The Ramsey Show - App - Should I Sell Investments To Pay Off Debt? (Hour 3)

Episode Date: January 23, 2023

George Kamel & Ken Coleman answer your questions and discuss: Dealing with tax debt, "How picky should I be in my job search?" Credit scores and why you don't need one, "I'm scared the economy is going to collapse and the government will take my money". Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6 Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Pods Moving and Storage Studio, it's The Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. I'm Ramsey personality, George Campbell, joined by Ken Coleman this hour. The phone number to call is 888-825-5225. This is a show about you and your life and you doing meaningful work and living a debt-free lifestyle and having incredible relationships. That's what we're here to help you do. Joshua kicks us off from New Mexico this hour. Joshua, welcome to the show. Yeah, hi. how's it going?

Good. How are you? Good. Good. Okay. So I I'm 24 years old. Um, I work in real estate, my wife, a nurse here, and, uh, we have five investment properties and then we have our primary residence. We have three vehicles to still have loans on them. And I guess the just to my question is, should I sell my investment properties to clear pretty much all my personal debt? And I think I'd have about 40,000 left on my personal mortgage. So how much do you have in consumer debt? You said you have two car loans, anything else? Two car loans. I have taxes coming up, which I actually didn't pay for. I didn't do a very good job. I just overspent.

We bought a few investment properties this year, and we just overinvested that money. How much are you going to owe in taxes? I'm going to owe about $47,000. Whoa. That's a whole lot of not paying taxes. Yeah, it is. How much are the car loans? I owe about $55,000 on my truck and my truck and then 18 on my life's car.

What's your household income? Total household income is probably about 320 a year. Wonderful. Wow. How much is each car worth on the 55 truck? How much is the truck worth? That one's pretty new. It might be worth 54, 53. I'm probably barely under on that one because I barely bought it a few months ago. Okay. What about the car? That one's worth about 26. And you owe 18 on it? Yeah. Okay. Well, I would sell the cars before I would sell the investment properties. It's a whole lot less of a hassle. Okay. So if you sold, how much money do you have in the bank?

We have total about $32,000, $33,000. Oh, great. Okay. So we have to have money to pay these taxes. Are they due April? Yeah, I'll probably file an extension. This is the first day I'll probably have to do that. And I guess that was one of my kind of questions also, would it be smart to maybe set up a temporary payment plan so I can pay them off this year without having to sell?

Are you working with a tax pro currently? Yeah. Okay. And what has been their advice? I haven't got advice specifically on this yet. Because I guess this is the first year where I didn't do a very good job of saving for it. I would go ahead and get this out of your life instead of kicking the can down the road. You'll have the money once you sell these cars.

You can get two cheaper cars. Okay. Well, if I did that, because they don't have a ton of equity, so even if I sold the Camry, I would keep $7,000, $8,000 and then the truck, I wouldn't make anything probably on that one.

Yeah, you could just net zero on that. You'd have $8,000 plus $32,000. That gives you could just net zero on that. You'd have 8K plus 32K. That gives you 40K. And now we still need two cars. And so we're going to get two very reasonable used cars. They're not going to be fancy like the ones you have right now, but it's temporary. But, George, I'm curious why you say you wouldn't sell at least one of the properties. You can do that.

Do you have a least favorite? One that's given you the most hassle? Not worth the cash flow? They've all been pretty solid, actually. I did pretty well on them. But yeah, there's definitely some I have in mind that I would sell before another. Do you own all these cash? No, no, no. They all have mortgages. They all cash flow pretty well and it can run you through the numbers if you wanted to, but they all have mortgages on them. I'd be curious so George could get the whole picture because I'm, George, I'm not sure why he's not selling all the houses. If you stand to make money on all of them? Yeah. And so, like I said, I can run you through kind of- Run through them real quick. Run through. So we have five houses or four?

Five investments and then just my primary. yeah run through them real quick are we good with this george so run through house number one um how much do you owe on it how much could you sell it for okay house number one i owe about 147 and i could sell it about 255 Okay, number two? House number two, I owe $145,000. I could sell it about $235,000. House number three, I owe $74,000. I could sell it about $110,000. Another one, I owe $112,000. I could sell it about $220,000.

Another one, I owe $162,000. That one is priced at about $212,000. And just for fun, your personal house, how much do you owe on your home? $395,000. All right, George, I'm genuinely asking here. He's got some serious equity here, and he can clean all of this up. If you're willing to sell one of the investment properties, it would put you in a much better financial situation. And I might sell both cars and sell a rental property to really set you guys up for success. And the thing with the cars is it's a depreciating asset versus the homes, which are going to appreciate at least. I don't love that you went into debt for five

properties, but it's less risky than these cars continuing to go down in value that are toys. Yeah. Well, and my concept was that these cars would last us 10, 15 years down the road that way. We have a kid on the way, which is also why I'm trying to get together financially. I'm going to be more aggressive than George. If it's me, I'm selling the houses. I'm trying to get together financially. I'm going to be more aggressive than George if it's me. I'm selling the houses. I'm cleaning all this up, paying off money. The one you owe $112,000 on that's worth $220,000, that would clear six figures for you.

Yeah. Yeah. Now you've got nice paid-for cars, baby on the way. I'd be super aggressive. The cars aren't a large part of your world as far as income goes. And so either way, something's got to give. Either we sell one of those properties to clear the car debt or we sell the cars to clear the car debt. And so one issue with, and it's not a drastic issue per se, but if I were to sell a car, I would have to, because I depreciated them on my taxes.

So I would have to reclaim it and- You'd owe tax money on that. Yeah, but that's not a reason to stay in debt. You're going to have the cash to pay your taxes now. And you got to stay on top of it with these taxes. Is your tax pro helping you do this? He is. Yeah. And he's really good. He's been on it. Like I said, this was the first year. We bought three investment properties last year alone, I guess. And so with 25% down, we just overspent on investment properties last year. Yeah, I'd pump the brakes on the investment guru stuff and work on paying these off. And you may just want to snowball them. And what's your mortgage left on your primary? $395.

Okay. Yeah, I might snowball some of the smaller properties first and then work on attacking that personal one. And by the end of this, if you keep this up, you'll have a bunch of paid for properties that are cash flowing, no payments in the world, and a whole bunch of money in the bank. I like that plan. But with a baby on the way, nothing will get your butt in gear like a baby coming into the world. I'd sell them all. Hey, I'm a fan of Ken's move right there. It'll definitely help you sleep better at night.

Sell every one of them. Knock out as much debt as you can. You're eventually going to get back into it because you know how to do it. And whatever you have left in cash, yeah, you have a few hundred thousand left over. All right, let's go pay cash for some real estate. Love that plan. This is The Ramsey Show. this is the ramsey show i'm george camel joined by ken coleman this hour open phones at 888-825-5225. Jesse's up next in Knoxville, Tennessee.

Jesse, welcome to the show. Thank you. How are you fellas doing? We're doing great. How can we help? Well, so I'm graduating from college in about three and a half weeks. And I've been job hunting for the last few weeks. And I'm wondering if I'm being too picky with which jobs I take or look at. Oh, what is making you feel like you might be being too picky? So I've gotten a couple bites mainly in sales positions,

which I'm not particularly interested in anyway. And I just can't imagine myself doing anything like that and not being absolutely miserable, which is the main thing I want to avoid. That sounds like some self-awareness. Tell me what it is about you that you feel like a sales job would just be awful. What is it? I am a very brutally honest person. And in my experience, at least, salespeople always kind of have to be like fakely nice or over-exaggerate how good the product is. And that's just something I wouldn't want to do. What about the performance side of sales and kind of the pressure? How does that hit you?

Oh, I think I'd be good at it. I don't want to. My main fear is being sort of like my parents were, where I come home from work every day and then just cry myself to sleep because I'm doing something I hate. I want to avoid that. There we go. Jesse, you're my kind of guy. That's why I work, is to help people find work that they're really good at, that they love. All right, so what do you want to do? See, that's the thing. I'm not really particular with what I want to do. I just don't want to do something I hate. Okay. So you've been in college almost four years.

You're getting ready to graduate from UT, I'm guessing? Well, I'm graduating a year early, but no, I'm graduating from University of Phoenix. All right. Oh, okay. Gotcha. So you said you're brutally honest. So am I. I don't believe you and I'm calling you the University of Phoenix. All right. Oh, okay, gotcha. So you said you're brutally honest. So am I. I don't believe you, and I'm calling you out because I want you to feel the confidence to tell me what it is you're thinking about doing. I don't believe a guy like you who's as serious as you are, saying some of the heavy things you're saying, doesn't have a couple of ideas, something he's wondered about, but he's just

got some fear or he's got some doubt. I don't believe that your mind or your heart is a whiteboard. what are you thinking about what's the thing that comes up all the time come on jesse i i genuinely don't have one like i've read through your book and everything and the only thing i could really come up with was like fatherhood or maybe game development okay even then that's okay like super specialized and would take forever. And I know, I know excuses. Yeah, so you actually answered my question and you proved that what I said was correct.

You think gaming is something that's very interesting, but it feels unattainable for you. It feels like it's not worth all the trouble. Yeah, basically. Okay, what about gaming interests you? The function of the work. Is it programming? Coding? No. What about gaming interests you? The function of the work? Is it programming? Coding?

No. What is it? No, it's more like design, figuring out how things would work together. Okay. So something that, let me ask you this. What have you always found that you have been able to do pretty easily, came easy for you, and people complimented you for it? Don't overthink this. I'd probably like teaching people how to do stuff um i worked in

manufacturing for a few years though i hated it i was really good at uh training people did you quality assurance did you actually got the word for qa one time nice did you enjoy the training part yeah yeah i'd like teaching people how to do stuff. Okay, there's a clue. There's a clue in the fact that what interests you about video game designing is the design element. Those are all clues. What we've got an example of is something that you're naturally very gifted at, which is communication and connection. That's the training element. And you enjoyed the result of that, seeing somebody's light bulb come on, do it better. You took some satisfaction in that.

Those are all clues. And then the design element, that's very interesting. Maybe it's an aesthetic. Maybe it's the analyzing. I'm not sure. But when you're looking for ideas on what to do, and by the way, I'm going to give you my get clear career assessment because it's going to pull stuff out of you. But I'm going to venture to say you overthink some stuff. Is that true? Yeah, probably. Yeah, I get it. Listen, I'm a recovering overanalyzer myself. But what we want

to do is when you're somebody who's overthinking everything, we want to detach the brain and we want to go to the heart. So here's a quick exercise, George. Can we do this on the spot? Let's do it. All right. Here's the deal. Jesse, you got to answer quickly. No thinking. You ready? Yep. Who are the people you most want to help? What comes to mind? Say them. Who are they? My wife. Your wife? Oh, geez. Yeah. You can't go hallmark on me. Outside of your wife and the Good Husband Award, who are people in this world you think i'd like to help these people what comes to mind when i ask the question uh people who don't know how to handle money people who don't know how to handle money fantastic

all right we're going to come at the same problem different ways different question you ready what is the problem or desire that they have? Probably not knowing how to budget, I guess. Right. Maybe some discipline issues, maybe some bad habits around money. And then finally, what's the solution to people who have money problems that you get most excited about providing? Seeing their light bulb go on. Does that have anything to do with training or instructing?

I mean, yeah. Yeah. Does it have anything to do with maybe analyzing and designing a plan or a program or a way to connect to them? Yep. What do you think? Yeah, I'd say so. So we got something, right?

Now here's the deal. I want George to weigh in on this too because he's been around me a long time. George walked a very similar path that I did professionally. He gets this idea of talent, what we do best, passion, what we love, mission, what moves us, what results motivate us. I'm going to give you the Get Clear Career Assessment when we put you on hold and my book, From Paycheck to Purpose, you give it to somebody else. I know you've read mine, but I'm going to give it away as a bundle.

But I want you to take the assessment and then remember this conversation that we had because we just walked through some clues. George, any thoughts? He's spot on right there. I mean, it sounds like he's leaning towards some level of financial coaching, maybe on the side. Or certainly being an advisor, a financial advisor, maybe teaching a financial curriculum. And the next step I'd go, do I know anyone who'd let me just shadow and just pick their brain over coffee and see what they do and just see if that stirs you up. I mean, you could be a smart investor pro down the line, you know, and train and guide people. You know, you could teach on the collegiate level. You could teach on the high school level. You could go work for a company in HR and bring in our smart dollar program and be the person

that leads that. But there's some themes here, Jesse, that you've got to pay attention to. And what we just did for people that are brand new to the show, like, what was this guy doing? When you're trying to figure out what it is you want to do with your life professionally, don't miss that there is this emotional component to work. Love, in other words, relationships and work, our occupational life, they share the same result. It's about serving others. People that are happy in their work, it's not about their paycheck, but a fat paycheck, it makes me happy. But it's never just about that. It's about the contribution. I feel like I'm serving people.

I'm making a difference in the world, George. Well, there's something about the education system. As Jesse's talking, I'm going, what a broken education system where people get out of this whole thing after doing it for, what, 18 years? And they're going, I have no clue. And so that part frustrated me for Jesse. Yeah. That he spent all this money in school, got a degree, and is still walking out going, no one prepared me for whatesse yeah that he spent all this money in school got a degree and is still walking out going no one prepared me for what's next which tells me there's some personal responsibility and that the education system needs some overhaul so now watch what happened with jesse this is

really cool so he's presenting on this phone call he's going ken i literally have no ideas at all i knew he did but we went back a little bit what if what always came easy for you like if for those of you out there that feel like you have no idea what you want to do, you're trying to figure out, begin to look at who you are. So what if people always complimented you on doing, or it came easy for you, you saw somebody else struggle in school in this thing, and you were like, this is easy for me. We're just getting to, I'm talented here, and there's going to be a connection between what I do well talent and something that I enjoy in fact we humans George don't like to do anything that we suck at that's true it's only fun for a little bit and then you go it's not fun when it's really

difficult forever I mean I've seen why I don't golf that's why George doesn't golf he's abysmal absolutely but I did beat you at mini golf one time and I still hold it over your head there's a backstory on that that's probably a separate episodemal. But I did beat you at mini golf one time, and I still hold it over your head. There's a back story on that. That's probably a separate episode. The front story is I beat you at mini golf. Yes, you did. That's all you care about. Hey, Jesse, hang on the line. We've got the Get Clear Career Assessment,

which is going to get inside your head and your heart and give you some confidence and some clarity. Love it. Hey, more of your calls coming up. 888-825-5225. This is The Ramsey Show. We're here for you, America. Well, guys, if you're wondering, maybe you're looking to buy or sell a home this year, and you're not sure about this housing market, well, here's what I'll tell you. There's still more demand for homes than there are homes to buy.

The median home price is expected to keep rising, but at a slower rate. And interest rates likely aren't going to stop going up. So what does it mean for you? Well, if you're buying a home, you're still going to face some competition and big price tags. And if you want to sell your home, chances are you can still make a nice profit, but you have to be patient for the right offer to come your way. And of course, this depends on where you are. Every market is going to be wildly different. And it's why you need to work with an experienced real estate agent when you're ready to start this home buying or selling process. You want someone who's done this hundreds of times before and knows how to

negotiate a strong deal based on the current market. And you can find those agents, we call them Ramsey Trusted Endorsed Local Providers, on our website. These are the top performing agents around the country who we trust to serve you well. If you want to connect with one of those agents, just go to ramseysolutions.com slash agent. That's ramsaysolutions.com slash agent. Micah joins us up next in Charleston, South Carolina. Micah, welcome to the show. Hey guys, how's it going? We are doing great, man. What's going on with you? So I'm currently here in Charleston, Wobb station here, US Navy. I'm looking at getting the rest of my enlistment bonus going to be about 18 grand and then re-enlisting in a couple of months for anywhere between 80 to

120,000, half of which I'll get up front and the rest in payments. And I want a little bit of advice on how to, how to be smart with my money. I'm currently sitting on roughly $40,000 of combined student loan debt and car debt. And I was thinking about paying it off 100%, just getting rid of it and,

you know, having zero debt left behind. But all my friends and everybody I know is telling me that I shouldn't pay off my car because I should hold on to that and have it help build my credit. They want you to hold on to debt to build your credit. Yes. Are they making your payments on the student loan in the car? No. Then they don't get a say. And the reason the credit score exists is to vet people to go into debt. Do you plan on going further into debt? The only other thing I plan on taking money out for is a house.

A mortgage. Great. You can do that without a credit score. And I tell you that with great confidence because I did it. And it's called a no score loan through a process called manual underwriting. Our friends at Churchill Mortgage, they do these every single day. And what they do is they take a real look. That's why it's called manual and not automated underwriting, because a real person looks at your financial picture and says, hey, Micah's made on time rent payments for a year. Micah's paid his cell phone bills and insurance bills for a year. Micah's income to debt ratio looks great. We're going to give Micah's paid his cell phone bills and insurance bills for a year. Micah's income

to debt ratio looks great. We're going to give Micah the mortgage. It's about that simple. People try to overcomplicate it. They try to steer you away from it. They tell you it's way more expensive. It's so difficult. It's really that simple. And so I would pay off all of this debt and I would never look back because again, the only reason you want that credit score is now for the mortgage, right? And we just went over why you don't need it. Yeah. Any other concerns about the credit score? Not really. I mean, it kind of got trashed about three or four years ago. I didn't know what I was doing with stuff, and I've been working it up from about 300. It's in the 600s now. Okay.

Yeah, a bad score can and will hurt you when you go to get the mortgage. So the goal here is we're going to pay off all of the consumer debt, close all accounts, cut up all the credit cards, close those accounts if you have any, and over a period of time, six to 12 months, while you save up your emergency fund, your down payment on the house, it's going to take you that long, right? A year or two, three? Yeah.

Your credit score will become indeterminable. So it probably won't go all the way down to zero. It will just disappear eventually to where when you go to check your score, it will say indeterminable. Gotcha. And by the way, there's other things people will tell you you need it for uh like buying a car which you don't need if you're paying cash so save up and pay cash for used cars uh you don't need it to rent a car just check the policy which with each rental car company you might just need to have a little buffer in your checking account because they may add a hold if you use a debit

card gotcha and then even renting. I've rented multiple homes and apartments with no credit score. Because what they're looking for is a bad credit score to show, oh, this person doesn't make payments on time. No score doesn't say that. Gotcha, gotcha. Does that help you? Yeah, yeah, that helps a lot. Okay, tell your friends to go watch this clip, and maybe you guys can sit down and listen to episode seven of The Fine Print. It's called The Dirty Truth Behind Your Credit Score, and I break all of this down in nerdy detail. I talk to mortgage lenders, I call apartments and landlords at random all over the country and ask them if I can rent without a credit score, and I hope it helps just squash this myth and mythology that you need a credit score to live your life. Gotcha. I'm going to make sure to show my friends that then. Absolutely. Well, thanks for the call, man. And thank you for your service in the Navy. That's awesome. You sound like a bright young man making fantastic money. Let's get rid of

all this debt, get the emergency fund, begin building wealth for the future, and never look back. All right, let's move on to Courtney in Boise. Courtney, welcome to the show. Thanks. How's it going? It's going. So I have zero debt, no credit score. So when my, when they pull my credit score, it doesn't exist. Um, which is great. I have a fully funded, um, emergency and, and some money put aside for a nice down payment.

I'm trying, I'm running into issues, um, being able to rent or especially buy because I've also simplified a lot of my, well, all of my bills. So I'm having issues even qualifying for that manual underwriting. And why is that? Have you asked them why you're not qualifying? Yeah. So they said that, uh, they want four, at least four lines of, um, bills. So like, um, like a cell phone insurance utilities. Yeah. Um, and, uh, I, I don't buy anything. I always try and pay in cash right away, so I don't have those monthly payments. So you're paying in cash for, like, your electric bill and your water bill? Yeah, so I have my rent and my electric bill.

All my other utilities are paid through rent, and so it only counts as one line. Okay. So how many lines do you currently have? Two. You've got two. So if we needed two more, are there other normal monthly payments you're making, like insurance premiums, anything like that? I paid for my insurance at the beginning. So I'm being told that that doesn't qualify because I don't have those monthly bills. So I can create those monthly payments instead of paying up front.

But, like, for instance, my internet, I do prepaid because I get it for quite a bit cheaper that way. But then because it's prepaid, that doesn't count as a line. Okay. What lender have you contacted so far for this? I've gone through probably, I've spoken to at least five different lenders in my area. Okay. Have you tried calling Churchill yet? I have not. I would give them a shot. Call Churchill Mortgage. They're licensed in your state and get their opinion on this and they can give you some good hard facts on exactly what you

need to do to do this in the shortest amount of time possible. You said you have a full down payment saved already? How much is that? Yeah, I have just under $50,000. Okay. So worst case, you might need to rent and keep these lines going for another six to 12 months and then get the house. But that's only going to put you in a better buying position when you have a bigger down payment. It opens up your options. So it stinks that you're going through this. I'm sorry to hear that. But get these new lines open. You might need to switch to monthly payments because that's what they're looking for is just consistent monthly payments. And if you have that across those four lines, you should be in good shape to get this mortgage through the manual underwriting process. So wishing you the best. Call our friends at Churchill Mortgage. They'll be happy to help

you. Tell them we sent you. They'll treat you right. Thanks for the call, Courtney. This is The Ramsey Show. Our scripture of the day comes from Lamentations 3, 22 and 23. The steadfast love of the Lord never ceases. His mercies never come to an end. They are new every morning. Great is your faithfulness. Eleanor Roosevelt once said,

With the new day comes new strength and new thoughts. Brent joins us up next in Salt Lake City. Brent, welcome to The Ramsey Show. Glad to be here. Thanks for having me on. Sure. How can we help? Okay.

I have some cash, which it's about $55,000 in my credit union. And I'm really afraid of this economy the way it sits right now. What are you afraid of? The collapse. Based on? Well, yeah. In the past, you know, I mean,

in past history, the government has come in and shut down banks and taken people's money. Granted, it's been 100 years ago, basically, you know. I mean, it could happen, couldn't it? Anything could happen, but what's likely to happen? You think all of your money is going to disappear in that bank? Well, I have a lot more in that bank than just this cash. And it's insured, correct? It's insured, correct. Up to $250,000 per person on the account? Per person.

Do you have more than accounts in stocks and um well you can't be that scared since all your money's there what what's the fear driving all this all of a sudden listen to all these youtube videos yeah so so that's yeah so brent Fear-mongering clickbait YouTube videos. Yeah, I mean, if that's, listen, if that's all you do is pay attention to conspiracy theories and all these things that could happen, then it's going to absolutely impact you. And so I don't want to discount what your fears are, what you believe, your philosophies on government. I'm not, I don't want to get down into that, but I would say this. You start concocting the worst case scenario. Could it happen? I guess. Who knows the percentage chances? You can't argue about that because no one knows the percentage chance of any of that happening. But could it happen? Sure. But living life requires you to make some smart decisions based on the realities of what's working, the stock market, mutual fund performance. All that stuff has got history, and that's what you know.

But deciding what to do with your money based on something that you don't know is going to happen, that doesn't get you anywhere at all. So unless you're planning to go to a bunker somewhere and and and you know live off of the chickens and off grid and you know bury your money in coffee tins then then you know you know what to do you know what to do with that money yeah i know i i stop watching the youtube apocalyptic videos first of all that's why i've been watching you instead. That's good. We've got a head on our shoulders, and we don't do fear mongering. Well, is there a question underneath all of this that we can help with today?

Well, I just retired, and now I've got a 401k that I've got to do something with too. Half's in a Roth and half of it's in a traditional that, you know, do I take it out or do I just leave it there and let it ride? Well, do you need the money? What are you living off of right now? No. Both my wife and I retired. I just retired the end of December.

Combined, we live off of about $8,000 a month. And where does that come from? Her retirement from government and my retirement from Social Security. So between the pension and Social Security, you guys aren't even touching retirement accounts. Oh, no. What's the total of your nest egg? Two, three.

With our house, because our house is paid for, basically. What's the house worth? Six. It was worth eight at the high peak. So, $600,000? What do you have in retirement accounts? Probably close to $400,000. Okay. But it sounds like from the pension and social security, you guys are covered. So, that $400,000 can continue to grow yeah yeah i would i would let it run i just don't want to lose it well i mean you'll have required minimum distributions on those eventually if the on the traditional side yeah so that's the only thing you'll have to worry about um but you're not going to lose it it's not going to disappear into the abyss

worst case do you have any kids it'll be passed down to? Yes. Okay. Well, that's a great blessing and legacy for them. Is it a good thing to put set up a trust and get everything put into a trust at this point in time? If you'd like to, if there's a very specific way you want this

money distributed with terms and conditions and some strings attached, then it's a wise thing to look into. Yeah, yeah. Plus I have insurance, you know, my life insurance. Do you have a will in place? We have a living will right now, but it's fairly old. We need to do something and update it, I'm sure. I'd get all of that in order and I would sleep well at night and get off the YouTube channels, Brent. You're doing great. You guys have a great retirement income even without touching those accounts, but I'd just let it ride. And there's some great tax strategies you can use with the Roth versus traditional side. So I'd connect with a SmartVestor Pro if you want to figure out how to

best utilize that money down the line. All right, let's take a quick one here from Anne. Anne, we're right up against the clock. Get to the question. How can we help today? Okay. So I'm close to 60, my husband and I. We have zero debt. We own our home free and clear. I still work. We both still work. What do we do with our money? So the income you have coming in, or do you have savings? We have savings. I currently contribute 30% of my, uh, pay into my retirement account, my 401. Awesome. And my husband puts money in. We have about 20 in just our regular savings account. Um, and, um, you know, our living expenses are practically nothing. So I probably have about 3000 disposable a month. Great. Well, there's only three things

you can do with money at the end of the day. Give it, save it, and spend it. And I would suggest you do all three. And so find something you're passionate about. Maybe it's your local community, local church. Maybe it's a global mission, an organization that's doing great work, and give there. And then find some spending goals. Do you guys do fun things? Do you like to travel? Do you have any hobbies? You know, we haven't done much of that. We say we're going to, but we never do it. I know you're tight, man. You guys have worked so hard your whole life, penny pinching, and it's hard to let go and enjoy some of it.

Anne, where do you want to go? I want to go to Canada. There we go. Where in Canada? I don't really know. I'm thinking Quebec. I would like to go and see Canada. We just booked Canada.

Fantastic. You're out in Seattle, Larry. Why don't you go up to Vancouver and then make your way across the lovely country and end up in Quebec. Very French, very fun. But, I mean, start to map this thing out. Let's go. You got some money. Start to dream with your husband and go, what's all the things we haven't done yet?

Might I suggest someplace with less rain and warmer temp? There we go. In Seattle. And then find some hobbies. If there's something you've always wanted to do or something you used to love to do that you haven't had time to do. What's a hobby you want to do? And I keep saying that I want to do that when I retire, but I'm still working. And I'm saving that for the retirement years where I can give full 100% of my time to a cause.

Well, you can do that part-time right now. Yeah. I can. You've got vacation time, right? I do. When do you guys think you'll retire? I want to work until I'm 70. I enjoy what I do. You're talking to the right guy here with Ken Coleman here. That's a great thing to want to do. As long as you take some trips. Yeah, you guys are doing great on the saving side, Anne. And so, I would just look at give and spend side and go, let's have some goals where we force ourselves to spend some money here

and give some there. That will make you feel balanced so you're not just penny pinching until you go, what did we do all this for? Let's live like no one else. That's what this plan's about. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. My thanks to Ken Coleman, all the guys in the booth. We've got Ben. We've got Austin, James, Zach, Andrew. Everyone's in there. And you, America, you're out there listening, and we love you this episode and want to know more about getting started on the Ramsey Baby Steps,

go to ramseysolutions.com and click on the Get Started button. We'll help you figure out the best next step for you based on your specific situation. That's ramseysolutions.com and click Get Started.