The Ramsey Show - App - We’re Not on the Same Page and Considering Divorce (Hour 2)

Episode Date: February 6, 2023

Dave Ramsey & Jade Warshaw answer your questions and discuss:   "We're in a financial mess, what can we do?", Gilbert & Michelle pay off $113,417 in 39 months! "My wife has $24K in debt that I didn't know about". Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6 Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the pods of Moving and Storage Studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Jade Warshaw, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today as we answer your questions about your life and your money. Natasha is in Atlanta. Hi, Natasha, how are you? Hi, good, and you guys?

Better than we deserve. What's up in your world? Well, my world has been upside down for the last seven years. Me and my husband have been very good managing money. I believe we both make good money. My husband works in the film industry, and we end up moving to Atlanta, so he has a stable job here and income. And I am a teacher, so we make around $80,000 and sometimes it could be all the way to $100 yearly. But it has been a roller coaster

for us to be on the same page. And finally, we found your program and we're trying to make the right choices. This next two months, we're going to be like negative zero. We're just going to pay all our, you know, regular utilities and our payments are pretty high. So we're trying to figure it out right now if we have to get rid of one of our cars, even though our cars don't pay as much. We have one car is $560 a month. The other is $400 a month, monthly. But we just don't know where to start right now. I'm going to do like a garage sale to make the $1,000 to start for our savings. We have zero savings.

We're just a mess. And we need to know how can we start something. Are you guys doing a budget? Well, that's the first thing we started. But right now the budget is ideally, but we have so much things that are like overdue payments that, you know, we're not going to even have enough money for the budget. We're going to have to catch up the next two months just doing payments and just doing payments. Well, I think that you're a little bit confused about how the budget is working. So what you're going to do, so what do you bring home every month around $4,000?

I bring $2,800 and my husband brings $6,000. Oh, $6,000. Oh, okay, great. So you're going to plug that into your budget. How do you do your budget now? Is it a spreadsheet? What are you using to create your budget every month? I just have a, it's not really a spreadsheet. It's just, you know, a chart that I created. And we have $8,400 for $100 as income. Okay. $8,400. And ourgo is 8180 okay well let's start with what your outgo actually is so you're gonna start with 8400 and you're just gonna go down the line and you're gonna spend all of that money so you're gonna start with your expenses and go through making sure that you're making minimum payments on everything not just your you, the expenses that you do every month, like groceries and things like that, but also your debt.

And just to keep everything current. I know that you said that you're behind on some stuff, but start out by making minimum payments. And once you've done that, I think you're going to find that there are things that you're spending money on that you don't actually need to spend money on because you guys have a great income. What kind of debt do you have, hon? Well, we have the two car loans. Car number one that you owe $400 a month on, what's the balance on it? Okay, that is $25,000. Okay, the one that's $160,000, what's the balance on it?

No, that was $465,000. So the $560,000 is $160,000, what's the balance on it? No, that was $465,000. So the $560,000 is $25,000, and the $400,000 is $12,000. Okay. All right. And what are your other debts? The student loans. How much? It's around $20,000.

Okay. What else? We also have medical bills, and they are already affected our credit scores and how much i don't i don't know the number for that i think it's roughly around fifteen thousand dollars and you're paying monthly on these we're not okay so you're not paying anything on it you're not paying anything on that at all okay what else um well that's it like i don't what's your house payment we paid we don't own we rent what's your rent two thousand a month two thousand a month okay yeah all right what are you behind on

right now we own three months of the, and we also laid one month on rent. Okay. So what that tells me is that you all are out of control on your spending because you have enough to pay these bills. I don't even know where you're getting to $8,400. I can't get there. You're not paying anything on these medical. You've got $2,000, plus two thousand plus you got food lights and water

and then you got a thousand sixty and or no you got 960 in credit card debt or in car payments student loans on hold with biden yeah you're not paying anything on it you're not working a budget i think you're just guessing at the numbers every month and if you're not on a budget. I think you're just guessing at the numbers every month. And if you're not on a budget, you guys are spending like crazy, and then you're not prioritizing the things that you actually need to spend on. Who's the spender, you or him? This is what has been happening. Like, I try to, or I'll still stick on a budget. Who's the spender, you or him?

I think both. I think we're both very bad spending and why does it say on my screen you're considering a divorce yeah why does it say on my screen you're considering a divorce you haven't brought that up in our conversation i did um sometimes the only escape that I feel I have from this situation is, you know, only my own responsibility. Well, that would be if it's his fault. But you didn't just now say it was his fault. You said it was both your fault.

But it's hard for both of us to be on the same page. It's just hard. For now, I explained to him that we need to close our personal accounts, and one of the things that you guys recommended is for those to have one account together. And he's like, okay, we can open one account, but we will still keep separate accounts at the same time. I feel he doesn't trust. Separate accounts aren't your problem.

Your problem is you spend like you're in Congress. Somewhere between the two of you. I'm sorry, what do you say last I said you spend out of control no number of accounts will stop that having a singular account is not going to fix that getting rid of him is not going to fix it if you're the problem

so what we've got to do is you guys are going to have to lay out a game plan that the two of you agree to. And you guys are getting ready to head into bankruptcy because you're going to get evicted and repoed. You're not but one car payment away from getting into repo land. And you're about half a mortgage or half a rent payment from being evicted if you're my tenant. Because I don't fool around with people not paying their rent so uh you guys got to get this stuff together so here's what i'm going to do i'm going to put you on hold and we're going to hook you up with one of our coaches and they're going to sit down with the two of you free and i'm going to pay for you to go through financial peace university and

hopefully that'll save your marriage but the two of you it's time for y'all to look in the mirror and go, enough. Because the numbers you gave us, honey, you got to sell these cars. They're both ridiculous, number one. But number two, you actually could pay these payments with the income you've got. It's doable. But you didn't even choose to pay your rent. Instead, you chose to go party somewhere. I don't know where your freaking money's going. Hold on, we'll help you. and choose to pay your rent. Instead, you chose to go party somewhere.

I don't know where your freaking money's going. Hold on, we'll help you. thank you for joining us america jade Warshaw-Ramsey, personalities, my co-host. Well, taxes suck. Taxes are confusing. Taxes make me angry. But grown-ups have to deal with them. Anyway, so confusing, angry, suck. Yeah, all these things are anyway. So confusing, angry suck. Yeah. All these things are true.

So you got to get some help with this. If you've got a complicated return, I don't trust just anybody with your taxes. You need a real tax expert with, you know, that, that didn't just start doing this two weeks ago. Okay.

Which means they barely, if maybe don't know more than you know which is nothing hey that's kind of me i know a little bit about taxes but i'll guarantee you my stuff is so complicated i don't do it i can promise you freaking size of a phone book when i'm done with it it's ridiculous and float a small country with a crap you know so you got to get somebody in your corner if you got a complicated return go to Ramsey solutions dot com slash tax pro. You can get one of the Ramsey trusted tax pros and we'll connect you to them. Doesn't cost anything to connect you.

And then you interview them and figure out if you feel like they got their act together. We interviewed them and we think they got their act together. Otherwise, they wouldn't be Ramsey trusted. Thus the name. So check it out. Get some help in your corner. Ramsey solutions dot, thus the name. So check it out. Get some help in your corner, ramsaysolutions.com slash taxpro. All right, Jade, our last caller. We didn't have time to do a full counseling session for money on the air.

Let me help you guys if you're out there facing that, because I feel like we didn't address the key issue that would be a great learning for everyone else. If you are behind on your payments, behind on your bills, how do you do a budget? Okay. Well, the first thing you do is you have to force rank prioritize. You have to prioritize your dollars. And that means we're going to take care of what we used to learn, and they no longer teach it in the eighth grade, called civics,

the difference in necessities and luxuries. Ninety-eight percent of what everybody spends money on in America is a freaking luxury. So let me help you with what an actual necessity is. Food. There's one. No, eating out is not a necessity some of you people all you know how to make is reservations and you got to work on that okay so food at home cheap that you bought at the grocery store with a coupon food is a necessity. Utilities, lights and water so you have heat and cool.

Utilities is number two. Cable is not a utility. Cable is not a utility. Thank you. Hulu is not on your list. Oh, Netflix is not a necessity, Tiger King. Let me help you. Okay.

I just had to put that out there. Just helping you with your little increase there to $12.95. Okay. I've got it all, increase there to $12.95. Okay. Transportation. I've got it all, but I'm not broke, okay? So I've got Hulu and Netflix. So I'll just give them a little add there, but they're not a necessity. You can live without them.

Promise you. Now, once you've gotten food and utilities where belly's full and we're warm, number three is shelter so you take care of your place to live so you're not homeless you pay your rent now almost everyone can scratch around and make enough money to buy their food keep their electricity current if they're first second and third and keep your rent paid right the only way you get behind on rent which our last caller was is if you are completely discombobulated screwed up and you're spending crazy money on something else you'd have to be it's the only way because otherwise you go okay

i'm gonna go out to eat but i'm gonna get evicted that's called insanity i mean stupid right yeah you know we're going on this trip but we're going to get evicted well that that's i mean what are your parents cousins really i mean seriously no one does that but people do it all the time because when we get all stressed out we don't force rank priorities and if you'll just get real calm cool and collected and go we're going to eat before we do anything not eat out we're going to pay the utilities not cable before we do anything we're going to pay rent and when you do those three things you got a lot of money most of you and left over after those three things then the next one's transportation yeah now that this is the one that gets people dave yeah well they had 960 in car payment they did so we're gonna fix their

transportation problem because we're gonna sell that crap tomorrow okay if you can't pay the car payment hello there's a signal here god is saying sell the car it wasn't even dave god said it and you know how i know he said that the blessings of the lord have no sorrow added to them that's right he said that in the psalms and if you have sorrow added to something it's not from god and this lady has sorrow they're about to have their cars repoed and she's thinking about divorce and she's thinking about divorce because they're going to pay their car payments so these cars need to go in the meantime you actually have eight thousand dollars a month coming in how almost nine thousand dollars a month coming in how do you not pay one thousand dollars worth of car and two thousand dollars

worth of rent that's only three thousand dollars five thousand dollars left over after that how are you behind on those because you didn't have them prioritized that's what it tells me right okay after 30 years of doing this i have great insight But how are you behind on those? Because you didn't have them prioritized. That's what it tells me. Right. Okay. After 30 years of doing this, I have great insight. These are things that you need to build into your daily way of life. Your budget is something that is not something that you make once a year and you come back to it when things are bad. You do your budget every single month before the month begins.

You create that plan you spend every dollar on paper or digital paper every month before it begins so you have a plan so you can see what are the areas that need attention maybe you do need to get your income up that's not really the case in her situation wouldn't hurt she's got a spin they've got a spending problem and maybe you'll start to see that as you put your budget together but let's just pretend for a second okay she said she's three car payments or two car payments yes yeah okay so what's it take to get current and pay this month two thousand dollars she could do that this month and what's it take if she's a one month behind on rent yeah

what's it take to get current on that another two thousand yeah it's four thousand bucks yeah so you could be 100 current on the things that matter in one month that's right and you're not gonna do anything else you're not gonna do anything else something else might get behind well and if something like if you got master card laying there they can jump in a creek we get we we don't get evicted and we don't pay master card if we got choose. When you like the taste of steak at a restaurant more than you like the feeling of paying your bills on time, you got a problem. Hello. You would rather sit, wine and dine yourself.

You would rather go on trips that you can't afford than just have the peace of paying your bills on time and sleeping at night. Yeah. But here's the thing. If you're behind like that, you said early in the conversation, how do you, you're doing the budget wrong. What you need to do

is you need to spend this month's $8,600 on this month's problems. And until you clear food, utilities, housing, and transportation and get them all current, you don't spend anything else on anything i don't

care if somebody doesn't like it oh and you need to stop your stupid 401k withholding you're over making investments while you're paying a thousand dollars in car payments okay so that this is what's going on in that house yeah i'm not fussing at her. I'm just saying mathematically, this is so easy for some of you to turn around within one month or two months. You could be 100% current on the things that matter. Because here's the thing. You emotionally, Dr. John Deloney could do a whole clinic on this. You're emotionally completely shut down in crisis mode, trauma mode.

Yeah. on this you're emotionally completely shut down in crisis mode trauma mode yeah your brain your fit your critical thinking skills shut down when you are in threat of being hungry homeless and have your lights cut off and your cars repoed these are the necessities of life yeah to have you know food shelter clothing transportation and utilities clothing we don't need to worry about you know you got clothing okay shut up there's 73 pairs of shoes in there shut up you don't need clothing good lord the money we i mean we've got enough clothing last okay yeah so um i mean if you're trying to make a fashion statement you're getting evicted you got other issues right well you got to grow up dave and i can say oh there's i can say that because i've been there i've had to look in the mirror and go jade you're

acting like a child. You're buying clothes. You're going out to eat and you cannot pay your bills. You've got to change. You've got to do what you're doing differently. Doing things the same way and expecting the same result. That's insanity. So.

And I was an insane child. Take care of the four walls first. That's not insanity. It's the opposite. Food, shelter, clothing, transportation and utilities. Get current on them before you worry about anything else. Everyone else can jump in the creek until that's done.

Yep. jade washall ramsey personality is my co-host in the lobby of ramsey solutions on the debt-free stage gilbert and michelle are with us hey guys welcome hi good to have you where do you guys live tucson arizona oh great place well welcome to nashville good to have you. All the way up here to do a debt-free scream. How much have you paid off? $113,417. Way to go. And how long did this take you? 39 months. Good for you.

And your range of income during that time? We always hovered around $165,000, $170,000 between there. Okay, cool. What do you all do for a living? So I'm in sales, and then I also have a part-time counseling job on the side. I'm a 1099 through a psychiatry office. Great. And I do IT consulting in Tucson.

Great. Very cool. What kind of debt was your $113,400? It was our house. Whoa! Looking at weird people. I love it. Way to go, you weirdos. What's this house worth? What's it worth? I think around 300 now

we're not quite sure yeah it's paid for yeah i love it man how old are you two i'm 43 i'm 44 and you're a paid for house paid for house that's so weird yeah it's awesome it's really settled in on you how unusual you are seriously uh i mean very few 44 year olds have a paid for house every day kind of settles in a little bit more like when i open up the door to do laundry it's all of a sudden like oh my gosh i my we own our house nobody can take this from us man that's so cool yeah let's see it build because we took a yardstick and numbered it so that way we could track it and every night when we ate dinner together we could see where that was at and it was there every night showing where we were at and also where we were going sometimes that felt like forever yeah and other times where we put

large amounts we're like whoa look how far that just went and so you could really see it with the yardstick that we had a little bit like parenting the days are short the days are long and the years are short yeah that's a good analogy so were you with us before the home payoff journey in the debt-free journey as well yeah so uh when i first met gilbert i was in grad school uh racking up student loans and i had a card loan and he was 100 debt-free, house paid for. And even in that time, he actually bought another property cash. And so he was kind of my first like, how does this happen? And I did think at that time, like this, well, he can do it, but I don't know how I'm going to do it. And then I graduated and I knew I'd take a pay cut. But as I was getting job offers at counseling therapy offices and everything I looked at the numbers I'm like I can't eat I have all this student loan and now I can't eat and I said we

were doing numbers at the tables and I sat there and I cried and I cried and so that's when I started realizing I I'll pay off my car loan that will be the very first thing and it gave me my first like win as you say and then after that I was like what if I didn't have my school loan what would that feel like and I remember I had a classmate she had this like little strange envelope system and I kind of started googling like how to get out of debt and of course you came up and from that moment on it was definitely a spiritual thing because I sat on my couch and I read it and I was like why not why can't I do it and then from that moment on I just went forward and I think it was 24 months almost to the exact day of paying off a little over

$80,000. It's just student loan debt that she did yeah I'm so proud of her. Amen and then how long have y'all been married? March will be four years. Okay so after you get married then we look at the house and we go we're doing this in 39 months. Ding, ding. Yeah. So we knew we wanted to pay it off fast. And we were kind of building a plan and getting a little bit aggressive. And then 2020, we're like, okay, we're going to really go at it. And then obviously the pandemic happens. And I get furloughed for almost three months from there.

And of course, at that time, you're like, I don't know if I'm going to have a job when I go back. I mean, we rode that out really nicely because we were out of debt. But we thought, what if this house wasn't here? How much better would that be? And from that moment on, I went back to work and we just went gung-ho from there.

We stayed gazelle in tents. I know that's not necessarily the plan to have to, but we wanted to stay that just because we knew how much freedom that would give us. Amen. Yeah. So the last 12 months is i think we paid off around 75 000 oh most of it most of it was in the last yeah yeah we sold once you can see the finish line it's weird you just you get geared up yeah yeah we ended up selling one of his stocks and then we had a little bit over in our savings and then we took my car fund i think it was like the last month we're like let's just do it let's get rid of it so who supported you in this process

or who thought you were crazy well it's either one of the two well Gilbert was definitely my biggest fan I guess you could say throughout the process and he really supported me and um friends and family were there they're like okay cool okay, cool. That's great. You know, even had some friends like, good for you, but that's just not for me. But they don't have a paid off house. No, no, no. Yeah. Way to go, you guys. So, yeah, we met later on in our life for us.

And so, my story a little bit for my journey happened well before then in my early 20s. And part of my story is a little bit similar to yours, Dave, where I had lots of real estate, but I kind of went about it in the wrong way with large amounts of debt. And then in 08 happened, in 09 happened, and I was able to get out from some of that, but not all of it. But it was just enough to still bury me in that. But I learned so much from that. And from that on, I was never again. And so I rebuilt from the ground up, but from then on I paid cash for my house and it was a small house. I went from a nice custom home. It's called the Oro Valley area next to Tucson. I got rid of that. And I went to a little two bedroom townhouse just because I'm like, I'm never going back to debt. And so even though it was my primary home and I was affording it,

I knew if I just sold that and I started from scratch from then on, it was just going to set me in a good spot. And I did that and I was able to build some wealth in some of that time on my own before we had met in some of that. And so it was a spot when we met, you know, you hear some people of like, well, on the relationship side, would you take on someone and meet someone in debt and any of that? But I knew who she was as a person. She was working it. Yeah, she was who she was as a person, and she was someone worth going through that experience with,

even though I had gotten out of it and we weren't married yet. I didn't partake in that, and it was her win. She ended up winning herself and fighting through that to get out of her student loan debts amen well done with the house paid off now i think that that did throw us into the baby steps millionaires from there i love to hear it not only do you have a paid for house at 44 but your baby steps millionaires yeah i love it i love it wow way to go y'all thank you how's it feel to be free oh sometimes words can't even say it yeah one of the things that was just before we're still working and we saw like what was happening with student loans and a bunch of them were getting

forgiven there was frustration at the table one night from that and like we worked so hard for that and it's just gonna get written off but it was like but look who it made us like you can't just give you be given that you have to work through that and become that yeah and that changed our perspective on that then no amount of money can actually build those characteristics yeah it's who are you becoming and so for me to live in a country where there's freedom but to my biblical basis it means for me to, the debt is slave to the lender. And once I really put that principle in my life, I'm like, I want to live a free life. That means I have to stay out of debt. And I encourage anyone else, even if you're just playing with it,

you feel like you're just managing it because you make a large amount of money. I hear a lot of people that make a lot, but they just manage it. That is one of the big differences between doing stuff Ramsey and just doing financial stuff, because we're so into you and who you are, the relationships, we're into the character, into that whole process, as much as we are, here's the tactics for getting out of debt, that what we end up doing, and it's almost unintentional, but it's also a necessary part of the journey if it's going to be permanent, is we're not only leading you to get out of debt. We're helping you transform to become something different in the process. That happens so often in that process. Be not conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. It's not merely paying off debt. It's a complete metamorphosis, a complete transformation.

You guys are incredible. I'm so proud of you. Thank you. Hey, we've got the live and give bundle for you. It's the Total Money Makeover book, the Baby Steps Millionaires book, and the Financial Peace University membership. Way to go. Gilbert and Michelle, house and everything, 44 years old, Tucson, Arizona,

$113,000 paid off in 39 months, making 165. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Yeah! Woo-hoo! Woo!

Woo! Man, that is awesome. This is the Ramsey personality, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Sam's with us in Lansing, Michigan. Hey, Sam, welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, how are you guys today? Great. How can we help?

So, my wife informed me a couple weeks ago that she was $23,000, $24,000 in credit card debt without me knowing over the course of the last year. And I was wondering what would be the best way to pay it off. We have a couple options. I got lucky. Rather be lucky than good. I won $36,000 at the casino. But that money, I earned about a month ago, and I already had that money tied up in money market because I'm using that to put the down payment on my next home.

Um, we could cash in her 401k, which has $25,000 in it and pay it off. Or do we just, um, kind of suck it up and just make the payments and just pay it down month by month. Um, I just wonder what the best option would be to avoid the interest payments and everything like that. You realize the interest payments aren't the real problem in your house, right? How long have you been married? How long have you been married?

We have been married for a year and a half now. Okay. And how long has she had this debt? A year. It started basically when my son was born a little bit over a year ago. And it was just online ordering, stuff like that, three different credit cards, going shopping kind of thing. And I never really noticed that we have separate finances. And I never really noticed it because have separate finances and i never really noticed

it because we don't have any debt you know other than our house we don't we don't owe anything so how's that working for you oh it was working fantastic up until a couple weeks ago don't think it is do you no not been work it's not been working for some time like ever in your married life it just was revealed it was just revealed a couple weeks ago. Correct. Yeah, you all are not on the same page. Not at all. Also, she's spending as a coping mechanism.

There's something that she's trying to cope with, and she's not doing it in a healthy way, and so she's looking to spending. Is she revenge spending because you're gambling? I don't gamble. That was the second time I had been at the casino in five years. What'd you spend? And did you budget for it or did you just go and do it on a whim?

We just did it on a whim, basically. All right. So I think the thing that, number one, when we're meeting, when we're researching millionaires, one of the things we find typically among, and we've done the largest study of millionaires ever done, Sam, is that the husband and wife are working together, and there aren't secrets, and there is not impulsive spending. And the number of millionaires in our study that became millionaires in a casino is precisely zero. The number of millionaires in our study that became millionaires in a casino is precisely zero.

The number of millionaires in our study whose wife or husband hides their finances from them because they don't have good communication is precisely zero. So those are the things that concern me more than the actual credit card debt. Do you see what I'm saying? Yes, I do. So if you guys want to prosper and do extremely well which is our goal to help you because we love you we want you to win uh it would entail uh combining your finances only one checking account and a budget meeting every month

that the two of you sit down together both of you have a vote some reason she doesn't think she's got a vote she had to hide it from shame or guilt or something um and we've got to rebuild trust which has been violated here and uh the two of you together she has a vote you have a vote we are in agreement about what our future goals are and where we're going from there. And so you don't agree with this, but I'm going to tell you what I think, okay, because you called here. I think you both did something stupid, and the only good news is it cancels out. I think you got lucky. Instead of losing a pile of money, you came home with a pile of money.

That's the worst thing that can happen at a casino because you're so dumb. Then you go back again thinking you're that guy. And so I'm cashing this money out, paying off these credit cards. We're going to combine our finances, and we're going to set a goal where we're very diligent, very steady, not flashy to save up a down payment for a home together. In the meantime, whatever spending we're going to do that is reasonable spending the two of us are going to be in agreement every single month before the month begins and not following through on that you or her is lying to your spouse and uh so what she did here is not cute it's not funny and what you did here is not cute and it's not funny it can be

devastating if it's extended out and forward both of them can be and so i you know i i'm fussing at you because i love you and i want you to win but if you were my kid and you're 30 years old this is exactly how i would talk to you and what i would tell you as your friend. Not because I'm your dad, but because I love you and because I want you to win. And so, Sam, if you haven't had, in our world, we call what she did financial infidelity. Yeah. Because it activates the same place in you that sexual infidelity does because it's a violation of trust. Yeah. that sexual infidelity does because it's a violation of trust yeah to run up 24 000 and

destroy or rather delay your dream of buying a home because of financial misbehavior yeah and a lie yeah and to be honest if i'm in their situation i'm probably going to seek out some counseling some marriage counseling yeah because they're they're early on and and this is not they're still forming that that foundation and this is not the sort of thing that you want in the foundation you want to get to the bottom of this find out why you guys are keeping secrets find out why she's feeling necessary feeling it's necessary to medicate by spending and and possibly same for you sam i and i think if i were in your shoes and I was 24 and some guy said to me what I just said to you, I would have a tendency to blow it off like you're overreacting, Dave. You're overstating this.

And what I'm saying is these two things, these three things, not working together, hiding and lying about money, and gambling are three things that will cause you to not become a millionaire. So this is like a million dollar discussion. That's why this is important. So I'm not overreacting because even though it's only 24,000 and 36,000, it's small in the scope of life. The behaviors are going to prohibit you or delay you at minimum from becoming wealthy to the tune of millions and millions of dollars. So this is a this is a I'm not overreacting because this is millions of dollars we're talking about.

Absolutely. Over time. Yeah. Dave, you're being kind because this this this is a big deal to me. I mean, if Sam Warshaw, if I found out Sam Warshaw went behind my back and spent $25,000, there'd be an atom bomb that went off. You would see the explosion. I'm just saying. There'd be a little fire. There'd be birds, little birds chirping around his head because I would have knocked him out. I'm just saying. I kind of think it might have been more likely you that would do that than him though

you know what that's probably true because i am the spender he is the saber he's mr deliberate yeah he is which is even more reason if he did that i would have gone off on him but it's it's what you said these little things it makes me think of that that scripture that says a little 11 the only time that we've even come close to that at our house and we did come in the early days we had lots of arguments about money and fights was when i was so overbearing i know you can't imagine that happening that sharon didn't feel like she had a vote yeah and she will tell you at about year seven of our marriage she felt like she got her voice yeah this is the way she says it and she she never lost it since, I'll just tell you. Her voice. Her voice. But I got my voice.

And, yeah, but it was, she got her vote. Yeah. And from then on, she's kind of had two to make up for the lost years. But that's the thing. If you don't feel like you have a voice in the thing, or you can't make a lot, you can't get there in a discussion then one spouse tends to go off and hide stuff and do things and that's not an indication it's not a money problem that's a relationship that's right that's right relationship problem and it

wasn't it wasn't my house too sam i'm just admitting just like you but i'm just old and it was a long time ago that's the only only difference. Don't be mad at us. We love you. That's why we're picking on you. But I would fix those things in my house because they're costing you, over the scope of the rest of your life, millions of dollars if you don't fix them.

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