The Ramsey Show - App - Should We Rent or Buy When We Move Back to My Home Town? (Hour 1)

Episode Date: June 11, 2021

Debt, Home Buying, Relationships, Investing Sign Up for a FREE trial of Ramsey+ TODAY: https://bit.ly/3rZTUAx Tools to get you started:  Debt Calculator: https://bit.ly/2Q64HME Insurance Coverage Checkup: https://bit.ly/3sXwUn5 Complete Guide to Budgeting: https://bit.ly/3utmVXi Check out more Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3fHhbVE

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's The Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey personality, best-selling author, is my co-host today. So we will be talking about your life and all of your problems, because he's good at that.

And we'll also talk about your money, because I'm here, and we're glad you're with us. Thanks for hanging out. You're good at that. Well, you are good at helping people with their problems. I'm going to give you that. I'm going to give you that one. You're good at talking about money. I am.

It's worked out for me. I'm hoping it's going to be a career someday. It's working out for you. You hang in there, Dave, and you keep working hard. It's like a hair in a biscuit. All right. Open phones at 888-825-5225. You jump in.

We'll talk about your life and your money. Jana is with us in Orlando. Hey, Jana, what's up? Hi. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. How can we help? I have a real estate and money question.

With my husband's job going mostly remote, we have the opportunity to move back to Kansas City, which is our hometown, from Florida, where we've been for about three years. So moving back towards family. We have a paid-for house here, and we've been without a mortgage for about three and a half years. And so moving back towards family and we have a paid for house here and we've been without a mortgage for about three and a half years. So moving back, we feel like we have options, but we're having a hard time narrowing it down, whether it's going to be lake or buy a few acres or even build is on the list. We can't, we can't quite decide. Um, so we're trying to decide now if we should just buy what's on the market when it's time or give it some time and rent in the meantime, so we can have, um, I don't

know, just experience the process moving to Florida. We, I didn't even see my house before we moved into it. It was a little bit more of a quick thing and it worked out and it was great, but I kind of want to enjoy the process this time but we're we're going back and forth whether that's worth it or not do we take our time and rent and spend that money that we haven't had to spend each month or go ahead and buy and you can never go wrong with the lake but i i agree i agree but they're not as easy to come by yeah but anyway, well, here's the thing. How long have you been gone? We've been gone three years.

Okay, so you know the market still. You know which neighborhood is rich. You kind of know, I don't want to be over there. I do want to be over there, that kind of thing. We know the county that we want to be in. We have it narrowed down to certain areas, certain lakes, certain country areas. And we keep an eye on it all. Well, if you don't find the thing that you want in those areas, then it would be rent and patience until you find the thing you want.

But if you find the thing you want, there's no rule that says you have to not get it. Right? Right. I hear in your voice a very kind usage of the word we. You know this place is where you're from. What's the holdup? My husband is real decisive, and I'm real not. Yes.

There you go. And I think he'd be okay. Yeah, because I'm that way. I can make a decision. If I don't like it, I'll just make another decision. Meanwhile, Sharon's still thinking. Yep. Yep. That's still thinking. Yep, yep. That's kind of how we are.

And I kind of want, I was okay with that on the way here because I was excited to come, and all I wanted was a pool in Florida. Well, if you're going to buy as you move, it needs to go at a slow enough pace that you process it, you, not him, because we already know he you process it, you, not him, because we already know he can process it, but that you process it in a way that it involves enjoyment, pleasure. This is a time of your life. You've earned the right to pay cash for property because you're moving from a paid-for property.

You know the area. This should be a pleasurable, by and large, moving never is completely, but I mean, it's like a root canal, but a pleasurable by and large moving never is completely but i mean it's like a root canal but a pleasurable a pleasurable process for you if you feel rushed jammed pushed hustled frustrated chill just rent yeah but if you found the right thing and you had the appropriate number of hours or days to emotionally process it while you were making an offer then there's no limitation right and we we're still holding out hope that there's going to be that place that we both get excited about whether it's lake or land that we'll go this is it my guess is you're going

to rent and it's going to take a while because you're on a bit of a treasure hunt a little bit yeah so then my question is um what i mean in that kind of a situation most places like to have a year lease and how much would we then i mean we could spend whatever we want i guess on rent but we don't want to waste our money so then how do you determine how much rent you are spending money to buy patients right so how much how much is how much is it worth to you that's what the question you got to ask you maybe you want to negotiate with the landlord up front that says hey if we find another place and we can find you a replacement tenant you'll agree to release us okay something like that okay as a landlord i i happily will release any tenant early

from a lease if I have a replacement. Okay. Because I often can increase the rent when they leave. So I love replacements. Okay. Yeah. And I haven't looked into specific rentals, so maybe I need to explore that a little bit more. That's not going to happen with a corporate rental like the apartment complex that's managed out of Atlanta or some such crap, right? But mom and pop like me that's got a house over here

with a for rent sign from Walmart in the front yard, they'll do all kinds of deals with them as long as it makes sense for them. Right. So I guess we just need to decide what size of a house, because it's going to go anywhere from a four-bedroom for $1,800 a month to a two-bedroom, which would be cramped with our two kids. It's completely. For closer to $1,200.

You have the money. Stop the whining about the money. You've got the money. You're trying to create a process here that, I mean, you're millionaires, okay? I can feel it. I know the numbers. I know the vibe on this. So you're there.

So just enjoy. You're going to blow $15,000, $20,000 for patients to get the right property, and that's what you're going to spend on rent for a year while you just sit there and enjoy the process of finding the right property getting the land bought you may even extend the lease a little bit while you build the house that's right so just just do it at a pace there's no you know one of the things money gives you is margin it gives you wiggle room and you've got the money to have wiggle room without forcing yourself you know and but when you're broke it's always you know you're just pushed in the corner and uh god i hate that feeling because right about the time i do that's when i do something

stupid every time i do something stupid when that happens that's right yeah i have that pressure that i'm jammed up i mean i can't tell you how many times somebody said well the car broke down so i bought a new car you know it's like? Why don't you just fix your freaking car? You know? Well, it broke down. It just broke down all the time. It's like, blah, blah, blah. You know, it's that same thing that's going on.

It's that, but they're, you know, the hassle of fixing a $500 thing on a car when you're broke is a big freaking deal. Well, in our house, we're not broke. And just a couple of days ago, my wife said, hey, we've got to fix a seatbelt. We still have a child seat back there. We've got to fix a seatbelt. And the first words out of my mouth were, is it just time for us to get a new car? That one's been there a while. And she said, I mean, that'd be nice.

And so I started thinking through and talking. I've got to be on the show with Dave. I can't do that. Well, I mean, it's just what you said. It's like, or $300 solves the seatbelt problem. And I mean, it's just how quick it was. Well, clearly we need to throw this thing in the lake and start over. Her question is a really good question.

It is, but that doesn't sound like a money issue to me. No, it's a process issue. It is a heart issue. It's a process issue. He makes decisions real fast, and he's jammed her up before. Horse her in. I know this because I've done it to my wife for 38 years. And if this is going to be the forever house, which doesn't exist,

but if this is going to be it... There's no such thing. There's no forever house. I want to go slow and make sure... It's my dream house until your freaking dream changes. That's right. So shut up. There's no such thing. It's a house. Let's go buy it. This is the Ramsey Show. What are your teens and preteens doing this summer? If they're business-minded or are wanting some extra cash, the Teen Entrepreneur Toolbox is perfect for them.

Best-selling author Anthony O'Neill created this toolbox to walk teens through eight easy, practical steps for starting their own business using our proven plan. Your teens can turn their ideas into a profitable business right from home. Teens love the ready-to-use tools, the interactive app, and of course, the money they earn. And you'll love the parent guide and the conversation starter flashcards that help bring up discussions about money and hard work. Whether it's mowing lawns or selling handmade goods, the Teen Entrepreneur Toolbox will help your teen turn their ideas into a business.

It will also teach them hard work, leadership, responsibility, and self-confidence. Buy the Teen Entrepreneur Toolbox at our online store at DaveRamsey.com or call our Ramsey concierge team at 888-227-3223. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Austin is with us in Fort Myers, Florida. Hey, Austin, how are you? Pretty great. How about you? Better than I deserve, sir. How can we help? So, I recently just got married about a year ago.

Congratulations. Me and my wife are trying to purchase a house, so I'm just trying to get some good advice, um, as well. Okay. What's your question? She also has, she also has some student loan debt and we're trying to figure out if this is a good time to buy a home or pay off her student loan. Pay off the student loan. Okay. So you have the money to pay off the student loan? I have money saved before I got married to her. I mean, I know when we got married, it's all equal as one, but it's money that I had saved before we got married. Correct, but now it's hers.

Okay. It's not I have money, it's we have money now. You're now a we. When you get married, you're French. Oui, oui. Sounds good. Okay, so here's the thing. The old-fashioned marriage vows in the Book of Common Prayer say,

in sickness and health, for richer, for poorer, unto thee all my worldly goods I pledge. You don't hear that in wedding vows much anymore. It's kind of anti-prenuptial uh it's quite the opposite it's uh if we're going to share life we are going to share the money and the problems and the good things because you're going to end up sharing them all anyway you might as well just admit it so uh this is a good time to admit it and it's a good exercise for her to accept that her student loans are paid off that she got before marriage with money that you got before marriage. And that's a very real sign in your relationship spiritually and financially that you have combined your households. And then you build your emergency fund, and then you save up for a good down payment.

Yeah, don't go into a house without an emergency fund, man, because 100% chance something's going to break when you buy it, and you don't want to walk into that house with student loan debt, and suddenly you're swimming upstream trying to fix stuff and make that mortgage payment. Let that house be a blessing, man. And there's something that snaps in the psyche, Dr. John, that when you force yourself to do an action that reveals that there's a new reality.

Yes. It's a winnowing, right? It's a test moment to where you can talk about it all day long. I know this is going to be ours. That's going to be ours. You can hear that here. I know this is ours, but I saved it, right? Yeah.

Okay, well, cool. Pay it off, right? And it's like, it's this shaky hand signing it off. When I really do it now is when it's a real thing. Yeah. And I don't want to hate on anybody. I get that that's weird and hard. He wasn't doing anything wrong.

It's just hard. That's a normal process whether you've been married a year or whether you've been married 10 years. There's people married 10 years still talking like that. Oh. Most of them. 30 years, 40 years with separate checking accounts. You take care of these bills.

I'll take care of these bills. Like roommates. That's exactly where they are, the roommates. They've never fully come together on this deal. But anything where you're changing your life, you're changing a behavior pattern, and then you have to actually do the action. Yes. Not just discuss the theory of the action.

There's something that snaps in the old psyche. You have to step into it. It calls your bluff, and it begins to change you physically and neurologically. It changes you from the inside out. And all of that, Austin, in your situation means that your marriage is already awesome, and it's about to get a little better. Yes. That's what we're saying.

And it's going to be real uncomfortable. For a minute. Right before it gets better. Right. There you go. As you write that check, your hand may shake a little bit, and then six months later, you're going to be going, yeah, but this is the woman I love. You're debt-free.

This is the woman I love. Beautiful. Daniel's in New York City. Hey, Daniel, how are you? Daniel? Hey, hello. Hi, Daniel. Hey, Dave and John.

How are you? Better than we deserve, sir. How can we help? Thank God. So I've been a listener for a couple years already. You know, I listen daily. It really keeps you motivated and moving in the right direction. Thank God. So I've been a listener for a couple of years already. You know, I listen daily, really keeps you motivated and moving in the right direction. Thank you. But yeah, of course. So I set myself up. I think I'm in a good spot. I have some money saved up from the past couple of years

of working. And I wanted to know how what I can do to really be setting myself up for success. OK, are you working? You're in college? How old are you? What's your story? I'm in college. I have about a year left. Okay. What are you studying? Business management. Good for you.

Okay. What's it going to cost to finish? I have a college fund that's taking care of that, and I have some scholarships as well. Great. What's it going to cost to finish? Not sure exactly, but probably another two semesters. You don't know what a semester costs? Maybe like another $25,000 to $50,000.

I think it's $25,000 each semester. Where the crap are you going to school? Yeah, on Mars. Say again? It's a private university. Yeah, I guessed that. Where are you going to school? Yeah, on Mars. Say again? It's a private university. Yeah, I guess that. Where are you going to school? In the city.

Is it a secret? It's a secret. Is it a secret school? What's the name of your school? What? Say it again. It's not such a large school, so I'd rather not say. Okay.

All right. It's a very small, very expensive school in New York City. It's a spy school, Dave. Yes. Okay. Well, it's a secret school. Secret. All right.

So you think you have enough money in the college fund and in scholarships to finish. How much money do you have saved that you're worried about investing? Like $250,000. $250,000? to finish how much money do you have saved that you're worried about investing uh like 250 250 thousand dollars yeah spy school is paying pretty good this is pretty neat i'm way in the wrong job i should have been what in the world are you doing where did you get 250 000 i mean i've been working since like all throughout high school since i'm like 14. Doing what? I worked really hard in high school, and I had like $250. Exactly. $11.

What did you do? I just never. Is it a secret what you did? You were a spy in high school, weren't you? And now you're in spy school, and now you're rich. Dude, I'm so impressed. We're picking on you. These numbers are bizarre.

Way to go. Well, here's the thing. The standard answer here is this, and I'll stick with the standard answer, although these numbers are not standard. Congratulations. You're obviously a young stud. Awesome, Daniel. All kidding aside, you got scholarships. You made a lot of money already.

I never saw $250,000. Good Lord. That's amazing. Good for you. I'm so proud for you. So your first goal is graduate. You are the secret sauce to success. Graduate with no debt.

You think you've got that figured out? You probably do have that figured out. You probably have enough money in your account with your scholarships and your college fund to do that. I really don't care if you invest $250,000 for the next one year. That is not going to change your life. Finishing this school with zero debt and launching yourself with zero debt into the marketplace is going to change your life going finishing this school with zero debt and launching yourself with zero debt into the marketplace is going to change your life and understanding that you are the secret sauce here not the interest on 250 000 for one year

dave would you recommend a 23 year old with that kind of money to launch in and buy a house or would you even recommend this not when he gets out of guy to chill? Get out of school. Because when you graduate from school, you have a high rate of transition. Correct. You often change cities. You obviously start a new job, a real job. And the chances of changing another. He probably ought to keep doing the one he's doing. And it's not unusual to get married within 18 months of that.

Right. So statistically, you don't have to. It's not like a rule. You Right. Within 18 months of that. Right. So statistically, not everybody. You don't have to. It's not like a rule. You're not doing something wrong if you don't. There's some research that says men especially do everything all at once. Right. That one year following school.

They do everything all at once. And that takes some money. And you probably aren't going to end up in the same city you were in. A high statistical average, you're going to end up in her city. Actually. Or is there any data on you take a job right out of college what's the chances you're still in that job five years later yeah very low okay that's what i would think these days in the old days it was but these days the average person has 17 jobs

in their working lifetime okay so you got the turnover but dude you're you've done so well daniel you're gonna be all right i think you're gonna struggle through with your quarter million dollars yeah we're gonna figure out. And if y'all need any extra spies, Daniel, you know a guy. You always wanted to be a spy. I always wanted to be a spy. When it pays like that. I'm telling you. Bond. In high school, man.

I had no idea James Bond was so loaded. He drank well, but man. I didn't know it was a good high school. He always had a good car, but we thought it was a government car. I thought I was killing it making 20 bucks a lawn in high school. Daniel just embarrassed me, man. Well, he said $250. I didn't know what he meant.

That's incredible. Way to go, Daniel. Good for you, Daniel. We're having some fun, buddy, but my God. Only because I'm jealous. Yeah, exactly. And we're just freaked out. But, yeah, you did really good, man.

So, graduate, graduate, graduate, graduate, graduate debt-free, then become an investor, then start your life. Don't get in too big a hurry. You're not missing out on compound interest by being out of the market for one year, making sure you graduate. Graduate, graduate, graduate debt-free. You are the secret sauce. You are the best investment

you can make. This is The Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage, Chris and Caitlin are with us. Hey, guys, how are you? Hey, how are you? Welcome, welcome. Good to have you guys. Where do you live? San Antonio, Texas. Good.

And you're here to do a debt-free scream. How much did you pay off? We paid off $230,000. Hee-hee! And how long did this take? We started February of 2015, and then we made our last payment on Christmas Day of this year. So six years? Roughly.

Just shy of six years. Just shy of six years. All right. Very good. And your range of income during that time? We started at $38,000, and then we ended at $150,000. Okay. Cool.

So with that length of time and that large an amount, was that student loans, or did you pay off your mortgage? Oh, gosh. It was majority student loans. We borrowed a lot. Yes. We actually looked at the student loans as it's like a giant credit card where we were just living off of it, maxing out our loans and what referred to the reaping my fruit before we even planted the seeds. What's your degree's in? My degree is in nuclear medicine. But currently I work for a tech company.

Okay. And I am a physical therapist assistant. Very cool. Okay. Two great career fields, but boy, did you pay dearly for them, huh? Yes, we did. Yeah. So what's your household income now?

$50,000? $150,000? $150,000. Between the two of you. Yes, sir. And probably on the way up, right? Oh, yes. How old are you two?

I'm 33. And I will be 38 later this year. All right. And $230,000 cleared off in six years. So tell us the story. What happened? It all started back in 2015. My boss at the time, shout chad keck hey um he gifted all of his employees a the financial peace book and i read it and i thought

wow there's a plan for this it makes so much sense because we were at a point where we borrowed so much we couldn't actually borrow anymore chris was in school. I had just gotten my adult job and I read the book and was like, oh, this gives me every step, how to save, how to start paying my student loans. It gave us a way out. And so after reading the book, I brought it to Chris. I was like, Chris, I think this is it. You've got to read this. Please read this. I've never had you asked you to read a book before, but please read this book, Anna. Well, yeah, I read it and immediately came to her and was like, yeah, that makes sense. Let's do this.

And she said, okay, one of the first things I want to do is I want to cut the cable off. I'm like, you want to do what? And she's like, yeah. What did I just sign up for? Exactly. But I won't do that. And then she wanted to move down an apartment.

We had a two-bedroom, really large apartment. And she's like, I also want to move down. I'm like, wait, what? So I had to go back and reread your book. I was like, I missed something apparently along the way. When someone with a degree in nuclear medicine says this is how it's going to be, you just go, yeah, that's cool. I'm telling you. But then once I read your book and I caught that part of the gazelle intensity,

and one of the first things I looked at was the fact that I had this brand, this F-150 I've wanted since high school. And we were, yeah, we had what you referred to as the log jam. I'm like, how are we going to break this up? Because we had $40 a month, $40 left over at the end of the month. I'm like, how are we going to break this up? Because we had $40 a month. $40 left over at the end of the month. I'm like, how are we going to do this? I looked at my shiny truck and said, I'm going to go sell that. My wife was like,

well, I didn't want to tell you to do that, but I'm so glad you want to do that. I was like, I can't force you to do that, but man, I'm so glad you decided on your own. I took your house and came home. But you're a real man now that you decided that. I sold that truck and I got a little $3,000 Prius, and then signed up for a pizza delivering company.

Wow. And I started delivering pizzas to pay cash for my college for the rest of the way. Wow. What did you make a month delivering pizzas? Oh, man. I was pulling at least like $100 a night every single time doing that, especially whenever the Spurs were in the playoffs. How many nights a month?

I was doing that five days a week during that time. So you're making like $2,000, $3,000 a month. Just off of that, but that was all going to make sure that we don't take any more student loans. I got that. But I mean, still, that's a lot of pizza money. Yes, sir. Very well done. But I want to note that because when you made this decision, you started working really hard,

and your hard work was to keep you from not digging anymore. You weren't even going. You weren't getting ahead at this point. You worked this hard just to stay level. And finish school. Yeah. Between that and the fact that I was in school with this need for gazelle intensity at the time, it was the equivalent of if the cheetah got a head start,

and I'm just rearing back behind the gate waiting to catch up and then as soon as I finished school I was working seven days a week three different jobs wow good for you man wow and then six years later you're done six years later that's a long time yes sir and Caitlin you know when a Texas guy sells his truck for Prius that's he's all in he's all in god that, let me tell you. He's all in. God, that was a hard one, yeah. Even you're like, I don't know, honey. I was so proud of him, though, because that truck got nine miles to the gallon. I was like, we can't even afford the gas.

Man, that's impressive. Well, when you're willing to live like no one else so that later you can live like no one else, it works. Yes, sir. It works. And now you're free. You're 30 years old and some change, and you've got no debt at all, and you make $100.50 on your way to $200.50. And, you know, oh, my gosh. Your future is multimillionaires.

Yes, sir. It's right there. I can see it. I mean, I see the math. I've watched it for 30 years. You're just going to do it. I'm so proud of you all. Thank you very much. It's amazing. I mean, I see the math. I've watched it for 30 years. You're just going to do it. I'm so proud of y'all. Thank you very much.

It's amazing. I mean, your hard work, your sacrifice. Okay, we talked about several things you did on the journey. Is there anything you want to add when I say, when people ask how did you do this, what do you tell them? Definitely consistency and creating a budget. I know a lot of people say, you know, doing the budget was the thing. But we thought we were on a budget until we actually did a budget together because I was the one that mainly took care of the finances.

And when I got him involved, we were like, oh, we're missing some things. We're not covering everything. But once we got a budget, we realized what we could afford to keep us out of debt, and it kept us on the same page and helped us communicate more. It was just the whole journey was the best marriage counseling we've ever done since we never did it. So I'm glad we went through this. So we're always on the same page and have the same goals now.

I think for me the key is to his belief, whether you're paying off debt, you're trying to lose weight, or try to quit smoking, if you don't believe that what you're doing is not working, if you don't believe that what you're doing is is not working if you don't believe the process is working or if you don't believe that the other side of all of this is worth it then you're not going to pursue it as much without struggling there was times where i was metaphorically crawling on my hands and knees because i was physically tired and emotionally exhausted from working so much but it's knowing that this was a light at the end of the tunnel, I kept pushing.

Wow. Very, very, you're right. Very impressive. I mean, people who, if you want to sacrifice or embrace pain with no potential outcome, that's just mental illness. I mean, there has to be a reason to do this. There has to be a light at the end of the tunnel. It's not an oncoming thing.

There has to be a little bit in there. Yeah. It's just strange, man. So you guys know that's very, very, very well done. Very well done. What was the hardest part for you? It was literally the day-by-day and knowing it would take us so long. When we started, we knew it would be at least five years.

And, of course, all the different roadblocks that came, you with medical bills uh global pandemic oh there's that yeah just a little bit and then not to mention texas had a nice little snowpocalypse that happened oh yeah that helped oh yeah yeah we had that too um definitely day by day just uh being each other's cheerleader and getting through um one of our biggest goals is we want to get a house. Yeah. Since we're in such a small apartment. And we knew if we don't do this, it's not even a possibility. Yeah. It's not even going to happen. Well, now you can. For sure. We have more options now. Well done. I'm so proud of you guys. This is so cool.

Thank you so much. They're amazing. Yeah. And your marriage, come what may, come the house buying, come kids, come in-law challenges. You have a six year chain that y'all have built that nothing's going to come your way that you can't figure out and sit down at a table and work together because that same skill you learned budgeting is how you're going to sit down and approach hard conversations and challenges and job layoffs and job

successes and hey, we got to move somewhere else. Whatever that's going to come your way. Built into their brains now. That's right. It's who you guys are. I'm so proud of you, man. Chris and Caitlin, San Antonio, $230,000 paid off in six years, making $33,000 to $150,000. They did it. Hard work. Count it down.

Let's hear a debt-free scream. All right, everybody. You might want to turn your volume down a little bit. All right. Ready? Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Yeah!

Woo-hoo! Wow! Unbelievable. This is The Ramsey Show. Thank you. Dr. John Deloney-Ramsey, personality, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Angela is with us in Idaho Falls, Idaho. Hi, Angela. How can we help?

Hi. I have sort of a financial relationship question. I'm sorry. You're going to speak directly into your phone. It was cutting out on you. I have a financial and relationship problem. I'm hoping you guys can help me solve it. We'll try.

Okay. So here's a bit of a backstory um i was married for almost 20 years uh we've been divorced about two years um i moved out about eight months ago during the time when we were divorced but living together. We were trying to work things out, but it didn't work out. We have financial issues with infidelity that way and relationship infidelity. We have decided we want to try to work it out. Where I'm currently staying, though, my lease is up, and I can't afford rent around here on my own. And so my ex has offered to let me move back in from half of what I'd be paying at rent anywhere else. And is that okay to do while we're trying to work things out, or should we stay separated while we're still trying to work things out?

What are you still trying to figure out after 20 years of divorce, living together after divorce, and then an eight-month breakup? What is there left to discuss? Well, we have trust issues with each other. Yeah, clearly. So what's going to come to the surface here when you move back into his house and he is able to lord

over you the fact that you're paying less less rent and you can't leave how is that going to solve a trust issue well see me moving out of this kind of proven to him that you can't cross that boundary and there's no consequences yeah see, see, you're playing Russian roulette. I know this is hard. It sounds like your relationship's over and either he likes having you around when it's convenient and you are still hanging on to this myth,

this fantasy that it's one day gonna, he's gonna bloom and blossom and grow and he's gonna be the guy you've always wanted to be. And after 20 years and a divorce and eight months of giving it another go, it sounds like it's over. Yeah, well, part of it

for the financial consideration, you had to deal with it directly last. And so, I wasn't accountable for that. It's just, it's going to be one thing after another after another. It has been. It's so hard.

I know. I don't want to minimize it. It has been one thing after another after another after another. I'm hearing somebody that doesn't understand their innate value and worth. Maybe. I get told that by a few people. You are worth not being lied to and cheated on again and again you're worth not moving into a house where someone's going to say hey by the way

i i got you because i'm charging you half rent you're worth more than someone else's table scraps and you've locked yourself into if i don't do't do this, I can't live here, and then I can't do it. Man, there is a big, wide-open country, lots of places you can go where people are going to treat you with the value that you're worth. And I know that's so hard to hear. Yeah, I guess it's more maybe me just afraid of the change, I guess, because in this eight months where we have been apart, I do come over almost every day. It's a bit complicated. My brother lives with him.

So I come and I see my brother and everything. So you're not really divorced? No. You've never really ended the relationship. Your relationship has continued. Yeah. And it's strung on and dot, dot, dot. And it went from the main road to the gravel road, back to the main road.

Yeah, it's just a mess. Yeah. And if you have a scab and you keep picking it and you keep bumping it and you keep hitting it. Angela, how old are you? 39. Okay. Do you have any children? I have one adult child.

And how old is your adult child? 22. Boy or girl? Boy. Okay. If he called you up and told you this story about him and his girlfriend, what would you tell him? I would tell him to break it off, but it's easier said than done.

Why do you value him more than yourself? Not your son, your ex yeah um i kind of feel responsible i guess for him and his relapsing because that's so much we're having before that is so much before like i know i brought on issues i no i mean that's just that's just bull crap. There's no possibility. How in the crud can you come up with the idea that this guy cheating on you, you're responsible for it? Or him getting back into the drugs is your fault. That's so whacked.

It's not. If your son told you that about his girlfriend after she's cheating and sleeping all over town, and he still wants to hang on, and he said, but it's my fault she sleeps around, you would smack him. Wake up, boy. all over town and he still wants to hang on and he said but it's my fault she sleeps around you would smack him wake up boy that's what you'd tell him wouldn't you yes because he because you know your son has value well we know you have value and this is just cray cray girl you need to get away that's uncle dave talking I have no psychological degrees. Dr. John's got two of them.

I'm telling you this. I've got a problem with your brother. Yeah. Your brother doesn't need to be buddying up with a guy who's disrespected his sisters over and over and over again for two decades the way he has. If your brother had some courage, he would step out and y'all could get an apartment together

and figure this out while you you got your feet underneath you? But he's not that guy. He does help me. Yeah, actually, my brother does give me money. Your brother stands there while you walk back into this toxic relationship. I'm not talking about money. Look, you called and asked us what to do. Here's what we're telling you to do.

Get out. Yeah. Get away. Don't have any more contact with this guy at all. He's your ex. Treat him like it. Move on, kiddo. Am I missing something?

Yes. The other piece is treat yourself like you treat the people in your life that you care about. Treat yourself at least as good as your ex. How about that? At least show yourself and do the work you've got to do to get that kind of dignity. When someone is mistreating you and you continually go back to them,

back to them, back to them, back to them over and over and over again and they continue a pattern of misbehavior, it is because you don't have enough self-respect to walk away from crap. And we're trying to say, you are worth it. You need to walk away.

And you need to have zero contact with this guy if your brother wants to talk to you it's going to have to be somewhere else where this guy's not around and not on this property you don't need to be on that property ever again and you don't need to talk to this guy ever again ever period you owe him nothing this is over this is so toxic, girl. You need to get plugged into a good church. You probably need to move to a different city and start fresh. Make no mistake.

You've been married to somebody for 20 years. At that point, they're a leg and an arm. It's a part of you. This is going to hurt. Once you finally acknowledge this thing's over and you start the grieving process two decades, this is over, over, it will hurt and hurt and hurt. And that doesn't mean it's wrong. That actually means

you're doing the hard work of cutting that infection out and now you're going to be on the road to healing. But you've got to be done with it. You've got to be done. Like Dave said, don't go back. It's over. You're worth more than this. Dr. John Deloney just called your ex an infection.

Yep. Yeah. And your brother's not helping. He's certainly not helping. It's time to go get surgery. Connect yourself with somebody who will see your value. And I know it's hard. That mirror gets dusty and dirty sometimes.

It's hard to see it. But, man, I just hate hearing that in my heart, man. Yeah, you need to get plugged into a great church. I really think, Uncle Dave's thinking you need to move to a different city and get a start. Because I think you're going to have to have the physical distance to have the courage to stay away. Yeah. And have the discipline to stay away. Because your healing is only going to begin to the extent you stay away, kiddo.

You're carrying in your heart his infidelity, his drug abuse, his fill in the blank, his money issues. Man. It's a mess. You're worth more than that, baby. It's a mess. It's a mess. It's a mess. You don't have to be mean to him.

No. You just don't have to be to him. You're already divorced. It's over. Yeah. You don't have to be. You're not required anymore. Your services are no longer needed.

Wow. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. Hey guys, this is Kelly, associate producer for The Ramsey Show. Did you know that over 16 million people listen to The Ramsey Show every week? And a lot of those people listen on one of our 600 plus radio stations across the country. To find a station near you, head to DaveRamsey.com slash show.