The Ramsey Show - App - What Does Opportunity Look Like? (Hour 3)

Episode Date: June 9, 2021

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🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Christy Wright is my co-host today. Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author of the book, Business Boutique. Thank you for joining us, America. We're glad you're here.

The phone number is 888-825-5225. Kristen starts off this hour in Eugene, Oregon. Hi, Kristen. How are you? Good, Kristen. How are you? Good, Dave. How are you today? Better than I deserve. What's up? Great. Thank you for taking my call. I wanted to call. My husband passed away suddenly about eight weeks ago. Oh, my. And so I am trying. He died of COVID complications. Oh, my. I'm so sorry.

How old was he? He was 58. Oh, my. I'm so sorry. Okay. Thank you. How can we help? He did most of the finances for me and him. Our children are 29, 26, and 21, so they're grown and out of the house. I knew we did the finances

together. We did a budget every two weeks or every month, and then every time we got paid, divvied the money up into envelopes and did that. But we did have a collection account from 2009 because he was diagnosed with leukemia back in 2005. At the time, we didn't have insurance, so all of his chemotherapy treatment ended up being turned over to collections because the hospital would only carry balances for six months and then turn people over to collections. With that being said, it was about, we started at about $125,000. And now we are down to, I guess I am down to $29,500. And I was, we were just about ready to possibly make an offer to them and see if they would settle that out with us. And now that he's gone, they're kind of pressuring me. They have a lien on a house that we have, and I just was hoping to get your opinion

on maybe trying to settle that out with them. I just need to get that over my head, gone. Is this one singular bill? bill yes it's one singular bill there's twenty nine thousand five hundred dollars from the old cancer treatments back in the early 2000s uh late 2000s yes and and they and they and they sued you and took a lien against the house yes they did okay and what is it the hospital yes okay yes it was originally the hospital and now it's at a collection agency uh well it's at a law firm now um okay because they've sued you it's gone past collection agency collection agency may have a law firm in house but they're um okay okay and so do you have

money i can i i have some life insurance that i could use um i how much um about a hundred thousand okay good good i couldn't get a whole he never could have a lot of life insurance. Sure, what other debt do you have? I have a car loan that is about $3,000, and I have a travel trailer that's about $2,400. Are you going to keep it? The travel trailer I am for now. Okay. I'm just not ready to let it go right now. The house that has a lien on it, what is it worth?

It's worth about $425,000. And is it paid off? We owe about $144,000 on it. But that's not the home you live in? No. We moved for his job, and so we kept that home. And it's rented? It's rented, yes.

Okay. But currently I rent. I don't own a home that I live in. Okay. Well, you got a lot on your plate for a really fresh, recent tragedy. Right. And so what I always try to do is do as few moves as I can this close to the loss because it's hard to think clear this close to the loss.

Where is the other house? It's in southern Oregon. It's not in the same town I live in. Gotcha. Okay. All right. the same town i live in okay all right so um what i would do is call uh do you have a law firm that has the lien you have records of a law firm that did the lawsuit i'm i'm i'm probably i'll have to look back through the records i would rather you call the law firm than the collection agency,

because the collection agency is somebody who's been working there about two weeks, and they sit in a cubicle, and they have zero power and zero sense in most cases. Sometimes you can get somebody, but it's very rare. So what I'm trying to do is get to somebody that's allowed to make decisions, and if you can even get a good paralegal at the law firm, you've got a better chance than you do a collector in a cube. So I'd get them on the phone and say, I'm willing to settle this for a lump sum today. If you make me a deal, what will you make me?

It should be 50 cents. Okay. Fifteen grand ought to settle this they may start a little higher but no matter what they say go oh my gosh you're kidding i thought it'd be better than that okay act surprised about how horrible their offer is no matter how good it is okay okay because for them this is a game for you this is your life exactly yeah and so mess with them kiddo have you got enough stuff inside of you right now with all this pain to do that i think so i think it's just tough i mean i've lost about three quarters of my income

you know losing my husband and i'm trying to make it all work so what i'm gonna do is is like you call up and they say okay we'll we'll take $10,000. Go, oh, my gosh, I so thought it was going to be better than that. Can you not do any better? Okay. And just see what they say. And when they say seven, say, okay, I guess. But if they say 15, say the same thing.

And just go at them a couple times in one conversation. Now, in writing, they have to send you an email or a certified letter or something in writing saying they will accept that amount as settlement in full, and then you wire money to them. No electronic access to your checking account under any circumstances, and no deal until it's in writing. If it's not in writing, it didn't happen. Okay. They lie. Yeah, definitely. deal until it's in writing if it's not in writing it didn't happen okay they lie yeah okay so if you

have more than one conversation this starts to drain you hire an attorney pay somebody a thousand dollars to go do this for you it'll be worth it okay because you're not you may not have the i'm not sure i'd have the chops and i do this all the time right and i'm not sure I'd have the chops, and I do this all the time. Right. And I'm not sure if Sharon was gone, I'd have the chops to go fight it eight weeks later, okay? So don't let yourself get pinned in the corner because of the situation you're in emotionally. But take one run at it. And let me just tell you, I think a year from now that house is sold, and you're buying a house with the equity from that,

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Today's question comes from Jackson in Utah. I'm currently working in sales for a software company, but I want to start my own software business. I'm debt-free, other than my mortgage, $245,000. Should I pay off my house before starting my own company or go for it once I have enough cash to build the product and start selling it

you just cash flow it and you can do that now you know baby step six is number six for a reason you know and Dave I work with a lot of people that start businesses that don't need a lot of up front costs but if you can cash flow that, you can do that now. Unless I'm missing something.

I think you start your own software business. If you can start it on the side while working for the current company without any ethical problems or conflicts with customers or anything like that, then I would. I would get it going and get the product built, and you can start selling it on the side. You don't have to just quit your job to go do that. As a matter of fact, I wouldn't. Right, yeah. And I would say, especially with something like software,

start out with your 1.0 version. This doesn't have to be the Cadillac version where you save up a ton of money, prove your idea and your concept, start it on the side with a 1.0 version. You can improve and iterate over time. And that will help you get it to market faster and get feedback faster. Yeah, absolutely. And you'll, because you're going to iterate anyway. Whatever you put out there is going to change.

You can count on it. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Josh is in Appleton, Wisconsin. Hey, Josh, how are you? I'm doing fabulous, sir. How about yourself? Better than I deserve. How can Christy and I help? First of all, thank you for taking my call, both of you. Sure.

My question is about my 18-year-old son, just graduated. He's gone through a youth apprenticeship program and showing up for work every day, all that good stuff. The company he's working for offered a contract to reimburse for technical college in a trade in machining. But there's not, and he's required to work for three years. Otherwise, if he quits within that three years, says this isn't for me or whatever, he has to reimburse them. So my question is, he loves working for them. They've treated him very well.

I like the company. He loves working for them. They've treated him very well. I like the company. We met with the owner a couple nights ago, and everything looks right. But there isn't a dollar amount to when you're done with the apprenticeship program, this is what you're going to make. He told us this is what he's going to make and said, I guarantee it. And he said it twice. What direction do I go with that? What was the, I thought you said you didn't know.

So you do know what he's going to make. In a handshake, basically. Okay. But not on paper. It's not in the paperwork. Okay. It's not in the contract. Ask him to put it in the offer letter. Okay. But not on paper. It's not in the paperwork. Okay. It's not in the contract. Ask them to put it in the offer letter. Okay.

When we hire someone here, we give them an offer letter that states their start date, what they're going to make, what their benefits are, so they know what they're signing up for. And it's us putting it in writing so they know what they're getting when they come to work here. Sixteen new people came to work here on monday all of them did so several weeks after receiving their offer letter and uh so sounds like this guy is a uh a former machinist himself that runs a small business yes it's a smaller company yeah he's just not just not super sophisticated in his HR, that's all. He's probably a great guy. And so what I would do is just say, since he's going to owe you the money back on this handshake, you're going to want to put that in writing in the form of a letter.

So just send him a letter saying how much he'll make after the apprenticeship, what you told us in the meeting. And go ahead and put in the letter that if he doesn't work three years that he's going to have to reimburse the technical college and of course you're going to look at your costs on the technical college and your son's going to know he's on the hook for that right and he could cash flow it right now on his own he's been working and saving everything well and so he could write a check if he had to quit or got fired or something. Right. But he really likes the place.

But I'm just saying, how is your son going to get pinched on this? One would be if he didn't get what was promised on the income, or two would be if there's some kind of sideways thing on the reimbursement on the college. And so all you've got to do is just put both those things in a letter to your son from the owner, and then you know you've got something you can bring back. It's probably not a binding contract. That's not what I'm asking for, if I'm you. But it's a point of clarification, and it's in writing in case people forget.

We're all on the same page. I got to tell you, I put stuff down in letters all the time to people, what I've promised them, so that I have a copy of it so I can remember what I said because I got a couple deals in the air. Yeah. Right. And it looks like he's going to keep growing. The business looks really strong. Yeah, you'd go with this.

I mean, you see it here in red flags, Christy? No, yeah, it's a matter flags christy no yeah it's just it's a matter of just clarifying it's just a good old boy running a business and he he thought the handshake was clear and you're like yeah it is clear let's also put it on paper so we can remember it that's all it is it's just an extra step right for you to feel good about it you know just say listen it's not an act of disrespect would you mind uh just for our sake for our peace of mind giving him an offer letter of what you're offering him in income and in tuition reimbursement and what his responsibility is and

you can kind of wink at the old guy and go and so this is also for him to remember he owes you that money if he leaves i want him done i want him to understand he's getting on the hook here and this is you like telling telling him to how to coach your son up, you know, kind of thing. Yep. And that way it's not offensive to him. Right. Just saying, hey, put it in an offer letter. That way I can make this 18-year-old knucklehead stay on track.

I'll help you with him. And then we all know what we said, and it's real easy. And it's not that we're questioning your word at all. Yeah. And he'll do that. It's a simple letter. Have your assistant write out a quick letter and send it to us. Just send him an offer letter. Just call it an offer letter because that's really what it is in HR terms.

And, but it's, you're wise to clarify it and get it in writing, mainly because people get busy and they forget. Most people aren't dishonest, but sometimes they get busy and they forget. Most people aren't dishonest, but sometimes they get busy and they forget. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Christy is talking these days and did at Entree Leadership in-depth about balance in our lives, about spending our time as carefully as we spend our money. And Christy and her team have developed the 24-hour challenge. They want to give you 24 hours of your week back by using their new free Time Finder.

If you want to get the free Time Finder to check on your time like we check on your money, text TIMEFINDER to 33444. Text TIMEFINDER to 33444. Thank you. In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the Dead Free Stage, Drew and Erica are with us. Hey guys, how are you are you hey we're good welcome and where do you guys live uh we're in hipburn idaho oh wow did you drive or fly to tennessee we flew good i feel better about you already that's a long way okay cool man so how much debt did you guys pay off uh we paid off four hundred thousand dollars whoa nice and how long did this take just over four years wow and your range of income during that time 140 to 160 okay did you

sell something or no no we just you just been on beans and rice and put 100 grand a year on this yes what kind of debt was it it was 40 00040,000 of personal, and it was about $360,000 of business debt. Oh, wow. Okay. So now your business is paid for. Paid for. And sure is a little bit more profit after that. Yeah, we're actually able to keep something.

What a concept. Yeah, we've made a lot of money, and we've lived on $50,000. Yeah. What kind of business? It's CNC Machine Shop. Oh, we've made a lot of money, and we've lived on 50 grand. Yeah. What kind of business? It's CNC Machine Shop. Oh, good. Good. Cool.

And what do you do, Erica? I'm a stay-at-home mom, but I recently finished your financial coach master training program, and so I'm in the process of building my financial coaching business. Good. Well done. Wow, look at you guys. Cool. Very fun.

Well, congratulations. So tell us about your journey. What happened four years ago that put you on this process? Well, it actually started about 10 years ago. Drew was working at a different machine shop, and he had an idea of how to build some parts better than they were doing. So he approached the boss and contracted the workout. So we bought a machine and put it in our garage,

but we had to borrow money from a family member to do that. And the payment was really big, almost as big as our mortgage. And we got kind of worried that we weren't going to be able to make the payment. So we started putting our living expenses on credit cards. And we paid the machine off on time and never missed a payment. But we got into some really bad habits of just living in excess of what we made every year, I guess. And so Drew was kind of frustrated with me. I was bouncing checks, and the credit card companies kept calling me asking,

why aren't you making your payments? And I just, I could only pay what I could. So he decided that he was going to take over the finances, and he didn't do any better than I did. He was busy. I didn't realize how frustrating it was. After that, we had the genius idea to do a debt consolidation loan. And only one bank, we went to several banks and one bank said yes to us. And we walked out of there with the loan and

said, oh, we're never going to do that again. And about two or three months later, we'd racked up $24,000 more of credit card debt. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. So we were kind of disasters. So you found? Oh, yeah. So when the frustration got bad enough and we realized what we'd done, I had this random memory from about 25 years ago. I remember riding in a car with my brother and my dad. My brother was telling my dad about this

guy that he'd heard on the radio that basically was teaching about money and said something to the effect of, you've got to deliver pizzas until you save six months worth of income. That's all I can remember. But I did remember your name. And so when I went to Google, I found the radio show, the podcast, and started listening every day. Wow. Yeah. And then he told me about it. And I told him, I said, oh, I'm totally on board with getting out of debt. I want to start investing.

But everybody has a car payment and everybody has a house payment. So I'll do the other stuff, but I'm not doing the car payment and house payment. And he was really patient with me. He just said, okay, okay. And, um, at the time I really, really wanted a Yukon. And so I thought if we just pay off the debt, then I can go get a payment for a Yukon. And I, and he just kept saying, okay, that's fine. But, um, for our anniversary, he had bought tickets to Celine Dion in Vegas. It's about a 10-hour car ride from where we live, and I didn't realize this at the time, but he had planned to trap me in the car

and make me listen to the Total Funny Makeover for 10 hours. Well played, Drew. Well played. Celine Dion is the bait. There's a bait. I'm going to lure you in. Dave is the tiger.

I'm going to lure you in. Dave is the tiger. I'm going to lure you in with this chick concert and then teach you about money on the way. Exactly. But not too long into it. I don't know if Celine would appreciate this. Yeah, not too far into the trip, I realized that following the plan completely is what we needed to do. As soon as you said the line in the book, what is it? If you paid yourself a car payment for 30 years, you'd have $5 million. Hope you liked your car.

Wow. She stopped and turned and said, oh, crap, I don't get a Yukon. Yeah. So what you're saying is. So what you're saying is. Yeah. So after that, we were pretty much on board. We were just gazelle intense.

Yeah. For four years. Yeah. Wow. Yes. We were just gazelle in tents. Yeah. For four years. Yeah. Wow. That's impressive, y'all. Very good. And so basically what ended up happening was you rolled all this consumer debt over into the business. Almost all of it.

Well, I... $360,000 on business, you said, right? Yeah. Yeah, what happened is I had rented some machine time and subcontracted some work through a business, and that guy actually passed away. So I had to scramble to get some machines and kind of build a little shop in the backyard. So I either was going to close the business and get a job or do what I did, so I doubled down. Yeah.

Wow. Way to go, guys. Thanks. Thank you. Just a lot of work, huh? Yeah. That's all it was. You were working a bazillion hours a down. Yeah. Wow. Way to go, guys. Thanks. Thank you. Just a lot of work, huh? Yeah. That's all it was. You were working a bazillion hours a week.

Yeah. Just take all you can get and plow through, and then you're done. Was it worth it? Oh, yeah. 100%. Because you're done now. Yeah.

How does it feel? You've got to feel like you lost 300 pounds. We've listened to a lot of debt-free streams, and nothing that anyone can say relays the feeling of freedom. Wow. Yeah. Drew works like, I don't know, 16, 18 hour days.

He started sleeping in the shop and he'd take my couch cushions and lay on the shop floor with him. And finally I bought him a cot. I said, at least if you're going to do this, give me back my couch cushions and be comfortable. I want you to be comfortable a little. Mostly, I want my couch back. But he puts in a lot of hours. Wow.

Y'all are amazing. And she's kind of been a single mother. She took care of everything else. I had to start Googling how to do stuff because he didn't have the time to do stuff. So something would happen. And I thought, well, I don't know how to do it. So YouTube or Google and just make it happen. Yeah. Now you're free, though.

Yeah. I'm so proud of y'all. Yeah. You're an incredible couple. Thank you. You guys are heroes. You took control of your life. Well done.

Very well done. And you work like maniacs. I mean, and you work like no one else. Later you get to work like no one else. Now you can do whatever you want to do. I mean, you can play this however you else. Later, you get to work like no one else. Now you can do whatever you want to do. I mean, you can play this however you want to play it. And you brought the guys with you. They've got three sons, right?

And their names and ages? This is Brooks. He's 12. Jace is 9. And Dax is 6. All right. Awesome. Very cool.

Good looking guys. Yes. We've got a copy of the Legacy Journey for you. That's definitely something you've done for those three young men. You've changed their legacy. You're leaving a legacy very well done and a copy of the total money makeover and as a coach you can give that to somebody or a friend or whoever and pay it forward and wake somebody up somebody uh give somebody the hint that uh you used to lean dion as a trap day trap them in the car with d for 10 hours. Oh, my gosh.

That's just cruel. That's a new one. That's a personal thing. Cruel and unusual punishment. That's what I'm saying. All right. Drew, Erica, Brooks, Jason, Dax, $400,000 paid off in four years,

making $140,000 to $160,000. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Yeah! Woo-hoo-hoo-hoo-hoo! I love it.

Well done. I'll tell you what. When you work 16, 18-hour days for three years, it is emotional. You see it in his face. I wish people that are just listening could see it in his face i wish people you know that that are just listening could see it it's like oh you feel that in your heart the freedom that they feel

yeah you just see the release yes yeah it's uh man and the other thing about that situation is once you paid that kind of price to get out you'll never go that's right you will never go back no not even close not for any reason there There's something about something that's that hard that it brands it in your spirit. Yeah. And it's like, no! It's this visceral response to it, yeah. The idea of getting a car payment is enough to make you throw up when you've acted like that. Yeah.

Where other people are like, well, maybe someday I might. Yeah. You know, but they'll never go back. You don't even need to ask them the question. Will you ever go back? No! You know, that's it. Not a chance. I don't know. I want'll never go back. You don't even need to ask them the question. Will you ever go back? No! You know, that's it. Not a chance.

I don't know. I want you free. Right. And I want you to pay a price like that to get free. Well done, you guys. Very well done. This is The Ramsey Show. Thank you. We'll be right back. Our scripture of the day, Psalm 37, 3 and 4. Trust in the Lord and do good.

Dwell in the land and enjoy safe pasture. Take delight in the Lord and he will give you the desires of your heart. Jim Rohn said, you cannot change your destination overnight, but you can change your direction overnight. Kyle is with us in Santa Rosa, California. Hey, Kyle, how are you? Mr. Ramsey, it's an honor to talk to you, sir. You too, sir. What's up? Okay, so quick question.

I am a big listener. A friend of mine who is also a listener recommended something to me. I wanted to run it by you. I have a pickup truck that is the 2006 Duramax diesel. He is suggesting with the high market value of used cars right now to sell it, to put it toward and potentially pay off my debt. What's the truck worth? Blue Book value has it at about $14,000.

How much debt do you have? $20,000. How old are you? I'm 34, or I'll be 34 next week. What do you make? With my wife and I, we grossed about $145 last year. Is this your daily driver truck, or is it a third vehicle or extra vehicle? Well, my wife has a car, our family car with a new baby that we just had and

then i have my truck okay so i would i would end up selling it to get get a hooky as you like to call it yeah uh to be my driver yeah do you like the truck i do like the truck um you know and that's what my buddy was saying is that he was saying to you know get rid of the truck, you know, and that's what my buddy was saying, is that he was saying to, you know, get rid of the truck. It's just a truck. Put it toward your debt. Work toward your house. Well, if it was $44,000 maybe, but it's only a $14,000 truck. It doesn't fix the problem, and it's not that big a percentage of $145,000.

If you like it, I would keep it and get your butt on a budget and get this $20,000 in debt paid off and keep your truck. It's just a faster way for you to jumpstart your debt paying off, but on that income, you can do this without selling it. I would not sell it. Instead, I would roll up my sleeves and get my household on a tight budget, everybody in the house, and let's get this $20,000 paid off.

I don't know. You make $145,000. Let's do it in five months. Okay. $4,000 a month. You can do that on that income, and you get to keep your truck. It's a little bit slower than you doing it next week yeah well if you sell the truck you're still gonna be you still got six thousand dollars in debt still gonna take

you two more months yeah yeah so the difference is a hoopty for for saving you three months it's not and then you wouldn't do it you need to turn and move back up out of hoopty into a better car yeah right and and so i was just the only reason i was thinking about it because of the like i said the the demand for used vehicles today yeah but so what i mean again if it was a 54 000 truck i'd sell it in a heartbeat on you sure but it's just it's not it's not that big a percentage of the problem or of your income. Uh-huh. So it doesn't move the needle enough for the hassle is my point.

Got it. Got it. If you hate the truck anyway, then, yeah, let's dump it while the market's high and get you something else. But that's not the problem. You don't owe $14,000 on it, right? No, I don't owe anything on it. Yeah, your only debt is $20,000 other than your home. Yeah, we don't own our home, so we don't even have that. Okay, all right. Hey, hold on. I'm

going to have Kelly sign you guys up for a year in Ramsey Plus and put you into Financial Peace University and get you onto EveryDollar Premium budgeting app, and so we're going to show you how to budget and how to handle your money and how to work your way through this debt. And you're going to be able to see after you go through Financial Peace University with your wife, you guys are going to be able to see if you'll dial into this. I'll give it to you free for a year if you'll dial into it. But you've got to go do it, and then you've got to call me back and tell me you're debt

free. But you're going to be able to see what Christy and I are seeing because we've looked at this for years, decades. And so we can see instantly that, yeah, you need to just pay off this debt. But if you're going to screw around and take four years to get out of debt or something with $20,000, then you've got other problems that the truck doesn't solve. Yeah, especially on that income. Like, this is very doable on that income.

If you're calling in with a $30,000 income, that's different. But you can do this. John's in Boston. Hey, John, how are you? Hi, Dave. I'm great. How are you? Better than I deserve. How can we help? Great. Well, thanks for taking my call. I've been listening for years, and you're actually one of the reasons I wanted to become a finance major in college. So thanks for the inspiration. I really appreciate it. Honored. Thank you. Thank you. My question is, what does opportunity look like? I just graduated college. I worked very hard to graduate debt-free and with a good chunk of change in the banks. And while I'm looking for a job, I'm also looking for opportunity. I think the economy is

closing a great position right now. Is it intuition? Is it being extremely organized? Is it networking? Like, how do you just put all the pieces together and make stuff happen? What is it you'm looking for something to focus all my passion and energy towards, whether it be a job or an opportunity to start my own thing. I'm just not really too sure. I mean, when you just think about that really simple question, what do you want to do? What do you see yourself doing? I love helping people with their finances. I love learning about financial literacy and personal finance.

And so that's definitely one of my big passions. I also really like real estate, but I'm not too sure exactly what. Oh, and you just graduated in your senior year. I'm sure in classes you talked about all the different ways to use that degree. Were there any that jumped out to you more than others? Because there's a lot of ways to use that degree. Yeah, that's true. Well, I guess there were a lot more things that jumped out at me that I knew I didn't want to do than things that I actually did want to do. Studying finance was more of institutional and corporate finance,

and I'm not sure if I particularly like that side of finance. I'm more of a people person and like talking with people and building relationships and things like that. So I guess just some wisdom or guidance into how to kind of enter that realm of finance and enter that world. Why don't you click on SmartVestor at RamseySolutions.com and see if you can find a SmartVestor Pro or two in the area to talk to you about the possibility of being a financial advisor working on one of their teams and what it would take to get to be that and do that.

What kind of ramp up there would be, what kind of on-ramp there would be to do that. Because it sounds like you're wanting to get hand-to-hand kneecap to kneecap with folks and actually help them with their investments or help them with their money in some way and that might be a a way to start doing that the other thing i would tell you to do is just uh comb through the different free offerings on ken coleman.com ken coleman's website he's got a lot of stuff on there about getting how you get clear on what it is you're wanting to do um and then what your next steps are and we'll send you a copy of his book the proximity principle uh it was the number one

bestseller about about the importance of being in proximity to the people, the places, the activities that you want to be a part of. You still are pretty panned back. This is still very big picture. And so your next step is to get more clarity on exactly which direction to move. Yeah, and you'll learn some of that through doing. Your first job out of college won't be your dream job. That's okay. It's just do something in the direction you want to move. Yeah, and you'll learn some of that through doing. Your first job out of college won't be your dream job. That's okay.

It's just do something in the direction you want to go. Get your feet wet. Get some reps. Real life experience. Go, oh, I really like this, but not so much this. It's going to teach you

about yourself and more about what you want by doing something. So get clarity and then take some action. Ken's resources will help you do that. That's good wisdom.

I never really thought about it until you said that, but my first job out of college was not my dream job. It was my nightmare job. It was the worst in the world. The worst people, too. It was just nasty. Christy Wright, good job. James Childs, Kelly Daniels in the booth, good job.

I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace. Christ Jesus. Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for The Ramsey Show.

If you would like to do your debt-free screen live on the show, make sure you visit theramseyshow.com and register. We would love for you to come to Nashville your debt-free scream live on the show, make sure you visit theramzshow.com and register. We would love for you to come to Nashville and tell Dave your story.