The Ramsey Show - App - Should I Change Careers? (Hour 3)

Episode Date: January 15, 2024

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, host of the Ken Coleman Podcast, and number one best-selling author of the book Paycheck to Purpose is my co-host today. Thank you for joining us. We're so glad you're here. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Holden is with us. He's in Austin, Texas. Hi, Holden. How are you? Hi, I'm good. Thanks, Daveen. How are you? I'm good.

Thanks, Dave. And Ken, thanks for having me on. Sure. What's up? I am 39. I live with my wife and two daughters. We are debt-free, thanks to my wife and to your plan. We do owe $260,000 on a house worth about $550,000. I'm an industrial designer with a

master's degree. I was making $80,000 about a year ago before I was laid off, and I made about $50,000 contracting this past year. And I'm considering a career change between my undergraduate and grad school. I was a substitute teacher for a few years, had some long-term jobs, and I love teaching. I've had some good, my design career, I've had some good moments, but I've lacked some fulfillment and I've always felt called to go back to teaching. And I'm calling for advice on how to make that decision and how to look at it from a financial perspective. Is that K-12? Yes, I like to teach art. Okay, and have you considered the higher education level?

I have. I was looking at a community college here and haven't been able to get my foot in the door. What is the pay range? Do you know the difference between community college professor versus K-12 in the Austin area? Yeah. Starting, it would be about $10,000 more at the community college. Well, what are those totals?

What's the number about 53 53 000 for uh k through 12 and maybe 12 around 65 at the community college okay uh and you've substitute taught enough to know that you really like that environment and the reason i'm asking this is because I absolutely respect the calling, and if you've tasted enough of it to where you know the good, the bad, and the ugly, I think it's a different, deeper conversation. But candidly, the public school environment across the nation as a whole is not very good. The National Education Association's own numbers show that 52% of the current teaching population are considering leaving because it is a very difficult environment.

And so I'm leading with that because I want to make sure you know what you're heading into. Right. Do you? I did teach for, yeah, I taught in some difficult schools in Baltimore City. I had long-term jobs during that stretch, teaching for half a school year, two times. So, and yeah, I understand that it is difficult, but I feel ready. Okay. If you had both options on the table, and let's go a step above community college. Let's go higher ed, community college level, then K-12. If you had a job waiting at all three of those levels, which one would you choose? I would choose the K-12.

Because of that age group, you really have a real draw to that age group? Because of that, yeah. And to teach art. Yeah. Oh, I get that. I'm sorry. They don't teach art in a four-year university? Well, my degree is in industrial design, so.

I know. That wasn't what Ken asked you. Yeah. You qualified this, and you qualified to force you into this answer that you've predetermined is the way to go that makes you happy because you've got income i don't know why you can't teach art in a four-year just because you have an industrial arts degree right right no i would definitely be open to that possibility teaching and higher well you have to look at that because here's what I'm getting at when I ask this question.

Is it about instructing the specific topic that gives you the joy, or is it about instructing kids in a certain age group in the topic? That's really important because if you look at the numbers, you were making 80 before you got laid off, and then you made 50 as a contractor. What I'm trying to do is show you that you can do something you really enjoy and make close to 80 uh there might be some short-term sacrifice but i think you got to look at all your options and i think you've limited your options is what i'm trying to help you see right yeah i understand there's a weird thing that Ken and I have observed over 20 years, and he and I have talked about it many times,

that sometimes, more times than not, for some reason, I don't understand the reason, people get in their heads that in order to do something that they love, it automatically means they make less. And I don't know where this comes from, because it ought to be just the opposite. If you're doing something you love, you ought to automatically make more because you would be enthused and creative and motivated and everything else.

But we trap ourselves into this. The only way I can do something I love is I have to sacrifice my income. And that's just not true. By the way, Holden, I'm a teacher. Yeah, that's right not true uh by the way holden i'm a teacher yeah that's right i teach for a living i'm probably the best paid teacher you'll ever met me but but i'm i'm that's what i do it's one of my gifts one of my spiritual gifts leadership and teaching and uh and i'm very good at it i'm not good at a lot of other things, but I teach adults in a lot of different formats and variations, and I didn't decide just because I love watching the light bulb come

on over someone's head after I present them an idea, and they go, I'm going to take that next step. I'm going to do that next thing. A good teacher loves that moment like you do and I do, but I didn't decide that that meant I had to make less. There's another path here, Holden, that I would suggest to you. What if you get back in the industrial design game? Let's say you get back in at 80. Or let's say that you repeat the year you had last year, and I think you should have higher sites than 50 as a freelancer. But let's

say you did 50 again as an instructional designer. How can you do art tutoring and lessons and things like that in an Austin, Texas area where the income would support it? Could you make $30,000 or more over the next 12 months as you begin to take that love of instructing art and you begin to teach some kids and some wealthy families private lessons? There's a couple ways to get to this. And that's what Dave and I are challenging you on is to see all of the ways that you can make the same income, if not more, and work your way into this. It's not a just all or nothing proposition here. That's exactly right by the way that just to be very clear the data that you're citing on the teachers

leaving oh yeah the the classroom are not leaving the classroom the indications are because of the children no no it's the bureaucracy it's the uh politics that's right and the bureaucracy and the ridiculous you know everything that every they've taken everything away from the teacher's ability to teach that's correct And it frustrated the crap out of them. And so because they're all worried about some kind of virtue signaling rather than actually doing the job of teaching. This is The Ramsey Show. Ken Coleman, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Thank you for joining us. We appreciate you hanging out. I'm Dave Ramsey personality is my co-host today thank you for joining us we appreciate you hanging out I'm Dave Ramsey the phone number is 888-825-5225 Annie is with us in Indianapolis

hi Annie welcome to the Ramsey show hi what's up um well thank you for taking my call. So I am just looking for advice on how to talk to my teenage foster son about money in a way that isn't shameful towards his reality, I guess. In a way that isn't what towards his reality? Like making him feel shameful. Shameful. Oh, I see. Making him feel shameful. Shameful. Oh, I see. Making him feel bad. Yeah. Okay.

So he's coming from a poor environment and you don't want to make him feel bad for that. That's good. That's sweet. Good for you. Okay. How old is he? He's 15. And I can give you like an example of something if that would help.

Sure. Sure. Okay. So, like, for Christmas, he's asking for, like, crazy expensive things. And we're like, you know, we don't have the money for that. We can do this instead. And he's like, well, like, I know you have money. And it's like, yeah, but, you know, we have to buy groceries and all these things. And he's like, well, just swipe your food card.

Like, well, we don't have a food card. And he's talking about like snacks. So like things like that, like he doesn't understand. I don't know if that makes sense. Yeah, it does. And how long has he been with you? Almost two months. Okay.

All right. has he been with you um almost two months okay all right well i mean if he's been in and out of foster he may be manipulating you okay that's a possibility with that it may not be simple ignorance it may be a sense of i'm going to get what i can get for they dump me back out into the system. Okay, so beware of that and be careful with that because a teenager that's been in and out of that system, they know the plan and they know how to work it. And so you've got to be loving and kind. It's not a matter of shaming someone,

but be very aware that he may not care about your goals or your money. He may just think I better, you know, I can get this expensive gift, and then when I'm gone, I'll leave with those tennis shoes or that jacket or whatever it is he's wanting, okay? So that's a possibility. But all that aside, we still need to try to minister to him, try to help him while he's under your care, and that's so that you've still got the right question you're asking.

But having said that, then, what do we do? Well, I would just sit down and say, hey, you know, I'm not sure if you care about this, but let me show you how this stuff works and show him a budget, that this is the money comes in and every dollar has an assignment, and we spend some of it on the necessities of life food shelter clothing transportation utilities we spend some of it on enjoyment um and we spend some we invest some of it for the future and that's what has enabled us to be in a financial position to be able to bring you into our home as a foster child and feed you.

And so we have to manage the whole thing, not just do we have the money for that gift, and let him look at it holistically over your shoulder. So when our oldest one turned 12, I sat down. Back in those days, we did a paper budget, and I had her look at the budget with me and then actually start back in those days we wrote checks a paper budget, and I had her look at the budget with me and then actually start – back in those days, we wrote checks. You remember what those were. But she would write out the checks, and I would sign them.

And I'll never forget that she's like 11 or 12 years old, and she's a sweet, sweet kid, and she's looking at this, and she goes electricity is 340 dollars dad and i'm like yeah that's just for one month honey she goes oh man i see why mom's yelling us to keep the door closed all the time unbelievable and turn off all the lights i now know why she's saying that i'm like oh and so she related it you know this this request for you know to behave and not act like you're raising a barn to she finally related it to an actual economic thing and she went good lord because this kid probably has no idea what your electric bill is he may not care but he has no idea what the electric bill is and so when he actually sees that and you go, that's why when you are staying with us,

it's warm in this house because we pay that bill. And so I would introduce him to the whole picture of generosity, of future thinking called saving and investing, of making sure necessities are taken care of before we do luxury things. And then we may not choose to buy expensive gifts so that we can do these other things. And he might, you know, come away going, oh, that's how rich people do it. And, Annie, I would recommend you don't commit to this long term because I understand the

volatility sometimes of these situations. But if I were you, I would come up with a small amount, not a huge amount of money. What's small? Give me an example. Well, I don't know their budget. What do you guys make? What do you guys make income-wise? Like a year? Yeah. Around 85. Okay. Let me just say, maybe you do this for two months and take $100, okay? And I would sit down and explain the concept of give, save, and spend and living on 80%. Just as an example, say, hey, I want to teach you some basic concepts. And I would say, here's what we're going to do. For two months, $100 may be too much. Maybe it's 50 bucks. Okay. The point is, is I would, I would give that child a chance to make some mistakes. I'd teach them how to do it. Say, okay, if we're going to give you 50 bucks for a

month, you're 15, 50 bucks. I think you should save 10%. I think you should give 10% to somebody you choose who you want to give that to. And the rest of it is we're going to let you just spend that how you want to with your friends or whatever. And just I want you to learn how to manage this money because long term and then show them based on a $30,000 salary, a $60,000 salary. I would try to teach with some real money knowing that you've budgeted for it. If he blows it, he blows it, but he learned something through failure. I just think that's a valuable experience for some of these kids to realize how quickly money gets spent. Because I'll tell you something, this kid goes out with only 50 bucks. Well, 100 bucks, it's going to go quick if they want to go to a restaurant with their buddies.

Our kids are learning that with the money they've made, Dave, working. They realize how quick it is. Oh, you want to go to the little place with your friends? Oh, yeah, an appetizer? A is. Oh, you want to go to the little place with your friends? Oh, yeah, an appetizer? A meal? Oh, you're broke. Yeah. And, Annie, you know, I guess one other thing,

because this is such a great question. Thanks for letting us go off on it. I would tell him, say, you know, when I first started my adult life, I didn't have any money and uh and so what i did though was i started looking at what rich people do because rich people handle money that's how they get rich and so here's what i learned from the rich people they always give some they always save some and they're always wise with their spending and um and then you could implement what ken's talking about in that setting and you just teach him you know this is this is what i learned i learned if you if someone's doing something well

you can emulate copy what they are doing and then you can be like them if you want to be skinny eat what skinny people eat right if you want a great marriage talk to people who've been married 67 years not 67 minutes and and you know let's learn how they did that and let's emulate successful people that's called in business best practices and you could tell teenagers this and they get it um and so uh you know i want i want to do rich people stuff with money because i got a good chance of being rich people if i do poor people stuff with money i got a good chance of being rich people. If I do poor people stuff with money, I got a good chance of being poor people because the only reason they're poor is not outside variables.

Some of it is outside variables. Some of it's oppression, bad systems, bad thinking. There's a lot of things that cause people to be poor that aren't their fault, but some of it is behavior. And so the only one you can control is behavior, and that's how we meet people that used to be poor and now are rich, because they controlled the only thing they could control, which is their behavior, and to not spend everything they make on Friday night.

Thank God it's Friday. This is not a rich people saying, right? And so they think in tenure blocks of time, not the attention span of a gnat. And so these are things you can teach him and talk to him about. And it's not about, there's no shame in any of that. Would never shame someone for where they're from because I've been there too. But I want to talk about behaviors that are going to get us to a better place. This is The Ramsey Show.

Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, is my co-host today. Thank you for joining us, America. We're so glad you are here. Phone number is 888-825-5225. Jordan is in Daytona Beach. Hi, Jordan. Welcome. Hey, good afternoon, guys.

Thank you so much. Thank you. How can we help? So I just got started on the EveryDollar tool. I was actually out to lunch with my manager last week. He told me about it. I looked it up and immediately signed up. Cool.

Thank you. I'm really excited to get started on that. Thank you for making it. So I've done baby step one. Luckily, I had, you know, the starter fund, emergency fund saved up already. So I'm jumping right to step two, which gets scary real fast. Yep. I'm jumping right to step two, which gets scary real fast. So basically a quick, quick rundown. I've got about 58,000 in consumer debts.

My question to you is I have an old 401k. It's got about $22,000 on it. I've been sitting there for a couple of years. I haven't added anything to it. Is it a smart move to close that out and use that as a jump start on my debts? Okay, good question. What do you make? It's 60, 60 to 65.

That's your household income? Yes. Okay, all right, good. And, okay, technicality to start with. you can't add to an old 401K. You can only roll it to an IRA. You can only add to a 401K where you currently work. This is an old employer. That doesn't matter, but that's a technicality.

The second thing then is, here's the thing. When you cash out a retirement account, an IRA or a 401k before 59 and a half, they charge you a 10% penalty plus your tax rate. Your tax rate will be probably 25%. And so you're going to be hit with 35% here. And so mathematically, that's like you calling up and saying dave i'm really enthused about getting out of debt i want to borrow some money at 35 percent interest oh man yeah we wouldn't do that we wouldn't do that so we don't want to give the government half of this or a third of

this money seven eight thousand bucks so um i'm gonna yeah i wish i wish it would work but it's not a good shortcut for that reason um people do it but when they wish it would work, but it's not a good shortcut for that reason. People do it, but when they do it, it's all emotional. It's not math. The math just screams in your face, don't do it. That's exactly why I wanted your advice. You know, emotionally I'm looking at it, and I'm like, man, I could knock out a huge chunk of this debt right off the bat and get started.

Actually, about $14,000. Yeah. Because the government would get seven or eight and so in roughly in where we are so that's that's the problem uh but i think you're going to get there and i think you're going to get there because of what the way i'm hearing you describe your first interfaces with this uh after doing this for 30 years you've got all the symptoms of someone who's going to play through this. You're really going to do it.

And so because you reached a point somewhere in the last few weeks that you went, this sucks, something has to change, and I'm it. Yeah, exactly right. Yeah. I mean, I can hear it in your voice and your sentence structure. It's all there. So you're really, you're going to do this. And if you got anything that is non-retirement that you can sell,

you know, the jet ski you haven't used in two years or whatever, I would do that and get this jump started that way. I would do that stuff. But I wouldn't do this. As far as this 401K, I would jump on RamseySolutions.com and click on SmartVestor Pro. Sit down and talk to a SmartVestor Pro. Anytime you've got a 401k, when you leave a company,

you ought to roll it to an IRA into good growth stock mutual funds. There's 8,000 mutual funds to pick from, and you'll get a better performance on that portfolio if you learn just a little bit about it. It's really not hard to learn about it. And a SmartVestor Pro can help you do all that and teach you. So, yeah, that's how I would handle this. Good question, sir.

That one comes up a lot over 30 years. Yeah, it does. And it's smart because this guy is thinking he's now – I love what you said. You can tell that he's tasted what the future could look like. He's like, I want that. And I love that. And that's the beauty of the EveryDollar app. When you lay down your stuff on there and you go oh crap 58 000 but oh we can do this that's right and i can do this and i can do this and i can do this and you start possibility

you know what does this now make possible right that's your brain starts to work that way rather than oh god i'm stuck life sucks you know the biden economy is killing me the anxiety of my father-in-law everything i mean everything's killing me here you know it's just like everything isn't that what budgeting does dave it opens up possibility people realize now they're in control yeah it gives you a sense of it's the weirdest thing somebody can be about to be foreclosed on and when i lay out their budget and show them a we're not going to get foreclosed on but b here's not only the way to stop that but you're going to make it all the way around the corner and start moving towards wealth.

You're not even there yet. You're only six hours in, and yet your anxiety level has dropped way down. Just because you can see the future. It's called hope. Renee is with us in Nashville. Hi, Renee. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Yes, hi. It's so great to talk with you you too what's up um okay so this is my second time doing the baby steps because the first time i did not follow instructions

um well that was coming clean you know um, and I want to get a bigger shovel. I want to shove more money at my debt. I've already paid off $5,000. I have a total of $21,000 of credit card and personal loans and then my mortgage. And I mainly want to pay off the mortgage. And I just, I want to do this as quickly as possible. How much is the mortgage? The mortgage is $65,000.

Oh, great. What do you make? $60,000. About half of that is tax-free. What do you do? I work for a pharmaceutical company. From home, I work remote. Absolutely love it.

It saves me so much money on gas and food and everything. And then the other half is VA. Okay. 90% disabled. So that's what you mean by the tax-free income? Yeah. Okay. So when someone says they want a bigger shovel, that means I want to make some more money, bring in some more money. So based on your experience and what you're doing now, what comes to mind for you if you think about the freelance opportunities that are out there? Because we live in an age right

now where freelance work is very available. So what could you do? What do you bring to the table as a skill set that you could start to look for freelance opportunities or even a better full-time job? Well, I have a lot of friends that do DoorDash. Some of them, it has been a blessing and very lucrative for them. Others, not so much. That's not a skill set. I can drive a car. I wouldn't call that a skill. In fact, my wife doesn't think I'm a very good driver, if we're being honest. What are your skill sets? I'm good at organizational things, or I'm a project manager.

That's what I'm asking you because that's where your opportunity is to make more money. Okay, I'm good at my job. I'm good at processing medications. Great. That's where I'd be looking. I mean, listen, if you could go from working at home to full-time or taking on another work-from-home job, that's where you need to be looking right now. What's available in my space where I know I have the qualifications, I don't have to learn anything,

I just have to say I'm willing and I can come in and make a difference. That's where you start because that's where we double our income potentially. If you can't double it, anything else right now is extra that's what you need to be doing dave when you're thinking bigger shovel yep that's right and it may involve stepping outside of some of your comfort zone very few things of growth happen inside the comfort zone and so it may involve that you do something that's a little bit uncomfortable in order to have the comfort of being completely debt-free. So, I mean, if you found $100,000 extra money in the next three years, you wouldn't even have a mortgage.

That would be very cool. I'd be willing to be uncomfortable for a couple of years to do that. Ooh, this is The Ramsey Show. Our scripture of the day, 1 Corinthians 13, 6 and 7. Love does not delight in evil, but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. Dr. Martin Luther King said, Change does not roll in on the wheels of inevitability,

but comes through continuous struggle. Wow. That works in the baby steps right there. Works everywhere. We honor him today on MLK Day. Wow. Absolutely incredible. All right.

Cody is with us. Cody is in Indianapolis. Hi, Cody. Welcome. Absolutely incredible. All right. Cody is with us. Cody is in Indianapolis. Hi, Cody. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Oh, thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So I've been listening to your show since about 2020, and I paid off my debt except for my mortgage and found a way to go to college debt-free through a college achievement program,

and I got my degree in corporate accounting. Good for you. When I graduated, I started working for an accounting firm in tax and bookkeeping, and I found myself hating every morning to have to get up and go to work. So my wife and I decided that it would be best for me. How did you go through all that trouble to become an accountant and not realize you hated accounting? It was more about the leadership and not... Oh, so it's not you hated accounting, you hated that company? Yes. Oh, okay. All right. I'm back with you. Okay. So you left,

I hope. Decided, yes, I did. I quit and decided I'm going to finish my CPA license and give myself some focus. But I also needed to get out of the house, so I got a job as a baker. While I was training with the owner as the baker, we talked about my work history of being a manager of restaurants and coffee shops and my work in accounting. And she asked me to take on more of a business development role. And so now I truly love what I do, but I find myself constantly thinking about work and doing things all day long at all hours of the day with the work. What does a baker need with business development? Yeah, that's my question as well. What are you developing?

Well, she owns a series of restaurants, and I am helping her to try and grow her business. What does that mean? We have a goal of increasing revenue this year, and so she wants to use my skills and do that with him. That's not business development. That's marketing. Business development is where you bring in investors

or you bring in outside money of some kind. I mean, developing the business by adding revenue is just marketing. You're trying to get more customers, right? Well, I'm doing bookkeeping. I'm writing standard operating procedures. I'm working on developing new products. For a bakery. So that means we've got to sell more bread, more cakes, more muffins, right?

She owns a series of restaurants. Right. Yeah. Okay. It's more than just the bakery? It's not just the bakery. That's where I started, but that's not where I'm working. Okay.

I'm sorry. All right. All right. All right. So that sounds almost like a COO, like you're doing operations and accounting. Okay. So, all right. So you're CFO, COO combo right now. You're doing bookkeeping and looking at the finances and looking at the operations systems. Yes, that's correct. All right. I'm with you. Okay. And you all, you all named that business development. Okay. Now I'm caught up. So what's your question then? So I love what I do,

but I feel like I am doing a lot more than what I'm being paid at. When I was making $16 an hour, I was, you know, just in the bakery, I could clock in, clock out, and it was off my mind. And now I'm working all the time, or what feels like all the time, and doing a lot more intensive work than I was before. Is she paying you $16 an hour still? Yes. And so I wanted to ask, how do I negotiate compensation for that?

And how long has that been going on? I've just gotten into this role about a month ago. Oh, okay. But we've set some goals. So why did you want to talk about compensation when we talked about changing your complete job description? That is why I'm calling now. I realized that it was a communication thing and think that I just need to know how to go about. All right. So how many restaurants? Let me try to break this down for you. How many restaurants does she own?

Two with a third one being opened. Okay. So what you've got to do is you've got to do your homework, your own numbers guy. And I would start with the revenue. I'd find out if she'll tell you certainly what your gross revenue is. Yeah, that's fair. That's true. You're in the books. Thank you, Dave. But the grace on the gross revenues of restaurants like that and someone who's operating like a general manager or a COO for somebody who owns two restaurants.

So I'd be looking at what that is paying out there in the marketplace. You've got to start with a baseline. And I can tell you it's not $16 an hour. So you've got to start with some real research that is pretty easy to figure out. What's our top line for the whole package right now? Just over a million. Okay. All right. So what does a COO make for a company that's grossing a million dollars a year yeah it ain't 16 dollars yeah all right so let's look that up and then go hey i looked at this and this is what it appears you know i found these

three different restaurant companies that are doing about a million and they're paying a COO or CFO, this kind of a thing. It appears I'm doing those types of jobs here. If that's not what you think I'm doing, then let's talk about it. But if I am doing that, then this is the market rate for that. How do you feel about that? Okay. One thing I'd pull out of the conversation is just because you're thinking about it all the time and you want to put all this work in, that doesn't mean that, you know, that, that plays into your compensation package too. I know you're excited about it, but also understand that, you know, this compensation you're looking at is, is based on you not thinking about it every second of the day. If you want to think about it every second of the day, that's on you,

but make sure you don't kind of fall into that. i'm thinking about it all the time and i'm working 60 hours if she's not asking to work 60 hours uh my point is is is is be be level-headed about that you're you can care deeply about something and still go home and have dinner with your wife and turn it off right i mean that's i do and i own and run this place for 30 years. That's right. So, I mean, and it's a little more than a million top lines. So, I mean, I turn it off at night. I don't think anything about it. On Sunday when I'm in church, I'm not sitting and thinking about, you know, the payroll here or something.

I'm just not. The other thing, Dave, I wanted to get you. Nor have I ever. Yeah, right. And here's the thing. He was talking about, you know, listen, I was on my way to being a CPA. He's still doing that. And then he was talking about. You know, listen, I was on my way to being a CPA. He's still doing that. And then he gets this opportunity.

The bakery situation was just a stopgap. Really proud of him for that. But you get an opportunity like this, and it may not be the greatest opportunity. I think it's exciting to him. But I'd also, in this advice we've given him to go, wait a second, where am I at on this whole CPA path? And I was heading this direction. Is this a distraction? I wonder.

It's exciting. It's a challenge. This guy who's challenged by this and i get it but is it the right path yeah you don't want to you don't want to end up in something by default yeah you want to you want to end up in in something because of intentionality and you you are in this by default it doesn't necessarily mean it's bad but um but it does give us both a reason to give you pause and say, hey, you had a path and bread baking threw you off of it. That's exactly right. And so, you know, do you want to do this? And are you intentionally going to turn down a different road than you were on before? That's okay.

I mean, Yogi Bear said when you come to a fork in the road, take it, right? Yes, great call. Well, one of the lessons here we all have to learn, Cody, is that we all desire to be wanted. And when somebody comes to us and says, hey, I know you're baking for me, you're doing a good job, but the fact that you got this degree in this and this, you could do this for me. And there's something to that to be valued and to be wanted. And that can be a distraction. And sometimes saying yes to something good is the enemy to this idea that we had that was great for us. And that's why I'm asking, just consider it. Yeah. One of the systems you need to put in place is don't move any more employees to new positions without compensation packages.

There is that. I am concerned that it didn't come up at all from a leadership standpoint. From either one of you. Yeah. Neither one of you thought, you know, we're going to talk about the fact that I make $16 an hour and I'm going to run your business from the inside. I don't think so. It should come up. It should come up early in the conversation. You know? Wow. Ken Coleman, good show today.

Thank you, sir. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus. We'll see you next time.