The Ramsey Show - App - There IS an End to Your Debt Payments - Don't Give Up! (Hour 2)

Episode Date: August 24, 2020

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paying off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host, my co-host today here on the air, Chris Hogan, Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author, and we're here to answer your questions about your life and your money. Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Melissa is in New York City.

Hi, Melissa. Welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Hi, Chris. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Hi, Chris. I think you guys are awesome, for the record. Thank you. And I appreciate you guys in my life. Thank you.

I'm just a little stressed right now. I need a little guidance. I'm on baby step 3B. I have two children, one on the way. I'm in the position to buy. Um, I have a dump. Uh,

I have my down payment and I have, um, 2.75 interest rate. I was told for 15 years. Um, but I, I didn't want to continue renting because there's some issues with my apartment right now.

And they want me to come out because they have to like fix some leak and they have to like open up the walls anyways um the issue is that i want to be an hour commute to the city because i live in new york city um but of course you know how city prices are um and that's without without traffic i'm just looking at an hour commute without traffic so i saw i found a, and I was just wondering. It's not anything that I wanted in real life, but it's going to be my first property. It's a condo. I really wanted a single-family home. But the condo is more within my budget, and it would be less than if I were to be renting.

There's no backyard I could um so I was just wondering if I should just settle for a condo um or if I should rent continue renting and try to save up for another property or could I keep the condo and then maybe sell it in three years but then I'm not really sure how it works in the market and if I if it would be easy to sell in the future. Okay, stop. What happened is you have to move earlier than your plan, and you don't quite have the down payment you initially dreamed of having when you made this move, and it's stressing you out.

Is that right? Well, I wanted to move yeah i know but you're you're stressed out because you're you're getting ready to accept some piece of crap condo that you don't want i know why because you're stressed out well because i'm in a good i mean i feel like i'm in a good position to buy because I have my security. Then why would you buy something that's crappy? I mean, it looks nice. You haven't looked enough.

I've been looking since January. I've been looking a lot. It's just really aggressive in the market right now, and things are on the market for a short period of time and then they just go because I've been looking in the New Jersey area close to the city

and it seems to be like I don't know, I can't find anything that's an hour away What you described to me was you said, I don't like this condo. Should I buy it anyway? That's what you said.

Is that what you said, Josh? Because you're tired of looking, Melissa. You did say that. You said it real clearly. Because it's like an apartment. So I could just get it because it's like an apartment. So if I rent an apartment, it's going to be $2,500. And then if I buy the condo, it would be like $2,000.

You said, I don't like this condo. Should I buy it anyway? Okay. That's what you said. Because of the rent's too high. Because I don't want to move twice. Because I've been looking and I haven't found anything. And I'm frustrated.

Should I buy this condo that I don't like? Should I surrender and buy a condo that I don't like? That's what you've been saying all the time you've been on the phone now you're going to get in there and within five or six months you're going to be miserable yeah so you need to either go rent something and calm down and look more slowly or you need to take more time and find something different but you told us over and over in this call. Just go back and listen to this when it's on the podcast. It was Melissa saying, I hate this condo. Should I buy it anyway? You said it five different ways.

You used different languages for different words. Less than if I rent? Because it would be my own. No? No. No. It would be your own and you hate it. Have you not ever owned something you hated?

I have. Deep inside your spirit is saying, I hate this condo, don't buy it, maybe Dave will tell me I should anyway. He's not going to. He's not going to tell you that. I've owned crap that I hated, and I hated it the whole time I hated it, and I gave it away when I got ready to sell it because I hated it. Okay.

So either go rent a little while longer, even though it's wasted money, but it's better than buying something you hate. Am I missing something? No, not at all. Or even if it takes you longer to commute in, find something you like that's inside of your budget. I promise you, you will not regret that. It's tiny. It doesn't have a backyard.

I don't like it. I don't like it. I don't like it. I don't like it. But I've been looking forever, and I've got to move because they're tearing the walls out of my condo. I'm frustrated. Should I buy it anyway? No!

No. Don't do that to yourself. You answered your own question. Here's another way of saying it, Melissa. A friend of mine says that God's Spirit is inside of you, and he says, he's talking to you, and it says, when in doubt on a decision, when in doubt, don't. Hmm. If you don't have peace there's a disturbance when in doubt don't and every time

that little bell inside of me rings and i go forward anyway i pay stupid tax and i have god helped me paid so much stupid tax in my life you know I was thinking about this morning the first house I ever bought Chris I was working for a real estate company a builder and a national builder and they took this little house in Antioch Tennessee in on trade against one of the houses that we had sold in the subdivision and they said hey we can't get rid of it let's see if dave will buy it this house was uglier than ugly one of those tennessee houses where they cut the road through the middle of the street and the houses below you can stand on the front porch and see the oil pan of the cars by, and the houses above are a ski slope.

Ugly. It was perched up on a hill. Ugly. Ugly with a capital U. Ugly. But I got a deal because they sold it to me. Nothing down. They carried back the second mortgage, and I assumed the FHA first mortgage.

I was thinking about when I was running this morning. I paid $59,250 for that house. You know how I remember that? Why is that? Because I sold it four years later for $59,250 and felt blessed to be out of the Ugelee house. Just let it go. Homeownership was not all it was cut out to be when it's carved out of the side of a freaking cliff and it's Ugelee. I hated that house when I bought it. I hated that house when I bought it. I hated that house when I sold it.

Melissa, this is how I know your story. I have lived your story, darling. Dave's trying to save you. Listen. Listen. I've done so many stupid things in my life. But that was my first home purchase. By God, I was a homeowner.

You got a deal. Stupid and Uglee. But I was a homeowner. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Folks, I love telling you about well-made, well-thought-out products. Today, I'm talking about Grip6 belts. I don't know about you, but I'm not a fan of traditional belts. They never fit right, and they're uncomfortable. Grip6 belts are unique. Owner BJ designed a truly modern,

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To learn more and get this month's Dave Ramsey special, visit GRIP6.com. That's GRIP6.com. Chris Hogan, Ramsey personality, is my co-host today here on the air, number one best-selling author. So, Chris, we were talking going into the break about stupid stuff I have done, and I have done a lot of stupid stuff. We used to do a theme hour here on the air where people would call in and tell stories of stupid things that they did that cost them money. When I lose money to doing something stupid, I call it stupid tax, as you know. Yes. And so you pay stupid tax when you do something stupid and you lose money as a result.

And I try not to pay the same stupid tax twice, meaning don't do the same stupid stuff. There's plenty of other stupid stuff to do. That's right. Why repeat one? But here's what we've discovered over the years. There are classes of people, lower class, middle class, upper class, on the socioeconomic ladder. Okay? And there's different stupid stuff among age groups and among classes of people uh for instance you don't see the payday lender the car title pawn in the rich end of town that's always in the poor end of town right uh you don't see and so that's the stupid stuff

and the tote the note lot right okay and that kind of stuff. And then the upper class does other kind of stupid stuff. Most of theirs is prestige-oriented. They're trying to buy recognition with a stupid purchase to be somebody they're not or something like that. They're trying to get fulfillment in the wrong place. The middle class, it pretty well falls into four or five categories. I mean, usually the middle class doesn't do payday lender, right? They're not going to fall for that. And they don't buy a lot of lottery tickets.

Most of the lottery tickets are sold in lower income zip codes. The middle class, it's obviously credit cards. It's car leases, fleeces we call them. It's whole life life insurance. It's timeshares. Timeshares are getting to be, I'm seeing them more. I mean, I thought that would have died off by now because it's stupid on steroids. It really is.

I mean, they're expensive and they have absolutely no value. It's one of the few products out there that you can find a 93% dissatisfaction level with. Like, everybody that buys it wishes they didn't. Yes. And yet people keep buying them. Yeah. Dave, we got 9.6 million households have one or more timeshares. 9.6 million.

Good Lord. 64% are married, and the average age of a timeshare owner is 44 years old so it's that at that bracket you're talking about yeah so it's a middle-aged stupid it is it really is but it sounds sophisticated it doesn't sound sophisticated well at all you're buying the right to go to a hotel room which you could have rented there's nothing sophisticated about this at all all it was was you went on a free vacation and got put in a room oh yeah and they wouldn't let you out of the room for seven hours and you couldn't say no so you said yes you got screwed and you paid 14 to 25 000 bucks for

air you don't have an asset and you can't resell it because nobody wants it. Well, they say that it's deeded. Well, some are and some aren't, but even if it's deeded, what do you got? You got a deed to air. Get some paper. Nobody wants your week. Look on eBay. Look on Craigslist. They're everywhere.

You can't give the dadgum things away. You are stuck. Yeah. Oh, well, I've got points. Just the same stupid thing. Say about a credit card. Say about the credit card. You ought to try using that for your credit card.

Use that for your... Oh, God. Yeah. You have a sense of ownership. I love that. You have a sense of ownership. That's in the pitch. Yeah.

When you hear the pitch, it's kind of like being an owner, except you're not. Oh, my Lord. Restrictions not oh my restrictions so many restrictions and then the point system it requires a trigonometry degree to figure out all the nuances let me tell you how you'll never go on vacation all right okay you use your airline miles and try to book your air and line it up with your week that you bought points on on the timeshare. These two things are never in the same. Freaking Aquarius would have to be aligned. I mean, Mars, I have to be aligned with Venus to get all this to line up.

The chances of you getting this middle class free crap you thought you were going to get ever lined up is zero. Yeah. So let me try again. Don't buy timeshares. Be clear, Dave. Don't buy timeshares. I don't want to be unclear.

I know. It's a long and aggressive sales presentation, so I have to match the length and the aggression to offset it. I think there's a thing here. Don't buy timeshares. And not to mention the preying on people that want better than they have feel like they're entitled to some stuff and they they play up to that mental sense of you being smart to do this let me help you yeah if you're gonna pay 17 to 25 000 for something okay just take that and

divide a hotel room into it and you can go anywhere in the freaking world you want to go and you don't have a thousand dollar maintenance fee that goes up every year that's true and you aren't stuck yep and frustrated and then the property gets tired meaning warn the freak out by the freaks who went on your week the other weeks into your unit this is not the way to enjoy your vacation. It sounds sophisticated. It sounds high-end. It's just not. And don't fall for it.

Matter of fact, don't even go to the meeting. Yeah, don't even go because I'm going to tell you. They won't let you out. Yeah. You'll have to draw a firearm to be released. Like Clint Eastwood. Yeah. I'm out of here.

I'm out of here.'m out of here it's just but seriously just don't go and uh this is one of those things where if you know this about yourself i have trouble saying no don't never go into a meeting where the only way you're going to get out there saying yes yeah no and you know the only way you can do that is you've got to deal with a reputable company uh to be able to through the process. And it's still going to cost money. Yeah, it costs money to get in, costs money to get out. There's just no fun in this discussion. No, it is not fun.

Listen, I have coached and counseled families for 30 years. The number of times I found someone who loved their timeshare is almost zero. Now, if you're out there and you love your timeshare, you should really think about that. But I'm happy for you. You're one of the 4% or 5% or 6% or 7% of the people who actually are satisfied with one of the worst financial products on the planet. Have I been unclear? It's right up there with payday lender.

It's the payday lender of the middle class, the whole life life insurance, the car fleece, the credit card airline miles. These are dumb things that people lose money on called stupid tax. And the people in the business are scummy. Scummy. Scummy, scummy, scummy, scummy. Even big name companies like Marriott and people like that get in. They're scummy it's scummy scummy scummy i mean even big name companies like marriott and people like that get in they're scummy they're scummy it's just it's how it works you know and the time shares

people it's like and you ask we've had people call in here that used to work for the business and they're like well i'm going to end up doing a documentary on this one of these days. Because the people behind the scenes that want to come forward and expose what is going on in that business, what happens in the sales presentation, well, we'll take it back. No, they won't. No, they won't. They lied. They will not take it back. No, they will not.

And so. You can wait three days and think I can just call back. They won't. They really won't. They'll pull up camp and they're moved on to the next individual. Yeah, the next herd of cattle that they can put in a room and butcher. That's right. It's just, just herd them in there and shoot them.

It's just, oh, my gosh. That's what happens to you, man. So please, please, please, please do not fall for this. If you want to go on vacation, I want you to go on vacation. Sharon and I have traveled all over the world. It's been one of the dreams of our life to build some wealth and enjoy some of our time and get to see some of the coolest places in the world. But, you know, the number of times that you want to go back to the same exact place over and over and over and over again, it's very rare.

It's extremely rare. It's very rare. Don't put yourself in. Don't give yourself limitations. If you're going to do that, at least buy a condo. Right. Save up your money and buy you a beach condo if you want to be in the beach. Buy you a condo at the mountains if you want to be in the mountains.

I don't care. At least, by God, you'll own something then that could go up in value that somebody could actually buy, and you could turn around and resell it. You could resell it. That's true. In this, though, in this, you are just stuck. Yeah, it's air. Timeshare is Greek for I'm stuck. I can't get out, and my money is gone.

I can't get out. Let me go! They won't do it. You're stuck. They got you. Stupid tax. Timesha stuck. They got you. Stupid tax. Time shares on the list. This is the Dave Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage.

They're here. Phillip and Lindsay are with us. Hey, guys, how are you? Good, how are you? Welcome. Where do you guys live? Lakeland, Florida. Right between Tampa and Orlando.

Right where it is. Been there several times. Well, good to have you visit. Welcome. And here to do a Debt Free Scream, how much have you paid off? $60,000 in 18 months. Good for you. Range of income during that time?

Started out just under $90,000 and by the end we were making $150,000. Whoa! Nice jump in 18 months. Like somebody got a job or what happened? Promotion. A big promotion. Right at the very beginning I went from a co-pilot at work to a captain

and about six months later I became a check airman, which is the ability to teach at work. Oh, wow. Very cool. Very nice. Well done. Thank you.

Good job, you guys. So what kind of debt was the 60K? Everything but student loans. Everything but. We had a motorcycle, credit card. We had to finish the rest of my car payment, got that knocked out. A water machine. A water purification machine right after we got married that we got sucked into.

You don't really want to talk about that. Of course. Yeah. So you guys are kind of normal. Yeah, pretty much. How long have you been married? Almost three years. Almost three years together for nine.

Okay. So after a year or so of marriage, you look up and you go, oh, this sucks. We got to do something. What happened? What broke this? It was about half a year or so of marriage, you look up and you go, oh, this sucks. We've got to do something. What happened? What broke this? It was about half a year in. We make decent money, and for us to have negative 17 cent in our bank account at one point just didn't add up. Right after I upgraded to captain, actually.

We were sitting down doing the math, and it's like, this doesn't make sense why all the bills were paid. We had dinner on the table, but there was no money. No money. In fact, we owed money. So that was kind of a big wake-up call for us. What did you do? Well. I laid down a bunch of note cards, got our bills figured out, timing of them,

how much money we had left up, and told them we're about to say no for a little while. Suck it up. Lindsay grew up in church the same as I did. And so we both had heard of you over the years. them how much money we had left up and told them we're about to say no for a little while suck it up lindsey grew up in church the same as i did and so we both had heard of you over the years but uh never really applied that to ourselves and uh lindsey had just started watching your youtube channel and was getting some good information from there she came home one day and said look this is this is what we're going to do. So either get on board or get out. Whoa! Whoa!

She didn't say that. But no. He knew that, though. She was serious. All right, Captain. Here we go. Buckle up, buddy. Buckle up.

Lindsay needs that security hand. Yeah, seat tables in their upright positions. Buckle in. Here we go. That's right. That's right. Wow. Amazing.

Well done. So once the switch flipped, it was just game on, huh? Yep. We both got really serious about it. Our friends and family, they were like, you guys are kind of weird, but you're doing it, actually. And so slowly, as the months went by, they were like, wow, this is working for you. And then all of a sudden, the support started rolling in. They wanted to see if you were for real before they backed you, huh?

Right. Pretty much, yeah. Our success led to a bunch of our other friends looking more into it. started rolling in and they want to see if you were for real before they backed you right pretty much our success led to a bunch of our other friends looking more into it we've got them sat down almost till midnight got all their bills and stuff figured out now they're on the train that we were just on so now we get coaching people so lindsey's a financial coach yeah she is and she's good at it too i'm really good at telling people to say no and i'm really good at telling them no i'm just really good me too. I'm really good at telling people to say no, and I'm really good at telling them no. I'm just really good at it. Me, too.

I've been doing it for 30 years. Just say no. That's all you got to do. What would you tell other young people out there, though, that are finding themselves where they're not able to make the ends meet, but they want change? Is it possible? Absolutely. With God, all things are possible.

That's her favorite verse. And having our people around us to tell us to keep going and yeah community is certainly key you you are the people you surround yourselves with so when we got serious about finances we started surrounding ourselves and with people that were on the same page as us and that served as motivation and kept us moving in the right direction it was hard because a lot of our friends i mean the younger crowd they don't really understand i feel like and so they think that we're crazy saying no and missing out on things. But the small sacrifice now will pay off in the long run.

And we've figured that out in 18 months of doing it. Yeah. So when you had that moment, there's a moment right there, 17 cents. Negative 17. Negative 17. Excuse me. Off by 34. by 34 okay missed it by a nickel a quarter and so uh when you're looking at that i remember those types of moments in my life what was the emotion that you felt when you saw that i I was upset. I was confused.

I'm big on security and having the extra fluff for things, and we did not have that. And I remember sitting there crying, honestly, and telling him, we've got to do something. So it was fear. Right. And then once we took away that fear and we started putting the money towards debt and then...

I'm very much so in the moment. I looked at that and went, this is freaking stupid. Yeah. So yours was a little bit of anger. Right. I looked at the income and then I looked at what we had and I'm like... Disgust. Yeah.

Exactly. Why? We make too much money, but it's broke. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. And you were afraid. Yep.

Yeah. Yeah. Because usually associated with life transformation, there's a moment where there's a visceral emotional experience. And I remember, I mean, the sweat in my palm, my hands on my upper lip, I'm trying to balance the checking account. And that was in the old days when there wasn't an internet and I was doing it with a calculator and a checkbook register. And I realized that I hadn't posted a check and we were negative several hundred dollars, and I'm getting ready to bounce checks if

I don't find it really quick. Scratch some money together from the corner of the couches, and I remember going, it was a combination of both of those things, being afraid, but you can feel the sweat on your upper lip. You can feel it coming out. You know, your heart rate changes. Oh, yeah. And you feel like there's shame that goes with it but all of

that works for your good when you go that's it i've had it never again never again and when you have that never again moment that's what you had that's so cool y'all i'm so proud of you thank you well done well done so i'm guessing that uh you had some cheerleaders along the way you said who were those well at first our family and friends thought we were crazy. And then, like I said, once they figured out it works is when they were like, okay, y'all are killing it. Keep it going. And so every...

Family, mom and dad. Yeah. Okay. How old are you guys? 25 and 27. Okay. Wow. Wow.

Very impressive. Yes, you are. So, again, what is the key for the 24-year-old, 25-year-old just got married out there listening and they had that moment? They're afraid, they're disgusted, they feel like they've done something wrong or somebody didn't teach them something they should have known. What should they do? What's the key to getting out of debt? You know, obviously your principles are absolutely the path, but I would say that, at least for me, knowing there's an end in sight. I mean, it may not be in sight yet, but there's an end. This too shall come to pass, right? So we're sitting at the table,

I'm taking a test and I've got this entire college class in front of me. I just keep telling myself, you know, tomorrow morning, this is going to be over with. So there is an end to this. And that's for 18 months I just kept saying there's an end to this. And if we keep on it and keep on it, we're going to get through it. Was it worth it? Absolutely. Absolutely.

We went to Disney World and celebrated. Hit the final payment at Disney World as the castle fireworks were going off. We were serious about it. Party! I like it. I do, too. That's how you keep yourself motivated. That's it.

The final payment when the fireworks go off at Cinderella's Castle. That's really cool. Submit, baby. That's really cool. Exactly. I love it. I love that the word is submit. Yeah.

Yeah. It was. If you don't think the borrower is slave to the lender, just look at the word, submit. That's correct. Wow. Good for you guys. Very, very well done. We got a copy of Chris's book for you, Everyday Millionaires.

Without a doubt, that's the journey they're on. Yes, it is. And you all will get there. Just that same kind of intensity and focus that you've had, get that moving as you go to baby step number three. Build up that emergency fund. Start investing and then stay clear. Avoid stupid because it's around every corner.

Just waiting on you to let your guard down a little bit. And so just stay focused, you guys, like you have been. You can do this. This is very cool. I'm proud of you. Thank you. All right. Phillip and Lindsey, Tampa, Florida. Lakeland, Florida.

Paid off $ off 60 000 in 18 months making 90 to 150 count it down let's hear a debt-free scream three two one I love it Boom man 25 and 27 Game changers Sharp You don't think we got a future in this country Those people are out there running around

I'm going to tell you Young and focused And smart This is the Dave Ramsey Show. our question of the day comes from blinds.com they have a 100 satisfaction guarantee meaning if you mismeasure you pick the wrong, they'll remake your blinds for free. You get free samples, free shipping, and with the new promos they run every month, you save even more. The promo code is RAMSY. It's magic.

It'll get you the best deal. Chris, our question. Yep, today's question comes from Dominic in New Jersey, and he asks, How much or a rule of thumb should be my target for retirement? My current goal is to achieve around $3 million before the age of 62 to 67, depending upon my retirement medical benefits. I currently max out my 401k and have a Roth IRA, but still feel like it won't be enough. Is there an ideal amount? Well, here's the reality, Dominic, is we've developed a free tool that is going to

help you with this. It's called the RIQ, the Retire Inspired Quotient, a free tool, once again, on my website, ChrisHogan360.com, that will help you understand your ballpark number, but it'll take it a step further, my friend, and show you how much you need to be investing to get there. Now, you're maxing out 401ks, or you're putting $19,500 away in it, and if you're over $50,000, you've got an extra $6,000 you could do on a catch-up provision as well as your IRAs. You don't tell me your age, but I'm going to tell you this. If your goal is to have around $3 million and you're following the baby steps, you're going to have more than enough, right?

Because it's going to depend on your lifestyle, how much you want to travel, how many mission trips do you want to do, and how much giving. So the good thing is you want to take control and you want to be the guide of that and what you're spending and how you're living. Yeah. You need to know your retirement IQ, your IQ. That's a good thing. And some good rough and dirty numbers are this, okay? If you do what we teach, you save 15% of your household income. Now, we don't know your age and we don't know your income.

But the average household income in America is just under $60,000, $59,000 and some change. Okay? And so if you save 15% of that from age 30 to age 70, you would have about $8 million in a good mutual fund. If I'm half wrong, you still got double what you're projecting. And the $3 million mark, here's a good number, okay? Let's say, let's just make up numbers. Let's say you made 10% on your money at $3 million. What is that?

That's $300,000 a year. If you made 10%, you could pull $300,000 a year off and not touch the $3 million, just the golden eggs, but don't touch the goose. If you pulled off 8%, that'd be $240,000. So as long as you think you can live on that, then $3 million will be enough. The trick is to try to have a nest egg that you can live off of the money that it creates the way you're willing to invest it without touching the egg. That's right.

I keep mixing the metaphor up here, but don't crack and scramble the nest egg or don't shoot the goose that's laying the golden eggs is another way of saying it. The principal amount, your base amount, is your goose. And, you know, you leave that as an inheritance. If you want to burn through it, you can burn through it. It's your money. Do whatever you want. But you can create a perpetual motion machine that will sit there and spit off golden eggs as long as you don't shoot the goose.

That's right. And here's the reality. You get yourself out of debt. machine that will sit there and spit off golden eggs as long as you don't shoot the goose that's right and here's the reality you get yourself out of debt you don't have the requirement for as much so that allows you to be more in control of your lifestyle and what it is you're doing you can always find something to do with it oh yeah give it i mean and there's other you know there's another place to travel you haven't been with a car to buy you haven't bought. And there's other stuff you can do. There's ways you can enjoy it with outrageous generosity. And I've never met someone that goes, I have too much. No, me neither.

I have met people who are spiritually inept, and they never get to enough because they can't reach contentment. As an independent discussion, apart from the amount. But in terms of the math part, I've never met somebody who went, golly, I just screwed that up. I got double what I should have had. I never hear that. No, I've never either. So if your three is six or your six is $12 million, then that's okay.

That's all right. I never dreamed I would end up where I am today when I was broke and starting to invest. I just wanted to reach enough that I could live off the income of it. And once I reached that, then I just kept going. But not because I'm greedy or I'm piling up money or I'm building bigger barns or I'm, you know, I can increase my generosity and I can increase the fact that I changed my family tree. And, you know, if I've got my way, if I teach my kids and my grandkids and I leave them money, this could be the dumbest Ramsey in the stretch of family tree. I could have changed the whole stinking thing.

Yeah, you really could. Get rid of the stupidity and the brokenness all in one generation. Just leave it all with this one, with the old man that did it. He's the one that changed it, you know. And that's cool. That's a cool goal to have. So I think he's in a great shape there. I do, too.

Now, once again, if you're out there and you're thinking, okay, how much do I need? Again, the RIQ is the Retire Inspired Quotient, free tool that allows you to plug in numbers, plug in how much you want to live on and how much and how long. And it's a tool. So you can change the rates of return and withdrawal rates. The goal is to make people more aware of why you're saving. Your 401k becomes your paycheck later, right? So we've got to put money in to be able to grow to outpace inflation so you have a paycheck

later. And that's what Dave was just talking about. So check it out. Chris Hogan,360.com. So, Hogan, I just looked down. You're speaking at Christy Wright's Business Boutique this year. I am. I get a chance to go and hang out with Christy and that fun bunch.

They love to have fun. Yeah, they do, and they didn't ask me. Oh, Dave. So you're going, I'm not. You were there the last three years, and I wasn't. It's my turn. You need to share, Ramsey. Listen, I own it, and if I want to go, I'll go.

You can go. It's okay. I'm bringing you with me now, business boutique people. No, you're not. No, you're not. So the business boutique is an event Christy puts on one of our emcee personalities. We do with her, obviously, once a year. It's typically 3,000 people, and it's typically sold out.

This year we're going to hold it to 1,500 so we can keep distance between folks at the event, at the venue. And because of that, it's got just a handful of live tickets left. They'll be gone soon. The event is coming up October 22nd through the 24th. And I think I'm out of town, Chris. But Chris Hogan will be speaking, Elizabeth Hasselbeck, Annie Downs, Lisa Brevere, Gigi Butler of Gigi's Cupcakes, Jamie Lima, who sold her company for a billion with the B dollars. Wow, Kelsey Humphries is our emcee again.

The Business Boutique Conference. Here's what we're going to do. Because we're cutting it off to maintain some space and we'll be sold out way early this year, we're going to go ahead and do something we've never done, and that's live stream it. And people are live streaming stuff that never thought they ever would. That's right. I mean, we're putting out as a live stream that we never thought we'd put this out and people are watching stuff that they never thought they would watch so this conference is october 22nd through

the 24th and the live stream is a she's this is a deal 129 ticket you would pay that to see any one of these presenters uh it's absolutely a deal so So just go to DaveRamsey.com or go to BusinessBoutique.com, wherever you need to go, and you'll be able to watch Chris Hogan on the live stream at Business Boutique. That's probably worth $129. Again,

by itself, I won't be there, but Chris will be there. So... You share so well Dave you know that I'm just generous I know look at you cackling over there hey we're going to have a lot of fun

I'm telling you Christy is high energy all of these speakers and it's going to be a great opportunity to really help these ladies and these women really dig into their businesses and to help them to grow individually so they can go back and cause their businesses to grow. So this is a unique opportunity. You have to invest in yourself.

It's really important for us to keep that in mind during this time. Business Boutique Conference, Christy Wright, equipping women to make money doing what they love. Selling this year for the first time and maybe the only time ever as a live stream. If you haven't been able to make the trip or you're scared to make the trip or however that all works in your world, either way, we'd love to have you October 22nd through the 24th as low as $129. Almost cut $100 off of it there. $129 a ticket, and you can get that at businessboutique.com or davramsey.com. That puts this hour of the Dave Ramsey Show in the books. Thanks to James Childs, our producer, Kelly Daniels, our associate producer, and phone screener.

I am Dave Ramsey Show. If you would like to do your debt-free screen live on the show, make sure you visit DaveRamsey.com slash show and register. We would love for you to come to Nashville and tell Dave your story.