The Ramsey Show - App - The State Is Acquiring My Rental Home (Hour 1)

Episode Date: June 29, 2021

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🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host, Anthony O'Neill, Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author of the book Debt-Free Degree, and host of the ever-popular YouTube show, The Table, is my co-host today. As we answer your questions about your life and your money, open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225 that's 888-825-5225 the advice is free the call is free

and some say it's worth exactly what you pay for it matthew is in valdosta georgia hey matthew how are you fine how about you good man how can we help i was calling today to see what to do with my mobile home my question is i have it i'm working on getting it paid off so i was wanting to know would it be better just to pay the extra and pay it off and maybe keep it as a rental property or pay it down sell it and put it down on a new home. Is there another option where you can just sell it today? I mean, I can, but I've still got to pay it down a little bit because I'm a little upside down in it.

Okay, okay. What's it worth today? Right around $50,000 is what I had it valued as how much do 53 9 yeah what would it be worth in uh 10 years i'm not real sure maybe 40 20 10 20? 10. 20. Nice. 10. Yeah. So investments should go up. Mm-hmm. Mobile homes go down. I got you.

They're not investments. You're sold. So what we're going to do is we're going to do what Anthony was suggesting, and that is get out of it sooner rather than later for simply that reason, because you're getting ready to turn over a period of a number of years. We don't know the exact number, but you're getting ready to turn $50,000 into $10,000. And we can't do that very often and become wealthy.

Yeah. So when you want a rental property, you want a rental property that's going up in value while you're dealing with renters and collecting rent. You don't want a rental property that's going down in values and all you get is rent because systematically the asset is depreciating. It's going away. Yeah. So what I would do is I'll go ahead and just put it on the market and just cover the difference. If it's $3,000 and a difference, I'd rather you pay you pay three thousand dollars today than thirteen thousand dollars in the next year or two you know because

while you're trying to pay it off it's depreciating so you're going to always be playing that game you're chasing it it's just like a car yeah i mean cars go down in value that's how you get upside down on a car yeah and uh you know you can't no one can look at you with a straight face and call a car an investment. It's a consumption item. Yeah. And, you know, they go down in value like a rock. That's where Chevy gets at. And you Ford people aren't any better.

It's found on the road depreciated, right? And so they all go down in value. There's no exceptions. I mean, the only exception would be a classic car that you don't drive that's a collectible, and you might buy something that goes up in value i like watching those car auctions of those two hundred thousand dollar cars from the 70s that i bought for three thousand dollars and didn't keep so there you go but that's not that's that is not the normal situation with the vehicle the normal situation with the vehicle is that you're going to lose your butt and the same thing would be true of a mobile home uh the difference is with a mobile

home you actually have a different option which is buy something that goes up in value. Yes. The old house thing. And then you've done pretty well on your real estate. I have. I've done very well. I'm happy. Your timing is...

My pocketbook is screaming happy. That's all I can say. Your timing is Ramsey-esque. Hey, listen. I mean, I'm connected to the Mr. Real Estate guy, so everyone thinks he's the only get-out-of-debt guy. Man, listen, I listen to you, David. No, because I tell you, I don't sell stuff. I just buy it.

And you sell it. I do. You take the cash off the table. I sure do. No, wait. Linda is in San Jose, California. Hi, Linda. How are you? Hi there. Thank you for taking my call.

Sure. How can we help? I have two options. So option number one is do I do a cash out refinance on my property to use that money to build a home in a lower-expense state. Option number two is I can liquidate my brokerage account, which is currently giving me roughly between 16% to 18% rate of return on my money, and use that money to pay for the construction of the house. Is there an option three? Option three. Sell the house that you are going to refinance and cash out

and use that money to build the property. Oh, man. I've been around days. Well, I was going to do that, but option three can't be there because we currently have a business, and our children are still in college, and we want to build a house. And why do you need a house in another state? Yeah.

Well, that is going to be my retirement property. Okay, when you get ready to retire, then sell the house you're in and move over there. But you don't need to buy a house 10 years before you retire because someday you're going to need it. Yeah, okay, okay. You are not going to do this. She's not. She's not going to do this. She's not. She's not going to do this. Hold on. So the reason I brought up about the cash out refinance is because my property is worth $2 million,

and I only owe $200,000 on it. So if I do refinance and get the money out. How much is in your brokerage account? Roughly $300,000. Okay. I'll probably just pay off your house out of your brokerage account and be debt-free, and then let's just build a big pile of wealth over here to the side and when you get ready to leave sell the two million dollar house which by then will be worth more and use some of your brokerage money or whatever you need to do at that time but you don't need to build a house that you don't need

you don't need this other house well what we've been doing is we would like to have a property up there where my husband and i can work there three days a week and then come back to California four days a week. And that's what we're thinking because I need to get my husband somewhat away from this area where we are. It's very congested, and I want him to relax a little bit. That was my thought. It's more just money. So what is the property going to cost that you're going to build that you're going to live in half-time? We already paid.

The land is debt-free. How much money do you need to complete this deal? Roughly $300,000. Okay. I would use your brokerage money then. Yeah. Listen, you called the Ramsey Show. 100% of the time, we don't tell you to borrow money.

100% of the time. I would never tell you to borrow money. Yeah. 100% of the time. I would never tell you to cash out to buy a second home. Yeah. To refinance cash out on your personal residence. It means you can't afford the second home. And I would disagree with you on that part, Dave. I'm going to say still pay off your house and then just stack up the money for a year or two and then go buy the other house. That'd be okay, too.

You know? But if you're going to do the other house deal, yeah, you know what? I would do that. You're right. Because I wouldn't. Listen, the second house is a toy. Exactly. Your husband needs to relax, buy a vacation.

Thank you, Dave. Thank you. Yeah. You don't buy a second home, which is a toy, until your present residence is paid off and until you pay cash for your second home. You got me on that. Thank you, Dave. I was about to let you go after that comment.

Let me go where? I ain't going anywhere. Let me go. Set me free. This is the Ramsey Show. Imagine a world where people never have to worry about money ever again. At Ramsey Solutions, our mission is to teach people how to get out of debt and build lasting wealth. And if that means we have to take on the toxic money culture that says you need debt to get ahead, then we're okay with that. We've seen millions of lives changed, and we will continue to create digital products and services to help people transform their lives. If you want to join our thousand member team on this crusade, we're currently on the hunt for

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in America. Find out about all the available jobs by texting careers to 33789. Text careers to 33789 to find out about all our open opportunities. Anthony O'Neill Ramsey personality is my co-host. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Real estate's going crazy. We were just talking about that. The peak real estate season is here. This year, things are different. Prices are higher.

Competition between buyers is intense. Sellers need to know what they're doing. If they're going to make the most out of the sale of their home right now, you can make a six-figure mistake messing this up. A friend of ours, Anthony, works on the team here, sold his house the other day. $150,000 over asking, 17 bids. Wow. What in the world?

You can make a big mistake if you don't have a high. I mean, this is not amateur hour. You need a real estate agent that has played this game before. So you want a high-octane, high-protein real estate. So good stuff. You've got to get her done and get with one of our endorsed local providers. They're real estate agents we trust. Our ELPs will help guide you through the entire home buying or home selling process.

RamseySolutions.com slash agent will connect you up with our trusted ELP, our Ramsey Trusted Real Estate Agents, ramsaysolutions.com slash agent. Check it out. All right. Dallas is with us. Dallas is in San Antonio. That's so confusing. Hey, Dallas, how are you?

Good. How are you? How are you gentlemen doing? Better than I deserve. What's up? So, my wife recently changed jobs, and she had about $40,000 in the

401k at her old job. And we're looking at where to put that money. Good. And her new job, it's a they have a 401k, but they don't match. And I know from listening to you that we should make the, put the money somewhere where we can choose how to manage it instead of

someone else. Good. So I have, I have my own Roth IRA account with Charles Schwab, and I was just wondering if you'd recommend like putting it in the spot, or if it would be somewhere better for us to roll that money into for now. Well, Schwab is fine. Obviously, you're self-managing all of that, and so I personally use one of our SmartVestor pros because I can get some insight from people who are playing in the stuff all day long.

I can pick up the phone and call the guy, and I know a ton, obviously, about mutual funds. I've got millions, tens of millions of dollars invested in mutual funds. But I also love having a guy in my corner that messes in it all day long. He just eats, breathes, and sleeps mutual funds. It's what he does all day. And I can pick up the phone. He's a friend. If I die, my wife is going to call him and say, you know, where's our stuff?

And so this is what I want in my corner for my investment person versus kind of a DIY thing. But Schwab is fine if you want to just DIY it. But if you want to get a little bit more, pull all your accounts in one place, begin to develop a long-term wealth-building relationship with an advisor. You can click SmartVestor at ramsaysolutions.com and find someone in your area. It's good to have somebody in your corner. Absolutely, Dave. I have one person in my corner, too, and I'm always asking them little questions here and there, learning. But absolutely, SmartVestor Pro is the way to go.

Yeah, and we're always going to tell you, as you said, you had that figured out, Dallas, that we're going to always, when you leave your company, roll your 401K to a traditional IRA. There's no taxes on that direct transfer rollover. And my personal investments and the investments we've told people to do for 40 years or 30 years are the same, and it's four types of mutual funds, growth, growth and income, aggressive growth, and international. And in each of those categories, pick a fund that has outperformed its category, the index for its category.

And you can find funds that have outperformed the market. Not all of them have, but you can find them with guidance from somebody like a SmartVestor Pro. Luke is with us. Luke is in Owensboro. Hi, Luke. How are you? Hey, Dave. Doing great.

How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? Hey, so anyways, right now I'm working on coming up with a counteroffer. The state of Kentucky is widening the road in front of my duplex, and they need most of the land and most of the duplex. So anyways, I'm trying to come up with the best option after we get through this negotiation for reinvesting the money. I recently found out about the 1033-like kind of exchange,

and I was curious if you think I would be able to use that since there is like a threat of eminent domain here. Is that the difference between a 1031 and a 1033 eminent domain? Yeah, it says eminent domain or the threat of eminent domain. Well, that's definitely what this is. I mean, they're taking it. You didn't have an option here. Correct.

Yeah, I wanted to keep it until retirement. I'm currently 34. So I've never heard of a 33. That's a 1033. I know what a 1031 is, but a 1033 is the same thing as a 1031 except it's eminent domain. What's the difference other than that? So basically, you have two to three years to reinvest the money, and you get to hold on to it instead of putting it in like a third-party account is what I'm seeing. So that would be a much better deal, especially with the way the housing market is right now.

Yeah, tough time to reinvest, but a good time to cash out, assuming they pay you market value. So, well, what I want to do, because I don't know anything about this, and I've been in real estate my whole life, it's a wonderful thing. I'm just learning something brand new. I'm excited about that. But if I'm in your shoes since i don't know uh i'm going to not depend on a website to inform me and me end up getting tagged with taxes i want to get a good tax professional local that i can get my hands around his or her neck and choke them if they're wrong

because i really want somebody digging into this that knows their stuff yeah definitely yeah this probably doesn't happen too often it's just some kind of predicament i found myself in yeah but i mean how'd you figure out that you're just doing some research on google or what yeah i just started googling and kind of went down the rabbit hole and found out about that and other people i've talked to have heard of it but i don't know if anybody's ever done it yeah so the thing is yeah the 1031 is a fairly standard process but you don't want to miss a step on that or the whole all the taxes come due and i suspect the 1033 is the same way and so if some goob wrote a blog on the internet about it and you go by that but that's not aligned with actual the detailed nuance of tax law,

you could screw this up and bring all these taxes due and defeat the whole purpose. So you really want to make sure you've got every little thing, every T crossed, every I dotted, every jot and tittle is taken care of, because that would be the part that would scare me. Because I don't know how to do this, I would want to really have a pro in my corner, and it's worth the couple hundred dollars fee to have a tax professional look over it, guide you through the process because you're going to save more than that on taxes by doing this. The last thing I'll tell you is this.

The state, the city, the government institution, sometimes they get bureaucratic, and they don't really have many emotions in the deal, but they make a wrong offer. And so if you can support with comparable sales a market value that is higher than they are offering you, I'm going to hold their feet to the fire for full market value in this market. Not a year ago, but today. As hot as real estate is today, they're taking a property you didn't want to sell, and they, eminent domain requires full market value, or we go to court and the judge looks at my comparable sales and my appraisal and

says oh it doesn't agree with the bureaucrat at the state now you can't just make up something you can't go well i think it's worth that that doesn't matter i'm saying actual appraisal technique with comparable sales make sure you're getting every dime you're due so now dave let me ask this question because i'm learning uh this is brand new to me, the 1033 as well. With it being the state saying, hey, we need your house for us to make these roads better, shouldn't he get assistance with the taxes then since he has no say so? Because it's state versus federal. Federal tax is where your capital gain is, and the feds don't give a rip how you got the money.

But the 1033 allows him to get paid, use that money to buy another property, and roll his old basis into the new property, thereby all the gain, and there's no tax on the gain. Gotcha. It's almost like the call before with the IRA rollover. Yes. It works like a rollover in that sense. That's the way it works. That's the 1031.

The 33 evidently has got some nuances to it because it's forced by the government, meaning eminent domain. Okay. This is The Ramsey Show. Thank you. In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage, Jonathan is with us. Hey, Jonathan, what's up? Nothing much, Dave. Super excited to be here. How are you? Honored to have you, man. Where do you live? I live in West Lafayette, Indiana. Oh, Dave. Super excited to be here. How are you? Honored to have you, man. Where do you live? I live in West Lafayette, Indiana. Oh, cool. And all the way to Nashville to do a debt-free screen. How much did you pay off? I paid off $73,728. Love it. How long did this take you? Took me 18

months or about a year and a half. Good for you. And your range of income during that year and a half? I started at about $66,000 and ended at about $80,000. What do you do? I'm a quality engineer at a local automotive plant. Good for you. Okay. What kind of debt was your $74,000? $46,000 of it was student loan debt and $25,000 car loan and $2,000 consumer debt, credit cards for some electronics.

Gotcha. Okay. How old are you? Electronics. Electronics. Electronics. Very expensive. 26 years old.

Okay. So what happened a year and a half ago? I never had a great relationship with money. I was always a very big spender, buying things I didn't really need, trying to keep up with the Joneses, so to speak. I remember at my first job out of college, there was this group of guys who all drove Corvettes. So good idea here.

Have my first car out of college be a 2003 c5 corvette of course yeah there you go because that always happens yeah very normal um they say it uh it pays to look good and i was paying i think it was a five-year note with the seven percent interest rate wow i thought those guys at the dealership were being really nice to me yeah they were they helped you get that car you wanted yeah yeah that's funny i started a a new job and there was this group of guys there who were always talking about dave ramsey dave ramsey and you know i'm not one to really take a lot of referrals for podcasts to listen to. But they said something.

They said, if only I heard about Dave Ramsey when I was your age, I'd be a millionaire right now. So my interest was piqued. Wait, how do I become a millionaire? Yeah. So Greg, my coworker, lent me your Total Money Makeover book. And I'm also not much of a reader, big spender, not a big reader. And I read that book faster than I've read any other book. Finished it in about a week. And it really appealed to my logical side. I saw some of the errors in my ways, did everything wrong that I'm not supposed to do money-wise,

and really got me thinking about my why and all the good reasons to get out of debt. Yeah. What was your why? I'm curious, your main why. To be honest with you, I took a trip to Hawaii one summer. I said, this is such a beautiful place.

I would love to retire here. Oh. But I know that's not just going to fall in my lap. So that's going to take a lot of hard work and discipline. And also, you know, growing up, we never really really owned the house we lived in. It was always mortgaged with the plan of always moving away. So having those roots, building a strong foundation with family is something that's always really pushed me through. I love it.

I do love it. 26 years old, making $66,000 a year. You paid off $73,000 in a year and a half. This means that you were really making some strong sacrifices. You were living way below your means. Throughout these last 18 months, what was the hardest thing about that journey? I think the hardest thing was taking a bonus check I got and putting everything towards the debt.

Right in the beginning, I got this $20,000 bonus check, and I hadn't even started Baby Step 1. And so putting $19,000 of it straight to the debt was really daunting. Well, that was commitment, though. That's when you knew it was game on, right? Sure game on right yes yeah yeah you were not fooling around anymore this is we're doing this this is a whole new thing yeah way to go man yeah that that's when the uh you know when the everything's a theory till you get hit in the mouth you know and uh that old saying you know and and that's the truth here i mean everything's a's a theory to you. You drop $19,000 and it's all gone.

Yeah, because you had to clear up the debt because you'd already spent the money before you got it. Yeah. Wow. Way to go, man. Yeah. Way to go. So who were your biggest cheerleaders? Obviously, my girlfriend, Athena.

She really pushed me to be debt-free. She's debt-free herself and wanting to get married one day and have a good foundation. As well as my coworkers, Greg, Patrick, Ray, Steve, they were all very encouraging, always checking up on me. Well, how's your debt-free journey going? All the guys that wanted you to show you how to be a millionaire. Yes.

That's the ones, yeah. I like these guys. This is a good group, man. You become who you hang around with, so I think you chose well. Yes. Very good. Very good. So what do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is?

First and foremost, know your why. I think in this journey, I was learning so much about the benefits of being debt-free, trying to share this with my friends, but they weren't really on board. And I think it's because you can't just convince someone with the benefits. You got to feel it in your heart and it's got to become a part of your mission. So knowing your why. And second, the budgeting. It's really like what I've heard on the podcast before.

Money just comes out of nowhere. And with the EveryDollar app I used, that's how it was. I actually calculated it would take me 24 months to get out of debt. But with the budgeting, money just started coming out of everywhere. Well, you increased your income $14,000 during this time. Absolutely. Were you taking on overtime or side gigs? Overtime.

Yeah, okay. Yeah, and so, hey, money is available. I'm going to go get some. There you go, baby. Ding, ding. Yeah, that's fabulous. I'm so proud of you, man. I am, too.

Well done. What's next? I'm curious. Now, since you're debt-free, what's on the next thing for you? Saving up for a house. Okay. I'd love to have the goal of paying cash for a house. I've always heard it on the podcast.

Okay. It's shooting for the moon, but... No, it's not. No? No, it's not. You can make 80 grand, and you don't have any payments. I mean, how does it feel to have no payments? I know, man.

You're 26. It's scary, honestly. Scary? What was the one thing that when you paid it off, the one debt, and you went, God, I hate you people. I'm so glad you're gone. Which one was that? Glad to say her name. I would say it was the car loan.

Yeah. I would drive the car and be really... Do you keep the car and pay it off? Oh, yeah. Yeah, so you still got the Vette? No, no, no. Oh, no, that one's gone. Oh, that one was gone.

That was gone, okay. So what kind of car? It's a Chevy Bolt. Okay. Okay, all right. So when that debt was gone, that's the big one, yeah. I love it. I got a picture on YouTube here.

I own the title to my car. There we go. Good. That's a fun feeling, man. There he is got a picture on YouTube here. I own the title to my car. There we go. Good. That's a fun feeling, man. There he is. Well done. Well done. We got a copy of The Legacy Journey for you.

That's the next chapter in your story to move on to that millionaire status. You are heading that direction, man. You'll be on our Millionaire Theme Hour. Before you know it, our Everyday or Baby Steps Millionaires. Way to go. And, of course, another copy of The Total Money Makeover for you to give to someone. And maybe it'll be the first book they read in a while and they'll stay up all night and read it and it'll change their whole direction like it did for you i'm so proud of you thank you very very well done jonathan from uh west lafayette is that louisiana or indiana indiana indiana okay

cool 74 000 paid off in 18 months making 66 $66,000 to $80,000. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. I'm debt-free! Yeah! I love it, man. I love it.

Woo! Hi, man. Going along from clueless and bouncing along, no financial direction, bumps into some guys that say you can be a millionaire. Here's the book. Here's the podcast. Ding, ding. Walk the baby steps.

Here we are. I love it. Look at him. So proud of you, Jonathan. Well done. This is the Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Brittany is in Knoxville.

Hi, Brittany. How are you? I'm doing well. How are y'all? Better than we deserve. What's up? So I am on Baby Step 3B, saving for a down payment on a house. I'm currently a nurse, but I work Monday through Friday,

so I'm trying to figure out a side hustle where I can make some extra money to eventually pay off the house early. And I'm wondering if it would be a good idea for me to start a photography business on the side. Are you any good at photography? I've not really had much practice, and currently I don't actually have a camera. I've been wanting to play around with my

moms a little bit but so why photography then i have always liked photography itself i like the idea of helping families make memories that sort of thing um and i know when we took my senior pictures with my aunt uh just coming up with poses and stuff i had a lot of fun with that okay and your mom's camera is what what is it is it good enough camera to take some pictures with get started i'm not sure i think she got it in like 2013. So it's a, with a decent camera then, but it's pretty outdated. I would also definitely need a laptop because my laptop from college is shot. It doesn't really work anymore.

Yeah. And is your goal, Brittany, to generate extra income or are you trying to start, uh, extra income to pay off debt or are you trying to get extra income to, you know, just because you want to have another hobby aside business?

I would like to, um, like I said, I'm on baby steps three B, so I want to save up for down payment. And then my goal is to eventually I'm 23. Uh, I'm single.

I want to have a pay-for- house by the time I have kids eventually. Good. So what do you make? So I can stay home. Yeah. What do you make? I make about $55,000. And what do you want to spend on a camera and laptop?

It would be probably for that and like some SD cards and stuff, my budget would be $2,000. Okay. And so if you take $2,000 in the middle of the table and light it on fire for a hobby, it does not keep you from hitting your goals. Okay. And so if you take $2,000 in the middle of the table and light it on fire for a hobby, it does not keep you from hitting your goals. Okay. And so that's like your worst case scenario. In other words, you buy these things and it never amounts to squat. You don't make any money, but you got a nice camera and you got a nice laptop and you just did this for a hobby. And you spent some of your house money to do that or some of your income money to do that. You see what I'm saying?

Yes. Now, if you told me it's $20,000, I would say no. Right. Yeah. Right. Because as a ratio in your world, that's too stinking much money to burn. Yeah. Now, if you make $500,000 a year and you want to burn $20,000, we'll talk about it.

But you see what I'm doing? I mean, we're just saying, does this keep you from hitting your goals by the time you're 30? No, it does not. And so it's okay at that budget amount to give this a try. I will tell you that from a business-only perspective, what I think you ought to do is you ought to check out Christy Wright and Business Bout boutique i was just about to say that and begin to think about how we're looking at this um this sounds like something you you thought about over coffee and prayer one morning and you've actually never done it at all and all of a sudden now you're opening a business doing it that's a

that's a bit of a leap yeah and so i would I would rather you, you know, before we actually set up shop, I'd rather you just go around and get some confirmation from people that you actually have an eye through that lens. And some people go, wow, I really like those shots. And maybe somebody would pay for that, you know, or, you know, or people go, maybe you shouldn't do this. And do some research on it, too. You know, YouTube is very good. If you're going to buy a camera, I would definitely jump on YouTube and see what's the best camera out there in your budget. People are doing reviews all the time. Set your budget and it'd be very clear.

And then you say, hey, best camera under 500 bucks. You're going to find a lot of cameras uh that people are saying here's here's here's the good things but i definitely will sit back and ask yourself you know uh am i doing this because i really want to become a photographer or am i doing this just because and if you're trying to save money to buy a house you can go drive for uber you know if it's a temporary fix because i don't see you making a lot of money that quick on something you've never done before but if you pick up an uber job uh delivering pizza delivering uh groceries picking up people groceries you can make money instantly so i don't think yeah i i

kind of had the feeling this i agree with you but my kind of the where i went on it was it's more about scratching an itch than it was actually i got you didn't make money i got you and so it's quasi a hobby that might turn into some money i got you and i and if that's the case if it does turn into money we'll call that wonderful you know but uh you know what's it how many pictures you gotta take to get your two thousand dollars back a lot whoo yeah depending on me as a beginner photographer a lot and a lot of time because she's got to get her skills up. Yeah. Jean is with us.

Jean's in Cincinnati. Hi, Jean. How are you? I'm well. How are you? Great. How can we help? Great.

It's wonderful to talk to you. And I appreciate having access to someone with wisdom and getting some great advice. So I have a son, daughter-in-law, four grandkids. And a number of years ago, I paid for my son and daughter-in-law to go through Gay-Ramsey. You mean Financial Peace University? That's right. Okay. And they even taught it at their church, but they are very duplicated.

They're not living it. And the four children have not been taught day-by-day. And they are two are teenagers and two are over 18. And so I'm seeing lots of issues and talking isn't getting me where what I need is I want my grandkids to learn Dave Ramsey. And so I want to compel them and have rewards along the way to have them do it, do the steps. So I need some wisdom on your part on how to compel them to take Daybrain-Zoo without being pushy about it, having rewards along the way, as I said, and measurable. And so if you could give me some advice on how to do that, I would appreciate it. What a wonderful heart you have to love your grandkids.

And I told one of my friends the other day, and my kids all are, you know, they're not off the rails. They're on track, obviously. I'm real proud of them. But even in that case, they just do some things different than I would, obviously. And I think the most difficult stage of parenting is when you're not allowed to tell them what to do anymore because they grew up. That's right. And you have to watch them do stupid butt stuff. That's right.

And it's aggravating. Even if it's something minor, you know, and it just aggravates you. And so I think it's the hardest thing. It's the control. So let me just tell you what you just said as an example, because I was laughing to myself because it sounded like something I would do, because I'm going to make fun of you, because I would do it too, okay? You said, how can I compel them without being pushy?

The definition of compel is pushy, okay? You want to grab them up by the scruff of the neck and make them freaking behave is what you want to do, Grandma. I know you. You're just like me. Yep. You're absolutely right. Grab them up by the scruff of the neck and make them freaking behave is what you want to do, Grandma. I know you. You're just like me. Yep. You're absolutely right.

You can't because they're grown and they're not yours. I know. So here's what I have to do. I have to periodically, and my friends that are my age and your age facing these same exact things i have to periodically stop breathe you know you remember the old thing when they catch on fire stop drop and roll you remember that it's kind of like that okay i have to stop i have to breathe and i have to go i cannot talk to them like they're kin to me i have to talk to them like they're kin to me. I have to talk to them like they're my friend or even my friend's kid who I have no ability to compel to do anything. Instead, my only shot at moving them along is persuasion.

Okay. That's your only shot, Grandma. Persuasion. okay that's your only shot grandma persuasion and so you just sit down and take them to breakfast and you say i love you more than life itself and i've learned some stuff and i wouldn't bring up dave ramsey i think leave dave ramsey out of this i would just say common sense and say i've learned some stuff and because i love you i'd love for you to know that stuff. Can I talk you into walking through it with me? Because I love you so much. That's compassion and persuasion. You're not going to compel anybody that's grown to do anything.

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