The Ramsey Show - App - When It Comes to Investing, Keep It Simple (Stupid) (Hour 2)

Episode Date: May 3, 2024

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm George Campbell, joined by my co-host, Rachel Cruz, who's also the co-host of Smart Money Happy Hour. So be sure to check that show out if you enjoy this one. You might even enjoy it more. Who knows? Who knows? We have a lot of fun on that show.

Big question mark, but it is fun. And our recent episode was all about how birthdays and parties and gifts have gotten out of control in today's world. That's right. So it's a fun one. Are you setting me up for a birthday? I'm not doing anything. Happy birthday to George, though.

Thank you. Because it is his birthday today. George, happy birthday. I thought it was apropos. After a small money happy hour release yesterday, the birthday today, we're on the show. There's so much, so much happening. The stars have aligned.

So much is happening. So great. Give us a call, 888-825-5225, and we will give you our best advice. And remember, it's free. So take it all with a grain of salt. Olivia kicks us off in LA. What is happening, Olivia? Hi, thank you so much for taking my call or my question. And my question is to give a little backstory. My husband and I, we got married very young with little knowledge or actually no knowledge of how to handle finances. And we've kind of stumbled through life, through marriage, through children, through buying our house. And although we've always wanted to tackle it, It's kind of complicated because when we do discuss it, we get into arguments of, you know, well, you bought this and you did this. So I've kind of

had a hard time communicating with him. And it's gotten to the point now that I think it's more peaceful if I just try to do things on my own the best that I can. And we both work. So I'm wondering if that's possible and what you would recommend to do. Yeah, it's difficult. And a lot of couples find themselves, Olivia, in your exact situation because it is a touchy subject. And especially, you know, you just said like we got married young and we're just kind of getting through these big parts of life. And what we find, Olivia, very often is that it's not usually a money problem. More than likely there's a marriage issue going on. And I wonder how you guys communicate about money. Do you communicate about other things in life in the same kind of pattern or tone. Right. I would agree with that. And I've also suggested that we seek marriage counseling.

Yeah. And he's kind of just like, well, he doesn't say, yeah, let's do it. He's just like, huh. And then changes the subject. So at this point, I'm like, well, you know, if marriage counseling is not important or you're not recognizing that we need it, how are we going to move forward? Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's where a lot of people find the fork in the road of just this idea of, oh my gosh, is this kind of the reality of where we're at in our relationship and in our marriage. And when one spouse is wanting to work on it and do it well, and the other spouse seems to just be apathetic to it, it's very hurtful, right? It's very hurtful. It feels like a level of rejection.

You're probably asking yourself, am I not worth putting the work in and actually having effort towards this? Have you shared that with them, like what Rachel just said, the kind of the gravity and depth of this, of how you feel about it? Not in those exact words, but I have had conversations where I feel that I could get more input and I just don't see the effort. And it turns into, well, you're always unpleasable. You know, anything I do doesn't satisfy you. Yeah. And I've come to think that maybe I have extremely high expectations.

No, it's his immaturity. It's that, but also... He doesn't want to change. The way you're confronting him, though, Olivia, it is pointing fingers. I want more input from you to you, you know, to him. And I want you to stop saying what you want from him. And I want to start talking out of Olivia. What is Olivia? What is Olivia feeling? And what does Olivia want? Hey, I feel very hurt. I feel isolated. I don't feel like we have a partnership. I don't feel like we have a marriage. I feel like

I'm doing this on my own. I don't feel like you care about me. And I'm in a place that I want this to be better. I want this to be better. And this is where I'm at. Would you consider, you know, X, Y, and Z going to marriage therapy? Would you consider sitting down and doing a budget? Because I think what ends up happening, not that you're meaning to, Olivia, but I think it can be so easy, even in a nice tone, to point the finger of this is what you're doing wrong. So he automatically is going to be defensive and say, well, this is what you're doing wrong. And it's this back and forth game that you guys have been playing versus just owning your own perspective and what you're thinking and feeling about you and less about him, if that makes sense. But that could be a starting place.

But I think that's one of the best things that you can do with your spouse. And it's very vulnerable and it's very scary. But when you do just say, here's what I'm fearful of. Here's what I'm feeling. Here's what's causing me to lose sleep at night. I mean, there's so much when your marriage is in a level of like, man, this is just not fun.

This isn't good. This isn't what I thought marriage was going to be. And not even that, because sometimes we can have unrealistic expectations in general. And I think asking him very point blank, hey, I want to set up an appointment in two weeks with this marriage counselor.

Will you meet me at the office at two o'clock? You know what I mean? And like, be pretty bold with it. Because I think once you guys get on the same page, I think you're just missing each other. And I think that happens a lot, George, with couples. the office at two o'clock you know what i mean and like be pretty uh pretty bold with it because i think once you guys get on the same page i think you're just missing each other and i think that happens a lot george with couples especially when they've had a pattern of doing things a certain way it becomes even harder to change how long have you guys been married olivia it's gonna be 20 years in january oh my goodness you know what my therapist calls it because we go i mean winston

and i we do marriage counseling we do individual therapy we do i mean like i'm all into understanding yourself and work because i think it's so helpful to give the tools um but she always said it she called it your dance and winston and i have our dance like we have our thing that you kind of just end up going back into when you're not even aware and you look up you're like oh my gosh we're back in that same dang pattern and when you can get to the point olivia where you can kind of laugh at it, that's where Winston and I are. I'm like, oh my God. You're so self-aware. You can see it happening. And you can pause and use new tools that you've learned because we're all trying to, you know, in some ways, manage our way through life, right? And so there's things that you've learned to protect yourself. I mean, there's a lot there. There's a lot there, Olivia.

The way you grew up, the mistakes you've made. And then once you guys start those healthy patterns on your marriage, then suddenly when you're like, babe, the money is stressing me out. He's able to be like, okay, I hear you. Because you're using a different way of, you know, different language, different tone, different approaching, all different ways of life. But again, Olivia, just like so many people, I really, I would encourage you guys, it's a marriage thing at this point. But to give you a quick,

you know, you called into a money show. So, and I'm not a therapist. You're not a therapist. So we will not claim. Rachel's way closer than I am. No, no, no. We won't claim that. But I would say to start off and just say, hey, don't point blame at him, but say, hey, can you help me with next month's budget? And Olivia, we'll give you guys Financial Peace University and every dollar premium for a year and do a mock budget on every dollar. And then just say, hey, I would just love your input. I would love for you to look over this with me because I want to make sure that my brain's not the only one in this.

I want your input. I want to know your thoughts. Your input matters. only one in this. I want your input. I want to know your thoughts. And here's your input matters. It's a different conversation. That's right. Yep. Instead of pushing the blame. And hopefully that's a good jumpstart on the money conversation.

But again, I think the marriage piece, it's big. I mean, working on that. Getting a spouse on board is one of the hardest things you'll do in a marriage, but it is worth the work. And that might mean, hey, we're going to listen to Smart Money Happy Hour. This is a fun podcast. Then, hey, what if we to listen to Smart Money Happy Hour. This is a fun podcast. Then, hey, what if we took Financial Peace University?

That may then lead into counseling down the line as he sort of warms up to this idea and realizes he's not the villain here. We're trying to grow together in this marriage instead of apart. This isn't a conflict where we're at each other. We're aiming at the same thing together. And those are the kind of things that will help. So hang on the line.

We'll gift you those gifts. And I hope he uses them. And I hope there's some amazing transformation on the other side. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Rachel Cruz. Open phones at 888-825-5225. I'm buying my co-host some time. I see Chow's down on a cookie from the Baker Street Cafe. I'm sorry. We have like warm cookies. She can't pass that up. And Melissa just gave me one at the break.

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Adrienne is up next in Asheville, North Carolina. What's going on, Adrienne? Hi. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. So I heard you say in the last segment that if you do the stuff twice that you're really stupid and I am No, no. What did you do twice?

Well, I was in debt My husband and I claimed bankruptcy in the end of 2020 and now I'm back in debt and I have a house um in florida i live in north carolina now and rent um and i want to know if i should sell the house there to pay off my debt yeah i'd probably sell your house regardless because being a long distance landlord's really difficult but um but adrian tell me uh what caused you to go back into debt. Well, we decided to move up here when I finished nursing school.

My husband said, you know, we could use a fresh start. You can literally get a job anywhere once you're a nurse, but move. So we moved. And then within a couple months of living here, my mom got really sick and passed away. I'm sorry. And not knowing anybody in the area, like, I just kind of coped by spending money on like everything. Yeah. And anything, you know, $200 pair of shoes, $100 lunch out, like you name it. And and then some other things happened over the past couple of years. And so I'm just ready to get out of debt. Now, I know you said it's tough to be a landlord long distance. I actually have a really great tenant in there, and it's been working out wonderfully. But your life's not working out wonderfully.

No, you're right. How much debt are you in? So in total, including the mortgage down there, about $225,000 to $230,000. What's not the mortgage? What's just your consumer debt? So the mortgage is about $67,000, so about $160,000. And is $160,000 mostly credit cards, or what's in that? No, so about $97,000 of it is student loans okay um about

9 000 is a car payment and then the rest is like credit cards and personal loans okay okay um and how much is the house in flor? How much could you sell it for? I think about $200 is what we could probably get for it. Okay. You could walk away with a little over $100? Mm-hmm. Which would knock down a good chunk of this consumer debt. It doesn't get you completely debt-free, but, man, it would change your life. Yeah. Yeah. it doesn't get you completely debt-free but man it would change your life yeah yeah i mean so adrian i mean i yeah i would do that regardless of where you were financially i think it's going to be really wise for you to do it because of where you are

financially but also recognizing that you know so much of personal buying but personal finance it's behavior right and it's us that is, you know, we talked about this in an early segment. We make the choices on what's going on with our money. And so understanding, Adrienne, that things within you, recognizing those things and healing and putting better money habits in place, better boundaries for yourself. I mean, all of these things are important because if you don't fix Adrian, in a sense, you're going to be right back here five years from now, right? So we want to stop the pattern of what's causing you to do all of this. And maybe it was because of grief and where you were in loneliness in a new city.

But I also would just be very aware that this, you know, this is going to be a gift to you, this margin to be able to swipe out so much debt. But it also is not going to cause, could potentially not cause the habit transformation that needs to really happen. So just being aware of that. is your spouse on board with this plan my spouse kind of leaves things up to me oh your spouse what they kind of leave things up to you like so if you said hey i'm gonna i'm gonna sell the house i'd be like okay whatever you want to do yeah basically i know that's crazy crazy. Do they have any debt? I mean, that debt's like ours combined.

Okay. I want them to care more than just going, whatever you want to do. I want some buy-in here. And so I think you need to lay out everything together, all the debts, all of the income, create the budget, and go, hey, here's where we're at. Here's the state of the union for our house. And part of the plan is selling this house. And the byproduct of that is we're going to be able to clear all of the student loan debt in one fell swoop, maybe the car loan. And then we're going to start attacking these credit cards and personal loans. We make 150. We're

going to attack the 60 within eight months. That's the level of detail you guys need to have together. What is your household income? I would say about $160,000. Okay. I was almost spot on. That's amazing. I just had a feeling. And both of you are working full-time. Yeah. So think about that. You clear all of your student loan debt, sell this property. You're making $160,000. How quickly could you pay off another $60,000? Freeing up all those payments. It's going to happen like that. We're talking less than a year.

And so set an aggressive goal, and both of you are working toward it. You're both marking down the debt-free chart. This needs to be a group effort. I don't want you taking this on your own just because they trust you. Okay. It's going to be easier and more fun and help you grow in your marriage and the communication and help you avoid ever getting into this again. Because both of you felt the sacrifice. Both of you saw the progress and you can't unsee it. And that's going to help you transform so this never happens again. Okay. We also have... Sorry, I can't hear you, Adrienne. Speak directly on your phone.

Oh, I'm sorry. Can you hear me? Yes. Okay. We also have a daughter who is graduating in a couple of weeks and is wanting to go to college in the fall. Okay. Have you talked to her about a plan to do that without debt? Not really. Okay. Well... I'm not sure how to approach a plan for that.

Step one, you can go watch Borrowed Future for free on our YouTube channel, and that will be a great conversation starter. We'll lay out all the facts. We'll lay out all the stories, the inspiring ones, the heartbreaking ones. And I guarantee she'll have questions at the end of that and say, oh gosh, mom, I don't want that to be me. What can we do about this? Then you guys can formulate a plan together. And Adrian, I think, and I think it's a very honest conversation too of what debt has done in your life. It's created stress. It's created a wedge possibly within your marriage. I mean, this is like, it's not produced good fruit in your life, right? It has been harmful.

It has not been helpful. And to guide your 18-year-old and showing her and talking to her that it's just not an option. You are not going to sign and co-sign a loan for student loans. You're not going to do that to your daughter. You're not going to put her and start her off on a foundation of which you're trying to get yourself out of. So like the intensity too of the situation needs to be very much communicated to her. And I know she wants to go to college. She may not have the money to go to college and that's okay. Maybe she takes a gap year. Maybe she goes to community college. Maybe she applies for scholarships and grants. Maybe she looks for an in-state school that's okay. Maybe she takes a gap year. Maybe she goes to community college. Maybe she applies for scholarships and grants. Maybe she looks for an in-state school

that's less expensive than going to, you know, off to college in another state. Like you can start having these conversations with her, but you're in a real, you know, moment though, Adrienne, of your own story, your own relationship to debt. And she needs to know about that. Like that's a gift to her

and you're not going to stray her down that path as a mom. Like that's a gift to her and you're not going to stray her down that path as a mom. You love her too much to do that. That's the conversation I would have. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell joined by Rachel Cruz. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Well, Rachel, we got a lot of questions about investing, the social media world, young people, all they want to hear is about how to build wealth and it can be overwhelming it's great great conversation to have but there's so much noise out there it can be overwhelming you can get sort of paralyzed the paralysis analysis that's right and a lot of people end up doing nothing because they're scared of doing something but doing it incorrectly. And so I want to set them free today with some teaching on this, on kind of the primer for building wealth.

And research has shown that a lack of confidence in making these decisions, it's a primary reason why people don't invest. So we just need to bring them some literacy and some hope that it's way easier than they think. So here's what we're going to call it. Keep it simple, stupid. You ever heard of that? The KISS method? That's what they call it back in my day. So investing is a long game. You're not trying to time the market and buy single stocks. You don't need to be a prodigy. And everyone is a first-time investor the first time they invest.

That's right. So it's okay. But before, there is a prerequisite. If you know the Ramsey plan, you've got to be in the right spot in the Ramsey baby steps. So we've got baby step one, start our emergency fund. Baby step two, paying off all the consumer debt. Baby step three, fully funded emergency fund. Then comes baby step four. Investing. Yep. Make sure you knock those first three out. Otherwise, it's going to be much harder to invest. You're going to add a lot of risk and stress into your life. But once you're there. And even those who are investing now and still

have consumer debt, when you're paying off debt, we would even say to pause investing too. So truly, those first three steps are just like one at a time. You're doing nothing else but those. But then you get to baby step four and you get to start investing. You start building for the future instead of paying for the past. Yep, that's right. So this is where it gets exciting. Yeah. So the first thing to really think through is what are your goals? What are you wanting to invest for? Are you investing for retirement, knowing I'm not going to see this till I'm 60 years old and I'm putting money away because

I want to retire at 60 and be able to cash everything out and be great or not cash everything out, but live off those investments. Is it that you want to maybe open up an index fund or a mutual fund and put some money in month to month because you're looking out in the future and you're like yeah we'll probably be putting a down payment on a house maybe in four to five years i don't know but i want to be able to get to that money without penalty um so you know i'm doing that is it kids college are you investing for kids college in a 529 so again mapping out why you're investing and kind of what those goals are will help really take a really broad subject and narrow it down for you to know what lane you're wanting to invest in.

And that why will keep you focused and eye on the prize instead of sort of getting a little starry-eyed or pulling your money out when you go, oh, no, this is for this purpose. Yeah, because just so you'll know, we define investing as five years or later, right? Or longer. That's investing for us. Savings is more short term. You're saving for something in the next month, two, three, four years. But when you're talking five years or more, that's where you're like, okay, we can start thinking about this investing. That's because there's less risk for you to lose money in the short term versus long term. We know you're going to make it if you do it the right way. So the next step, once you've decided on your investing goals, you got to figure out how

much you're going to invest. And your goals will determine this. But we recommend a baby step for putting away 15% of your gross household income into tax advantaged retirement accounts. So simply put, this would be I've got a Roth 401k at work. I'm going to put 15% of my income. My spouse will put 15% of their income together. That's 15% of household income. That's a question we get a lot. Wait, do I do seven and a half and she does? Oh yeah. Nope. Because 15% of yours and 15% of hers becomes 15% of ours of the total.

So that makes it real simple. I love that 15%. Don't overthink it. You don't need to do more at this point. You don't need to do any less. Keep it there and don't stop. Yes. And then also understand your investing vehicles. So you were just saying that, George. So when you're thinking about retirement, you guys do some research and figure out, okay, at my workplace, do they offer a 401k or a 403b? These are great investing vehicles to be in. Or is there even a Roth option within it? Because Roth means that it's after-tax dollars and the growth is tax-free when you take it out, which is huge. So if you ever see Roth, jump on that train. That's a good one. Or maybe you're doing a Roth IRA, which is another great place to put your

money. A really simple investment, honestly. And anyone can do that with earned income. So that's a good clarifying point. You're like, my employer doesn't have an IRA. That's outside of your employer. So 401k, 403b, those are employer retirement plans. The IRA, anyone can do if they have earned income. It's up to, I think, $7 thousand dollars this year in 2024 that you can put in so they limit it um but again that's another one and so you guys you can sit down with somebody a smart investor pro or someone to open up you know especially like something like a roth um or mutual funds or other things but you know you can also go to vanguard and say okay you know looking into options i mean like there's there's ways to do this but just know when you when you open up an account,

which again, if you sit down with a professional, which we recommend, they're going to help you with this. You actually have to invest the money because that's a mistake people make. They open up these accounts and they may put money in the account, but then they don't go and take that and actually invest it.

You need to buy funds with it. That's right. There's an extra step there. So just remember that. It's just like a shell. You have a shell, but now you need to put some stuff in there to allow it to grow. So that's where it comes into choosing different types of investments. We've all heard of stocks and bonds. Our favorite of these is mutual funds or even index funds. The word fund is the key here. A fund is going to hold a giant basket of those stocks,

which helps you diversify and it doesn't put all of your eggs in one basket. And we may be beating a dead horse, as they would say, George. I've never done that. But again, we're getting very simple here with this. I love horses. We want you guys to know this. Yeah, George does.

He loves horses. Never beat them. Don't ever sell the horse. Alive or dead. I wouldn't touch one. Oh my gosh. Is within these accounts, your 401k at work, a Roth IRA, you're investing in mutual funds within

that account. So just to be clear on that. Yes. And so the next step would be picking an investment strategy. And we've mentioned that good growth stock mutual funds, that's the way to go to invest for long-term consistent growth. You're spreading that out among a lot of different companies. And even then we recommend four different types of funds. And so we'll tell you more about that. I'll give you a great resource to check out. But the key here is diversification. That is why we do this. That's right. And then next, that'll be opening the account, kind of what we were saying earlier. So you're going to go and talk to your employer at work, you know, and then you're going to do, remember this formula, Roth. No, wait, match. Hold on. Oh, no, I just messed it up you're going to do, remember this formula, Roth, no, wait,

match. Hold on. Oh, no, I just messed it up. I messed it up, George. Roth. Nope. Match. Start with the match.

Thank you. My gosh. Match beats Roth beats traditional. We got there. Oh, Lord. Five words. On my soul. Match beats Roth beats traditional.

So remember that formula because that's going to help guide you to say, okay, what do first so again go up to your match in your 401k if there is one if there is one and so say it's four percent well you have 15 you got to invest in so you can put that so that means you have nine percent of your income left to invest that's when you're gonna go over to a roth ira fund up to that 11 if you max that out and yes good lord it's okay the cookie is messing with her it's i mean i told her i get an americano i get a chocolate chip cookie and i go downhill um that's right 11 left go back go to your roth and if you max it out and you have more percentages left go back to your 401k but the beautiful thing would be a roth 401k love that's what we have at ramsey and so for a long time, that's what I was doing.

It's just Roth 401k, all 15%. We've got good mutual fund options. That's the key. Hey, should I do all 15% of the 401k? Yeah, if you've got good options and low fees and it's a Roth, go for it. Yes. So it's simple. Match beats Roth beats traditional.

And again, this is regardless of the employer match, you were doing 15%. You don't do less because your employer has a match or they give you free money. Even if they give you a free 4%, you still do 15%. Yeah, that's right. So the next step, the final step here is working with a pro to start investing, to keep learning. Rachel and I both have a smart investor pro in our corner, as we call them. And the key here is you want someone in your corner who can educate you, who has the heart of a teacher, who can maybe help you avoid jumping off the ledge when the

market's crazy, help you understand the trends that are happening and give you a full plan, not just with choosing a fund, but what about estate planning and tax strategy and kids college and making sure you have a holistic plan? Yeah. Cause in our world today, I mean, there's some stuff, I mean, Vanguard's a great example that you can do on your own, right? I mean, very much so. But even if you do that, you guys, having somebody in your corner, and this is what one said I do, we meet every January with ours, to look at everything.

They're looking at your entire financial life. And so I think that's so, so important that you're not doing this on your own because if you're making big decisions, to have somebody that's, yeah, from the tax standpoint, I mean, all of it, just they're seeing your entire financial picture, I think is really, really important. Get that third party in there. So if you want to learn more, we've got a great article that we'll put in the show notes in the description that explains it all. It's called How to Start Investing, and it's on the Ramsey Solutions site. So go to the show notes, click the link in the description, and it's all free. We just want to help you guys build wealth with peace and confidence. I'm going to go

drink more coffee, George. She needs it. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Rachel Cruz. This hour, open phones at 888-825-5225. In a previous segment, Rachel and I gave you a little deep dive on investing, but there's only so much we can cover in about seven minutes. And so lucky for you guys, we've got a brand new event coming up. That's like four hours of just investing content. It's called Dave Ramsey's Investing Essentials. And at this event, Dave Ramsey and myself, we're going to deep dive into investing for the first time ever. He's going to share his personal playbook on investing, including how he buys real estate,

which is something Dave is known for. He's got an insane real estate portfolio, and there's a smart way to do it. He's going to lay it all out like never before. So this is a two-night virtual event happening May 21st and 22nd. And because it's online, you can watch from the comfort of your home wherever you are in the country. And investing is something that you guys ask us about all the time. You want us to dig deeper. You want us to nerd out a little bit. And that is where this is going to happen. So we're going to cover the basics, of course, the normal baby step four stuff, but we're also going to talk about how to maximize your investments, your 401ks, your mutual funds, investing outside of retirement, how to invest once you're in baby step seven and beyond,

Dave's personal strategy for real estate, and which investing trends to follow and which ones you should avoid. Tickets start at, I think, 200 bucks right now. So go to ramsaysolutions.com slash events, get your tickets today and join us for this virtual event. I am so pumped for it. Let's get to the phones. Marie joins us in Bend, Oregon. Coming up, what's happening, Marie? Hi, thank you. Sure. How can Rachel and I help?

So one thing I really love about your philosophy about money is just the openness, especially when it comes to, it seems like, your family, just being able to have those open conversations and everyone knows you know what what's going on with everything my main my main question is really just how to have those open conversations um i i know that um there are things in my name that i just have no idea what they are and i mean that's not a terrible thing they're there but i also just feel kind of in the dark i think so my family members who set up things don't want, you don't just kind of want to wait to it till a certain time period.

But I also just like, I don't know, I guess you just want to figure out how to navigate that. And also, um, uh, just, just being able to be open in general. And are you talking more like with your nuclear family, like your husband and kids or like your parents and siblings? Mostly my parents and grandparents, but yeah, it's definitely with everyone. Yeah. So when you say your name is on things and that means more from like an inheritance standpoint that you'll be receiving. It's not like your name is on the deed of houses out there and you don't know. It's not something like that. I think it's mostly just trust and whatnot. She'd be a beneficiary on there.

Are you coming from wealth? Do you know? I mean, have you guys done really well? No, my grandfather did very well. Yes. Okay. And you just have no clue how much they have. You have no clue if there will be or if what amount of money would be

passed down to you. I mean, like those are the questions you're, you're asking. Yeah. And I think it's, I think, you know, whenever we talk about money or family, it just, it's not as like, it's just not well planned out, I guess. I mean, again, I'm grateful for, you know, what my grandfather did, but I also just, there's not as much of the, like, I just feel like left in the dark and where I can't do smart things. Like, I have my child, and I want to be able to set her up well and be open about things. And I guess I'm just looking forward to being able to set things differently

for her, and now I'm just trying to figure out if I can maybe figure out some boundaries or have discussions with my own family. I don't know. How old are you? I am, uh, 28. Okay. And how old are your parents? Um, my dad is 60. My mom is almost 50. And your grandparents are still, they're still living? Yeah.

Okay. Um, and is that where most of the wealth came from? And your grandparents are still, they're still living? Yeah. Okay. And is that where most of the wealth came from was your grandparents and your parents and then, okay, I'm just trying to get a, get a family tree, a little bit of what you're, of what you're thinking. Are you married, Marie? Yeah, I'm not. You're not. Okay. And how old is your daughter? She is four. Okay, great. Yeah, I mean, I think at the end of the day, they're going to have to be the ones, your grandparents, if they're the ones that hold most of this, that it's their decision on how they choose to do it.

I think you could, depending on the relationship, have some level of a conversation of like, hey, here's what I've seen, I just want to be able to to plan well and just to know how to prepare if you know or when when something happens to you guys and kind of what the plan is and it's not from a gold diggers perspective in a sense or like hey I'm going to just wait around till something's passed to me because I don't want that for you either, Marie. I mean, I want you to have the dignity to stand on your own two feet regardless of what you'll receive one day. But I do think, you know, it's like, I don't know. I mean, I think that that's a fair of like, hey, I'm just I'm I'm kind of just curious and I would love to sit down.

I don't know if there's a way to do this, know with all the the cousins and the other siblings and everything and let's just kind of have a family estate meeting and kind of just get a lay of the land of what's going on because it does feel in the dark and and you know and I think one of the worst things that families can do is that you know what you know the grandparents pass and you guys it's like in the movies all end up in some like old english looking mansion and like a live in a library you know and then the the will is read out and the first time you hear anything is in that moment you know um which i know kind of could happen i guess but it's a little dramatic but um and i think just that i think just your desire to just um have the knowledge you know for yourself so

that it's not at this point of like after they're gone suddenly it's a surprise you know i think that's a fair thing to say but i think it's up to them obviously at the end of the day if they it's still going to be slightly awkward there's not a normal dinner time conversation and so it's okay to lead with hey i know this might be awkward and i'm just trying to open this conversation if i if you lead with some grace and humility instead of like entitlement and you're you know sort of aggressive about it they may or may not tell you and i'd also live my life knowing that it may or may not happen because life a lot of life will happen in between then so like rachel said i would prepare for a life where you get zero inheritance and prepare so that if you do get

inheritance you know how to manage it well. And regardless of it happens and how much it is, whether it's a dollar or $10 million. But it's fine to be curious about it. But again, there's no, what kind of sparked this for you, Marie? Was there a moment that was like, hey, I'm actually wondering about this? I guess largely just inspired by, you know, setting things up for my own daughter and then also just seeing the way that other people are able to operate where it's more open. I just really like that. It's just like. I guess I'm wondering, how does it affect your financial life in the meantime?

I mean, I definitely. I mean, I'm fine where I am so I'm not like trying to ask them for money or anything it's just like sort of like scratching the itch in your brain it's like I'm just curious what's gonna happen here yeah I've just kept on going I think I'm just an over thinker

I've kept on going back and forth I'm like should I say anything does it really matter? Or do you have a good relationship with your parents? Do they have a good relationship with your grandparents? Like how, how's the family dynamic? It's definitely just, it's, there's just not really a whole lot of boundaries. It seems like it just feels, feels harder for me to navigate. Boundaries with money? Well, money and just other things in general. Like they overstep, they're too involved,

or are they like that kind of thing? In some ways, yeah. And then in other ways, it's, I don't know how to explain it really. no you're fine i just wondered like yeah if you were just like like hey mom and dad i'm curious how much are grandpa and grandma worth like what what's gonna happen you know when when they pass away i don't know like if you just very awkward conversation it would be and my question would be i'm just curious why would they be judging you would they not even know the numbers? Would they, like, what causes that to be awkward? It was just always such a secret.

And it was like, yeah, we just always lived like we had nothing. But then there was actually, I think my parents actually had a lot. We just didn't, you know, as kids know about, we were taught to stress about money. Yeah. And it's just strange. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I don't, you know, as kids know about, we were taught to stress about money. Yeah. And it's just strange. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I don't, yeah, again, to George's point, I don't know from the day-to-day aspect,

I think it's something good for you to start saying, hey, I'm going to do something different with my daughter moving forward, and I'm going to have this to be a topic that's open, but we can't force people for it to be an open conversation. And just start with, I don't want to assume anything. I'm not here to be entitled. I just want to know. And that's it. It's just a place of curiosity, not expectation.

That puts this hour of the show in the books. Thanks to my co-host, Rachel Cruz, all the folks in the booth, and you, America. We'll be back before you next time.