The Ramsey Show - App - This Debt Is Affecting Our Marriage (Hour 1)

Episode Date: November 7, 2023

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. I am Rachel Cruz, Ramsey Personality, hosting this hour with bestselling author and Ramsey Personality, Dr. John Deloney. And we are here to answer your calls. And it's a free call anywhere in the country at 888-825-5225. All right, we're going to start off. Hold on.

Whoa, whoa, whoa. It's launch day, yo. Oh, I was going to get to a call first. No. It's launch day. We'll jive right headfirst into it. We finally have a book that's at my reading level coming out of this company, and I'm excited for it. It's a children's book.

I'm glad for what I have. So it's my kid's book that is out right now. So you can go and order at RamseySolutions.com. It's beautiful. I can't wait to buy them for all my family. It's amazing. Thank you. It's really great.

All about contentment and great for this holiday season that we're about to embark in. I know. And George is writing these money books I can't understand, but I can understand this one. You can understand this one. Lots of pictures.

That's right. Yes, baby squirrels. Baby squirrels. They ask for more and more. Baby squirrels. They gather as much as their burrows would store. So yeah, get ready.

Hey, that looks really great. It's really actually amazing. Yes, thank you. So yes, I'm glad for what I have is out today. Awesome. All right. Let's see if Michael in New York who's up next. Let's see if Michael has any kids I have is out today. Awesome. All right. Let's see if Michael in New York, who's up next, let's see if Michael has any kids.

Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike. Michael, do you have any children? I got one on the way coming. Yes. Good. Hang on the line. We're going to send you a book. I'm going to send you my new kid's book for the new baby on the way.

Okay. How far along is your wife? Very early. It's like we're about eight weeks, nine weeks, something like that. Oh my gosh. This is just now becoming real. I'm the first baby gift. I have a feeling, Michael, that will be given to you. That's awesome. Hang on the line after this call, but how can we help? So, you know, since, you know, me and my wife got married about two years ago and she's very reluctant on attacking her $120,000 student loan debt she has.

Right now, she's, you know, I'm willing to help her with it. You know, I'm definitely there for her to help her with it. But she doesn't want to make the steps for herself to really attack it. So I want to, you know, every time I bring it up to her, she gets, you know, a little defensive. She doesn't want to really talk about it. So I'm just trying to get a way to get us on the same page. Yeah. It's a great question. And I think, Michael, you know, just even the way you have kind of phrased the situation, even to us, it does feel like a his and her mentality. So yeah, when you go to her

about her debt, it can feel like an accusation or you're wanting something that she doesn't want, and it's about her stuff. So that's where things get really messy. I understand why she probably is feeling the way she is, because I think the mindset that you guys have, not just the student loan debt, but just in general with money and the way you guys look at this as a team sitting down and saying, hey, before like we're going to talk about the $120,000 student loan debt, let's talk about like the values of our family and our soon to be right family without that that kids are coming into the picture, which is very exciting. But hey, what do we value? What do we want as a family? Do we want to be debt free? Do we want to live without debt? Do we want

to be a generous couple? Like what are these values that we want to have? And out of those values is where you can make these tactical decisions like paying off student loan debt. So I think that's one of the bigger conversations, Michael, that I would encourage you guys to have is as a couple and money fights and money problems. I mean, this is of the bigger conversations, Michael, that I would encourage you guys to have as a couple. And money fights and money problems, I mean, this is a big tension point for people. But it's not just because of the money. It's usually the things underneath it that get stirred up because values are not aligned. Does that make sense?

Sure, sure. What shuts her down when you start having that conversation? Why does she withdraw? You know, I come to her and I'll be like, you know, I'll ask her because I'll be like, how's you doing with your student loan? And she pays it every month. Hold on. I want to stop you right there. I want to stop you right there.

Are you all married? Yes. Yeah, it's y'all's. Yep, exactly. It's y'all's. I totally agree. It's y'all's. So do you'all separate accounts

yes we do okay i'm not a fan of it i'd rather our accounts be together but she won't join your accounts with you she's reluctant why she's reluctant how come that's a great question we we've had that uh conversation before what does she say? She's like, oh, well, you know, it's really like spinning the wheels to be honest with you. I couldn't give you the exact wording on it. I haven't spoken to her about it in a little bit. So here's a conversation

that happened in my house about 10 or 15 years into being married. I realized that my dad was a policeman growing up and there were seasons when he would put his debit card in knowing there was no money in that account but he had babies to feed right and I remember money being this pulsing neon sign that told me that my family wasn't enough and that my dad's service to his community wasn't enough and that I was less than all my friends because they could buy

cars and they could go on vacations. And so I didn't want to talk about money and I thought it was fighting my wife and I wasn't. What I was fighting was my childhood. Sure. And the only way we got to that conversation was the time my wife said the words, John, I am scared to death. And it took the air out of my lungs. And so I think there's a conversation to have about,

hey, have you paid your thing? Have I paid my thing? And dude, like Rachel said, y'all will dance around this thing forever until you have a baby and then it will be like i want to have it at home i want to have it at the hospital i want it right and then it's just going to go on and on it's getting to that that underneath thing that rachel was talking about hey honey sure i feel like you have your life and i have my life and we're about to have a baby

and I've been coming at you with numbers and plans and your money and my money I'm scared to death we are going to create a life that we just co-manage as household and I want to do life as one. Will you join me

in that? You see what I'm saying? That's you taking a knee. Let's say this. Sure. Your plan hasn't worked. The way you've tried hasn't worked. And it won't because she won't. Right. If she doesn't want to do it,

she doesn't have to do it. You know, the way it's set up. Right. It's not like, it's just odd to me because it's not like we make bad money. We make decent money. It has nothing to do with that.

All that does is buy you some margin to be a little more stupid and a little more separate. If you both are making $7 an hour, you have to pool this money because you can't. Because you all make good money, it allows you all to do stupid for longer. Yeah, Michael, and I think, too, if I was in this situation and my husband came to me and just said, and it's a instead of a pointing fingers accusation, it's a different posture, honestly, of the conversation of saying, God, what is underneath that, babe? What is the thing that scares you so much that is making you so hesitant, not just to pay the bills, but for us to be together as a team? That's almost, Michael, more concerning to me than just $120,000 student loan bill, which needs to be paid. But this mindset shift. So I would want knowing and humility and

kindness, Michael, that you want to know her. You want to know what's going on and having that conversation with her. And then on a very tactical side, just to give you something, even pull together your income and just say, hey, how long, Matt Batt, how long would it take us to pay this off? If we like really dove in and like at least give some kind of plan and let that even be a tactical step, too, because sometimes this idea in your head of paying off, it's like, I don't know how I don't know what the first step is. But if you initiated that, even it could be a jumping off point to into the conversation. But we're going to give you Ramsey. We're going to give you FPU as our gift to you. Yeah. Hold on the line. We'll give you the book. Glad for what I have in FPU.

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And Christmas, have y'all started shopping yet, John? Yes, we have. You have? Yes. Well, good for you. But we're doing it different this year. This year, we're not going to buy a thousand things. Okay.

We're going to do a couple of things. Yes. And be very intentional. Yes, with it. And so, yeah, we're already thinking that buy a thousand things. Okay. We're going to do a couple of things. Yes. And be very intentional. Yes, with it. And so, yeah, we're already thinking that through. So nice. So nice. Well, we know that Christmas is a big deal to all of you watching and listening.

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So order the books, order the stuff to give away to your friends and family and actually let it be a meaningful gift that you give that's actually going to help them in their life. So RamseySolutions.com slash store. Alright, up next we have Logan here in Nashville. Hey, store. All right, up next, we have Logan here in Nashville. Hey, Logan, welcome to the show. Hi, Rachel. How are you? We are doing well. How can

we help? Yeah, I wish I was better than I deserve. What's up, man currently I do have some debt I got to deal with, and I never thought I would actually be calling into the show after all these years. So currently I do have some credit card debt. I have a little bit of student loans left. I am married. My wife has a little bit of student loan debt too. But basically this year we've had a lot of trouble with cash flow. Her job's not, you know, just basically paying her by check.

She was working remotely and things kind of fell behind and, um, yeah, we are feeling the stress. Um, and we actually, and our, and I mean this lightly cause, um, our marriage did kind of, uh, was a little bit on the rocks, but you know, we both want to make things work out. So I guess the best way to go forward about this, cause I mean, I know I've got a little bit of, I probably got a few years as far as an uphill battle, as far as the debt, um, the snowball debt and everything, but how can I get her, um, on board with this without feeling, you know, on the same page as me, uh, without feeling, you know, so anxious and everything. And, um, basically I suggest my question. Yeah. Okay. So just a couple of just tactical

questions, Logan, how much do you guys make a year? Um, so I make around 48 on one job. Uh, I am taking, I am taking a second part-time job. And she makes around $38,000. Okay. All right. And then... Before taxes. Before taxes, sure. And then how much debt are we talking?

How much student loan debt combined and credit cards combined? So my student loan is $6,000, which is not bad. I mean, it's just, I haven't paid it in a couple of years, mainly because, well, we don't get into it. Uh, but then, uh, uh, hers is around 17. Okay. And how much credit card debt do you guys have? Uh, 13 uh 13 uh that's over two cards one is uh one is approaching the max out and the the culprit of it is uh you know our rent's 1700 a month right now and uh there were hey hold on hold on hold on hold on logan logan logan yeah not the culprit not the culprit I'm listening to you talk, and you have very distant language from reality. Here's what I mean by that. We had some trouble with cash flow.

No. Y'all didn't make enough money, and you spent too much. The main culprit is the rent. It's not. It's not. The main culprit is we have chosen to make 38 and 48 and not work one job two job three jobs we've chosen to live in a city i all of the healing that has to happen in this household is going to start with y'all both choosing reality right and not living in

this this world is descending upon us in all these ways no dude we're gonna take it right by the horns and say what is real and what is not what is real is we are broke what is real is dude you don't have a ton of debt you have too much but i thought you're gonna say 150 000 dollars the way you're just sounding like eeyore like oh well it's all coming down bro it's not you know what i mean it feels like it by my standards because this wasn't a problem two years ago. Yeah, but you stopped being intentional. Yeah, exactly. That's it.

Yeah. Why'd you stop being intentional? I don't know. I'm just thinking about. Just give me a straight, right-on answer. Why did you stop being intentional? I guess it's because I cared too much. The thing is, this was a philosophy.

Dave's philosophy was something that was important to me, and then I found myself in this position. But I guess what I didn't do was make sure that I did the necessary things to keep us out of this position. Perfect. That's the kind of ownership you need moving forward. Because now you're going to, right? Yeah.

Yes. And what's your wife's hesitation? Because I know you were asking about the marriage part of that. What is her, why is she why she hesitant well she's never really i'd see best way to put this just say it just say it just say it she's not she's never really focused on this aspect of life. Just okay. So she's a free spirit. She's a spender. She doesn't really want to be bogged down with the details.

Right. At least she used to be worse. Um, but obviously this past couple of years, she's saying, okay, we need to do something. Yeah.

Yeah. Logan, there's a, there's a feeling I'm having and I could be totally off base because even the way you were talking about the marriage, your marriage, and then the money stuff, there's just a level of kind of like life is just happening to us and kind of a level of apathy that starts to kind of just sink in. And you kind of just become going with the flow. And I'm not saying you have to live your entire life intense 24-7, but realizing that people that win in life, that have a healthy marriage, it doesn't just happen,

right? They work on it. They go to therapy. They read books. They sit down with couples that have a marriage that they want. They practice communication. They fight about, I mean, they do the work with money. People that win with money, it doesn't just happen. They are so focused, so intentional. So there's this level of intensity. I kind of just want to shoot through the air right now to you and your wife to be like, you guys can do this. Your numbers, and especially if you get a second job, you guys can make real progress, but you have to care. You have to get in this place. And I think you may be there where you're realizing, oh my gosh, I don't know where else to go. That's why you're calling us. But there's this intensity that I want you guys to have that's going to help you get through this process, this lackadaisical kind of attitude. You kind of end up getting what you're getting,

and nothing changes. There has to be some level of deep change for you guys, and there's a level of passion there for life, for your marriage, for your money, like all of this, to do it on purpose, right? And I would want you and your wife to be on that same page and working towards that same value system, that same goal. This sounds like I'm going to come out of left field. Do you exercise, dude? I do every day. I'm a delivery driver driver so it feels like it

like what do you get passionate about um well honestly uh about music because i am a musician and that's why i came to nashville and i actually uh i actually made a living as a self-employed musician for years when the pandemic happened and I kind of went in other directions. Okay. But I still play. Well, I want you to deal with the loss of that, of that identity, that who you are. And I'm guessing, Rachel, there is a sense of just kind of lost at sea. Yeah.

Good for you. I know some musicians who just sit on their hands. Good for you for getting out there and throwing boxes to put food on your table. That's amazing. But I want you to find some vigor again. Like Rachel said, like find some passion, some intensity. Sit down with your wife and hold both of her hands and say, let's do this. You can do it.

So, John, inevitably what money brings up at times for people in their relationships are just these like little awkward moments you know i know you and i thanks you and i have i've talked to couples who are like um seeing each other naked made kids uh bought homes together don't know how to talk about money and they're like, I don't just want to bring it up. It's like, y'all made a human. Like, I know, but it's weird. Totally. It's a thing.

And within friends and family and in-laws and parents. I mean, all of it. How much you making over there, Deloney? It's such a... It's like, so like, really? So GoBankingRates had these awkward questions and George Campbell and I on the Happy

Smart Money Happy Hour we've talked a lot we've had this conversation because there's so many that come up in life and I don't feel as awkward just because I guess we just talk about money every day it's our job so I'm like I don't even think twice about it but for so many people it is such a thing so

let me tell you a quick Deloney thing about awkward can I do this James so so um i was creating a questions for humans sex and intimacy thing we're working through and some people in the building were like john this is super awkward super awkward and i was like i asked these questions to my friends so i went home to sheila my wife and i was like hey these are all questions like i've asked at dinner parties across and she goes and i quote yeah john you've been making dinner awkward for a long time and i didn't know i was like oh geez okay all right so anyway i know you're very comfortable with all these questions okay but so james split these questions up and so i don't know what rachel's about to ask me and she doesn't

know i'm about to ask her so you go first because mine starts at number two. Okay, so I'm going to put it in as if I'm asking you. Okay, awkward money question. So John, how much money did you make last year? We did good. We were blessed last year. Well, I feel like it's a fair conversation. People are talking about their income a lot and it's kind of a little selfish to hold it all in

because if I know what you're making then maybe it's going to help me so how it would but like one of the most common things people tell me is i'm selfish with private things and like you're exactly right i like to keep that between me and my wife i tried to really that's it get in there okay so if someone because that's a trend right now i would ask how much oh yeah oh gen z's like all in it and because they're like yeah if my friends in marketing and i'm in marketing i should know what she makes but you super should i because because if she's making more than me i could then i have the potential to make more i just don't know i could be making more if i don't know what everyone else is making here's my challenge with that here's oh my gosh

here's my challenge with that it goes back to the book you just wrote. If me and my leader, Jeremy Breland, we shook hands. Yeah. Here's what I'm, here's what I agree to. It doesn't matter at all what you make because I agreed to this. I shook hands. The only time it's unethical, I think, is if we agree and shake hands

and we say on X dollar amount and he pays me Y and he pays me less. And I'm like, hey, we agreed on this. amount and he pays me y and he pays me less and i'm like hey we agreed on this that's but that's talking about within your leader your person that's paying you i'm talking about your friend or this does say colleague oh this does say colleague oh yeah but hey if i knew how much you made you know because you're on the board so you know exactly what i make so there you go okay number two, number two. You're asked to donate to charity, but don't want to. Okay, so, hey, Rachel.

I got mine. It happens at the grocery store all the time. Will you donate? No, no, no, no. Round up. Not the school stuff. I'm your friend, and we work together.

Would you donate to my pet parent fund to help pet parents, particularly cat moms and dog dads all across the United States? Would you donate to that charity? Is it a 501c3? It could be. Okay.

It's an OU812. Well, Winston and I, we actually planned out all of our giving. Oh, so you instantly went to blame the husband. That was well played. Winston and I, I said both of us, we are one.

We have planned out our giving for the year. So we give to three organizations. So that's already planned out and we kind of have a miscellaneous giving. So let me chat with him. But we usually put, we usually give to individuals in that fund. So you can apply next year

to the Rachel and Winston Giving Fund. Wow. I'm just kidding. You can imagine like a Girl Scout coming to your door with Girl Scout cookies? You'd be like, well, here's an application you can apply for next year. I did buy wreaths from a Boy Scout last week because I wanted to support the Scouts. And I buy Girl Scout cookies by the wagon load. So there you go.

Okay, next one. Hey, John, can I borrow some money? No. What do you need? I'll give it to you but i'm not gonna loan it to you i just don't loan money yeah because it makes but i feel weird i can pay it back in six months but that's cool if i feel like i can give it to you i'll just yeah i won't take it back all right that's how you handle that one people just give it's a gift number one um rachel i borrowed five hundred dollars and I didn't pay you back.

I'm sorry. I forgot to pay you back. That's fine. I gave it to you. Oh, you just switched it? I don't loan money. Because originally you loaned it, but okay, cool. Wait, is that your number four?

Yeah, someone forgot to pay you back. Oh. Okay, well, okay, okay, hold on. How much? 500? Like for plain, like say like we were all going on like a couple's trip. Yeah, I didn't have it. Well, if you don't have it or you have it and you just forgot to pay me back, uh how much 500 like for plane like say like we're all going on like a couple's trip and i like i didn't have it was if you don't have it or you have it you just forgot to pay me back because

i have forgetful friends in my life and like oh i meant to venmo you i just got that text this morning i forget all the time yeah so if it's like you have the money it's like oh we forgot to pay you once back for the plane tickets but that's fine you can just venmo me today no worries yeah yeah so if you don't if you're free to have the money yeah then forget it i'm not holding that over you okay um okay so we're out at a uh on a double date and you leave the waiter ten dollars on a nice meal not a great tipper what do you do this reminds me of a friend's episode where rachel green's dad anyone didn't tip well and ross swooped in there and changed the tip dude i'm what do you do make a big ordeal what wait to your friends yeah i will even if it's not a great friends if it's not a great friend

if i don't know them that well you don't know them that well i'll over tip no but what if they what if they bought the meal and there's one bill sitting on the counter or sitting on the table i've actually i've actually left money before just left some cash what if you don't have cash change it would you i guess you could do that yeah you can't do that yeah not good um you're on a date and they ask about how much money you make i haven't dated you and this winston thing just didn't work out and so you're on a date with dan and dan's like rachel how much money do you make how many dates has it been three yeah no sorry you don't get that no if we're like if we're about to be if we're about to like oh yeah i'm in love he's in love and we are and this is it then we're talking money planning for like next stages yeah

yeah yeah then then then i share would you want it to be on a third day surprise but i won't want to be not a surprise but like um dave tells a story of like you you all and your spouses knew that dave and sharon were doing good but didn't know like oh wow and so I would imagine I would have liked that conversation to be had after I was married so there wasn't this I would always be able to know I'm not somebody isn't looking over my shoulder or I'm not a part of a bigger plan this person has they love me for me oh I hear what you're saying I like driving an 88 to sell easy hatchback because I knew my wife loved me it was not for anything not after the money yeah no i can see that totally

all right you have a roommate yeah uh and he's not paying his fair share uh you have to have that hard conversation yeah and that looks like you agreed to pay rent bro you don't yeah and here's the thing. Bro. People always say, I don't want to screw this up. Like, I don't want to make the relationship all weird. They did. All you're doing is addressing the weirdness that they have made. Yes.

They have violated your friendship. It's not you. That's a good point. And they'll often go, are you seriously going to just like throw me out? I'm simply responding to your lack of character and your violation of our friendship. You did it. I've just got to call spade a spade. I can't afford all this rent.

I got to go get another roommate now who will actually pay rent. Are you serious? Does that make sense? It's hard. That's a great point. But all I'm doing is calling it out. Yes. I've never thought about that.

You haven't done anything wrong. Right. I had a group of friends in college and we may or may not have gotten in trouble and it was fascinating because every person in line was no that was it was me next person i do that was me and the person eventually was like y'all get out right yep it wasn't the if you tell on me because that makes me a bad friend for letting you go down for me right so i think yes we get that out of order all the time. Yep, yep. Hey, you can't afford to be a part of someone's bridal party. I want you to be at my wedding, but it's $7,000. Flight Al Capulco.

All these destinations. Yeah, man, I will be there in attendance. I just, we, I can't, I don't have money to be able to do it. I would just straight up say it. I would just say it, yeah. Y'all, if money wasn't awkward, I don't know. I don't know if it still is. I feel like we really helped a lot of people. We just solved America. I think we helped a lot of people out with that segment. Embrace the awkwardness, people. Embrace it. Head into it. This is The Ramsey Show.

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. It is a free call anywhere in the country At 888-825-5225 Up next we have Ashton In Panama City, Beach, Florida Panama! Hey Ashton You live in a great area Oh you know it is beautiful

The Emerald Coast It is, a lot of Nashville people Hedge your way on most breaks, school breaks. Yes, ma'am. Yes, ma'am. In one month, me and my wife may drive up to Franklin to see you folks. Come on. Oh, I hope you do.

Come join us. We have some lovely people right now in the lobby watching the show. We have lots of visitors, a lot. Tell them I said hi. I will. Ashton says hi, everyone. Ashton says hi. How can we help?

Yes, so me and my wife, we are blessed beyond measure. We are Gen Zers to kind of follow and piggyback off what you just said. And we talk about money all the time. We communicate and we are blessed because we're in baby step three B now. However, we're really just in a place where we really don't know what to do with our money because we are having to travel four different locations in a matter of nine months for her doctor of physical therapy school. And so we're in the second rotation now, and we have a fully funded emergency fund, no student loan debt, no consumer debt whatsoever. Good for you guys, Ashton. Oh, yes, ma'am. Yes, ma'am. We we are blessed like i said um but however i just

really want to make sure we do things properly i don't want to make any mistakes however i know life's all about making mistakes right yeah no detrimental ones we don't want as much as possible yes okay so um so if you guys are past baby step three, are you guys homeowners? We are not homeowners. And that's kind of where I was getting at is like we're having to bounce around to these different cities. So we were in Tulsa for the first one. Now we're here in Florida. And the next third and fourth one is going to be in Missouri.

So we really just don't know where we're going to end up. And I don't necessarily know if we're even going to be looking to buy a home soon based on where we're going to live, if that makes sense. For sure. So you know what I would do, Ashton? I would be funding retirement. Are you guys putting any money away? You know, that's the thing is like, we call this storm mode just because we're, our life's pretty chaotic right now. In the nine months, we have to really live out of our suitcases and Airbnbbnb cash flow everything like that and so it's really hard to like really get the budget down when it comes to knowing what's gonna what the months are going to look like in the next month so we're really just saving everything that we have in order to

be able to cash flow it It's a unique situation. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's fair. And nine months for retirement isn't going to be absolutely detrimental. But I also don't want for that to be on pause for too long, right? So if I were you guys, I would map out as much as I could the next three moves and the next nine months and just to say, okay, on average, how much is the Airbnb going to be in Missouri? If we're going to be there for six months, is it cheaper to rent somewhere for a six-month rent or Airbnb? I would kind of start pricing out your options just to get a ballpark because here's what I don't want to happen, Ashton. I don't know. This may not be your case, but I don't want everything in those nine months to cost you guys you know i'm just going to throw out in random numbers 20 grand and you guys have 50 saved and you could actually be putting some of that in the market

because you have plenty of of margin so so you are telling me though that you feel like there's not a ton of margin you're not just being overly cautious you guys are really like hey this money we really need and we'll probably use. Just based on living off of my income, to kind of give you an idea, my wife's full-time clinical, so she's putting in 40 hours no pay because it's called education with quotations, right? What a racket, right? Exactly, exactly. You know, Dr. John Deloney, the higher education thing. I understand. So, yeah, we're blessed beyond measure. However, we're making about $50,000.

But praise God, we've only spent $37,000 in a year. And so we're definitely living below what we're making, but we're not making a ton. Okay, that makes sense. Yeah. Yes, ma'am. For sure. So, yeah, so, I mean, I would be fine with that kind of storm mode mentality, having things in a high-yield savings account and just kind of staying afloat until the nine months. But at nine months, do you guys know where you're going to land?

Do you think you know what city you guys will be at long term or no? It's okay if the answer is no. I'm just curious. That's the kicker because she's Native American, and that's why she's getting a full-ride scholarship for grad school. Oh, wow. She has to go work for a clinical or hospital that's under the Indian Health Service. Yep. And so that is such a blessing,

knowing that she'll have to get a job. If she doesn't get a job within 90 days, they're just going to place her randomly. So it's a lot of stress, you know? Okay, okay, yeah. Hey, so Ashton, I want to throw something at you. It could be... Oh, what's that, sir?

I want to throw something at you. So there's a strange thing that happens when you're, the nerd word is agency, okay, or autonomy. But when your body understands that somebody else is directing your life, it will sound the anxiety alarms. It will make you uncomfortable. And most of us, when we start feeling that discomfort, we start trying to solve problems that are just over the hill. Right. Does that make sense?

It sure does. Part of me feels like you are stretching. You're uncomfortable though, right? Well, part of me thinks, I mean, you've got the plan rachel just laid it out to you just dump money into an hsa a high yield savings account not hsa but high yield savings account and focus on living every day the best you can for the next nine months and then where y'all get because i think a lot of this is just spun up energy that you're trying to dissipate by extra, extra, extra planning. A hundred percent.

I'm such a type A planner, the nerd. I've got my every dollar inside spreadsheet. So, dude, homie, listen. Get into working out. Get into hiking. Get into doing something else. I love to golf and fish. I'll tell you that.

Do what? I do love to golf and fish. I'm trying to go golf with Ken one day. Yeah, for the sake of humanity, don't golf. But go fishing. Go fishing. But come up with some things you can do in real time to practice dissipating that anxiousness.

Because here's what's going to happen. You're going to start attacking your wife with spreadsheets and plans, and she's going to come home exhausted from a clinical rotation. You're going to be like, Hey, honey, I got four new houses for the next seven moves for the and she's going to start leaning a little away from you because you'll be a lot and what you're going to be doing is using her to try to dissipate some of your anxiousness don't do that find outlets you have a deadline right rachel like there's an end to this marathon. Y'all are just in mile 12.

And mile 12 to mile 19 of a marathon is the worst, except for the last five miles. So just keep running. Just keep running, man. And just, I mean, you're kind of saying it even with picking up hobby. Like, go do something. But also just take a breath, too, right? So, like, you guys are doing great, right?

If you guys were, were you know deep into student loan debt and she's getting her graduate and it's going to be another hundred grand you know all of it then i can see the you know the the tight woundedness that you are ashton i feel like a little bit from the call so breathe you have permission just relax just breathe you're good that song you're good just faith hill i think faith, yeah. I don't know why Jessica Simpson came to my head. Why did that happen? Sorry, Faith. You're thinking of a Michelle Branch song also called Breathe.

Oh, lots of Breathe. Okay. Listen to all of that, Ashton. Still not Jessica Simpson. Start a playlist, Ashton, with all of these songs to remind you to breathe. Because you've done the hard work. You guys are young. You don't have debt. You have a fully funded emergency fund plus the storm mode that you're

talking about. So all of it's good. And then where you guys land in nine months, rent somewhere for a year and kind of see, okay, is this going to be a long-term play? And if it is, then you can use some of that money that you guys have saved in this period of time for a down payment and move forward. But I would not keep investing off the table for a year. Okay, so like I understand, you know, having some money during all these transitions, but once you guys are settled in a place longer than three months, start thinking about retirement

and start working through the baby steps. Because again, it's the analysis, paralysis of the analysis is what it is. Yeah, and it's also an obsession with the finish line and the more you can realize that finish line just going to move on you because the moment you get assigned to um a native american hospital you're going to want to know how many years we have to do what's the minimum number of years we have to do this so that we can go to the next place and you're going to immediately jump to that and then as soon as you move there you're going to start looking for hey can we make more

money and you're going to realize as you get older that finish line just keeps moving. So my buddy Sal DiStefano says, the man who falls in love with the journey goes much further than the man obsessed with the finish line. So make peace. You're on an adventure for the next decade of your life because you married this amazing, brilliant woman who's going to be serving these special communities. Awesome. Make peace with where you are every step of the way, not this obsession with where you're going to end up. That's right.

Ashton, thanks for the call. Thank you, America, for listening. Thanks to all the guys in the booth to make it happen. Thank you, John Maloney, for co-hosting this hour. This is The Ramsey Show.