The Ramsey Show - App - What to Do if You Get Furloughed During the Coronavirus (Hour 2)

Episode Date: April 6, 2020

Anthony ONeal, Home Selling, Insurance, Savings Tools to get you started:  Debt Calculator: http://bit.ly/2QIoSPV Insurance Coverage Checkup: http://bit.ly/2BrqEuo Complete Guide to Budgeting: http://bit.ly/2QEyonc Interview Guide: http://bit.ly/2BuGnZE Check out other podcasts in the Ramsey Network: http://bit.ly/2JgzaQR 

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. You jump in, we'll talk about your life and your money.

It is a free call at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Anthony O'Neill, Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author, joins me this hour, this day on the Dave Ramsey Show to answer your financial questions. He has a message of hope being delivered tonight. Each of the Ramsey personalities, including me, Rachel, and Ken Coleman, kicking that off about a week and a half ago, started this idea off that we're going to put out ideas that are real, that change your perspective on everything that's going on. It doesn't fix it, but this idea that we have to be in full-on panic and hysteria mode

is ridiculous, the way that some folks are treating each other, the way they're acting. And you've got a special message tonight, I think. Yes, it's going to be very special. I went for a run day for the first time out in my area, and it was real dark. And I got a little nervous. I got a little scared, to be honest. I just didn't know what to expect. But I seen something very small ahead of me while I was running, and I don't want to give it away because I want them to watch it tonight and get encouraged.

But this very small thing gave me hope. And I started running a little bit faster when I got towards that. It changed my evening and I actually ran an extra mile because of what happened. And so I've learned as a former preacher, still a preacher today, but as a former youth pastor to take my life experience and turn that into words of encouragement, even especially around money, like what you and I do on a daily basis. Spoiler alert, the small thing you saw was not the Easter Bunny. No, sir. It wasn't the Easter Bunny.

It wasn't none of that stuff. But it was something that just really gave me hope. And I literally stopped, Dave, and said, this is my message of hope. Yeah, thank you, Lord. When I had the opportunity to record it on uh today tonight that this is what i'm gonna talk about yeah very very cool and on top of that we are releasing today a week at ramsey publishing are starting to call a a quick read which is a uh a chapter or two chapters roughly in a book form but it's like 64 pages in this case long. Yeah.

Because when you did the number one bestseller debt-free degree, you kept getting questions. Yeah, that's all great for somebody who's not been to college yet, but I got debt. What do I do? Yeah. You know, the number one question when I was out on book tour, when I was doing media, I'm even on with Tamron Hall, and she says, well, Anthony, what about these people who actually have debt?

What can they do? Will this book help them? I was like, no, this book will not. And so I came to you and our team here and our board and said, hey, can we put this together? And Dave, this is a simple, a simple it is two hours to read. If you read slow, it's two hours. If you read like Dave Ramsey, it may take you 45 minutes. But it's a deep dive into baby step two. It's no brand new content, but I really go in there and answer all the questions from, you know, how to add on more money to it. What is my thought? What are my thoughts on counseling student loan debt? How is the properly refi? When is the right time? When's the only time should I consider it? I literally deep dive and answer everything about how to attack our student loans.

And right now, Dave, if you still have a job and still have income coming in, now is a great time because you're not paying interest for six months. Right. And take advantage of that. Don't use that to not pay. Exactly. Use that to pay extra and get out faster. Yes. If you've got a stable job situation.

Yes, sir. Destroy your student loan debt. That's what it's called. Destroy it. Destroy it. It's kind of violent. You've got to hate it to destroy it. Yeah, and for those of you that have been Ramsey tribe members for a long time,

you don't need to read this. You already know this. But a lot of you know someone who goes, yeah, but I'm stuck. And this is a little quick read that you can pick up they're only ten dollars and uh we put them on amazon this morning they're selling like crazy already and uh you can call our remsey concierge team i mean buy a box of them for 10 bucks goodness gracious and hand them out to people that feel stuck and while they have the student loan interest forgiveness this is a good time to use that to get out of debt. Call them at 888-22-PEACE, 888-227-3223.

It's a good graduation gift right now, Dave. We have a lot of college students sitting at home that's about to graduate with some student loan debt. It's a good way just to get them connected to our tribe. Just here you go. Check this out. Oh, yeah. I'm serious. They're sitting at home.

It'll take them an hour and a half to read it and now you just connected them to the ramsey tribe and man i just thought about that that's a good idea really a good idea because the poor you know these guys are not really having graduation they're not and so they need a gift they do they really feel better they and they have nothing but time right now it's like these poor kids with their birthday parties i don They have a parade in front of their house instead of an actual birthday party. Right. One of the guys works on our team. His wife arranged that this weekend.

Had all the other kids walk to a parade past the house for the birthday party. That was tough. They need to do something for us single people, Dave. Uh-oh. That's a different. Oh, no, no, no, no, no no no no you didn't do that maybe you need to be leading the parade that's what that's what it is okay you can go parade in front of someone's house now don't get you're gonna get arrested

no i will not do that stalking he's stalking me ramsey personality in trouble i'm saying my boss told me to do it it's all dave's fault put that on the long list of things that are dave's fault all right so there is a bunch of stuff going on out there with stimulus package and everything else and we've got some do's and some don'ts we've kind of been working on i need to make up like a list of these we're going to try to get it done the next couple days and get it out to you guys on the instagram post or something but there's some do's and don'ts uh let's start with you have been laid off or furloughed you have no income coming in yes okay do take care of your four walls yes sir so that's your utilities yes your transportation that's your food and that's your shelter right

and you know if there's a little bit of clothing but most of you got enough clothing shut up okay so yeah those shoes still fit so um you know but food shelter clothing transportation utilities those are the necessities of life do take care of that yes don't pay extra on debt yes pay to bear if you are out of income yes Do look for a part-time job or six of them in the interim. Lots of people hiring in the delivery world, the grocery world, the medical world, the whatever world. Do that. Yes. Okay?

Don't cash out your 401K because you are not in foreclosure if you've been furloughed for two weeks. Yes. Come on, Dave. Don't cash out your 401K because you are not in bankruptcy if you've been furloughed or laid off for two weeks. Get a job. Fill up the income. Take care of necessities only. Don't pay extra.

Probably don't pay anything. Yes. Do mess up your credit before you go without food. There you go, Dave. I like that one. Do skip out on a credit card bill before you go without food. Absolutely. You know, and so do keep your mortgage current, your rent current.

If your mortgage company allows you to skip a payment and everything's going okay. Let's take the next group. You got a secure income. Yes. We're going to continue this after the break. We got to, Dave. You got a secure income coming back from this break. What do you do and what do you don't?

You got a small business coming back from the break. Yes. What do you do and what do you don't do You've got a small business coming back from the break. Yes. What do you do and what do you don't do? SBA loans? Don't. Forbearance plans. Forbearance plans? Don't.

Don't. Unless you're broke and have no income. We're going to talk about it after the break. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. For most of us, health care costs seem to increase every year, and saving money on health insurance feels more and more out of reach. For example, take the Olcheski family from LaGrange, Texas. Jeff and Cherise had just celebrated the birth of a new baby boy. Shortly after, they had a health scare involving one of their kids that was completely unexpected. With today's healthcare

climate, this could have bankrupted them. But thanks to Christian Healthcare Ministries, the Olcheskis were spared from a ton of medical bills. As members of Christian Healthcare Ministries, they're part of a group of believers who financially and spiritually support each other. CHM is the original health cost sharing ministry and is a Better Business Bureau accredited charity. It's biblical, affordable, and it's shared nearly $97,000 to help the Olszewskis. To be a part of Christian Healthcare Ministries, visit chministries.org. That's chministries.org. CHM is a proud sponsor of Dave Ramsey Live Events. chministries.org. All right, one more time.

If you've lost your job or you're about to, you're in a very, very unstable situation with your income, not generally afraid of the COVID shutdowns, the coronavirus shutdowns, but you really are about to lose a job or have lost a job or you're furloughed. Okay. Do buy food first, lights and water second. Pay your mortgage or your rent third. Do keep gas in your car. Do look for an interim job with one of the grocery chains or the delivery folk all the pizza places

are hiring you can make some money to keep your household running for a period of time until that job you had comes back or you get a new one yeah just like if you just walked in in a non-coronavirus situation they said we're doing layoffs you wouldn't just go home and sit and cry you might for a minute but then you get up and you get after it yes you got to hustle and grind right and so you you do that don't cash out your 401k unless it's to avoid a bankruptcy or foreclosure and there's no way you're in a bankruptcy or foreclosure today because of the coronavirus no way you were already there and the coronavirus pushed you over the edge maybe right but the coronavirus shutdown and associated income losses are not old enough to have caused a bankruptcy or foreclosure a foreclosure folks take six months in almost

every state and usually longer and so if you've missed apr's payment, you are not in foreclosure. You're just late. That's it. Calm down. Do not cash out your 401k. Now, let's take another group of people and say, oh, okay, your income is stable, but you're just generally worried about the whole coronavirus thing well welcome the human

race right now right but uh and so like i don't know papa works at uh ups and mama's a teacher yeah okay those are two stable incomes stable they're you know i got an issue the deliveries are going on and the teacher salaries even though they're at home are going on yep and they're really not in jeopardy they're not about to be furloughed they're not they're not about to do a bunch of massive layoffs those are two stable incomes you're a federal employee you're a postal worker you're a health care worker you ain't going nowhere nowhere okay so uh those are stable incomes now what are some do's and don'ts there? So do pay your bills on time. Yes. All of them. Yes.

Do go ahead and continue the baby steps, whatever baby steps you're on. If you're getting out of debt, do go ahead and continue getting out of debt. Yes. Don't take advantage of some of these forbearance plans. Delay your utility bills. Do not do that. And that's very, very very very frustrating dave i went to pay my bill uh my mortgage payment the other day and i just read up on the forbearance plan they're

offering and here's why i say do not do it even if you are a little scared continue paying bills like we said because at the end of your forbearance plan if it's three months all of it comes due at one time including that month yeah look up the word forbearance yes in the dictionary or google it for those of you don't know what a dictionary is but uh it does not mean forgiveness yep it means patience yes if i have forbearance with you it means i have patience with you i forbear with you and i give i give you time that's all it means and so if you don't pay your payment this month guess what you still gotta pay it yeah you still gotta pay it by this year yes it's gonna come back so delaying it just to say i delayed it unless you can't pay it but it's one of the first three things you pay and you should be taking a job doing something so do not

get involved in one of these forbearance programs if there's any way you can avoid it because it's going to catch up with you later and do not if you're an entrepreneur business owner dave you could talk more into this because that's what you are do not take advantage of these government loans that they're calling government grants that they're not a grant yeah they're not a. It is a loan with forgiveness provisions. And you read the details of the law, like I've done in the last 24 hours, it'll scare the P. Wadden out of you. It so will. Listen, if you don't maintain employment exactly like it was, and they're going to be looking at every little thing, then you're going to get bit later.

Yeah. Avoid this. Now, I'll tell you, there is something you do want to do if you're a small business they are allowing the portion of the payroll tax that i have to pay as the employer to not get paid this whole year oh and it and then it is paid systematically or not over the next two years you it's delayed. It's not forgiven. It's put off, but it's delayed. And if that will help you, and, you know, that's a lot of money here with 1,000 people working on this team, we will definitely be not paying that payroll tax under this provision, knowing that we have to pay it next year and the next year.

You make it up over the next two years, but through the end of the year, that's a lot of cash flow that will help make sure that our employees stay employed that we don't have to furlough or lay somebody off by protecting that that monthly cash flow do that one yes sir do not borrow money yes from the sba yes churches do not borrow money from the SBA. The borrower is slave to the lender. When the government comes in, and after this is over, and some of these people that don't agree with your biblical viewpoint of life are going to come in and start telling you, you have to do this in order to get forgiveness. The Treasury Department is setting the regulations in place, and they take direction from Congress and from the President from the president and depending on who's in the white house after november that could get really messy for some of you people uh in a church world in particular and you do not want to get

involved in all of a sudden you don't do something the way they think and according to political correctness and you think that the Bible says opposite of that. And now you're going to find out the borrower is slave to the lender. Do not take this money. It is not free money. And Dave, here's another one. Do not do cash advances. Do not do payday lender places.

You drove past a place yesterday. I sure did. And I was so upset and my ig followers knew it because i got on there and i i was trying to be respectful to the company because i didn't want to get in trouble why well because you my boss and i ain't want you calling me i think you ought to take them down you know but i mean i've seen 13 cars out there at this particular uh payday lender place and i was frustrated take four jobs do not borrow money at 800 interest don't do it don't and that's what the payday lender charges they're scum

and they're going to take advantage of you stay off of that lot unless you're sweeping the lot and they're paying you to sweep it don't even go in their driveway yes do not do that stuff do not cash out your 401k because you're afraid do not cash out your 401K because you're afraid. Do not cash out your mutual funds because you're afraid. This time next year, you will be kicking yourself going, I jumped off a roller coaster right in the middle of the ride. No wonder both my legs got broke. I mean, my God, don't do this.

Don't take out a line of credit on your home. Don't be borrowing money to get this mess covered. Don't be borrowing money on credit cards to cover this mess. The number of times, Anthony, doing crisis counseling over these 30 years that I've sat down with somebody and they go, well, I lost my job last fall. And that's how I got this $45,000 in credit card debt. And I'm like, wait a minute. How long were you out of work? Two months.

What did you make before you got laid off sixty thousand dollars that's five thousand dollars a month that's not forty five thousand in two months that's ten thousand what's the other thirty five thousand oh we bought some other stuff but we justified it and rationalized it and called it unemployment debt and all it was was stupid because i was stressed out freaked out and i went to the mall to feel better, went to the car lot to feel better, and bought a bass boat to feel better. God, don't do this stuff. This is the time to be wise and calm and deliberate and very careful steps on these slippery rocks. You're going to fall and bust your butt in a creek and be wet very

careful steps do not cash out your investments do not delay payments on these loans these student loans you got i got free interest so i hear people saying delay the payment you're just you're jumping all over them on that i'm jumping all over if you still got the income stuff coming in no go after the payments because now you can put more payment, more money towards the principal. Yeah, no interest on my student loan for six months. That doesn't mean you stay in debt six more months. No. It means if you have a steady income, you attack that much harder.

Now, if you're doing the four walls, cool. Set it aside. We're not worried about Sally Mae. She can starve, feed your kids. Yeah. But if you got a steady income, bust that thing, man. Use this opportunity to push through. Don't be skipping payments unless you have to to eat.

That's it. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. In times of uncertainty, there is one thing you can control, you. So it's time for you to say no to fear and yes to a plan. And that plan is Financial Peace University. Through FPU, nearly 7 million people just like you have learned to pay off debt forever. Save for the future. Build wealth and become outrageously generous. And for the first time ever, you can start a free 14-day trial of a Financial Peace membership.

This free trial includes all nine video lessons, financial tools, and downloads, a vibrant online community, and every dollar plus our premium world-class budgeting app. It's everything you need to start getting your money on the right track. This proven plan doesn't change with the economy or what's happening around the globe. Start your free trial of Financial Peace University today at DaveRamsey.com slash FPU. Anthony O'Neill, Ramsey personality, joining me on the show today. I joined him tonight at Anthony O'Neill on his Instagram, his Facebook, his YouTube, whatever all those things are called. Couldn't make it come out of my mouth. For a message of hope.

Rachel Cruz last Monday, Chris Hogan, Christy Wright, John Loney, Ken Coleman, and now tonight, Anthony O'Neill's message of hope. We are bound and determined at Ramsey to put out reasons to be hopeful, and Anthony's got an incredibly motivating message tonight. Be sure you gather up the teenagers. Yes. And have them listen in as well. Danny is in North Carolina. Hi, Danny welcome to the dave ramsey show hey dave hey anthony thanks for uh taking my call sure what's up um so i was i've kind of

been mulling over some things uh my fiance and i are looking to move out of the condo that she has mortgaged and get into a house within the next few years. And then for later on down the road, we would like to have a beach house and possibly, I'd really like to have a cabin too. So what I was looking for was an opinion on when you move out of the condo and you move into the house, do you sell the condo and stockpile your money that you got from it and then use that later on when you're ready to get your beach house? Or do you use the condo as a rental until you're ready to get your beach house or do you use the condo as a rental until you're ready to get your beach house and then sell it and then get your beach house see none of the above exactly i would i would sell the condo when you get ready to buy the next house right and i would get that house

bought and when it is paid off i would save up and pay cash for toys. And beach houses and cabins are toys. I got you. That's what I did, by the way. I've got a lake house. Mm-hmm. And I did not buy that until my home was paid off and until I was 100% debt-free and until I could pay cash for it. And it changes the enjoyment of it.

And what you'll discover once you own some vacation properties like that is what you pay for them per hour of use is absolutely asinine. The number of hours you spend in it versus what you spent for it is, even if you rent it out and try to make money on it and all that, is ridiculous. So you have to be in a position where you have enough wealth that that kind of money can sit there and not produce anything. It's kind of like buying a nice car. It's asinine financially, right?

Yes. But you have to have enough money that if you take a $50,000 car and you turn it into $10,000 with depreciation, that it does not affect your finances. And so it's a small percentage of your net worth, a small percentage of your world, and you pay cash for it. And all of those things make the purchase tolerable because you can afford the calories since you've been working out. That kind of thing. I don't know. Anthony, what do you think?

No, I'm riding with you, Dave. It's the same thing. Even before I even think about that, I'm just going to make sure as well, Danny, that I'm just in a good financial place out of debt as well. But I just purchased a home. I have a dream to one day own a lake house but it's a dream i'm gonna pay cash for it i'm gonna pay off my house here then i'm gonna go from there so i agree with you dave it's the best way to enjoy the wealth yeah it's like a boat with payments is not as much fun as a boat you know i understand so it's hard to have it's hard to have peace in

the mountain cabin with payments that That was good, Dave. I got you. I got you. So the person who obviously does not have a whole lot of experience with investments would look to what kind of like literature or something to kind of get a little bit more insight for future reference. As far as investing for your 401ks and those kinds of things, we use mutual funds. That's what I do personally. And you can connect with our SmartVestor pros, the people we endorse. We're not in that business, but they'll sit down and teach you and help you.

Now, that does not help you with the real estate question that we're talking about. That's a different sort of investment. And, again, then you're going to decide if you want someone staying in the property that you're going to use for vacation. Some people are comfortable with that. Some are not comfortable with that. And it's not a matter of selfishness. It's just a matter of people in your stuff.

And when you rent out your vacation property, there's people in your stuff. That you rent out your vacation property there's people in your stuff that's what goes with the territory but when you own it you really don't it's it's okay letting it sit there yeah it's yours that's my point so that's but that's a different kind of thing i know people all the time say i bought a beach house and i'm you know the renters are paying for everything and they rent it back out but then they have to deal with the couch is broken they're you know the picture with their baby that was on the table got broken or the whatever the silverware disappears or i don't know there's all this other stuff you deal with when you deal with uh vacation rental stuff it's uh it can be a pain or you dumb everything down in the property

to the point that it's okay for rental but it's not where you want it exactly the furniture the the setting the silver all that kind of stuff and so that's the it's not where you want it. Exactly. The furniture, the setting, the silver, all that kind of stuff. And so that's the stuff you've got to deal with. First world problems, for sure. Right. But there you go. So, all right, Mark is with us in Texas. Mark, welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show.

Thank you. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. Thank you all for your ministry and your good work. Thank you, sir. About 35 years ago, my wife and I paid off our first house using a technique that we learned from Larry Burkett, where you use your amortization schedule to keep you on track, and with every payment that you send in, you send in the next payment number, principal payment. That's wonderful.

I like that. Well, it worked great back then, but I'm counseling a young man now, and I told him about it, and he brought me his amortization schedule, and he's got this extra element in there. It's the PMI. And my question to you all is, if we follow the technique that I just described to you, paying the next line's principal payment,

will that, it actually erased that associated interest payment. Will it do the same with the PMI? No. The PMI is based on the original amount borrowed. And it does not go away until you reach 80% loan-to-value or less, in some cases 78% loan-to-value or less, in some cases 78% loan-to-value, and then he has to buy an appraisal from an appraisal company that is approved by the mortgage company in order to prove

that he's at the 80% loan-to-value, and then they'll drop the PMI. But the PMI is a fixed amount until you reach that point and get it dropped completely, and that's if it's a Fannie Mae conventional loan. Is it a Fannie Mae FHA or a VA? I don't know. I'm looking at his amortization. It didn't say. It just says the lender.

Yeah. So then can I counsel him to, along with the extra principal payment, also send in that month's associated PMI? He has to. Well no the annoyment each month there's a pmi won't do once a month but he and if he wants to pay extra principal that's fine it won't affect the pmi one way or the other don't prepay pmi yeah just pay one twelfth each month with the correct amount any more than that you're going to pay should be extra principal. Because here's the thing.

I might want to not do the AM schedule thing, even though it's a real neat mathematical thing. I might want to just chunk huge amounts, if he's at that point, towards that principal until we get it down to 80% loan-to-value, get rid of that PMI, which frees up even more money to attack the principal with. Does that make sense? I think it does. Let me spit it back and make sure I'm understanding.

If he just chunks money at the principal, then watch that schedule, and when he gets to that 80%, then he can readdress it with his lender. Yep, and they'll usually require him to buy an appraisal. If it's 80% of the original loan amount, they may not, but if it's 80% of today's value, they may require him to buy an appraisal, $400, $500 at his cost, from a company that they approve.

He can't just randomly pick an appraiser. Okay, and that's how he gets rid of it. But yeah, he can get it dropped if it's not an FHA or a VA. Now, it's a different process with them, but if it's a Fannie Mae, a typical conventional mortgage, that's how you get rid of it. And PMI, Anthony, is about $75 a month per $100,000 borrowed at the time you borrow it. At the time you borrow it.

And as you reduce the debt, it does not reduce it. No, sir. Until you get rid of it at the 80% L to V mark. And you have to ask the lender to do it. They're not going to do nothing automatically. They'll keep taking your money all day long. All day. This is the lender to do it. They're not going to do nothing automatically. They'll keep taking your money all day long. All day. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Dental insurance is great if somebody else is paying for it.

But if you're footing the bill, OneDental.com is a much better way for my listeners. OneDental.com is a discount membership that gets you unlimited lower rates at the dentist, not just for cleanings, but even dentures, implants, root canals, braces, and more. Whether you're getting a plan for yourself, your family, or your business, OneDental.com is the way to go. Visit OneDental.com. Anthony O'Neill joins me today on the Dave Ramsey Show. Bill is next in Washington. Hi, Bill. Welcome to the show.

Well, thank you, Dave, Anthony. Bless you both. Thank you both. I'm a 71-year year old retired PE teacher. I have $150,000 term policy that is going to jump from 85 a month in August. It's going to go to 285 a month. I've had it for over 30 years and I don't know whether or not it's a good idea to keep it at that cost per month. Doubt it. Do you have any money? I have $6,000 in savings. I've got a mortgage of $175,000 on a house that's about $250,000 in value. I'm retired. My social security is $14,000 a, and my PERS is $17. My ex, who we're good friends, she gets the other half of my PERS.

I'm debt-free other than a $1,200 a month mortgage. Do you have any money in a retirement account other than your pension that's coming in? No, stocks stocks nothing like that okay so you have six thousand dollars to your name yes okay so let's walk through um what we always do on life insurance okay it's the same thing sharon and i do. Same thing Anthony does. He's single as well. You're single, I take it. I am. Okay. What happens when you die with money?

And this is how the life insurance question is answered. Okay. What happens with money is you have $75,000 equity in your home, and you don't have a lot of money in cash or investments, and your ex will get your pension, the survivorship on the pension, and no one is harmed or left hungry because you passed away. Is that correct? Okay, I have two daughters, 39, married, two children, two grandchildren of mine. And they'll get the equity out of the house.

Yes, they both are. Yeah, they would get the equity out of the house, and they would pay for a funeral out of that. Okay. So you don't have someone that is depending on income that you're producing to eat when you that you're late behind my insurance has been an emotional legacy i have nothing else to leave if i was to die tomorrow they get 150 to split yeah well that's that's not the way to create an inheritance, though,

to the tune of, what are we talking about here, $4,000 a year now? It's going to start to get really expensive out of the income that you have coming in. I mean, you're living on a pension and on Social Security. We don't need to hit that with $285 a month. Your legacy is how you raise your kids, who they are as people, and your financial legacy is the equity in this home. I would not do that if it were me. I'd let that sucker go. I don't know. Are you hearing anything else, Anthony? No, I'm not hearing anything else, sir. I mean, I'm saying the exact same thing. And I really

want to just tell you, as a young man, and my father, I love what Dave just said said his legacy that he's leaving for me it's not about money it's about everything that he taught me as a young man and so i agree with dave i'm not i'm not paying that and i'm i wouldn't advise my father to pay that you you've given a lot a lot over these years yeah and even even if you were a horrible dad and i doubt you were yeah um leaving them 150 000 when you die doesn't fix it doesn't so um matter of fact probably hurts it so let me tell you legacy is leaving dave he's not leaving him with any debt right well there's not anything to clean up exactly yeah you don't the debt is not inherited anyway but but there's no there's no mess to clean up now i would make sure i have a will in place everyone should have but that that i would make sure i had you know uh if you

have any money savings if you can build up some savings to earmark to cover the funeral that would make it easier when you die um and i keep saying when you die you know because it is for all of us we will when you die uh it's not if you die we're not getting out of this alive so you need you know when you've got a family counting on you to eat, you need term life insurance. And everyone needs a will. And a lot of people are working on that stuff right now not because they're scared or you shouldn't be working on it because you're scared, but they're working on it because they've got some time on their hands. Yeah, they do.

It's a good time to get your will done, good time to get your term life insurance from Zander and get that stuff taken care of. But that's a really good question, Bill. I appreciate your heart to leave a legacy yeah but life insurance is always a bet that the life insurance company is betting you're going to live longer and pay them more money you're betting you're going to die sooner yeah and that's what life that's what it's what life insurance is it's really death insurance yep and so it. And so it's not a place to invest money, buying it as term in this case or buying it worse even the whole life with a cash value buildup in some of these ridiculous policies.

So good question. Thank you for joining us, and I appreciate your heart. All right, Kathy's with us in Kansas. Hi, Kathy. How can Anthony and I help? Hi. Hi, Dave and Anthony. It's good Kathy's with us in Kansas. Hi, Kathy. How can Anthony and I help? Hi. Hi, Dave and Anthony. It's good to talk to both of you. Anthony, I do want a quick little comment on your book. I bought it, and we have a senior. Actually, we're a little late getting started on it, but thankfully, we've been good savers, and our daughter has a good college fund,

and what happened was the book actually became a really good source for a friend of hers that was going to go. She came in and she announced that she is going to the University of Hawaii. And we said, how are you going to do that? And she said, oh, I'm just going to get it. So I gave her the book. She had it for a couple days. Now she's going to a community college for the first time.

I love it. Community college in Kansas versus Hawaii. Oh. Wow. I said, no. I said, no, no, no, no. Oh, man. Hey, but thanks for saving it.

Anyway, I know. So I guess here's my thought. We're doing well. We have no debt. And we had a good college time because we've been such good seniors for our daughter. Good to see her. And I guess my concern is, and she has a couple of scholarships as well, my concern isn't anything at all. And I don't ask my husband.

I leave it, leave it, leave it, leave it. And I know Dave, yours is too. But I thought, Anthony, what should I do with that 529? Should I just, I don't know. Is there anything I can do to protect it? It's lost only $6,000 so far, which is not bad. It's gone from $86,000 to $80,000. So do you have any suggestions?

So there's $86,000 in there before, and now there's $80,000 in there. How much of that are you going to use her first year? Well, the first year is probably going to be about $20,000 to $25,000. We've paid a few things, but not much, just the dorm. And then what do you think during the following three years will happen to the remaining $60,000 if you leave it? Well, see, that's what I don't know. Because if she were, like, say, a freshman or, you know, middle school, we wouldn't be quite so concerned.

Right. But my point is you're not using it all today. You're going to use it all over four years. Right. I know. Do you think it'll come back in four years i don't know kathy honestly it sounds like you're nervous right now with everything going on and dave and i do not want to just just brush over that we understand why you're nervous but hear us clearly let it sit still okay it's going to come back it's going to work in your favor you only need 20 000 to get to get through this first year.

You'll have enough to get through. All right. It's just going down on paper. In reality, we haven't been impacted just yet. It's just only on paper. Okay. Let it sit there.

Calm down. Use wisdom. Use knowledge. Don't, don't, don't allow your emotions to take it over. Your daughter is going to be okay.. Your daughter's going to be okay. The 529 is going to be okay.

Let it sit there. You've done great, by the way. Yeah. Congratulations. Rockstar, Mom. Touchdown. Very well done. $86,000, Dave, and a 529.

Yeah. That's very nice. I mean, don't you wish. Come on now. Back in the day. Come on now. When I was living on nothing. I needed it.

And yeah, instead of 186 in student loans, mom's helping her pick a good college. Yes. Mom and dad have saved money. Yes. Hey, life is good. Life is good. And debt-free degree was given away as a gift and saved a kid. Way to go, Anthony.

From racking up $200,000 in debt. Easy. That would have been an understatement. Yeah, easy. Wow. Out-of-state tuition at the University of Hawaii. Why? Because it's nice to visit Hawaii. It had nothing to do with the education. It had nothing to do with the field of study.

No, sir. Saved her from it. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. In the middle of these uncertain times, Ramsey solutions wants to give you some hope for the very first time ever we're giving you financial peace university free for 14 days go to ramsay.com hope so you can watch from home be more intentional with your time and money sign Sign up for eMeals and let them do the thinking for you. They have a shopping list generator that makes it incredibly easy. You can have your meals organized and planned for the week

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