The Ramsey Show - App - This Is the Greatest Fraud in a Generation

Episode Date: May 4, 2022

Dave Ramsey & Ken Coleman discuss: The $80 billion stolen in PPP fraud, Tithing on a vehicle sale, How much to budget for hiring employees. Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX  Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6 

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, is my co-host this hour. As we talk about your life and your money, we help people build wealth, do work they love, and create amazing actual relationships. Thanks for jumping in. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Well, Ken, two years ago right now, people were locked down in their homes. We had flatten the curve you remember flattening the curve well i remember hearing about it but it turns out you and i and some brave staff people

kept coming in and putting out live shows so i heard about it and we heard about but the curve apparently had to be flattened yes and then later apparently two weeks is what we had to be masked and then apparently we didn't yeah and then apparently we all had to be vaccinated, and then apparently we didn't. And some people are still bathing in that fear porn that's out there. In the middle of all of that, there's a complete, I mean, we shut down the American economy for, you know, what, 60 to 90 days. And we're now experiencing inflation as a result of that uh lack of production creating shortages and now a an over uh zealous uh retail thrive driving supply i've been driving demand way high and supplies still out of kilter two years later we're trying to recover from the

flattening of the curve but one of the things i didn't know until i picked up this from nbc news this week um they're calling the ppp plan the biggest fraud in a generation the looting of the covid relief plan yeah that remember ppp oh yeah where businesses were not going to you know the economy was going to collapse if the government didn't step in right just like we were all going to cause the collapse we were all going to die if we didn't flatten the curve right economy was going to collapse and everybody was scared and everybody's running around screaming and screeching at the top of their lungs and so the government lines up this just blows my mind um 90 i'm sorry let me see let's just say okay they bought lamborghinis they brought ferraris and bentley's here's the article

and teslas of course lots of teslas many have participated in what prosecutors are calling the largest fraud in u.s history the theft of hundreds of billions of dollars in taxpayer money intended to help those harmed by the COVID-19 pandemic. Instead, these fraudsters came in and couldn't resist purchasing luxury automobiles, mansions, private jet flights, and swanky vacations. They came into the riches by participating in what experts say is the theft of as much as 80 billion dollars 80 billion dollars oh yeah of the ppp yeah was fraudulent use and theft of the 800 billion that was handed out in the covid relief plan known as the Paycheck Protection

Program or PPP. That's on top of the 90 billion to 400 billion believed to have been stolen from the other 900 billion under the COVID unemployment relief program. So we've got 800 billion and 900 billion we dumped into saving the world. Well, we have a theme, Dave. So what happens is when government says they're going to come in to save the day, government doesn't operate efficiently or effectively. And what we had was a small business administration on the first half of this, the PPP, saying, hey, write us a letter. This is about as fundamental as it was.

And tell us why you need it. So what do these people do? These scumbags, they go, let's take advantage of the U.S. government because they're a bunch of morons. And we're going to get money. And they got it. And the government just said, here's a check, here's a check, here's a check, here's a check because they wanted to save the day. Exactly. administration truly believed and they were screwed in the head that they had to get this money plugged into the economy fast to offset the the drop to offset the quarantine right and when

you go at that rate of speed you don't have any way to verify and put in place that's correct and you drop trillions and trillions of dollars out there, and now we're finding out that well over 10% of it. Unbelievable. North of $500 billion now went to people who did not have an unemployment problem and did not even qualify for PPP because all they did was say, sign this document and check here that you really are due this money. They didn't even look. No.

I have 46 employees. I happen to work out of my basement and have no employees. But I have 46 employees, and here's the name of my company. People were going to state records and pulling company names off of state records and filing under that with false addresses basically creating a form of identity theft and getting checks for hundreds of thousands of dollars sent to them to keep their business open and they didn't even have a business yeah this is what happens when leaders lead from desperation desperation and fear it's exactly what panic it was full on panic was full

on panic right and when people are panicking, they're not leaders. That's correct. I don't care if you're a Democrat, you're a Republican, you're a lefty, you're a masker, you're a righty, you're an anti-masker, you're a vaxxer, you're an anti-vaxxer. If you're in a full-on panic, you're straight-up stupid. That's right. And so what was happening is the government was trying to give the illusion of, we're control. We got you. And the fact of the matter is they didn't. And this is taxpayer dollars. fraudulently spent, and all because leaders are trying to give the illusion that they can solve your problems. And by the way, they're the source of the shutdown, where the governors and the senators,

Trump, all of them, they all signed on to this shutdown, and it broke businesses. And in their desire to help the businesses they broke they ended up wasting money and i got to tell you something it ought to be a wake-up call to the american people stop and go hey yeah this is this whole thing yeah was off yeah and let's stop blindly this is like some kind of bad movie right here. But $500 billion paid out to people that didn't even own businesses or that weren't even unemployed in the name of panic brought on by false sets of assumptions about numbers. Oh, God. It's a case study in leadership not leading. And the nanny state run amok. It's true.

And so the people are screaming, you have to take care of us because now you've made us, locked us in our house, and now you have to feed us. Yeah. And, man, people, you people, people i'm telling you if you ever allow your government to do this to you again you're a bunch of freaking sheep but yeah because this the the results of this are going to ripple through our economy for a decade 500 million dollars and here's the deal you can do something something about this. That's a half a trillion dollars. You know what you can do? Vote. Go

vote. Anybody that was a party to this kind of junk, send them home. From a school board all the way to a governor to a senator to a president. You can vote. Send them home. Good God. This is the Ramsey Show. building wealth is a hot topic right now there's all kinds of opinions on how to do it. Plus, inflation has everyone freaking out. Well, it's time to cut through all the noise and learn how to build real, lasting wealth the right way.

That's why this year, we're hitting the road for our Building Wealth Live event. Joining me will be Rachel Cruz, George Camel, Dr. John Deloney, and Ken Coleman. And we'll be in Vegas, Orlando, Sacramento, Minneapolis, and San Antonio. At Building Wealth Live, you'll hear us tackle the latest trends and dive deep into investing, saving, and planning for retirement. I know that might sound super overwhelming, but it's way easier than you think. Plus, while you're there, we're going to be signing books and taking photos. Seats are just $25 a piece, or you get a four-pack of passes for only $60. Go to ramseysolutions.com slash events to get your seats before they're gone. That's

ramseysolutions.com slash events. Ken Coleman Ramsey personality is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Guys, if you're wondering whether to buy or sell a home this year, we've got some answers. You can expect the market to be a lot like last year. Prices are still on the rise. Interest rates are headed up, too. What does that mean for you? It means if you're buying a home, you might be up against some heavy competition, big price tags, and a higher interest rate. And that can mean mortgage payments that are higher.

So you need to stick to your budget. And if you want to sell your home, chances are you want to sell it quickly and you want to sell it for top dollar. Of course, that's going to depend on where you are. Every market's different. To win in any market, you really have to know what you're doing. And this is not amateur hour right now. You need a pro in your corner. You need an experienced real estate agent at your fingertips, and we have them through our endorsed local provider program. As Ramsey-trusted pros, they care about your values, and they help you keep more of your money in your pocket. So check out ramseysolutions.com slash agent.

Connect with a Ramsey-sey trusted real estate agent a pro that can help you navigate this local market that you are in ramseysolutions.com slash agent open phones at 888-825-5225 jacob is in toledo hi jacob welcome to the ramsey show hi guys how are you doing? Great, man. What's up? I've been a longtime listener, but I've never put your teachings into practice until finally this year I decided to get serious. And last year I financed a vehicle, and this year I was able to sell it and make a little bit of money back. I made about $2,500 after the lien

was paid off. And I was excited because I owe about $4,000 in credit cards, and I was excited to take a chunk out of it. And I feel like the Lord has put it on my heart to tithe it. I've kind of been tossing it back and forth with my wife exactly how much, if we should do the whole thing, if it's smart to do it at all. Because I know that we're still in a little bit of debt. I mean, we're not crazy in the debt, but we have a little bit of debt left to go. But I just feel like it's just really been weighing down on me that I should be giving this money that it doesn't really belong to me.

And I just don't want to be stupid. Giving what money? How much money? The $2,500 that I... The whole $2,500? Yes. Okay, that's not a tithe. Well...

A tithe is 10%. I know what you mean. A tithe is 10% of your profit. That's a tithe is 10% of your profit. That's a tithe. But if you're just saying you feel like the Holy Spirit's leading you to just give everything you made on this. Yes. Okay.

I never argue with God. If God is telling you to do something, do it, okay? I'm not ever going to do that. I can give you the biblical guidelines on tithing. We can talk through the technicalities of that, and we can pan back and say your heavenly father is crazy about you, and he doesn't need your money, and none of the giving should ever be done out of compulsion or guilt or toxic twisting or anything else.

All giving should be done out of an open hand and an understanding that I really just manage this for God anyway. What do you want me to do with it heavenly father it's your money anyway and so if father is saying give the 2500 then dude give the 2500 but your biblical guideline on tithing would be simply you 10 of the profit you made on the. The profit would be how much more you sold the car for than what you paid for it. What did you pay for it? Yeah, right. I would not say that I technically profited.

Okay, then there's not a tithe due. So we'll just change the language in this discussion, okay? Okay, yeah, I'm sorry. That's okay. No, that's okay no that's no that's okay i just want to make sure that we're clear i mean a tithe is a tenth of your profits a tenth of your increase from deuteronomy is the scripture okay so you don't have an increase on this car you have a decrease you lost money on the car in terms of what you bought it for what you sold it for versus what you bought it for but you got out of the debt and you ended up with some money in your pocket and you do feel

like god's telling you to give that money then if he's telling you that then give the money i'm okay with that okay yeah i just didn't want to be stupid anymore you know what i mean yeah i don't think it's stupid to follow if you think it's god now i always I always, I mean, I've been walking with God for 40 years, and so I'm always less so today than 40 years ago, but I'm never a thousand percent sure that I heard God on something that is different than Scripture says. Now, if there's a scriptural guideline, then that's simple for me. I'm going to do it, okay? That's an obedience issue for me from a faith walk, all right? But it's something like, okay, you just made this profit, and you're trying to get out of debt, or not profit, you made this net cash to your pocket, cash flow,

that you could throw at the debt, or you feel like God might be telling you to give it, then there's not really a biblical reference that says anything other than be obedient to the Holy Spirit. Now, what I was going to say, though, is I still wonder until I look back. Now, I can always look back and tell, but in the moment like you are, you're facing this, I still sometimes have a little bit of trouble discerning the difference between the Holy Spirit and last night's pizza. Indigestion. Okay. So, I mean, is this just guilt or is this something floating around because you're finally starting to get control?

I don't know any of that, but I never argue with someone. When someone plays the God card, I back up and go do whatever he said. Yeah. Jacob, I just want to ask you, did you see something, experience something, and you felt a tug on your heart and you go, I could do something there. I feel like I something, experience something, and you felt a tug on your heart? You go, I could do something there. I feel like I want to do something. Is there something specific on this?

I just felt like I don't really like explaining it to people just because some people believe it, some people don't. And that's fine. But I just felt like the Lord, I felt like someone was telling me that it belonged to him. Got it. Very good. Okay. I believe you.

I do, too. Now, I will tell you this. It does belong to him. Yeah, that's right. All of it belongs to him. It belonged to him. That car belonged to him before you sold it. Agreed?

Right. So this is just a matter, but you're saying you feel like you want to transfer it into a ministry somewhere, and you feel like that's the guidance that the Holy Spirit's giving you. I'm not going to dispute that. I'm really not. That's a fine thing to do if you want to do that. And you're never going to look back and regret doing it. You're never going to go, oh, that was the dumbest thing i ever did in my life i've never said that about generosity now i have given into some situations where i didn't look into it well or something like that and i look back and i go well probably should have been

more careful with that generosity i'm not sure i was wise with it in terms of who i gave it to or how i gave it or something like that but i've never regretted the actual act of giving. Never once. Or obedience. Or the act of following what I feel like is God's voice. Okay? Right. I understand.

The more you pray about that and the more you get a peace about you did hear God's voice on this, then the more you need to just do it but it's not a finance it's not a biblical financial principle and it's not you know something that i can tell you 100 this is other than my sheep know my voice follow the shepherd right right so have at it brother you're a good man you got a tender good heart and you're gonna do well you can never mess up being generous well you can't but i mean it's you very seldom regret it you never look back at the end of your life and go man i just gave too much people never say that it never comes up they do say things like i really didn't need some of those things i bought they do say things like that but the idea that um we're going to give that and i gotta tell you when you

got four thousand dollars in credit card debt and you get twenty five hundred dollars in your hand and you're willing to release it that says something about your spiritual walk absolutely does positive yeah very positive very positive and you know, I would say make this count, you know, in the sense of, you know, this is an investment. You've been asked to give, so give it wisely. If there's nothing specific that you've been led to, then really do your homework and invest this wisely because it's going to come back in multiple ways. But also, Jacob, probably what you're learning through this whole process is to remember 100% of it is God's. And then he gives us guidelines on how to manage his money for him. One of those guidelines is take care of your own household first, or you're worse than an unbeliever.

That's a scriptural guideline. This is The Ramsey Show. show. In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions, Jeremy and Ashley are on the debt-free stage. Congratulations, guys. Where are you all from? New Philadelphia, Ohio. Cool. Good to have you. Welcome to Nashville.

How much debt have you paid off? $241,600. Good for you guys. And how long did that take? Five years and six months. Wow. And your range of income during that time? It stayed pretty consistent around $100,000.

We had a couple medical events in there and a job change. Cool. What do you all do for a living? I am a local truck driver. I'm an insurance sales agent. Very good. Good for you guys. Fun fun so what kind of debt is this 242 000 three cars a lawnmower our deck a 401k loan and our house oh there goes the house

look at the weird people and the lawnmower yeah way to guys. We need to upgrade to the tractor now. There we go. I love it. I love it. Not a debt in the world. Congratulations. Thanks. Fabulously done. So how old are you two? I am 36. I'm 34.

This is the 30-year-old debt-free house and everything show today. Yes. Wow. 36 and 34. Very cool. Five years and six months, you've been pounding at this whole process as an insurance agent and a truck driver. Very, very well done. What's the house worth?

About $380,000 right now. Very cool. How much in your retirement accounts? A little over $100,000. Good for you. All right. So you're up over a half a million total, give or take, and heading towards a million dollars, getting ready to be Baby Steps millionaires. Look at you guys.

I'm so proud of you. 34, 36 years old. You're kicking it. Well done. All right. So what happened five years ago? Because y'all are weird. We are weird.

So about five years ago, I worked for a small manufacturing company, and the president of that company takes the growth of his employees very seriously, both personally and professionally. So he shuts down the plant like six to eight times every year, and we have just small group discussions about everything you can imagine from leadership to life to even finances. Wow. So one day in 2016, the end of 2016, the topic of the day was a guy named Dave Ramsey and his seven step process to financial freedom. So I left the meeting a little intrigued, but didn't really bounce on anything until a couple of days later, the HR lady actually sent out a mass email to everybody saying that she had a copy of your book and if anybody wanted to borrow it so of course i jumped all over that borrowed it and within i don't know two weeks you guys had me like hook line and sinker wow this is intriguing so how big a manufacturing

plant is that uh it's about 100 people okay so he just shut it down had a little discussions periodically to help his his men and women there do better right it's they're in our great leadership slow times but yeah about eight times a year i got a follow-up on that do you guys have low turnover yes now that now let me tell you something that that right there dave is the example of investing in your people manufacturing is a high turnover business and you have low turnover how much of it where it used to work he didn't work there i know but my point is is that low turnover that's a big big takeaway there investment in people they don't want to leave good for you man that's great wow so uh that's fun and and they you know go by pick

up the book the linda linda library thing here and two weeks later uh so actually jeremy's uh getting indoctrinated at work um what were you what were you saying at home i just pretty much thought he was crazy and i was like do what you want i'll do what i want it's fine and then he made me sit down and do a budget sheet of every little penny we spent for a few months and that's when i realized what we were spending and where we were spending it and that it was really time to make some changes oh wake up call yes okay yeah that's kind of revealing a little shame inducing but uh it's our conviction i guess is better than shame you get convicted when you look and you go where's all our money going look at this i know why we don't have any retirement we're eating it we eat out

every night yeah that was what people that's what happens when you look at this stuff pretty cool guys and so game on after that huh for sure all right and what did you do following that you get on a budget and you start following the baby steps yep and we pretty much stayed gazelle intense the whole time uh even after baby step two and we paid off all the debt um we just kept throwing everything we could at the mortgage like that was the end goal we didn't feel debt free until the mortgage was out from under us because when we signed the mortgage paper the paperwork we felt like we was never going to pay it off it was a hundred and we ended up borrowing about two hundred thousand dollars on the house and it just felt like it was you know an insurpassable mountain

something we would never you know never climb felt like you'd signed your life away right exactly literally yes but then you say no i'm taking my life back correct way to go guys very very cool congratulations thank you what do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is now that you've done it i would say the key would be to make your budget, follow your budget. There was many times we wanted to go do something, but it wasn't in our budget, or we didn't have the cash flow for it, or we told friends and family we couldn't go out to eat that month because we already spent our monthly budget. And just sticking to the budget, it really does work.

I've got a question about the momentum part of this journey i mean this is a long time five years six months that's a journey is there a point where you hit kind of okay uh we we feel like we're on the downhill slope here we've got this despite challenges budget issues saying no was there a moment of great momentum that you remember probably like 2020 like right when covid hit um we didn't slow down we got busier and made more you know was making more money and the government kind of helped with a little bit i guess and uh it just made the process easier and it was like look if we dial everything in right now we can have this paid off by we you know 2022 wow and we literally just paid it off what what, a week and a half ago?

Yes. Wow. We don't have the first check yet, but we are done. I love it. That is awesome. Man. So how's it feel to be 100% free? Amazing.

Free. I don't know that it's hit me yet. Like, I still, I don't know. I just, I mowed the grass the other day, and it felt a little different, but. Well, think about that new budget you get to do. Right. Coming up. First tractor.

Oh. They got the money spent already, so there's. There we go. Yes. The kids. Didn't take long. No. Didn't take long to adjust to the newfound prosperity.

Are you getting a zero turn? No, I have a Steiner right now. Oh, okay. All right. All right. Here we go. Game on. We're talking tractor now.

Well done, you guys. Very, very well done. Who were your biggest cheerleaders outside you guys? I would say his cousins. We're pretty private people in life, so not many people know our financial situation or what we're doing. But his cousins also follow Dave Ramsey, so they were definitely on our journey with us. We were very open with them. We went out to dinner with them a lot. They would never let us even pay for our dinner because they said, take that money and put it on your house.

There you go. That's awesome. So priority number one is paying for their meal yeah that's cool we're taking you to dinner tonight right yeah because we now can this is awesome well live like no one else later you can live and buy your cousin's dinner i was gonna say eat like no one else there you go it's kind of nice i'm going with that one going with that sticking to it. Way to go, guys. All right, bring the kiddos up.

What are their names and ages? We have Easton. He's seven. This is Carson. He's 11. Riley's 13. Jace is eight. And Ryland is 12.

All right. Very cool. Well done, guys. Very well done. You changed your family tree. We've got a copy of Baby Steps Millionaires for you. That's the next chapter in your story. You are well on your way.

Probably by the time you're 40 or so, you're going to be there at this current rate. Well done. Very well done. And also a copy of Total Money Makeover. Maybe you can loan it to somebody at work. You never know how that's going to turn out. Look what happened to you. So good stuff.

All right. at work you never know how that's going to turn out look what happened to you so good stuff all right jeremy and ashley and the gang 242 000 paid off house and everything five years and six months later making 100k count it down let's hear a debt-free scream all right three two one we're Three, two, one. We're debt free! Yeah! I love it! Alright, Jeremy, you've got to call your old boss. Tell him you paid off your house because of what he did at that plant. That's good stuff.

This is The Ramsey Show. Our scripture of the day, Psalm 147, 4 and 5. He determines the number of stars and calls them by name. Great is our Lord and mighty in power. His understanding has no limit.iver wendell holmes said the young man knows the rules but the old man knows the exceptions that's deep it's so true that would be true ken coleman dr john deloney george camel rachel cruz and i are doing a well a building wealth event tomorrow evening th Thursday evening in Las Vegas. If you want to come, there are still a few tickets left.

We've sold almost 3,000 tickets for the event. Wow. We would love to have you. I just got an update a minute ago. It's 2,625 tickets sold so far. And so there's still some tickets available. You still can come. We would love to have you in Las Vegas.

May the 5th, for those of you listening to this at another time, Thursday night is going to be the event. And they're at Central Church. And just jump online at ramseysolutions.com slash events, and you can pick up your tickets. They're only $25. You can get a four-pack, and you and your spouse can bring some friends for only 60 dollars and you get these people you've been trying to talk into this stuff uh this is a good uh way of learning because we're going to be talking about a lot of the things happening in the culture right now ken and dr deloney are going to be doing a breakout ahead of time and a kickoff thing and then we'll be

doing the major event with all of us and be signing books and pictures and everything afterwards um it is a full-on ramsey ramsey personalities event of course i'll be there in the midst of all of it as well so make sure you're coming out las vegas may the 5th tomorrow night thursday night still some tickets again only 25 dollars and there's still some left about 3 000 folks going to be there so by the way that means if you've got a ticket you should get there pretty early because you know it takes a little while move 3 000 people and there's still some left. About 3,000 folks are going to be there. By the way, that means if you've got a ticket, you should get there pretty early because it takes a little while to move 3,000 people in and out of a building.

It's not an instantaneous process. If you thought, oh, it's just Dave and Ken. I'm going to go hang out with them. Well, yeah, it takes a little bit. So give yourself a little margin. It's a Thursday night, work night, school night. So give yourself a little margin and make sure you get over there. It's a Thursday night, work night, school night, so give yourself a little margin and make sure you get over there. It's going to be fun,

Ken. I'm so glad to be back out on the road. It's one of the really the key tenets of what we do at Ramsey Solutions in meeting people where they are and getting out on the road. Of course, we just all missed it. We missed the energy. Our events are always a lot of fun. We like people. We do. It's not good that

man be alone. No. And there's something special about a room, Dave, where people are there to get better, whatever the topic. Yeah. And these are people that are intentional that come to these events. I can tell you times I have sat in an audience in various sales conferences, seminars of different kinds, church, where I'm sitting in the audience and something done and said from stage, and I'm in proximity to thousands of other humans,

and it feels like right that moment that something happened, and that turned the trajectory of my life. Yeah, it's going to be fun. Can't wait. Come on out, and we're just getting started. We've got more events coming. We've got a full fall slate, too. So Orlando, May 19th as well, coming to Orlando.

Yeah, two weeks we'll be in Orlando. So go ahead and get those tickets. And we've got about the same number of tickets sold there as well. So good stuff. All right, Bob is in Eugene, Oregon. Hey, Bob, how are you? Hello. How are you doing?

Better than I deserve. What's up? So I'm an electrical contractor, and I'm new. I've been doing it for 18 years, but I've been in business for three. And I'd like to branch out, but I don't know exactly how much money I should have in reserve to hire an employee. I'm kind of sketchy on the work, too. I mean, I've got two weeks booked out to three months. It varies as the time goes on.

And I just, what's the good amount of money I should have set aside to hire and employ? Okay. Are you running a profit and loss statement on your business? Yeah. Okay. How much profit do you make a month? Oh, we're not the most thorough. I can tell you at the end of the year what my profit is.

Okay. You need to start doing one monthly. Okay. Because that'll give you what you're really making on the business that month. And then the same time next year, you'll look and say, okay, I'm doing better or worse than last year. And that kind of thing.

It starts to give you some measures in the business to know where you're going and how you're doing it. So what did you pay taxes on last year? $100,000. Way to go. Good for you. What does it cost to hire someone? For base, for a journeyman in our area, about $60,000.

Okay. All right. And so if you add no revenue to your company as a result of hiring him, you'll make $40,000. Yeah. Okay. But he gets paid. Can you do that? Yeah.

You think you're going to get some more work, right? Yeah. Okay. I'm hoping to get an employee so then I can push for going to try and fetch more to work instead of doing the whole rigmarole but you've the net result has to be that the company takes in more than sixty thousand dollars more than it used to right yeah that's the scary part for me and you kind of you kind of got to figure that out okay i'm making this per job and this is what you know how many jobs can i add if i'm doing some he's

doing some and i'm out there you know snagging new work and you're figuring that out because all of that factors into how much you should have set aside because if you can bring in enough to pay for him from day one then obviously you would not need to set aside anything. But if it's going to take you three months to get ramped up once they come on board, then you need $15,000 because that's three months of $60,000 a year or $5,000 a month. Okay. Kind of look at that. So, you know, it'd be a good idea to have an extra $10,000 laying around. The economy also.

Well, the status of the world has me. I'm a little bit too paranoid on that. I probably shouldn't be. Well, yeah, let me speak to that for a second, Bob, because I don't know if you know this or not. I'm sure you do. But we saw the trades explode in 2020 and 2021. And in 2020, we thought the world was coming to an end nobody knew what the economy

was going to do and the trades never missed a beat it turned out you were essential yeah so yeah so i i appreciate a healthy amount of caution but i i would uh guard against fear yeah yeah i i think you give it a shot dude and you just be honest with the guy that's coming in go i never done this before i'm a little bit scared but think I've got a lot of work here. And if you want to try this together with me, let's do it. And that's how I hired my first person. I told him the truth. Marisa is with us in Phoenix.

Hi, Marisa. What's up? Hi. I'm grateful to be here. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. How can we help? I am engaged and um something that i'd like before the wedding is for my fiance to get out

a credit card debt good what's he make just recent uh makes about a hundred thousand a year how much is his credit card debt 35 000 has he got any money a little bit of an emergency savings. How much? A thousand dollars. Okay. You got baby step one. Okay.

And when are you planning on getting married? No date set because it's important to me that we can tackle this credit card debt. Now, we don't tackle credit card debt when we aren't married. He tackles credit card debt no we don't tackle credit card debt when we aren't married he tackles credit card debt yes you don't pay his debt until you're married he pays it got it that's clear yeah that that's going to create a strain on the relationship and a major mess in the event of a breakup and no you don't want to do any of that it's not good for anybody involved so now and i i you can do what you want to do.

We at Ramsey don't tell people to avoid marriage because of debt. We do tell people to avoid marriage because someone doesn't want to deal with their debt. But if your fiancé is plowing into this and is aggressively attacking it, using the debt snowball, living on a budget, being careful, being wise, being frugal, and hitting this debt hard, and he's knocked off $10,000 of the $30,000, and you can see that he's well on his way and he's a changed man and the credit cards are cut up, then I wouldn't, if you were my daughter, I would tell you to marry him.

And that's what we're working towards, but he recently talked to me about him taking out a personal loan or some options in consolidating his credit card debt which leads me to calling you because he finally gave me that green light where he's he's ready to move forward so you don't need to consolidate anything you just need to pay it it makes a hundred thousand dollars a year he can pay it really, really fast. He hasn't got any expenses except you right now. And you could be determined

to not be an expense starting Ready, Set, Go. Yeah. What we need to do is we'll get you guys into Financial Peace University. Hold on, Kelly. I'll sign you guys up. We'll give it to you as an advanced wedding gift. And you guys go through it and start talking about it. But he pays his own debt

and he starts on it immediately and we don't borrow our way out of debt with consolidation that puts us our the ramsey show in the books we'll be back with you before you know it in the meantime remember there's ultimately only one way to financial peace and that's to walk daily with the prince of peace christ jesus the ramsey show is one of the most popular podcasts in the world get your daily dose of advice on life and money. Check out all of our shows from The Ramsey Network wherever you listen to podcasts.