The Ramsey Show - App - Should I Go Back to School or Be a Stay-at-Home Mom? (Hour 3)

Episode Date: November 1, 2021

Debt, Investing, Retirement, Career, Relationships, Budgeting As heard on this episode: Sign Up for a FREE trial of Ramsey+ TODAY: https://bit.ly/3rZTUAx Tools to get you started:  Debt Calculator: https://bit.ly/2Q64HME Insurance Coverage Checkup: https://bit.ly/3sXwUn5 Complete Guide to Budgeting: https://bit.ly/3utmVXi Check out more Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3fHhbVE

Thank you very much. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Ramsey Show. Where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host, Christy Wright. Ramsey Personality, number one best-selling author, is my co-host today.

Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Allison is with us in Des Moines, Iowa. Hi, Allison, how are you? Hey, Dave, I'm good. Honestly, I'm nervous and also overwhelmed. My husband and I, we just started Financial Peace University about two weeks ago. So we just got done with step one. We're working on step two. I've done two plusectctomies today. And our class is moving on to step three, but we still have some things to work on in two as well. We have about 30,000

in debt, non-mortgage debt. We have three kids and our annual income is just over $88,000. Me being overwhelmed, what's a reasonable time frame for the snowball? Well, I just use big numbers. There's a lot of ways to look at it. You're in Ramsey Plus. You can jump in there. There's a snowball calculator in there that'll help you run it out. And so, you know, that's the nerdy, detailed way way to do it but the way i look at it is 88 minus 30 is 58 you ought to be able to live on 58 okay which means one year okay but that's how i do it i mean it was just a big number that's that means 2500 bucks a month which you're just getting started so that's probably like oh my god no you know so i mean you haven't gotten that far in yet you might and i'm saying you'd have to average that you might

start out with less because you're just getting started you just cut up the credit cards today and so you're not you're not in freak mode yet when you get into freak beast mode and you start cutting this down cutting your lifestyle to nothing because you're completely obsessed with getting out of debt, you can do $30,000 on 88 in a year. It leaves you 58. But you're going to have adjusted a whole bunch of stuff. I mean, you're not going out to eat.

You're not going on vacation. We've cleaned out all savings. It's not retirement and thrown it at the debt. We've chopped up every credit card. We're on a detailed budget. We've sold so much stuff the kids think they're next i mean we're we're just you're going to be in beast mode you follow me yeah absolutely selling things is actually on my list to do i've started posting

some things already to help with that um that's three yeah so what's the $30,000? What kind of debt? Well, a lot of it's credit cards, and then it's also truck payment. I'm looking. How much do you owe on the truck? A little over $13,000. Okay. So that's half of it. Yeah. And then we just moved into a new house, so that's new to us. It's about $1,000.

Of course, that's not included, but we still own the last place. And, you know, we have been talking, and we're just not sure whether we're going to dump money in to rent it out. No, sell it. Sell it. I was waiting. I was like, as soon as you're done with this, he's going to tell you to sell that house. And see, that's the thing, too,

because we want the seller to take it off the lot, too, because we're keeping the actual property as it was just handed over by his grandpa who passed away. And, you know, the rest is credit cards. The buyer. Yeah. This is a trailer. Yep.

It's a single-wide manufactured home. Yeah, it's a trailer. Yeah. And so what do you owe on it? Nothing. Nothing. We actually. Awesomeness. What will it on it? Nothing. We actually – Awesomeness.

What will it sell for? What will it sell for? That we don't know because, I mean, the inside does need some work, but we're hoping 10. Give me a guess. 10 grand? I would say maybe 10. Yeah, that's what I'm thinking.

Yeah, great. Now we only got to pay off 20 grand. Right. I would say maybe $10,000. Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. Yeah, great. Now we only got to pay off $20,000. Right. And guess what that trailer is going to be worth in five years? Probably nothing. So why are we keeping something that's going down in value? Take your $10,000 and get out of debt.

Sell it. Now. Don't fix it up. It's not a fixer-upper it's a trailer sell it i will i will make sure to do that because my husband's listened to you for a while we just never acted upon it until recently and we're trying to get our lives back i'm glad you are i'm so proud of you you're you got a lot of balls in the air and you really do i mean you got a lot of you cut up your credit cards you're selling stuff and now i sold your trailer i mean you got a lot of stuff going on right you didn't know when you called all this is gonna happen yeah but i mean this is what you do you you know because here's

the thing it's like you're going down the interstate and you realize because gps goes off that you pass the exit you missed your turn so now you are going 75 miles an hour in the wrong direction yeah the first thing you do is you get off the interstate now you're going zero miles an hour in the wrong direction but zero miles an hour in the right direction you go under the ramp under the bridge get back up on the ramp and go back 75 miles an hour in the right direction this is 150 miles per hour change this is what you're doing so it's going to give you whiplash absolutely yeah it's going to shock your nervous system in a wonderful way. If this doesn't feel like a little like, what? Then there's something wrong with you.

That's to be talked about on another day. We'll have to wait on Dr. John to be here. Wait until Deloney's back. Wait until Deloney's back on. We'll talk about your mental illness but you know it's it's normal to shock the nervous system when you say oh my gosh you know uh i had a friend of mine who's a health nut and he works out all the time and he decided that he had gotten he kind of kicked it off and he wasn't eating right and he decided he's going to go all healthy and so he's detoxing so it's like he's got the flu yeah he's like he's a drag button around yeah got his little so it's like he's got the flu yeah he's like he's a drag button

around yeah got his little lip stuck out like he's got the flu but in you know in a week whenever two weeks for this to break out his diet to change back to healthy eating then he'll have more energy he knows that but his body's going through this shock yeah of change i've never heard you give that interstate example that's a great visual that's a great because even the speed you're talking about like when you're very first getting started it's slow and then you start picking up speed like that's a great visual yeah but every every mile per hour in the right direction is on top of the 75 miles an hour that you were going in the wrong direction right so it's a big change yeah it's a real thing and so but it's normal for

the human system to go oh my god for 10, for 10 years, you know, I've been eating everything in sight. And all of a sudden, I'm going to change my eating habits. And of course, your body's going to react to that. It's going to freak out. You know, it's the same thing. It's the exact same thing with your money. It's the same thing with your career.

If you decide, like, I've never, I've always just kind of been a jerk at work. And I'm going to go to work and smile and actually work hard. It's going to shock everybody. They're not going to know how to act. They're going're going who are you and what have you done with that other guy you know it's the same thing so yeah just shock it you know do that do it baby get it up get let's go let's go you got this People all over the country are discovering a faith-based and budget-friendly way of meeting health care costs through Christian Health Care Ministries. Christian Health Care Ministries, or CHM, is a nonprofit organization that helps members carry one another's burdens with health

care expenses, and they have successfully shared each other's medical bills for nearly 40 years. See if CHM is right for you by visiting chministries.org. CHM is a proud sponsor of Dave Ramsey Live Events. Imagine what your income could do for you if it wasn't going to somebody in the form of payments like credit card companies or student loan companies or your car payment what if you had no payments you know what you were just feeling in your heart you that can really happen for you it doesn't have to take as long as you think it does either you can get there and it gets you can get there with financial peace university it's the class that's helped over six million people learn the proven plan to get out of debt and become wealthy.

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Christy Wright, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Louise is in Akron, Ohio. Hi, Louise. How are you? Hi, Dave and Christy. Thank you for taking my call. Sure.

What's up? I have a question about starting a Roth after retiring. My situation is I have a little over $100,000 in a 457. I'm 56. I retired a couple years ago, and I don't plan on needing it anytime soon. So I wanted to take out about $10,000 a year from it and put that in a Roth so that it grows tax-free.

The 457 plan sent me the paperwork for it, but they also sent me a lot of information about how I make more in the 457 because their fees are lower. So is moving some of it to a Roth a good idea? What's it invested in in the 457? It's invested in a couple of, they call it large cap, mid cap, and small cap funds. What kind of returns have you been getting? I've been getting some pretty good returns.

I'm averaging about 12%. Yeah, okay. That's about what you should be able to do. Good, okay. So I don't know that they're correct on the fees i think that's probably just them trying to protect their accounts their portfolio but um i don't think you're going to gain a huge amount by moving money out of this uh to an ira in the in mutual funds that perform similarly i think you're going to have about a break even there the only thing you could have is the money from this point forward could grow tax-free. However, you're going to have to pay taxes on whatever you move.

So do you have some extra money that's not this account? What they do is they withhold 20% of the tax. No, they don't either. That's not up to them. If you withdraw it, they withhold 20% of the taxes. No, they don't either. That's not up to them. If you withdraw it, they withhold 20%. But that's not going to be their option. You can roll the whole thing to a traditional IRA, and they don't withhold a dime. Then when you roll it from a traditional, they're not allowed to withhold on that.

That's a direct transfer rollover. Okay. not allowed to withhold on that that's a that's a direct transfer to roll over okay into a tradition enough to cover i would have enough to cover the taxes on about ten thousand a year okay if you roll it all to a traditional get with a smart investor pro put it in similar mutual funds you're going to make about the same money and if you roll ten thousand a year out you're going to have about a twenty five hundred dollar tax bill on that you can go you're going to have about a $2,500 tax bill on that. You're going to cash flow that tax bill. That's what you're saying, right? Correct.

So you don't have any other money? Yeah, I've got an emergency fund and some other money and a fund for, like, home repairs, car repairs. Okay. And are you working your encore career after after you retire because you're young yes i yes i'm running a small farm okay so what kind of money are you making there uh not a lot uh last year i grossed about three thousand um but i'm having the time of my life yeah okay so i want you to start making some money while you're having the time of your life too okay

uh okay yeah let's let's get a little bit of business model i'll turn you over to christy on the farm here uh she's also someone who's lost money on a farm so i'm with you louise i was having a lot of fun a lot of work but a lot of fun yes you know in addition to everything dave's talking about i'll send you my book, Business Boutique, a woman's guide for making money doing what she loves. You can do both. You can have fun. You can play, enjoy the farm, and also make some income that will help take the pressure

off, give you some options, and just get that income up a little bit. So we'll send you that as well. Yeah. Here's the reason I'm pushing you on that, okay? Number one, you're young and you've got a a lot of time left a lot of runway left to uh on ramp to go do something big and fun make some money number two you kind of need to a hundred thousand bucks isn't that much money true so uh your nest egg's not huge and uh i would love for it to be if you told me if you had a million in there and you wanted to goof off on the farm and make no money, we can talk about it.

But I need you to grow this nest egg for you. And screwing around with $10,000 is not fixing this. Adding tens of thousands of dollars into your investments every year is going to fix it and get this thing up, and that's going to require income. So that's what I would tell you to do is work on that side of the equation too. Hold on. We'll have Madison pick up. We'll send you a copy of Christie's book.

Open phones at 888-825-5225. Rachel is in California. Hi, Rachel. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi. What an honor to talk to you both. Thank you for taking my call. Sure.

What's going on? My question today for you is me and my husband, we have about $50,000 in a savings account in the bank. It was going to be used towards me going to school. However, we had a child. He's about a year now and I'm a stay-at-home mom and my husband loves being the breadwinner. I'm itching to go back to work. I'm itching to go back to school but he wants to use that $50,000 that we have to start a business and he's always had businesses and in this case he wants to start a trucking business and we both really just need some wisdom and guidance what to do next. This is interesting, Rachel. This is an interesting question because

this isn't as much about money as it is about values, what you want to do with the money versus what he wants to do with the money. So I'm curious, if you go back to work, what do you do? What do you want to do? I'm a veterinary technician, and I would be going back to that, and the money was going to be for veterinary school, which is, I understand, a huge commitment with a child, and even just to go back to work would be great. But I want to respect what my husband wants for the family structure. Yeah. This is a conversation that I think would be so beneficial to have with a counselor,

not because y'all are broken and your marriage is having a hard time, but sometimes it can be so helpful to have a third party walk through what are his fears of you going back to work? What are his desires? What are your desires to go back to work? What are your fears around money and that type of thing? And dig to the deeper layers going on in this conversation that I believe is a lot more than just financial. But here's the key. Both of you need to be heard. Both of you need to be a participant. Both of you need to be

respected. He does need to be respected, as do you, Rachel. Both of you need to be respected, heard, seen, and both of you need to be respected heard seen and both of you need to speak into the decision if you do something that makes you concede your life in the name of respecting his view of the structure of the family, that creates an unhealthy relationship 10 years from today. You will resent it. That's not going to work. You can only hold your breath so long. So it needs to be where both of you have worked this thing through

and you went, you know what, I like that. I don't like it as much as B, but I like A, and let's go do this. And both of you are going to concede something. But where you just say, well, I'm going to completely walk away from what I care about, my dreams, my thing, because of his view of the family structure. That sounds bad just when you say that. Yeah. So I think the beautiful music is made when both of you can play your instruments loud, and even if they're not in perfect harmony, but at least you're both playing them loud. So I think Christy's right on seeing someone and having them help you unpack that. Brad and Marisa are with us in New Haven, Connecticut.

It says on my screen, you guys are debt-free. Congratulations. Thank you. Hi, Dave. Hey, how screen, you guys are debt-free. Congratulations. Thank you. Hi, Dave. Hey, how much have you guys paid off? We've paid off $88,608.27. Awesome. Way to go. How long did that take? That took us 22 months. Wow. And your range of income during that time? $140,000 up to $175,000. Good. Awesome. What do you guys do for a living?

I'm in finance. And I was a teacher. Now I'm a stay-at-home mom and a freelance writer. Cool. Yeah. And good. So what kind of debt was the $89,000? Oh, we had it all. Two car loans, 401k loan, student debt, medical bills, and of course, credit cards. Of course. You guys were like normal. How long have y'all been married? Ten years? Thirteen. Thirteen. Almost like I guessed it right. Good, okay. So after 11 years of marriage, you looked up 22 months ago and said something's got to change.

Tell us the story. What happened? Yeah, absolutely. We were just sick and tired of living paycheck to paycheck, and especially not knowing where all our money was going at the end of the year. Yeah, the end of the month was always like, where did it go? We had no idea. And then Dave, you were a guest on another podcast that we both listened to. And he came home from work one day and said, hey, did you, you know, this guy, Dave Ramsey was on and I really liked what he had to say and asked if I can grab the total money

makeover the next time I went to the library. And I had said, oh, I heard that today, too, and I really liked it, so I'll get the book and I'll read it with you. And the next day, I think we got the Total Money Makeover, read it in, oh, gosh, maybe two days. Whose podcast? We drank the Kool-Aid. Cool.

Whose podcast? You were on Ben Shapiro's Sunday special. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Very cool. Good. Yeah. Ben and I have become friends since then.

That's very nice. Oh, that's awesome. He's a great guy. He's a great guy. Their whole team just moved to Nashville to get out of California just a little while ago. Yes. Yes. That's right.

New neighbors. Well, cool. Way to go, guys. That's so fun. I'll have to tell him that happened. Yes. That's right. New neighbors. Well, cool. Way to go, guys. That's so fun. I'll have to tell him that happened. He'll like hearing that. So $89,000 later, the total money makeover told you how to do it. You go and do it, right?

We did. Talk a little bit about what this was like in your marriage. Because y'all had been married for over a decade when you started this plan. Talk a little bit about what it was like to work as a team and have such an intense goal. Yeah, absolutely. This is probably the biggest thing for our marriage, too, is just having the joint commitment to tackle this and change our spending behavior and especially change our family tree. Wow. And it all started off with, you know, us coming together, reading this book, like we said, drank the Kool-Aid. And then we sat down together for the first time, did a monthly budget.

And together, you know, we took that first step on this new lifestyle change. Yeah. Good for you. And I would say it actually, you know, we've been through quite a lot in 13 years, but I would say that this was probably just brought us so much closer than any of the other things we've done over the years. Yeah, it does that. It's just amazing in that sense, what it did for our marriage. The only way to pull it off is to work together, and the only way to work together is to be more unified than you've ever been. So, yeah, it's a pretty intense transformative process for sure. What do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is?

Like Brad said, just the joint commitment and being willing and able to make those changes, especially in your behavior, doing it together and communicating your goals and your, you know, hopes for the future. And we've done a lot of those dream meetings over the last two years. And that's, and of course the budget, the budget's huge because we never did that before. When we wrote out our debts debts i put it on like this little drawing i made it like a big brick wall you know smallest to largest and the staring at it you're like this is going to take forever but you got to take the first step and it happened a lot faster than we thought and i know you preached that too on your show and it's true but it still feels when you're at the beginning like oh god this is going to take forever. Yeah.

Yeah. It's a huge mountain sitting in front of you, $89,000 worth. Yeah. Pretty cool. Yeah, we thought it was going to take a long time. It was very daunting. Yeah. What was the hardest part?

What was the hardest part, that, the dauntingness? I think it was actually the hustle. Marisa also did Waitressing To help accelerate this payoff So we would just be passing each other I would come home from work and she'd be on her way out And we have three young kids

So no breaks We went intense So I think just getting at it That was hard And we did that for a while But it paid off in the end, so it could have taken a lot longer. That's right. But she's a tough woman, so she got after it.

Yeah, we didn't see each other much. Yeah. Well, you increased your income $35,000 during this time. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you had to be, you know, unless somebody just got some inordinate raises, you guys have been after it. That's pretty cool. We hustled. Well, that's what it that's pretty cool we hustled well that's what

it takes and uh the good news is now that you're free how's it feel now that you're free oh my gosh i think for me the freedom was was the biggest part and that really um hit me um back in the fall when it was time for schools to reopen and our school district was so wishy-washy and they're going back, they're not. And at that point, we were on our last debt and our snowball was big enough where we were able to still, you know, make our snowball payments, but also cash flow private school for our oldest daughter for the year. And I felt like this is what freedom feels like. This is, you know, I'm not, not, um,

yeah, using debt to support it or just not knowing how we're supporting it, just doing it. Yeah. And just being able to, to know that we didn't have to be at the mercy of, you know, teachers' unions or politicians. Amen, amen. It was a big, like, so that for me was, I think, when it really hit, that like, wow, look what we can do. Yeah, money has no value at all except what it will do. And one of the things it does is it gives you options. Yes. That you don't have if you don't have money.

And you had options. You could reach over to a private school, keep the kid rolling, and you can avoid this. That's one of the reasons that the pandemic had such a hard time. The hardest people hit in the pandemic, the economic suppression from the pandemic, was the folks on the bottom rungs. I mean, who lost their jobs well it wasn't white collar executives at wall street they didn't lose their jobs who lost their jobs were the maids at the hotel because the hotel was closed down the waitresses you know but you were you were waiting tables you saw it and those those restaurants closing up those are the people the

people that could least afford to lose their jobs are the ones that lost their jobs it was a horrible thing horrible inequality of how the economic suppression brought on by the governments in this how it affected everybody so anyway enough of that way to go you guys i'm so proud of you so proud of you we got a copy of the legacy journey for you that is the next chapter of you so proud of you we got a copy of the legacy journey for you that is the next chapter in your story for sure you have changed and set your legacy it is a new thing for you so proud of you also got a copy of the total money makeover because that's what changed you guys and now you can give it to somebody when they ask and they say oh read

this and i'll give you an extra copy to give away. And I'm glad the book was there to help you and the podcast and everything else. Brad and Marissa, $89,000 paid off in 22 months, making $140,000 to $175,000. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're set free! Woo-hoo! Yeah!

This is how it's done. That's awesome. Wow, wow, wow, wow. Great job. Great job. Thank you. Our scripture today, Isaiah 54, 17, When God is for you, no weapon formed against you will prosper. Helen Keller said, Optimism is the faith that leads to achievement. Nothing can be done without hope and confidence.

Julie is with us in Los Angeles. Hi, Julie. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave and Christy. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So I have a question. I am paid on Mondays on a biweekly basis, so I normally get two paychecks a month. But this month, I will be receiving three paychecks

rather than the normal two paychecks because there are five Mondays in the month. Always happens. So my question is, how do I budget during a three-paycheck month? What do I do with the third paycheck? You're doing your budget wrong. You should do a unique budget every single month. And the principle for doing a budget for a given month is you figure out what your income is for that month, and you spend that income on paper that month.

So it's not per paycheck, Julie, it's per month. Does that make sense? So like you have your monthly expenses. No, you're trying to do a template where you use the same template for every single month. And it's not, every month is different. They're not substantially different, but every month is different. And so quit trying to do a template that works for every single month. Just say, this month, how much money have I got coming in?

I've got to give every one of those dollars an assignment okay so i look at it as three paychecks for this month so i have a larger income for this month exactly i'll just allocate everything exactly so if you're running your household where you're existing on a two paycheck month this ends up being the same as a bonus and then you can put all that extra to whatever baby step you're on. Exactly. If it's your debt, it's your debt. If it's your emergency fund, whatever that looks like for you. It's a great thing.

You have two of these magic months a year when you're paid biweekly. Okay. It happens twice a year because you get paid, I mean, 26 times you get paid instead of 24 times. So it happens two times a year. Okay, so it's not a matter of rolling over that third paycheck. Nope, nope. It will apply to the month of May, and then I'll pay my... Not as long as you're able to live on the income that is two paychecks represents, which I suspect you are.

Yes, yes, okay. able to live on the income that is two paychecks represents which i suspect you are yeah yes okay yeah so in it's it's just the same exact thing as said if the boss came and said hey i'm going to give you a bonus well you wouldn't go what do i do with that no you just give every one of those dollars a name and you use it for the baby step your own you're on baby step two you're doing the debt snowball it's the next debt down it's going to get all the money and you're going to throw it at it you're going to keep rolling. And so it's like you get a bonus check twice a year. That's really what it amounts to if you've set yourself up to where you can live on the two checks, which it sounds like you have.

So good job. But that's a normal thing that happens to a lot of people budgeting. So it's a really good question to bring up. Jorge is with us in Reno, Nevada. Hi, nevada hi jorge how are you i'm doing great how about yourself better than i deserve how can we help all right hi yes i have a question um so i recently i just got divorced and um uh i'm i'm 30 i make about 50 000 year, and I am currently $24,000 in debt. I just started doing your baby steps, and I'm on step number two. My question is, I have $5,000 in lawyer's fee, $2,680 in bank child support, and I owe $10,000 on a car payment. So I'm trying to figure out which should I tackle first, the bank child support, the credit card, or the lawyer?

We normally would tell you to list your debts, smallest to largest, pay minimum payments on those. Are you paying payments to your lawyer? Yes. Okay. Then list your debts, smallest to largest, pay minimum payments on everything but the little one and attack the little one. The only thing I move ahead of that order is IRS or child support. Because taking care of your children is a primary goal of dads and moms i agree and so uh it just so happens your child support by a rearage is also your smallest debt

so it also it so for two reasons it's number one but if it were not your smallest debt i still would move it to the front because it is not a a debt it's an obligation. I mean, it's a different kind of thing morally. And so, you know, and the IRS has such high penalties and interest, I would move it up there too. And they've got unlimited power. So those are the only two I cheat on the debt snowball. Everything else, regardless of interest rate, I just leave them in that order. And so, you know, you're going to pay minimum payments on your credit cards, minimum payment

on your car, minimum payment to that lawyer, knock this $2,600 out. But you ought to do that in less than two months, right? Oh, yeah. I mean, a month and a half. Yeah. So as soon as you're caught up on that, then you're going to start really chunking on that lawyer and getting rid of him.

That's going to be two wonderful things to have in your rearview mirror. Agreed? I'd strongly agree. Yeah. And then you can start attacking those credit cards. How many different credit cards are there? It's just one. I took it out to put for a down payment for the lawyer.

Oh, good Lord. This is all lawyer except the car then. It's all about the divorce except the car. Exactly. Yeah. Unfortunately, yeah. I'm sorry. How long were you guys married uh we were married for about a year and a half oh my goodness how many kids do you have yeah one just one yeah just one

wow what a heartbreak yeah okay well yeah i mean you got you got nine thousand dollars with a lawyer here huh ouch yeah it was supposed to be cheaper um unfortunately the divorce itself was perfectly fine but the custody for my son was was what caused us the most headache luckily i mean the lawyer's like you know what i'll just give you a discount just pay me four thousand and that's it we'll call it even yeah okay wow okay you got it done and so yeah you're going to plow through both of those really quick, all of this really quick, because now you've got one job and you're not distracted anymore with all this other drama. And you're going to feel such freedom financially when you get these debts,

especially all the non-card debts behind you, not just from the financial standpoint, but from the emotional standpoint, not having to pay on that memory and that pain. You know what I mean? Yes. You're going to feel such freedom on the other side of this. How old are you? And you can get through it. I'm 30.

Okay. Just turned 30. All right, yeah. So good news is you're getting a fresh start at 30, huh? Yes. Yes, yes, I am. I'll try not to make the same mistakes again, but, I mean, yeah. Yeah, I hear you.

Yeah, me too. I understand. Wow. Ouch. That's no fun at all. So the debt snowball, in this case, it actually laid out perfectly, oddly enough. But the idea of the sense of traction you get of knocking a debt out is a big deal yeah it just really sets you free and um you get this emotional momentum when you

pay off one that leads you straight to the next one yes and the momentum is what that's right the momentum propels you forward and people always argue on the interest rate but when you get that smallest debt by balance paid off the motivation you get more and more fired up to attack the second one and then the third one and so on. It's so much more about motivation and momentum than math and the interest rates. And so I just it's amazing to see the success. And the research shows this, that people stick with the plan when they see the progress and have the momentum from doing it this way. Yeah. And what's weird is it even adds more momentum when it's a debt associated with something that you hate. Yeah. The pain associated pain like that. You know, get the lawyer behind me, get this child support, child support behind me. Get the you know, that there's a that's an

extra level of momentum, emotional momentum and freedom. That's right. It sets you free to move on to the next thing. That's that's a big deal. You guys, it really momentum and freedom that's right it sets you free to move on to the next thing that's that's a big deal you guys it really is and that's sometimes when i'm doing a debt-free screen with people i ask them what's that one debt you paid off that you just hate those people because there's something about that that drives you you know it's like i want you people out of my life forever yes i can go back and name them in detail and it was 35 years ago yes you know it's just oh my gosh i hate you people yes i'll never be in debt to american express again i hate american express oh hate them yeah it's that exact situation so good show christy that's great good job good job james and kelly in the booth i am

dave ramsey your host will be back with you before you know it in the meantime remember there is ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus. Have a friend or family member that needs a daily dose of Ramsey advice in their life? Let them know about the Ramsey Call of the Day podcast. It's a quick hit of advice about life and money in under 10 minutes. Check out the Ramsey Call of the Day podcast wherever you listen.