The Ramsey Show - App - Set Down What's Killing You and Pick Up What Gives You Energy (Hour 2)

Episode Date: May 13, 2021

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host, Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, host of the Ken Coleman Show, is my co-host, where he talks about finding your dream career, your dream job, and helping you get on a clear path to execute and cause that to happen. So you've got career questions, you've got money and life questions, he and I are here to help you.

The phone number, 888-825-5225. Kyle is in Grand Rapids, Michigan. Hey, Kyle, How are you? Hey, Dave. Thanks for taking my call. I appreciate everything you guys do and the opportunity to discuss my situation. Sure. What's up?

So, I'll be honest, get into it. I'm married with three young children. I'm in debt. I hate my job. I'm having a problem with drinking, and I'm just feeling uninspired, broken, and exhausted. I hate my job. I'm having a problem with drinking, and I'm just feeling uninspired, broken, and exhausted. I've been working the debt, but I have a ways to go, and I can't seem to get out of my own way when it comes to figuring out my career and getting my health together. If you guys need a little bit more backstory, I can give it to you, but basically, I would just

like some advice on how to proceed because I've been struggling emotionally since before my kids were born and I'm still not happy with where I am which I feel bad saying but but that's where I'm at sure I want you to be is just brief but very descriptive on you keep getting in your own way as it relates to figuring out what you want to do with your career what does that mean so I feel like I just keep coming and hitting these mental roadblocks. So I'll sober up and stay focused for a week, two weeks at a time. And then something will happen that'll trigger me emotionally to want to drink or to do something that's not related to the career I want to have. And a lot of times I don't know if it's circumstantial or if I'm getting in my own way. In my heart of hearts, I feel like I can fix it and that I'm just getting in my own way. But

at the same time, I'm in the grind of early parenthood and I'm dealing with a lot of pressure from the career I currently have and I'm the breadwinner. Most of our annual income comes from my job. So I feel like most of my focus has to go there. Sure. It's a family, and it's getting in the way of who I am. Sure. So, Kyle, I'm hearing a lot of things. So the emotional stuff, you need to get some professional help on that, and I'll talk about that in just a moment.

But you've had some ideas. Based on what I'm hearing, you have some ideas. You may have one clear idea that if I could snap my fingers and put you in it on Monday morning knowing you couldn't fail, I got a sense that you have an idea or two. Am I right or am I wrong on what you would do? Yeah, you're right. What is it? And listen, here's what I want you to do for the next couple seconds.

I don't want you to think. Don't think. Don't qualify. I want you to just answer my questions. Agreed? Agreed. Here we go. What is it?

Tell me what it is. What would you do tomorrow if you knew you couldn't fail? I'm apprehensive saying it because it seems true, but honestly, I'd like to get into game development. Game development. Now, you did what I told you not to do, but that's okay because we got the answer. You want to be a developer for video games, yes or no? Yes. Okay.

Do you have the baseline technical talent that if you were trained properly, that you know that you could develop effectively game technology, yes or no? I would need additional training. I don't think so. So the answer is yes. You have the core talent.

If you were trained and educated, you could do it. Do you believe that? If I was trained, yes. Okay. All right. So hey, you got to say for one second, Kyle, I want you to throw off all this self-doubt that's hanging on you like a giant winter coat. Throw it off. You can't even answer a question about yourself because of the doubt. And I know there's a lot going on, and I get that. But, brother, I just want you to get real for a moment and know, wait a second, do I have the technical talent? Now, let me ask you this. Why, I want you to give me a short answer, why would you want to develop for video games? What's the why behind that?

Because I like creating experiences. There you go. Always had a knack for technical stuff and always had a knack or always had an interest in experiences. Yes? Yes. Okay, now. And you're a gamer. That's right.

So here's the deal. You think because you're a dad of three small kids, you guys have got some debt, and you're dealing with some emotional stuff which is driving you to drink, you're thinking, I'll never get there. Is that about right? Yeah. But that's not true. Is that about right? Yeah. But that's not true. But that's not true.

So let me challenge you. All right? You need to understand that there is a path. So you know what you want to do. If you could just make it happen, you know what you want to do. So you're in that get clear stage. Now it's all about getting qualified. So you have to actually do the homework and not get stuck in the bottle and doubt and insecurity and fear about what it's

going to look like and go, what would it take? What has to be true for me to be qualified to actually apply for jobs like that and someone hire me? Is it starting out in another development role and getting development experience somewhere else and then crossing over the video game industry? There's lots of different paths, brother. I'm telling you. One thing I want you to do is call Bethel Tech. Betheltech.net. They're a partner of the Ken Coleman Show.

And they take adults from zero technology experience, zero, to working in the technology industry in nine months, less than 15 grand. You're not there yet. You've got to get your debt paid off. Dave Ramsey, Ramsey Solutions, we can help you with that. But you've got to believe that you can get there. And then I think You've got to get your debt paid off. Dave Ramsey, Ramsey Solutions, we can help you with that. But you've got to believe that you can get there.

And then I think you've got to get healthy. Dave, I think he's got to get healthy, and he's got to get on the debt elimination plan. And we put the dream on hold. It doesn't mean it's gone. It doesn't mean we'll never get there. But you've got to get out of debt, and you've got to get healthy emotionally to where you believe that you do have what it takes and that you have a unique contribution so that you're not leaning towards the bottle. So are you guys involved in church at all?

No, not at all. How old are you? I'm 34. Okay. All right. When I was a young dad, I wasn't either, and I wandered in the back door one. It changed my whole life because I got men and women in my life that would walk beside me as I changed some of the habits I needed to change to be successful. I like that idea, and I haven't asked my wife about that because we're yearning for that sense of community,

and I feel like just the overall message and sense of community, whether we're religious or not, would be helpful. Exactly. So we almost went to church for that reason alone. That's okay. That won't make anybody mad, even the people at the church. Just go over there and make some friends with good people. And good people will walk beside you, and once they're good enough friends to reach over and pop you on the back of the head if you're drinking too much, that's a really good friend. Right? You need

some buddies in your life, man. You need a band of brothers that love you enough to knock a knot on your noggin. I agree with that. And you can pick it up there, and it wouldn't hurt to step into a 12-step program. It wouldn't hurt to sit down with a good counselor. Because what it amounts to is you're stuck, and the way you get unstuck is you get new information and new inspiration. Yes, sir. And that helps you then build a vision for your life that Ken was laying out for you that you can believe in. And when you believe in that vision, then you can run through walls to get there.

And you can set down the things that are causing you to stumble. And we've all got them, man. It ain't different than you, me and Ken. If you counted up the stupid butt stuff between the two of us that we've done, you can fill a room with it. But you've got to set down the stuff that's killing you and pick up the stuff that gives you the energy. And that's goal setting and inspiration, information, good people in your life, good community in your life. So, yeah, that's my assignment for you. And then walk with Ken over at KenColeman.com and he'll get you the job.

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Most of it's confusing. And some of the so-called experts sound like Charlie Brown's teacher. Wah, wah, wah, wah, with all the big fancy words, trying to sound smart. Learning about money should not be this complicated, because it's not. That's why we created Ramsey Plus. We break down the financial topics in Ramsey Plus that are important to you, so you can tackle whatever you're facing right now, customized to you. We'll be right back. with the super confusing business of filing your taxes. That's right. Ramsey Plus is now offering a free Federal Classic e-file with Ramsey Smart Tax. And remember, Tax Day is next week for all you procrastinators out there.

Don't panic. We have a quick, simple, and reliable way to do your taxes Ramsey style. So get them knocked out with your Ramsey Plus trial. Money can make sense. Text the word trial to 3378 text trial for a free trial to 33 789 33 789 our question today comes from blinds.com they have a 100 satisfaction guarantee means even if you mismeasure you pick the wrong color they'll remake the blinds for free free samples free shipping and new promos all the time.

Use the promo code RAMSY. It's magic to save money. Today's question comes from Emily in Louisiana. She writes in, I will graduate from college debt-free this year with an MBA. I'm taking FPU currently, and I want to work for a company that matches my values and is passionate about helping people change their future. As I start looking for jobs, how do I decide my career path and then find a company that aligns with these values? Sounds like she needs to come here. She does, and she might be tipping us off there. We'll have to see. A very simple process that I teach,

and you use your talent. That's what you do best, think hard skills, soft skills, to perform your passion. That's work that you love. Think of a task, a function, a role that you just love doing. To accomplish your mission, that's results that matter deeply to you. So how you figure out if a career path is the right one for you, which by the way, Dave, when you figure out where those three gifts from your creator align, talent, what you do best, passion, work you love, mission, results that matter, when they come together, it looks like this. I use what I do best to do work I love to accomplish results that matter to me. And here's what happens. When you answer those questions, what I do best, what work I love, what results I want to accomplish, then we're looking at job descriptions.

We're looking at career paths, and we just simply go, does this particular career path with the jobs that are on that path, do they allow me to use my talent? Do they allow me to do work I enjoy? And do I create results that matter? Once we figure that out, Dave, what we're going to see is multiple jobs, career paths, and even dream jobs in that contribution zone, or in other words, the sweet spot.

And that's how you determine which way to go. And she's asking also about aligning with a company that aligns with her values. So because some companies are real mission and values driven, and others just want to hire you to get the work done, and you've got mba and you can do this work and it could it could fit all of those three things yep but you get plugged in as a robot that's correct into a place that it doesn't really it in a sense is agnostic in the sense that it has no values it's not values driven it's it's driven by performance it's driven by well i guess

that's a value sure but uh how do you the interview process, let's coach her a little bit, find out if the company is, you know, going to be political, cutthroat, performance, climbing on the bodies of the people behind you, in front of you to get up the ladder, or it's going to be caring and missional. And how do you find that out? Because people put on their best face when they're doing interviews, but companies put on their best face when they're interviewing. That's exactly right.

And then there's, let's go a step deeper, there are some leaders in an organization that will have a different answer than the actual top-level leadership. So you've really got to do your homework beyond the interview. But to answer your question, in the interview, you you want to ask questions like what kind of person wins here that's an open-ended question a lot of hiring managers don't get asked so they're going to be one of two responses there if they're and they're stumbling all over themselves that means they actually haven't thought it out that should be a warning sign i wouldn't call it a red flag but a yellow flag if they answer in a way that is just very flat and it just sounds like corporate jargon,

that's a red flag. And if they say some things that make you go, whoa, that doesn't sound like the kind of person that I am. So you're asking an open-ended question of what kind of person wins here? How do the company values show up in the workplace every day? That's another open-ended question. If they've thought about it, like at Ramsey Solutions, if a hiring manager here can't answer that question, well, they've been on medication and it's not a normal day for them. We know. We can say, here's how the Ramsey Solutions values enter into the hallway, into meetings, at live events, when we're talking on customer care so you need to ask questions like

that and the answers themselves the quality of the answer the lack of an answer is going to reveal a lot to you now back to that the the three-part uh indicator that i laid out for folks when you know what results you want to create and you say okay you know i think i think i want to add to that other part though before you do that okay i think you can smell the air in a place oh you can i i mean if they're walking around like a bunch of stepford children all buttoned up corporate crap then you kind of you kind of got an or if they're sloppy yeah and and they're they're you know they're not on time um you know they're just uh you know like they all just were smoking pot at the break you know i mean or whatever do you feel kindness in the air happiness in the air do you see people uh when they're walking are

they walking really slow like somebody just whipped them and they got no hope or are they walking a little too fast because they're stressed out no hope or are they walking a little too fast because they're stressed out it's a little too fake a little too clean a little too perfect that's the step for example i think i think you kind of got to look for those kinds of things tell you yes but i'll tell you what else smell the air you can smell the air but again that's not a gonna gonna be a complete indicator because but because you got to do one thing i think that people do that would be smart is to look at vendor reviews. If you can do some homework and see what are their vendors, what is a company's vendors, some people out there.

Now, you don't take one comment. But if you could see a pattern of people going, they don't treat their vendors well, they don't treat their customers well, that's also a big sign. And again, I'm not talking the one or two. I'm saying if there's a narrative where customers go, these people, big business, they don't care about us. They don't take care. That's a values issue. Because if you see those comments once or twice about Ramsey, that gets fixed. We take serious the way we care for people. There's a values issue there. And how you and our leadership team have drilled that into us it's not acceptable

and i think that there's another way to get away from the disgruntled employees if you make a mistake i want to caution something don't go to glass door and facebook to get a review on a company well the problem that's usually disgruntled people well not and it's not only that it's um you don't even know if it's real because it's anonymous. It's like a Yelp review on a restaurant. You can't trust a Yelp review on a restaurant. That's true. Because what happened with Yelp was that competitors would jump on and trash the restaurant as if they were a customer and they weren't. Yeah, it's being manipulated. And that's what's happening with Glassdoor.

Glassdoor is losing its credibility fast. That's not credible. But I think if you look at customer reviews uh vendor reviews that's going to also give you a sign as to how does this how does this organization treat people in general yeah i think to me if i'm her looking for a job with an mba fresh out and uh she couched it in the in the not only finding her sweet spot which you obviously described beautifully, but I think sometimes people look for the income, the benefits, the job description, and they leave out the character. Yes, and the culture.

The sense, the culture, the spirit of the place, the values of the place. Absolutely right. Which those are the things that could destroy you. You could be in your dream job, Dave, in a horrible culture, and you won't last six months. Yep. Exactly. Exactly. That is absolutely the case.

You will not be living the dream. No. Yep. That's it. That's what I was talking about. Yeah. Very good. This is The Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today.

In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage, Drew and Stephanie are with us. Hey, guys, how are you? We're great. How are you? We're good. Welcome, welcome. Where do you guys live? Scottsdale, Arizona. That's a bit of a haul to Nashville. Well, good to have you. Thanks for being here.

Thank you. And how much debt have you guys paid off? We did $77,928. Love it. How long did this take? Just under seven months. Good for you. And your range of income during that time? The range during that seven months, the high end was about $308,000, low end about $218,000. Okay, cool. What do you guys do for a living? So I'm in leadership at a car insurance company. I'm a respiratory therapist. Awesome. Very cool. What kind of debt was the $78,000? All mine.

100% of it. Everything. So I went through a divorce in the past, kind of an expensive one that cost some money, but the normal stuff, credit cards, had one car loan, some consolidation loan, just you name it, I had it. So you were kind of normal. I was normal. Fortunately, I married somebody that was already nerdy i love it how long you guys been married we got married in

march of 2020 oh wow so uh pandemic marriage i like it with a respiratory therapist no less wow yeah this is cool it was crazy we were supposed to get married in Hawaii March last year. We had to call that off the week before. Sure. But we still got married. We knew that that was the important part, and people we loved were there with us. It was actually a blessing because it saved us a lot of money. We just had a little group in our backyard and did it that way. And it was actually a big relief.

And it felt like plan B was supposed to be plan A. Amen. It all works out. Very good. So tell me how this story goes down. You get married and she straightens you out or what's the deal here? Man, she straightened me out. So I knew heading into it.

Before the marriage, I sold my truck. So that was the first step. I had the new truck. I had to get rid of that. So I got rid of that. I bought a 10-year-old Subaru that I drove. So I was already kind of inching my way as we entered the marriage. Because you kind of knew what she expected. Yes. Yes. It was time. So once we got married, I think for me, it was just pure shame of having the debt and knowing that we needed to tackle it real quickly because I didn't want to carry that

and saddle her with that. I had done Financial Peace University in my early 20s, so I was debt-free, but I hadn't gotten much farther than that. And I looked at the mountain of debt that we then had and knew that that wasn't going to be how we were going to start our future and our family. So we knew that we had to do something. And shortly after we got married, about a week and a half later, there was a great need for my job profession in New York.

And honestly, that's what really kick-started all of it was that opportunity. So you got incredible income for a short period of time there yes and you said all right we can clean this up real fast we got to lean into it um and so you reconnected got out your old fpu stuff or what how'd this work no you did the free trial yeah um we for ramsey plus yeah so we did that we um we We did inspirational rings in our house that we cut down with each debt we paid off. We listened to podcasts nonstop. We did all the free stuff. Good. All my old DVDs, I don't think I even have them anymore, but we listened to podcasts like crazy

and just motivated each other a lot. So what do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is? Man, you have to submit to it. You have to just want to get out of debt. You have to, I think guys out there listening could probably relate to just the shame of it. Like I think a lot of guys, just especially guys, guys, you don't want to be walking around with that stuff. Like just get rid of it.

I mean, we have to work as a team. Obviously, I think that was like our biggest strength is we were always on the same page, always positive. Never had a single fight about it because we were just on board with the plan, the exact order that you lay out. I mean, we just did it. I would say accountability, too. Just stop defending your debt and accept it and just focus on what you can do to move forward. Think about the life and the future that you want to have and what you need to do to get there. Stop defending it.

That is a great phrase. Phenomenal. And I want to give Drew some love. Yeah, man. Well done, sir. Because you said something just a minute ago. I want some dudes to hear. We'll pick on the dudes, right?

Yeah. So you said submit to the process. Submit is such a word. We don't use that word much. But that means I'm realizing that it's bigger than me. And you said right out of the gate that you didn't want to saddle your wife with this, this new marriage, this new opportunity to start again. Submitting to the sacrifice.

Submitting to the discipline. That is really huge because i think that's what people don't get it's got to be bigger than you and your discomfort it's got to be big picture yep um i just want to praise you for that but i want to ask a question at what point in the journey i love to ask folks this in the seven months you did this pretty quick at what point did you guys go oh there's the momentum like it's been hard hard hard and now we're going oh i could feel the juice here. We're getting somewhere. Yeah, we were

rolling early on. So when she went to New York for me, I mean, when COVID was new, it was scary. Like, you know, it's a little bit different now. I think we understand it better, and it's kind of, you know, gone by. But at the beginning, it was like, you know, I'm going to send my wife up there into this kind of crazy, hectic world. I'm not going to let her do that for nothing.

So, you know, if she's going to do that, I'm going to be back home working, but I'm not spending a dime. You know, I'm going to lock down, follow the process. So we got some momentum rolling. She was getting paid every Friday and we were just every single Thursday before we would know what the paycheck would be. All right. How much can we, how much can we attack this stuff?

What's going to come in? What's coming out? Yeah. Stephanie, I'm curious about this. So you were making what in your regular job before all this? Well, I was just working a part-time job, and I was a travel respiratory therapist. What kind of money were you making? I was probably making like $2,000 a week.

Okay. All right. So $100,000 a year. All right. And then you say, all right, I'm going into the battle zone. I'm going to the front lines. I'm going to New York. And what did they pay you?

That was $7,000 a week. A week. Whoa. And obviously, COVID has respiratory written all over it, right? And so you had to have some special fear and some special knowledge about that. What, I mean, what were you, because people, a lot of people in the medical profession ran the other way. They just said, they're shut down.

They're getting away from this. And you ran right into the fire, into the burning building. I mean, that's pretty courageous. And you didn't just do that with money and you didn't do that without using your intellect. So talk about how you, I mean, what were you thinking as far as COVID goes? Because obviously you didn't think you were going to die. You wouldn't have gone in there. No.

OK. I knew that it was going to be something incredible when I went there. And that's exactly what it was that first week I flew there. There was maybe three other people on my flight to New York. And there were also health care workers. And, you know everything was empty there but you knew you were part of this amazing thing where people were flying blind to New York just to be part of something they didn't know where we were going to work

how long we were going to be there we're told to be prepared to work seven days a week and didn't know if it was nights or days or what equipment it would be um what kind of death there would be if we would get sick we didn't know if it was nights or days or what equipment it would be, what kind of death there would be, if we would get sick. We didn't know anything, but we knew we were doing it together. So that was definitely reassuring. I knew that I know my job well, but never in the first 12 years of my career doing this did I ever think that people would clap for me driving to work or coming out of work or just walking outside to get fresh air. People would hang out their window and honk and cheer for you.

So it was definitely heartwarming, and you felt like you were a part of something really big. And we talked a lot about how it wasn't going to be for nothing. How long did you do this? I was there for eight weeks. Eight weeks. Wow. $7,000 a week. And then when I left.

Did you get ill? No. No. You made it. Okay. Cool. I've been healthy. I'm so proud of you.

It's neat to talk to a hero. Front line. It's pretty amazing. Running into a burning building. Wow. And like he said, we're not going to do that for nothing. So, wow. And it propels

your your goals as a couple just amazing very very cool y'all i'm so proud of y'all thank you got a copy of the legacy journey because that's the next step in your process for sure you're now ready to be a legacy i think you've got the stuff to do that and an extra copy of the total money makeover for you to give away it's drew and and Stephanie. $78,000 paid off in seven months, making $308,000 and $218,000. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one.

We're debt-free! Wow. What a couple. Oh, wow. This is the Ramsey personality is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Remember this time last year when everyone was quarantining and we talked to health care workers who were scared and with good reason. I'm not shaming anybody for that.

But I'm now running into people on the other side of the story that were real quiet during that time. Sure. No one talked about it much. But Stephanie's case for eight weeks, she made a trip from Phoenix to New York City. And she told us during the break there that the overtime, obviously, $7,000 a week versus what she was making, $2,000 a week. I had a lady, I don't remember if it was you on the air, do a debt-free scream the other day, that had called in during that time.

And you and I fussed at her, told her to get her button gear. Yeah. It was a nurse. Yes, she did. And she went out and she worked Detroit, New York, and Chicago. She lived in Atlanta but bounced around, picked up wherever she could pick up as a nurse, and ended up making $500,000 in 2020. Just unbelievable. And paid off $275,000 worth of debt. And, but, you know, so, you know, but she ran into the burning building, ran into the,

ran at the storm. There it is. Rather than away from it. And it's, you know, it's just interesting human nature to see how some people react to different things and how you come out of it. Yeah. And, you know, wow. One person's crisis is another person's opportunity.

And I think it depends on where you stand. And these were not ill-informed people. These were licensed health care professionals who said, we're going to do this. And we can do it. And they did it. And they came out on the other side. Life changed. In a good way.

Yeah. Karen is with us. Karen's in Knoxville. Hey, Karen. Oops, did I push the wrong – no, I didn't. Karen, how are you, Karen? Hi, Dave. It's great to be able to be on your show and talk to you.

I'm so excited and nervous. Well, it's okay. We've never lost a patient. You'll be all right. What's up? So my question is really we'd like to be able to retire early, two to three years out. My concern is being able to afford health insurance for me for eight years to nine years. I'd have to pay out of pocket for health insurance.

So currently have no debt. We have $1.9 million in retirement accounts. We own our home and we own a piece of property as well, Dream Clear. Are you ill? We have a fully funded emergency fund. Are you ill? No. Why could you not afford health insurance?

You have $2 million. I have that gland that Sharon has. Yeah, but I mean, call Blue Cross Blue Shield. Oh my gosh, that's not enough money. Yeah, call Blue Cross Blue Shield and get a quote, and then compare that to the $2 million that's in your account. I think you're going to be okay. Okay.

It's an electric bill. You've got to pay the electricity, too. I know. How are you going to afford the electric bill? It's ridiculous and silly, but to me it's like well but karen here's the deal if you do what dave says and you actually get a number then you can actually react but you've got a narrative in your head that's that's created this huge amount of fear and even anxiety because you don't have an answer all you need is an answer then you can handle the answer let's pretend this is high this is high but let's

pretend it's a thousand dollars a month that's what i've been told yeah i don't think it will be it could be but i don't think it will be um not with a hsa and a good deductible in in tennessee with blue cross blue shield i doubt it okay but it could be but it's not going to be it's not going to be 500 but it's also not going to be $1,500. So we'll just call it that. $1,000 a month is $12,000 a year. Mm-hmm. Times 10 is $120,000 a year.

Mm-hmm. Times 20 is $240,000 a year. Times 40 is 50 grand. Okay? Yes. You got 1.9 million. That's what we mean by the numbers calm you down. When you look at that, you go,

you know, we're going to be living off of the income of our investments, and one of our expenses is going to be health insurance and you're going to be just fine because that's about where the numbers are going to come down maybe a little off but it's not not enough off that the example versus 1.9 million in your accounts way to go by the way millionaire proud of you great great job very cool But if you put actual numbers to the worry, it can make you feel like the worry is not a big deal because it's not a big deal. And if I heard this correct, she's got more than $2 million. They own the home free and clear plus land free and clear. So it's $2 million plus plus. She's got a net worth over three, but I'm just saying the investments alone are going to take care of the cost.

Because if it makes 10%, that's $200,000 a year, not $12,000 a year. Yeah, that's a good grocery fund. Yeah, you're going to be all right. You're going to be all right. All right, Matt's in Charlotte, North Carolina. Hey, Matt, welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hey, guys, thanks for taking my call. Sure, what's up?

So I'm really looking for some workplace advice. I have kind of a negative workplace, a little bit of a toxic environment, but I get paid really well. So with some of the things kind of going on, my wife's pushing me to look for different opportunities, but we're not in the position the last color was in, but we're in a really good financial position. What do you make? We're right now about $160,000. What's toxic?

They're really profit-driven. It's not really about the employees. It's about how much the employees can kind of make for them. It's very recently I've had some people hired underneath me that are really there to kind of do my job, but I'm responsible for them and I wasn't involved in their hiring. There's some other kind of anti-mentors, some people that I'm supposed to be working with that are really not really team players, they're looking out for themselves, not for the group,

is creating a lot of challenges with my job. So why can't you go get a job in the same field making the same money with a good company? So some of the opportunities I've found and I have been looking, they're not at the level that I'm making now. I am at a really good position. I've worked my way up in this company. So while I wouldn't be taking like a 20% drop, it would still be under what I would be making now.

Like how much? Probably, I think one of the ones I looked at, maybe the high 120s. Versus 160, okay. Versus 160. So my question, Matt, is do you want to leave or does your wife want you to leave? Is it that bad to where you are already going that direction? So I love my career and I love the people I work with, the ones that I've kind of mentioned. If those things were different, there would not be an option. I would be there.

I would stay. Okay, let me ask you a question. Let me ask you a leadership question. What I heard you say was there are some people that were hired that are underneath of you. You had nothing to do in the hiring process. It's a little bit gray to me as to how that decision is being made. Do you think that there is a healthy enough leadership structure that you could talk to your leaders about this, or have you already done that and the can's been kicked down the road?

So that's exactly the situation where I have talked to them about it, brought up these type of situations that I've been through, and they're just kind of kicking them down the road. They're brushing them off. All right. Well, to me, that's a sign. That's a sign. Yeah.

Listen, I think you've got to be patient. You're not in a true toxic situation where your health is is under attack and you're dealing with all kinds of anxiety stuff i would keep looking i would also set your sights a little higher and i would also not worry about taking a temporary cut as long as you can absorb it and it doesn't really challenge your budget and put you in a totally different position if you feel like you can get on another ladder that has a temporary cut, I'm okay with it. But don't settle for that. I wouldn't assume that someone of your pay, your experience, and your ability and desire to win

couldn't get something equally or better. I'd keep looking. I'd look a little harder, and I'd bite the stick a little bit, put up with this a little longer until I found the best opportunity. That would be my advice. Yeah, I think you're working for some horrible leaders. No question. That's what it sounds like to me.

And I don't know that you can fix it. So you probably are going to jettison. It's just a matter of how wisely you do that. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer for The Ramsey Show. This episode is over, but if you heard about an event, product, or service and didn't have a chance to write it down, don't worry.

We list everything you've heard about during this episode in the podcast show notes section or head to theramsayshow.com. Thanks for listening.