The Ramsey Show - App - Teaching Kids How To Handle Money (Hour 3)

Episode Date: March 29, 2024

Девочка-пай Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Rachel Cruz is Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author. My daughter is my co-host today. The phone number here is 888-825-5225. Kennedy is with us in Indianapolis to start off this particular hour. Hi, Kennedy, how are you?

Hi, Dave, how are you? Better than we deserve. What's up? Hey, so I was calling because I have a son. He's four and a half. And his dad and I are no longer together, but I'm in a great marriage now. And we are actually on baby step two. We're working with Deb. And my son's dad, he's not very good with money.

You know, we built a house together. I wasn't on it, obviously. But we built a house together, and he picked out everything that was super expensive. He went and he bought a brand new Jeep when he had kind of a beater. He lives to like impress people and he's not a bad dad. We're on good terms, but he's just really bad with money. And I'm trying to work with my son now on chores and saving money and making money. And I'm worried that his dad is going to show him habits, like going out to eat all the time and buying every single thing. And it's just kind of going to reverse what I do here at home. Can you help with that?

Yeah, I mean, this can be a tough one. The good news is, though, Kennedy, I mean, your son's five, which is great, right? I mean, they're young and, yes, impressionable. But you can start doing things with him that's not going to completely unravel just because he sees his dad. And I think parents, and I have to even realize this even with my kids, so much of what they learn is what they're watching. And so more is caught than taught. And you only have the power to control what goes on in your house. You don't have the power to control what's going to be going on in your husband's house.

And so I think the older he gets, the more conversations you guys can have around money. But right now, where you're at, the fact that he's five, I think instilling these small habits. And again, Kennedy, we have a five-year-old at home. We do this stuff. I teach it every day.

And we still probably aren't as intentional as we should be with our kids, right? So there's a lot of grace in this. It's OK. They're still young. But I think, you know, slowly but surely that consistency over time of what he's going to see from you, that's what you can control. And so that's what I would focus my energy on. And again, I'm sure as he gets older, there's going to be more questions. And I think you have those conversations with respect for his dad and still honoring him but also telling the truth of hey here's what common sense looks like when it comes to money here's how to here are habits to have to set you up to win right because i think it was meg meeker that said we don't raise kids just to be good kids we raise them to be good adults and so i love meg meeker yes kind of having that long-term mindset is helpful too.

But now Meg would tell you first and foremost, never trash his dad to him. Absolutely not. Under any circumstances. That's never ever going to happen. But then sometimes the way I can find my answer on some of these things is if I take it to an extreme, it tells me how to handle it.

Let's take it. Let's take a different thing instead of money. Let's just make up something kind of weird or wild to see how we would handle that. Let's say his dad drops the F-bomb every other word. He does, actually. Oh, who knew? And we don't do that at our house. No, we don't.

Okay, so how do we handle that? Well, we don't trash dad, and we can't control what dad does with his mouth over at the other place, but we can only control it when you're with me. And in this house, we don't speak that way. We have more class than that. We're not trash, okay? You know, we have a sense of decor decorum we have a sense of nobility in our home and we don't we don't speak using those types of words uh they're called vulgar we don't

teach a four-year-old that but i mean this is what's going through your mind right and so you go well i can't control that but all i can control is what we do here and and so your interaction with him is we don't do that when you're here. Okay. And we don't do that here. And so we don't, when we're here, we work and we do our chores. When we're here, we're generous with our money. When we're here, we save our money. When we're here, we make wise purchase decisions with our money as coached by our mom.

And then that's all you can do. Now, what will happen at the end of the story is this, okay? Common sense and love and proper truth does win out in these things, but it takes time. So when he's 26 and he did something stupid with money, he's going to know what stupid looks like because it was described to him by you. And so he's going to go,

gosh, I really can't model my life after my dad. My mom's plot process works. I need to gravitate back to that. And I'm going to probably go to my mom. Yeah, and if I need financial advice, I don't go to my dad who's broke. I'm going to go to my mom who taught me this stuff the whole time growing up and but that he'll go through the phase like all kids do where first year you you know somewhere around 14 years old my mama is stupid gland kicks in right and then it takes until about 30 or 25

or whatever for it to grow back right before and then suddenly at some point in their 20s or whatever you're a genius again and you're going to go through that regardless of whether you're together or whether you're apart so uh uh you know that's going to happen here it's not going to be a perfect path and there's not anything you can do to protect him from uh bad money habits or vulgar mouths when they exist with your ex. Because the truth is, too, Kennedy, you could have been in a marriage, raising him and doing everything possible to teach him to be wise with money, and then at the end of the day, when they go off on their own,

suddenly they're adults that have to make their own decisions, too. And we're getting even that second generation of Ramseyites, the kids that grew up listening to Dave on the show. Make very sure you talk about what you and your current husband are doing to the four-year-old in age-appropriate ways so they see the model. And you coach him on his personal behavior so he sees the model, and then it'll work out. It's going to be okay.

But there's no ironclad protection when you've got, you know, when he's going to get exposed to the virus on the other side. Okay. It's just like the mouth thing. It's the same thing. And so you just got a bad model over there. And that's, you know, but you can't fix your ex-husband. That's why he's your ex.

And you can't control him. That's why he's your ex. And you can't control him. That's why he's your ex. But even with parents, too, what I was saying earlier was, you know, even if you do in about any area of parenting, right? There's no guarantee. Yeah, right. All you can do is give it your best shot. That's right.

So that's what I would say, too, Kennedy, is like, give yourself some grace. Do what you can in your household. And then at the end of the day, launching them into the world, it's like, okay. If you model it more as caught than taught and you teach it, you've do what you can in your household and then at the end of the day launching them into the world it's like okay if you model it more is caught than taught and you teach it you've done all you can do that's your best shot and it works out more times than not so that's why we do it that's why we do it hang on we're going to send you a copy of smart money smart kids that rachel and i did together teaching your children how to be smart with money so that when they grow up they have a brain.

And what's hard in those situations is like the Disney dad thing, too. When they go to mom or dad's house, that's the spender. And it's like, oh, we're going to have all this fun. And to a kid, it's like, oh, this is way more fun. And that's a hard pill to swallow, too, when you're the parent. I'm the only grown up in this equation. I know. You're doing great, Kennedy.

It's going to work out. Hang on. Austin's going to pick up. We'll send you a copy of Smart Money, Smart Kids. It was the first number one bestseller Rachel had and the only book I've ever done with her

that was a number one because it's the only book we ever did together. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, you guys. Health insurance costs are only moving one way and that way isn't down.

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No, maybe I'm the YouTuber. You're the watcher on YouTube. I'm just a YouTuber now, Rachel. That's kind of like Deloney. I'm down to that now. Open phones here here 888-825-5225 jonathan's in washington dc hey jonathan how are you hi sir thank you so much for taking my call rachel it's a pleasure to speak with you thank you jonathan how can we help yeah um so i'm in a bit of a predicament. In January, I moved my family up from central Virginia to the southern Maryland outside of D.C. for a fantastic job that God just kind of seemed to have fallen to my laps.

And then two weeks ago, I was laid off. Oh, nice. That sucks. We went from, yes, so we have now gone from making more money than I thought I would make in my life to literally only getting the disability I claimed from the Air Force. And so we are on baby step two, trying to work down our debt. As soon as I lost my job, we started contacting all our creditors and explaining the situation and everything's been great. Everyone's been very accommodating, which was, thank God. Cause I was not expecting that. Um, with the exception of today, my wife's credit card company basically said, we're not going to lower your monthly payment

unless you go through a consolidation loan. Um, and so they connected her with an organization called NaviCorp, not familiar with them. Don't know anything about them. You don't need to do that. Okay. Tell them to bite your ankle. Okay. Okay. No. They're not in charge. They're a stupid credit card company. You're in charge.

So what were you making? I was making $88,000 a year. At the dream job that you just got laid off? Yes, sir. Doing what what i am a public relations specialist okay what happened how did they screw up so bad they move a family from out of state only to lay them off that's pretty freaking ridiculous sure um what was told to me is that I was not meeting their expectations for quality of work. Okay. Wow. Ouch.

And I can only vouch for myself so much. You know, I have a degree to go with it and seven and a half years of experience doing public relations for the Air Force. And that's all I know. You know, I have my opinion, but I don't think it's worth that doesn't matter now their opinion counts because they own the place they can do what they want okay so you're looking how long have you been looking literally since the day i got laid off no when was that uh that was on may 3rd okay just a couple weeks ago okay yes sir all right so how's the hunt how's the hunt for me um it's okay you know there have been a couple things that have have kind of drawn out but

one was in dallas texas and they want wouldn't they would want me there day one and i don't know if i can move my family halfway across the country having just moved them upwards. Oh, you can. If you're choosing Dallas over D.C., in about 13 seconds I'll make that decision. And I believe you, and I agree there. I just, neither my wife and I through prayer have felt comfortable with it, and so we're just trying to seek God's will as much as we can there. And then been applying for as many things as I possibly can. Had an interview this morning, but unfortunately it's sort of a different sort of communication,

more of like a dispatcher communicator than a telling people what's going on in the world communicator. But, yeah, if you know anyone who's hiring for a public relations person with 12 years of experience and a college degree. Jonathan in Washington, D.C. is looking. Okay, so. That was a bit selfish. I apologize. That's okay.

It's all good. How much money do you got in the bank? We have about $1 hundred dollars in our credit account in our yeah in our um does your wife work she does not no she um has gone off work to you got a side hustle going yet i am actually i was about to throw on a tie and go out to our local warehouse store and uh apply for an in-person interview. Yep. Yep. Take all you can get right now.

Just get some money coming in for food. Yeah, I was going to say the side hustle. And then, Jonathan, honestly, it's not a long-term thing, but the remote workplace is still booming. People are still doing so much remote. If you can find a company that maybe you're not there long term but at least gets you into a career that you don't have to move your family because you guys aren't comfortable with that right now and then it's kind of settle into something and then and then maybe in a year you look for

something else you know but finding something quickly i think is going to be the key and it may not be your passion it may not be everything that you love it may not be a company you love but you guys got 1600 bucks. And I'm like, you know, what can you plug into very quickly? The side hustle will be that, that bridge. But I mean,

I'm thinking about health insurance. I mean, there's just a lot, there's a lot there. And so you, you want to be able to, to have something fast. And I think because of the urgency,

it may not be a thing that you absolutely are passionate about and love, but it's getting what you need for your family for the time, and then maybe that other opportunity comes, and you have the bandwidth to be able to do that. How old are you? I will be 34 in June. Okay. Thank you for your service, by the way.

Let me give you something to pray over and think about. It would be normal in your situation because you felt like god led you to this and obviously didn't um and so sometimes in my life in my spiritual walk i have confused uh last night's pizza with the holy spirit or he did and he's teaching and there's a lesson for jonathan i mean it could be it could be but it didn't it short term it doesn't look good right so sometimes I thought something was God and it wasn't is all I'm saying. And so what happens with that and getting fired for something you know you're good at, it shakes your confidence if you're a normal human being.

At least it did mine when those kinds of things have happened to me and so um uh i i would just pray about the dallas move as to whether uh ask god for real clear guidance as to whether that's his spirit that's not troubling you or just you're not feeling confident right now and so nothing that looks risky feels okay nothing that has a high rate of change feels okay because you're at a low point emotionally. I'm not saying one way or another. I'm not just declaring that that's God. I don't know what God's will is for you. But I am seeking peace, and I want that peace to come from him and from strength, not from avoiding anything that looks like risk after I just got my lights punched out.

Yeah. So just kind of lean into that and you guys make sure that's what it is. Because with everything that's going on, I liked the sound of the Dallas thing just looking in from the outside. Now, I've met you a whole three minutes ago, so I'm not an expert on Jonathan's life or what's good for you. Don't misunderstand. But out of everything you put in the mix here, that sounded the most fun of anything you brought up.

And obviously, I mean, I like that city for a lot of different reasons, but for opportunity for you and all kinds of things as far as PR goes. D.C., the PR stuff is much darker. It's much more oriented around politics and social issues and those kinds of things rather than doing PR in a business setting or a ministry setting. Not as much of that in D.C. as there is in Dallas. So just something to think about. And no income tax in Texas. So there you go. Yeah, there you go. in D.C. as there is in Dallas. So just something to think about. And no income tax in Texas. So there you go.

Yeah, there you go. Helpful. Yeah. That's fun. Yeah. I could just go on and on, but I'm going to leave it right there. I think Dave. We're going to go into the commercial break on time.

This is The Ramsey Show. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality, is my co-host today. Thank you for joining us, America. Matthew is with us in Jackson, Tennessee. Hi, Matthew. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hey, Mr. Ramsey. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's up? Hey, Mr. Ramsey.

I have a 16-year-old daughter that's just entered the workforce, and I want to make sure I'm giving her the proper financial advice that I was not given growing up. Okay. And she's 16? Yep, she's 16. That's great. What is she doing? She's a hostess for a restaurant, making about $11 an hour. Good for her. That's awesome. And is she doing this to pay for expenses or car insurance? Is there like a big goal for her that she's working for or just to have some spare money? She wanted to do something to get out of the house. And she also wanted a car. And I said, well, you're going to have to pay car insurance, so you're going to need a job.

And she got the job. She's paying her car insurance. And we're starting the baby steps. And she's on baby step three. She had $2,000, had an emergency come up, and she paid for her own money, her car repairs. Wow. Yeah, I'm very proud of her. She's ahead of me on the baby steps. Very proud of her.

That's impressive. What is, what's her plan after high school? We are, we've been talking about that. She's still unsure on what she wants to do for the rest of her life. I said, that's fine, but we need to have some kind of plan to get general education going. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, that's great. Well, I think, you know, Matthew, one of the things about teaching anybody about money is kind of even going just down to the basics that there are three things that you can do with money. You can give it, you can save it, and you can spend

it. And we need to be doing all three all the time. And especially with children in the home, teaching those three basics is really helpful because that's just going to magnify as she gets older and has a career and earns money and starts a family, you know, and life continues on that she needs to know how and what to be generous with and what that looks like, what that feels like, how to delay gratification and have savings and knowing to put some savings away, which she has done a really great job at already. And then to spend some and enjoy it and learn some mistakes in that area, right? Buying things that you realize, man, I shouldn't have bought that. But learning all of that, those three basic principles is a great place to start.

And so that's one place I would just encourage you. And then, you know, even setting her up with a really simple budget, there won't be many line items, but for her to be practicing when that paycheck comes in, put some specifics around it on where it's going to go and what it's going to do and give it a name. So again, it's kind of just taking what we talk about here on this show and I'd say minimizing it some because it's not going to be the dollar amounts of a full-time job. But still those money habits, putting those in place early is huge and they don't have to be complicated, but it's simple things like that. She can start building the wise spending muscle, the generosity muscle, and the saving investing muscle, even though the amounts aren't going to be large.

They don't need to be. It's putting that groove in her brain. You know, we're starting to say this is how life works. And so my job as your dad is to make sure that you develop these muscles so when you get the opportunity later to handle a lot more money, you're going to automatically go to wise spending, good generosity, and good investing and saving. And you're always going to be thinking that way, debt avoidance.

The only other thing I would add to all this from a practical standpoint is I'd go down and make sure there's a checking account opened in her name with your name on it where you have visibility and you look at it with her once a month and teach her how to reconcile that and how to keep a checking account properly operating. We did that with all three of ours, and we did the save, give, spend thing with all three of ours. And when they went to college, they had a set amount per month that was their budget, and they were used to living on what they had, and they were used to managing their own checking account. I did not have drama with all three kids through four years

of college age. None of them called with financial crises in the middle of college because they had the muscles built to carry these different things. And Rachel and I talk about that in the book, Smart Money, Smart Kids. It was Rachel's first number one bestseller. We did it together when she first joined us here at Ramsey after college. And it was her being the daughter part, me being the old man daddy part. But it's teaching kids how to handle money. And it's covered in there on an age-appropriate basis. And, you know, you're doing a really good dad thing here, Matthew.

Way to go. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, and Austin will pick up, Matthew. We'll give you a copy of that book, Smart Money, Smart Kids, because it is a great resource. But I think what you're doing right now, honestly, is great. And then she's going to have natural questions like we did as kids of questions about taxes later down the road and investments and all of that. After you get your first paycheck and you realize they keep a lot of it,

you learn to vote different. It's just good for you. It starts forming politics i don't like socialism i don't like it when i'm the one that's earning you figure that out real quick you don't have to be 80 to figure that out you start 16 years right there i do remember making a um powerpoint presentation asking for more money every month because i was driving home and i remember being like i have no i mean there's like no gas i mean i don't really have much and i think i needed like an extra 50 bucks a month or something and i did a whole presentation was

that in college or high school that was college really because when i came home and i was like i need there's a powerpoint presentation in college yeah we did powerpoint in college yeah i know but i just don't remember this. Yep. It doesn't, if anyone of us three would have done it, it would have been you. Because it works. Yeah. That's funny.

Did it work? Did we give you more money? Yes, you did. And I was like, he is generous. You made the sale. You made the sale. He is generous. It's a marketing presentation.

Look at him there. Yeah, we raised that whole, raised it 50 bucks a month, and your life was changed. That is for a college student. Changes a lot. It was back when you went to college. Back when I was there. It's true. It's true.

Zach's in Houston. Hey, Zach, welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hey, Dave, thanks for taking my call. Sure. Quick question about investing. Okay. my call quick question about investing okay um with interest rates being the way that they are are cds a wise investment option for right now no for short term well for short term but in short term is not an investment short-term savings okay investing is long term and you've got to

outpace inflation and taxes long term you got to be north of 10 most of your life investing and cds aren't north of 10 right even with a uh like a nine month uh cd why do you i mean what do you what what is this money for uh just general money that's set aside uh my brother's been whispering in my ear man cds, man, they're going up. They're the way to go. Way to go for what? To get rich? To get rich?

I think just for short term is what he's looking at, not long term. Yeah, I mean, the interest rates on CDs, high yields. They're not short term unless you have a short term goal for them. Right. So what are you going to use the money for six months, a year, when this CD cashes out? For my brother's intentions, I have no clue. No, you. For mine, for me, it's just another way to bring in money, just another way to get some kind of return.

Okay, it sucks for that. Okay. We call them certificates of depreciation because they don't even keep up with inflation. If inflation is running 9.6 and your CD is paying 6 or 7, you're losing money. You get that, right? Yes, sir. Totally understand. So next time he whispers in your ear, tell him to get a girlfriend.

Oh, my gosh. Oh, my gosh. Okay. But I would say CDs, high yields, money markets, all of that are, it is wonderful when you have money in it for short-term savings because- It is short-term. Yes, that's what I'm saying. It's like for an emergency.

You want an emergency fund. I know, but I'm saying if he's excited about the interest rates today with those accounts, yeah, it is exciting versus what it was four years ago, three years ago. It's not exciting. It's just better. Well, it is when I have short-term savings, and I'm like, dang. You're not making any money. Yeah, but it's better than 1% or 2% than what it was.

It is better, but I mean... That's why he's probably excited, but for short-term savings. It's not a way to build wealth. No, no, no, it's not. It's a way to park money more wisely. But I'm excited about the interest rates today than it was there. Yeah, park money more wisely, but park it for a short term. Like if you're going to buy a house in September

and you want to park it until September, fine. That'll work. Our Scripture of the Day, 1 Corinthians 3, 12, and 13. If anyone builds on the foundation with gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay, or straw, each one's work will become obvious. The day will disclose it because it will be revealed by fire. The fire will test the quality of each one's work.

Alex Honnold said, no matter the risks we take, we always consider the end to be too soon. Even though in life, more than anything else, the quality should be more important than the quantity. JT is with us in Tupelo, Mississippi. Hi, JT. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hey, Mr. Dave. How are you and Miss Rachel? Better than we deserve, sir. How can we help?

Yes. are you and uh miss rachel better than we deserve sir how can we help um yes so my wife and i we are actually in the process of a new chapter in our lives uh several years ago we went in and throughout mexico and brazil doing mission work and spreading the gospel of jesus christ into the streets and we fell in love with helping people. It was something that absolutely changed and shaped our lives in the biggest way possible, and God really put it on our hearts to do this permanently. So upon arriving back to the United States, we set out and pretty much turned a school bus into a home, and so we're going to be taking this bus in and throughout Latin and South America. And, um, our goal or really our mindset is to be doing this very long term, possibly 10 years, even 20. I don't really know. Um, but previously the way we did it was we would just raise money,

quit our jobs, leave, uh, do all these things in the streets and then come back, find our jobs, leave, do all these things in the streets, and then come back, find new jobs, and then repeat the process. But doing it this way, we're not really going to be able to do that. We want to permanently be there. And so my question is, in regards to this, we're looking at somewhere around $40,000 more or less a year. And that's not a lot, a lot, but I think it's more than enough that we will need to do it. And we're trying to figure out which direction to take for the amount of, for the support that's coming in as far as like churches and individuals and businesses that are giving to us to support this mission. How do I do that? Like, is this something I need to do through nonprofit?

Because it's just my wife and I and my one child. So it's not like a big corporation or, you know, nothing big, really. But I don't really know how to do it as far as the taxes and stuff goes. And at the same time, I want the people that are supporting us to have as much benefit as possible as well, you know, in regards to tax write-offs and stuff like that. Well, love your heart, brother. Very cool. Thank you.

You're a good man. And so it is a fairly simple process, but it's going to take a little bit of time and a little bit of expense. You set up a 501c3 nonprofit,profit and uh that non-profit then becomes tax deductible for anyone that donates to it uh you'll have to find you know you'll establish an irs number and that'll be associated given to each of your donors uh that they then contact that take the tax write-off a non-profit does not mean um that uh uh no money's coming in it doesn't mean that not enough money is coming in it is a simple accounting entry that shows that the owner of the business is not taking the money home for x as excess profit it's all it is okay so

my point being this a non-profit has to technically has to physically be profitable or you go home meaning you have to bring in more than you take out like if you need 40,000 and you bring in 30,000 you're a non-, but you're going out of business, right? Right. So nonprofits have to be, from a cash standpoint, actually profitable. So you have to bring in more than goes out. But it's an accounting entry with the IRS that shows that the profits are being used for the benefit of the ministry, which includes feeding you and your wife.

And it's not $400,000 a year of income for the two of you, although that's technically okay. It would be suspicious to your donors. But it's $40,000. And, you know, just as a practical thing, Ramsey Family Foundation, we've got friends that do some of the things that you do, and they are some of the people that we donate to from time to time. And as a donor, from the donor's side, we love seeing that the money's helping people. And so just some simple iPhone videos sent back occasionally and a little bit of a report on the finances showing that, you know, you're living on $40,000 a year, which even in Latin America is certainly not a living high on the hog, right? So we see where the money's going.

We see that the people are being helped, the results of our donation, because we see our donations as investments into those people on the street that you're trying to help, and you're the vehicle by which they get there. That's how a donor thinks. Okay. And if you can keep that donor relationship real clear and have the IRS, and it's a separate bank account, separate from your personal checking, and then you are allowed by the charter of the nonprofit to live out of that,

to pay personal expenses out of that, because this is a ministry. It's a mission. You're missionaries. Okay. And that'll be... So in regards to, like, spending money, let's say, because we're trying to be really realistic as well with, I guess, allowing time for ourselves. So, for example, let's say we went to a local carnival a couple days out of the month or something

to just have like a family day for us to keep things. You're allowed to live a reasonable life out of this. It's not a violation of law or it won't lose your tax status or something like that. Where people get into trouble is more of a PR thing than a legal thing. When some nonprofit starts buying a private jet, that's when people go, huh? You know, that kind of stuff. And going to the carnal is hardly on that thing. But that's more of a PR than a legal.

It's not technically illegal to buy a private jet with a non-profit it's nothing wrong with it uh but but it blows the donor base up and it blows the pr up right so um and we've all read those stories you know so uh in a non-profit settings because people like me we don't want to donate to your private jet we want to donate to those people on the street that you're helping and if you take your family to the carnival in the process we're not going to be angry about that okay i see so in regards to us doing those types of activities that's completely normal and you would move you would move money from the non-profit into your personal account as your personal income missionaries all do that because missionaries all have to eat and have electricity and gas in the

bus right the non-profit and then at the end of the year what do i do as far as taxes go in regards to keeping up with how much i move from that account into ours nothing or nothing you're you're living on donations oh okay i understand double double double check with your tax person and they can help you walk through all of this matter of fact if you hit the tax pros on ramsey solutions.com one of those in your area will probably be able to guide you through forming the non-profit it's really not that difficult it just takes a little bit of time it's not considered income if he takes that shouldn't be i'm sure i mean he's living on donations. So, yeah, but, you know, again, double check that because I'm wrong half the time on this

stuff. So tax stuff I'm horrible at, but I do know the part about the nonprofit because we formed the Ramsey Family Foundation. We've got our own that we use for as a as a methodology for our family's generosity and philanthropy. And so we have a 501c3 that does not take donations from the outside world. We fund it ourselves. And then that's how we handle the distribution of our giving is through that. And your sister Denise is the director of that.

Again, so we kind of got into all of that in detail, even though we're not on the mission field. Now, I don't draw an income from that foundation. I furnish the income to the foundation, so quite the opposite. But that's what you've got to get into and just learn about it. But it's really not really that tough. It's not complete rocket science where you can't get your arms around it. You'll be able to figure it out and do it.

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