake. No, you're making the wise decision.

Because five years from now, you're paying cash for a house while the rest of the goons who are making fun of you are paying off their 30-year mortgages. And so I don't know who these goons are that would be making fun of you. I mean, this is brilliant. Well, sir, yes, sir. And today, a lot of military people, from what I've met, they buy houses everywhere they go, and they rent them out. So everyone around us is telling us we're making a mistake being in military housing, and we should be buying and...

They think it's a life hack because they haven't gotten burned by playing this game. And you simply don't need to play the game, regardless of what profit they say they're making, because all it takes is one emergency scenario where they've got to pay the HVAC or the roof or the renter stops paying or there's another pandemic and it's illegal to evict and your tenant doesn't pay. So this is a dangerous situation when you've got a mortgage attached to it. And so I would keep going the route you're going, even if you bought and once you move a year and a half from now, you want to buy in the next place and you hold on to that for three years, you would be totally fine. I don't think there's any lack of wisdom in

that either. Ian, I got to ask you this very quickly. Did we say anything that you hadn't already thought of before you called the show? Absolutely not, sir. Everything you guys said just reaffirmed it. Right, so here's my point. You needed a shot of confidence. And I'm telling you, you got it. You are a wise young man. You have to drown out all these other people. You got to decide what life you want to live and live it. Yes, sir.

That's exactly what I need. You guys just, you reaffirmed it yesterday. We listened to you the entire day and we just, we figured it'd be best to hear from you guys directly. So glad you called and thank you for your service. You're a great American. Wow. What a sharp guy. That gave me a lot of encouragement. And it also reminded me, like you mentioned, trowing out all the noise, all the negativity, everyone's saying you're doing it wrong. If you are living your life with the goal of complete debt freedom,

where your income, your greatest wealth building tool stays with you, that is a great plan in good times and bad. So I'm sticking with that plan. I'm taking that to the bank. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. My thanks to my co-host, Ken Coleman, all the folks in the booth keeping the show afloat, and you, America, thank you so much for listening in. Share the show if you enjoyed

it with a friend, someone who needs to hear this message, and we'll be back real soon. Hey, folks. Ken Coleman here. Did you know The Ramsey Show is one of the most popular podcasts in the world? Get your daily dose of advice on life and money. Check out all of our shows from The Ramsey Network wherever you listen to podcasts.