The Ramsey Show - App - Should I Stay in School or Not? (Hour 1)

Episode Date: November 19, 2019

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Music Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Thank you for joining us. Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Thank you for jumping in. Carrie starts off this hour in Georgia. Hi,

Carrie. How are you? I'm doing good. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? So my significant other and I have been engaged since June. Your phone is muffled. Can you speak directly into it, please? Yes. Can you hear me better now? Yes, ma'am. Thank you.

Okay. So my significant other and I have been engaged since June. However, we recently got married, and the Justice of the Peace ceremony so that he could get on my insurance plan. And I have been on my debt-free journey by myself for about 18 months, and I am set to be debt-free by March of next year. He and I still don't live together. We're not planning on moving in until after the new year. My question is, do we combine finances and I start tracking on his as well as mine? Your phone is breaking up, honey. You're going to speak directly into it.

I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Should I keep focusing on mine and focus on his after the fact? You're married now, so there's no mine and his. It's ours. Okay. And so we combine everything. We combine incomes.

Okay. We combine assets. We combine liabilities. And we plan a life together of how we are going to win. And so you reset your debt snowballs where he had a debt snowball and you had one. Now you integrate them and you have one. You reset your baby steps and you might have been on a different baby step from him and you have one. And you reset your budget where we have one and we're working together and we're communicating.

Why are you not moving in with your husband until January? The only reason why we got married when we did is so that he would have insurance coverage and not have a break in insurance. I heard that. Why didn't you just move in you got married because he is we live about 96 miles away from each other um and so he is staying there so that he finishes out the year he's a volunteer fireman and so he's made commitments to that fire department where he's going to stay there until the end of the year. And living an hour and a half away, he wouldn't be able to fulfill those commitments. So we had not planned for him to move in until probably February to March of next year anyway.

Okay. All right. Well, I mean, however you guys want to do it, but the thing would be you combine your finances as soon as possible you can whether you move in together or whatever but legally they're now combined under the law and so you know you might as well start working together and it's as if he's on deployment or something with the military for a few more months before he gets to before you get to actually combine your households physically. But, yeah, I would definitely combine everything as soon as possible.

Again, you can do it now or you can combine households physically. I don't care. But all the data that we have shows that couples that work together towards a common goal are the ones that win with money. Couples that try to live separate lives under one roof and call that a marriage do not have a high success rate with money or marriage, for that matter. Amanda's with us in West Virginia. Hey, Amanda, how are you?

Good, and yourself? Better than I deserve. How can I help? I am concerned with a decision I made to transfer to this school that's out of state. I came here with the intent to go under their academic common market, which means I can get their in-state tuition for the major I was pursuing. However, I decided not to pursue that major, and I found a major I would like to pursue. However, I'd be paying their out-of-state. And for this semester alone, it looks like I'm borrowing $30,000 and will need to do that for the next few years.

No, thank you. That's what I'm saying. So there is one school back in my home state that offers that major. I was just debating whether to move out of the school again and go to school in-state. You're not getting anything for the money you're paying. The money you're paying got you nothing except to live in a different state. It didn't get you a better education. It didn't get you more education.

It didn't get you anything. And you're going in debt just to live in a different state because you don't want to go backward on this decision. Now, what I am hearing is this. You change your decision about every 20 minutes, and you've got to stick with a plan, kiddo. I know. So you move back, and you stick with this major, and you graduate. Don't change again. Right. Right. Quit changing horses in the middle of the stream. It's going to cost you your degree and your money yes sir what are you studying uh interactive design for media interactive design for media that's you that's basically

like um user experience so i'd be like, creating graphics and animations for various media outlets and electronic devices. Yeah, okay. Yeah. I might broaden that a little bit to where you could have some digital application with that because the number of jobs that do what you're talking about is just a handful in the entire nation. And so, I mean, like three people in every city do it in television and a few more in major cities and where there are networks and so forth.

But if you get in a digital situation where you can start to build digital interaction websites for companies, you don't have to be in a broadcast scenario. You probably would be more employable and probably make more money. So I'd probably broaden that. Don't study something that's so nuanced that the job market on the other side is very, very limited. If I'm understanding what you're saying, you know, you're developing like lower thirds on a TV show and that sort of thing and stuff.

We do that here. We've got people here that do that. But we're an unusual company in that we do broadcasting. But if you had a web application of that or a digital application of that in some way, probably broaden your income chances as well as your overall job prospects. So, hey, good question. And just whatever you do, just this moving around is what's killing you. That's what I'm observing.

So, yeah, you don't stay out of state just to get a degree and pay, I mean, just to get the same degree you could get it back home and pay four times more for it. There's no logic to that at all, especially when you're going in debt to do it. I mean, if you're paying cash for it, I guess you could have a discussion about it, but you're not. It's just creating a major nightmare for you. The 30-year-old version of you is going to hate the 22-year-old version of you if you stay on this track. So just don't do it. Please don't it hey thanks for the call open phones at 888-825-5225 hold on i'm going to send you a copy of a medicine pickup of anthony o'neill's number one best selling book debt free degree which is the new new goal that you have you need to have a debt free degree goal not just get a degree at any cost goal.

And that's what's killing folks with these student loans right now. Thank you for joining us. Also, folks, you check out the Borrowed Future podcast. It is exploding. Yum. Almost a million people have now downloaded it. The eighth episode of eight episodes has dropped this week, yesterday. And so now you can listen to the whole thing, subscribe all the way through.

You can binge watch, binge listen if you want to all the way through. Borrowed Future, the full expose of the student loan debacle. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Folks, let's cut through the bull. Interest rates are exceptionally low, so you're missing out if you have not called Churchill Mortgage to see if you can save money on your home loan. Lots of other companies are out there claiming great deals, but don't get lured by slick advertisements. No-cost refinance offers do not mean they're free. Churchill Mortgage has a no-bull refinance. This means there are no hidden fees. They will shoot straight with you. Yes, Churchill can offer loans with no closing

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And Christmas will be here before you know it. And that means that the giving season is in full swing. And sometimes the smallest gift or the smallest act of kindness can make a huge impact on someone, a friend, a family, or even a stranger. Generous giving, outrageous generous giving, is really the most fun you'll ever have with your money. Around here we call it the generosity effect, and I just wrote a blog on a wonderful story about the effect of generosity that you can check out on our website and we've been getting stories like that from all over the nation from people uh and we want to hear from you so uh in the meantime we're going to share

some of these stories all throughout the holiday season because this season is all about giving and uh becky is in maryland calling in and has a generous giving story. Tell us what happened Becky. Hi Dave, so it was about this time last year my husband and I we've been married for 15 years we had three kids and we had been struggling with the cycle of debt pretty much that whole time we We'd never really been, you know, taught anything about finances or how to manage anything. We got married really young and we felt like everything we tried to do to get ahead just kind of put us behind. We had no knowledge of, you know, your program or the baby steps or anything like that. So we

had found ourselves in a position where we got a foreclosure notice in the mail. And so we were terrified. We had been trying so hard just to keep our heads above water. And then that happened. So I had put out a post on Facebook just saying, you know, we've really been dealt a hard hand. If anybody could just pray for us, you know, that kind of a thing, keeping it very general because we're not ones to ask for help or put anything out there really really. And all of a sudden, I got a message from one of the leaders in our church, and she said, you know, I read your post. I was just wondering, you know, what's going on? You know, is there anything that we can do to help? And I was just like, you know, going to tell her, yeah, you know, just pray for us.

We're going through a hard time. But I found myself laying out our whole debacle, basically, to this woman. And she responded with, give me an hour or two and let me see what I can do. So an hour or two goes by. She sends me a message. And I broke down in tears at work because she said, I have spoken to the other leaders of our church and we have agreed to pay all of your back due mortgage to get you current.

Whoa. Not a small amount. Yeah. So she, she did that and I was just floored. And then she sent me another message and said, we also would like to pay to put you through our Financial Peace University class that we're having in January. And I was so excited about that because, you know, at the end of the day,

we didn't have a plan. We had no idea, you know, what we were doing. We were just trying on our own, and obviously that hadn't worked up until then. Yeah. And then she messaged me a little later and asked for more lists for all of our kids for christmas because she wanted to provide all of our gifts for christmas unbelievable incredible i love her this is awesome this is very awesome she's a pretty awesome lady that is so cool very cool so how are you guys doing a year

later we're doing great we took the class and it was mind-blowing um and you guys are part of our generosity story too because honestly i had never had anybody break things down so practically and and just this is this that is that this is why you don't want credit cards. This is why debt is bad. This is why, you know, you don't want to fight, go score, all this kind of stuff that we have been, you know, just taught traditionally. You know, you want good credit.

You want this. You want that. And then we took your class, and it just completely changed our mindset about money. And so, you know, we're making progress now. We're on baby step two and just kind of, it's very slow progress, but, you know, we're getting there. And just not seeing the world like we used to.

So we're thankful to you guys and your team as well. Yeah, very cool. Well, we're honored to be part of that story. Oh, my goodness. Wonderful. Yeah, and it won't be long until you're in a place where you will be able to do that for others now. That's our plan.

We would love to do that. We would love to be able to help people, you know, in whatever situations they're in who also don't, you know, don't know what to do, kind of point them on the right path. So it is a generosity effect. Very cool. Very cool. Great story, Becky. Thank you for sharing that. And right around Christmas time, your house is in foreclosure,

and along comes your church and this angelic lady to guide you through a couple of three different things, catching up on the mortgage, getting the kids some Christmas, and getting you into the financial peace class so you're never in this situation again. Wow. very cool. That is a good three-step process right there. That's awesome. Very cool. So if you have a giving story, we're going to share some of these every week between now and Christmas because we just want to keep giving at the forefront of all of our minds. That is the reason for the season. It is not consumerism. It is not materialism. There's nothing wrong with getting or giving gifts. I'm a big gift giver.

I enjoy doing it. But if that's your definition of happiness, you're pretty shallow. So, you know, it's not what it's about. But we're going to talk about what you can really do with your generosity and the effects it has. So if you've got a great generosity story email it to me at dave on air at davramsey.com just put generosity story in the subject line or something like that tell us a little bit about the story in the email dave on air at

davramsey.com we'll make you one of these callers that we feature in order to do this very cool times good stuff good stuff Our question of the day comes from Blinds.com, the number one online retailer of custom window coverings. You get free samples, free shipping, and with the new promos they run every month, you'll save even more. Use the promo code Ramsey to get the best deal possible. Rules and restrictions apply. Today's question comes from Kelly in Iowa. Can you tell me more about a Solo 401k? My husband stays home with our kids, does not usually have an income. This past year, however, he did have a bit of income,

and it did have retirement taken out. We're wanting to open a Solo 401k for him and wondering how much we can put in this. Well, that generally has to do with self-employed. And you can get the details from a SmartVestor Pro, but you can do, there's a lot of different things you can do, a SEP, a solo 401k, or a simple IRA, which is a 401k for a small business. They've got unique differences between the three, but basically there are all three ways that if you have some self-employed income

that you can start a retirement program in addition to traditional Roth IRAs, which I probably would actually start with before I fooled with any of this stuff. I'd just start with let's do a traditional IRA. You can do that up to your earned income with a maximum of six thousand dollars uh you know per person if you're under 50 and so that's that's what you would do i would start there thank you kelly we appreciate you uh emailing us in and giving us our blinds.com question of the day uh Kaylee is with us. Kaylee's in Texas. Hi, Kaylee.

How are you? I'm good. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? Well, it's about to be open enrollment, and I had a question. I know you recommend HSAs, but my HSA options, once the deductible is satisfied, none of them is 0% for my pay after that.

But I do have another option that does hit 0% after the deductible, but it's not an HSA. So I was just wondering what you would recommend. So the HSA, after you meet the deductible, has a copay amount that you're offered. It says once the deductible is satisfied, you pay 10%, and the plan pays 90. Okay, that's a copay. Yeah, you pay 10, they pay 90. Okay. All right.

And what is the premium on that? It would be me and my husband right now so it'd be like 40 a month okay and what's the premium on the other one 36 a month 86 a month uh 36 oh 36 a month so the premium is basically the same and uh whichever one gives you the most coverage is the one i'd go with then okay because if you're paying the same premium and you're getting most coverage is the one I'd go with then. Okay. Because if you're paying the same premium and you're getting more coverage with the other one, you'd go with the other one. In your case, the HSA is not a beneficial situation

for whatever reason. Not usually that way, but it can be. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. If you're going to join this team, we want someone who cares and has a passion about what we do. That's why we trust LinkedIn Jobs. They are the best at matching the right person with the right job. We don't want someone just looking for a 9 to 5. We want thoroughbreds. One of the things that distinguishes a world-class thoroughbred in racing

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Visit linkedin.com slash Ramsey. Terms and conditions apply. Dallas, Texas is on the line. Ryan and Britt are with us to do their debt-free scream. Hey, guys, how are you? Hey, Dave, we're doing great. Awesome to have you. How much have you paid off? We've paid off $132,800.

Way to go, man. And how long did this take you? That took us 32 months. All right, good. And your range of income during that time? Dave, we started off around $100,000 and ended up around $125,000. Cool. What do you two do for a living?

I'm an elementary art school art teacher. And I'm a project manager for a technology company. Phenomenal. Well, way to go, guys. Thank you, sir. How long have you guys been married? About four and a half company. Phenomenal. Well, way to go, guys. Thank you, sir. How long have you guys been married? About four and a half years. Okay.

And what kind of debt was the $133,000? This was our house, Dave. You paid off your house? We did. And you've been married five years? Yes, sir. You are officially weird. Yes.

That is awesomeness. Thank you very much. How old are you two? 27 and 29. Unbelievable. You have a paid-for house, and you're not even 30. That's right. That was the goal.

Do you have any friends that you know that have done that? We don't currently know anyone that's done it. We do have friends, though, Dave. Yes. I know. I know that. I that we don't currently know anyone that's done it we do have friends though dave yes i know i know that i'm just saying i mean it's just so unusual for your age i'm so proud of y'all what in the world tell me the story what got you this fired up yeah so uh dave my journey with your program really started back in high school my parents actually went through financial peace um and even at our church we had actually had a high school. My parents actually went through financial peace. And even at our church, we actually had a high school version of FPU that I did. So really before I even had any money to manage at all, I was introduced to the baby steps. And then my parents

had me applying to every scholarship known to man so that I could get through college without any debt. So I started a little bit ago. Yeah, and then I met Ryan shortly after college, and he pretty much brought you up right away. I'd heard of you, but I didn't really know that much about finances. So right when we got married back in 2015, we took FPU together, and we lived in an apartment at the time but we made it a goal that even though neither of us had any debt going into the marriage we wanted to keep it that way and so we we planned that when we did buy a house we would pay it off early and you know really we we saved up 20% down payment and then 32 months ago is when we bought the house and kicked that plan into gear. Yeah. I mean, two and a half years, you kicked this thing down.

That's just rocks. That is so rocks. And we kept moving the date closer and closer. You know, at first we were trying for seven, cut it in half, and then it just kept coming. It went down to five, and then two years, and then, oh, maybe in the summer, and then, oh, looks like it's going to be pretty close. Yeah. So it really went by quickly. So, Ryan, you're kind of what happens to a financial peace baby.

When we tell people to change their family tree and their teenagers are watching, or their young kids are watching while they get out of debt, while they go through financial peace, then they send you off to school, make you work, get scholarships, you go get scholarships you go to school debt free and of course you look for a woman that thinks the same way right that's right yeah yeah and so it comes up too early in the dating process you're real romantic hey you know about the day rims ago yeah week two of knowing each other i put it in there that That's awesome. Very cool. And so, Brett, did you grow up with a family that did manage money well, so you had this natural inclination, or what's your back story?

Not exactly. So I grew up with a single mom, and so, you know, she was trying to figure things out herself too. So basically I knew don't spend more than you make, but that's pretty much where my knowledge stopped. I was actually kind of afraid of, I was afraid of credit cards only because I was afraid of like all banking. And so I just, just because I was uneducated, but really going through the class that helped me just feel so much more confident. And so now it's actually fun to me. Yeah, Dave, if I could just for a second honor Britt, you know, when we first started,

you know, this process, I was definitely the CFO of our family and tried to do that with as much grace as I possibly could. But, you know, Britt really took the educational side seriously and she really knows her stuff and so she became the one managing our envelope systems our cash and keeping us on track and she has definitely taken over that role from me and so I wouldn't say that I have moved to the other side of the free spirit but Britt definitely embraced that role and really really happy to do it alongside of her yeah so moms and dads if you're out there listening we got a single mom on one side we've got a family that went through financial peace university on the other side and both of them created these two

that turned out i mean this is pretty incredible So both a single mom with her struggles and probably working three jobs just to eat, you know, creates this incredible young woman named Brett. And the way you've lived your life was impacted by your mom. And so we honor her in this. And of course, Ryan, you know, your parents are walking you through the financial peace stuff when you're in your teens because they're going through it, and the way you turn out is this. And what an incredible thing that really both of your parents changed their family tree, and I'm talking to two young people that aren't even 30 years old yet and have a paid-for home in Dallas, Texas.

What's that house worth? Dave, the house is worth about $220,000 220 000 and one more time you're how old 27 and 29 i just love this so have either one of you done the math as to how rich you're going to be just by investing a house payment for the next 35 years to 65 that's like a pretty pretty detailed excel spreadsheet does it have over 10 million dollars on the other end i suspect it does not sure but we haven't scrolled that far down but that's that's certainly a possibility yeah if i put a 200 000 house payment in from 30 to 65 i get i get 10 million dollars this is what your parents have done and what you have done

this is absolutely incredible I'm so proud of y'all who were your biggest cheerleaders? Had to be your parents definitely I would like to say you mentioned the family tree we actually made it a goal of ours to kind of pay off our house

before Ryan's parents finished their mortgage once they heard that they took that as a challenge they ended up beating us by a few kind of pay off our house before Ryan's parents finished their mortgage. Ooh, a little competition. And so once they heard that, they took that as a challenge. They ended up beating us by a few weeks. Oh! Yeah. But that's okay.

And then my mom has since gotten remarried, and they actually, once they heard we were debt-free with our mortgage, they ended up selling a few acres of their land, so now they paid off their mortgage. So all three of us are debt-free with our mortgage, they ended up selling a few acres of their land, so now they paid off their mortgage. So all three of us are debt-free altogether. And within three months of each other, Dave. What a great story. Merry Christmas. That's right.

Wow, what a year. What a year. This is incredible. I'm impressed. So well done, y'all. All right, we got a copy of Chris Hogan's book for you, Everyday Millionaires. You're going to be wanting 20 minutes at this route. That's the next chapter in your story.

It's going to be a short chapter. It's going to get you up to about 10 million soon right after that. So unbelievable. All right. Ryan and Brett, not even 30 years old, $133,000 paid off, a debt-free house worth over $200,000. They did it in 32 months. Only debt they've ever had. And they paid it off fast, making $100,000 to $125,000.

Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Wow. Oh, mic drop, baby. Woo! That is amazing.

The ripple effect up and down the family tree. Then they get in a competition with their parents to see who can pay off your mortgage the fastest. What kind of family does that? An awesome one. Unbelievable. Woo! This is The Dave Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. Thanks for joining us, America. We're glad you're here.

Open phones at 888-825-5225. Kevin is with us in North Carolina. Hi, Kevin. How are you? I'm fine, thanks for talking to me. Sure, what's up? I have a question for you. I'm considering a career change, and I may either change professions altogether and or cut my hours to part-time. And I'm 49, and I have a million dollars in my retirement accounts and about $600,000 in my taxable account. And I'm wondering,

I max out my retirements, my TSP every year. And I'm wondering, in light of my situation kind of being in flux, does it make sense to cut back on my retirement contributions and put that money into my individual taxable account to kind of give me more protection in case I need the money? It doesn't give you more protection, but it gives you access for the next 10 years. Yeah. And so, I mean, you've already got a million in retirement. And so, you know, at 49, and so you'll have $3 million in that account

if you've got it invested well by the time you get to 65 if you add nothing to it. Okay. If that's invested in good growth stock mutual funds, it'll double about every seven years or so. And so, you know, you've got 15 years, 14 years, 64 years old. You'd have around $3 million if you add nothing else to it. Yeah, I probably would go heavy into the non-taxable. And then you've got some investing you can do.

Or if your next career is a business situation where you want to buy into something or you want to start something with some capital, either one, you've got access to it to do that. And so, you know, you've done very, very well. Did you inherit any of this money or did you make it all? Made, I mean, the vast majority of it. My dad died many years ago and he left me a little bit, but 90% of it has been self-generated.

Wow. What'd you do for a living? All the retirement. I'm sorry? What'd you do? all the retirement i'm sorry what'd you do how'd you make it i'm a t just just frugal living and constant investing over the years okay my retirement account and probably 90 of my individual my taxable account all of the retirement account was was self-generated but the about 90 of my uh individual account has been that was my own money so okay frugal living, like you advised. What was your first career? Teaching.

You were a teacher in college or public school or what? No, public school. I did some international teaching, but mostly public school. Wow. And you've just been really frugal and a heavy investor then. Yeah, but I've also lived my life. You know, people kind of accuse me of being a miser, and I donate more to charity than most people probably in the world do.

Not that I'm some kind of hero, but I donate a lot of money to charity every year, and I've lived abroad, I've traveled a lot, so it can be done. Yeah, you just watched what you were doing and didn't have a lot of setbacks and mistakes and you know you're intentional with every one of those dollars well way to go man you're truly an everyday millionaire congratulations yeah i think you're on track there um i think you're got enough in retirement to where you're going to be okay. And because what we're saying is you're probably going to end up, if things just kind of stay on course, between 65 and 70, you'll probably be worth about 10 million, somewhere in there. And if three or four million of that is retirement, then that's going to be okay.

You're not going to be too heavy, and you're going to have had a lot of other opportunities. Because also, I mean, if you start being very careful and, like, started a business or started doing some investing, like in some real estate or something, where you watch it and you know what you're doing and you're 100% cash, no borrowing, you could take that $600 and make it do actually better. And you reach a point that money is more flexible and you can make more with it than you might have in just a standard investment process. So, hey, good question, man.

Thanks for the call. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Dean is in Indiana. Hi, Dean, how are you? I'm all right. It's hard to speak with you. You too. How are you? I'm all right. It's an honor to speak with you. You too. What's up?

Hey, it's looking like that I'm going to be going through a divorce. And I've sat down and talked with an attorney. And basically, my wife is going to be entitled to a half of a half of my pension because it's a 30-year-old pension. But we've only been married just shy of 15 years. It's going to amount to about 15 grand. It would be her half of a half. But it's a municipal pension, so it's going to be structured out,

or I'll have to just make payments. What would be a fair cash offer on a 15-grand structured settlement like that well um the the technical way to calculate it would be to figure out when she would actually receive it when would she begin receiving it well the attorney said you need to go two ways. I'm 49 years old. I can't retire. I mean, I'll have my points in when I'm 54, so I could actually start drawing then, but I don't plan on retiring then. Okay, and that affects when she would get this? I think so. Okay.

Because being municipal pension, they allow no early withdrawals for nothing. Okay. I think every other 401K does, but I've been a municipal employee all these years, and they allow withdrawals for no reason. Right. Well, if you have an investment advisor, they can put it into a financial calculator, and what you would say is you're going to get $15,000 12 years from now, or whatever the number is, right? And you're actually not even going to get $15,000 12 years from now or whatever the number is, right? And you're actually not even going to get it then.

You're going to get payments for the next 15 years beginning 12 years from now or whatever it is. But those factors, and they can put in a discount rate. I'd probably use about a 6% interest rate because that's what most of the pensions grow at. And then that discount rate would tell you what the present value of that lump sum is or what the present value of that future stream of payments is. And that would be the appropriate discounted amount.

I doubt that that is going to be very appealing to her. It's going to be a very low number. Okay. So if I were in your shoes, I probably would offer. I mean, I'm thinking that's going to end up being $3,000. Totally? Yeah. That's the present value of her receiving a stream of payments from a $15,000 portion

beginning 12 years from now, and she'd probably get the payments for 15 or 20 years. So it's not going to amount to squat is what it amounts to. Instead, if I were in your shoes, I would rather have the clean break. I'd probably offer her $5,000, $7,000, which is probably a lot more than that's technically worth. Fifty cents on the dollar would be a nice offer. Okay. Well, I was thinking $10 thinking ten would be real fair.

Yeah, very. I mean, you can actually get someone. I can't do it here on the air because it takes a few minutes to put all those numbers into the calculator and make it spit back out your answer. But I would tell your financial guy to put it in a financial calculator. What payments would she receive over what period of time beginning when and that will tell you what to put in there and the payments beginning at this stage and then they bring back the value as of today in other words if if she had that seven thousand or that three thousand dollars and

invested it today and it and on her own it would create more money than seven thousand dollars for sure would create more money than this pension will create for her because you would invest it it would it would grow between now and 12 years from now or whenever you would retire and then it would create payments from then on out and it would create more money so it's good for her to take it as a lump sum it's good for you if to take it as a lump sum for just from the simplicity of your life and the cleanliness of the clean break in a divorce um and so yeah i would be generous with my offer seven to ten thousand but i think you can make a real strong mathematical case that that is

you put it in the calculator but i'm guessing it's going to be twice what it's worth which is uh what it's going to take because she's not going to believe you it takes someone in the financial world to actually grasp that whole thing and work it out and she's just going to think you're trying to screw her over that's all it is in a divorce it just changes everything everything is all about the emotion then and working it through. So, hey, good question. We appreciate you joining us. I'm sorry you're going through this, brother.

That puts this hour of the Dave Ramsey Show in the books. Our thanks to James Childs, our producer, Madison Browder filling in for the vacationing Kelly Daniel. I am Dave Ramsey, your host, and we'll be back with you before you know it. This is James Childs, producer of The Dave Ramsey Show. Did you know you can now listen to The Dave Ramsey Show on Pandora and Spotify? For all the ways to watch and listen, check out our show page at DaveRamsey.com slash show.