The Ramsey Show - App - Should I Change Jobs to Get One With Better Money? (Hour 2)

Episode Date: October 15, 2019

Ken Coleman, Career Tools to get you started:  Debt Calculator: http://bit.ly/2QIoSPV Insurance Coverage Checkup: http://bit.ly/2BrqEuo Complete Guide to Budgeting: http://bit.ly/2QEyonc Interview Guide: http://bit.ly/2BuGnZE Check out other podcasts in the Ramsey Network: http://bit.ly/2JgzaQR 

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions and broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studio, this is the Dave Ramsey Show. It's where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. Sitting in for Dave Ramsey this hour, I'm Ken Coleman, the best-selling author of The Proximity Principle and host of The Ken Coleman Show, which is a part of the Ramsey Network. So thrilled to be with you today. and host of The Ken Coleman Show, which is a part of the Ramsey Network. So thrilled to be with you today.

The phone number is 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. We'll make this a career hour this hour. So if you've got a question about your career, are you stuck? Are you scared? Are you stuck? Are you scared? Are you confused? Have no idea to the age-old question, what should I do with my life? I promise you, you do have the answers. It is my job to get it out of you. And we're going to look at a very simple construct. What do you do best? And what do you love to do most? The sweet spot for every man and woman is at that intersection where you use your talents and skills, that's what you do best, to do work that you're passionate about.

Work that you look forward to. Work that when you engage in it, you get the juice. Your heart comes alive. And then it creates results that matter tremendously to you. That's what we mean by passion. What you love to do most. And within that sweet spot, there are multiple jobs and career paths. But why do we talk about this?

Why is it so important? Because every man and woman on the planet was created to fill a unique role. That means you're needed, but it also means there's a duty for you to do it. Somebody out there needs you to be you so this is not a selfish pursuit it is a selfless pursuit so let's get about the business of helping you be you triple eight eight two five five two two five we'll start off in New York where Erica is on the line. Erica, how can I help? Hello, Kent? Hi.

Hi. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's going on? So here's my question. I have a job, and, like, the pay is okay. There are no benefits. I'm working on my side business, which is actually my dream business, and my question is should I put a pause on that

while I'm building and networking and all that other good stuff to find a better job to help support myself better or continue pushing the business and try to get that up to par financially? Okay. What if you got a better job than the one you have now as the day job, and you continued to do the side hustle, which is the dream job? So I'm giving you a different scenario than you just gave us. I'd like to see you get a better day job, which pays you better. Maybe it's a better environment, better culture, or maybe it pays you the same, but there's a ladder. There's a culture where they have proven that

they invest in their people, they develop their people, and they promote their people. So if you can find a better job that has one of those two unique circumstances there, better pay instantly or the opportunity for better pay soon, and then keep pursuing the side job. I don't want you to stop the side job because the side job is the eventual dream job and it is creating additional revenue so i like that scenario a little bit better is that possible it's it's possible it's absolutely possible that was a trick question okay so you're looking for something that is a better temporary job meaning that it's not the dream job it's not long term but it's something that you can move into pretty soon, and it just keeps you on the path. This is an important thing to point out, Erica, and to the rest of you that are in a similar situation.

Erica's day job is funding her future. until that side hustle, that dream job, is ready for her to step into, then that day job, whether it's the current one that she stays in or she goes and gets another one and gets her out of debt faster, and then she keeps that side hustle going. And while that side hustle grows, all that money gets contributed to paying off debt. So, Erica, that's the plan. That's the best way forward. 888-825-5225.

Ken Coleman sitting in for Dave Ramsey this hour as we do a career hour of the Dave Ramsey show. Let's go to Minnesota where Quinn is on the line. Quinn, how can I help? Hey, Ken. How's it going? I'm living the dream. What's going on? I recently just

accepted a new job yesterday and I'm kind of feeling obligated that I should go to school for what they want me to go for, but I know that I don't really want to go for what they want me to go for. I really just kind of took it to fund school. Yeah, don't go to school for what they want you to go to school for. I don't understand why you would feel obligated to go get schooling that you have no desire to get. Is that something that's required as a part of the deal? It was one of those handshake deals that, hey, we'll give you a job and we'll pay for your school, but it's got to be this? No, but they've kind of wanted

me it sounds like they want me to kind of move up in the management but like what do you want your four year um i still trying to figure that out okay so in the process of trying to figure that out don't feel pressure to take a path that you absolutely know you shouldn't go down. Are you a dad, Quinn, by any chance? No, I'm not. Do you remember being a son? It wasn't that long ago, right?

You're still a son. You remember being in your mom and dad's house? What would your mom and dad tell you if you were a kid? If you came to them and you were a teenager, say 14-year-old Quinn comes to his mom and dad and says, Hey, Mom and Dad, I'm not sure what path I want to go down, but all my friends want me to go down this path, and I know I don't want to do that. What do you think I should do? What would your mom and dad say?

Don't do it. All right. So I'm trying to channel the voice of your mom and dad. And, Quinn, you don't want to do it because here's what happens. If you succumb to this pressure to take a path that somebody else thinks you should take, but you know in your heart that you shouldn't take it,

you will not only regret going down that path, you will also resent those people and potentially resent yourself. You're at a really interesting crossroads. You don't know what your path is, and you need to examine right now what you do best, because you know that, and what you would love to do most, and really think. If there were no risks, guaranteed success, what path would you take? I think you know the answer, but we know for sure it's not the path that your employers are suggesting you take. So this is a

moment for you that a lot of people faced with this kind of pressure won't have the courage to say, I'm not going down that path because while I'm not sure which path I should take, I know it's not this path. So see this as a warning sign, like a construction zone. Road closed. Lights are flashing. Road closed. Don't go down that path. Just because they gave you a job, Quinn, doesn't mean you owe them a poor personal decision which by the way is not a good decision for them either no true leader healthy leader wants you to make a decision

that hinders your ability to be all you can be for them so keep that in mind alright folks quick break when we come back more of your calls it's the career hour on the Dave Ramsey Show. Ken Coleman sitting in for Dave Ramsey.

Don't move a muscle. Over the years, I've seen so many families suffer by not having life insurance. It's not that they didn't care. It's just that they didn't know, so they did nothing. That's a huge mistake. Listen, husbands and wives, moms and dads, think about it. If you died, how would your family pay the bills, the mortgage, food, and plan for a better future? This is what life insurance is all about, and term life is the only way to go. It's not expensive, and it's not complicated. Stop wasting money on cash value plans. You need 10 to 12 times your income in protection and I recommend 15 or 20 year level

plans. I also only recommend Zander Insurance and I have for over 20 years. These are the only people I personally use and they only offer the plans I recommend. Call them at 800-356-4282 or get instant quotes online at zander.com. Trust me, these simple steps will let your family know how much you care. Welcome back, America. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, author of the bestselling book, The Proximity Principle, and host of The Ken Coleman Show, part of the Ramsey Network. Sitting in for Dave Ramsey this hour, it's a career hour. 70% of Americans who wake up on Monday morning and are miserable because they know they've got to go into a job that there is no connection to.

They're overwhelmed. They're underappreciated. They're in a toxic culture. Or they're bored. Relief is on the way and it's available to you by simply getting clear. Who am I? What do I do best and what do I love to do most? And I need to find that intersection, my sweet spot. You think that wonderful analogy, you think of a baseball bat, a golf club, a hockey stick, a tennis racket. The description of the sweet spot is such a beautiful analogy of what it's like to live in a state of flow, to work in a state of flow, where you are operating at such a high

level of efficiency, it appears and feels at times effortless. That is the analogy. That's where we get that. And so your personal sweet spot is at the intersection of what you do best and what you love to do most. In other words, we use what we do best as tools to perform the work that brings us tremendous joy and satisfaction. So let's help you get clear. 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. We go to Michigan where Nate is on the line. Nate, how can I help?

Hey, Ken, thanks for taking my call. Sure, how can I help? Well, I guess I kind of fall under your 30% of people. Every day I wake up, I'm super excited to go to work. I actually don't feel like I'm ever working. Great. I've got this predicament where I'm really happy with where I work now, but I've had other companies reaching out to me, and then one company stuck out to me where they actually offered double my current income to go work for them.

But I'm kind of sitting in this predicament where I'm super comfortable, very happy with where I'm at, and if I leave a company that's been good to me and I've been good to them and I go to a company that I don't really know the atmosphere that well, I mean, I feel like I could be shooting myself in the foot. That is true, but it seems to me that you're not absolutely certain and I would want you to be certain on that fact. So for instance, have you talked to anybody besides the folks that have contacted you who want you to work for them? Have you talked to anybody else in that company to say, hey, what's the culture like? What is the leadership atmosphere like? How do they treat their people?

Have you asked those questions and gotten answers? Yep. Yep, I've spoken to two people that work there. They both are super excited and happy about what they do there. So, I mean, it was uplifting for me to kind of hear that kind of stuff. Great. So, you heard from them that the culture is really healthy, similar to what you're in now.

Yep. And double the income. Yep. What am I missing? What are you really, truly... I don't know. I guess I'm just kind of nervous from uprooting and going. That's what it is.

I'm just going for it. Okay. I'm so glad you said it because I'm trying to drive you to that. We have to name what is holding us back. Is it a fear? Is it a doubt? Is it a combo? Do you doubt that you have what it takes?

Or do you think, I got the chops. There's no question I can win in this role. It's without a question. I can do the job job so what you're really doing what i do now great so what you're really fearing is this is a change we're going to be moving zip codes and we're going to be uprooting everybody i'm going to be dealing with something that's a little bit unknown even though i hear good things and and i believe i can do the role and win in the role. Let's just be honest, human beings, we don't like change. Some of us really don't like it. And I don't know where you fall on that spectrum, but if you are a guy who's... I really don't. You don't like change at all. Okay, so you need to understand what's really going on. This is a natural fear that you have. Something new,

there's a lot of natural fear there. And so you have to call that out and say, this is a fear. This is the same level of fear that our kids have when they think there's something under the bed or something in the closet.

And they call us up there, Mom, Dad, there's something in the closet. We know there's nothing in the closet. But we still got to open up the door, turn the lights on, and let Junior or Susie

look in there and see there's no monster in the closet. And you have to probably ask a few more questions. You've already started the process, but this is a situation where you need to sit down with a good friend, somebody who's a truth teller in your life, who's completely objective in this situation, and say, here's what I'm afraid of, and get a little bit more detailed than you were with me. Well, I'm afraid about doing this to my kids. I'm afraid about finding the right school in this new place. Just let's go ahead and just list all the things that are giving you some anxiety over this. And in doing so, number one, you can see, well, what's the answer to that fear?

Well, we're going to go find a good school. We're going to go to DaveRamsey.com, and we're going to find a world-class realtor who's going to walk us through all these things that we need to think about when we find a new house, and therefore I don't need to be scared anymore. This is the exercise. This is how we overcome fear. We shine the light of truth on the lie that fear is telling us. Well, if you do this, you're going to uproot your kids.

They're not going to find a good school. You're going to find an awful house in a bad neighborhood, and you're going to be making double the money, but everybody's going to be miserable. This is what fear says, and it sits on our shoulder. So continue to expose that. Get some objective opinions in your life who will reinforce the truth that will shine the light on the fear and move forward. This is exciting. This is amazing. Way to go, Nate. That's huge.

I absolutely love it. Let's go to Jennifer who is in Wisconsin. Jennifer, how can I help? First of all, it's a pleasure to speak with you today. I really appreciate it. Thank you. To make a very long story very short, I am pretty much at a crossroads. I have multiple degrees and for some reason cannot find any job that will hire me in those degrees.

My current employer has said they will not promote me due to they don't think I can handle it. I have a medical situation that I'm dealing with. Unfortunately, I will have this medical situation the rest of my life and I am dealing handle it. I have a medical situation that I'm dealing with. Unfortunately, I will have this medical situation the rest of my life and I am dealing with it. However, I am drowning in student loan debt because I was the first college graduate in my house, in my family. And I did it basically to show my kids, yes, you can go to college and have a life and work. You can do all this. It just takes, you know, some scheduling and some willpower. I'm still working in this job, making barely, if that, enough to survive, let alone to get anything paid off.

How much are you making? How much are you making? How much are you making? This year it will be about $32,000 a year. Okay, and what do you do? I have several people who I work with who are listening to this, so I'm going to be very cryptic. Okay, just tell me the industry. I work in clerical and government.

Okay, so you're in a government job, and you're basically administrative clerical work. Yes. What did you get your degrees in? Real quick. You said you had three. What are they? I have a double bachelor's, business management, business administration, and I have a master's in management. Okay, great. So you're in a role that is way beneath you as far as your potential,

and it's not what you want to do either. So let's just real quick, Jennifer. No, I want you to not think about fear and doubt and your debt and all that stuff. I just want you to think from your heart for a moment. Let your heart answer this question. If I could give you something tomorrow and there was no risk, it was guaranteed that you were going to succeed in it and you could just try it just to see, would I love this?

What would come to the top of your mind when I ask that? As far as career goes? Yes. Probably like financial or management. The reason I went with the degrees that I did is because there's a lot of different ways I could go with it. Yeah, but do you want to lead people? Do you want to lead people? I love leading people.

I knew it. I love leading people. I knew it. I love teaching people, and I love the numbers base. I love having a lot of line even. Jennifer, I want you to listen to me. You need to be using your web of connections. Hang on the line. Kelly's going to give you a copy of my

best-selling book, The Proximity Principle. You know what you want to do. You want to be leading people. We're in an economy right now that needs people that are just quality people. They'll train you on the specifics of the company, but somebody who knows how to serve people can get just quality people. They'll train you on the specifics of the company, but somebody who knows how to serve people can get hired leading people, but you're going to

have to use your web of connections. I walk you through step-by-step how to do it in this book, The Proximity Principle. It's my gift to you. Read it and do it. Don't move. More show coming right up. It's a career-themed hour on the Dave Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, host of The Ken Coleman Show, part of the Ramsey Network. Sitting in for Dave this hour, 888-825-5225 is the number. 888-825-5225. If you're stuck, confused, scared, down, you just need a mirror, somebody to show you who you really are. You do have the answers.

You really do. You can identify what you do best because everybody's born with talent that can be honed into skill. And you do know what work, tasks, functions, roles make your heart come alive. This is passion. You're born with that as well. And you put those two together. You use what you do best to do what you love to do most.

Why? To create, to contribute to your fellow man. That's what this is about. This isn't about this ambition to just, you know, be super rich and super successful. No, no, no, no. There are miserable people that are crazy wealthy because they're not doing the work

that makes their heart come alive. There's no connection to the work. And you lay your head down at night, all of us long, to know that we played a role that day that mattered not just to us but to others. And so that's what we're here to help you with. 888-825-5225 is the number.

Let's go to Arizona where Fred is on the line. Fred, how can I help? Hey, Ken, good afternoon. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. I just feel like I'm stuck where I'm at. I'm just plain old stuck. I had an IT career about 10 years ago, and I want to get back into it, and I just don't

know which way to point, and I'm just stuck. Well, the good news is you know where you want to go. So let's have some more fun with that, and let's unlock your brain a little bit and let your heart kind of seep up into your brain. So if we were going to get back into that IT career tomorrow, and I could wave a magic wand and get you into a situation where, okay, so we've lost Fred.

Okay, no big deal. That happens from time to time. We'll get Fred back on the line. But let's talk about Fred's situation. Because what's interesting is on the Ken Coleman show every day, we get calls like this every day. So what is Fred's situation? Ken, I'm just stuck. I have absolutely no idea how to get where I want to go. Because he, in the same sentence, said, I had an IT career 10 years ago, and I really enjoyed it,

but I don't know how to get back in it. And so what's going on here, it's almost as if Fred has a blindfold on his head. Let's go back to the kids' birthday parties. I don't think kids do this anymore, but we used to do pin the tail on the donkey, right? Just the classic birthday party game. They had this cheap little plastic picture of a donkey,

and they put it on the wall, and then the kid's got a donkey's tail with tape on the end of it, and it's got to walk right up to, or you spin them around, and then you go, okay, go pin the tail on the donkey. And we all laugh as the person with the blindfold walks aimlessly around trying to figure out where to put the tail. So what's happening with Fred, and we're getting Fred back on the line, what Fred is feeling right now is utter hopelessness, which is why he's saying he's stuck.

Because he's going, I know I want to get into the IT field, but I don't know how to get back in it when, in all reality, he does. So what we've got to do is identify what is he afraid of, there's a fear, and then what's the doubt. So we've got Fred back on the line. Great. Okay, here we go. Back to Fred.

All right, Fred, so you're back in the house, and here's the good news I want to encourage your heart with. You know you want to get back into IT, so let's paint a clearer picture of the destination. So when you say you'd like to get back into IT, is there a role, and forget about job title for a second, but what would you be doing every day if i could just wave a wand and give it to you tomorrow and you knew that you would succeed what would you be

doing in it uh networking great did you do networking in the past i did more help desk in the past okay what's the You have to forgive me here. Are there clear differences between what you did before help desk where you were going in and getting everybody back up and running and fixing and solving problems? What's the difference between that and networking? Well, on the help desk, I did more of a first call resolution type thing. And then I just want to go one step further, go into more of the problem solving. Okay, great. I want you to be very honest with me.

How qualified do you feel you are? Forget about current qualifications in the marketplace. Just if we gave the job to you and you had to figure it out as you go how confident are you that you could actually pull this off you've got the chops i would probably need a little more train a little bit of training to come come up the speed what's occurred what's up currently okay great so you're pretty confident because it's a little bit of training this isn't something brand new you got to learn so we because it's a little bit of training. This isn't something brand new you've got to learn. So we're talking about a little bit of training to get back in the game.

Do you know where you can get that training? Community college. Okay. Certifications. There we go. So, Fred, first step for you is what do I need to learn and do to get qualified? So you're not stuck. You feel stuck because you're thinking about down the road.

But we'll get to down the road once we step onto the road. We can't get down the road unless we're on the road. And getting on the road for you means tonight before you go to bed you need to identify community college classes online certifications webinars whatever everything you just told me that you know you need to get and you need to identify that tonight then tomorrow and the next day you need to talk to somebody who you used to work with 10 years ago or somebody that knows somebody and go, hey, here's what I've researched, and this is what I believe I need to have to be qualified to get back in and be in networking. Can you verify this? Let's get that step of verification.

Now you should have total confidence. All right, I know what I need to learn, do to get qualified. Now what do I need to do? How much money is that going to cost me? And based on your financial situation, Fred, that becomes the plan. Okay, well, I'm going to have to save up to be able to pay for this certification slash qualification. And how long is it going to take me? Okay, so I'm making this up, Fred, but let's say we look down and we say, all right, it's going to take me 12 to 18 months to get qualified, and now I'm ready to go.

So beyond learning and doing in the qualification process, Fred, the other thing you need to be doing is reaching back out to all those contacts. And I know it was 10 years ago, so if they're not around, great. But how many people do you know in your zip code, your metropolitan area, Fred? How many people? I know quite a few. I know quite a few are still in the field, too. Great. Give me a number, though. I just want you to see something.

Play along with me. How many people do you think you know on an acquaintance or very close relationship? How many? Give me a number. 50 to 75. 50 to 75. And how many people, give me a number, Fred, do you think those 50 to 75. And how many people, give me a number, Fred, do you think those 50 to 75 people know collectively? I know a dozen for sure.

No. 50 to 75 people, they all know at least 50 to 75. So we're talking hundreds of people, Fred. You see where I'm going with this? And here's the good news. You actually know people in the technology industry. So, Fred, you've got your homework. I want you to figure out what you need to learn and do, how much it's going to cost, how long it's going to take.

Then we start working our relationships, the web of connections. Kelly, let's give them a copy of my best-selling book, The Proximity Principle. Five people, five places, Fred. I walk you right up to these people. I walk you into these places. I tell you where to find them, what to do when you're there, and proximity to the right people plus the right places, Fred, will equal opportunity. Always. If you're not getting opportunities, folks, and you're sitting around going, I can't catch an opportunity, I can tell you right now, you're not around the right people and you're not in the right places. Fred, you know where you

need to go. Figure out the best path to get there and then step out on the path. And here's the best part. Stay on the path. Turns out this success journey isn't as complex as we make it. Don't move. More Career Hour on The Dave Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, best-selling author of The Proximity Principle and host of The Ken Coleman Show on the Ramsey Network. You can get it all around the country, KenColeman.com for the list. You can listen to it on SiriusXM or wherever you enjoy listening to podcasts. 888-825-5225.

888-825-5225 is the number. We go to Georgia where Destiny is on the line. Destiny, how can I help? Hi, Ken. I just had a question. I'm kind of feeling stuck in which way to go. I'm a recent college graduate, but the career field I want to go in seems to be the only way to really get there

is either really knowing somebody or having a master's degree. So I'm just trying to figure out what I should do next. Okay, what is the field? I'm wanting to either do college advising or workforce development to helping other people figure out what jobs they want to do, kind of that aspect of things. Okay, so did you say development, meaning raising money for colleges or nonprofits? No, workforce development.

Oh, workforce. Okay, gotcha. Okay, all right. I'm tracking with you. Okay. Who has told you that the only way to get that is a master's degree? Where did you get that information? Well, I've applied for multiple positions, and everything always shows they prefer a master's,

and I can't seem to even get in the door for an interview. So the people I've talked to in the colleges, they say kind of either getting your foot in the door, knowing someone in another position, or having a master's degree. Yeah, okay, great. All right, so I'm glad that you got verification of that, in another position or having a master's degree. Yeah, okay, great. All right, so I'm glad that you got verification of that because what you need to understand here is that the master's degree isn't the only way. What they said was master's degree is what everybody's kind of putting out there as saying you've got to have that requirement,

but then the very people you talked to said, or you've got to have a relationship. And I'm going to tell you that working your web of connections, this is an actual psychology, sociology term. I write about it in my book, The Proximity Principle. This is a real strategy. In fact, there is a sociologist by the name of Mark Granovetter who did a study many years ago, and he's been quoted pretty much in any type of career study that has to do with this idea of networking, which I can't stand that word. I like the word connecting. But what we know from Granovetter's study is that acquaintances, destiny, are the greatest source of

jobs for people. So when I talk about an acquaintance, I don't mean somebody that you spend a lot of time with. An acquaintance is somebody, well, you may have a mutual relationship. You know this person lightly, for lack of a better word, you know them just casually is probably the word there. And yet when you see each other, you're going to be kind to each other.

You can have a conversation with that person so on one hand you need to get into a college staff my advice is if you want to eventually be doing career advising in a college university setting just getting on the staff at the college would be the lowest form of entry. That would be the easiest point of entry, rather, than a master's degree. What college did you just graduate from? Gordon State College. Yeah. I mean, what kind of relationships do you have there?

I know some professors there, and I keep in touch with them. They haven't had to make postings there in particular, but we have a few technical colleges around the area that I've applied for. Okay. Go ahead. The one thing I also considered with the master's degree I was looking into was I would be getting two years of work experience through a grad assistantship, and that would cover tuition. Okay, so you can cash flow your way through a master's degree?

Yes. Okay. Yes. Well, that changes everything for me because when I hear master's degree, what is usually attached to that is massive amounts of money that people don't have, and then they try to get a loan. And so two things. I think that that is something you need to explore because, again, you'll get the relevant work experience, and you can cash flow your way through it, obviously, with the help of some of that tuition assistance.

So I think that's a great way to go. And it certainly will get you there. But I would not in the time that it takes to get the master's degree, I wouldn't just ride those coattails. I would be working relationships at Gordon State where you went. You're talking to people going, hey, while I'm doing this, I'm getting this master's degree, getting this experience, I'm looking to just get in. And when you come out with this master's degree, getting this experience, I'm looking to just get in. And when you come out with this master's degree, if you run into a situation where you can't get that gig that you want right away, I want to make sure I hammer this.

Just getting in the door is always a good move. So if you want to be in the college career advisement offices over there at any school, you go, okay, I want to be there, and I've got the requisite master's degree. I've got some experience. A job's not open right now. What do I do? Get on a college or university staff. Just get in the door.

Here's where the whole thing changes for you. Once you're in and you're an employee, then you're able to go meet these folks in the department you want to work in. You go, hey, I'm working over here in this department. Oh, great. We're all on the same team. Don't see each other every day, but we're on the same team. Now you're not an outsider trying to get in. You're an insider looking to maybe move over.

Big difference. And this is the key. Just because you get the master's degree does not guarantee that a job is going to be waiting for you with a giant ribbon wrapped around it. Now, that's your baseline of qualification, but it doesn't mean that the door swings wide open and there's all this wonderful music and we walk in and there's glitter and confetti

and trumpets and all this kind of stuff. It doesn't work that way. So you're still going to need to work those relationships. I also want to give you a copy of my pal Anthony O'Neill. He's on book tour week two of his book, Debt-Free Degree, because I know you've got a plan, but I want you to have Anthony's book as well, because again, he gives you a wonderful step-by-step guide on how to go to school without

going into debt. So I don't want you to be tempted there. So check that out, and Kelly's going to give that to you. Thank you for the call, Destiny. All right, let's go to a social media question. I love this one. This comes from Facebook, from Mario. He says, Ken, I'm curious about getting into voice acting to see if it's something I want to do. Do you have any advice or insight? All right, so this is a very specific field. So how do you start from scratch to get into voice acting just to see if it's something he likes to do? All right, so let's talk about is this something I'd really like to do.

So the way you do that is you've actually got to get online and look up voice actors, and you can find voice actors in your area. In fact, I know there's a database, and you can find people, and you just reach out to them and go, listen, I'm thinking about getting into your space. You're a pro. You're making this happen. I'd like to tag along the next time you've got a commercial that you're cutting or you're doing some type of script, you know, for some corporate client. I just want to watch you do your thing.

Watch how they warm their voice up. What is it like? Are they pushing their own buttons, meaning they're cutting it themselves? They're doing the editing. They're doing the recording. Do they give it to somebody else? Just by getting in proximity and observing somebody do this, you're going to get tremendous clarity on, okay, that would be a lot of fun for me because you can actually sit there and observe. So observation is key.

Second thing is, why don't you try a few things? Even if it's not a real client, go get a script, take the same car commercial script that you heard that guy do or that gal do or watch it on TV, type it out, do it yourself, see if you enjoy the process of recording it and making it sound really good. Just try it. Doesn't mean you have to get paid for it. Just to try it and go, did I get juice when I was engaged in this process? So those two things, observation and then low risk testing.

Just kind of, I'm going to participate in this. Maybe I'll create a website, put some demos together, see if I get a few clients. Try it on the side, Mark. It's not going to be full time anyway. So some demos together. See if I get a few clients. Try it on the side, Mark. It's not going to be full-time anyway. So just try it. If you just try it, folks, and you get around it, you're going to get verification. Oh, this is big

fun. This has been a career hour here on The Dave Ramsey Show. I want to thank our producer, James Childs, and our associate producer, Kelly Daniel. Of course, Dave Ramsey, for letting me hang out on his show. And, of course, you, America. Thank you for listening. This is The Dave Ramsey for letting me hang out on his show. And of course, you, America, thank you for listening. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for The Dave Ramsey Show.

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