The Ramsey Show - App - The Shortest Distance to Wealth Is NOT Through Debt (Hour 2)

Episode Date: June 29, 2020

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🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host.

Thank you for joining us. Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Joining me on the air today on The Dave Ramsey Show, my co-host is Chris Hogan, Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author. Patty is with us in California. Hi, Patty. How can we help?

Hi, Dave and Chris. Thanks so much for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So I am 25 years old, and I just got accepted into an accelerated nursing program that I'm going to start in September. I currently have no debt from my previous bachelor's or any other kind of debt,

and I'm going to have to take out a student loan in order to finance this education, and I just want to figure to take out a student loan in order to finance this education and I just want to figure out the the widest way for me to to pay for school so I don't end up in a big hole at the end of it you're not going to like us okay we teach people to not borrow money. Yeah. You knew that, right? I knew that. I've been listening to your show for quite a while. And my... In the history of your listening, have you ever heard us say ever to anyone to borrow money?

No, I have not. Okay. Probably not changing that today. So how can we figure out a way to help you? Because we can't help you with your question. I can't help you borrow money. Okay. Because I don't think that's wise for you, okay?

I mean, I love the Accelerate Nursing Program. I love what you're talking about doing. I love the field that you're in. But if you were my daughter, I would tell you not to borrow money to do this. I'm going to have to find another way to do this instead of just accepting the cultural norm of going into student loan debt. Because, Patty, you said you had avoided debt even for undergrad. So how did you pay for the undergrad? Yeah, so it was a combination of a college fund that my grandparents and my parents had set up for me and then substantial scholarships that I was offered.

Okay, good. So what does this cost? The cost of the scholarship program? In the fall, yeah. Yeah, so the total cost, including living expenses, is going to be around $47,700. So you have to change cities? Yes, yeah. Are you working in nursing?

Are you working in nursing now? No, I'm not. I am currently working in a service industry. Oh, okay. And so currently working in a service industry. Oh, okay. And so did you get a degree in nursing already, or this is to become a nurse? This is to become a nurse. My first degree was in ecology, so I worked in river assessment for a couple of years, and then decided that I wanted to switch over to nursing. Okay, but you're in a service industry now.

Yes. Yeah. Okay. What do you make? What do you make now? I make $15 an hour. Okay. All right.

And you're living on that? I'm currently living with my parents. I've been home for the last five months. Okay. And what city do you live in? I live in a small town, Manus Lakes, California. How far away is the nursing program? The nursing program is in Iowa.

Oh. Okay, there's that. Whoa. How'd you get the fellowship on the other grades? Yeah, grades. So my plan is obviously to apply for scholarships, and I've already submitted my FAFSA, so I should be getting some kind of financial aid from the federal government, and then the application period for scholarships opens in October.

So I will, of course, be submitting. I thought you started in the fall. I do, yeah. They had an application period open in March, but I wasn't aware that I was accepted into the program. I see, okay. Well, there's lots of places you can apply for a scholarship. They're not the only place.

Okay. I also would start talking to hospital companies like the HCAs of the world. There's a nursing shortage. And talk to them and see if they have programs where they will assist you in your nursing school costs. In return, you promise to work for them maybe when you come out for a number of years or whatever. There are programs like that out there floating around. But would I just jump and go 50 grand in debt without having done anything else just because you got accepted in Iowa and you live in California?

No. No. I might tap the brakes on it. Probably going to have to because you simply don't have the money and you're getting ready to go deeply in debt. And if you don't finish or you don't pass your boards, you're right back to trying to pay off 50 grand with this $15 an hour job again. Okay. So the risks of taking out the loan, you think are greater than the benefit of being able to make significantly more money than I am now. Yes, after having talked to the 32-year-old version of you for 30 years, who's up a freaking creek because they made these choices,

and then they end up getting married, and one lady, I remember, I'll never forget, I was just heartbroken. She got married and had her first child who had all kinds of medical needs, and she wanted to quit and go home and stay with this child that needed its mother at home, and she couldn't do it because she had $100,000 in student loan debt. Because these are the things, when life unfolds, you don't see this stuff coming. No, you really don't, Dave. And I'm going to tell you, I know, you know, Patty, you're sitting there, you're thinking this is a great opportunity and this is the time for you. And it's the doors are opening up and it's not.

It's actually trap doors that are opening up that have swallowed, unfortunately, 44 million Americans around to the tune of 1.7 trillion in student loan debt. And I would forego this for a year until I could save up or, as Dave said, look for scholarships or companies for internships. I'm going to figure out every way possible but not signing these student loan documents. And, Patty, I'm telling you something. I'm talking to the four-year-old version of you. I hope you take this option off the table. I hope you don't just hear us and it rattles around in your head for a little bit and you still pick up that pen because it is a costly pen to sign those student loans. I hope you don't.

I really do. And you can follow that dream, but you have to follow it in a different direction. When you do your dream the wrong way, it ends up being a nightmare. Ooh. And it just, that's what happens. Yeah. And I've just talked to tens of thousands of patties that wish they hadn't done this. And it only works if it all works perfect. And it never works perfect in life.

No, it doesn't. Kind of like when you got the ecology degree. Yeah. It didn't work out. Now, what if, you know, what happens if, dot, dot, dot. And, you know, that's what COVID shutting everything down, underlined for people everywhere, is that their plan that they had sucked. And when you stress test a bad plan, it comes up stupid. And that's what happens.

I hope it doesn't stress test you, but Patty, there's a reason you've never heard us tell anybody to borrow money. It's not just because we're killjoys or dream killers. It's because it's quite the opposite. We want good things for you. We love you. We want you to win. Yeah. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Business leaders now more than ever, we need people with the right skills to support our communities,

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To post a health care or essential service job for free, or if you're in another industry and have hiring needs, visit linkedin.com slash ramsey. linkedin.com slash ramsey. Terms and conditions apply. Ogun, we did not win that last one. What do you mean? She's going to get a student loan. You think so, Dave?

I don't think we won it. Did you think we want it? No. Because, I mean, she started the conversation. She'd already done. The deal's already done in her head. Yeah. And I don't think we turned that car around.

No, you're probably right. And, you know, I hate that. I hate to think that. Because we only have a brief period of time, right, to try to convey it to someone. But as you said said you've been talking to 30 year old patties for 30 years now what what do we do how do we help people to realize because you said it the perfect plan never happens well it just it doesn't once somebody gets her dream and the you know the horse leaves the barn i mean she's going down the interstate

75 miles an hour we had to make her stop get off the exit and the horse leaves the barn, I mean, she's going down the interstate at 75 miles an hour. We had to make her stop, get off the exit, and turn around and go the other way. That's right. And I don't even know if we slowed her down, but I don't think she got off the exit. I don't think she turned around. I don't know. Maybe we gave her something to think about. Maybe.

I don't want to be. The thing is, is the entire culture has lost its mind. And when you adopt the values of a culture that allows and encourages American young people to go very soon to be $2 trillion in debt to get a degree. And some degrees are valid and some are ridiculous. That is a valid degree. It's a valid degree. But what she put on the table was 100% financing for a program all the way across the United States from her family, which is not, that's survivable. You can do that.

Right. But there was no tip of the hat to the way she did the other thing even. There was no. Yeah, she said it very quickly. Her grandparents had a college fund, and she had some scholarships. And a fellowship. Yeah. Which means that she's bright.

She avoided it at some point then and you know what day people do get stupid i remember going to grad school and there is a thing in your mind that says this will guarantee me more money this masters will guarantee and it's almost posed in your brain that you're almost if you get accepted then you're stupid if you don't do it yeah and that's the way it's feeling right now so when we when we stopped and suggested that it felt stupid right that's what i heard yeah no you're absolutely right in the spirit because here's what she's thinking if i can play devil's advocate she's thinking i'm gonna get out i'm gonna make 80 if 47, I'm going to live on 30 something and pay it. Yeah.

Ha. No, you won't. It doesn't work that way. You won't. I'm going to tell you right now. You won't because you've opened the door and you're going to keep adding to it and it's stacking. And then it's the couple.

You talked about the lady that had the sick child that she wanted to stay at home with. I'll take it a step further. It's the young couple that meets that's wanting to get married and then have a baby and then somebody wants to be at home. And you qualified for this debt with this double income, and now you're trying to survive on one. You just dug the hole. You dug the hole. So, Patty, put the shovel down and think long term for you i guess what you hear is really one old guy and one younger dude me i'm the younger one in this duo trying to trying to give you some life

guidance and if you won't listen to the old one lost your credibility if you know i, when you lie on the radio, you lose your credibility. But you're right, Dave. People get going down the road so fast. I guess I want them to hear the pain we've heard sitting across from people. Yeah. I mean, we're just, you know, our whole job is not only put up a speed bump, it's put up a wall. Yeah. It just says you can't go here.

You can't go here. Get Anthony. We should have given her that book, Anthony O'neill's debt-free degree yes i goofed there's another thing i goofed on that call but um you know in a sense what we're doing we're trying to teach you folks the shortest distance between where you are and your best possible life as far as wealth building goes the highest dollars dollars of wealth, the shortest distance, is not through debt. It's proven time and time and time again. It always feels like, and here's the other thing, 100% of the time you talk to wealthy people that started with nothing,

like all the millionaires that we interviewed, 100% of the time they tell you to make a decision that hurts now financially that causes you to prosper later. Don't make a decision that's easy now that hurts you later. And that's always debt. It is. It's easy now to sign up for these payments and I drive off a lot in a shiny new truck that's easy but it hurts you later it sure does it's hard to do what uh you know young man we talked about in the last hour talked to in the last hour he came home from work every day for three years and built his own house with his hands that's hard now but now he's sitting there with a paid for home and you know so if it's easy now and hard

later it's the wrong financial decision correct and that's what that's what it always is too by the way you can anything you want to put through that lens that filter will help you make financial decisions if it's easy now if it's easy money if it's quick money if it's easy now, if it's easy money, if it's quick money, if it's get rich quick, the Bible says he who hastens to be rich is in a hurry to be rich, will not go unpunished. It doesn't say sometimes you get by. It says will not go unpunished. Get rich quick 100% of the time will kick you in the teeth easy payments will always set you up in a mess so what feels like it's smart right now but it's easy right now it's the path of

least resistance is what people do with student loans instead of figuring i'm gonna sweat i'm gonna work i'm gonna get apply to more different colleges, find a cheaper deal, find one within range of my home so I can live at home and get rid of the living expenses. I'm going to get scholarships. I'm going to work my tail end off. Work at night, yes. And I'm going to wait a year. None of this is easy. But when you're 32 versus 25 you look back you'll

go man that was smart that's right it is no you're absolutely right i tell it when i was coaching people i want you to make two-year decisions i want you to make a decision that you'll look back on in two years and you're glad you made it right and that's the stuff that puts you on the path so just for the other young people out there that are listening just hear this hear this yield hear this kind of you know i like that dave throwing up a wall because i'm tired of people climbing it and then falling down into this pit and then helping trying to dig them out they're trying to dig themselves out for 15 years avoid that pit yeah go another direction Go find some nurses that have $50,000, $100,000 in debt and ask them if they think they'd

do it again. Ah. You know, they won't tell you to do it again. No, they will not. No, they will not. I say, I would have done it. I think being a nurse is a great idea, but I would have done it a different way. That's right.

No, you're right. Or anything. Fill in the blank. Nurse, whatever else. You know, put it in there. Attorney, doctor. I mean, just walk down through the list because we've counseled all of them. Yeah.

Hmm. Yeah. So, there's not a proven methodology for convincing someone who's already decided anything. And so, but guys, we just, I mean, it's real simple with us. We're not primitive. We actually have been doing this for decades. This is a very sophisticated organization and a sophisticated train of thought. And these are proven points of data.

They're proven that the shortest distance between where you are right now and where you want to go wealth-wise is of getting out of debt and avoiding debt and building an emergency fund and living on a budget and so forth so with these crazy times right now if you have said never again you don don't want to be at the mercy of anything, including even global crises. Never again. Well, the news cycle puts you in a panic. If you've got a plan and you have savings and you don't have any debt, you're going to be in a different place because this has happened to you and scared you. The new Ramsey Plus program, there's a free trial going on right now.

And you need to check it out. It includes all the Financial Peace University. It includes sinking on every dollar. It includes the new Baby Steps app. Check it all out at DaveRamsey.com. Ramsey Plus, free trial. Folks, I love telling you about well-made, well-thought-out products. Today, I'm talking about Grip6 belts. I don't know about you, but I'm not a fan of traditional belts.

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Grip 6 is determined to help build and modernize American manufacturing. To learn more and get this month's Dave Ramsey special, visit Grip6.com. That's GripIX.com. That's GRIPSIX.com. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Chris Hogan, Ramsey personality, is my co-host this hour and today here on the show. On the debt-free stage in the lobby of Ramsey Solutions, Jeffrey and Caroline are with us. Hey, guys.

How are you? Hey. We're wonderful. How are you? Better than I deserve. Welcome. Good to have you. So where do you guys live?

Chattanooga, Tennessee. Actually, Ottawa, Tennessee. Yeah. Just kind of northeast of it. Right where it is. Good to have you guys. Welcome. Welcome. And how much debt have you guys live? Chattanooga, Tennessee. Actually, Ottawa, Tennessee. Yeah. Just kind of northeast of it. Right where it is. Good to have you guys. Welcome, welcome. And how much debt have you paid off?

So we've paid off $130,000 and $130,450. Good for you. Oh. And how long did this take? That took us right at 30 months. Good. Wow. And your range of income during that time?

We started about $120,000 and we finished up around $160,000. Good for you. Cool. What do you guys do for a living? I am a sales engineer. And I am a fifth-grade teacher. Awesome. Very cool.

Good for you guys. So tell us, what kind of stuff did you pay off? Okay, so I've got a list here. All right. I started off a little bit with, I was a credit card junkie. I loved my points. I had $36,000 in credit cards. So those points paid off.

Yeah, we got a couple free flights out of it. $36,000 in debt. But then we went on trips that we just paid with credit cards. Oh, of course. Yeah. Wow. So then we also had about $66,000 in student loans. Of course.

That was me. Both of us. But we also had $28,000 in student loans. Of course. That was me. Part both of us. But we also had $28,000 in two car notes. Oh, wow. And we can't forget the $1,000 lazy boy. Of course. Yeah, that's lazy. That was needed.

That was my birthday gift to him for his 30th. Oh, there you go. Very nice. You guys were normal. Oh, very. Completely. So how long have you been, how long have you all been married? Seven years.

We just celebrated. Okay. So two and a half years ago, five years and some change into the marriage, something happened. What happened? Well, I'll say it started, I lost a grandmother and I got a very small little inheritance. Maybe it was under $2,000. And I was kind of in control of our finances at that point. And I kind of knew where we were, but Caroline had no clue where we were.

And so we were about ready to start making a family. And basically what happened is Caroline was like, well, why don't we take this little bit of money, add some to it, kind of go do another honeymoon, like a babymoon, and celebrate our last big trip without kids. And so in my embarrassment, I was like, yeah, let's do that. But I knew deep down that was not a good answer. That is not the way to live life. And so we went to Jamaica to an all-inclusive resort and had a blast, but it wasn't the same as our honeymoon because I knew deep down we shouldn't be there.

And so we got home, and I started Googling, how do you get out of debt? Like, how do I do this? And that's when Dave Ramsey pops up. Like, it's everywhere on the Google machine. So I bought your book, Total Money Makeover, read it in probably under two days, and I was just gung-ho on it. And so I cleaned up a little bit of the mess myself, my mess, because I was so ashamed of it. And then a few months into it.

Came clean. I came clean to Caroline, and it was so much easier at that point. It was just so much easier. I mean, our marriage has just been blossomed because we now communicate. And it's just amazing. I read the book in a day and jumped right on board. And I'm super competitive, so once I saw how the program worked i was like yeah let's do this gamification works for you you're like get it yes it was amazing yeah get after it i love that well very cool okay

so caroline before he quote unquote came clean how much debt did you think you guys had um i knew we had my debt from college so probably about 60 grand and then i knew he had put a little bit on the credit card but i did not know it was so astronomical and you didn't know there's a car payment yes i did and you didn't know you financed the lazy boy yes guilty as charged yeah okay so you knew you knew most of it i did the credit card was the credit card balance was the shocker then we um had separate accounts and so i think that was a major problem once we kind of got um financially on board as a team things were there was a lot more clarity there. Well, that makes trust increase, but also communication.

Definitely. And it increases the speed by which you do everything. Absolutely. Very well done. Jeffrey, tell me this. What did you all, what's the biggest thing you sacrificed to get out of debt? Oh, man. We are beach people, and we haven't been to the beach

since that baby moon and we've already booked our trip next summer saying no to people yes a big one um you know we with any budget food is always the eating out it's one of the biggest ones you can cut back on and so there was a lot of cooking at home and things like that but i mean we still lived life but we kept it. So we did a lot of cooking at home and things like that. But, I mean, we still lived life, but we kept it. You know, we tried every month. We were trying to throw money as much as possible at the deck. The budget was crucial. Absolutely.

And the EveryDollar app has changed our life completely. And I'm in sales, and I'm strictly commission-based. So there's some months that it was, yeah, we waited all month, and we don't have that much to throw at it. But then in the bigger months, it was like, wow, we're really, you know, that's a big pile right there going through. Big chunk. Yeah, it makes up for it. Well, way to go, you guys.

Way to go. What do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is? $130,000 in 30 months. I think just picking a budget, sticking to it, and communication, definitely. The communication is number one. But I think what really changed my philosophy is when I truly believed that it's not ours. You know, you talk about it all the time. And we actually, quick shout out to my financial peace class.

We just wrapped up lesson nine yesterday. Oh, yeah. So that was fun. But, you know, especially in that lesson, the analogy of the cup overflowing to the plate and then just knowing it's not ours. We're just managing. And when you give that up, it changes everything. Yeah. has to happen um inside of a person that makes this um the handling of money no a nobility

happens inside of you when it's something bigger than you yep that you're doing whether it's your child you're saving for i'm changing my family tree i'm going to serve god because i'm going to manage his stuff better i'm going to be a better steward those are all things outside of us that raise our nobility and when you do, you increase the speed by which you start to win with money. Because you will sacrifice and do things you wouldn't do just for yourself. And you guys did great. Very proud of you. Who were your biggest cheerleaders?

Each other. Yeah. For sure. No, we had some family that was encouraging us for sure. Yeah. Definitely. In financial peace class, you was encouraging us for sure. Yeah. Definitely. And financial peace class, you said you got in that. Yeah.

We took one. So we were on the journey for about a year after we read the books. And then just, I mean, we weren't slacking or anything, but just to keep in it, we joined the class and went through it. Yeah. For accountability, you say. And so that was good. It's very good for that.

And then now you're teaching it. That's right. Yes. Okay. Wow. Coordinator. Yes. Very good. Well, congratulations. Thank you. well congratulations thank you we're very very proud of you guys are heroes well done and you got two babies but i understand they're going to sit with mom and dad

they're going to sit with the grandmas they are so they're names and ages though um henry is two and aubrey was just born she is five weeks old all right so that baby moon stuff works okay good deal i don't even know what that was until about four or five years ago i'll have to google it my generation didn't know this but yeah but it's good i learned about it from my kids it's important stuff so good job you guys well done very well done we got a copy of chris's book for you everyday millionaires and that's definitely the next chapter in your story. You guys are on track to kill it, man. Well done.

You're making good money. You're in control. You're working together. You have all the attributes of people who become millionaires. Yes, you do. You're right on track. Good job. Jeffrey and Caroline, Ottawa, Tennessee, just outside Chattanooga.

$130,000 paid off in 30 months, making $120,000 to $160,000. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Yeah! Woo-hoo-hoo-hoo! This is how it's done, boys and girls.

I love it. Man, they are cool. They are cool, Dave. I'm going to tell done, boys and girls. I love it. Man, they are cool. They are cool, Dave. I'm going to tell you, and so young. Teaming up. Obviously in unity. Yes, they are. Obviously in sync.

You can see that. And that is just, that's one of the big data points of whether you're going to win or not. That's right. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Let's talk about preventing the unexpected. Imagine your refrigerator goes out. You can fix your major appliances yourself with parts and expert advice from my friends at Appliance Parts Pros. They carry over 2 million appliance parts and offer easy returns. And anyone can do the job themselves with 3,500 repair and how-to videos,

plus live chat on their website. Save money and get your parts today at AppliancePartsPros.com. Ramsey Personality, Chris Hogan, my co-host today on the Dave Ramsey Show. Jennifer is in Alabama. Hi, Jennifer. How can we help? Hi, guys. Thanks for taking my call. We have a little bit of a unique situation.

We're in Baby Step 2 right now. My husband's in the military, and we just recently got a bonus for him being in the military. About 10 years ago, we had a house at another base that we were at, and now it's our rental house. Because I know we're supposed to go down to the $1,000 and keep that as our emergency fund, I'm pretty much losing my job cause we're moving. And, um, we're worried that if something happens with the rental house, that we won't have the money to cover that mortgage now because of like security clearances and whatnot, we have, he has to make, to pay his bills. Of course. Um, should I put money away in

like a different account just in case that happens for that rental house before taking that bonus and putting it all towards a bunch of debt that we have or should I just kind of wing it I don't know what to do now you can set a little extra aside over in the rental house account that's a separate business and you're holding retained earnings in it that's separate from your personal stuff although technically you're on it but I would just do that while you're getting it sold. You need to sell that house. We are going to sell it probably next year. We're going to sell it. Why? Well, because we're PCSing right now, and

the amount of money to get it up to selling to sell it that we would need, I'm going to go out next year and do everything myself so that we're not paying need. I'm going to go out next year and do everything myself so that we're not paying out. I mean, just to, I guess they were saying to paint it, to get it ready, it's going to cost $6,000. Yeah. That's what I was like.

Who is they? Yeah. Well, the lady who takes care of our house, our rental manager, she got a bunch of quotes together. Well, listen here, Jennifer. Listen, how much do you owe on this home? We owe $123,000 on the home. Okay, and what do you think it's worth? Probably we could get around to $152,000 for it. Okay, all right. And so the payment on this mortgage is how much, this rental property? $872, um 872 okay and what other debt do you

all have outside of this rental oh boy here we go we have about 180 000 what break that down what is it um let me see um i have about 84 000 student. We have, let me see, a bunch of credit cards, and we have a car loan. Okay. How much is the car loan? $13,000. Okay. What's your degree in? Accounting.

Okay. And you're not working. Why? Well, with the COVID thing and everything, I was a school bus driver. Why? Do you have a degree in accounting or are you a school bus driver? I don't have it yet. I'm like, I'm seven classes away from getting my degree.

So I stopped taking student loans out and I'm actually using my husband's GI Bill to stop the whole student loan thing. So I'm just, I'm getting there next to finish my accounting degree okay that's good that's very smart and yeah I think the house needs to go sooner than later I don't want to delay it every day it sits there it's a problem

looking for a place to happen and every day it sits there that's I don't know what the net of this is going to be $20,000 $30,000 worth of equity that you could use towards the debt. Right. This is not something we need to wait a year on. No.

Okay. All right. Somehow we need to make this a priority. And so if you guys are moving now, when are you moving, actually? Well, here's the situation with that. My husband isn't allowed to move, but we did buy a house before we started this whole university thing and found out we shouldn't have. We just bought a house, and so now he's not allowed to move, but we found out that I can go ahead and

move, and then he's going to get a small place up here until this COVID thing is, and he can move down. I'm sorry. The military is moving him, but he's not allowed to move. Okay, so the military right now with the COVID thing, some of them are not allowed to move. We bought a house in April, so the wives, kids and family can move ahead of time, of course, but he is not allowed to move until they give him the right. Okay, but they've given him new orders to a new location and that's going to happen as soon as covid clears yes okay i see all right and where where is that um florida and you bought a house already there

in florida yes okay and so you're moving without him, you and the kids, when? In about two weeks. Okay. And when did you buy that house? In April. In the middle of COVID. Right, right. When you knew they weren't going to allow him to move.

Yeah, we were about two days after the COVID thing first started. We put an offer in a house because we knew we were moving down there. And then when they put the stop movement together for the second time, we were two days away from closing. Jennifer, are you telling us, based on the math, you said you all have $180,000 in debt, excluding the home, $84,000 in student loan debt, $13,000 in car loans, CARs. So are you telling us you have $83,000 in credit card debt? That and a fixed loan. Okay. And you did say you went through Financial Peace University recently. Yeah, we did buy the program,

and then we're actually taking one of the classes once a week right now. Okay, good. Well, you've got a lot of different things going on. So we need to finish the accounting degree. We need to get the husband moved to you as soon as the military will let him. And we need to get the other house sold as soon as possible because we've got to get your income up above bus driver up into accounting so that you can pay this ridiculous mess off with his help.

And we get rid of that other house so you can do that. So all of that together, yeah, you're going to do it as quickly as you possibly can. But in the meantime, yeah, I would hold a little bit back for the emergency because you've got no margin right now. You've got a huge pile of debt, and you've got like 73 variables in plate spinning. When things calm down a little bit and the house gets sold and you get settled, you're going to want to pull back and do your baby step one, two in order. But right now you're in a transition period. And so you're not even hitting the baby steps. You're on pause. You're not going

to pay off a bunch of debts. You're going to pile up cash, get the house sold, moved get your accounting stuff started back and then push play on your baby steps until then you're going to need the cash to execute every bit of that because you've got a you got a lot of plates that are spinning at the same time and we got to keep them rolling yeah don't take on any more debt okay like nothing not i mean seriously not a thing uh you guys are you're you're trying to do sophisticated stuff and and what we want you to do is stuff that works. And Dave's right. Being intentional, piling up money, but really and truly you all unifying together and thinking what's the step we're taking and what's in the best interest of the family moving forward. And so this is going to be crucial that you plug this.

And listen, I know you bought Financial Peace University. I want you to watch it. Like, go through it. Go to the class. Yeah, because owning it and going through it are two different things. Yeah. So what I hear is you guys are very busy people. You're people of action.

And some of your actions prior to learning about the stuff we're teaching you have caused you messes. And so, you know, what you need to do is lay out a very detailed, exact plan, and then all of your action needs to be executing that plan to get these debts paid, get this house gone, get the accounting degree finished. All of that's part of the same picture. And let all of your action orientation that you have be directed at that instead of getting off the path and getting into a mess. Dave, I know you have a heart for our military just like I do. I've spent a lot of time with them.

They can get called and moved around quite often. At what point do you need to be sitting still before you would advise someone in the military to buy a home? Most of the time it's five years. And very seldom are they. It's two years. Right. Most of the time they're on a location two years.

And so most cases don't buy a house. And these are all exact reasons why right here. Because that house is caught in that other market. They did not set out to have a rental property across the nation. They just bought and then got moved. Right. And then the house is sitting there. And so you become a landlord by default, sprinkled all over everywhere you've ever been stationed.

And so you get into a mess. But, hey, thank you for your service to the country. We appreciate you. That's exactly what we would do is execute this, push pause on everything right now, pile up cash, work your way through those steps, and then push play again. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. This is James Childs, producer of The Dave Ramsey Show. On your smart speaker, you can add our skill by saying, Alexa, open the Ramsey Network skill.

From there, you can listen to all our shows. Ask Dave money questions like, how do I invest my money? Or what is the debt snowball? Find out more at DaveRamsey.com.