The Ramsey Show - App - Should I Quit My 6-Figure Job to Get a MBA? (Hour 3)

Episode Date: June 3, 2020

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live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studio. This is the Dave Ramsey Show, where you learn to take control of your money and create a life you love. My name is Anthony O'Neill. Joining me is Dr. John Donnelly. We will be co-hosting the show today and sitting in, having a great time. If you have any questions, concerns, want to talk about money, life, if you're a millennial, I want to see more young people calling in too. You know, 18, 15, 21, 22, in college. I would love

to have a conversation with you. The number here is 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. Or you can send us a message on Instagram or Twitter. You can reach me at Anthony O'Neill.

Dr. D, what's yours? At John Deloney. At John Deloney. We went complicated. Yeah, very, very complicated. And I want to say hello to our YouTubers, man. For those of you all who are watching this, we've got about 2,000 of you all watching this on YouTube right now. Thank you for joining us. So any questions, concerns, comments, give us a call, 888-825-5225 how you been man it's been a week it's been a month it's

been a few months man what's new with you in your world every single thing we are cranking out youtube shows we are working on honoring people we are listening being quiet being quiet, growing, reading, listening, repeating. How about you? Man, I'm living. I'm living and learning, man. I'm just really excited about what we're doing on YouTube right now, but we're going to talk about that a little bit later. I want to get to the phones because I love talking to people. So we're going to go out to Oklahoma and talk to Piper. Piper, how are you doing this afternoon? How can Dr. D and I help? I'm well. It's a pleasure to speak with you both. Oh, man. You too.

How can we help? Thanks. So I've got a parenting question. I have five children, and the oldest two of those we adopted as teenagers through foster care, and they were 15 and 17 when we adopted them. They're now out of the house. They're 19 and 21, doing what 19- and 21 and 21 year olds do, doing their own thing. Going to church and working three or four full-time jobs, that kind of thing?

Not exactly. Not so much. Okay. All right. All right. Go ahead. So they're not making choices that we try to instill in them. But, you know, we hear from them whenever they need something and, you know, when they need help with bills or groceries. And neither of them are able to seem to be able to keep a job on a regular basis. And we want to be sensitive to the culture that they were brought up in and a poverty culture. And then they lived in foster care for a significant number of years. And then, you know, they were only with us a couple of years before they decided to go and try life as adults.

And so we feel like there needs to be a balance there between helping them and, you know, enabling them. And so I was just looking for some thoughts and some inspiration from you guys. That's a lot. Anthony, what do you think? I'm going to let you go first on this one. Let me go first?

Yeah, because you're a parent. I'm not. Yeah, but you work with thousands and millions of millennials. So, Piper, number one, big-time high-five to you from Nashville to Oklahoma on being the type of mom, the type is going to, um, go through the adoption route. It's a challenging route. It's a hard route and it's a wholly gifted route. And so high five to you. Second thing is, um, is you nailed it on the head. Um, a trauma background rewires your brain. It, you, you get launched out of the cannon for a thousand million different reasons, disconnected.

And so that's a lifetime journey of learning how to reconnect. That's a lot of hard work you put in. As a parent, that's a ton of hard work that you put in as a, for lack of better terms, a trauma survivor, someone who's been through a lot and is still working through how to reconnect. I think this is one of those calls that I love, but also know that you know the answer, but I will say it for you because I love you and you're from Oklahoma, which is close to Texas where I'm from. How about that? Right. We accept each other. Well, not really. If you're from Texas, Oklahoma is basically Southern Canada,

but we'll let it go now that I'm in Nashville. So here's the deal. You are right, and what I would recommend in this situation is, number one, to have a, and you've probably had these, I would have one more, a clarifying conversation in a non-emotional moment. Take the kids out to a restaurant, sit down and say, here's our boundaries. You always have a bed here at our house. We love you. We're not going to let you hang out to dry but you're going to be a part of you're going to be enrolled in school you're going to have full-time jobs you're going to um we're going to

work together on a budget or our money stops and there is a part of love that show like the the stronger the boundaries the more love you're showing. And that's hard. That doesn't feel good. And that's heavy. But that's the right holy thing to do. And these young guys are going to recognize, or men and women, I didn't even ask, they are going to recognize over time that boundaries equal love. And you've got to lay it out that way. And if you've been giving them rent, you've been giving them food, and you just cut that off,

man, that's an abrupt stop. So I think they're worth a conversation. They're worth clarity, clarity, clarity. And they're worth knowing that they always have a bed they can come home to because you love them. Man, that's awesome. I love it. Thanks for calling in, Piper. Going out to Virginia, we're going to have a conversation with Aaron.

Aaron, how can Dr. D and I help, man? Hi, John and hi, Anthony. Big fans of both of y'all. Thanks so much for taking my call. I appreciate you for calling in. How can we help? All right. So I think I have a two-pronged question.

To preface and to put it shortly, I think my mom might be addicted to being scammed or catfished. And so to summarize, catfished, yeah. Okay. I don't think what you said is a thing, but go ahead. Catfish is a thing. That's a thing. Addicted to.

Go ahead. Go ahead, Aaron. You've got my attention. I can't wait to hear this. Yeah. Okay. All right. So both of my attention. I can't wait to hear this. Yeah. Okay. All right. So both of my parents are in their late 60s.

They are likely going to be divorced. They've been separated for about six months. A few years ago, they have been – my mom has begun a series of online dating emotionally and financially, you know, a series of online relationships that have been both emotionally and financially infidelitous. Is that the word? Not really, but we'll let it ride. That sounds good. Infidelitous. Thank you.

Yes. Right. Appreciate it. So she's been doing this kind of thing for a while. She's been paying thousands and thousands of dollars to people that don't exist and not gotten a dime of it back. So anyway, they've been separated for a while. And so I recently became privy to her being a part of a whole new one. And so I let everybody around our family know, all of her friends who she's gone to ask for money before.

And so my brother and his fiance, as well as myself, we intervened with her yesterday, pointed out that this financial transaction that she was given that was looking to exchange thousands of stock. Hey, Aaron, hold on a minute, man. I like the way this is going. We've got to hear this one. Yeah, we're going to finish this conversation. Hold on. We're going to come back to you after the break. I mean, because we're talking about being catfish.

We're talking about infidelities. She's spending thousands of dollars. Oh, we're going to have us a good conversation. Infidelities. I'm going to look that talking about being catfish. We're talking about infidelities. She's spending thousands of dollars. Oh, we're going to have us a good conversation. Infidelities. This is going to be good. I'm going to look that word up over the break. This is going to be good. Yeah, we'll be right back after this. For most of us, health care costs seem to increase every year, and saving money on health insurance feels more and more out of reach.

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It's biblical, affordable, and it shared nearly $97,000 to help the Olcheskis. To be a part of Christian Healthcare Ministries, visit chministries.org. That's chministries.org. CHM is a proud sponsor of Dave Ramsey Live Events. Before we left the break, we had an interesting phone call And we're going to go back and have a conversation with him But if you have any questions around your money

Or around life, give us a call 888-825-5225 We have about two more segments And I would love to hear from you But we're going to go back out to Virginia And have a conversation with Aaron And before we got off Before the break in it, it Aaron correct me if I'm

wrong from what I understand is your mom is about to have a divorce and she has been doing some online dating situations and unfortunately your mom has been a catfish as far as and maybe being misled scammed to give other men other people money is that correct thus far yeah yep yep Yep. Yep. A hundred percent. Correct. So what, what's your question for us today? Cause I, I, man, I just, I'm loving this, this one right now. Well, what's your question? How can we help? Okay. So, so the current situation in the, and this will lead to my question. We, we intervened with her last night and basically pointed out inconsistencies in a phony transaction document. And she seemed to agree with what we were saying and said that, you know, you're putting

your family's identities at risk and we can't be allowing you to make these kinds of behaviors anymore. And she, she acted like she understands, but, um, just today she had indicated that, um, she believes that it's a completely valid transaction. And so what, what I'd like to find out is one, um, is there anything that, that, that me or my family can do to to be able to to protect her because i feel like like like to her this is like professional wrestling but in relationship format and she's a seven-year-old boy a part of her knows that it's not real but she won't um she she just doesn't really care because she she's dirt broke and um doesn't want

to work and is nearing you know she's getting older and i feel like she's she all of these scams have involved hey send us five grand and we'll give you a hundred gold bars and stuff like that yeah so this hurts and um i'm to say something that you probably already know, but your mom's an adult. And there's no laws against painfully hurtful, stupid decisions. And you can protect yourself. If you do think you've got some back channels to find out where a particular scam is coming, you can call the police and ask them to look into it. But at the end of the day, what you need to do is protect you and your family. And I wish I had some better advice for you.

I wish I had some better, like, yeah, you only do this, this, and this. The reality is your 65-year-old mom, your 60-year-old mom is struggling from some connection issues. And it sounds like she's in a marriage that um is is over at some shape form or fashion she's been seeking connection online and there is something about a dopamine hit there's some oxytocin hits that you get when you give somebody money it feels good for a second and then you get on to the next thing and that's what predators do especially online predators but but here's the thing Dr. D, and I think this is where, and correct me if I'm wrong,

because I could be wrong. You are never wrong. But I have a problem trying to protect a grown woman, and I'm being stressed, and I'm trying to help. I need to be protecting and providing for my family. That's what I'm saying. You've got to make sure that your social security number,

your checking accounts, make sure the people in her world don't give her money. You do all your due diligence. You're exactly right. At the end of the day, all you can protect is you. That's heartbreaking. I think having a group of people who love her to rally around and have a hard conversation,

that's good. I hope she can hear it. It doesn't sound like she's able to. That's my thing. Once I sit down and have a conversation with my mother, if she was getting catfished and she was still giving away money, that's my mom. That's my mom. That's my mom. I mean, I'm going to be hurt. I'm going to be upset.

But I can't stress over my mother's life when I have – I'm dealing with a lot of stuff. So I'm not worried about that. But, man, I'm praying. I hate that for you and your family, guys. I hate that for you and your family. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Keep having the hard conversation, but also keep loving your mom. Going out to New York, having a conversation with Rodney,

how can Dr. D and I help, man? Hi, good afternoon to you both. Yeah, good afternoon. How can we help? My question is a little bit for both of you, but I was looking into leaving work and going back for an MBA, you know, before all this stuff happened. And, you know, this was back when the job market was good.

But now, you know, obviously there's uncertainty and I'm less comfortable leaving work for two years than I was, say, six months ago. Okay. So what's your stance on, you know, potentially staying on that track or, you know, since I'm not as confident in the job market or, job market or what my opportunities will be in two years when I get out. Yeah. How old are you, Rodney? I'm 24. 24 years old. What are you doing?

How much money do you make right now a year? Right now, with my bonus, I'm at about $130,000, $140,000. You're making $140,000 a year at 24 years old, and you want to quit that to go back and get your MBA. What's an MBA going to get you? Yeah, let's go to it. But hold on, I got another question. If you go back to it, because you're saying leave your job as far as in leave the income, how are you going to pay for it?

So part of it, between what I've got saved up and what my parents will help me out with, when I finish, there won't be much left, but I won't have any debt. There won't be much savings left. Okay. All right. So I like Dr. D's question, because if he was talking about taking out some loans, we was going to have a different conversation, but since you're saying you want to go about it for a debt-free degree route. Okay, cool. But explain to the, explain to me this way to this, explain to me this, what is it going to do for you? Getting this MBA, is it going to take you to $300,000 a year? I mean, what will it do for your career? So the reason why I wanted to get it is it's a natural progression in my field.

A lot of the seniors that I work with, it's sort of a natural rite of passage for them, right? They all get the MBA. I'm guessing the additional credentials help propel them to get more promotions over the course of their career. And I've seen that, you know, without that in my industry, sort of almost like a glass ceiling kind of thing where it's hard to, you know, you don't see too many levels without it. What's your industry? I'm in finance. Okay. So am I.

What I'm going to tell you, Rodney, is the credential for credential's sake world just got dumped upside down. And if you are a 23-year-old making $130,000, $140,000 in the finance world, and a company has valued the skills that you are bringing to the industry at 23 and 24 to pay you that kind of money, there is nothing at 23 or 24 that an NBA is going to bring to you. And I'm a higher ed guy. I am the most pro-hired guy I know. Now, when you're 30, maybe an NBA will be able to contextualize some of the things you learn and add some of that to the theory and give you some stuff you're going to learn down the road.

But this idea that, hey, you've got to have this credential for the sake of just having this credential, I'm telling you right now, I am connected to leaders in higher ed all over the country, and they are sweating this idea that that world's coming to a quick and abrupt halt. You know, when I heard his answer, I think when I hear when I hear your answer, man, I heard, well, this is what they say. This is what they say. This is what they say. This is what I I'm hearing. I want you to go back. Let me address the financial part. If you want to go and get it and not rack up any debt, you go for it. But go get it and go get the education because that's what you want.

And that's what I didn't hear. Yes. Right. I wasn't convinced that. This is not teaching me how to do supply chain management and run my company. And that bothers me because, you know, you're in the education space and I'm talking to young people and to all ages who want to get into the space, and they're saying, well, they said, they said. No, what do you want?

Because it's going to be your money. It's going to be your hard work. It's going to be your life. So what do you want? I'm in a financial space, and I don't have an MBA. Right. And I never will get one. And you're doing just fine.

Yes. And here's the thing. An MBA is an extraordinary credential if it's going to help you learn to take the next steps in your business trajectory. And if it will especially give you more money. But to go and get it for an extra $5,000, $10,000, it's not worth it. It's not worth it. And you're an education person. Let you say it. I'll still say it's not worth it.

Just make sure you calculate the cost of that NBA plus two years of 140 out. So that's $280,000 plus the cost of the NBA. That's the true cost. Most people's money problems come from not paying attention. That's why before I spend a dime of my money on something, I do the research and make sure it's going to live up to what it claims. Recently, I got a great pair of sunglasses from a company called Shady Rays. When you're looking for sunglasses, it feels like your options are limited. Name brand sunglasses cost too much and the cheap knockoffs are ugly and really don't protect your eyes. Discovering Shady Rays is a game changer.

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to have an honest conversation with you uh 888-825-5225 888-825-5225 dr d speaking of conversations uh right now uh every single morning of this week at 8 a.m. I'm releasing a singles panel where a group of singles from the ages 22 all the way up to 44, from black, white, and even Chinese, from celebrities down to, you know, just some great, amazing people who work every single day, are talking about what it feels like to be single in today's day and time. Dude, I'm hooked on this thing, man. I'm hooked on it, man. I'm married.

I'm an old married dude. Man, they're not holding back. They are not holding back. And today, America, I want you to go to my YouTube channel because a lot of you all have been asking me questions about dating on a budget. This video that went viral. Dave and I talked about it a couple weeks ago. And so I actually bring this up in the conversation today. And the ladies and the guys are just going at it in a healthy way, though.

But they're like, you know, the guy's like, no, he was right. And then the lady was like, ah, he was wrong. And so the conversation is very good. I wish you would have been here because we needed a counselor in the middle of that situation. I'm staying far away from that many people. Hey, but here's another thing that's important. It's easy to check out because it says it's a conversation among single folks. But the stats don't lie that half of marriages in this country don't fail. And I would guess that half of the half that do make it end up being roommates.

And there are a lot of people who are married and single in their house. Wow. And they know exactly what I'm talking about if they just heard that. Wow. There's a lot of people who are roommates with the person they're married to. Yeah. And so there is something powerful about listening to folks in who are single yeah asking hard questions about what does this mean what does that mean that married couples should be paying

attention to also and so i want to recommend that as a as a way to introduce conversations into a married relationship you've been dating for five years watch this series man because you're laying some heavy questions out there that apply to everybody, not just single people. Questions are real. So go over to YouTube. Go to YouTube.com forward slash Anthony O'Neal. We currently have three segments, and I'm telling you right now, you're going to find a little bit more out about me. You know, I'm being honest on this series as well.

And I actually admit, America, I'm going to tell you this much. I admit it where I was wrong. I admit it where I was wrong. But guys are the first time and check it out but you've ever been right now we're gonna go over to indiana and have a conversation with jason man jason how you doing this afternoon hey jason hey guys thanks for taking my call thanks for calling us yeah how can we help man uh i just wanted to let you guys know ahead of time, I have an anxiety disorder, and I never thought I'd be calling into a radio show like this, and so I'm a little nervous just throwing it out there.

I have struggled with anxiety, and I sure never thought I'd be working on one, man, so we're in this together. What's up? So I've been struggling a lot with this anxiety disorder. I was diagnosed with it a few months ago. Since I was diagnosed, I had two nervous breakdowns, and I've been in and out of the hospital. So fast forward to right now,

I grew up in a small town in Indiana. And after my nervous breakdowns, I had to move back in with my parents. And everyone knows everyone in my small town. And it got to the point where the people in my town started harassing me. People, they were saying that I was making this up to get attention, that I just needed to get over it move on with my life and you know i just i can't really do that um you know like uh and um i'm sorry man take a breath you're good okay it's a blessing to hear your journey

keep going okay some of them have been like harassing me they got a hold of my phone number and they started calling me and just yelling at me telling me to get over it

to stop being weak. So Jason, how old are you, man? 28. 28, okay. Yeah. Jason, take a breath for me right now, man. Okay. Just stop and just take a breath right now.

You're on the phone with two people who understand you We don't know you but we love you And I want you to take a breath And just And just breathe Okay Okay So let me ask you this question

Because I want to make sure that We give you something that can help you out right now. What exactly, how can we help? How can we serve you right now? Sure. Sure. So I know at the hospital they call this fight or flight. And I feel like I do need to move out of this area because it just, they just won't leave.

Like they won't leave me alone. And I get so much anxiety just walking around town. The problem is, is that I've been fired from every job I've ever had because of my anxiety. And now I do have roughly $80,000 in mutual funds. And I was just wondering if you had any ideas on how I could work to move out of this area or if you have any suggestions for me.

Are your parents supportive of you now? Yes. Do they honor the situation that you're in right now? Yes. Okay. So I'm going to give you a broad context of my personal experience and my what i call my nerd world experience um with anxiety and then give you a couple of of to do right now okay so i want to um reframe a couple things for you. Number one, you are not your diagnosis.

Yes. Okay. I want to say that again. You are not your diagnosis. Okay. Yes. This is a anxiety is a learned behavior. It is something in it.

And I don't mean that in a negative way or pejorative way. It's a way your body learns to take care of itself and to sound alarms that your ecosystem is out of order. And if you grew up in a small town where there's a bunch of jerks that are still trying to get ahold of you and mess with you, um, I get your alarms are ringing as loud as they possibly can right now. Okay. Um, uh, another important thing to note is think of anxiety as a disconnection disorder. That could be a community. That could be stemming from childhood traumas. That could be stemming from the alarms got so loud you just sit in a corner and have to cover your ears because the alarms are so loud.

And they are real and they are debilitating and I have experience in myself. Okay. And so anybody who says what your experience isn't real and you're faking it, here's the deal, man, they don't get a vote. And that is easy for you for, for me to say, but I want you to know it's when I started taking people out of my box that didn't get a vote in how I feel and they did not have permission to hurt me. And I left a few people in there that I connected deeply with and that started the journey to get well. The next thing is if you've got a supportive family system with you right now that doesn't allow you, I mean, that lets you not pay rent and gets your feet underneath you and get well,

then take advantage of that. If you have to leave your environment, then you sit down with your parents who support you and love you and make a plan. You're at a stage now where you've been hospitalized twice. I'm going to strongly, strongly recommend that you sit down with a counselor, with a psychiatrist. The alarms can get to be where they're so loud, Anthony. They're so loud.

There is medication to help shut the alarms off so that you can then sit down with a counselor and get the connection and the therapeutic help that you need. But I want you to hear me say this. And I'm not a big medication proponent, but there is a season when it's helpful and turns the alarms off so you can be able to do the hard work. But I want you to hear this, Jason.

And I'm looking directly into this camera. There is light on the back end of this tunnel. And there is life free from anxiety. And I've got a wife that loves me on most days, and I've got two healthy kids on the back of this deal. And I want you to know that through connection and relationships and the right medication and the right community and little wins and a lot of hard work on your part, you can get well. We're with you. Please hear me loud and clear. The government is not going to bail you out of your student loans, at least not completely and not without a catch. What they're talking about only impacts federal, not private loans, and you need to take responsibility for what you owe and pay your debt down quicker.

Right now, Splash Financial is offering their lowest rates ever. With lower rates and extra payments, you could just find yourself debt-free in the next five years. Visit SplashFinancial.com slash Ramsey to see if you qualify. Scripture of the day is now faith. It's the assurance of things hoped for for the conviction of things not seen. Hebrews 11, one. All growth depends upon activity. There is no development physically or intellectually without effort.

And effort means work. Calvin Coolidge. Oh, man. Going out to Tennessee. We'll have a conversation. Actually going right here to Tennessee. We have a conversation with Rob. Rob, good afternoon. How can Dr. D and myself help, man? Good afternoon, gentlemen. I really appreciate what you all do and really admire you all for the way you handled Jason there. That was a very emotional call.

It was. I thank you all for that. First time with you, Anthony, but I have talked to Dr. D before about two weeks ago. I called in and found you guys on YouTube for the first time, and I am at retirement in May. I hit full retirement. My wife is going to hit full retirement in December.

Okay. Congratulations, I think, I hope, right? Yes, absolutely so. All right. As I told you before, John, I just want to make sure that we're set in our retirement and get advice from you guys. I didn't get to ask two

questions, but I do want to ask them today. I'll be glad to give you any information you need. We combined, we're going to give $45,000 in Social Security in December. She'll get half of mine. So we'll have $45,000. We have about $18,000 left in our IRAs and 401ks. We have our house not paid for, but we have been downsizing and prepping for this. And my car will be paid off in October. We have about $2,000 in medical bills. And I can give you any other information. But anyway, I do have two questions that I do want to ask you. So I don't want to take up a lot of your time, but I'll be glad to answer any other questions if you need more information. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So, Rob, let me make sure I understand this correctly. You're going to be making $45,000 a year, and you have $18,000 in your IRAs, correct? Yes, that's gross on our Social Security. We'll be grossing that. Of course, we have to pay Medicare and Medicare supplements out of that. Any other income coming in on top of the $45,000? No. Okay, cool.

She's working now, but she's going to stop working in December when she turns 66. Okay, cool. Great. And she's going to take full retirement. Okay, cool. Go ahead. How can we help? Okay.

We have one debt that we have that I'm calling you about. We owe $60,000 in her student loans. And I have insurance that is costing me a chunk of money, a life insurance that I bought probably 30, 40 years ago. And it was one of those terrible policies, what do you call it, the whole life universal or something. Anyway, it keeps going up every year i'm spending 320 dollars on that but i needed it at the time i needed it and up till now i needed

it because i was grossly overweight okay and uh and i needed it because of my medical conditions i had gastric surgery about a year and a half ago i dropped 200 200 pounds. So I'm healthy. Yeah. Thank you. A world of difference, I tell you. But I was out of control. But anyway, my health is good now. So my question is, on top of a student loan, do you think that I need to keep paying that $320 now that I am healthy and it's going up every year because of the type of policy that it was, or should I take that money and apply it towards these student loans and get this down because that's going to be the only debt we have after we sell our house. So are you asking should you stop paying for your whole life insurance policy?

Yes. Do I need to keep paying that because it keeps going up every year? It's $320 a month now. It'll go up next year even more and the year after, and it terminates at $70, and I'm $66 now. I want you to stop that. I mean, you know, we don't do whole life insurance. We promote term life. So I do want you to get term life insurance for you and your wife to cover you just in case if anything was to happen. So that term life will go down, hopefully, depending upon your health. But then at the same time, I do want you to start attacking your debt.

All right. I do want you to get on baby step number two and attack that. Now, with you making $45,000 a year, we need to figure out how we can get some extra income flowing in so you can get out of debt quicker. But to answer your direct question, yes, I want you to stop doing co-life. And I do want you to go ahead and do uh get term life insurance for you and your spouse the the temptation is going to be to just let the student loans ride and so i do want everyone who takes out a student loan to remember this one thing um and this is this is definitely not pointed at you, Rob,

but it's just a broader question that we hear all the time. At the end of the day, we went to somebody and said, hey, would you help me pay for my education? I'll pay you back. And however predatory that was or however we didn't fully understand everything or we fully knew what we were getting into, we signed their name and said,

hey, if you'll loan me some money, I'll pay you back. And so making good on that commitment, even if it's a little bit, if you have to refi right now with these just bananas low interest rates, figure out a way to do that. But like Anthony said, don't stop chipping away at it. And my last little tennis ball to anybody retiring is make sure you have a plan to do other things.

Get hobbies, get life, get fun, get travel, go fishing, do whatever it is. But the research is pretty clear that if you plan to just stop life, man, your mind and heart and body fall apart pretty quick after that. Going out to the beautiful state, Florida. Sarah, how can Dr. D and I help? Hi, I am a single mom. I have two daughters. They're two and four years old. And I'm just wondering, I just had a huge change in life, I guess, is the best way to describe it. There's no real textbook answer for it. And so I'm wondering if I should go into storm mode and how do I know when to be out of storm mode? What does major life change mean?

So last year I went through a, I started the divorce process early last year with my to be ex-husband. Long story short, there were domestic violence charges last year and then everything was fine for about a year. He has been paying child support, no problem. I was a stay-at-home mom for five years so i never furthered my education um i actually moved um from canada when i moved down here um to get married have kids all that fun stuff um and so um when we split he had always paid child support about About a month and a half ago, new charges came about, and he has now been in jail for the past month and a half.

So there's been no child support coming in. And the child support is more than I actually make at my job. Gotcha. So I currently still have my job because I'm deemed essential during COVID, and we were just granted the PPP loan. So I'm only working 20 hours but getting paid for that normal 40. So what's your broader question? Yeah, this is a mess.

I'm so sorry. Did I go into storm mode? Because I have about $3,000. I have about $16, dollars I have about sixteen thousand dollars in debt so it's credit card and a car yeah um so getting into interpersonal relationships he's spoken with his parents we don't have any contact it doesn't seem that he has any sort of desire to pay it um moving forward or that he's paid any sort of backlog. So my guess would be to go into storm mode.

And then if this becomes a long-term thing, how do I know when to get out of storm mode? Yeah, that's a good question, Sarah. And here's the thing I'm going to suggest for you is that, especially right now with COVID impacting your income right now, I want you to get into what I call the four walls mode. Just go ahead and make sure you can have enough to cover your four walls. That's going to be your shelter. That's going to be your food. That's going to be your utilities if you move out on your own. And that's going to be your transportation. Just make sure you have enough to take care of

that. I want you to still keep working, still keep seeking for a job, still keep seeking for more income. But I want you to go ahead and make sure that you have enough to take care of that. And then as things progress and you see that things are progressing for the good, then yes, start opening things back up. But right now, I do want to make sure that you are prepared. And I want to make sure I also want to make sure you find somebody at your church where you work and you find an attorney that you trust. You mentioned that he just decided he doesn't – may want to pay this, and that's not how that works. And so I want you to find a lawyer that you trust that you can sit down and explain this and see if there's a state that you can go after if there are cash reserves or savings accounts.

People don't get to opt out of paying their responsibilities. And men, you don't get a choice. You've got kids, and you will take care of your responsibilities. I was going to say something. I'm done with that. Yeah. Man, I was going to say something, but you didn't. I agree with you.

I'm going to start swearing on national radio, so I'm going to keep my mouth shut, Anthony O'Neal. We can't get fired, man. But, hey, I want to thank our producer, James Schout, and associate producer, Kelly Daniel. You guys, it's been an amazing time with you all. Thank you so much. This is The Dave Ramsey Solutions wants to give you some hope. For the very first time ever, we're giving you Financial Peace University free for 14 days.

Go to DaveRamsey.com slash hope so you can watch from home. You may feel like there's not a lot you can control these days, but I'm here to tell you, you can control your budget and you can control what you feed your family. My longtime friends at eMeals are here to help. They have simplified meal plans and created new recipe collections such as easy pantry meals and freezer meals utilizing basic ingredients. It has never been easier to shop smarter and stay on a budget. Try it free for two full weeks at emeals.com.