The Ramsey Show - App - When Can I Let My Foot Off the Gas & Have Fun?

Episode Date: April 6, 2022

Ken Coleman & Rachel Cruze discuss: What will the best career fields be in the future? Using retirement to pay off your house, Marketing yourself in the job market, Buying a house now vs. investing, When you can relax Baby Step 6. Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is The Ramsey Show. It's where we help you live your best life by being healthy relationally, successful professionally, and peaceful financially. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by Rachel Cruz. We are here taking your calls, your questions this hour. The phone number to jump in is toll free. It's 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225.

We know that this is about real life, and so we know these calls can be sensitive and private, so we'll change your name, location, and even some of those details so that we can hopefully get you some practical answers so that you can hopefully move forward, I mean, with hope, on a very clear path forward. That's why we are here so excited that you have joined us. Let's start it off this hour with Tom in Tampa, Florida. Tom, how can we help? Hi. Thank you for taking my call.

You bet. I had a question on paying off my mortgage. So the wife and I read Total Money Makeover and we are completely debt free except for the house, but we do have 163 in mutual funds, but we'd have to pull 190 from our Roth contributions, which we are able, but wasn't sure if that was a good idea. Yeah. How old are you, Tom? Are you over 40? You're what? I'm sorry. 40. You're 40 years old? That's a young man, by the way. Young man. Young man, I know. So if there are non-retirement accounts, I would consider it.

But your Roth, in order to take money out of retirement, you have to be 59 and a half not to be penalized. So I would not touch any retirement for any reason except to avoid a bankruptcy or a foreclosure, which obviously you guys are not in. Do you guys have kids? Five.

Oh, wow. Yeah, what are their ages? So we got five, six, 17, 18, and 20 uh 20 i'm sorry 19 and 20 wow okay so half kind of a step out of the house and then to in that you're that for i'm just thinking college in my head too um yes what's your income uh about 83 a year. Okay. But with the, with the question as well,

because from my understanding, we could take out of Roth contributions that we've made. And, and we can pull from that without taking a hit. But our, our bigger problem is that we're right now we're at about 35% of our take home for, um, the, the mortgage payment. So I know that's well above what, what y'all suggest for 25%. Yeah. Yeah. We, that 25 to 30% for sure is, is where we usually hit. I mean, I, I'm not, I'm not too concerned about it. I still would not touch retirement though. I would not take money

out of, um, out of that retirement. And your mutual fund, you have $163,000 in the mutual fund? Yeah. That's not associated with the Roth? Correct. We have a total of $646,000 in total investment. Yeah. You guys have done great. That's fantastic. Y'all have done an awesome job. Rachel, I got to tell you, Tom, listen, I think this is an income thing. I got two eyes for you, income and intensity. I think you could make more than 83, and I think that as a result of that, you can increase your intensity on paying the mortgage off. I wouldn't touch those mutual funds at all. I understand the formula that we talk about, but because you guys have no other debt, that's why Rachel's not concerned about that.

I wouldn't touch that investment money. That is in a good place. You're only 40 years of age. Over the next 25-30 years, that's going to be a tremendous amount of money. You've shown great discipline to this point, my goodness. Five kids and doing all this. I think it's an income increase and

an intensity increase in paying off the home. I don't think you need to touch that money. I wouldn't personally if I was in your shoes. So I guess that's part of the question then because I'm a government employee and my wife is at home with the kids. Sure. So increasing the income would be pretty difficult. Only if you stay in the government. I understand that.

The government's going to give you those gradual increases, and you largely have no ladder. But how can your talent and skill plus experience transfer to the private sector, where we're in the hottest job market in the history of our nation tom are you interested in looking outside of government work yes sir do you suffer with a little bit of doubt as to whether or not you could cut it or no one will hire you because you've worked with the government for so long no good then what are we waiting on i'm serious what are you waiting on what do you do uh describe what you do the type of work um well i'm a surveyor with uh private

police and uh other background. Okay, great. So you don't have to list them for me right now, but can you think of three or four other jobs in the private sector that would allow you to do that kind of work, similar work? And even if you had to get some basic training, you could springboard off of this? Can you think of two or three things? Yes, I can. Okay, great.

Do you have any idea? If you don't, it's okay, but I want you to go research it. Do you have any idea? If you don't, it's okay, but I want you to go research it. Do you have any idea what those pay, what those career opportunities are beyond just that getting in, what advancement might look like? Do you know those numbers? No, I don't. Okay, so let's just say that you can get a job in a local gig. You're not moving a family, no uprooting, and it's private sector, and you're making $115,000. Would you jump on that, yes or no? That's still difficult because the stability of the government job with the retirement. Let me tell you something. That is a total lie, and I want to set you free of that.

The government stability is like saying, because it's the government, I'm never going to get laid off. I'm always going to have a place to work. And that's not true, number one, but it's also that it's saying that the private sector is risky. It's not risky, Tom. It's not risky at all if you can provide value. So I think a couple of options, Tom, you got. You can take from your original question. If you want to take a little bit out of the mutual fund

to throw out the house to make you feel a little bit better, you could. Ken wouldn't touch it at all. Again, we're not touching any retirement. That's an option. Looking to see, is there even getting my income up? There's some great opportunities out there. Is there a move there that would take that 35% of your take-home pay going to your mortgage down to 25%, even 29%? I don't care, but it lowers that percentage so you guys can actually gain some traction.

Or I'll give you a third option, Tom, because I don't know. And I don't know. I mean, the housing market right now is just insane. But running numbers and looking, I don't know. Is there another option for your home of where you could go? It's not crazy.

If it was 50% of your income, I would be telling you to move. But you guys are teetering enough in life because of your debt-free, all of it, your income could change depending on a job move.

Things can kind of start happening to get that percentage down, so I'm not worried. If you want to throw some out of the mutual fund to the mortgage, you can, but I would just keep chipping away. You're in great shape, Tom. Doing great, Tom. You really are. Figure out the best way to pay this mortgage down.

We gave you some options. And please just look, see what could be for you. Ken wants you to have a new job, Tom. Oh, I want him to make more money. Yes. Because I want him to pay off that house. He's 40. The market needs him. This is The Ramsey Show. Let me tell you a story about two families that are very much alike in a lot of ways. Both families have two working parents and a couple of young kids. Each has debt and has struggled to make ends meet. But they're starting to make headway with their budgets and smarter decisions with money.

They have dreams and plans, and the only real difference is that one family has the right amount of term life insurance, and the other doesn't. Big difference. If one of the parents die, and that does happen, their well-being would be destroyed. Paying for the mortgage, utilities, food, and other bills would be impossible, let alone saving for education or retirement. That's why every day I talk relentlessly about getting term life insurance. Just go to zanderinsurance.com or call 800-356-4282 and see how inexpensive it really is.

Be the family that takes those deliberate steps to be different and responsible. It really does make you the hero of your story, and it puts you on course for better things ahead. Welcome back, America. You are joining the conversation here on The Ramsey Show. So thrilled that you have joined us. It is all about your life, and we want to help you win. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me this hour in studio, and we are here to take your calls. It is a free phone call, 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225.

Rachel and I were out during the break shaking hands and saying hello to folks. It's always nice to see people from all around the country, and I'd like to mention we'd love to have you join us. It's free. There's no ticket cost. We've got cold beverages, hot beverages, baked goods. Come see us, ramsaysolutions.com. We'd love to see you. It's always great to see fine folks. And we've got a great crowd out in the lobby today. I know. It's that spring break. I feel like people

swing through. That's right. It is fun, though. Let's get back to the phones. Baltimore, Maryland. Home of the Orioles in Major League Baseball. I like the random facts for you. I would not. You would not have known that. I would have gone Ravens.

That's the only sporting team I know about. Well, the Orioles have been around much longer, so I had to give them some love. I bet Sam knows all about it. Sam, are you a baseball or football fan? Hello, Sam. Can you hear me? Yeah, Rachel asked you, are you a Ravens fan or a Orioles fan, or both? I grew up an Orioles fan with Cal Ripken and Eddie Murray.

That's my guy. That's my guy. I can't even say that word. Hey, Sam, true story. She's never even heard of the Baltimore Orioles until moments ago. I've heard of it. I'm sorry. I know.

That's right. That's awesome. Hey, thank you so much for the call how can we help well i hope you can hear me clearly we can and god bless you both okay great um you know i am the 180 from the last caller ken i have the proximity principle sitting in my car next to me, someone's play that needs to be shaped into something. And I've had a very difficult battle trying to shape myself into something that the market wants to buy, if that makes sense to you. Why have you, what do you want to do? What have you tried to shape yourself into?

It feels like there's some intentionality there, but it hasn't worked out. What have you been trying to shape yourself into? Well, I'd say trying to do too many things and intellectualizing them and not offering the market one specific thing has maybe been a problem for me. Good. That's very good analysis. Oh, thank you very much. Well, I get gleaned wisdom from Dave and you guys and everyone in the Bible,

but I have been too many for too little value. And what I probably want your advice on is kind of along with your book and along with the videos and YouTube and everything, try to really settle on something, part into it, like this is for me. I can do it. I'm intentional about it, and I wake up every day. Okay. But I have trouble marketing myself, Ken, whether on LinkedIn or, you know, who knows about that.

Sam, I don't think that's your problem. I think you did a great job of analyzing your challenge earlier. And I think the marketing yourself is, I can give you some techniques and some resources on that, but I think the issue is you've tried to be too many things, and in trying to describe yourself to others, you're not really clear. And so I want to simplify this really quick. I'm going to ask you three really simple questions, and I want you to answer them, okay? But I'm going to give them to you one at a time, right after another, then answer all three. You ready?

Who are the people you most want to help? What problem do they have or desire? And then what solution or solutions to that problem or desire do you get most excited about offering? Now answer that for me. Roll right through that because I think you have an answer. Be super specific. I really have to answer the first is i want to help myself

now that may sound egotistical but from the places i've battled to come up if i place mental health and physical health i help so many others when i'm healthy so okay so again i want i appreciate the answer you're being too pure and i've just found out what's really going on with you would you if i interviewed everybody that knows you, would they say that you're an over-analysis kind of guy, an over-thinker? That would be the understatement of the year that you're not talking

to me right now. I would be saying that you're not talking to Sam in Baltimore. Yes, my mind tells me not to ask. I know, and that's okay. So, Sam, I didn't ask you that question to embarrass you. I asked you that question to set you free because here's the deal. You're talking to somebody who does that. All right?

So we've got to stop thinking. You didn't even answer my question. Who are the people you most want to help? Tell me right now. Who are they? The people I most want to help are people who have been in the same situation as me. So once I rise, I will help them rise. I appreciate, but you're still not answering.

You got really close. What are they dealing with? Those people that have the same challenges or they've come through or they're struggling with what you did, what is that? Tell me. Okay, I think the people I most want to help is what the markets need for helping. Something like that. You broke up.

We were so close. You broke up. We were so close. You broke up. Who are the people you most want to help? I think you got me. Well, I can't understand you, unfortunately. So here's what we're going to do. He's breaking up so bad. Let me just kind of walk through

a couple other quick steps here, and then I'm going to give you two things, Sam. I'm going to give you the Get Clear Career Assessment. It's a 20-minute assessment that I created, and it's going to give you some very clear details about yourself. Just answer honestly. Don't overthink. Then I'm going to give you From Paycheck to Purpose. Think of these two tools. One is the compass. One is the guide up the mountain. But here's the process that I want you to walk through before you get these tools. At the end of the day, Sam, you and everybody else, when we find work that we really love,

it is always going to be attached to people. Whether directly or indirectly, the work that you do, you will see a result from your work that you can say, this is helping people. Give an example. Somebody could love being a software developer and love that work, and they never really see people that their software may touch. But they know that if they come to Ramsey Solutions, for example, and they develop software or they develop a website or an app, they can see that it is providing transformation to somebody that they may never meet.

We've got to understand that there's always a direct or indirect connection to people, Rachel, when we do work. And so the reason I ask this question is because people get so hung up on a job title. I don't care about job title. I don't even care about career path. I first want to know, who do I want to help? That's good. Why do I want to help? And that's that problem or desire they have.

By the way, if you want to design shoes for women, that's a desire. That's just as worthy as solving a problem. So we really want to get behind what's that personal connection. So Sam, those were the reasons for the questions. I want you on your own to answer those questions. I want you to stop thinking, put some answers down. I want you to get four or five people in your life

who are truth tellers, who know him very well to check those answers and then take the assessment and read the book. So good. So I have the answer for me, but I want to hear the answer for you. Why is it that you start with who are the people you want to help? That's the first question. It's not what's your passion in life. You know what I mean? Why do you start with that? Because we long to make a contribution to this world. Like every human, I don't care what your faith is, your politics, what country you're from, what race. Everybody wants to make a contribution to this world. So the reason I ask it in the form of who are the people you want to help, two reasons.

Number one, I'm trying to shut their brain down and get their heart to answer. Because they will, by the way, even the people that struggle on the air, and this is hard to do. Yeah, totally. So this is nerve wracking. But their heart begins to fill in the answer because they're connected to a person and it's almost always connected to past pain. Whether we experienced the pain directly or we saw someone else go through the pain. I mean, caller after caller after caller after caller.

That seems confused on the Ken Coleman show. After about two or three minutes, we find that what was really going on, they had the idea, but they needed validation that, A, they had what it took to be able to do it. So I start with people first, and then I'm trying to drive deeper into, well, you told me these people, you want to help them. What's

that specific problem or two that you get excited about? And that's why we do that. I want to turn our brains off because when you start thinking about job future, career path, that's intimidating. Yeah. And I understand that. And you know this.

I teach this. I want people to know. A lot of people new to all of us, Ramsey personalities from time to time. I don't believe there's just one dream job for everybody. I believe that you and I are both in our dream jobs, but I also know there are other dream jobs. What makes that true? Any job where I can use my talent, what I do best to do work I love, that's passion, to produce results that directly matter to my values. That's your simple dream job description. So loosen up, engage the heart. Sam, hang on the line. We're going to get you some great resources. Good luck to you, Sam. You're a great guy.

Yes. So pure. And boy, do I understand overthinking. I'm an over-thinker in the Hall of Fame. Hey, don't move. Rachel and I aren't going anywhere, don't you? Because more of the Ramsey Show is coming up right around the corner. Thank you. welcome back america you are joining the ramsey show i'm ken coleman joined by rachel cruz and we are here to take your phone calls you want to financially? You want to win relationally? You want to win professionally? Sure you do. How can we help? We are here for you. Breakthrough is one phone

call away. 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Let's go to Tampa, Florida. Nathan is on the line. Nathan, how can we help? Hey, how are you guys doing today? We are having a blast. What's going on with you? Good, good. I'm actually calling with a pretty good problem to have. I just got accepted into grad school. I got accepted into two programs, and I was hoping if I could get some financial advice because I want to make a good decision and pick a track that will be in a field that's more lucrative in the long term. I got accepted into a strategic intelligence program and a project management program. And I'm going on a free tuition waiver because I work at the school that I got accepted to. And I'm just

trying. Yeah. So so right now I'm in between baby steps three and four. So, you know, building up my emergency fund, investing in my retirement. And I just want to make the best decision to go into a field that kind of sets me up better in the long run. So what do you guys suggest as to what I should do from a career aspect? That's a great question. So I want you to describe the first, the PM I know, project management. What was the first one you said? And give me like a little bit of detail around that.

It's an MS in strategic intelligence. So things like counterterrorism. I can work for like the FBI or the CIA. Okay. So like, that's kind of where I thought in my head, but I thought, or a project manager. Those are two very different routes, Nathan. So the question has to be, yeah, which one are you leaning towards? Which, if you look at the paths that those specific areas of study open up, which one is most

attractive to you? Just the feeling, it just feels better when you think about it. I'm teetering, I'm right at 50-50, mainly just because I like to make my decisions based on where I think the industries will go in the future. And I set myself up best financially. All right. You're a smart guy, and you're crushing it, by the way. Let's remove your brain for a second because I've got great news for you. Project management is one of the most versatile studies of discipline.

It's extremely versatile in that you can do project management for so many different industries, so many different types of organizations, and then even more exciting about project management, there's a ladder for you to grow. I mean, you can really move up into an executive level over time by continuing to deliver as a project manager. So I want to tell you something, that's a fantastic path. And then the other path, kind of call it counterterrorism, maybe even artificial intelligence, cyber security. Yes. That's where I go.

Yes. Action star. I forgot to mention that. That'll pay you $20 million a film. So there you go. Both of those have tremendous upside. So let's remove, because I heard what you did, and I like the way you answered that. You're very strategic.

Let's shut the logic down, because I think I've made the case. Both of those are great financial opportunities for you. So let's remove that. What is your heart most interested in in either one of those paths? Well, I got my undergrad in sport management, and I always wanted to go back to that field, but I learned quickly with COVID and entry level that the pay wasn't there, the opportunity wasn't there, part of why I moved to

Florida, and I would love to get back into that field, and I feel like both industries could get me back there someday. So I'm more leaning along the lines of where Tampa will be in the next 10 years, what field would I want to be in, you know? Well, if you want to get back into sports management, which is essentially be a sports executive one day, am I right? Yes. I would go the project management route because the counterterrorism is very, that's a different, that's a whole different ballgame. Are the skills transferable?

Is the experience transferable? I think you can make that case. But if I want to get into sports management, I want to prove that I was a really good numbers process systems guy because that's what they're looking for. These big-time pro organizations, all of them now have entire staffs that largely don't know much at all about what happens on the field or the court, but they're crunching numbers.

They're looking at data. So if that's where you want to go, I would lean towards project management. Rachel? Yeah, I mean, that's your end game, because that's what I'm trying to figure out. Because I think both, I think it's smart to ask, okay, so what are each industry, where's it going to be? But I mean, I think both cases, I think you're fine, Nathan. I think it's just to say, hey, in 10 years, what would your perfect world be? What would you be doing? And what are the things that you can do to get you there? But you're still, how old are you, Nathan? I'm 23 years old.

Yeah, I was going to say, I feel like you're still young in a great way to say, God, you have so much, so much time ahead of you. Even if you change courses, Nathan, in 10 years, it's okay. Very good point. Can I ask you why you're so hung up on being in Tampa for a long period of time? Tampa's great. Love Tampa. I have friends there. Originally, I'm from Connecticut, so I wanted to get out of the cold. But the biggest thing is like, Tampa is the big economic hub right now, innovation hub. So when I got an opportunity

to work with the school, I knew they had like the employee tuition waiver. I know you guys are big on avoiding debt, so I'd be able to finish my master's debt-free. So I just wanted to be here and involved in everything going on here. So here's my point. I'm just going to play older brother for a moment. Don't limit yourself to Tampa with the training and what you're going to be doing. I love that you're doing this debt-free. Do the schooling here because you've got the situation. But open your mind up to multiple markets throughout the country for opportunities. Tampa is not your only place that you can be successful. So listen, I wouldn't give up on the sports management, but I do like the nontraditional route.

And I love the project management. It's probably which way I would lean. But Rachel's right. Both of these are fabulous industries that pay well and provide for advancement. So I like that. It's a great question. What a sharp young guy. I know.

No debt. And see, Rachel, this is very interesting. Here's a guy who figured this out. He's like, now, if I go here and I do this, I can get master's level education for zero dollars. It's amazing. Absolutely incredible. Yeah, I love that. There's so many 33-year-olds, Nathan,

that wish that they were you at 23. Isn't that the truth? That is so true. All right, let's go next to Burlington, Vermont. Landon is on the line there. Landon, how can we help? Hi there, Rachel and Ken. How are you guys today?

Doing great. How can we help? So three short pieces of background. I am currently a University of Vermont student. My major is computer science, minors in stats and math. I will be graduating in May. And then second piece for you is that I just got married in July 2021 to my lovely wife, Sarah. Nice. Congratulations.

Thank you. And then finally, the third piece of background is that we are currently on baby step four because I was fortunate enough to go to UVM for $1 because of a calculation mistake in a grant, but otherwise it's been fully covered with a massive blessing from the Lord. And I guess our question for you today is we are both very interested. Do you understand what he said? Is that real? Because of a clerical error on some grant paperwork? No, no, no.

Sorry, sorry. It was, I just got charged $1 because of a little calculation error, but otherwise it was my grant that covered me. Okay, the way it sounded is if somebody made an error and you got to hold them to it, you only went for $1. That's what I thought, too. Okay, I got it. All right, what's your question?

Anyway, my question is we are both very interested in having a family in the near future, and we are interested in buying a house, but I'm wondering whether we should prioritize saving up for a 20% down payment first or prioritize retirement saving. Yeah, that's a great question. I would say for you guys, where you're at, you're going to be graduating in May, newly married, all that. Are you all going to for you guys, where you're at, you're going to be graduating in May, newly married, all that. Are you all going to stay in the area that you're at currently?

Are you guys looking to move? Is that going to depend on the job? What's your plan in the next six months? So funny that you ask. We are interested in moving. One of the places that I just applied to, mostly out-of-state jobs is what I'm applying to, but I just actually applied to Ramsey Solutions yesterday. Oh, that's cool, Landon.

Maybe we'll see you in Nashville. Yeah, we'll see. So I would say, depending on, I would wait, pause, figure out what city you guys want to live in, figure out the job situation, wait a year, rent, you're fine, and then press play on saving up for the down payment and then retirement. But just pause for a year. If you want to go ahead and open up a Roth or rent, you're fine, and then press play on saving up for the down payment and then retirement. But just pause for a year. If you want to go ahead and open up a Roth or something, you can do that, but I would wait to buy a house. I love that advice, and you're already in baby step four, so you're off and running. Good for you. Appreciate the question. Wow. Will Landon make it to Ramsey Solutions? I don't know. We won't be able to answer that anytime soon.

Don't move. We can't answer your questions. Coming up, this is the Ramsey Solutions? I don't know. We won't be able to answer that anytime soon. Don't move. We can't answer your questions. Coming up, this is the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by Rachel Cruz. Thrilled to have you with us. The phone number to jump in is 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. 888-825-5225. All right, Rachel, a very interesting phenomenon going on right now of what they're calling boomerang employees.

All right, so kind of set the context for this. Since August of 2021, leading up to the jobs report in March, we've had over 4 million plus people changing jobs each month. It's crazy. So we're hurtling towards 30 million people that have changed jobs. So that's one factor. A lot of people leveling up, getting a bigger paycheck. As a result, we've got the lowest unemployment rate we've ever seen, 3.4%. And so there's this hiring war that is going on.

I mean, we see it. We showed a picture of a – it went viral on the Ken Coleman show, a picture of a Panda Express that was offering $68,000 to a manager of a Panda Express, plus tuition, plus, plus, plus. Oh, my gosh uh we also showed a recent taco bell hiring sign that said cell phone breaks included so instead of smoke this is for the younger generation they don't want to smoke a cig they want to go they want to scroll instagram check tiktok and instagram tiktok so you're way cooler than i am well great no no, I'm not. Let's be honest. You like, drop that in there?

Yeah, they want to scroll. So what's happening is, is there's big push for hiring. So companies are losing people to somebody else and employees are going, hey, I can get a 20% bump. I don't blame them. Right? So they go, right? So boomerang employees are two types of people.

Some of those people who left jobs, Rachel, in that 30 million are already realizing that the grass was not greener, to use an old, old phrase. They got there. Recruiters may have sold them a bill of goods, whatever. And they go, it's not what I want it to be. And even though I got the bump, I don't like it. Can I go back home? That's one boomerang employee.

And then the second one is the employee who left prior to the pandemic maybe three four five seven years ago yeah but because of technology facebook linkedin whatever people stay in touch longer and better and so companies are now in this employee uh they they're like they can't find anybody and they realize wait a second I wonder if Joe, who left us seven years ago, would want to come back. Interesting. So it's the employers reaching out. That too.

So we have two things going on. Employers reaching out to past people who left well, meaning they didn't burn a bridge. Sure, sure. And then these people who have left and realize, it's not as good as I thought it was going to be. Can I come back? And so I know in an audience this large, there should be no shame in your game, is the phrase.

If you made a decision and you left well, and you feel like the relationship's still there, and it's not working out, swallow your pride. Yeah. I'd go check. And then if the company comes calling for you, and you feel like, all right, man, you know what? I'll go back.

I just think it's interesting. It's called the boomerang employee. Thoughts on that? Well, it's funny because the boomerang generation was a whole other thing. When I was in school and you would come back and live back at home. But the boomerang employee, I'm curious how many people left jobs specifically just for a higher salary, higher pay, that are unhappy. Yeah, we don't have the data on how many. I know, but I would be curious.

I would love to see it. If anyone out there, if that was you, call in. I'll pet you. I just am fascinated because that's a big thing because it is so competitive out there. Very competitive. And if you love the place that you work, but man, someone's going to offer you yeah 15 20 grand more yeah your mind that says okay i'm glad you brought this up right like yeah so here's a really quick caution to those of you who don't want to become boomerangs right you know okay so what do we do all right let's understand what happens psychologically

when somebody a recruiter reaches out to you or a friend says, hey, my company's hiring, are you interested? And that company shows interest and they offer you a job. Two things happen that are really hard to overcome. The first thing is you get offered a job and it's more money that, that feels good. It's like, whoa, I got more money. I'm going to be able to do this, this, this, this. Yeah. I've already spent it in my heart. A hundred percent. The second thing that happens is it looks good. We get to tell our coworkers, our friends and family, hey, I had a recruiter reach out

and they offered me a job. Don't we all want to be wanted? So there's two big psychological things that you got to be careful. Yeah. It's almost like the old advice to sleep on it two or three days so that you don't make a decision based on the feeling because that check feels good, bigger check, and then the promotion looks good. It's a little status.

It can make you make a bad decision. Because this is your world. I don't live in this world, the career world. But how have you felt like this has been? Because the numbers are staggering 30 million in just like four months or something right i've changed like it's just crazy yeah so what are you what are you seeing are you seeing that people are branching out they never would have because they you know maybe the money is enticing and they actually are thriving are they finding a setback

are they like do you know what i mean i I'm curious. It's still so unstable. Well, it will eventually calm down. It'll cycle out. But I don't know how soon it's going to cycle out. Here's what's driving it. I think the majority of people are moving because the pandemic created an opportunity for them to level up. They just flat out said, you know what? I'm not treated like I'm super valuable.

This is a function of poor leadership and how employees have been treated for a long time. So they're going, wait a second. I don't feel valued. I don't feel like this is super meaningful work to me. So I am going to take that immediate hit, which is a bigger paycheck. Show me the money. You know, the classic line from, I think that's one. And I do think that there are a lot of people that a little bit more on where I'm focused is helping people do something that matters. I do think that the pandemic brought on a massive change. So people got more comfortable with change, which they're not normally comfortable with. Number two, mortality set in. They were looking at death numbers scrolling on the screen every day. And I think you start to go, what am I doing with my

life? So because two things happened. One, people started looking for work that they would really enjoy to go after. And then we saw entrepreneurial starts. So the numbers have been record numbers of people starting small businesses, working for themselves. Yes. So all that's in that same thing. Because there's a flexibility aspect too that people look for more these days than they did 20 years ago. Some people vowed that they would never go back to the office again. They said, if my company makes me come back, I'm not going back. So very, very interesting. Let's get back to the phones. Julie is joining us in San Antonio, Texas. Julie, how can we help? Hi there. I actually have kind of a unique question. I am on baby step six and on track to pay off my home in the next two years. And I'm scratching my head asking myself, when am I going to have fun?

I've been paying off all this debt and concerned that I'm paying off the house, that the house does need some repairs. And I find myself wobbling between do I want to pay off a house that needs repairs because I'm not using any money for the repairs, or do I need to save some money and get a new house? It's really funny. I mean, I've enjoyed this whole process, but now I don't even know how to spend money anymore.

It's kind of interesting. No, we hear that a lot, for sure, especially if you've been very motivated on it. Because we tell people once you pay off debt and you have your emergency fund, you can kind of let your foot off the gas. And it's more looking ahead. It's not as that gazelle intensity that we talk about, maybe since one through three. So how much will the house repairs cost? The house repairs will probably run about $30,000.

Okay. How much is your house worth? The house is worth about $260,000. Okay. Do you like the house? Are you happy where you're at? I am happy with the neighborhood. I'm happy with the house.

However, I do see that there's some improvements needed. Sure. And I'm nervous to spend money, honestly, on the repairs. Yeah, it's more of that. How much do you have left to pay off? You said you have two more years. Yeah. If I keep going the way that I'm going, I have $115,000 to pay off.

Nice. And are these repairs urgent? Are the things that, like, really need to be done now? Or you just see, hey, in the next little bit, I probably need to start fixing some stuff no they're not urgent i've done some but that that i paid off were the urgent repairs okay okay they're not urgent that's great well i mean julie two years is is pretty fast so i would pay it i would go ahead pay off the house save up money do the repairs and all that

and just force yourself to do it say my house needs to be I can spend this money it's good money being spent you're not just going crazy with it but I would do that

because when you don't have a mortgage you're going to be able to save up so that $30,000 so much faster than you will right now I love it

since they're not urgent I take a little fun vacay then come back and deal with all those repairs. There you go. You've earned it. You're going to pay your house off. Way to go.

Congrats, Julie. Hey, Rachel Cruz, thank you. Thanks to our team in the glass. Appreciate you. Thank you, America. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, it's Rachel Cruz, co-host on The Ramsey Show.

If you want to do your debt-free scream live on the show, visit ramseysolutions.com slash debtfrees scream. We'd love for you to come to Nashville and tell Dave your story. That's ramsaysolutions.com slash debt-free scream.