The Ramsey Show - App - Prepare For Your Future Instead of Paying For Your Past (Hour 3)

Episode Date: February 19, 2024

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is The Ramsey Show. It's where we help you win in your life. Winning in your money, winning in your work, and winning in your relationships is the formula. I'm Ken Coleman. George Campbell joins me this hour. The phone number to jump in is 888-825-5225.

That's 888-825-5225. Let's stay right here in our neck of the woods, George. Nashville, Tennessee is where Megan awaits. Megan, how can we help? Hi, how are you guys? We're having a blast. How are you today? Good, good.

I have a question about some properties that we own and just kind of looking for advice on, I think, whether to keep or to try to sell and get rid of them. So my husband and I have moved around a little bit. And so we currently, we'll be up to three houses now. And as we've moved, we're renting out to a long-term rental here. And as we've moved, we, you know, renting out to like a long-term rental here. And I guess I'm just kind of thinking, you know, we, we didn't pay for any of these, I guess, investment properties with cash. And so we do still have mortgage, you know, so now we have three mortgages and I'm wondering, you know, is it better to keep them and just continue to have renters, you know, pay our mortgage for us or to, or is it, you know, causing us more harm, you know?

How many of the three? Are all three of these out of state? Yeah, so we lived in Georgia and Tennessee, so we have houses there, and then moving to New York now. So that would be our last stop, yeah. So we're getting ready to leave this Tennessee house. And I think as we're going to like list it and rent it, I'm thinking to myself, is this a good idea? Should we? All right. So let's do this real quick. Tell me how much you owe on the Georgia house and what

you think you could sell it for. Give me the first part. How much do you owe? Yeah. Yeah. So that's the thing. All three of the, or I guess the two that we would want to sell. I don't think we would, you know, with the cost to sell them, I don't really think we would. So you have very little equity.

You'd break even. Yeah. So break even on Georgia and Tennessee. I think we'd break even on Georgia if that on Tennessee we may owe a little bit because we did kind of move here. And what's New York? What kind of house are we getting in New York? Well, so that one, that's more of a forever home. So that one's a bit bigger. And we plan to stay there and not rent that one out. So that one we definitely want to keep. So you already have a property in New York? We're closing on it, yeah. And that's your third property? Just haven't moved

in yet. Yeah. But it's not a rental. That will be your primary residence going forward. Correct. This is a no-brainer to me, George. Yeah, I'm selling both of these. Number one, it's never wise to be a long-distance landlord. And the way we look at it is you live in New York, would you go out and buy a property in Georgia? Right. No. And so we do actually have a property manager for our house in Georgia that we pay about 300 a month, I think. Well, I'm guessing because you have no equity, this thing is barely cash flowing, if it is at all, after all of your expenses. So the first, the house in Georgia is actually technically two properties. There's like a cottage house in the back.

And so we do kind of have a bonus there. The first year, or one year, we were actually profiting about $600 a month on it, just with the two incomes. Since then, we did lower one of the rents, and so it's about $300 a month that we are, I guess you could say profiting, but I know. No chance. I could go work part-time and make $300 a month. I don't think this is worth it for your sanity, your time, or the money. And so for those reasons, I'm out. I'm going to sell both of these and just start fresh in New York.

And I'm guessing you've got a big mortgage on this New York house? We do, yeah. How much? It was about $500. And I'm guessing you got a big mortgage on this New York house? We do, yeah. How much? It's about $500. And what do you guys make a year? Let's say we sold these condos. What's your actual income going to be in New York? Yeah, take home about $120.

Okay. I mean, even that feels tight just covering the New York mortgage. That feels really tight. Yeah. I think that was just kind of the New York mortgage. That feels really tight. Yeah. I think that was just kind of the decision to not want to, you know, we've moved so many times. We don't want to move again, and we wanted to find the forever home. You don't have to find the forever home in the forever place. Right. What are you guys putting down on this New York property?

What's the down payment? About $100,000. Okay. So it's a $600,000 property. You put down $100,000. You took on the $500,000 mortgage. What's the mortgage compared to your monthly take-home pay? So the mortgage is about, yes, about 40%.

Goodness. You guys like being stressed, huh, when it comes to houses and mortgages. You guys love it. Yeah, I guess so. I mean, in the moment, you know, buying the first two, it seemed like we were living there, so it didn't sound like we were trying to buy, you know, an investment property. We were just kind of living in it. And then when we moved from the first one, the mortgage was paid and it was as if we

didn't even, I mean, not fully know it was there. We, of course, knew it was there, so it didn't seem like a lot. But you guys are working really hard with not much to show for it. You're making six figures, you're running all these properties, and you still have a mortgage payment that's 40% of your take-home pay. And you still got to live your life. And you got to pay off, you're going to lose money on the Tennessee house. You're going to have to pay something.

You got to come out of pocket. Where's that cash? Do you have any money in savings? What was that? I'm sorry? Do you have money in savings? We do, yeah. How much?

About 30. Okay. Well, I'm going to use that money to cover the difference, if needed, when you're selling these places, and then I'm going to restart the baby steps, which means pay off all consumer debt. Do you have any consumer debt outside of mortgages? We don't know. Just finished paying off my student loans. Oh, good for you.

So whatever you guys need, after the dust settles on this, you're going to build up a three to six month emergency fund, then begin investing 15%. Whatever money's left over, which it doesn't sound like there will be much, we'd throw at the house to get this mortgage paid off early. Okay. And so I guess my question would be, so you would say sell the houses immediately or try to hold on to them until we can break even? No, I don't know there's going to be a day in time you break even. I'm going to sell them now and cut my losses and consider it a stupid tax. Okay. And get your income up.

If you're going to sign up for 40% of your take home for a house, you're going to be house poor. And this is on a 30-year, I imagine? A 30-year, yeah. Oh, man. You guys better start making some money. Now, I'm going to tell you something you don't want to hear, Megan, but if it were me, I would rent for a year or two, clean up this mess,

get a bigger down payment, be able to increase our income, and I would say we are planting roots in New York. Great. But we do not have to buy the dream home or the forever home right now. I would wait. Gotcha. Okay. I just don't want to buy a house george and then be like

every month just are we gonna make it well the forever home turns into uh forever stress because it's hard to keep up when you're making 40 payments toward that mortgage and you only have this much left to live your life especially in in a high-cost of living area like New York. So I wish you guys the best. I think you're on the path if you sell these and cover the difference with the emergency fund, then stock it back up and start investing. But I think you'll be hard-pressed to invest 15% while having anything extra to throw to the mortgage while living your life. Yeah. So at this point, now you have to out-earn your decision. Let's get that income up. That's the solution here. That's not always fun either. So at this point, now you have to out-earn your decision. Let's get that income up. That's the solution here. That's not always fun either. So anyway, thanks for the call, Megan. Hoping the best for you.

Really appreciate it. All right. We got to do a quick break. We'll be right back. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, you guys. Health insurance costs are only moving one way, and that way isn't down. And if higher costs aren't enough, the wait times to see your doctor are longer, and it's harder than ever to get anything approved through the bureaucracy. So if you feel like the system is working against you, try a biblically-based alternative to health insurance, Christian Healthcare Ministries. CHM is a health cost-sharing ministry that's helped hundreds of thousands of families like yours take care of over $11 billion in medical bills since

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How are you feeling, George? Did you get caffeinated earlier? I'm alive. I'm still fading, Ken. You need another cold brew? I think that'll be too much caffeine for my little body. Yeah, I think you'll start shaking. All right, you ready to take another call? Let's do it.

Who do we got? We got Josh in Los Angeles, California. Josh, how can we help? Hey, how's it going? Thanks for taking my call. You bet. What's happening? Well, it's raining, so that's weird, but that's not why I'm calling.

All right. I'm calling because I have two cars. I have an electric Fiat and I have a Jaguar, and I want to sell them both and get a Rivian. And so my question is, do I use the money that I sold both of them for to buy the Rivian in cash, or do I put that money in my Robinhood account, which is earning 5.25% interest, and then I have some more money in there, and then use the interest being paid to lease it, so I can hold on to my principal? All right. Is this a legit call, or is this one of those, hey, I've been listening to this show, and I think I'm going to stump George and Ken? I got to know.

No, it's a real car. It's a real call. How old are you? A real call, yeah. Oh, 43. And what do you make a year? Making $380. Wow.

What do you do for a living? I'm a TV producer. Oh, very nice. Nice. Any shows that George watches? Yeah. I kid. I've done fear factor um back in the day i did deadliest catch oh yeah i used to watch deadliest catch you wouldn't think about it at looking at me but i thought it was a fun show i really did and fear factor that was a fun one the pig the pig intestines all all the stuff. Did you eat the pig intestines?

Yeah. Pig intestines actually weren't the worst thing I've eaten, but yes. Wow. I did the pig intestines. The worst was probably I had to eat a rat for our 100th episode in New York. Josh, your commitment to excellence is second to none. I applaud you, sir. Respect.

All right. Let's get to the numbers. Well, I know, but people want to hear this, George. Ken got distracted by the pig intestines. Everything to you is a calculator. I just need to get to know these people. Alright? Would you just relax? America wants to know this. This is a man who ate a rat

once. Alright? Now, Josh... Wait, is my question absurd? Is that why you think I'm a fake caller? Yes, I'll tell you why it's absurd. Here's why it's absurd. Okay, please, tell me. You make make a lot of money and I'm guessing you have some equity in these other two cars? They're paid for. They're paid for. So why in the world would you lease a car with earned interest from your Robinhood account when you've got the money to just buy the car you want? This Rivian's expensive. It's about a $90,000 to $100,000 car, isn't it?

I was going to get a used one for $65,000 because I don't want to spend money on a new car. You're brilliant, Josh. I just don't know what the angle is as to why you think this is a good money play. You seem like a very intelligent guy, the rat withstanding. Why would you want to lease the car? What's the benefit? Well, my thought is that I have this money, so I have like $180,000 in my Robin Hoods earning like $1,000 a month, and then I can just use that $1,000 a month

to pay for the car, and then in three years, I still have my $200,000 sitting there as opposed to spending $65,000 of that to buy the Rivian. And then in three years, who knows what that thing's going to be worth. Yeah. All right. George, you've heard this before. Well, the problem with leasing is that you won't own anything at the end of that. And so you're

just going to trade, you're going to sell these cars and just get on a life of payments. And this amount of money, it's a small part of your world even if you paid cash for this thing you still have six figures sitting in savings that can work for you right instead of bleeding out to a lender every month to make them rich because all you're doing with leasing is you're pre-paying the depreciation on that car that's the key what about getting a loan for the car and paying for it that way that's just that's just slightly less dumb, but still dumb to the nth degree. Why? It sounds like you're just wanting to leverage debt for your whole life,

and you're too successful to play that game. That's a game for broke people. Your greatest wealth-building tool right now is your income, making $380,000. And if you cannot give any of that money to lenders, you're going to be so unbelievably wealthy and you're going to make very different choices when it comes to the things that you spend money on. Because when you get a loan, you go, well, I'll get the new one then. Who cares? The payment's low compared to my income. And that's how people end up giving away

a large portion of their wealth over a long period of time. So instead, take what you would have put in a lease and add that to your investment accounts and to your savings. Yeah, but you're also assuming here that there's no risk with the Robinhood account. There's like nothing could go wrong. Well, let's just play this out. Savings rates are at an all-time high, as you know that, Josh, and they're probably going to go down over the next few years as things cool off. And so there's an assumption that I'm always going to be making enough or making enough to make the spread worth it.

And it's just too much brain calories burned, too much stress. I think the peace of mind of just owning it free and clear is going to make your life better. Okay. Yeah, you're right. That's a good point. I didn't think about that interest rate going down, but 100%. Well, and just the emotion of it, just the peace of mind. I found that you could out-math me all day, Josh.

You're a very smart dude, and on paper, you could win. That's exactly right. I'm not that smart. Yeah, well, it was for your job. So, again, very impressive. You're very brave. You know what? $380,000, I might eat a rat.

I don't think I would. Was it cooked? That makes a difference to you? It does. I was only making $500 a rat. I don't think I would. Was it cooked? That makes a difference to you? It does. I'm only making $500 a week. I think the psychological part of eating a rat doesn't matter whether it's raw or cooked. I just feel like Dr. John Deloney would eat a rat. He would, but he's nuts.

That's fair. That's a whole separate deal. That's a good point. But Josh, here's the thing. I want to wrap this up because George is right. On paper, because there are people watching and listening to this, a lot of people. They want to wrap this up because George is right. On paper, because there are people watching and listening to this, a lot of people. They're like, oh, Josh got it. Listen, on paper, you can make this case, but most people can only make the case on paper and they can't live it out. And so they start leasing. Then they go, oh, I'm going to

make debt work for me. And all these influencers on social media tell you, oh, you know, you guys, you can make debt work. And most people can't. And if you think that it's our opinion, just look at the sheer numbers. And so that's why we're kind of preaching this. It's a philosophy that in the long run wins in the numbers big time. So I really appreciate your great sport. And George, this is a call that we get. I mean, I feel like this call happens once a month. Yeah. Somebody goes, well, I can leverage debt and I can get this and I do this. I did my attempt at talking about these fleeces and I made a video called Why Car Leasing is Stupid on my YouTube channel about eight months ago. So Josh, go search

for Why Car Leasing is Stupid on YouTube. You'll find my video there. Just give it a watch. It's less than 10 minutes. It's entertaining. And I go through the actual mathematics of why leasing is stupid on YouTube. You'll find my video there. Just give it a watch. It's less than 10 minutes. It's entertaining. And I go through the actual mathematics of why leasing a car is so dumb. I also did my biggest video ever, Ken. It's almost at a million views now, is the number one wealth killer. It was all about car loans. And people were actually getting it after the video going, oh my gosh. So the comments are- I regret the car payment. I regret the lease. Never again. Yeah. And well done. Well done, sir. Two shameless plugs for your YouTube channel. I'm trying to give people a next step

because we can't cover this all in a radio call. Oh yeah. I got no problem with it. I'm just saying it was beautiful. Thank you. You're a giver. I mean, you just drop that in there. I just remembered. I was like, I think I covered this on a video recently and went in depth on the car lease. But I thought you made a really good point here is that you can win an argument on paper that doesn't necessarily play out in real life. And it rarely does. And I want to give Josh a gift because I had fun talking with him. I'm going to send you a copy of my book, Breaking Free from Broke. I want you to read, I believe it's chapter five on car loans because I break all of this down. I cover all of the objections and I tell people what to do instead. And dude, you were so successful.

You just truly don't need debt in your life ever. Yeah, good for you. You got the two cards. By the way, Josh, if Fear Factor makes a comeback, George and I would both like to audition. I might regret that. You think a Fear Factor junior where, like, Ken eats tofu? Well, I think the thing with Fear Factor is you can jump into the competition,

and if it gets to be too much, you go home out. Yeah, but you're a competitive man. I feel like you're going to see it through. I've seen you on the pickleball court. I am a competitor, and you put me in a situation like that, I feel like I hold my nose. But I will tell you, as much as I'm talking trash right now, I don't think I could eat a rat.

I think that's probably too much for me. I'm glad you have some sort of standards and limits for your life. Bugs. I used to watch Survivor. I watch Alone on Netflix. All these things that I would never do, but I really am enthralled by them. I don't think I could chew on a rat. I think I'd have a hard time getting that down.

But it's a chewy meat, don't you think? I think we're off the air at this point is what I think. We are not. Nobody wants to hear this. These are the questions America wants to wrestle with. Can't always be about money, George. All right, don't move. We've got a debt-free scream coming up next.

This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. George Campbell joins me. The phone number is 888-825- 5225. And George, I look across the studio out into the lobby. Fabulous young couple looking at us.

Ebullient is the word that comes to mind. It's a big word for George. What that means is they're glowing. Thank you for the translation. There you go. It's very exciting. And I believe this is Steve and Maggie. Is that right? That's correct. Where are you guys from? We are from Minneapolis, Minnesota. All right. And we met you guys earlier today. We know you're here for a debt-free scream. That's so exciting. Let's get the numbers. How much money,

how much debt did you pay off? We paid off 200, I'm sorry, $129,610. Wow. And how long did that take? Just over 39 months. 39 months. And what was the range of income during that time? We started at around $130,000 and we got to $217,000. Whoa. What happened? Give me that story.

Honestly, just promotions at work. Yeah. Just crushing it. What do you guys do for a living? I'm a customer success manager at a software Just crushing it. What do you guys do for a living? I'm a customer success manager at a software company. Okay. And I'm a sales manager at a logistics company. Nice.

So you guys both contributed to the increase in income? Yes. All right. Very awesome. That's good stuff. Okay. So take us to the moment 39 months ago, and you guys say we've had it. We're going to take this debt-free journey.

What was going on? How did you discover this process of the baby steps? Yeah, I mean, I'll never forget it. Rewind back to 2019. We were dating at the time, and we decided to move out to Denver from Minneapolis and start living together. And around that same time, we saw our friends here posted on Facebook the amount that they paid off in their student loans. So my initial reaction was, wonder what lottery they won, right? Reached out and they introduced us to the Ramsey plan and everything. So fast forward six months, we had lived together for a

while, COVID kicked off and really nothing had changed financially. We both got new jobs. We're making the most money we ever had, but we're in the worst financial position we ever had been. So for me personally, it took a lot to just sit down and say, okay, what's not working, right? Figure out if there's a cashflow issue or what's going on. And I figured out that every dollar of my income was going right back out to payments. Wow. I think between all of our debt, it was 11 separate payments every single month. What kind of debt was it? We had student loans and credit cards and cars.

Okay. So your garden variety debt? Yep. Yeah. Pretty normal. Completely normal, right? Sure, sure, sure. cars. Okay. So you're garden variety debt? Yep. Yeah. Pretty normal. Completely normal, right? Sure, sure, sure. Wow.

Yeah. Well, you guys are an impressive young couple. How long have you been married now? Coming up on two years. So in the middle of all this, you're getting married and cash flowing the wedding, I hope? We cash flowed the wedding. Wow. Did you make different decisions because of that?

Because of this journey? Yeah, definitely. I kind of started out by doing this myself, right? And I sold off my brand new car. That was really hard. That's what got cash flow back in. What was the car? Let us know. A Chevy Malibu, but it was sweet. It was all black and it was my first new car purchase. I didn't know there were any more sweet Malibus. I'm going to have to look that up. I'll take your word for it. They're out there. No judgment. That was extremely hard for me because I loved my car, but that was the kickstart of it. And then 2020, at the end of 2020, we got engaged and started talking about money together

a lot more. All right, so real quick. So you're living together, and you come home after talking to friends over here, and you go after it. Maggie, are you just kind of like, what is going on? I was not into it. I had a sense. At all.

Yeah. What was your reasoning? I thought that I was doing everything the right way already. Yep. So were you stressed about money at this point? Or were you just like, it's fine. We can manage the payments. I think she was pretty relaxed about it.

I felt pretty relaxed. Okay. I'm over here sweating. Yeah. Yeah. Was it because you were handling more of the financial world and you felt the brunt of that or what? I just felt like I spent, but I wasn't overspending

and everybody has to earn loans. So you just thought, well, this is normal. You're just kind of a low-grade stress making your payments and you just live your life. Exactly. So at what point do you, Maggie, go, I'm on board? Was it pre-engagement? Was it post-engagement?

What's the story? It was probably around the time of engagement, realizing that we have to be on the same page, whatever plan that is. And he was really ready to go. I had to excel spreadsheets. You were gazelle intense. I had it all planned out, showed her when we'd be done.

And we knew we had to cash flow that wedding. So that was the kickstart of how do we budget enough so we can save for the wedding while also paying off debt. Nice. And, you know, we kept things separate up until our marriage, but really worked together throughout that first year. I'm curious, once you guys get married and you combine finances, did you get a pep in the step as far as knocking out debt with dual income and really being focused? Yeah, major.

We did actually both put our bank accounts onto every dollar. So for about a year leading up to getting married, we were budgeting together, even though our bank accounts were separate, which was huge in being transparent. It felt like premarital counseling in itself. Yeah. And from there, once we got married, I think we combined our bank accounts like two days later and we just went crazy. Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah. And did it change your marriage? Like, is it healthier because you guys had this experience together and you got on the same page speaking the same language? Absolutely. We still have our budget meetings at least monthly if we're talking about it every day every week but we sit down create our budgets every month and at the beginning they're a lot more tearful but now it's easy now

it's less stress no payments there's no debt columns to deal with pretty streamlined wow so we got a lot of people listening watching watching. What would you both say? Give us your quick anecdote on what the key is to getting debt free from your own perspectives. Yeah, we each picked one. For me personally, I think the key to getting out of debt is starting. As easy as that sounds, I think it's the hardest thing for people to do. Right. For me, it was facing the numbers, laying everything out, looking at that pile of debt we

had and facing it head on. It was very emotional. I didn't even know how much debt we had, right? So that's step one is really laying it out for yourself and going along with that as a budget. You have to have some intentionality there in order to make progress. What about you? Yeah, I would say having a plan and working on it together. No way could we have done this without every dollar and putting every single line item in there, dragging our transactions, though sometimes painful. And doing this together was the biggest piece,

being on the same page. I love it. Let's stay in that lane here. What about your support group? I mean, we obviously know we've got a fabulous young couple over there who modeled the way for you, your friends, but what was the support like? You know, I think we really were our biggest cheerleaders, each other. Ah, good. So many people have opinions, you know, finances are personal. There's a lot of different schools of thoughts out there. So we knew what we wanted in the end and figured we're going to stick on that path. Yeah. And it worked out for you.

Our friends and family were great though. They were always checking in with us, always, you know, asking about our journey and it's awesome. Yeah. That's huge. Well, since every dollar was a big part of your life, we also have a gift for you. We have two every dollar premiums. So one you can use for yourselves and you won't have to pay for the upgrade if you already have it. And another one you can give away and tell someone else, hey, I believe in your journey. Here you go.

This is the tool that helped us do it. That's awesome. Thank you. Fantastic. I absolutely love it. I got to ask, now you stand here. You guys have been married how long? Almost two years.

Almost two years in May. Yeah. So, I mean, I still think that's a newlywed. It is. It is. It's great. And you guys have the rest of your life in front of you. Have you allowed your brain to start to compute and begin to dream now that you've reached this milestone? And if you have, what do you feel comfortable sharing about the future that you can now do yeah i mean we we really haven't slowed down as soon as we finished paying off of our debt we built up our emergency fund and now we're on 3b building up our down payment come on so it's been really fun

working together on that and knowing how quickly we can come up with cash because we don't have to worry about those other payments. And you guys are going to be millionaires before you know it. Well, that's the thing. We used the Ramsey Plus to look at the network calculator, and we were just like freaking out. Let's do it. That's crazy.

You guys ready to celebrate? Let's do it. All right, folks. We got Steve and Maggie from Minneapolis. They paid off $129,000 in 39 months, making $130,000 to $217,000. Take it away. Let's hear your debt-free scream. Three, two, one.

We're debt-free! Yeah! Steve and Maggie. How about that? A young couple. They have their entire life in front of them. I love that part. She's like, we looked ahead on the investment calculator.

That's where it gets exciting. Building for the future instead of paying for the past. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. George Campbell is with me. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Our scripture of the day comes from 1 Timothy 2, verses 1 through 2.

I urge then, first of all, that petitions, prayers, intercession, and thanksgiving be made for all people, for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness. And our quote from our third U.S. president on this President's Day. Who is that, George? Who's the third president? That's my boy, TJ. All right, very good. In matters of style, swim with the current. In matters of principle, stand like a rock.

That's a good one, George. Wow. That's a good one. I bet Tommy had some style. I think he did. I think he would have wore the sweater. Now that's quite the claim. You know, look, this is not going to be in five years from now, George. So at that point, I have

to probably give it to Goodwill. I think the wigs they wore, that didn't hold up either as far as style goes. I don't think so. All the powder. So much powder. And the heat. Think of Philadelphia mid-O-Summer with those little shoes they had to wear. The stockings, the wood shoes. I much powder. In the heat? Think of Philadelphia mid-o-summer with those little shoes they had to wear. The stockings, the wood shoes. I'm out.

It's a tough time. I'll take some Dr. Scholl's over that. Oh, that's funny. That's a tough time to be alive, folks. Oh, I'm so grateful for good shoes. Daniel's up in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Daniel, how can we help? Hey, fellas. Thank you so much for taking my call. I appreciate it, y'all.

You bet. What's up? Well, first off, I just want to let you know I'm at a Chick-fil-A playroom with my kiddo. It's just us two, but you might hear my kiddo in the background. We love that. I had three kids. Good for you, Dad. No problem. We don't care if the kid screams. We can handle it.

Okay, good. Okay, good. So, my question is for about the past We don't care if the kid screams. We can handle it. Okay, good. Okay, good. So my question is, for about the past year, I've been working three jobs trying to support my family. My wife takes care of the kiddo the majority of the time. It's President's Day, so I get the day off to hang out with, um, our daughter. And, um, uh, for about the first six months of me working as many jobs that have been, again, it was like paycheck to paycheck.

That was the reason I started working the extra two jobs and that continued. Um, uh, little late into the last year, we printed off a budget thing because we just knew that something wasn't right. We didn't have to keep living like this. Um, and so we were able to pay off quite a bit of our debt. Uh, I'd say about 18,000, um, we have about 5,000 more. And my question is, I'm just trying to figure out when is the time I'm able to slow down a little bit and start working two instead of the three jobs because I feel like unless there's a holiday or a quick break,

I'm not able to spend the time with them like I would like to. What are you making from your full-time job? 48. So I take home about 14. What do you mean take home 14? 14 every two weeks, I'm sorry. Oh, got it. 1,400. Got it. All right. So about 2,800 a month is what you're taking home. What are the other two jobs bringing in every month take home? I'm a bartender on Thursday, Friday, Saturday, and it's hard to determine how much I'm getting because it does change, but I average it on the low end of about $400 every week, and every two weeks on that I get a $300 check. Okay. So about 600 per month net? Yeah. All right. And what's the third job? I'm a janitor and I make $166 a week.

And is that the least amount of your time spent, I'm guessing? Yes. It's about seven hours a week. Okay. But it's about the same as your bartending gig. You're still making about $600 net. Right. I'm just wondering, if you cut one based on what would give you the most time back, which one would you cut? The most time back, I would keep the janitor position. Financially, I would make quite a bit more bartending.

Like I said, about $400 a week is for sure on the low end. It's on the slow season. But the hours are crazy. Yeah, I work about 21 hours. How does this thing is on? Sorry. I'm sorry. Go ahead.

So the janitor position is Monday through Friday. So I don't really see them at all throughout the week. I leave one job, go to the gym so I can get a second of me time, and then I go work that position, and then by then my kid goes to sleep. The Thursday, Friday, Saturday does eat up my weekend, but I do get the weekdays if I were to leave one of them. Well, it's going to slow down your debt payoff, but I'm okay with slowing it down by a few months.

Is your wife like, hey, listen, you don't exist, and this is putting a strain on me? Yeah, I can see it. They're very supportive, but I can see it. How long have you been on this debt-free journey? How long have you been intense about it paying this down um so i've been intense about working um for about a year now um as far as trying to pay off debt for about four or five months and as far as listening to you all i've been listening for about six weeks now i heard you on the um how to money podcast podcast george and oh yeah those guys are awesome after that yeah thank you how about that great guys out of Atlanta. So here's the thing.

If this is going to be another three months, I think we can stick it out. If this is going to be a year and it's going to extend it by a few months if we slow down, I'm okay with that. But the deal is have a goal and stick to it and just be in communication with your spouse, constant communication. Hey, how are we doing this week? Do I need to take a shift off? Do you need a break? All that kind of stuff. But it sounds like you'll be done with this regardless within the next six months.

It's only 5K left. I have about six grand left. So I've heard you all say the gazelle intense until you get to baby step four. And so I was just thinking. That's when you go from intense to intentional. Emergency fund to get step four. And so I was just thinking... That's when you go from intense to intentional. Emergency fund to get to intentional. The bigger thing is your full-time income needs to come up

if you're going to be the only income in the household. Right. And so long-term, I want you to have the margin to still invest 15% and put money away for those kiddos college and pay off the house early. All of those still need to be goals you have. What's the professional future look like? What would you like to be doing, Daniel?

Let's assume we're just doing one job. We're debt-free. We're in Babysit 456. We're rocking and rolling. What do you want to be doing? So right now, I'm a resource navigator for a nonprofit that helps justice-involved people navigate the system to get benefits and things like this,

but I was told that I should be getting a promotion soon for an employment specialist, which would raise the income about $7,000. Okay, but what's your long-term? Is that the world you want to be in, that nonprofit world and helping folks and get placed and all that? Is that your ministry kind of focus? Yeah, it's just from lived experience. When I was 24, I actually went to prison. So it does speak a lot to me for me to be able to work in that field. It doesn't seem like, yeah, it didn't seem like when I got out that I would be able to do anything other than work in kitchens, which was a long time of where I was at.

But now you know that's not true. That's not true. So I had such imposter syndrome for so long. Here's the deal. I want to give you my Get Clear Career Assessment. My book, From Paycheck to Purpose, is my gift because I want you to dig a little deeper on that. I think you've proved to a lot of people, and I think you'll continue to prove, and you'll have to, you know, you have a different standard because of your past. But, which is unfortunate, I don't think that's deserved. But I want you to think about

what it looks like to grow your income over the next three to five years. Really grow it and still do work that you love. Now, here's the deal. The assessment, the book will help you. But, George, I want to jump in real quick. We've only got a minute here. We've got 30 seconds with you, Daniel. I think there are levels of gazelle intensity, and I think when you've got a wife who's going, I don't think I can stretch this much longer on this kind of schedule and not see you, and it's just really hurting.

I think gazelle is different for George than it is for me. Is that fair, George? That's fair. And I think we need to probably dial back. Well, in stages of life, some people when they're single, I'm like, go work 90 hours. When you've got kids and a wife, it's a different situation. So I would probably, I'm going to say don't try to hang on

for three more months. Not the way it sounds. I'm not in any way disagreeing with you. I'd cut one of the jobs and see where things are at and do the math of how is it going to slow it down. Okay, it's going to slow it down by two months. I like that. So I think that's the move, Daniel. Yeah.

Choose your family in this situation. You're not going to regret that. You can always go back and get the third job or whatever. But I'd pull back and let's breathe a little bit. You're crushing it. I don't have any doubts you guys are going to win big. So hang on the line. We'll get you those gifts.

Appreciate you, Daniel. You're a good man. Now enjoy the play area of Chick-fil-A with your dog. I'm getting hungry. He's a nugget or two. He's eating a rat. Yeah, he's a rat. I'll tell you that. George Campbell, great show. One of the thanks to the guys, Austin, for filling in for James

Childs. Thank you, and thank you, America. This is The Ramsey Show.